assassination

[strange python]

is this even right dragon scale sim better than raden trink

[balmy condor]

Yeah it happens sometimes

Vita doesn’t sim with party buff

Run the vita

[strange python]

oh your right forgot about party buff with vita

ty @balmy condor your the man!!!!!!!!!!

[balmy condor]

No problemo

[strange python]

what im going to do without you man

[normal olive]

I can help you with more dmg output on fights too

some opener help never hurts

[balmy condor]

I’m not disappearing for shadowlands lmao

I’ll be around xD

Hell, I might play sub and still answer questions in here cause I’m not needed in the sub channel

Who knows

[umbral rapids]

We need you here

[normal olive]

I'ma play priest and still send you guys fucked up openers

[balmy condor]

Well you don’t need me

But it’s probably a better discord experience ™️ if you have a dumbass who answers everything instantly

[normal olive]

All i can do is being dumb

[hallow coyote]

Really hope sub is in a better spot in SL

[umbral rapids]

Shutup

[hallow coyote]

Want to try that spec one day. Sin looks like it will be fine

[umbral rapids]

I need you here

[normal olive]

[umbral rapids]

[normal olive]

Don't worry i'm not going anywhere

Just like my openers

[crimson palm]

Want to try that spec one day. Sin looks like it will be fine
@hallow coyote sin is dead, sub is pump

I can see assa being played by masochists

[hallow coyote]

Kind of hard to prognosticate about SL without knowing any of our legendaries and stuff

I'll definitely shift over to Sub if it plays better though, and the changes look promising so far

[normal olive]

I'll stay Assa no matter what

[crimson palm]

20 apm spec on beta atm

[normal olive]

Yeah it plays like trash

Gonna play Disc or Balance if Assa is trash

[hallow coyote]

Yeah I don't think Ill be able to handle the haste lost at 9.0

Going from 70% haste to like 10% is going to blooooow

[crimson palm]

Wonder what sort of anti sleep pills koji took while he was testing

[shrewd night]

[umbral rapids]

gz

[shrewd night]

@drifting cloud look its not only trinkets

[normal olive]

Mechagon rings? Those don't exist

[balmy condor]

Maybe koffing can parse

Also imagine pawn in 2020 from a ravenholdt mod

Tsk tsk tsk

Youre slippin

[spice spire]

[quartz depot]

maybe he's just an addon hoarder like some of us

[stable radish]

I know 3x Shroud is the recommendation, but my 480 hood of the slithering loa (double dose, swirling) sims higher than my 465 gibbering maw by ~200 dps. Is that enough of a margin to pick the 480 over the 465?

[shrewd night]

Nice one hemo

[crimson palm]

Nazi mod

[normal olive]

[balmy condor]

@stable radish that’s up to you, I personally wouldn’t do it, because cleaving garrotes is pretty gud, but for single target, sure. DD is still a good trait with all the haste we have

[cosmic jetty]

@strange python is it better to roll expedients instead of crit?

like severe / strikethrough?

[stable radish]

thank you, think I'll stick with shroud as my haste isn't really where I want it yet

[sullen pagoda]

ss becomes better with more haste not worse

[strange python]

@cosmic jetty with exang build you gotta run a lot of expedient haste is better for the build

[cosmic jetty]

ahh okay, ive got some severes + strikethrough in my bag atm

but unsure what to put it on because i don't want to put it on anything lower than 465

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4KfVEbKdW42ydMAwtiXiJE

[stable radish]

Ah thanks @sullen pagoda, that might explain why the 465 has slowly been closing in on the 480 when simming, as my haste slowly improves

[strange python]

With Azerite you got better with crit try sim it man echoing blades likes crit i think, I just like axanguanate build I can use it in dungeon and ease don’t have to change gear

[final harbor]

im at like 52% haste rn and the expedient build fucking pops off for me

way better than DD and appendages imo

it sims way higher

[strange python]

*raid

[balmy condor]

I smell sims

[strange python]

@balmy condor I think @cosmic jetty need help with his corruption

[balmy condor]

Yeah I see that

Looks like more than that

I’m fixing it atm

Is that a raid set? Feels like m+

Dungeon slice

[strange python]

@cosmic jetty you gotta ask @balmy condor his like the Jedi of sin rouge

[final harbor]

crit and severe im pretty sure is better than exp in mythic+

[cosmic jetty]

M+

please

[final harbor]

Playing echoing blades is better than the haste build in m+

[cosmic jetty]

im more focused on M+ than raid tbh

[strange python]

I use my exang build in m+ and it does produce some decent damage

[final harbor]

I would go like triple shrouded triple echoing and stack crit

[balmy condor]

Haste is fine

[final harbor]

isn’t it worse on maps with big trash pulls?

[young dust]

crit and severe im pretty sure is better than exp in mythic+
@final harbor not sure in tyrannical weeks though

[balmy condor]

Tyran weeks definitely not but no one pushes tyran weeks

So that’s kind of a mute point

[final harbor]

i feel like its better for like 3-4 trash pulls

[balmy condor]

Haste does fine though even in something like freehold

If you’re giga-pulling like 3 packs every pull, probably not

[cosmic jetty]

ive got 2 strike throughts + 2 severes in my bag and 1 expdeint atm, pretty random

[balmy condor]

But it’s still fine

[strange python]

With 15+ my exang build produce some decent damage

[final harbor]

I just started playing sin in m+ like a week ago, switched from olaw, previously sin was just my raiding spec but im having more fun with it in m+ than olaw

[cosmic jetty]

i think the last time i simmed toxic blade came out better

[final harbor]

than use it

[cosmic jetty]

yeahs i can't hack outlaw in M+

the Rng wrecks me too much

[balmy condor]

I play haste in 20’s and stuff sometimes

But I prefer crit

[final harbor]

the rng is alright but i hate the single target damage

its like tickling the boss

[balmy condor]

I mean

[high salmon]

hi guys, i usally just play rogue as a alt, and start raiding on it late in the tier when ive cleared the raid and had a few reclears, now im starting to play it more in raids, but ive always struggled a bit with how to deal with two targets (like 3rd boss bod and hivemind this tier), do i just keep up garrote rupture and crimson tempest on the 2nd target? and on opener do i just do my full on opener on 1 target or do i garrote and rupture the other target aswell first ?

