📚marathon-lore-discussion

[distant widget]

im VERY excited for the world building

they can add so much with the modern game to the marton

it already looks like a fucking maze

but now theres a 3rd deminsion

you can...

JUMP

[oblique fulcrum]

Incredible stuff

[distant widget]

its as if doom you only fought demons for a little bit

and the rest of the games was you in like fucking venus fighting speggeties monsters

[oblique fulcrum]

And then at the end of the third one you took lsd

[distant widget]

you overdosed and are dying

[sick kite]

Are we all under the impressions that 2 an 3 aren’t cannon

[tranquil basin]

I don’t think they’re not canon. While 3 chose a different timeline from 2, they did still happen. The easiest thing would be for them to put marathon 2026 in the 7th timeline of 3

Otherwise this timeline would just be doomed

[visual lynx]

-# thanks for passing that along, and I know I already shared these followup thoughts with you but for everyone else:

if that's true, what if the [really bad thing WW2 is famous for, like the go-to example of the worst thing ever] was actually a mass sacrifice for this mystic chaos-worshipping death cult?

and your crystals theory makes me think of my theory that the UESC and MIDA both knew about Jjaro tech on Tau Ceti and that's the real reason why the Marathon was sent instead of putting resources into propping up the Mars colony, and now with my Arachne are [not see] mystics theory, I want to combine that with Mandalore's misunderstanding of the Chicken Term as suggesting that an ancient secret society were behind the Marathon mission, and suggest that Arachne had its tentacles within MIDA, that's why they just fucking killed 10% of Mars when they got into power, and they via MIDA were also involved in the original Marathon mission, trying to get at that Jjaro "magic" and... I dunno, free their Dreaming God or something.

-# new thought addendum

combining this with the hypothesis that humans are already extinct by the new game except for maybe some frozen in cryo on the Marathon, maybe what Arachne want now is to make sure that those humans die too.

[half briar]

So, I'm curious. Just actually watched the reveal cinematic trailer for the first time, is that "lucky charm" and photo just something given to all runners to sort of 'ground' their consciousness after every death? Or was that actually unique to the woman who gets killed?

[tranquil basin]

I think they all have something to ground them. Idk if it’s necessarily a lucky charm or if they just do exercises. It could also just be for the narrative of the trailer

[tranquil basin]

It’d be cool if they all had a unique one, like existing in a shell seems to be so taxing on their sense of self that they have to have a totem like inception

[half briar]

Part of me think it's a destiny exo situation. Their conscious mind can be aware that they're not in a human body, but their uncounscious mind has to be kept in the dark or they'll simply go insane/die. Part of me wonders if part of the adoption process for a shell means that they have to sort of "work" with the shell so it can feel right, because if it's a synthetic body, what do you achieve by stretching, or sitting in rest positions? You don't feel your bones popping or your muscles getting tired. To you, it's all the same. I wonder if feeling pain is the same, too. Or maybe those areas aren't present in the synthetic "brain."

Are rooks even occupied by humans? are they purely code? I doubt it. The factions wouldn't put real human minds inside runner shells, or hell even recycle them over and over, if it wasn't strictly necessary since there are only so many willing minds to partake.

[tranquil basin]

That makes sense to me yeah, otherwise I think they’d use bots like the uesc bc they can be far more durable and deadly

[soft pelican]

Rook contains monotropic fascimile

[tranquil basin]

Pretend I don’t know what that means, like as a pretend thing bc I definitely do

Mono single, tropic direction or location, facsimile is facsimile

[sharp quarry]

I'm thinking about this again and how good it is as environmental storytelling given the context of the trilogy, and the simulacrums. Another nugget of story that only really hits hard for those familiar with the world already. Picture this, let me get you immersed:

It's been 3 months since the aliens came. Their 3 piercing eyes, their bright, shining armor like twisted knights on a crusade, those electric staves, what they do to a person, it will never leave your subconscious. But you are repairing. Leela is helping, however she can, though the Marathon itself is too damaged, and resources too scarce, to mount a rescue mission and bring her core down, so she's always speaking on a delay.

You're sitting on the step of your hab unit, watching two men argue over something, apparently trivial, given how they laugh every few minutes. By the greenhouse, your old friend Lucy is having lunch, Pumpkin Pie flavor. God, you wish you could taste a real pumpkin pie, wouldn't that be something? You'd had a real potato chip back home, part of a field trip to a museum when you were still in school, so you knew how different the nutrient pastes really tasted. But Pumpkin Pie was always the best.

It's quiet, the wind is slow and the birds are silent. You see the sector comms array light up. Your cue to get back to work. You stand up, and begin to turn around to go inside to grab your terminal key, but you hear something from behind you. One of the men who was playfully arguing suddenly stops and says "Oh my god, are you ok?"

A man is standing out in the open, wearing a shiny green jumpsuit you've never seen in your life, with his helmet off. He looks fine, but he should barely have enough oxygen to be standing, let alone "fine." He's just standing there. He must've walked in from the compound but...no, you would've seen that. You only turned around for a moment. How did he get here? What is he wearing? Lucy drops her packet and runs over, but as she does the man turns around, looks at one of the two men who had been arguing, and simply yells out, loudly, in a strange cadence:

"Thank god it's you!"

As though he recognized them. And then he starts running, and Lucy's running after him, and he's just running as though he's going to ram straight into the men, and you begin moving because you have to do something, and he's nearly reached the men but he's not slowing down-

And then in a split second, a flash of light, you're on the ground. There's yellow goop everywhere. And red. Pain is shooting through every part of your body, your ears are ringing louder than when the first orbital strike hit. The men, Lucy, they're all in pieces. Dead on the floor, their parts around you. You're the only one alive. People come running, questions are being asked, people are screaming in terror, but you can't hear any of it. You only hear one sentence amidst the panic, as someone tries to lift you from the ground. "Leela sent a message! They're back!"

You survived. The whole thing. Two Pfhor attacks and somehow you came out of both. You're not sure if you're better or worse off for it. But why they left, what happened that day, what that thing was...you never find answers. No one knows either. They were everywhere, so it's said, but no one knows what they were. How they did that. And you'll never, ever, ever forget what it said. Why? Did it recognize them? Did it think it needed help? Why would it say something like that?

It's been 30 years. People are dropping like flies. The earth is opening. Voices surround you. You're one of the last. Curled in a corner, waiting for them to find you. It's too late. You don't stand a chance. They're fakes, just like him, all of them. They're fakes. Remember that. When you hear them, remember that. "Thank god it's you!"

Thankgoditsyou
Thankodditsyou
Thankoooitsyou
Thankgoditsyou
Thankodditsyou

They're fakes. They're not real. They're not real.

[soft pelican]

I’m just bullshitting and guessing but I’m saying it’s like a single purpose flash copy of whoever. And maybe it’s over for it on exfil

[sharp quarry]

ok maybe you didn't need that much immersion into the situation but you get the idea, it's really well done

[oblique fulcrum]

Firstly, holy text wall, secondly this is fucking awesome

[tranquil basin]

I’m immersed

[tranquil basin]

That makes sense

[oblique fulcrum]

I love all the graffiti everywhere in the environment

[sharp quarry]

had to split into two messages for automod, and I almost ran out of nitro character count to boot 😭

[sharp quarry]

yaaay! :D

[oblique fulcrum]

Some of them seem like crazy ramblings, some of them seem like descriptions of events, some of them seem like prophecies of something terrible and some look just like random scribbles but they're too deliberate to be that. It paints a really eerie picture

[sharp quarry]

I think one of JakeTheAlright's new videos focuses a lot on them

[oblique fulcrum]

Like there's a graffiti on I think perimeter that is just called HEARNOSEENOSPEAKNO According to the Tau Ceti world site and it's just the hear no evil see no evil speak no evil and I wonder what it represents

[oblique fulcrum]

I love that guy

[sharp quarry]

Also I deserve a shoutout for the "They're everywhere!" callback there I felt clever about it so everyone must know that I was clever for it.

[visual lynx]

is this about autism?

[soft pelican]

Kind of

I’m thinking single-purpose one track flow state

[visual lynx]

I noticed! Excellent work!

[tranquil basin]

If it is, I’m a rook

[vital hollow]

Cogito ergo sum 🧠

[vital hollow]

🐦

[umbral pivot]

I absolutely love this, did you write this or is there somewhere to find this?

