mhm, im currently running td1+td3
#assassination
vocal hedge
tropic ocean
yeah good enough
I run t3+t2
and since u can switch gear in visions u can just
switch for trash switch for boss
I just made 2 gearsets and macrod them to keybind
vocal hedge
oh u can switch in visions?
tropic ocean
yeah
tropic ocean
np 😄
arctic acorn
Guys, about the 485 daggers, should I just say f it and cleanse them ?
normal olive
Hey quick question for Warlord's Trophy, does the pvp rank increase the ilvl you can increase an item by?
arctic acorn
Cause I dont see TA doing that much vs expedient
I think yes, it bumps to your current tier
scarlet sequoia
it depends on your rating when your get the trophy yes
if you get the trophy at 2.1 it wont go from 470 -> 475 if u get to 2.4
@arctic acorn ye TA is useless if u can just get expedient
unless u love rng ofc
vestal wren
time to farm gc
faint harness
so with this change, do you just use it on CD?
vestal wren
you use it so that exsang lines up with it
faint harness
thats what you dont
do
that was the dps increase
it would hold until exang
i assume its opener - alone - 2 min cds - alone - cds and so on
vestal wren
the condition:debuff.vendetta.up|(!talent.exsanguinate.enabled&cooldown.vendetta.remains>45|talent.exsanguinate.enabled&(cooldown.exsanguinate.remains<6|cooldown.exsanguinate.remains>20&fight_remains>65)))&!exsanguinated.rupture
fathom swift
you use on pull, then use when your next exsang rupture falls off, then use before your next exsang within vendetta
basically as long as exsang isn't about to come up and you don't have an exsanguinated bleed up
faint harness
ye thats basically, what i meant
scarlet sequoia
ah fk that then
patent topaz
465 gcb is 1k over 445 coral for me it looks like
fathom swift
I've been using it a while it's not that bad most bosses this tier
raden and xanesh only ones that move a shitload
crimson palm
isnt it the same case as worldvein
scarlet sequoia
fair
fathom swift
like you'd expect it would be shit but it's actually ok
scarlet sequoia
idk fk using that, maybe worth if u happen to get 475 one
patent topaz
if you have 475 pvp/plumage I guess its not worth
fathom swift
ya I only looked into it cause I got a 475 from cache a couple months back but it's a good option
strange python
why does quick sim tell me to reapply rupture twice in a row instead of envenom? (exsanguinate is on cd)
https://gyazo.com/2460f7eb6a317a8e89efe291c35bbb3a
patent topaz
the first one is after one muti so 2-4 cp only
wet ruin
could be a 2-3 cp rupture
strange python
ah makes sense tyvm
mint valve
strange python
i use that, not sure how useful it is really
strange python
as long as u can stand in it for the full duration its good
its not THAT small of an area, so if you place it at the right time it should be good
its like a lust
gives me like 22% haste
is ooze blood+4% crit damage ( i have high crit%) better, or a rank 2 twilight devastation for m+?
475 ilvl - so 517k hp
i have a hard time understanding this
fathom swift
it's usable but it def requires some big thunking
glacial jasper
I’m out then
strange python
how the fuck do i figure out whats best
red turtle
so i am trying to get the SS build to work but it sims only 4k dps higher (with Mechagon rings and Ra'den trinket). I dont have the Mechagon rings and i dont have the Ra'den trinket. Is it worth to go for the Build anyway? atm i am optimising everything for Nzoth Mythic.
is there a super importent item i need für the SS build? i always thought Ra'den trinket and/or Mechagon rings.
still totem
Well you need a lot of haste amp and haste items
red turtle
jea but how much is "a lot of haste"? i think the problem is that i dont have any proc other than the Weapon enchant.
atm i am at 2k Hast unbuffed and i have Expedient 3 two times.
crimson palm
it should start pulling ahead with t6 exp and the right items
and it's the better build for boss dmg on nzoth
475 dragonscale is a decent replacement if u dont have vita
lime edge
man, i rlly need the mechagon rings
minor thicket
I think people need to realize you don’t have to use the exsangugate build
If you’re comfy using TB and don’t have the haste to switch than don’t
minor thicket
Sure doesn’t seem like it
minor thicket
People asking when to switch etc
lime edge
if i could
unkempt nacelle
hey guys whats better 1 td or stack 3 Strikethrough?