[balmy condor]

It’s still not awful

Crit is slow but it does quite a bit with all the cp generation

It’s certainly not bad

[cosmic jetty]

i feel like i cap out

when im FoK

then rupture each as i can

then go round envenom

[final harbor]

go round envenom?

[balmy condor]

@high salmon you would maintain bleeds on both and then funnel envenoms into one

[cosmic jetty]

but is it better to just carry on FoK

rather than envenom

[final harbor]

just keep ur dots up

[balmy condor]

You only rupture until you can sustain energy if you’re going a crit build

From then you spam fok, and maintain EP

[high salmon]

@balmy condor and just open on one and just put up bleeds on the other target after my opener ?

[cosmic jetty]

whats EP?

[final harbor]

i garrote rupture garrote then switch to my second target and garrote rupture @high salmon

[balmy condor]

Elaborate planning

[cosmic jetty]

ah okay

[balmy condor]

@high salmon with subt you gar1 gar2 gar1

[umbral rapids]

hm why not gar1 gar 2 gar1

[balmy condor]

And then rupture, opener on 1

[dull crypt]

Inb4 it meant energy points all this time

[umbral rapids]

:)

[final harbor]

only 2?

[balmy condor]

Then get rupture/CT up and maintain

It’s definitely worth triple garrote on 2 targets

[high salmon]

thx 😄

[balmy condor]

100%

[final harbor]

hmm ok

[umbral rapids]

i mean

you get 3 empowered garrotes

[final harbor]

that makes sense

instead of only on one target

[umbral rapids]

yah

[balmy condor]

@cosmic jetty https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/c6wzAnisLDHsFkRaQhevoN

So I would play vigor/PB with this

But you can make your own decisions about that

The ramp time is pretty slow with DS and you run into some issues with triple garrote from stealth if you drop your haste

On bosses it’ll feel like dog as well

But something like that is fine

[cosmic jetty]

okay, il give it a try

thanks!

[quasi pewter]

take hod instead of ttk

on shoulders

[balmy condor]

TTK is fine with the crit

[quasi pewter]

hod is better

[balmy condor]

On a 450?

It’s probably fine, but I think we’re gonna disagree on that

[cosmic jetty]

are the azerite traits on my other head/ shoulders not that great?

[balmy condor]

You’d want to replace those shoulders

The helm is fine for now

But 450 azerite kinda sucks

[cosmic jetty]

yeah

[balmy condor]

SS/EB is poppin, and pretty common on the vendor for shoulders

[final harbor]

WAIT WAT

[quasi pewter]

hod is far better than ttk

[final harbor]

how did u do that

[quasi pewter]

in every way

[balmy condor]

Hard disagree

[quasi pewter]

how can you disagree with a fact

[balmy condor]

Because in m+ with a crit build you’ll see far more TTK than HoD

[quasi pewter]

what does that mean

ttk does nothing better than hod

not even prio

[final harbor]

i also do not get why ttk is better here

[balmy condor]

You get off a ton of envenoms

[quasi pewter]

also i wonder where you see people playing ttk in m+ this season

definitely not good players

[balmy condor]

Wdym where I see it

Ryfie plays TTK all the time hello

[quasi pewter]

idk who that is

[balmy condor]

Rank 1 sin rogue

[quasi pewter]

so?

he is right because he is rank 1?

[shrewd night]

[balmy condor]

That’s literally not what I said

You asked who plays TTK

I gave an example of a 5600 io rogue

[quasi pewter]

yes and i told you there is no reason to play ttk because it is worse than hod in every way

unless your azerite doesnt allow it

[balmy condor]

And I told you that I disagree

[quasi pewter]

i dont understand how you can disagree

but ok

[crimson palm]

Or you can just sim

[strange python]

This guy is trolling man

[quasi pewter]

we did this

MONTHS ago

when i was playing sin in m+

[balmy condor]

This discussion comes up a lot

[crimson palm]

I know

[quasi pewter]

there is no way im doing this again

[balmy condor]

And that’s fine

There’s no reason to fight this late into a patch, let alone an expac anyway

[quasi pewter]

im not fighting

im just telling the facts

[balmy condor]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[crimson palm]

Just play w/e works for your group

[umbral rapids]

no fight ?

:(

[balmy condor]

I don’t disagree that HoD is strong, I just fine TTK is better

[quasi pewter]

ok can you explain why you think that

[crimson palm]

TTK doesn't do anything in aoe

And if you need prio dmg, there is another build

[quasi pewter]

and dont say prio because hod is better in prio

[umbral rapids]

sin doesn't do anything in aoe

hides

[balmy condor]

You’re basically getting 4cp envenoms every other global on bosses and you’re playing TB

Getting a lot of enven damage

HoD is definitely good though, and it’s a fine replacement

[quasi pewter]

but it sims worse

how can it be better

[balmy condor]

TB builds still run a TTK in raids

Why would they do that

If what you’re saying is true, we will never see TTK on anything ever

Cause just HoD everywhere every time

Much better right?

[wet ruin]

there is no point man, top io players run it, so it must be better

[balmy condor]

But that doesn’t happen

[wet ruin]

and people run TTK cuz it was 490

[quasi pewter]

yes ppl run ttk

because carapace chest

[wet ruin]

and I believe they ran it instead of DD not HoD

[quasi pewter]

ttk has never been that good

[balmy condor]

People run that shit even without cara chest

[quasi pewter]

the only reason we ever ran it was because we had it on our best azerite pieces/earlier seasons m+

then they aparantly have no better options

[balmy condor]

Every m+ guide ever, even the one pinned, puts them as replacements

I’m not saying don’t take HoD

[quasi pewter]

bro

[balmy condor]

But I prefer TTK and I think it’s not as easy as “HoD better always HoD everywhere”

[quasi pewter]

ttk doesnt sim better than hod

in any scenario

there is no reason to pick it on those specific shoulders

anywhere

the only thing ttk is above average at than other traits is prio damage

but hod is better than ttk at that too

[shrewd night]

No way Im doing this again

does it anyway

[normal olive]

[sacred yarrow]

Is this sins equivalent to bote vs iris on the outlaw discord

[quasi pewter]

i know how guy feels

[cosmic jetty]

i feel like im that child who did something wrong when the parents argue

[balmy condor]

It’s either this, or haste vs crit m+, or CLF vs blood

[umbral rapids]

lmfaooo

[balmy condor]

Those are the 3 conversations in this channel

[cosmic jetty]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2CzuLFrfbwCTPVQhFwncC4
@quasi pewter how would you build my gear ?

