Imp. ambush with remorseless, stealth ready after each kill. I find it pretty quick.
#classic-discussion
gray stream
But am considering combat daggers for now. If the dps difference isn't that big, I think it's worth it since it's way more fun (imo)
lean pendant
vocal hornet
@lean pendant that really good. I've been knife throwing at stuff with dots on it. I won't get healed at 60 will I.
unkempt cove
Anyone able to help explain weapon swapping?
I'm looking at macros but not understanding how it works exactly
I need to stealth so do I start with dagger for ambush then I need to restealth somehow to swap? Or vanish?
chilly coral
in classic you can swap in combat
so if i understand correctly you start with a dagger so you can use ambush then swap to a mainhand weapon (sword, mace, axe, etc.) so you can use sinister strike
vocal hornet
Your stealth macro could have an equip dagger. And your ambush could probably follow up with equip mainhand. Warriors do it with 2hr to shield swaps all the time.
Pretty sure they have the exact name of the item you are requesting.
unkempt cove
Awesome I just tested it
The only issue is the stealth macro that puts the dagger in mh can't be used as is to unstealth if I need to
I'm using
#showtooltip stealth
/Cast !stealth
/Equip wep 1
/Equip wep 2
How could I edit that to unstealth me too if already stealth
Ambush macro is what puts the mainhand back in place as I unstealth which is sweet
Also I guess it would be nice to have a WA to show which weapon is in which hand since apparently if I spam the macros it weapon swaps
modest cobalt
would this work
/cast [nostealth] xxx``` nah cant think of the command to unstealth 😛er the other way round, [nostealth] stealth
unkempt cove
Doesnt work
And holy shit how have i not been using distract to get ambushes off this whole time
I'm a changed person
signal ember
Stealth is hella different in vanilla, same with sapping
unkempt cove
I did it
@modest cobalt
It's /cast [stance] stealth
vocal otter
How long should cruel barb last for me?
chilly coral
Until 30 and then some i think
delicate stone
So it's:
#showtooltip Stealth
/cast [stance] Stealth
/Equip wep 1
/Equip wep 2
?
vocal otter
Gonna try for double cruel barb before equipping it, but yeah
delicate stone
@unkempt cove
unkempt cove
You have to type out equip weapon [name]
And add /cast [stance] stealth
To unstealth
Otherwise it will only put you in stealth
vocal otter
any decent cooking recipes I should chase for leveling in the 20ish range?
broken pollen
at 60 can horde rogues do dagger combat? or uselses due to wf
signal ember
@broken pollen You play with what you have the best, so if daggers, clear choice is to go daggers
and you could do seal fate build
vocal hornet
@unkempt cove ambush is only mainhand dagger right? So the offhand can stay the sword?
plucky nymph
Ye
unkempt cove
@vocal hornet ye. Only use daggers for ambush and then otherwise u want it offhand for poison procs and better ss from mh sword/mace/etc
plucky nymph
If you're Ambushing with your OH > _> that's likely a poop dagger.
rugged patrol
anyone got the spammable sap macro?
unkempt cove
@plucky nymph well u wouldn't ambush with a mainhand sword
My comments are in reference to a combat rogue leveling. You use sword/mace mh and dagger oh until like 32+
dusk crystal
lucky 
brisk merlin
Are you guys using crip situationally or all the time, I’ve been generally just running double instant until I get deadly
unkempt cove
Instant all the time. Crip will be fine for PvP. Deadly isn't worth it because it ruins gouge/cheap/blind and the mob needs to live semi-long for it to be worth.
I won't bother grabbing deadly until after I've gotten my mount waste of gold
novel sinew
how should I make so my sword in bag goes in main hand when I do my macro to equip that ?, I have the same sword in off hand and it just swaps both
brisk merlin
You can either macro it to the bag slot or put the weapon names in the macro
novel sinew
how do I macro it to the bag ?
fallen ridge
Hey guys can I find talent builds somewhere besides wowhead? I don't know if I'm doing it right so just wanna check what people are doing.
brisk merlin
I’m not sure off the top of my head
fallen ridge
I picked up Riposte. Is that the normal route?
cyan vessel
what reward should i choose guys?
tender canyon
Guzu has them all listed on his stream
some of the builds
https://www.twitch.tv/guzu in the description
fallen ridge
Damn thank you man 🙂
brisk merlin
Riposte is supposed to be very good, I’ve heard people recommending to take it before going into precision
cyan vessel
🙄
fallen ridge
Yeah I've got Riposte + Sprint/Evasion CD
I already have precision as well. I'm good I guess
rapid night
Hey Rogue buds. Just quickly sharing an article I wrote for Addon Recommendations - hope it helps and everyone is enjoying Classic!
cyan vessel
so the dagger is bad then?
pallid vigil
Sword of Omen MH or Outlaw Sabre MH?
exotic trellis
Sword of serenity is the fucking
HELL YEA
Idk what to say but like
You’re basically gonna use it until level 45
rapid night
^
exotic trellis
Serenity mainland until vanquisher’s sword, move serenity over to your offhand when you get vanquishers, get rid of serenity when you acquire thrash blade
shadow tapir
Hows the skill cap on rogue at max level? Pvp mostly
exotic trellis
Sword of serenity is a sword to bust a nut for tldr
pallid vigil
@rapid night is that chart accurate? cause im showing more damage with the outlaw sabre equipped MH I think because of the +15AP
exotic trellis
Highest base damage weapon goes in main hand
Highest Dps Weapon goes in offhand
Wait are both swords main hand only?