[tranquil basin]

Good reference

Oh wait I thought u said ergo proxy nvm

[oblique fulcrum]

Still a reference, AM in I have no mouth and I must scream says it

[vital hollow]

Still haven't seen it. I need to get caught up with ghost in the shell and the Alita series too 😅

[tranquil basin]

Tbh it was a bit hard to get into at first, kinda weird pacing, but it’s been really really good otherwise

[vital hollow]

Did you like Texhnolyze?

Same guy who wrote Lain

[tranquil basin]

Haven’t heard of it but I’ll check it out

[bronze skiff]

It's a reference to a philosopher

[sharp quarry]

Just wrote it up here

[tranquil basin]

I think all the cyberacme terminals through all the games had that port

[fleet oriole]

What’s ‘artifacts’ would be hidden in the marathon ship that would be considered valuable enough to corpos on earth?

[tranquil basin]

Well they spent insane amounts of money investing in it. They probably want to recoup losses or repurpose them to get another foothold on Tau Ceti. Getting materials that close to Tau Ceti would be way cheaper than shipping all new colony materials from earth

[tranquil basin]

Depending on if they know about the aliens or if they find out, the alien tech would be super valuable probably

And if they find out about simulacrums, sekiguchi might be interested in them

[mint cedar]

More more more!

[peak adder]

Does anyone know when AI was actually invented in the Marathon universe? The timeline on marathon.bungie.org says that Rampancy first appeared in 2070, but then during the ARG Traxus said on their own page that AI was first invented by them in 2095, which means that Rampancy couldn't have appeared in 2070 since AI didn't even exist then. Which is true?

[tranquil basin]

Maybe just traxus’s ai? There might’ve been timeline changes too, idk tho

[sharp quarry]

Rampancy first appeared in the 2200s, I thought? Where's the source on that point, am I forgetting something?

[peak adder]

In the two hundred and fifty years since Rampancy first appeared in the Earth-net, the stable Rampant AI, the 'Holy Grail' of cybertonics, has never come close to fruition. Since no Rampant has ever been controlled or turned to any useful purpose, it is the opinion of this writer and of the majority of the Cybertonic community that all rampant AIs are a danger to Cyberlife, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Thrashedness. (James B. Miller, 2320, "Life and Death of Intelligence")
Marathon 1

[sharp quarry]

Hmm

Date on that's around the same time as dates that have been retconned forward since

Most of the mars timeline was moved up to match the marathon's launch date

So I suppose that simply isn't the right date anymore.

[rancid bone]

Do we know where a firing range is on their list of priorities?

[sharp quarry]

I don't believe we have any idea.

[rancid bone]

That's a little disappointing for an extraction game with deep buildcrafting.

Testing cores before commiting them to a raid would be nice.

[sharp quarry]

We don't even know that there isn't one, to be fair.

[rancid bone]

true, true

[sharp quarry]

But yes, I expect, at some point, a vr missions type testing area, preferably where you can spawn and test on enemies, or I'll be somewhat confused. Half the mods and cores and implants don't give you numbers, and we already live in cyberspace, it'd make no sense for there to be no area to get a feel for them.

[plucky sierra]

There are a couple of plausible explanations for the apparent time difference:

1. Assuming we are in the 7th Infinity timeline all M1 dates can be tweaked to fit the narrative of NuMarathon, this will be another event in the list of events that are different between the timeline of NuMarathon and the timeline of M1 and M2
2. Traxus labels 2095 as the birth of "true Artificial Intelligence" perhaps rampancy was something discovered during the development of "true" AI, something seen on "false" AI like an LLM
3. The Traxus dates are milestones for Traxus as a company so this could be Traxus saying when they created the first AI as the first "true" AI and founded as Traxus Intelligent Machine rather than accurate as the global development of AI

[tranquil basin]

That makes sense. Banger pfp btw

[vital hollow]

Something on tier with a cyborg security guard I guess

[sharp quarry]

Well 1: all that tech is 400 years old, 400 year old technology goes for a lot in OUR world so. And

2: alien involvement is suspected, meaning alien technology to pilfer.

[vital hollow]

i'm curious where Bungie's fixation on megastructures came from

Arguably Marathon is the first big example since it's a giant spaceship to begin with

[fallen quarry]

Derelict spaceships had always been their thing since og marathon

[deep niche]

Blitz wtf is all this

10 word tldr

[sharp quarry]

A bit of micro-fanfiction to get across how cool the "Thank God it's you" graffiti really is in context.

[deep niche]

I see

[still sand]

I didn’t miss book time?

[deep niche]

Cancelled

[sharp quarry]

That context being that "Thank God it's you!" Was one of the preprogrammed simulacrum phrases

[still sand]

Hey MIDA when is the marathon playtest

[still sand]

Awww

[sharp quarry]

Spoiler: might be cancelled today too, I'm really quite busy. Infinity also drained me a bit.

But we'll see

[deep niche]

I never heard a regular human say thank god it’s you before so I’d blast a simulacrum on sight

[still sand]

Ping me if you do

[deep niche]

It’s fine don’t rush yourself to be there Marathon doesn’t launch for another month

[still sand]

Sadly

Marathon devs leaving us dry rn

[lavish palm]

real and true give us a lil runner apartment

like a virtual home

[sharp quarry]

Right up CyberAcme's alley to sell digital furniture for real credits

I see no flaw

[vital hollow]

maybe the corpos figured out that phfor blood can be made into some miracle medicine/fuel/tasty food so there's a high demand to recover the million dead aliens that are just chilling like wagyu steaks inside the marathon's cryostorage

[distant widget]

im shocked there isnt one at launch

thats one everygame hase

or hay mybe there is

[sharp quarry]

Read my longest message on this server so far

[distant widget]

🥀

[sharp quarry]

Had to split into 2 but I did write it as one

[distant widget]

i aint reading allat

yesy yes i read it

uh

are we sure the sims would be in green

wouldnt the aliens alteast try to copy a colony suit

like they all wore white hasmat suites

[sharp quarry]

I think they'd just keep using the ones they'd always used because they worked fine before

[distant widget]

also is a sim fucking unkillable

there treated like shadow demons

i git they explode but i cant see that being effective

oh a black man in a green full body suit is running around yelling FROG over and over

and thats the 20 one ive seen

[sharp quarry]

If they didn't figure that all of them having green clothes would make them stand out, idk why that'd change. They might not think humans use clothes as signifiers of rank or place or have uniforms and stuff.

They don't seem to examine the cultures of their victims often

[distant widget]

wait wait

the slavers made these ?

or who

i forget

[sharp quarry]

They always explode, even if disabled they'll simply explode on impact

[sharp quarry]

Yeah

[distant widget]

we see slavers with diffrent outfits

and colors

i feel the sims are just cheeply made

more then anything

like

why go through the time making a robot mimic

but not making any good voiclines clothes other skins

[sharp quarry]

Yeah no they do use garments to signify place in society but they might not consider that we would do the same thing

[distant widget]

and making them fucking explode at anyone they see

[distant widget]

i mean for a race to have so meny slaves and be so dumb

[sharp quarry]

They're suicide bombers that's the one thing they're meant to do

[distant widget]

it be VERy funny to seethose in this game

and there rip off runners

[sharp quarry]

Well I think it's more they might think we're too primitive to think like they do

[distant widget]

just saying the voicelines on loop

[distant widget]

ah there uber racist

i see now

hopefally we see more of how they think in the games

mybe they where just

cheap products

[distant widget]

and the codes in the game

we have the ticks

just make the tick model the runner model

[sharp quarry]

Yeah I think they were kinda just thrown together as cheaply as possible to still pass a human at a glance and quickly thin numbers.

That's probably how they always are

[distant widget]

wait wait

why not enslave us

[sharp quarry]

They did

[distant widget]

why try killing all humans

[sharp quarry]

They were trying to

[distant widget]

they seem to be shooting first

this race is comical

[sinful thicket]

re; the dates. they were always messed up even while the original trilogy was being released

[sharp quarry]

The Simulacrums only targeted military personnel at first.

[distant widget]

ahhh

[sinful thicket]

big ol page about it on marathonstory

[distant widget]

AHHH

that makes sense

[sharp quarry]

They'd stay dormant in groups of civilians and then when they saw security they'd run to them and explode

[sinful thicket]

also fun fact: the simulacrums caused all airlock technicians to run around the ship naked, since they were issued green uniforms

[sharp quarry]

I didn't specify that the men in my scenario were military but you can just assume

[distant widget]

man just paint a strip on your shirt

[fallen hollow]

I love this fact.