[normal olive]

wrong one xD

[balmy condor]

He would do basically the same thing I did, get rid of MfD, get a third SS, and then switch out the TTK for HoD

We don’t disagree on much, it’s just he hates TTK

[quasi pewter]

you just hate hod

[normal olive]

[quasi pewter]

what did it do to you

did you run under 25 corruption on accident

[balmy condor]

I literally said they’re both fine replacements

I prefer TTK

[normal olive]

I'm on Whispyrs side even tho i didn't read what's going on

[balmy condor]

But HoD is good

[quasi pewter]

but why do you prefer something worse

i dont understand

do you like green

[balmy condor]

If that makes you feel better

Then yes, I take it because I like green

[cosmic jetty]

i just put in my new sim stuff becausei picked up a ring ><

[quasi pewter]

@sudden brook help

[strange python]

Stop liking what I don’t like you asshole

We must all be the same

[balmy condor]

I’m not even trying to be confrontational or anything here

HoD is a great trait

[normal olive]

[balmy condor]

I just like having 1 TTK when I’m running 2x EB alongside it

And if that makes me the anti-christ then I guess I should learn how to walk through walls

[tropic ocean]

ttk is bad

compared to hod

[quasi pewter]

dont bother

[wet ruin]

you just blindly follow someone cuz he is a top io or whatever

[quasi pewter]

you are talking to a brick wall

[tropic ocean]

only scenario u use ttk

is arena

[balmy condor]

I’m not even blindly following

People run TTK all the time

[tropic ocean]

yeah

[balmy condor]

Not just ryfie

[tropic ocean]

ppl suck all the time too

[wet ruin]

yea, you are, your only arguments are, this guy is running it

[quasi pewter]

dont get me wrong whispyr this is not personal but i just cant understand why someone would use/suggest to others to use something that is worse

[umbral rapids]

annsie you don't have any so let's the big guys talks :)

[balmy condor]

Would it make you guys feel better if I just used HoD all the time

[wet ruin]

hm?

[balmy condor]

Is that where this is going

[tropic ocean]

annsie you don't have any so let's the big guys talks :)
@umbral rapids how does individual player level has to do anything with trait potency

O_o

[quasi pewter]

im not sure what you are trying to say

[tropic ocean]

use whatever u like

recommending ttk is not good

though

[umbral rapids]

@tropic ocean i meant arguments

[balmy condor]

Sure

I’ll stop recommending TTK if that’s what’s gotten everyone riled up

[wet ruin]

all I am saying is to stop blindly following players

[crimson palm]

[quasi pewter]

why are you getting so defensive

[tropic ocean]

and im not sure why you would replace 1 eb with 1 ttk

eb will be insanely more valuable than 1 ttk

[quasi pewter]

i'd just like if people didnt recommend suboptimal thing when they dont know anything themselves

[normal olive]

[balmy condor]

Im not trying to be defensive

I’m trying to come to a mutual conclusion

So we don’t have this every other week

[tropic ocean]

conclusion is simple

play raid build

[quasi pewter]

the only conclusion is hod>ttk in every way

[tropic ocean]

or crit crit dmg

[quasi pewter]

because thats a fact

[tropic ocean]

or play anything else and be weaker

[quasi pewter]

idk why you are arguing facts

[balmy condor]

So if I stop recommending TTK, you would stop pestering me about it?

[quasi pewter]

im not pestering anyone

im telling the facts

and you are not

[balmy condor]

I’m just looking for an answer to the question

[tropic ocean]

to which question

[balmy condor]

The one I just asked 3 seconds ago ausrr

With a question mark at the end of it

[crimson palm]

How many pieces have ttk and hod on the same row

[tropic ocean]

???

[quasi pewter]

if you stop saying ttk is better than hod then yes i will stop mentioning it

[umbral rapids]

no just one

[balmy condor]

Okay

Then I’ll stop doing that

[crimson palm]

@Saryero ttk is better

[umbral rapids]

great

now hug

[quasi pewter]

but i still dont understand your thought process

[umbral rapids]

o no

[quasi pewter]

we can leave it alone though

[umbral rapids]

well

for the dude in question, eh's gonna replace his azerite sooner or later

soooo

[tropic ocean]

i just play 3 dd 3np in keys

[strange python]

ttk survives prepatch, hod doesnt

😉

[tropic ocean]

[balmy condor]

I agree we can leave it alone

We’ve been through this Spiel so many times I just want to stop arguing about it all the time

[arctic walrus]

[strange python]

you sound like guy

[balmy condor]

Not a good look

[strange python]

you dont want to sound like guy

[balmy condor]

I’ve never talked to guy

Idk what he sounds like

[wet ruin]

guy trusts the math though

[balmy condor]

I assume he’s pretty hot tho

[strange python]

found the guy alt acc

[umbral rapids]

he has a weeb pfp too

you'd get along just fine

:)

[quasi pewter]

@arctic walrus in spec channels

[balmy condor]

Anyone who fosters an environment with less arguing is good in my book

[strange python]

Arguing is good

This was more of a discussion wasnt it

I don’t know why people are such babies about confrontation. Express your opinion. If you’re wrong, you’ll be challenged. The end result is always more truth

[balmy condor]

Discussion is good, arguing is not

[strange python]

Calling somebody names for their opinion is bad, arguing that somebody’s opinion is wrong is not bad

[balmy condor]

I agree

[umbral rapids]

???

[outer lotus]

are there any dummies that dont reset details on vanish?

[umbral rapids]

just argue againwdym

[strange python]

Fuck @balmy condor did we just have a discussion, you and I?

[tropic ocean]

therse no good arguments in sin channel

[quasi pewter]

@outer lotus overall data + dynamic overall damage

[tropic ocean]

a proper alpha would've said fk you noob and stopped responding

🤷

[strange python]

@outer lotus try having a thing from beyond up, a guardian or something like that

and yea overall is your friend

[outer lotus]

thanks saryero

[umbral rapids]

there's no good arguments in this whole discord tbh but yeah lol

[balmy condor]

I mean, we did have a discussion, yeah

[outer lotus]

and thanks haste!