minor thicket
Mythic or raising lol
unkempt nacelle
mythiv
minor thicket
Sim it
lime edge
em
red bloom
I feel like I've done something wrong, I picked up an expedient2 and now sims are telling me to gem for mastery and crit
minor thicket
Because your haste is now amplified
So now your stat weights have changed
That’s completely normal
scarlet sequoia
there seems to be a middle point or whatever where u cant quite reach the next lvl of all out haste
just get past that
then u will be able to go full haste and drop lucid
until then just do what the sim says
red bloom
yeah I get that 🙂 just felt funny to me now after a few weeks of full haste
minor thicket
How much haste are you at
red bloom
rightnow with haste gems/enchants 47% so I know thats not crazy high yet, feels like the awkward stage between a haircut atm
minor thicket
Link your toon
crimson palm
@scarlet sequoia how's bote minor performing vs void on ur toon
im getting 0.5% increase with bote
oh ur running the major
nvm
scarlet sequoia
i dont play clf
crimson palm
aye
red bloom
This is the last sim i just did checking the gems and seeing if bote+3xDD or 3xNP+VoP pulled ahead
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gScPVuJTaoTbNKcLMVNC8J
crimson palm
if 1x clf vs 2x bote ends up being neutral it's probably worth to drop bote and use it as minor
crimson palm
mellow pier
Why anti clf
minor thicket
This is the last sim i just did checking the gems and seeing if bote+3xDD or 3xNP+VoP pulled ahead
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gScPVuJTaoTbNKcLMVNC8J
@red bloom doesnt look like haste is 47%
wow armoury has you at 17%
scarlet sequoia
red bloom
is that my outlaw set?
minor thicket
no
red bloom
there its updated now
fathom swift
clf was being used prepull on sims but if you do that in raids most of the time it bugs out for the first ~5s of the fight
red bloom
I have another expedient2 on legs aswell but the sim seems to like the socket atm with the second wiggly boy
patent topaz
is CT in the nightly yet?
vestal wren
yes
patent topaz
Doesnt show up in quick sim, must be because my chest has ttk on it atm
strange python
I dont get how ppl can play with more than 40 corruption... My Raidlead would kill me if i get some unlucky spawns with Thing from beyond or beeing slowed and fuck up the bonds or the spread on ra-den -.- guess i'm just bad -.-
lime edge
ites easy
its
dont run over 40 in ra-den
in certain bosses, u dont run high corruption
like ilgy
carmine osprey
So on Alpha, rogues still using 2 non lethals?
lime edge
i think they use 2 lethals, no?
verbal sparrow
is it worth buying that Exp R2 ?
red bloom
ive been under 40 more of progression but on carapace now, healers arent having issues its a lot of other people fecking up the last phase so running 59 corruption has been grand
lime edge
@verbal sparrow about how many echoes do u get a week
strange python
we progress on ilgy tonight. many melees. I assume it's going to be a shit show anyway ^^
red bloom
I got forced to play my hunter on ilgy XD
verbal sparrow
well, since Exp r3 rotation I saved just 15k echoes so idk
I'm not Raz to somehow farm 30k in a single minute lol
minor thicket
question becasue im curious I dont play the exsan build. But if your haste is that high playing it wouldnt you want IS since it procs based of haste for single target
vast forum
please do name the single target bosses of ny'alotha
vast forum
maut has an add up all the time
that can soak your IS stacks
also, IS can 1-shot you on intermission on maut 🙂
spoiler alert, it's literally just shad
faint harness
killtimers starting to get shit for IS too
unborn tangle
you clean gushing + severe go full haste corruption + vers on use trinket, maybe go versatile nav if it sims higher but mainly full haste corruption
crimson palm
@cobalt kindle it wont sim higher
lime edge
i believe
cobalt kindle
so ppl using blood even when it sim less than clf ?