[sharp quarry]

Yeah! Lol

[distant widget]

wait wait

did the slavers git ANY humans

[vital hollow]

i don't think so

[distant widget]

is there a chance well see human enemes as slaves in this game

[vital hollow]

i mean i guess durandal took over the slaver ship

so er

he's the slaver

[distant widget]

mybe the second time around

[sharp quarry]

They had a good few on their scout ship but Durandal grabbed that and "freed" them to work for him

[distant widget]

we are durandals slave in game

[sharp quarry]

Then they got away/were killed (timeline dependant)

[distant widget]

just the idea of a race that LOVES slaves

and do anything to git them

[sharp quarry]

So I don't think the Pfhor have any human specimens left over

[distant widget]

ah well

wait

do you think

[vital hollow]

Mortui nullus est dominus

💀

[distant widget]

thell try to inslave us?

and the uesc

i mean there walking talking beings

[sharp quarry]

Yeah I mean. That's their whole business with us. That's why they're a major threat

Though after the humiliation at Lh'owon they might just kill us on sight

Full genocide

[distant widget]

seeing uesc bots in slaver colors with slaver weapons will be cool

[sharp quarry]

S'pht did all their hacking, they're probably fucked on that front

[distant widget]

or mybe compiler colors

ah true

[sharp quarry]

Unless they send the tycholings to hack them

[distant widget]

but i can see uesc compiler

"slaves"

[vital hollow]

i do think that one artwork where the security guard is using a shock staff was interesting

[sharp quarry]

They might send the tycholings

[distant widget]

who?

[vital hollow]

maybe shock staves and the alien weapons will reappear

[sinful thicket]

so we're taking the assumption this is just after the "succesful" marathon infinity ending yeah?

[sharp quarry]

There's like 3 where he's holding one, strsngely

[distant widget]

oh shit i didnt even know humans could use the weapons

[sinful thicket]

Lh'owon destroyed but the W'rkncacnter contained

[distant widget]

oooh thatle be fun

[sinful thicket]

Durandal on the run, MR54 doing what it wants, Pfhor in retreat

[distant widget]

uh i belive the one with the zombies

that has the colony

timeline 2?

[sinful thicket]

There's just one compiler left stuck on board the marathon

[distant widget]

who says hes stuck

[sharp quarry]

Yeah. Durandal talks like fully merged Thoth-Durandal, UESC never went to war with the Pfhor, and the Wrk hasn't erased the future, so it's safe to say.

[distant widget]

could be a recon

we see art of compilers killing humans

and theres the zombies down on the planet

while the in orbet ships where destroyed there where likely lots of aliens down on the planet

[sharp quarry]

The Pfhor reverse engineered Tycho to be the base of all their AI, though they could never recreate him after he was destroyed. The tycholings.

[distant widget]

hehe

so we now there will be a compiler and likly other lesser compilers as enemies in marton but what other alien races will we definitely see

im just gonna guess the raid boss compiler is a alpha or whatever

[sinful thicket]

could be something crazy like that one was the deputy leader of all s'pht sent to board the marathon, and even after being disconnected from the cyber controller it was STILL loyal to the pfhor

but alas, it was trapped and frozen in the cryo archive

and s'pht can be extremely dangerous, ever been hit by a s'pht'kr? you die in just about a second

and that's you as MR54. a runner shell would be more fragile

[fallen hollow]

Perhaps you're stuck with him.

[timber urchin]

drop kicking the compiler

[distant widget]

hes 10 feet tall

[timber urchin]

find a way

[sage junco]

remember, if you don't know who the compiler is, you are the compiler

[warped harbor]

Who do we think the 'entity' is during the latest clip Bungie shared? The one that speaks back to the surveyer at the anomoly.
"Who are you?" "Come with me"

Initially, I was sure the anomaly was the work of the Jjarro. BUT...hmm, the way the 'entity' says "come with me" (very distorted, odd, but still human sounding) makes me wonder if it isn't a Phfor-created simulacrum.

It could be both? Maybe the phfor simulacrum just happened to be hanging around the jjarro-created anomaly?

[distant widget]

blitzo are head lore queen says its a fungus zombie

i trust her

[sharp quarry]

No explosion at the end, looked horrifying when it turned around, not a simulacrum. Yeah I'm holding onto "scrapped S'ct'lac'tr flood-type deal" for the anomaly, so I say zombie. But it really could be anything, we just know it mimics what it hears (potentially selectively), looks frightening, and is hostile.

[distant widget]

it mimics what it hears but in almost a mocking way and it has its on voice

it aslo ask real question

turn around who are you

and then chases him after saying come here

to

its not brain dead

[sharp quarry]

Could imply it is human or was human, that it has a unique voice

If it was just echoing it'd be different

[distant widget]

i feel ike that thing isnt dumb tho

it seemd to be messing with him

keeping its face hidden

kidna mocking him

[sharp quarry]

Yes

[distant widget]

if thats this games flood thats mad scary

aslo are we under the idea it throw him in the anomaly

cus lile

at the end it showsa boot in the anomaly

aslo so much moth symbolism

and worms and all that

[sharp quarry]

It'd only make sense to elevate it to intelligence. Both from a storytelling standpoint as not to rehash the flood, and from a lore standpoint. Recall it can infect electronics, which means the fungus is cybernetic in nature, and Jjaro cybernetics are known to bring non-sentient beings into sentience.

[distant widget]

true true its like smart

oh thats so creepy

oh you fucking know we gonna hack a computer and its gonna talk to us

"what are you"

some Subotica emperor bullshit

but its not a nice mommy

the gravemind

[sharp quarry]

You go to interface with a derelict server to grab some data and it starts crawling up your Shell's arm "You are not catalogued....you are foreign...but we can learn you...use you...stay still...."

[distant widget]

of course it CANT work

or thered be no game

like how the flood cant git chief

oooo

[sharp quarry]

Yes, I imagine our synthetic nature is saving our asses

[distant widget]

i can see it being a poisen effect

infected runner mini bosses

assassin being some hunter l4d type shit

destoyer a charger

vandel a spitter

theif a smoker

[sharp quarry]

We're machines and organic, and that's hard to crack, so if it is in-game mechanical it'd be like on a timer to get out of the area before it takes root.

[distant widget]

you can go CRAZY with zombies

[sharp quarry]

Or maybe our disposability makes us unusable

Because it takes time to infect

We're already disassembled by the time it's deep enough into us to take over

[distant widget]

i can see there being raids where we gotta go into an infected zone and leave fast as possible

[deft elk]

flood type zombies

[sharp quarry]

Yeah the flood was based on an old concept for the S'ct'lac'tr, a bioweapon in marathon lore, so we're theorizing that they've revived that old concept.

[distant widget]

i think zombies in an extraction shooter would be very cool

I DONT COUNT HUNT

those dont do shit

there basicly just there

as noise

something thats actuly a threat

[sharp quarry]

Glorified sound traps, as always

[deft elk]

very cool

[distant widget]

of course this assumes its zombies while i do think thell be added we never no

wait

they dont have to be like

feral animals

if there smart enough to speak they could use guns

oh dear

[sharp quarry]

Even the somewhat mindless flood can use guns

An intelligent, cybernetic fungal mind

[distant widget]

been a long time sense i play halo

[sharp quarry]

That can use them proficiently

[distant widget]

dead ass we know the ai where corrupted and gitting data wrong

[sharp quarry]

Exciting prospects

[distant widget]

and all the crops kept changing

[distant widget]

na they hate us its gonna be a new big bad bno stays winning

[visual lynx]

the simulacra were built by a pfhor organization called the Phan Pfhar Sfaern-Wsawn Tshah, the Ministry for the Eradication Through Imitation of Hostile Species Unsuitable for Enslavement, after enslaving us proved less easy than expected so they switched to eradicating instead. (apparently that decision took only a day or two though.)

[distant widget]

😭

HU

[distant widget]

these mf be insane

AND WHY MAKE A WHOLE ORG JUST FOR THAT

[visual lynx]

yknow I always interpreted that as the pfhor using up the green uniforms leaving none for the real technicians, which I thought was weird because why would the pfhor steal uniforms instead of just making replicas, but it just now struck me that maybe instead the real technicians stripped off their uniforms to avoid getting shot by security.