[quasi pewter]

you have to reset after every "pull" but thats what i did

[strange python]

Red is better than pink, fight me

waaait whispyr did you argue ttk is better than hod?

[tropic ocean]

@balmy condor and you had many opportunities to insult saryero but you didnt

B E T A

[outer lotus]

man feels just like outlaw in here

[strange python]

we're working on it

[royal lantern]

blood>beam

[sacred yarrow]

[royal lantern]

[balmy condor]

I’m not rehashing it

[strange python]

this is a christian blood channel

[tropic ocean]

i dont think iris is good on sin rogue

so i play lucid major

(very good boss dmg)

[outer lotus]

you should try ripple, its like having a second shadowstep

[tropic ocean]

cant think of a class that doesn't outdps sin atm

[sacred yarrow]

Sub

[royal lantern]

MM?

[tropic ocean]

got outdps in motherlode 24 by shadowpriest by 15k

[outer lotus]

shadowpriest is big

[royal lantern]

tbh, spriest dmg DOES scale with pull size

[tropic ocean]

despite running 3 ss 3 eb with 60% crit 25% vers and proximity potting every pack

😄

[royal lantern]

sin doesnt really

[outer lotus]

and motherlode is a great dungeon for them

because 80% of trash is chain pulling

[balmy condor]

Bm?

[tropic ocean]

hahahahahahahahaha

[strange python]

bm presses 1 button and they have 150k

[tropic ocean]

the avg green logging bm hunter can do 120k in key by simpling pressing multishot every 4 sec

[balmy condor]

Did we not ask what outdps’s sin

[tropic ocean]

and then u meet 239290 3k hunters that play without binding shot in tol dagor

reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[sacred yarrow]

What doesnt*

[balmy condor]

Oh I see

Uh

Sub

[sacred yarrow]

Lol same

[outer lotus]

disc priest

[sacred yarrow]

Resto sham

[lean marten]

1v1 me rust

[shrewd night]

Dont need binding shot if you ttk the adds down fast enough

scrubs

[strange python]

koffing providing the coffin

[balmy condor]

[arctic walrus]

@quasi pewter

[balmy condor]

Why can’t we all just agree scent of blood is the best trait

[royal lantern]

i wish

that would mean assa could be broken too

but no

[quasi pewter]

its propably better than ttk

[royal lantern]

no good stat traits for rogue

[quasi pewter]

joking

btw

[outer lotus]

you jsut need to keep scent of blood active on 10 targets and it almost beats danace of death

[quasi pewter]

but also maybe not joking

[royal lantern]

and keep it up on like 35targets and it beats a warrior that pressed collosal smash 1x with 1test of might trait

scent of blood needs a nerf ngl

[normal olive]

[outer lotus]

[quasi pewter]

look

not joking

[strange python]

LOL

[balmy condor]

[lean marten]

yall don't play 3xScent + WV?

[quasi pewter]

[shrewd night]

Calling yourself bleedbuilds when you aint running 3x ss 3x scent

[balmy condor]

The only thing I’m getting from that graph is that I should start recommending DD+MfD

[normal olive]

don't give me ideas

[royal lantern]

do it

give navi even better openers

[normal olive]

[royal lantern]

you can fuck up soooo much shit with mfd

[balmy condor]

The reverse synergy

[lean marten]

could use mark to get a CT into the opener xang 🤔

[normal olive]

you could also do this with mfd

Shadhar has ptsd now

[royal lantern]

dont you allready use CT before exsang....?

[quasi pewter]

sometimes

[balmy condor]

If you hit the legendary missed crit

[royal lantern]

ye 5 vs 6 cp

[shrewd night]

what the fuck is that

[normal olive]

this is peak performance

[shrewd night]

fucking navi man

[normal olive]

you might not like it but it's better

[balmy condor]

Update what guide

[shrewd night]

the cloak evasion muti

[balmy condor]

The one in pins is very recent

[shrewd night]

my sides

[normal olive]

Gotta ignore every mechanic for my openers

that's why you press all cd's

[balmy condor]

Navi’s openers can’t be put into guides

We tried once and discord crashed

[shrewd night]

Regular players dont have the iq capacity to follow those openers

[royal lantern]

man

navi

that legendary throwingknife 1cp rupture into exsang

[strange python]

navi openers are like car crashes

[normal olive]

yep

[royal lantern]

never thought about that

[strange python]

i wish i hadnt looked

[normal olive]

300 iq

[royal lantern]

but you cant look away

[lean marten]

do the tanks beat u in dps navi

[normal olive]

that opener was 71k at the end

[strange python]

holy priests beat him

[normal olive]

Nah my holy priest is trash

[royal lantern]

its holy priest

for dps they can do what

smite and holy fire

the end

aoe is nova

[outer lotus]

Halo

[normal olive]

I wanna play disc, but blizz gives me all the holy gear

[royal lantern]

if you use halo for dps you deserve too be skinned alive

[outer lotus]

you use halo to activate all the growths on carapace

[royal lantern]

not sure if you even play halo on holy at this point

[normal olive]

for raid you do

[balmy condor]

For the big damage

;)

[normal olive]

if i wanna do dmg i play with the star thingy

casting it every 2 seconds is funny af

[balmy condor]

But also this isn’t priest channel

[normal olive]

[shadow wedge]

[strange python]

priest is the only class i dont have at 120

[normal olive]

after i get my next 3 gushing i'ma buy all the IT i can

for that sick IT 3xNP build

[balmy condor]

I remember simming that for someone

And it was so bad I was crying

[tranquil stirrup]

Hi, wanted to ask a general question. I`m now 456iLVL and next weeks gonna clear Heroic nyalotha to get gear. Question about corruptions, is it okey to buy rank3 essences ( in this case Haste amp for the Bleed build, since I understaand thats the way to go for Raiding ) and put them on the Heroic Raid gear ?

[normal olive]

kinda sad someone else thought about doing it

[balmy condor]

If you’re not getting mythic geared soon, you can put it on 465’s from m+

[lean marten]

3xNP vop major is goat spec wdym

[balmy condor]

I wouldn’t suggest putting corruptions on anything less than that

[outer lotus]

can one of you big boys look over my sim and see if you can scratch more out of it? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/pKnMV7quGDkncEmYYANFqW

[tranquil stirrup]

So, I should aim for atleast iLVL 465 on an item before I put Corruption on it

[normal olive]

Replace the Gushing?