No outlaw Sabre is one handed, sword of omen in mainhand
14 AP is worth 1 DPS
pallid vigil
the damage
stat, on my character screen
shows outlaw > sword of omen in MH
damage with omen is 79-115 main hand
damage with outlaw 93-126 mainhand
are we sure that spreadsheet is correct?
red badger
are you supposed to delay sinister strike until after your mainhand swings?
neat sun
Just ran a full SM run
Went from 49 top end to 86... GG
I really wanted the mace from Cath - has a 106 top end, but the priest said no. lol
lament shard
does anyone have an idea of the old energy ticker from classic is somewhere out there? I can't for the life of me find someone that looks similiar. I found plenty of working ones but not one which looks like back in the day :(
vocal hornet
@neat sun a fat int mace? just make sure to run again with the same priest lol
plucky nymph
... yay
shadow tapir
How does rogue play at 60 in pve? Any kind of nuance to any of the "rotation"
drowsy phoenix
yeah they do
but I still cant figure out if BSB can be raised to exalted in classic and I need to verify the existence of the mobs behind CoT
neat sun
Yeah. I left. The wife was waking up from her nap. I still almost doubled my top end so I can’t complain.
plucky nymph
fuckMeThatsGood
rapid night
Been working on this WA, specifically for Combat Swords, if anyone wanted to give it a shot. Supports MH swing timer and energy ticks as well.
quartz pagoda
anyone know how to track poison charges or have some sort of poison reminder?
i cant figure it out with weakauras
@rapid night maybe u can help with this u seem to be knowledgable with WA
unreal spindle
To be noted I'm updating that trigger, new weapon enchant trigger should be comming in future alpha
hushed copper
for combat rogue dual wielding swords
what kind of sword should be in my mainhand
highest dps?
highest min damage?
highest max damage?
frosty rover
slowest one
hushed copper
why's that?
frosty rover
For some wierd reason SS dmg scale of weapon speed
like I have a dagger 1.9
and a sword 2.8
both have about same min-max dmg
(of the dagger have much more dps then)
my SS deal way more dmg with the sword
quartz pagoda
thanks @unreal spindle lmk when thats out 🙂
SS says in tooltip its wep dmg + X amount
frosty rover
ok I know
instant attack such as SS or Hemo are using Normalized weapon speed
so the SS formula is
(Attack Power / 14) * Normalized Weapon Speed + Weapon Damage + Bonus rank = Damage
So you must take the weapon with the highest dmg range possible
Normalized weapon speed = 2.4 for 1h melee and 1.7 for daggers
Ok I double checked and the weapon speed normalization happens in patch 1.8 so it's effective on classic servers
frosty rover
yes
hushed copper
alright, thanks
plucky nymph
Fun, WF should count as a weapon enchant.
pallid vigil
@frosty rover im not sure i understand the weapon speed part
plucky nymph
daggers are not considering "1h weapons" and have their own speed category.
same as retail, hilariously
vocal hornet
Are practice locks a waste of coin? I went to do the poison quest and didn't have enough lock pick to open the box.
plucky nymph
horde has that boat with infinite chests you can spam to 80 or so on
vocal hornet
Alliance?
plucky nymph
No idea.
brisk merlin
@pallid vigil if two weapons do 10 dps, one is 2.6 speed and 1 is 1.6 speed, that means that each hit of the slower one is more damage, since some abilities work based off of weapon damage( not weapon dps) slower mh weapons are favorable to increase the damage of some of your abilities
@vocal hornet there's a place in redridge filled with practice lockboxes that you can pick all the way up until about 90 skill
vocal hornet
Ok. That's where I'm at anyway. Will work.
neat sun
not really, no
Most mid-level patterns aren't very rare because of the SM GY farming that happened across the board.
plucky nymph
mmm, will see where is is
neat sun
I've found even things that are semi-rare, there's like 6 on the AH
You may get lucky, but with the chests from SM GY, I wouldn't get your hopes up
plucky nymph
The deposits are just too much atm.
unkempt cove
A lot of people are buying though
So if u can fit the deposit amount in the profit then put it up
plucky nymph
Silk is fine but that recipe is like, 30% of the total cost.
on the chance that it has to sell the first posting otherwise I am down money.
sells for 6s, AHs for 10s
Nah
void meteor
where do you guys usually level at 40?
neat sun
At 40 I'm usually finishing up Badlands and STV
plucky nymph
Correct.
drowsy phoenix
that's odd because when I was doing my turn-ins before I had an extra leaking into friendly and im at 100/6000
warped wraith
Alright, so i'm level 30 and have outlaw sabre, 35-67 damage, 18.9dps, 1h sword 2.70 speed, and Swinetusk Shank, 24-45 damage, 23.0dps, dagger 1.50 speed.
Do I still use the sword mh dagger oh, since the sword has a greater range
light musk
is their a macro that i can spam that will turn auto attack on and if energy is avail SS. Like being out of energy changing targets and starting auto attack or SS if you can
I'm spamming SS but when changing targets if i'm out of energy spaamming SS doesnt start auto attack i aalways have to right click. how can i avoid that?
plucky nymph
/startattack works just fine.
light musk
so like
/startattack
/cast Sinster Strike
plucky nymph
#showtooltip
/cast Sinister Strike
/startattack
wow nice and simple thanks
quartz pagoda
u actually dont need to update the rank
is there a way to track the charges of poison remaining as well?
plucky nymph
Not atm I do not believe so.
rapid night
SND
plucky nymph
What AoE?
chilly coral
press blade flurry when you get it to cleave
only 2 targets
and doesnt do that much dmg
only classes with real aoe in classic are mage and lock
unkempt cove
@warped wraith yes but also get a better mh
errant timber
BF on cooldown unless you know youll get it to hit 2t within its cd
otherwise yeah SnD > Evic for combo points pretty much
realistically not gonna get to spend on Evic much
unkempt cove
also around 32 u stop using dagger typically going for double swords or something like that because of specialization
U only dagger oh typically until that point
errant timber
iirc there's a bunch of good maces at that point as well
so you could do mace spec too
chilly coral
Do i have to worry about swing timers as rogue?
rugged pawn
master of deception worth investing in at all?
drowsy phoenix
im taking it later on in order to get to ghostly strike for pvp
pve it's not really useful at 60
heavy wyvern
anyone know how much hit % u need if u are human + have weapon expertise
plucky nymph
pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat pull eat 👍
drowsy phoenix
does classic have DRs?
