Tyduss - Log Review

[mint zephyr]

Please post the link from WCL in this channels for others to see.

[solemn gate]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/GTM8kbD4Fvzn1Xj7#fight=last&type=damage-done

[ocean vine]

Wcl makes it rly hard to know pull sizes without switching like 1000 times, so i will go with more general advise for things i see/notice. I will make this more of a discussion rather than stating that something is wrong

in the opener i see 20 seconds of storm/rupture/bp.
dance cdr should be enough to put it down to 20-25 secs, so unsure if it is worth it to hold your cooldowns for this long.

you don't want to wait for 2 gcds in dance between storm ticks

also secret would be better fitting as 2nd gcd than 3rd, this seems like something you repeat

also tea is used fairly late in the sequence

there is a 1 sec delay between dance and your first ability use

this seems to be just a lost global

vanish-storm is rly only a thing in mass aoe, i don't think this was mass aoe

this was better played but still not sure why secret is 3rd finisher

and why tea is this late

you only want to use tea if dance lasts for at least 4 more secs

okay, lets also look at a single target part

initially you would want to gb after strike to have a chance to apply fw

even better would be storm to have 100% chance

dance sequence is also not 100% relatable

you would strike-evi-strike-(gb if on 4 or 5 cp) - secret
with tea either before secret or not at all depending on your charges

this is a bit brutal

your first gcd in dance is 3rd one

and after that you used bp bp and secret way later

this seems inefficient

this dance seems completely wasted

why is this not a gb before secret?

also vanish with a strike very late

this dance sequence does not make sense to me

this one too
why would you use strike-strike? strike does put you on 6 cp, so 2nd strike is just wasting combo points
and no gloomblade

tea again at the end

what i also don't see at all in your key is strike in dance in aoe

you would strike in dance on up to 7 targets, with 7 you would always storm

strike in dance only with premeditation ofc

so in general a lot of things seem to be about cooldown efficiency and deficits in knowlage of the spec

or not enough practice

[solemn gate]

hmm, it does sound like there are a few things that I'm off on from what you're saying. All this time, I thought that sec tec in 3rd sequence of dance yielded more damage. Duly noted to always keep it at 2nd

[ocean vine]

things like:

• using dance at the wrong time and losing half of it
• holding on to cooldowns
• losing gcds in dance
• using a combo builder on max combo points

are all mistakes that are easy corrected when you play more

wrong cooldown or ability use is just lack of knowledge on the rotation.
you would in general use tea most of the time with dance in aoe, only sometimes on single target for example.
you can use tornado too on single target if you have it ready
the seqence in dance is also not always perfect, as mentioned lower target counts would still use shadowstrike (below 7 targets) for premeditation, gloomblade stays relevant as a filler in single target (when on 4 or 5 before secret) and secret should be used as 2nd finisher to get the danse macabre stack

[solemn gate]

and def playing my aoe wrong if I've not been using shadowstrike on up to 7 targets

[ocean vine]

its a small optimization, so its not something super important

but its nice because you also get a stack for dm

[solemn gate]

so when it comes to gb, it's actually worth using in shadow dance as opposed to only using shadowstrike? that's something I was unfamiliar with

[ocean vine]

yes

gloomblade is basically a filler ability

[solemn gate]

and I keep forget to hit tornado before shadow dance, which costs me a global in shadow dance. That's lack of practice

[ocean vine]

if you land on 4 or 5 cp before secret you can use it once to get to 6+

tornado def. is a bit tricky to use

its fun to play but idk if it is rly that strong

[solemn gate]

ooohhh, I've been thinking that at 5cp in dance you just send the finisher

better to use a gb to get to 6?

[ocean vine]

yes

but only if you haven't use gb before

[solemn gate]

being you're the expert, is the tornado build not the best in mythic +

I'm open to better builds if the one I'm running is not optimal

[ocean vine]

this is a discussion that is tough

basically, it is up to everone to decide what to play

and every talent you choose has trade offs

what tornado does well is give you a short time of compressed finisher use

so you will do a bit more damage in a short time

this is mostly relevant if you need to burst weak adds

it won't make a big diffrence in more sustained aoe

[solemn gate]

hmm, so what would be the go to talent to choose in lieu of tornado. With so many CDs, I don't mind having one less to track

[ocean vine]

so in a sense, what it does is it allows you to deal damage to adds that die fast

[solemn gate]

but that does make sense

[ocean vine]

that you else probably couldn't do damage to

or give you a small "burst" when starting a group

to bring all mobs down a bit

[solemn gate]

I will say as fun as tornado is, I feel like I hold onto for it too long since I try to pair it up with shadow dance all the time, and I tend to forget to use in ST

[ocean vine]

but i am unsure how much both of it rly matter

e.g. outlaw does not have this "burst" style aoe

and was considered way better for keys

and other dps talents improve other parts of your damage

[ocean vine]

this is the other thing to it

nothing against the spell, but the spell is barely a 1% dps increase when played optimal

[solemn gate]

I think I hear other people take shadow focus over tornado

[ocean vine]

and given that i think most players don't, even bigger runners

its hard to say how much value you rly get from playing it

[solemn gate]

would shadow focus be best talent to replace tornado?

[ocean vine]

i did suggest this in the all purpose build

hard to say if it is the best, but it takes away some pain points

it does help with energy management

and it removes tornado, that is complicated to play well

[solemn gate]

gotcha

[ocean vine]

there is also the option to take flag instead of DB in addition to that

so you would put:
tornado -> sf
DB -> flag

[solemn gate]

why do I hear so many people not wanting to take flag in keys?

[ocean vine]

its not that they don't want to

[solemn gate]

I've seen a few people go against it for some reason

[ocean vine]

it just is that flag isn't stronger

flag is good if you can align it to pulls well

but if you can't you already lose value

dm + db is always good

it does well on st (better than flag)
it does well in aoe (better than flag)

so flag is def. less appealing

even tho there is technically nothing wrong with it

[solemn gate]

okay, that all makes sense

but sorry, what is db when you say "dm +db"

[solemn gate]

you've been a big help, I appreciate all the feedback

one other thing, you mention to use gb in dance to add find weakness. is shuriken storm also work as a good filler to add find weakness during dance?

[ocean vine]

yes ^^

[solemn gate]

sweet

in ST IS GB>shuriken storm during dance?

as filler?

[ocean vine]

storm is only for fw

you else would not use it

[solemn gate]

ahh

[ocean vine]

it is due to silent storm

[solemn gate]

thank you again for the insight @ocean vine 🫡