[tranquil stirrup]

right ?

[balmy condor]

Yeah

[outer lotus]

its simming better than my r2 expedient boots

[tranquil stirrup]

I wont be doing M Nyalotha any time soon

[outer lotus]

or it was i think, ill look again

[tranquil stirrup]

okey

[balmy condor]

You’d just replace anything less than 465 anyway

[tranquil stirrup]

true

[normal olive]

Whispyr is a sim god he can help with that stuff

[outer lotus]

yea the gusher boots are my best

i got 475 crit/haste expedient r2 boots but without socket, they are worse

[balmy condor]

I mean, I’m just gonna slap CLF on that sim and say farm your sockets

[lean marten]

vaugn too scared to use his 455 coral

[outer lotus]

i should check the kill timers for clf right?

oh true i didnt even think of the coral

[normal olive]

CLF just gives your sim a higher number

[balmy condor]

It’s better on quite a good number of fights imo but I’ll get flayed alive for it

[outer lotus]

nah coral sims worse than plumage

[balmy condor]

Wait you actually simmed the coral?

[outer lotus]

i did now

[lean marten]

get a 475 GCB like a real chad assa

[outer lotus]

think 465 GCB would beat plumage? i think i can item restore one

[normal olive]

Imagine getting items out of the chest that are usefull

[crimson palm]

think 465 GCB would beat plumage? i think i can item restore one
@outer lotus it does

[balmy condor]

Gcb would sim higher

Gcb hype

[crimson palm]

Especially on 2 min fights

[strange python]

Vaughn if u are comfortable playing guardian it should give some dps aswell

Atleast it sims over 1.1k for me in 3mins

[outer lotus]

eh i havent play sin in raid in like 6 months

so i think ill stick with blood

[strange python]

Its easy

[crimson palm]

Atleast it sims over 1.1k for me in 3mins
@strange python it doesn't when you disable fight length variance and force 1 usage

[strange python]

do you guys usually run 3 min sims?

[balmy condor]

Hemo huge brain

You run 3 min sims when your raid is poppin

And you got shorter figure

Fights

[strange python]

Nvm it then vaughn

I was wrong

Ty for letting me know

[balmy condor]

2 casts of bote > 1 cast of CLF usually

[outer lotus]

yea our kill times are really fast

man ass is actually fun with this much haste

[normal olive]

Imagine losing all that haste

[outer lotus]

if i let all my bleeds expire during exsanguinate, do i reapply rupture or CT with my first finisher?

[steep obsidian]

ct isn't effected by xsang so why wouldnt you pandemic it before it drops off?

[normal olive]

You can exang ct

[steep obsidian]

what?

[normal olive]

ye

[balmy condor]

Yes you can

[steep obsidian]

when the hell did that happen

[normal olive]

But you shouldn't force it into exang

[balmy condor]

Always

[outer lotus]

nah but if it happens

i let both run out right?

[balmy condor]

You would reapply rupture first

Rupture is more important

[outer lotus]

alright ty

[lean marten]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/368zWiMTR4EcnqE3MjPzKY @outer lotus replacing ur GW with exp is ~2k dps but +5 corruption

[outer lotus]

i dont have another exp r3 though unfortunately, but thanks

[short lance]

Are there any good Nzoth Mythic Assas POV guides out there?

[balmy condor]

Replay on logs is pretty good from experience

PoV videos kinda aren’t huge anymore

[crimson palm]

if i let all my bleeds expire during exsanguinate, do i reapply rupture or CT with my first finisher?
@outer lotus it should never happen

CT has lower duration than rupture

You won't be in a situation where both fall off at the same time unless you are misplaying

[tranquil stirrup]

Rank 2 BoTE is okey ? Or until I get rank 3 I should use something else in mayor ? ?

[lean marten]

if that happens, always apply garrote and rupture first to get the energy from bleed ticks. CT doesn't give u the bleed energy

assuming the mob will live long enough ofc

[balmy condor]

Rupture also does more damage single target

[sudden brook]

LOL @quasi pewter

[vital haven]

how are kultiran rogues a thing but not tauren rogues

[sudden brook]

cuz hoofs

how do u stealthly walk around with clip clop happening

[vital haven]

hmm

that actually makes sense

wait what are you doing here

[sudden brook]

saryo tagged me for a good meme

[balmy condor]

Me and saryero got into our bi-weekly discussion on HoD vs TTK in m+

And I wanted to just let it die

[normal olive]

I want Tauren Rogues

they are just way to funny

[outer lotus]

yea tauren rogues would be dope

[strange python]

did you run a normal dungeon

[outer lotus]

heroic raid

[strange python]

[balmy condor]

If you don’t flex in LFR are you even a rogue

[keen tree]

the more i read the more confused i get re playing sin in m+

so how high does your haste need to be before you move over to exsanguinate

40%?

[spice spire]

60

[crimson palm]

You need 34% crit

Rest is w/e

[strange python]

^

[keen tree]

ok lets so i dont have that haste - i just stick with 2212223 build?

[crimson palm]

When you get 34% crit an AI steps in and starts playing for you

[balmy condor]

Yes you would stick with toxic blade doobkut

[steep obsidian]

im so close damn 😐

[strange python]

Swap Gems and u're BiS

[steep obsidian]

[royal lantern]

no 34% 👉 trash

[silent crescent]

Wish people could understand gearing, why do people even go for haste if they dont even have 34 yet

[lone junco]

I smell a meme.

[drifting hare]

hey I got a questiont to everyone here. should I switch trinkets, even when lustrous is bis? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/aPruHuw1fz8XBunoBusfCX

[fallow otter]

i use gcb on most bosses

and switch it out when there is too much movement

[drifting hare]

makes sense

[oblique lark]

swap DD for NP too 🙂

[fallow otter]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/28usKgfxt5mZZSynpCYaay

[feral shuttle]

Hi all - Just checking I'm executing this Expedient build correctly...My opener from stealth I ofc have Vendetta + Exsanguinate, 45 sec later I get another exang on it's own...then my next exang is like 15 sec away from vendetta - Currently I'm using it then just holding vendetta for 15 sec or so, is this correct? Or should it line up better with vendetta?

[strange python]

@normal olive someone needs your expertise

[vital haven]

inc

[drifting hare]

@fallow otter hm strange I did this sim similar to yours not long ago, but it gave me lower results

thanks anyway good to see

[fallow otter]

maybe coz of pot?