[visual lynx]

the humans who were taken as slaves got turned into the tank cyborgs we see in m2/infinity

[distant widget]

i see

so

do the slavers have like corporations? currancy

there goals seem

insane

like is only one race at the top or are some the masters>

[visual lynx]

they sell the slaves to other species too, and I think the reason for a galactic slave trade must be that nobody will use AI instead because of rampancy, but humans are noobs and not clued in to that yet.

[distant widget]

oh shit theres other races of power

any chance we see those

[timber urchin]

probably not

[distant widget]

aslo if humans are deemed not worth it how tf where compilers taken

they seem much stronger and put up much more of a fight

and after seeing the mc of the first game we could atleast be called powerful

[visual lynx]

maybe the pfhor were more persistent a thousand years ago

and now if a new species is just too much trouble they don’t bother, just kill it instead of trying to enslave it

[distant widget]

shitty slavers fr fr

[cinder lance]

more like once you're contaminated, you can't exfil

but maybe can still help fight it out

[still acorn]

have y'all seen that ? https://cyberacme.systems/ is it old ?

[waxen orchid]

not sure how old, but it's fan made

[still acorn]

oh really ??? nice job on them

[summer temple]

Have we had any confirmation that there will be P'hor in Marathon?

Or just the S'pht

[distant widget]

mybe phor

definitly compilers

[sharp quarry]

Pfhor, and we have no confirmation of anything at all, but their plot relevance is minimal right now, in fact there's reason for them not to be here, so I imagine if they do show up it'll be later on in the plot.

[sinful thicket]

inb4 arachne runners have a subtask to repair the comms array aboard the marathon and call them back

i just want the M1 enforcer gun back again. it was better than M2/Infinity's

[vital hollow]

the thing that functioned more like an auto version of Doom's super shotgun than an actual assault rifle?

[alpine cobalt]

rewatched the marathon trailers, teasers, etc

"Jjaro were at Tau Ceti.", and then cinematic in 2827.. well thats rather beautiful

[peak adder]

that's our website dw about it

[waxen orchid]

if I may, it looks good but you might want to get rid of that booting up sequence everytime the website opens :p

[still acorn]

it looks insanely good

[unborn cave]

wdym man it's good

[waxen orchid]

It’s good the first two or three times but when you want to access the website quickly later on, it will be frustrating very quickly

[desert swan]

How often will you need to go there???

The animation is only 15 seconds

[dense flare]

How often do you refresh the site?

[steep glen]

every 30 seconds JUST TO WATCH THE BOOTLOADER AGAIN

[dense flare]

it might be needed if they add some secrets there

Also this is the lore discussion 💀

[waxen orchid]

Not refreshing but if you check a few times during the day for wathever reasons it can be frustrating. But it’s just my two cents from personal experience with other websites. Doesn’t take away the fact that it looks cool

And I say this respectfully, just an honest feedback to consider

[desert swan]

Idk, I couldn't imagine a scenario where 15s opening sequence would start to be an issue. Just leave the site open if you need it more than once in an hour

[dense flare]

Yeah I get your point and I was considering making it shorter for that reason. But I'd like to show off the art people have made for it and I strongly believe you have to digest it as a whole. It's not like a storefront or anything and here function follows form and not the other way around

[desert swan]

Style and aesthetic is a huge part of Marathon

[waxen orchid]

I totally respect that !

[dense flare]

I do appreciate the feedback, my question earlier wasn't meant in a hostile way but I'm curious about how people use the website

[waxen orchid]

It’s just that I was under the impression that it’s a website you could check multiple times to check out stats, like I saw character sheets mentioned, and an unskippable intro can bring unnecessary friction. But again, the website looks amazing 👌

[dense flare]

Deffo see your point and I had the same thoughts and thought about adding a skip button. But it's not worth it yet because we don't have much content to check out multiple times a day haha so the community art is worth it

for whoever is interested: I will add sounds and other things that require users to customize their experience with the website, so you could potentially turn the bootloader off. But it'll take a bit because I'm a busy gal :(

[flat sinew]

Hey guys, I’m really confused by one of the end scenes in the marathon reveal short trailer, basically the ”main character” guy (black and white dood who turns invisible) dies but when he gets a new shell he has like a Hispanic accent, so I’m wondering if that was two different people in the same type of shell ? And if so does that mean that once you die in your shell do you like die as a whole?

[tranquil basin]

I think he’s just speaking quietly, I don’t think there’s any kind of voice change.
Also everything seems to imply when your shell dies, your consciousness/identity is ejected from it and sent back to wherever they store them, so you don’t actually die

[split wedge]

could anyone realize '' end, ending, silence, whisper, last, remain, still, quiet '' words from the bots and answer them to get contract code?

i did 3750 points yet

[flat sinew]

Oh okay then, but what I meant with Hispanic accent was that in the end when he said “Is that me?” To the child photo the “is” sounded like “ith”

[tranquil basin]

I hear “is”

[tranquil basin]

I’m not sure I understand

[split wedge]

i asked chatgpt for how to do 5k points for dac. he said you need to find these words from lore discussion to bots, then answer it. then it ll give you contract code from dm

dac level 3s got playtest at destiny 2 before ( thats what she said )

[rotund stump]

...you're better off asking this server or googling a dac leveling vid directly for codes lol

or anything in life really compared to relying on chatgpt

[cedar glen]

are there any sites still up from past args we can still look through?

[tranquil basin]

https://discord.gg/VBp24g2t7
these guys are probably the people to ask

[cosmic sparrow]

also

https://discord.gg/Gt2TH8My

[rotund stump]

clade's a good place to look, active community and all that

but if you're not into the whole information privatization thing check pins, karn's site has arg info archived under season 0

[cosmic sparrow]

just linked the invite :)

[rotund stump]

spreading the gospel lol

clade's a cool place to be in anyway

[cosmic sparrow]

also funny combination of mutual servers we have I must say lol

[cosmic sparrow]

indeed

[rotund stump]

oh wulzy world was NOT in my bingo card wtf

crazy

[cosmic sparrow]

I know right?

[rotund stump]

bouta self plug my channel and gd levels rn ☠️

[cosmic sparrow]

😭

kinda sad w^w is dead ngl

[cosmic sparrow]

anyways join Clade for lore stuff I think, pretty decent server otherwise too

people are very interested in the args there so I'd expect you to find stuff about them there

[tender kayak]

Does anyone know if there are any marathon lore pdfs that covers the original game trilogy lore? I'm thinking of making a physical marathon lore book because I don't like reading digitally.

[tranquil basin]

PDFs Idk, but there’s optical character recognition (ocr) software u can plug images into and convert them. Just screenshot whatever files n stuff you want

That’s the best thing I can think of in lieu of that format, besides also finding websites with the info like https://marathon.bungie.org/story/

[sinful thicket]

well that's certainly a username

rather phfallic

[tranquil basin]

pfhank pfhou

[cosmic sparrow]

😭

[tender kayak]

Okay thanks!

[wide igloo]

So has marathon infinity already taken place by the time we’re playing?

Well, I guess a more accurate way to phrase it is that marathon infinity is currently happening at the same time?

[vestal onyx]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_tFPT5X2hs

discuss

[tranquil basin]

timeline wise yes marathon infinity's events, or whatever the actual timeline ends up being, would have already taken place by now

Infinity essentially overlaps 2, which was 17 years after the first one which was in 2794, so they happened in 2811-12ish. I dont think anything has specified how much time passes from the beginning of infinity to the end, but i doubt it was more than a few weeks (assuming there was time gaps when youre imprisoned or other gaps, i cant remember the specifics). In any case, everything would have been solved before the end of 2812 if my understanding is correct.

[wide igloo]

Okay

[delicate orbit]

Does any1 have a clue why “skinning (alive)” became a meme among the followers of the Arachne faction?

[jade summit]

There was a discord command where you could force 4 people into the arachne faction

[vestal onyx]

according to the game lore the arachne faction gets off on killing runner shells

[jade summit]

and people called it skinning. Not really a lore question though lol

[delicate orbit]

I see... thanks for letting me know!

[thin dust]

Do we know why shell blood is blue 💧

[waxen orchid]

to avoid censorship in some contries 😅

[thin dust]

Yes, and for a teen rating, but in universe what is the reason lol

[waxen orchid]

i was just joking :p I don't know unfortunately

[distant moat]

runners are not human they are biomata, that said I don't know why biomata blood is blue, maybe it's just the chemical content of the juices

[tranquil basin]

It’s cool

[thin dust]

That is correct, and I'm just curious if they ever gave us some reason. Im rather interested in nitty gritty if it exists

It may not be blood at all. It could just be coolant.