brisk merlin
does anyone have any idea why this macro suddenly stopped working
#showtooltip sinister strike
/equipslot 16 Buzz Saw
/equipslot 17 Thief's Blade
/cast sinister strike
it says that ability is not ready yet, it was working fine and then half way through the dungeon, it just stopped
daring thunder
some might, but i've had mobs in dungeons stun lock me for about 15 seconds with the same stun
drowsy phoenix
kick missing is big memes
daring thunder
not getting pummel till 38 is a meme
time to respec into anger management for that shield bash wombo combo
errant timber
can i always have 5.5s gouge tho
drowsy phoenix
imagine kicking someone in the nuts irl full force and they just give you an intimidating look
daring thunder
i did that to someone
errant timber
it interupting casters is silly
drowsy phoenix
that's terminator level shit
daring thunder
im just sitting here why after 15 years warlocks still have no cd on fear
past leaf
have you guys seen Guzus stream?
is that bar under his frame that shows the energy regen a weak aura or is it an addon?
plucky nymph
p i c t u r e p l e a s e
shadow tapir
Would rogue be considered a high skill cap class in pvp?
silver cove
it's just basic nugenergy isn't it
past leaf
plucky nymph
Looks like Nug something or another.
He should get four more, ever increasing sizes though.
plucky nymph
NP
plucky nymph
/sigh
daring mortar
sorrry, probbaly better for off topic
plucky nymph
Nah.
daring mortar
or not to post at all?
plucky nymph
Nah I am just being a jackass :3
glossy portal
hey, whats up with sap removing stealth?
is it lower ranks or only misses? I don't roll with rogue myself, but my bro is
plucky nymph
It, and everything, can fail.
dusk crystal
thats how it is, without talent
glossy portal
is it only with talent, otherwise 100% leaving stealth ?
plucky nymph
Not enough people above 50, and I am not, to tell.
glossy portal
what was go to pve spec again? Was it combat? sorry for noobish questions 🙂
dusk crystal
combat for sure
clever kayak
So I thought combo points in classic were per target but I realized I lost them when switching targets?
E.g. SS target A, then tab to Target B and SS, do you have 1 cp on both targets or only 1 cp on Target B
plucky nymph
It's also NRG gen and not atk speed.
versed cedar
Best thing is to plan to refresh your SnD right before the mob dies but suddenly you or a group member crit too much and the mob dies with 4 CP on it :/
plucky nymph
woo, CP rot.
versed cedar
but i like the slower gameplay, not that hectic as bfa, although pressing SS maybe affects the life span of my "q" button
broken pollen
i have a question about rogues in high end dungeons (scholo/ubrs). How useless were they due to no AOE?
or were they still very good to bring
chilly coral
Not many classes really have great aoe optinos in vanilla so i doubt the lack of aoe was a drawback particular to rogues that keep them from being brought
signal ember
If you wanted aoe, you bring mage
@unkempt cove I'd do the AP pants, its 1 str/agi for 1 ap so you're getting more raw damage
the only thing you would lose is that minor stamina and little of crit.
broken pollen
i don't want to do aoe i wanted to know if in the end dungeons they were still very good to have
signal ember
Well, rogue is one of the top damage so yes, they will and are very good to have.
broken pollen
so is dagger rogue ever good as horde?
dull pilot
so, seems like pickpocketing SM is a waste of time? don't seem to be getting as much as people had suggested
(apart from leveling lockpicking and getting rogue reagents)
night plinth
does anyone know if evis/dagger build is comparable to sword combat at high lvl?
raven snow
Does anyone got a working weakaura for CC, like sap etc, but to continue to show after you changed targets? I used to deal with this in retail by setting Multitarget and it would remember. Please.
acoustic heath
ruby bridge
just play without wa's then, true classic experience
weak sinew
Hey guys this has probably been discussed and i can't seem to find a difinitive answer on Shadowpanther. In classic is there really much difference between 2 swords 1 slow 1 fast and MH sword OH dagger? For Raiding PvE
sour pewter
@weak sinew i assume ur going combat? if you read the leveling guide on shadowpanther it says during leveling it doesnt make much difference but once u get to max level which u would be for raiding having different weapons in you main hand to off hand you will lose the bonus from the weapons specialist traits in your talents which at end game is a big lose of dps hope this answers the question for you
exotic trellis
It doesn’t matter until you hit level 31, then your offhand won’t benefit from sword specialization which is a big DPS loss so yes you want to have that second sword or swap to a dagger spec.
weak sinew
What stops it benefitting? is this the chance to hit twice skill in the combat tree?
void meteor
yea, the sword specialization
stupid question, but does pickpocket reduce the amount of gold the mob drops?
thorn vector
do you get additional benefits by capping above 310 weapon skill?
thorn vector
310 is the cap to get 100% dmg from glancing blows 😛
If it goes beyond that, that is my question
latent summit
@thorn vector pickpocket goes on a separate loot table and afaik this includes money. I.E. looting 1s through pickpocketing does not remove 1s from regular loot.
versed cedar
if you think about it, its logic, cause you can pickpocket things that otherwise never drop, so there have to be separate loot tables
raven snow
@thorn vector it does not. In vanilla if you removed glancing blows it left you with hit, miss, dodge, parry on the list. Glancing blows stopped appearing on meters.
If i remember correctly you needed 13 points through racials and weapon expertise to remove them. I may be wrong that was a good 15 years ago
My biggest question will be combat swords vs combat daggers as in vanilla i played through all content with combat dagger and never lost to combat swords. However i never had the chance to loot aq ripper and the offhand from instructor to test vs the rogues in my guild that did.
winged crystal
I'm a lowly lvl 24 rogue still starting out with combat and using a swords so far. I went through a guide that had suggested for a PVP server to spec into the sub tree to hemo and then the assassination tree to fill it out, picking up imp gouge on the way. Other than losing AR/BF for dungeons and whatnot, would this drastically make me weaker for leveling? Always enjoyed the sub benefits
neat sun
It makes you weaker in the aspect of: you don't get bladeflurry and adrenaline rush
You also don't get any weapon specs, improved chance to hit, etc.
But, if you're having fun with it - then do it.