[drifting hare]

I dont know exactly what it was but I might screwed something up

I'm not that into raidbots, still learning a bit

[fallow otter]

@feral shuttle you are waiting for vanish anyway, so that lines up with vend/vanish and exang

[normal olive]

Who asked for the navi

[strange python]

o lord of openers

xlim needed your help

but you were too late

like you are with your vanish

[normal olive]

oof

Next time i'm here

[feral shuttle]

Thanks boys - So it's correct that there is a bit of time (about 15-30 sec) where Exang is on CD and I'm waiting for it to line up again with Vend/Vanish

It's the 4th exang usage I think

[umbral rapids]

yeah

it should come off cd around the same time as vanish

[feral shuttle]

Nice - Thanks for the help.

[edgy pawn]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/8KGMzkYgaL9UEKcRmvSvxV

can someone explain to me, why there such a big difference when i put +6% haste on my dagger?

seems kinda too much

[mellow pier]

Cause of scaling

[umbral rapids]

it also added enchants

[tawdry radish]

do we troll racial on cd or hold it for vendetta

[edgy pawn]

it doesnt add enchants, it switches the weapons there on

[umbral rapids]

the actual different is 1.6% with or without exp 1

[umbral rapids]

ok?

[edgy pawn]

i cannot imagine a world where 6 percent haste adds up to 9,5k dps

[rocky holly]

CT has lower duration than rupture
@crimson palm
You won't be in a situation where both fall off at the same time unless you are misplaying
@crimson palm
quick question about this, my CT is falling off at the same time rupture is falling off using this opener -

*garrote > rupture > garrote > GCB > Vendetta > Mut > Rupture > Exsang > mut (x2) > CT

am i misplaying this?

[mellow pier]

@edgy pawn ? Its 1.6k diff

[normal olive]

Just reapply your CT earlier

You can just refresh it since you didn't exang it

[edgy pawn]

23 corr is without anything
33 corr is with 6%
43 is with 12%

[umbral rapids]

which lines are you talking about exactly ?

[rocky holly]

hmm ok, im probably just using an extra envenom when i need to be refreshing CT

[edgy pawn]

53 is with 18

[mellow pier]

I dont understand what the problem is lol

[rocky holly]

ideally when do you refresh a non exang CT?

[balmy condor]

Whenever it drops or in pandemic

[edgy pawn]

i wanna understand why 6% gives mie 9,5k dps

seems too mich

much

[mellow pier]

Im glad ur a math expert

[normal olive]

Does it hurt like this when i send you guys my openers?

[edgy pawn]

when 12 gives me like 10,7

[balmy condor]

You go from 23 to 33

You get HoD trays

Traits

You get haste

[mellow pier]

^

[rocky holly]

i run into the problem that its dropping as rupture is dropping - i know that rupture is priority, but do i need to refresh CT instead of using an envenom? or do i not need to worry about CT falling off for 2-3 seconds at a time

[balmy condor]

Yes

[normal olive]

refresh CT at 4 seconds

[balmy condor]

You CT over envenom

[normal olive]

the Pandemic on it is 4.2 seconds

[balmy condor]

But pandemic exists

[rocky holly]

got it thx

[edgy pawn]

aaaaaaaah

fucking hod

thanks

[normal olive]

[wet ruin]

that pandemic is for 6 cp though

[normal olive]

Yeah should have added that

[shut garnet]

how wouldu play this on a 1:30 fight

channel font at 16s pre and then plumage normally after g rup g vendetta?

[crimson palm]

Yes

[arctic walrus]

@scarlet sequoia sivara throwback

[outer lotus]

why is gcb used way less than plumage? do people just dislike it because you have to stand still?

[tawny shell]

Master assassin as a leggo

xD

[kindred chasm]

[tropic ocean]

make master poisoner great again

[strange python]

https://www.wowhead.com/news=317150/new-shadowlands-legendary-powers-for-rogues-master-assassin-returns

omg

it's finally here

[silent crescent]

Shiv leggo seems fun

[kindred chasm]

seems trap

[strange python]

Zoldyck Insignia

Good to see they're keeping us the HxH spec

[kindred chasm]

it sounds good but really - single target it does nothing, in aoe its not really valuable, it would only actually be decent in 2-target

[silent crescent]

Why would you use an aoe/cleave leggo in st lol

[kindred chasm]

copy a pandemic empowered garrote to the 2nd target

[silent crescent]

Also what is shiv cd like in shadowlands atm?

Getting even just free ruptures pretty often isnt that bad

[kindred chasm]

compared to other lego effects tho

[silent crescent]

I mean if bone spike stays op it will probably be master assassin, but still

Also shouldnt shiv spread sepsis too?

[kindred chasm]

i agree it sounds fun, but its probably trap

[silent crescent]

That could be good for energy gains

Or the free vanish

Idk if they will stay same duration

[plain thistle]

Tiny Toxic Blades Shiv causes your Poisons and Bleeds on the target to spread to a nearby enemy.

[tawny shell]

Execute so good on prog even in ST

[strange python]

fuuuuuck me

[bright hemlock]

how much haste do i need with Exsanguinate build?

[strange python]

another week without a 2nd cara dagger

[storm forum]

iirc, >50% @bright hemlock

there's a guide for it pinned here too

[pseudo hamlet]

M+ question:
How much crit do I need to have to do some dmg? I mean I've got 3x Severe and I'm already on 51%, shall I buy another one or focus more on getting strikethrough?
Rest of my stats are: 14% haste, 36% mastery, 3% versa

[bright hemlock]

@storm forum i have 74.76 with corruptions and its kinda lame with dps

https://raider.io/characters/eu/burning-legion/Arthres

[crimson palm]

M+ question:
How much crit do I need to have to do some dmg? I mean I've got 3x Severe and I'm already on 51%, shall I buy another one or focus more on getting strikethrough?
Rest of my stats are: 14% haste, 36% mastery, 3% versa
@pseudo hamlet 34%

[verbal sparrow]

What's best on nzoth ? ( / Carapace )

[storm forum]

are you using CT? at this high level of haste it becomes comparable/better than poison bomb

also 3x Shroaded Suffocation is more or less mandatory

[bright hemlock]

i cant have it

[pseudo hamlet]

@pseudo hamlet 34%
@crimson palm Unfortunately I think that's a wrong answer. Plenty of good M+ rogues have high crit builds. I think you need to check out their guides(such as Ryfie) and read a little bit about that

[bright hemlock]

cause i didint get the piecies

which is bullshit

[storm forum]

F

you really need minimum 2x for this build

[crimson palm]

@crimson palm Unfortunately I think that's a wrong answer. Plenty of good M+ rogues have high crit builds. I think you need to check out their guides(such as Ryfie) and read a little bit about that
@pseudo hamlet unfortunately no, 34% crit is the way to go

you can trust me, i am rank 1 on nzoth

no rank 6 on maut but pretty decent still

[shrewd night]

@strange python REMEMBER WHEN I SAID LEGGO WRISTS?