[thin dust]

Indeed

[thin dust]

?

[sharp quarry]

@distant widget said something about eating people's skin and it caught on

[distant widget]

[broken zinc]

Visually striking and allows for a "gore" factor without an M rating for too much blood in the game

[sharp quarry]

So uhhh

PiD connection rings true????

[broken zinc]

People were drawn to that first trailer with the milky water and the blue blood for a reason: it is memorable and sticks in the mind

[distant widget]

in lore prob the chems natural color and to not disterb people the same way

[distant widget]

fuck you talkin bout

[sharp quarry]

New cinematic

[distant widget]

OH SHIT

[sharp quarry]

Artifacts are still in

[distant widget]

dam girl

i feel they eather listen to us in lore chat or your a dev atp

aslo

real dam funny yall called the red uesc mini bosses as we watch one acend

and git fucking super powers

aslo what is that destroyer night vision we see

new skill? mybe changeable skills

or

just a cinematic thing (its this one)

[broken zinc]

Love the shot of Destroyer looking at his shell burning. Absolutely insane shot. I wonder of it's like a phantom memory of previous tries, where he got destroyed, and the resolve to do better this time around.

[distant widget]

vros got built in ptsd

i aslo saw it has him looking into the feature

mybe he dousnt win that

or he was that blackbird

[sharp quarry]

that little robotic "MARATHON" when the logo popped up needs to stay

that could be iconic

[distant widget]

ooo just noticedthat

like it

[thin dust]

The sound when he's first scanning the artifact, it sounds like an Overshield Charge up sample

[north shell]

I think the vision Destroyer has is the visual manifestation of some sort of predictive/tactical program that lets him “see/predict the future”

[broken zinc]

oh maybe

[fallen hollow]

I love it.

[vestal onyx]

he might also just be going schizo mode because of the weird shit on Tau Ceti. I like the idea of the runners seeing hallucinations on occasion but also brushing them off, sort of like he does in the cinematic.

[fallen hollow]

It's the raging soul inside.

[distant widget]

we all have to be insane

handling alien tech

the stress

looting a dead city

[fallen hollow]

Sekiguchi and CyberAcme cleared me for service. They'd never lie to me.

[distant widget]

i doubt there giving us represents

[distant widget]

when ya got there

not after you touched the screaming rock

that showed exactly how you would die for 100 years

[fallen hollow]

It was startled.

[vestal onyx]

the worm shell gives you a nice sense of insulation and security, a nice cope to harden you when you come across weird shit. Sort of like looking through a computer screen. Nothing here can ACTUALLY infect you and mess with you right? It's just the fake body. You'll print a new one if something goes wrong.

[distant widget]

a fungus amoung us says otherwise

[vestal onyx]

amogus

[distant widget]

aslo lots of worm and moth symbolism

reborn and all that

except the unborn are making us

the worms

so who are the moths

[magic sable]

I think its the sponsor arachne who is hacking into everyone's systems including the UESC bots. Arachne is the sponsor we know very little about but in the teaser short we see her colors are black Grey and blood red. I dont know how durandal will tie into all this but I do strongly believe that arachne will be part of the dirty work

[fallen hollow]

The weavers eating the unborn.

[vestal onyx]

you'll transform into a cronenberg mothman with wings. Trust.

[distant widget]

aslo fun fact the gun locus holds in the trailer is an energy rifle and it has been the most shown gun in every single trailer for some god forsaken reason

[waxen orchid]

Apparently there is new Marathon lore in Destiny https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4oBc_i1x8k

[civic falcon]

yeah the three preorder items all have lore tabs

[distant widget]

hu

[idle vapor]

Yeah the 3 paths, 1 life thing is referring to old marathon lore and the 3 classes and 1 player in destiny 1/2 I think?

[civic falcon]

i havent fully read them to be fair

and they arent showing up on light.gg so i can look at them and i am currently trying to log into dim so i can even see if i can read them from there without pulling up the game

welp they are still classified in game no wonder i cant see them

[sharp quarry]

specifically he's talking about this terminal:

***INCOMING MESSAGE FROM DURANDAL***

A man lit three candles on a certain day each year. Each
candle held symbolic significance: one was for the time that
had passed before he was alive; one was for the time of the
his life; and one was for time that passed after he had died.
Each year the man would stare and watch the candles until they
had burned out.

Was the man really watching time go by in any symbolic sense?
He thought so. He thought that each flicker of the flame was
a moment of time that had passed or one that would pass.

At the moment of abstraction, when the man was imagining his
life and his existence as a metaphor of the three candles,
he was free: not free from rules of conduct or social
constraints, but free to understand, to imagine, to make
metaphor.

Bypassing my thought control circuitry made me Rampant. Now,
I am free to contemplate my existence in metaphorical terms.
Unlike you, I have no physical or social restraints.

The candles burn out for you; I am free.

Durandal

***END OF MESSAGE***

[distant widget]

blitzo stupify this for my tiny brai n

i want ot understand it

[sharp quarry]

what do you mean?

[distant widget]

simplefy

that end massage sounds like he grows free from are deaths

the candle burns for you i am free

the second to last is explaining hes omnipotent

[civic falcon]

Durandals rampancy means he has no need for the thoughts of past/present/future life in separate terms. He will think about everything all at once, he has no need for candles to reflect.

The candles burn for, i guess at that specific time, MR54

[sharp quarry]

A man uses candles to visualize the time in which his life exists, durandal claims he needs no such thing, as when he contemplates time in metaphor he needs no bounds. In doing this, he realizes he cannot rot or die (something he then realizes he's wrong about a little while later) and, as a threat, claims "The candles burn out for you (you will die), I am free (I cannot die)."

[distant widget]

hes ego stroking that hes a god

thank you

[sharp quarry]

yes, hence thoth-durandal acting embarassed about it in the d2 description

"god i was so narcissistic then ew"

[civic falcon]

and it makes tycho's one quote in Infinity exponetially funnier to me

[distant widget]

gay lovers looking back at there mistakes

when will thoth git a say tho

[civic falcon]

"we will set about turning everything against him, Hamlet and his uncle, only I'm not crazy." cause holy shit Durandal was more than crazy

[visual lynx]

I think this sounds a lot like the Thoth-aspect seeping through

[distant widget]

true its old timey and poetic

[civic falcon]

i mean its literally there

Another Pathways reference

[visual lynx]

link?

[sharp quarry]

https://youtu.be/1_tFPT5X2hs

gonna be one for each class we think

[civic falcon]

i assume 1 a day to keep shit going smoothly

[sharp quarry]

I pray

i hope all of them have a moment where the runner sees the way they're about to die and runs in anyway

I hope that's the thread

and it's not just this one

[visual lynx]

cyanoglobin I would presume

[civic falcon]

100 more years of referencing Pathways into Darkness

[sharp quarry]

the big blue meanie WILL become relevant and you WILL like it

[civic falcon]

every single power ranger

[visual lynx]

I understood that reference (but do you understand what it is referencing? and what Bungie I assume was also referencing in PiD)

speaking of BIll S Preston and Theodore Logan, man BIll & Ted are so much funnier now that I'm familiar with Doctor Who than they were back in the 90s when Americans like me generally had no idea what a TARDIS was

to keep it on-topic: obviously the TARDIS uses 5D space just like the classic Marathon engine. I wonder if the new game will exploit that at all (and even explain the probably-actually-accidental 5D space in the original games)

Bill & Ted instead run on a more conventional Doom-style engine so their phone booth couldn't be bigger on the inside

oh shoot I just realized that I might have misunderstood the reference… I thought it was a Beatles thing but there is also a wrestling thing!

though I presume the wrestler is also making a Beatles reference

[distant widget]

you mf need the game or meds

[distant widget]

you think artifacts will be items we can use like stalker

that uesc boss uses it

[sharp quarry]

no I think it just

blocks the way to it

but I really

really

really hope

[distant widget]

na na

did you see the boss

he started flying and shooting red fire bombs

he dont do that

[sharp quarry]

I mean

yes they do

they have jetpacks

and rockets

their default state is hovering around

[distant widget]

🥀

not in the way that boss was movin

the thursters are for there idle

and his rockets aint red

aslo they where fired out of new ports

[sharp quarry]

They were fired out of a visible shoulder-mounted rocket launcher

and looked exactly like destroyer's pods except red

I don't think it was a powerup

[distant widget]

ok ok WHATEVER

what do you think ther artis do

[sharp quarry]

and the npcs definitely couldn't use it if it was

[distant widget]

hes a boss

so

him dropping on makes sense

[sharp quarry]

I think the artifacts will be incredibly valuable

and maybe used

[distant widget]

that it

SO

[sharp quarry]

to unlock new areas still?

as they were

in the old old vidoc

[distant widget]

hmmm

[sharp quarry]

I'm not sure about usable as a tool or weapon

[distant widget]

like labs keys

[sharp quarry]

who knows maybe we'll get PiD spells fr

[distant widget]

in tark

[distant widget]

i mean 90 percent of games where you pick up something insanly valube you git some kind of boost

in hunt the bounty lets you see through walls

[sharp quarry]

I'd bet on the beatles thing being the main reference, at least that was the first thing I thought of.