That's the entire point of Classic
winged crystal
I haven't done it yet, but I def think I have more fun with the sub stuff so I'm considering it when I hit 30 and can actually get hemo
neat sun
Classic is all about having fun - so do what's fun for you. If someone says you're playing wrong, tell them to eat a dick.
neat sun
Try it and find out.
winged crystal
but I think it should be fine. I mostly do quest grinding with friends of solo
and I'm on a pvp server and plan to pvp so stepping stones
winged crystal
It doesn't increase you DPS perse
It shows when you next swing will be so you can decide to cut off an attack or not
broken pollen
ya i kno just wondering if doing that is a big difference
winged crystal
Min maxing it helps I'm sure. Depends on the use case
For me I use it so I know of I can move around between swings, not cut off an attack early if I'm about to hit. Nice for pvp. Definitely not a necessity
I think the energy tick timer is more important
broken pollen
why?
winged crystal
You can open right before you get the extra 20 energy and have 80 after your SS instead of 60
And you can time things during the fight better
broken pollen
hmm weird lol
winged crystal
You get buckets of 20 energy per tick now rather than going up at a rate like retail
You can open right after it ticks and have 60 energy for a few seconds or open with 80 instead. Little things really though
You also will start pooling energy in case you need to kick. Helps to know for timing that. It's all little stuff
void meteor
is uldaman just not worth it?
neat sun
I plan on running it tonight
But IMO, most dungeons aren't really "worth it" other than the fact that you get to do something different.
sharp oriole
MH/OH set ups, slow + fast ? just trying to figure out why I am seeing super slow offhands on some rogues lol
quick sigil
dungeons are really only worth it for the fact you can get gear, mainly weapon, upgrades which would then help you with questing.
ive been leveling as dagger rogue and really havent found any quest reward that gives a decent dagger. pretty much have to do instances to get weapon upgrades.
neat sun
I'll be doing Uldaman - but I don't think it's an efficient use of my time.
I also don't give two fucks about being optimal
civic crest
For sword rogues you should probably get a swing timer. Since the pro of the extra swing resets your swing. So if you time your abilities at the start of your swings, you miss less total hits with your weapon
leaden moon
I’m reading conflicting sites on whether agil is 2 ap or 1 for rogues?
scenic linden
From what I've seen from moving gear its 1
leaden moon
Yeah I saw it on reddit threads but I think they’re mixing up hunter ap values or just don’t know. Wowhead guide didn’t answer
gentle notch
any thinks on sword specilisation in the combat tree? worth?
vocal sand
@gentle notch for sure, if you want to top out pve dps
winged crystal
should have seen my face when I realized I couldn't do a pve AND pvp spec anymore vanilla boys!
gentle notch
nice 
plucky nymph
We are working to open our Free Character Move service for select WoW Classic realms in the coming days.
When free character moves become available from one of the most highly-populated realms, players will see the option to initialize a free character move on either the character select screen or the queue screen of the realm.
To best prepare, please note that a character cannot move if the character:
is a guild leader.
has active auction listings or bids.
has mail.
We will post full details about the realms available and character restrictions when we open the service.
Thank you!
only from high to low pop or free move everywhere?
soft hornet
ruby bridge
high to high would be an option too. if they can move wherever
winged crystal
I avoided the queue to get in a queue
silver cove
it'll just be to whitelisted realms probably
like, gehennas/shazz/firemaw to bloodfang/skullflame
with a few options
and potentially a new fresh realm to accomodate
drowsy phoenix
moves 60 server first!
blazing plover
is there a more elegent macro for riposte/SS
so i dont get the "cant do that yet" all the time
tough pilot
Highly doubtful they let people move from high to high when the point is to shrink the high/full servers.. 
Especially since it's well.. free..
limpid blaze
turn off the sound for it?
dusk crystal
sounds like only full realms will have transfers
tough pilot
as it should be.
dusk crystal
most are high anyway, some still without queue
full realms are very very overloaded
so few realms being available when name reservation came was 
winged crystal
Mine is mostly high but still hitting 30m queues in the evening. I expect us to be left alone as acceptable vs some of the others
gaunt kestrel
does anyone know of a good ambush macro that swaps your MH to your dagger (that's in your OH), performs ambush, then swaps it back afterwards? not sure if this is possible or not
karmic bridge
Is it worth stopping leveling and going back and level up a profession so It's caught up
Wondering about skinning
No mount btw
daring thunder
depends on your definition of worth
probably would be if you don't have a lot of gold for your 40 mount
north lintel
Hi guys, im wondering if any1 got a expose armor cancel attack macro that works for classic?
karmic bridge
I have 20g right now : /
daring thunder
better get farming boye
fair carbon
Honestly skinning has been carrying my gold since I got it
Like its so good
You don't even have to AH the skins, vendoring them still gives quite a bit of cash
karmic bridge
Do you just skin the stuff you kill then sell it all when you get back to town?
Oh okay
karmic bridge
I've mostly just been holding on to greens then putting those up for auction
but I guess that doesn't seem to be doing much
fair carbon
Honestly I'm vendoring greens too
AH on Herod is too flooded right now
Like its insane
drowsy phoenix
are you gonna transfer when they allow it?
noble sonnet
GOON SQUAD
karmic bridge
What's the addon called that shows vendor prices on items
daring thunder
vendor price
unreal spindle
They are a shit ton that do that, on top of my head, leatrix plus, tsm, zygor, vendor price, better vendor price, auctionator.
broken pollen
is even attempting combat dagger as horde useless due to windfury totem?
neat sun
damn, big boy queue today... 5 minutes
No @broken pollen - just like it's not useless due to hand of justice.
zinc grove
So for sword spec, on a weapon swing timer addon, you hit specials at the start of the timer right? Not at the end?
hushed laurel
Yes, as soon after a swing as you can
exotic trellis
the MH swing right?