dapper wraith
So I've been out of the loop a lot. So our options are full haste exang, or crit strike through TB?
scarlet sequoia
nah
lime edge
just haste
scarlet sequoia
haste is better with tb too
vast forum
expedient is best for any build for ST
agile phoenix
What do you go for m+?
lime edge
crit
minor thicket
If I’m using TB build, and my haste was only at 28-32% why would simming tell me to add more crit instead of haste? If haste is best
tropic ocean
because u dont have enough expedients
🙂
the strength of haste for sin rogue is that it makes ur bleeds tick faster
and it makes u have barely any empty gcds
quick rampart
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/mA93Dvax9oGoJUfro4t4W1
any idea how to improve? currently at nzoth mythic. Still have some mementos and echoes to add 1 socket and 1 exp II
lime edge
how much do u guys sim, dslice
vast forum
adding haste and adding expedient aren't the same thing
expedient has great synergy with overwhelming power and vita trinket
minor thicket
Well I only have 2 pieces of expedient. Rank 2 and 3
lime edge
thats not enough
minor thicket
Well I can’t make it magically appear
warm parcel
Then gem crit
vast forum
have you tried actually simming the contaminants instead of stat weights
minor thicket
Is it worth buying expedient 2 now since 3 won’t come back for awhile?
warm parcel
All up to how much you see getting echoes
vast forum
depends how much you wanna grind
warm parcel
I got rank 2s cause I know I want them now on my gear
And can get rank 3s when they arrive
warm parcel
And getting 2 rank 2s
Allows me to drop a tentie and have 3 less corr
So win win win
vast forum
you mean 5?
vast forum
ðŸ§
swift herald
mythic plus witch level 100 talent should i take?
lime edge
keep in mind i dont ahve 3xSS/3xEB azerites
swift herald
teir 7
lime edge
thats my dslice
which is weird cause, i still sim better with tb single target
by a bit
when do i use ct in m+
long portal
perfect 100k xD
lime edge
whats the rot
long portal
dont chnge anything
strange python
Hey is that really low it was a 20 junkyard : https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/rRnwYhJXPaDgyfT1/#fight=last&type=casts&source=184&ability=57934
strange python
oh yeah mb 😄
vast forum
should be >100k junkyard cuz of zapbots
strange python
i mean also the cast of tricks
honest iris
crimson tempest the way to go now with expedient stacking?
vast forum
sim it
wispy plaza
hey question is it wise to take the 2x tier 2 expedient or simply wait for tier 3 to come back around mainly for myhic nzoth progression https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vQSo9Trzp4NTTw6kBqi1QV
vast forum
if you're progressing it right now, buy, because you might kill it before the next time r3 comes around
if you're looking into the future, you can wait for r3
warm parcel
Using rank 2s right now does nothing but cost you echoes
So can you get your echoes back for r3?
Thats your question
nimble surge
Hi, i'm trying to improve my rotation as assa rogue, I was wondering why in guides it says you should not refresh empowered versions of garote / rupture. For instance, if you still have vendetta up for 4s and you have a empowered garote (subterfuge or vendetta), it is not worth to use the remaining vendetta to get another empowered version of garote?
tropic ocean
no
vast forum
that's not how it works 🙂
vast forum
vendetta doesn't snapshot dots
tropic ocean
u cant use a garrote on 4s duration of vendetta left to buff it for its whole duration
that only works with exsang(for snapshotting haste)
vast forum
only subterfuge snapshots dot damage, and exsang snapshots tick speed
so you want ALL subterfuge/exsanguinate dots to fall off before reapplying them
vapid scarab
All your empowered garrotes are for the entire length of vendetta too
nimble surge
Oh right thanks, did not know about that, everyting seems clearer now ahah
latent ocean
at what point does nothing personal become not worth it for MA build?
is there one or is it always preferred to have one?
strong jacinth
Hello all,,,a quick question...i play as ass rogue and do mythic+ only, what's the best corruptions i should go after?