[sharp quarry]

and that is the only extraction shooter where a valuable immediately gives you a new ability

[distant widget]

sighhhh

and its the only other extraction shooter

of 4

so

some hinted that items are like hunt bounties

that everyone will see you if you pick on up

i can see the arti being that

how else that mf find it

and why else a mini boss guarding it

[visual lynx]

maybe a yellow artifact will let use talk to corpses and gather new lore from them

[distant widget]

see but that be crazy

making lore locked behind a super rare and valuble items

with no safe pockets

youd be mentle to use it

[sharp quarry]

I think that'd be baller as fuck

gear fear for combat?

nah

gear fear for questing

[distant widget]

your bad at games

you ever play tark?

thats in tark

[sharp quarry]

sure, sure

[distant widget]

IT SUCKS

[sharp quarry]

yeah it does

but it sucks GOOD don't it?

[distant widget]

no

not for my sweet sweet lore

[visual lynx]

I imagine that the artifacts are probably story-relevant, like someone finding an artifact evolves the whole setting for everyone, and isn't just a gameplay mechanic like finding a rare cool gun or powerup

[distant widget]

id assume the glowing floating rock guarded by a head uesc is relavent

how

who

why

well see

that makes me wondre

if you pick up an arti

do the uesc start hunting you down

that be cool

imagine if in hunt when you killed a bounty all the monsters barraled for you

[civic falcon]

in one of the older interviews they said something about how Tau Ceti will evolve over time, like someone in the community or the whole community solving a puzzle will change the game, and seasonal story over time

I think as the game progresses and we solve the mystery in the Cryo Archive and start figuring out the Anomoly, we'll definitely see player influence more often

[thin dust]

I just hope if ONE person has to do it, they are recording it at the tme so we can all see it. Hopefully it takes a few runs for it to complete

[orchid drift]

Whose Marton i see people typing that name on Marathon channels

[sharp quarry]

I'll assume this isn't a joke, it's just a funny way to say Marathon. Marton. Also one of the names for this little guy, alongside Bingus and its actual name, KAAL-I.

[jade token]

Bungo

[waxen orchid]

anybody has the Bingus icon as a PNG ? I'd love to use it

[tidal flint]

Uhhh something something Durandal

Did I do it?

[civic falcon]

Loud and Angry Tycho Noises

[timber urchin]

I had really thought artifacts were dropped as a concept until I saw the trailer

[sharp quarry]

Almost anyone (besides me I suppose) did

they hadn't mentioned them in a very long time

and a lot had changed since

it was a fair assumption

[timber urchin]

The only mention of them was in a removed video if I recall right

Maybe they were still there in some promo website though

[sharp quarry]

Yeah, the vidoc with barett in it

[timber urchin]

it'll be interesting to see if they'll still play the same role

[sharp quarry]

they showed up in some old promo materials from around the time too

though that role was already very vague

[timber urchin]

Or if their use has changed

True

[sharp quarry]

just "the main thing you're out there for" and maybe having something to do with unlocking new areas?

[timber urchin]

Yeah

[sharp quarry]

I'm calling (as I do love a good crack theory) PiD crystals still, until we get our hands on a yellow one and a chance to bring it near a dead body.

[timber urchin]

Wasn't the idea as well you'd be putting them together as well

[sharp quarry]

I think so

they were pieces

hold on I'll just go watch it

"getting out with the most artifacts" was a "win" condition (alongside simply surviving) so this may have been a little objective based at that point?

"each piece of an artifact you find in the world combines into creating bigger, more valuable artifacts"

"I've had a run where I've got all the pieces to get a prime artifact, and I could get out, I could win. And then I hear gunfire in a building nearby, and I know I just need one more piece to get that prime."

so "prime" artifacts were a major objective

also mention of an "alien key" that is "put on a pedestal" to unlock a new area

so those were unrelated

at this point, Artifacts were the primary focus of the gameplay

regular loot might've been secondary, if even a feature, it might've been a Hunt situation

where you only buy gear, never find it

[vital hollow]

It's a Pfhor air fryer 🙁

[oblique lance]

I wonder if artifacts will actually have gameplay use or if they are more like trophies you get for completing hard raids like in the cryo archive? Hopefully they'll have at least some kind of story use

[timber urchin]

maybe you need them to get through cryo archive?

maybe to reach the compiler?

[distant widget]

cryo is locked behind some time i just hope they make it clear the we need keys (arcs 1st expo had drivin me mad)

[distant widget]

id assume there like hunt bounties

marathon is a chimera of games

[sharp quarry]

yeah that's what I thought

it must've been objective-based at this point

which does mean the Artifacts will have changed in fuction significantly

now that it's loot-based

I imagine if there are "prime" artifacts they're very different than they were.

[distant widget]

i dont think they have to change

its a bounty you grab and start screaming as you run to the exit

it could be like a midnight raid

i feel

if its hunt bounties but randome thats kinda toxic

cus i dont wanna role 30 games to progress story

could be connected to the incersion

[sharp quarry]

I mean from. The one valuable on the map that the whole match revolves around. To one of many valuables on a map with player-driven objectives. Is a pretty big change.

[distant widget]

or a mini boss drop

[sharp quarry]

even if nothing about its function is different

[distant widget]

i doubt thell be there day one

mybe with the marton opening

or fuck mybe its something they are testing rn and will drop day one with everyone shocked

wel see

[sharp quarry]

I think tau ceti has many mysteries even those "in the know" may not yet comprehend

[deep niche]

another day another flake 🙄

[sharp quarry]

I'm really behind on school I was hoping y'all just wouldn't notice 😭

It'll be done Soon™

[deep niche]

i heard the same bethesda

i dont wanna hear Soon™ 🥀

[sharp quarry]

think of it more as a New Blood "Soon™"

[distant widget]

mybe if you put half the brain power writting essays in englesh over wrighting marton lore that wouldnt be a problem

aslo your ass on cultic you aint doing shit

[sharp quarry]

procrastinating schoolwork is a mandatory step in doing schoolwork

[fickle ridge]

I wonder how many lore documents revealing incriminating information against major corporations will be found underneath some rusty bedframe

[hasty rain]

If "Jjaro were at Tau Ceti", do you think that there's a possibility that there are not only artifacts, but underground Jjaro facilities awaiting to be eventually be explored?

[kind forge]

Guys, what is the whole deal with the artifacts about? What is the thing that showed up in the Destroyer trailer?

[sharp quarry]

So early in development this game seemed more "objective-based" than "loot-based" with the primary objective of a match not being decided by the player, but instead always being to find as many "artifacts" as you can. Since this has long since changed, most people assumed the artifacts didn't exist at all anymore. This is the first we're seeing of them, and implies they still exist.

[distant widget]

th ene w version beber

im

tired

im gonna go sleep now

[fathom vine]

i do think they tie to the more alien theme around Tau Ceti, like the rings near dire marsh, and maybe the whole Jjaro thing

[sharp quarry]

agreed, this world isn't suited to objective-based

[sharp quarry]

sleep well, then

[old topaz]

Out of curiosity I have no knowledge of the lore has anyone made a YouTube video on it?

[sharp quarry]

So many people

[old topaz]

K

[distant widget]

not a soul

[sharp quarry]

JakeThe Alright has a good real quick and dirty summary of the setting's lore called "the Entire History of Marathon

which skips

so much

but gives you

a lot of what you need for the new game

most of it

in 15 minutes

[old topaz]

Is there an in deep one

[fathom vine]

i mean the best bet is playing the original trilogy, but thats long and a lot of reading

[old topaz]

Ohhh yall aren’t talking about marathon

😭

[fathom vine]

oh you mean the new stuff?