[strange python]

[crimson palm]

Raz was praying few days ago for the leggo wrists

[storm forum]

also deeper stratagem if ideal for this, it says youre still using vigor on raiderio

[pseudo hamlet]

@crimson palm but that's M+ question

[echo cargo]

That unnamed leggo better be SS

[strange python]

assa might be saved

[tawny shell]

lets all thank the rogue gods for blessing us with execute. nighthold tier set and venndetta boots

🙏

[storm forum]

there better be a garotte empowering lego or im switching to priest

[strange python]

i want 70% haste in a leggo

[echo cargo]

I don’t think most people will play sin without SS

[shrewd night]

Shiv causes your Poisons and Bleeds on the target to spread to a nearby enemy.

[echo cargo]

If they did m+

[strange python]

thats big pog

[tawny shell]

why would ppl not play sin with out SS?

[echo cargo]

If they did m+

[storm forum]

if there is an echoing blades lego, sin in dungeons might be salvagable

[tawny shell]

oh youre talkin m+

true

[storm forum]

but so far these all look like crap

[tawny shell]

Sub on the come up for m+

[echo cargo]

They look great for ST

[crimson palm]

:monkaOMEGA:
@shrewd night who cares, we all end up playing mantle

[storm forum]

i hate mantle/MA

[echo cargo]

But SS was the best thing sin had for aoe in forever

[strange python]

ok so if that leggo doesnt have a target cap

you'll play 3x assa with that leggo

and pull 50 mobs

then kite

[silent crescent]

Which leggo?

[strange python]

wait

it only spreads to 1

[silent crescent]

Yes

[strange python]

hopes crushed

[silent crescent]

Yeah that would be absurd

[storm forum]

at best its good at 4 targets

cause you can go garotte -> garotte -> garotte -> rupture -> shiv

[silent crescent]

My hope is it counts sepsis or bone spike somehow LOL

[storm forum]

so you have 4 subterfuge empowered garottes instead of only 3

[silent crescent]

Bone spike, shiv, 2 more bone spikes

Big dmg

[strange python]

is bone spike a bleed

[pure mauve]

when will be the legendaries and conduits released?

[storm forum]

sepsis i think is a poison so it should work with it, but idk what bonespike is coded as

[silent crescent]

Idk "bleeds" and "poison" are getting kinda nebulous anyway

[crimson palm]

it's a bleed

[silent crescent]

Even as a bleed it will end up just copying whatever blizzard wants to be a bleed

[strange python]

NEW Doomblade Mutilate deals an additional 20% Bleed damage over 3 seconds.
Envenom damage increased by 5% for each Bleed you have on the target.
Inventory Type: Shoulder, Hands

for this i mean

[silent crescent]

I just wish the tooltips actually meant what they said rather than "your weapon poison and garrote/rup"

[pure mauve]

are legendaries released??

[silent crescent]

Doomblade could be cool if it counts bone spike too. Thats a lot of bleeds

4 without CT

[storm forum]

some of them @pure mauve

[chilly marsh]

wow... boring most of rogues legs are teh same from legion

[pure mauve]

where can i see them?

[storm forum]

https://www.wowhead.com/news=317150/new-shadowlands-legendary-powers-for-rogues-master-assassin-returns

[pure mauve]

thx son

[strange python]

Mantle is back lol

[silent crescent]

Also I wonder how good vendetta leggo will be now that we can use haste...

[balmy condor]

Yeah lot of legion legos

The vanish one seems kinda weird to me

But I can see some synergy with the vendetta cooldown boots

Maybe 1 Minute vendetta’s

[chilly marsh]

well i love bracers one for a rogue execute

[balmy condor]

Will be interesting

[storm forum]

night fae disc priest funnel + dustwalker vendetta is going to be pretty funny

[pure mauve]

wow we have the soulders back

[storm forum]

except they can only go on wrists or fingers 🤔

[strange python]

kinda liking the fact you can decide which slot they go on

[lean marten]

everyone is a troll only 2 fingers

[strange python]

helps with proffs filling holes better

[pure mauve]

what does Dashing Scoundrel ???

[strange python]

no one knows yet

[storm forum]

what happens if you go into timewalking with a legion leggo and their new leggo equivalent?

[strange python]

you get perma deded

[storm forum]

F

[strange python]

200% crit that would be dope

[silent crescent]

? Arent all legion leggos disabled in SL

[winged veldt]

How many leggo can we wear? 2 again like legion?

[silent crescent]

Or does that not apply in TW

[storm forum]

starting at 1, idk if there have been talks to let us equip more later

[winged veldt]

Thnx

[storm forum]

legion started at one and like 7.3 they let us equip a second

[pure mauve]

what do u prefer for single target? Doomblade or Dustwalker's Patch

[strange python]

Legion started with 2 xD

ofc we'll equip 2

expansion is long

[storm forum]

wait did legion actually start with 2?

[strange python]

You just had to do the research

[pure mauve]

i expect at least 3 legendaries equiped 2 specific class and 1 general

[strange python]

I got Cnidaria then for cloak

It was horrible

[winged veldt]

That would be dope to use 3

[pure mauve]

this should be good for fan of knivesEssence of Bloodfang Your Combo Point generators have a chance to infect the target with Bloodfang, causing 0 Bleed damage over 6 sec, and healing the Rogue for 0 each time it deals damage.

[storm forum]

it looks to be the best for AoE/M+

[pure mauve]

or only affect the selected target?