I keep forgetting if its the mainhand or offhand swing that resets if you get the sword spec proc on sinister strike
hushed laurel
MH
zinc grove
Second question, how much of a DPS loss is it really potentially as over just spamming SS?
drifting lotus
is rupture worth learning for levelling?
drowsy phoenix
not really
broken pollen
is there a way to make weark auras show only the first .5 sec after a swing reset
plucky nymph
What are you the fucking flash?
broken pollen
yes
plucky nymph
like so?
broken pollen
oh shit right , thx
but how do i connect that to swing timer
i can't put if trigger 1
oh wait 1 sec
damn wont work
ok got it to work. aweesome
sand cipher
do the attack speed buffs from both SnD and BF stack?
like will i get 40% with both active
broken pollen
Damn how fasts will swings be like 1 sec?
blazing plover
I used to be able to get combat dagger OH to swing under 1 sec, so yes
though that may have been BC, not 100% sure when that was
broken pollen
ugh i can't even join group gotta solo, theya ll want aoe
drowsy phoenix
it's nice that blizz let grob players move to DD in case they were eastern
ngl I'd move to a realm named arcanitereaper if I were on herod
broken pollen
nice
last mirage
when looking at weapons, should i care more about the dps, or the actual weapon damage range?
last mirage
its just for leveling, but ive heard that wepons are the most important upgrade and im not sure which im suppose to comapre
well isnt the dps based on the speed and range?
karmic bridge
It might also depend on class
last mirage
i have a dagger while leveling, that is faster and has more dps, but worse range than a sword
combat, no specific weapon spec yet
im avoiding those until 60
errant timber
lower dps, slow weapon will typically be better for special attacks (yellow hits)
last mirage
that makes sense, but i would guess my autos are a bigger part of my daamage?
so i should compare the dps more?
errant timber
you want the damage range more than anything else
last mirage
idk im just trying to learn what i need to know for when i actually hit max and find out what matters more
ok, so forgo dps for damage range
stray whale
when do u decide to use garrote vs cheap shot i see some conflicting statements on some leveling guides
ive just been using cheap shot mostly feel like its more value to just not take damage for those few seconds
last mirage
Main hand: base weapon damage. Offhand: DPS. someone told me that, and i think that makes a lot of sense
karmic bridge
It's probably more wise to cheap shot to stay healthier
adds more value than a few ticks of damage imo
in solo content at least
stray whale
ye true ty vel qt bb
gentle walrus
ambush GG always mae target go under 80%
frosty rover
any rogue trying to solo some stuff ?
Not the best way to leveling but it's fun i'm farming the 3 rare in scarlet graveyard xD
exotic trellis
@errant timber is that a sword of serenity?
frosty rover
Your autos is a big part of your damage if you are consistantly hitting which is not always the case at lower level
frosty rover
low hit chance, mob higher than you might dodge parry miss erase every hit etc...
plucky nymph
Just get a Cath hammer /shrug
frosty rover
so it's probably better to take a weapong with a bit less dps but a better weapon dmg range for leveling
errant timber
@exotic trellis it was yes
frosty rover
I'm stuck with Van'cleef saber 😦
tried to farm the hammer from graveyard, killed the mob 5 time, he gave 3 time its shit mail chest and 2 time its ring ...
gloomy hawk
any reccomended dps meter addon for classic?
sand cipher
details
gloomy hawk
thanks
frosty rover
only add-on I use is Vanas KoS 🙂
plucky nymph
high speed makes the RFD reward have lower damage than healer mace
and you can get them around the same time.
plucky nymph
RFD is the level 38 quest reward.
Both have ~30DPS and are weighted as similar item level.
errant timber
Ye
exotic trellis
well vanquisher's sword is mainly an offhnad
plucky nymph
It's 37 actually I just don't think I ever grabbed it, either way the weighting betrays Vanq. due to speed.
errant timber
Vanq probably wins out because that's hella attack power
plucky nymph
¯_(ツ)_/¯
It's leveling I don't care about DPS I can about giant numbers.
Can use Vanq. or the SM sword for OH ezpz probably Vanq. due to the AP.
frosty rover
AP work that way on instant attack such SS : it add (AP/14)*2.4 dmg to your attack
such that SS dmg is basically (AP/14)*2.4 + Weapon DMG + SS Dmg (from rank)
this is regardless of your weapon speed, but the more dmg weapon you have and the more dmg you'll deal with SS
so that 28 ap only add 4.8 dmg to your SS and this is at lvl 60 tho, it's even less pre60. (around 12 AP per dps I guess at lvl 30)
MB it's more but nvm the TL:DR is that Weapon DMG > Everything 😄
gloomy hawk
any addons that could show my combo point on top of my target?
versed cedar
its a dagger 😉
cyan vessel
so?
versed cedar
dont know what you wanna know 😉
cyan vessel
aight mr 😉
verbal tiger
so i just started a rogue and the gameplay is just dodge/parry/miss on every mob
does it get better
exotic trellis
no not really
you dual wield, 19% miss chance or something like that, on top of weapon skills maybe not being up to snuff, you get precision later on which gives you 5% hit chance which helps a fucking lot but it doesnt really solve the problem.
cyan vessel
34 @exotic trellis
exotic trellis
Idk how I feel about it
I personally went sword spec for levelling since I can guarantee good swords basically until I’m level 60 at this point
So id have 0 uses for daggers
But if you’re going dagger spec then yea it’s a good dagger.
cyan vessel
u can OH daggers
idle cedar
speaking of swords - why do we use a weakaura and try to time SS/Evisc with the end of white swings?
exotic trellis
Yea but then it doesn’t work with sword spec
cyan vessel
what dosent work with it?
exotic trellis
The extra hit from sword specialization
It still happens on the autoattacks from your offhand
exotic trellis
Imma be honest I probably am too.
idle cedar
still though, I'm obviously missing something
exotic trellis
You said a weakaura for at the end of white swing animations?
exotic trellis
Oh funnily enough this also has to do with sword spec
idle cedar
yeah, asking why this would be helpful
exotic trellis
So if sword specialization procs on sinister strike or eviscerate, it’ll reset your swing timer
exotic trellis
So you want to have a swing timer and use SS or evis right at the beginning of your swing timer
Cuz every 20ish SS/eviscerates that you do will reset your swing timer
Rng being rng of course
idle cedar
so don't hold to cap for it or anything but when you've got the chance, do it
thorn vector
so ideally, you would want to auto+SS+SS+auto depending on your speed of the weapon? Fast MH would simply be bad then, since you would lose autos overall?