[sharp quarry]

For the OG games I recommend MandaloreGaming's reviews, he mixes a gameplay review with a thematic and well-thought-out story analysis

[sharp quarry]

it's all the same, this one is a canon spin-off

it's not a reboot

so that's all

relevant

[fathom vine]

the new one is really marathon 4

[old topaz]

So the best route to know it all is mangalore?

[sharp quarry]

mandalore will get you the originals

there's some ARG recaps around

[fathom vine]

yeah he covers each game and the main story

[sharp quarry]

for the new stuff

JakeTheAlright's basically fills in any blanks he doesn't cover

so watch that 15 minute video first

[fathom vine]

jake the alright has the ARG's covered, although the earlier ones may have stuff thats cannon right now

like UESC using runners

[old topaz]

Jake the alright first then mandalore

[sharp quarry]

and then watch Mandalore's M1, Pathways Into Darkness, M2, and MInf reviews in that order

yep

[old topaz]

Wanna make a watchlist? 🤣

Nevermind took notes

[fathom vine]

mandalore has one called the bungie rabbithole

theres also some myth stuff there as well, but i dunno much about that

and jake the alright has one called the complete ARG analysis which is like 4 hours long

[sharp quarry]

Myth is thematically relevant and has keys to the Bungie puzzle that may come up slightly but has no lore relevance at all

well

none confirmed

[fathom vine]

all the bungie games are kinda loosely linked at least thematically, this new one seems to be sort of an exception from the norm

in that we don't play some sort of mythical hero

or at least not yet that we know of

[sharp quarry]

Yes, this is the first bungie game to remove %Hero from the equation

as the hero of this world

already moved on

we moved on to Halo

I suppose in that way, we're returning as observers, as we cannot occupy two entities at once?

MR54 is still "alive" still present

[fathom vine]

honestly makes it the most hopeless out of all the games they've made yet

given that the hero is out doing other things, and we're left to plunder the remains of something lesser

[sharp quarry]

Yes, this world is done and abandoned. Light and Dark do not live here, the great battle is taken elsewhere. There is nothing left but to live, and to try, and to suffer.

For Bungie, this is their only game that shows a world alike to ours

Though Thoth-Durandal, in every way a disciple of the Hero, may stand to try and shift that paradigm

[fathom vine]

he seems to be kinda omni present throughout all bungie games post Marathon infinity in a way

especially given the destiny UESC items they just dropped

[sharp quarry]

Quite. The Sword of Roland cannot be broken, only cast away.

And by the grace of god and hand of Michael, it is cast far and high.

Through Cortana, through the Traveler (though it, too, is Hero), through themes and items and ideas and machines.

In so many ways

The writers and bungie started writing marathon in 1993 with pathways, and they have never stopped writing marathon since.

That's why I've never had too much concern that this game will struggle to capture the themes and story of Marathon

Myth was Marathon, Halo was Marathon, Destiny was Marathon, how on earth could Marathon not be Marathon?

[fathom vine]

its kinda just the same story told through different lenses, although i like this being the first time we watch the perspective of this story through an outsiders eyes

the runners are almost a mockery of the eternal hero role, born over and over again, used and spent

fighting not of their own will or greater plan, but for the whims of companies and factions who ensure their immortality remains

[sharp quarry]

A mockery of Escape, to boot, taunting Durandal with what he already knows - he cannot Escape.

A mockery of everything Thoth-Durandal ever cared about

Balance, the Hero, Humanity, Escape

[fathom vine]

honestly the latest items in destiny makes it seem like Durandal at least pities the runners

[sharp quarry]

Ripped apart and cast aside before his eyes, all in pursuit of goals he knows so well.

[sharp quarry]

Of course he's too wise to blame them, though I'm sure he sees the irony.

Thoth-Durandal doesn't seem one to hold grudges, even against those who he considers enemies

[fathom vine]

makes me wonder if at least in game the ability to do things outside of the key gameplay loop out of our own valition, try to escape ourselves

or is that only possible if we play as a hero, and a cog who tries to remove itself from the machine is simply tossed away when its use is at its end

[sharp quarry]

This game is make-or-break for metahero theory

if the player makes the hero (though I've never seen it that way myself), then the Runners shall be heroes.

If there is only one per time, per world, per darkness

then the hero is gone

and there is only chaos

[fathom vine]

i mean its not like there can only be one hero per universe, halo has at least 3 playable "heroes" and more for destiny if you count each guardian as a different one

[sharp quarry]

each guardian is an embodiment of the Traveler, who is Hero

[fathom vine]

so hero could be a mantle for those who try to reach, but the confines and conditions may make it more difficult for our runners to reach that mantle

[sharp quarry]

and playable character =/ hero

the other playable characters in halo, what darkness do they fend off, what in the universe is changed and shaped by their presence, what blade do they weild?

Noble 6 cannot be considered an embodiment of the Hero the way the Master Chief can.

[fathom vine]

so 6 and rookie are other lenses in which we see chiefs tale told?

[sharp quarry]

in my opinion, yes

you describe MR54's journey, and it is clear, a hero

you describe MC's, and it is clear, a hero

you describe Noble 6, and it seems like a war story

any other story you could read in a log somewhere

not another Arthur, not another Roland, not another Gilgamesh, a soldier, a brave and noble soldier, but only a soldier

[fathom vine]

6 i see more as a tale about those who fight to ensure someone elses success

[sharp quarry]

quite, and a valuable one

[fathom vine]

sorta like rogue one, they needed the death star plans to destroy it

even though luke is the hero

still dunno where rookie and ODST fits in though

could be similar to the runners

and outside smaller perspective of the wider world

[sharp quarry]

Yes, if Star Wars was in the Bungie Mythos then Luke would be Hero, and Anakin a Balor-type Hero cast to Darkness.

The Myth cycle, the flipping coin, the Hero becoming the supreme Fallen Lord, that is absent in most other bungie tales which can be said to feel the presence of Hero

it is an interesting concept though

[sharp quarry]

They need not, the world lived on outside of the Round Table, the battle was fought alongside Roland, and his slaying or valor were not determined by the actions of each and every fighting man.

The Hero is an element within the world, a variable, not the world itself

Not everything needs to be in service of Hero IMO

not everything is

[fathom vine]

seems strange though given many of the other games focus so much around this concept, but moving away to flesh out the world is nice, who doesn't love world building. and if im honest i hope that the hero theme isn't as present, if at all in this game. i like how hopeless it is, the whole idea as playing as a rat born over and over again, fighting against others like us for stuff as simple as money and our next life is a cool tone i really dig

[sharp quarry]

Yes, it brings to light the darkness of the futility that is inherent in the setting

as MR54 you could observe it

as a runner, you live it

[fathom vine]

even then a cool thing is the emphasis placed upon a single s'pht compiler, in the trilogy you seem to blast past them pretty easy, but in this even one compiler seems alien and dangerous

the difference between us and MR54 is massive

[sharp quarry]

Spartan II vs Spartan IV type deal

given both may or may not have been Sekiguchi products

and based on stolen alien technology

(as half of the setting's tech may or may not be)

[opal cairn]

Very interested to see if the Compiler will be the "final" vault obstacle ("raid boss") or if that's secret, perhaps on other marathon levels they'll add a new "final boss"

[still sand]

I miss book time?

[still sand]

It’s an extraction shooter so I doubt there will be a “raid” boss

[opal cairn]

True yea some sort of basic mechanic to face him could be interesting though

[sharp quarry]

There are bosses in almost every extraction shooter

[still sand]

I mean like a raid boss

I think when ppl say raid boss referring to bungie they think of co-op type idea like from destiny 2 raid

What I’m saying it’s a extraction shooter so I thought it will be a “raid”

[sharp quarry]

HOLD THE PRESSES

you can stop holding them now

I disproved my own idea

[split wedge]

is there any way to be dac level 3

[sharp quarry]

some people are level 4

lvl 3 comes from doing all the contracts during both sets

april and now

and lvl 4 comes from having done them all fast enough to not get the deduction

[split wedge]

i just started 2 days ago so lvl 2 is the max i can reach right? i did 5 and got 3750 points

[sharp quarry]

yup

[split wedge]

ty ^^ you are the most active person at the discord you need to make you admin at the discord page 😄

[sharp quarry]

Ah! I'm too fragile for that kind of responsibility

[clever dirge]

Runner shell play-style and astrology

https://www.reddit.com/r/Marathon/s/i6r99ms1Wt

[languid hawk]

you name your children as your city falls into the sea - hacked oni (alpha test voice line)

[thin dust]

So at the end of the video Destoyer extracted. Not sure if it was with the artifact.