[storm forum]

i would expect fan has a chance to apply it to every target hit

[pure mauve]

i gives extra energy if they're affected by poison?

it*

[storm forum]

i would assume it works like CT

where it doesnt interact with venomous wounds

which sucks and is kinda dumb but whatever

(no, would not give energy)

[balmy condor]

There’s no really poppin m+ ones

[pure mauve]

imo this is also good for m+ despite of improving a single target cd Dustwalker's Patch The remaining cooldown on Vendetta is reduced by 1 sec for every 65 Energy you expend.
Inventory Type: Chest, Finger

[balmy condor]

All of them are pretty boring but legion crowd favorites

Wonder why it took them so long to just add items that already existed

[storm forum]

also it seems that our hopes for an SS/Subterfuge type lego are slim, cause iirc the Dashing Scoundrel tier set empowered envemon and made it when our poisons crit they refunded energy

[pure mauve]

maybe they didnt find anything new/exciting in all this time and decided to cpypaste legion legendaries xD

[balmy condor]

We’re going down a poison path

I honestly think that set bonus should be a baseline into venomous wounds

Sin is so energy starved, any source of energy is going to be nuts, even just for QoL

[fleet whale]

if we get to use two leggos at the same time

[echo cargo]

We will later on

[fleet whale]

the bloodfang one and doomblade one have nice synergy with each other

[echo cargo]

I was about to say Sin leggos look good but boring alone

[fleet whale]

if we have higher haste it could be a viable option

[echo cargo]

But when we have three leggos on it’s gonna be good

[fleet whale]

or when we get higher haste

[balmy condor]

Yeah they’re all kinda boring

It’ll be a numbers game tbh to see what we run

[fleet whale]

a lot of people liked the legion leggos for rogues though

[echo cargo]

Afaik Blizzard said that we won’t get more than one leggo first patch to wear

But as we go on we can equip several

[fleet whale]

even if they were a bit boring they were utilitarian and very effective

[balmy condor]

Yeah

I’m not saying they’re bad

They’re just re-hashed

And not very interesting

[echo cargo]

No SS no aoe 😥

[true ingot]

What are the thoughts on the leggos?

[storm forum]

Zoldyck's looks like the go-to for progression, and I rather like the flavor for assassins' poisons and bleeds being more effective on heavily wounded targets

[fleet whale]

I liked in legion how I had a cookie cutter build for both M+ and Raiding in t21

[true ingot]

What few they put in anyway

[fleet whale]

pretty much used the same gear/talents in all content

[balmy condor]

@true ingot boring legion re-hashes but they’re fine and will be strong most likely

[echo cargo]

One of the talent trees has a 15% execute for 30 seconds if someone dies

[storm forum]

Bloodfang looks good over all, for both ST and AoE, but its kinda unfortunate how much it overlaps with Doomblade for sin rogue

[fleet whale]

i actually think it synergizes with doomblade

[true ingot]

Is there a world for Tiny Toxic Blades?

[echo cargo]

That’ll stack with execute leggo for prog

[storm forum]

tiny toxic blades looks good for exactly 2 target and 4 target

[fleet whale]

just think garrote and rupture, and the bleed from bloodfang and doomblade

that's 20% envenom damage

[balmy condor]

Tiny toxic blade is interesting imo

It helps the ramp time I guess

Garrote rupture shiv

And you got 4 bleeds

[strange python]

have they said how long crafting 1 leggo takes?

[storm forum]

they said it would be before the raid drops

[rocky holly]

not other than "you will get one before raid"

[fleet whale]

you will be able to craft more but i imagine the BiS leggo in pre-raid gear

could be different than what will be the BIS in full raid gear

[storm forum]

im assuming ~2-3 weeks, cause it looks like the expac will drop before the holidays, and they never drop raids before the holidays so they can be in the office tuning/patching it

december holidays*

[rocky ruin]

but the master assassine leggo is kinda useless for us, cause we got a talent or did they change the talent?

[balmy condor]

It seems to double dip with the talent

Not quite sure what the idea is there

[storm forum]

the leggo is better than the talent too

[fleet whale]

the leggo is far better than that talent

[balmy condor]

Yeah I mean it should be

[fleet whale]

if anything you will use nighstalker with the leggo

[balmy condor]

Would be wild if it weren’t

[storm forum]

i was just thinking about that varolyn

old nightstalker build

first WA i ever used was to keep track of empowered nightstalker ruptures

[fleet whale]

well in legion

you vanished envenom at least later on

[balmy condor]

I can see a nightstalker envenom

Nightstalker rupture doesn’t seem like the design direction of sin

[fleet whale]

Doomblade + MA shoulders

[balmy condor]

Yeah

[fleet whale]

and throw in CT

makes for a big envenom

[balmy condor]

CT single target probably won’t happen

[fleet whale]

probably not

[balmy condor]

But I can see big envenoms being the play

[fleet whale]

but it would be fun seeing a huge envenom

[rocky ruin]

so its kinda MA Leggo and Doomblade for the raid just for the feelcraft

[fleet whale]

too early to tell

[balmy condor]

We have no fucking clue

There’s no numbers on anything

Mutilate adds a bleed

A bleed for HOW MUCH

No fucking clue

[rocky holly]

i think the key there was feelcraft

[mellow pier]

Bracers will be used prob too

[storm forum]

i think Zoldyck looks like the best for prog raiding, but doomblade might be better based on the tuning

[balmy condor]

You can’t feelycraft without anything

[fleet whale]

there are a bunch of synergies i already see

[balmy condor]

There’s gameplay

[fleet whale]

but we have no numbers

[balmy condor]

And synergies

[rocky ruin]

wasnt doomblade an older T-Set Boni?

[balmy condor]

And interesting and old legendaries

[fleet whale]

yes in nighthold

[rocky holly]

weird

[rocky ruin]

i see nothing about a SS replacement and conduit arent still out for us

[storm forum]

if dashing scoundrel is a bonus to venomous wounds, it might also be excellent depending on tuning

[balmy condor]

Dashing scoundrel is an old set bonus

Energy on poison crits

[storm forum]

if invigorating shadowlust lets us put 2 shivs/TBs in the vendetta window it also might be excellent

anyways, what im trying to say is until we have numbers and people try them out and compare them we don't know what will be best

[rocky ruin]

the tiny shiv say poison and blood but from the reading its more directed at sins cause outlul dont have any bloods and sub got only rupture

[balmy condor]

Yeah dunno bout it