You would actually lose burst if you start combat with a combo builder then? due to how swing timer is reset?
winged crystal
without sword specialization, sword in the mh and fast dagger in the oh is the way to go correct?
thorn vector
technically no. practically yes.
from 1-20, 2 slow weapons are ideal. after 20, when you gain the ability to add poison, fast OH is indeed stronger
but it is without doubt, relying on your talent choices.
versed cedar
what poison combo is advised ?
at the moment im using double instant, cause I have only instant and crippling
but is deadly a thing for leveling and dungeons ?
i know for raids i dont use deadly cause of debuffs slot, and also cause of wf totem
thorn vector
2x instant is what I would do until mobs take a longer time to kill. Then I would use deadly
winged crystal
i'm combat now at 24 but once I get to 30/31 I'm going to spec into hemo for a more pvpish leveling build on the server
have poisons so I've been using a 1.5 speed dagger I found and a 2.7 speed mace
sharp grotto
Imho hemo + mace stun build will be best
If that’s the kind you want, or you could go ambush / backstab lock down build
plush perch
sup, my poison doesnt seem to proc very often on this wep https://i.imgur.com/kDOc7EX.png
doe sthe proc just take priority?
i was looking at it and i was sitting on 35+ stacks still after 30 minutes
while my mainhand was almost empty
sharp grotto
It’s the slowest offhand you could have it won’t proc near that much
winged crystal
when I get more pvp oriented at 60 i'll probably just go full daggers. the mace I found in a dungeon and was more dmg than the sword I had and since no specialization yet didn't think it would make a difference
modern sandal
isnt a sword with less dps but with swords spec does more dmg than mace ?
winged crystal
it's only a sword spec if you take sword specialization. at lvl 24 I can't even get close to it
mossy terrace
If you're leveling on a PvP server, is it still better to go sword spec, or subtlety?
mossy adder
Im going sword spec but im only level 25 so far so im just starting to get into contested zones
mossy terrace
I guess even if you plan on going sub for leveling due to PvP, combat is still optimal till level 30 (when Hemo unlocks), so perhaps the best option is to start the combat path, and at 30 decide whether you move on with Combat, or go Sub. Thanks anyway
winged crystal
that's what I think i'm doing, but i've also always liked the sub stuff
won't switch until 30 for hemo because a 45 cost SS is awful
mfw I sapped a target and came out of stealth. oh, so that's the way it used to be huh
ornate jetty
Imp sap BABAY
gloomy hawk
for human rogue
sword main hand is a must right ?
what about offhand
do i have to use sword offhand too?
mossy adder
Sword or maces will always be better as a human yes
latent summit
anyone got a working riposte-triggered WA ?
void meteor
trigger action usable -> Riposte
although it doesnt show up when riposte "procs" but on cooldown
all the other weakauras use that trigger so i dont think its possible
sharp oriole
I know we're a rogue channel but i wanted to get an unrelated class opinion, the gf's never played wow. she's been watching and wants to play, she's decided on paladin, to be a pocket healer but aside from heals how do they hold up for pvp, I remember a guild member back in the day getting Grand Marshal pretty quickly and he was ret/holy or something I dunno but obviously what was bad back then isn't gonna be necessarily the case because we're not new this time around. Made her go human for some kinda mix/max lol
winged crystal
for healing i'd go pally or pirest but i don't know much about them
gloomy hawk
resto druid isnt good in classic?
sharp oriole
i dunno , i know if you go resto druid now and get good
hasty ruin
Hey guys, is there an add on that tracks stun duration on an enemy?
sharp oriole
your pretty much set to be r1 glad every season of ladder if the last 5 expansions have told us anything lol but I tried to convince her to try druid but nadda, figured we could stealth run dungeons together without groups and for wpvp it woulda been nice to have her hide till she needed to heal. I mean we will probably never seen arena's on classic realms. But its one of those things you know they end up broken asf...haha.
sand cipher
they are the best 1v1 spec in the game
sand cipher
pve-wise though, unfortunately you can only really have one spriest per raid group
also they arent amazing in premades, would rather take a lock in most cases
but for 1v1, they're king
sand cipher
yeah for leveling you wanna go something like this
endurance is kinda optional i'd say. so is improved sprint, but having a way to not just get instantly invalidated when a mage or hunter is on your screen, is pretty nice
winged crystal
basically put those 5 pts into sword spec if you'd rather then little extra and give up a little extra defense
sand cipher
this is only a lv40 tree mind you
i'd probably get sword spec with the last 5 points before 60
that's just my personal feeling though, because once you have that talent you have to start holding your sinister strikes, and thats gonna feel pretty sluggish
gloomy hawk
riposte is that good?
winged crystal
I went 4/5 parry and realized I forgot precision, am now 5/5 in that and finished parry, next point is riposte. I kinda bounced back and forth but didn't want to spend the respec fee
but swapping at 30 so it's all kinda moot anynway
gloomy hawk
its 1 g rte?
winged crystal
i haven't even checked yet but I think the first few are pretty cheap
gloomy hawk
i might respec
sand cipher
thats okay too tbh, hit is extremely important
sand cipher
but i wanted that extra button to press asap, to keep my sanity lol
winged crystal
I still have backstab on my bar just holding that spot for riposte
winged crystal
that's why I didn't swap the 5 pts in my early 20's lol. but i'm going into sub for hemo at 30
gloomy hawk
are poisons hard to make?
sand cipher
gotcha. at 60 i may go hemo swords. i ultimately want to play the prep daggers spec for pvp, but there arent great daggers in the game p1, and that spec is garbage for raiding
nope @gloomy hawk the vendor sells everything you need to make them
winged crystal
yeah I'll go daggers again at 60 like I used to. but leveling on a pvp server, I want those sub benefits
gloomy hawk
blind powder and everything is in vendor too?