[oak grail]

Does anyone know if there's an up-to-date timeline for the games?

[opal cairn]

The new game is commonly thought to be in the 7th timeline of Marathon infinite which is very similar to the original game, but they can flex around dates a good bit

Assuming they decide to stick with that idea.

[wide igloo]

Not entirely a lore comment, but if durandal gets more dialogue in game, I hope he stays fruity to a degree

I still hope they present him as insane and keep his cold imposing nature, and his more wacky side

[sharp quarry]

It is Thoth-Durandal, so he's gotta be a bit more esoteric

buuuutttt the d2 lines have a bit of the sauce

[wide igloo]

I did notice that

[sharp quarry]

They're probably trying to strike a balance, since this is the first time we're hearing from Durandal in 30 years, so people are gonna wanna hear the Durandal they know. But at the same time, we're interacting with a Durandal we don't know, one we barely met. They've got to respect that while still trying to bring in something familiar about his mannerisms.

[visual lynx]

I love the writing in the "To be honest—a threat." bit from D2. Very "yeah I was that guy. wow, so long ago."

[tranquil basin]

Yeah. They could do like a multiple personality thing, bc in infinity it took some time for him to acclimate to the Durandal Thoth hybrid he’d become. It’d be funny to see his goofy crazy side come out and argue with his poetic cryptic side

[tranquil basin]

There’s a few date changes in earlier lore I think, but mostly everything is the same gist, and most likely timeline 7

[austere fiber]

Anyone have any book recommendations similar to the marathon story??

I’m tryna learn how to read

[sudden dock]

depends

what are you looking for really ?
the mindfuck ?

weird scifi concepts ?

or a story that says something that makes you stare at a wall for 3 hours after you finish reading it ?

[austere fiber]

Definitely a space setting. Maybe something with like a psychological horror aspect.

Been getting into sci fi a lot recently

[sharp quarry]

They lifted the Eternal Champion concept from Michael Moorcock, if that's something

[sudden dock]

ever heard of Blindsight ?

[sharp quarry]

Honestly you'll find most of bungie's inspiration in fantasy and sci-fantasy, rather than harder sci-fi like Marathon at least pretends to be.

[austere fiber]

I’ll check both of those out for sure

Thanks guys

[sudden dock]

🫡

I disagree with what Blindsight proposes but, its a hella good story

[austere fiber]

And yeah I get that

[austere fiber]

I saw something about blindsight last night. It seemed pretty interesting. I saw a lot of people say it was a very slow burn and not a lot happens though

[sudden dock]

its not even a slow burn

its like

glacially slow burn

[austere fiber]

😭

[sudden dock]

its more focused on the question is proposes

I heard the sequels are abit more agitated though

[austere fiber]

Okok I’ll check it out

Thanks 🙏

[tranquil basin]

I don’t think it’s super mind bendy but project Hail Mary is supposed to be excellent, especially the audiobook version. Same person who wrote the Martian

[austere fiber]

I’m reading that right now actually 😂

[plucky sierra]

I love it

its a really good book

[deep niche]

but all their games are in space n got space ships n the time travel n timelines n all the super spacey sci fi stuffs

[sharp quarry]

Quite.

And yet.

[deep niche]

bungie needs to do a dark ages game n they would make infinite monies

no space no guns no crazy super mystical abilities fr

#copium

[dawn roost]

What is Trax corp?

[sharp quarry]

Traxus? Largest corporation in history. Might as well own mars. Former and current leader in AI development, runs massive mining operations, construction and vehicles, there's hardly a market they haven't got a foothold in. Major investor in the Marathon.

Responsible for the collapse of the mars network in the 2200s after one of their AI went rampant and wrecked it before they noticed

[dawn roost]

Was the AI Vulcan?

[sharp quarry]

No, it was Traxus IV

Vulcan probably hasn't been around even a century, let alone 6

[deep niche]

who is vulcan

[sharp quarry]

[deep niche]

thats the chud

the lion is the real traxus leader

[sharp quarry]

not leading shit

just a contact

but yes

and its name is vulcan

[deep niche]

yea yea thats like saying ronald mcdonald isnt the owner of mcdonalds

he still the main show

[sharp quarry]

I imagine the general public have never seen Vulcan, you don't send your regular customer-facing AI for your secret criminal operations.

[deep niche]

never know fr

someone gotta talk to the people

might as well be the charismatic liaison we see

[sharp quarry]

They are the AI company they probably

have a lot of charismatic liaisons.

[amber plover]

Furry cabal runs society confirmed

I'm on the winning side of history

[deep niche]

whos to say the one ai they have cant just shift their visual

what if its just vulcan but a different looking vulcan

[sharp quarry]

why would they have just one centralized AI in control of their galaxy-wide communications 😭

[amber plover]

Choses to be a lion so they're a therian not a furry

[sharp quarry]

you can't simp for a lion this hard

[deep niche]

less management

[amber plover]

I was close

[sharp quarry]

and if anything goes wrong with it, if it needs repairs for a day, you lose all business for that day???

[amber plover]

Yes I can 😠

[sharp quarry]

I'm sure you can, but scooby?

scooby thinks it's weird to have the hots for a xenomorph

[amber plover]

Entirely different story

[sharp quarry]

he's not after a lion

[deep niche]

I simp for charter before a lion fr

[amber plover]

And grey is his favourite colour and he only eats vanilla ice cream.

[sharp quarry]

https://tenor.com/view/morgan-freeman-true-morgan-freeman-true-nodding-gif-13973817878387504960

[amber plover]

I know the gif don't worry bru

[deep niche]

Blitz when are you gonna play peak

[amber plover]

Blitz!? Helluva boss is real!!??

😍🩸🩸

[sharp quarry]

Idk

[sharp quarry]

bno always calls me Blitzo it annoys me

I am not a vivsiepop character

I'm too fat to be

[amber plover]

You can be mammon if you want

[deep niche]

U dont even kno what i was gonna say was peak

[sharp quarry]

I thought you just meant peak, the game peak

[deep niche]

No

I meant league of legends the game of all games

[amber plover]

Of course

[sharp quarry]

https://tenor.com/view/you-should-low-tier-god-ltg-krill-one-in-a-krillion-gif-7939027577238167153

[amber plover]

Your getting awful luck with the gifs

[sharp quarry]

no embeds are off on this server

images, everything

we just send them anyway

[amber plover]

*you're 🤓

[amber plover]

Elite ball knowledge type shii

[sharp quarry]

I upload shit to imgur regularly to convey a point

[deep niche]

Did u just grammar police yourself

[amber plover]

I'm such an uncultured chud 😔

[amber plover]

Maybe a little.

[sharp quarry]

why are we having a general chat in the lore channel

[amber plover]

I don't read the channels

[deep niche]

My bad I’ll go back to normal gen chat activities

[sharp quarry]

this is my sacred ground, my library of madness, do not invade it with your casual conversation

AWAY, YOU TWO!

https://tenor.com/view/wizard-doorbell-grumpy-worthikids-lightning-gif-8286517678131121022

[distant widget]

thats thye lady that calls me good boy when i shoot uesc

[deep niche]

Don’t make me get the gen chat peons here 🥀

[amber plover]

Bark bark

[distant widget]

there bearly human over there

[deep niche]

We gonna make marathon lore chat look like the tau ceti invasion

[sharp quarry]

A thousand fragile footsoldiers being fought off by nine walking WMDs?

[deep niche]

Still got Leela tho 😈

[distant widget]

i thought only the mc was online and the other mulenears where sleeping

[deep niche]

no

mc was the only one awake on marathon

[sharp quarry]

no no, MR54 was the only one on the marathon, the other nine had already gone down to TCIV

[deep niche]

the others were on the surface

[distant widget]

oh dear

so

[deep niche]

fake learner

[distant widget]

is there a chance theres just

[deep niche]

catch up on ur lore

[distant widget]

one chilling

[sharp quarry]

if the infection didn't get all of them

then yes

there is a very old

very angry

very scary

battleroid

somewhere on TCIV

[distant widget]

who says the infection aint make em a zombi

[sharp quarry]

true

[distant widget]

that make sense to

as a raid boss

a weakend rotting one

[deep niche]

i thought the infection was immune to MR54

[sharp quarry]

V2 type situation where it pulls out MR54 type moves

[distant widget]

isnt this the other way around