sand cipher
not blind powder
winged crystal
blind powder no
sand cipher
but everything else
my advice is to macro pickpocket to every one of your stealth abilities. you get a lot of rogue reagants for free
winged crystal
i'd have to use stealth first 🤣
sand cipher
yeah just /cast pickpocket /cast ambush
lol yeah that is the struggle. i didnt even bother casting stealth until i got rank 2
winged crystal
2 lvls until CS and then it'll be worth it again
sand cipher
even still its ass
winged crystal
casting SS from stealth is just so lul
gloomy hawk
isnt ambush is just better
sand cipher
ambush does more weapon damage %
gloomy hawk
whats the point of backstab then
winged crystal
doesn't require stealth
sand cipher
you can use it out of stealth
gloomy hawk
ah
winged crystal
but it's shit to lvl with
sand cipher
yes
winged crystal
which is why it's bad for leveling
gloomy hawk
gouge requires way too much energy..
sand cipher
you can technically "front stab" mobs while leveling but its a pain in the ass
winged crystal
1 BS every what? 5-6 seconds?
I saw a video that doesn't work, unless you have high pings
winged crystal
forget everything you know for xpacs
sand cipher
i can do it reliably but you reallly have to mash those strafe keys
winged crystal
vanilla is so much different
sand cipher
you'll get tendonitis by 60
winged crystal
it took me 5 saps to realize how it worked in vanilla
winged crystal
in pvp it can be, cold blood was really fun
sand cipher
cold blood is like a swifty oneshot meme spec
you will kill people out in the world before they can press a button
but it's not a big boy true spec
winged crystal
but it's such a fun feeling haha
winged crystal
i think that's fine, I"m horde this time so don't know for sure
north lintel
Hi guys, I'm looking for an expose armor stop attack macro for classic and I can't seem to find one. If anyone have a working one, please enlighten me!
winged crystal
you kinda of have to decide what you want to play and build around that
bold prawn
in redrige mountains on the practice lockboxes u can just keep lockpicking them and level up is this intended ?
feels like an exploit
bold prawn
cool thanks
winged crystal
there's no items in the chests
bold prawn
was this a thing in vanilla too?
winged crystal
and when you need to do your poison quest, go back and max your lock picking again before you start it
yup, right in that spider forest right?
bold prawn
yea
winged crystal
sweet sweet memories
bold prawn
thats op
bold prawn
it keeps freezing me aswell for some reason
gloomy hawk
i got stuck at 95
winged crystal
you out level them eventually
bold prawn
ye i keep getting levels
winged crystal
you can only max to what your lvl is or until they turn grey
that's what I meant, just get it as high as they will let you
winged crystal
i went when it gave me the lock picking quest, maxed it to 80 I think?
then for the poisons I leveled it again to like 100 before doing that
urban rapids
Stops at like 110
But it's slow exp theres a better lockbox
N u get trunks from pick pocket
sharp oriole
faster weapons in oh or is it better ratio weapon off hand?
unkempt cove
@sharp oriole faster oh
Unless you're double swords/maces for example and you have a big DPS difference in weapons. Then you want best weapon mh
winged crystal
seems like it would work if you are really insistent on using SS
The build I was going takes hemo and skips combat except for imp gouge
sly shuttle
Well what i am asking is obv impossible
winged crystal
oh, you said pvp and pvp
sly shuttle
But I want a mixed pve/pvp build like the sub who doesnt wants to spend golds on respec
winged crystal
i mean, world and regular pvp aren't that much diff
sly shuttle
Kicking asses in world pvp and be as good as possible in raids
That's what i am looking for
winged crystal
yeah vanilla is really a pick 1 and be worse for the other kinda thing
I plan on specing into sub with hemo and meh for pve. It'll be fine for leveling and normal content. it won't top meters against a full combat rogue though
but that's the trade off the for sub talents and a bit of pvp on the side
sly shuttle
When you are, like I, on a pvp server, be a full combat pve rogue is a hard deal
You'll be kicked out
fair carbon
winged crystal
it's not that bad, you just don't have some of the sneaky tools like improved stealth and what not. it's just a trade off
like most people buying a car want fast and cheap, but generally you settle for fast or cheap because you can't get both. doesn't mean it's a bad car, it's just better in 1 thing than another
sly shuttle
Sapping and being un stealth... lel
What a joke it is, combat is basically fury warrior with poisons
Yes but people are saying sub in pve is as bad as a naked ret pally
fallen panther
Classic pve 
winged crystal
does anyone know if all the tuning is the same is was back then? when Rags went down in 6 days I was wondering if things are tuned differently or if people were just really bad at the game back then
fair carbon
People were bad and resources were scarce
fallen panther
Yeah most people had no clue about anything
Most were clickers etc
It just wasn't anywhere what it's now
winged crystal
makes sense. just wanted to confirm because 6 days isn't a lot of time to gather resources in game for much haha
errant timber
the people who killed it have literally been farming those bosses for 5 years
idk what you'd expect
fallen panther
Bunch of sleepless nerds
fallen panther
Also true yeah
fair carbon
Not me 
winged crystal
taking off work to sit in queue lul
sly shuttle
And those people are as dumb as stupid
fallen panther
Yeah that's gotta suck
fair carbon
I didn't really sit in a queue
Because I would so something else while I was in queue
errant timber
i was pretty much expecting every boss to die as soon as it was able to be killed
fair carbon
do*
errant timber
if that makes sense
winged crystal
mine hasn't been awful after the first few days, was at about 30 mins around 7PM towards the end of the week. last night was only 5m
fair carbon
The worst queue I had was the day after release
errant timber
soon as they had enough people to make damage check and survive, bosses die
fair carbon
15k
sly shuttle
Imagine playing wow at work
fair carbon
And I queued at 3:30 and didn't get in until midnight
But I had classes so it was pretty okay
winged crystal
I remoted into my comp yesterday on my way home expecting a 30m queue, there wasnt' one. got home and it was at 5m. very tolerable
fair carbon
Lmao
Yesterday my queue time was so perfect
Was on the character select as soon as I walked into my room
After class
winged crystal
yeah, I booted up, went and got a drink, snack, pet the cat, came back and ready to go
fair carbon
What I was doing the first few days was sleep, then queue a few hours before I wanted to play, go back to sleep for a few hours
Bam
In
fallen panther
I still couldn't even get myself to play the old shit game 
guess nostalgia is not my thing
fair carbon
Honestly the community is very good
fallen panther
Yeah but the game man 
winged crystal
surprisingly
fallen panther
Many people do and all the power to them all
I just can't go back to that old mess
winged crystal
yeah I'm looking forward to 6 more lvls and leaving combat
winged crystal
oh yes, it's clunky as hell
winged crystal
i don't even know how they can make wow feel this way again. lots of the stuff that makes it vanilla is just so bad
but 1 change I absolutely hated was scaling everything to your lvl, really looses that progression feeling
fair carbon
All they had to do is just NOT add LFG
And Xrealm
That would have at least saved some of the community aspect.... because heaven forbid you communicate in an MMORPG
winged crystal
all the things we liked back then, even transmog. I'm seeing how transmog takes away from the immersion
winged crystal
you can't just see a player bouncing around and be like oh shit, he's got that goooood gear
winged crystal
i like the deathstalker set
winged crystal
bloodfang is and always will be my favorite though
I still remember killing Ony and getting that hood
taking it off in BC physically hurt me
fair carbon
Honestly I can't wait for Naxx and getting Bonescythe
winged crystal
naxx was never attainable for me back in the day. didn't have the opportunity to get there
fallen panther
Nah I never bothered getting it back.
exotic trellis
Naxx will not be an attainable goal for so many people even now
The amount of time you have to spend every week farming consumables if you’re not already a richboi
Idk if I’ll even go as far as AQ
fallen panther
Maybe
exotic trellis
I’ve seen footage of people doing it on private servers, mages are fucking bandaging themselves cuz the healers just can’t heal them cuz they’re too focused on the tanks and higher priority targets
winged crystal
private servers are tuned
I played on elysium before classic went live, it was much harsher
exotic trellis
Even naxx? We had numbers for naxx though.
winged crystal
I can't speak to specifics
errant timber
p sure they literally said rag felt undertuned
fallen panther
We shall see I guess
The real issue we had back in the day was having those tanks all log on
errant timber
i mean it's gonna be less an issue now
exotic trellis
Yea I know some pserver communities buffed shit like ragnaros and elites in dungeons because they thought it was too easy
errant timber
because you're not going to seriously try to do naxx without getting 8 tanks before hand
not gonna blindside you
etc
exotic trellis
We’ll see in a year’s time when naxx comes out
fallen panther
Yeah
exotic trellis
But yea if it’s as bad as it was on private servers
fallen panther
I mean people might make a sport of doing it sooner and less prepared tho
exotic trellis
Those consumables aren’t for your damage.
They’re for you to not fucking die.
And also for your damage for bosses like Loatheb or patchwerk
Oh jesus the nature resistance potions that you needed during loatheb
errant timber
is it bad that when i get resisted trying to pickpocket
i just imagine reaching in and touching the dude's hand cause i didn't notice
like "o fuk"
sharp oriole
lol
fallen panther
Seems about right 
winged crystal
wasn't his hand
fallen panther
errant timber
exotic trellis
shoulda had sleight of hand pro on
errant timber
oh god the absolute madmen long range knives
sly shuttle
Is Blizzard really wants rogues to delete their char with lokpicking ?
Why putting 3 chest for a whole world into the map ?
winged crystal
you mean at lvl 20 to start lvling it?
i'm horde and on the boat there was like 10 boxes to open. I just alternated between 2 of them back and forth
hushed laurel
Engi is BiS for like... everyone
winged crystal
goblin jumper cables 
cyan vessel
how bad would it be to OH serenity?
winged crystal
it's pretty slow for an OH but i'm not sure if the proc out weighs that
cyan vessel
this is why im not sure
i d have to OH serenity for that mace
im selling any good boe's i get
so i have shitty weapons atm
winged crystal
pvp or pve? In pve i'd wager absolutely not. for pvp, I don't know how important that poison application is from the OH which is generally why you want a fast OH to begin with
frail willow
Guys, i dunno where to ask, but i thought it would be an appropriate place
Leveling in dagger-pvp build is a bad idea or i should stay with sword build?
Got no interest in group content whatsoever
gritty goblet
dagger build is mostly in group content
solo lvling benefits much more of riposte swords
gritty goblet
well its better than just 1 is it?
broken pollen
lol true
dusk crystal
another target and more attack speed
orchid plume
Is sinister strike best using slowest weapon possible?
rigid flame
Question for you fine peeps. Anyone else having an issue with stealth? It keeps bugging for me and once I'm in stealth I can't voluntarily come out of it until I fully log out or hearth. Really getting annoying. 😧
plucky nymph
Great these are back.
tough pilot
does anyone know how much devilsaur gauntlets sell for usually?
wicked wyvern
Quick question, what's that addon that shows energy regen?
sharp grotto
@tough pilot guy on our server making them was making them with the buyers mats plus 10g
I can almost make them lol can’t wait
plucky nymph
@wicked wyvern There's a few
wicked wyvern
The one that's like a small yellow bar that keeps filling
unreal spindle
Idk just made one myself with wa 
vocal hornet
I like SS with a fat Mainhand. so idk.
errant timber
its just BIG pog
vocal hornet
i dont like positioning and bothering with the backstab. when solo, im punching stuff in the face getting riposts and snd. on to the next one. Ambush gouge backstab seems pretty shitty if you got a 2nd mob.
but thats just me.
and SS likes fat weps.
big bonks.
fossil steeple
dagger specs is mostly for group leveling anyway
fringe sail
would a 2 sec offhand be considered fast or slow?
silver walrus
mhhhh my intention is to open with ambush than i dodge alot and so cp regen faster so more eviscerates than there is parry too and in the end of fight u have more life i think so no spending much time in recover
idk
fair carbon
I'm. SO FAST! 