tribal obsidian
balmy condor
@latent ocean those two are always independent. Usually if you don’t have a lot of haste, at least 1 NP for the energy is generally good. Later with more, it actually becomes a hindrance, and will overcap you during your opener with bloodlust
And yeah, for sin m+ a combo of severe and strike through for EB, you could stack TD as well if you’re into that gamblin life
lime edge
for m+ with no EB trait
when do i use CT
g1 g2 g3 ct?
and im guessing i never use fok without eb trait
strange python
so i can have
lets say
5 twilight devastations?
theoretically
and no value is lost
normal olive
Yes
normal olive
But you do get all the corruption
lime edge
since the first one gives u a proc chance
while any one after that doesnt give u more proc
lime edge
td is good
but i wouldnt only run td
thats just me
u want severe/strikethroughs aswell
neon glen
For m+, is there a crit cap for EB setups? Wondering at what level to swap out some severes for strikethroughs
currently sitting on 60% crit
verbal sparrow
wtf I'm just trying out Apphendage R2 R2 R3 and one proc for 750k ?
verbal sparrow
no that was just single proc into dummy
but well
103 corruption is just 103 corruption
balmy condor
@neon glen theres no crit cap
verbal sparrow
I would have to purify everything except those but that's just not worth it I think
tender folio
There is no cap on crit
Get as many as you can but it's good idea to have at least one strikethrough, at least it sims good for me
tender folio
I dont use dung slice
balmy condor
Usually like 5 target 1 min imo
tender folio
Im doing 3 targets patchwerk 40sec
balmy condor
Yeah
3-5 patchwerk
40-60 sec
I’ve heard all sorts of things
I don’t think there’s a consensus
Simming m+ is weird cause every dungeon has massively different pull sizes depending on week
Like the way you pull in a teeming motherlode vs a necrotic kr
tender folio
Indeed but this is the closer that we can get to some kind of sim for myth+
balmy condor
Kinda huge difference
Yeaj
I would personally sim a couple variations
Just to get a better idea
And then go from there
woven prairie
yea xD
woven prairie
mostly crit haste on all pieces
balmy condor
475’s with haste is usually pretty safe
A piece with mastery or vers won’t kill you
So imo, kinda whatever
woven prairie
yea gloves waist wrist and boots are all crit haste, rings kinda meh, but legs are haste mastery so might wanna go for them
tropic ocean
@neon glen yes but taht cap varies a lot on target counts
I usually just sim 6 targets and after 50ish % crit strikethrough took over
ended up with 3 severe 4-5strikethrough depending on how much corruption i wanna run
burnt nimbus
When you sim the SS/Exang build, do you sim pure ST?
balmy condor
You always sim single target for raids yes
But you have to remember than subt can cleave really good
woven prairie
honed mind 3 on those legs maybe:P
burnt nimbus
Yh, but to get the correct numbers wouldnt u have to sim something like cleave add? considering almost every boss got some kind of cleave
tender folio
I'm still for more severe stack then strikethrough
balmy condor
Too many differences in raids to make sense simming that specifically
Kill times, how hard people are padding, the amount of fire mages etc
During prog, we had so much cleave that I got put only full boss pump
For a good portion of bosses
burnt nimbus
well yes, but every boss has some kinda of cleave. Except like maut and shad
tropic ocean
big
burnt nimbus
Reason im asking is because i cant for the life of me get the SS/Exang build to sim decent on ST for me
balmy condor
Then don’t use it?
tropic ocean
@burnt nimbus you can indeed manipulate the sim for the fight like in raden
depending on ur killtime
but even if ur exsang sims 2-3k less in st
tropic ocean
it will outperform dd in fights like raden/drest/nzoth/cara
balmy condor
Ez pz
balmy condor
Depends on what your job is
plain thistle
thats because exsg build isnt a lot better than TB for a 5 min ST fight (raidbots default)
tropic ocean
@plain thistle that solely depends on ur gear
2.3k or so difference for me last time i simmed
with all bis azerites available
and 485 weapons
plain thistle
yup, not a lot 🙂
tropic ocean
well
plain thistle
even with perfect gear, isnt that much better, for 5 minutes at least
3 minutes? sure
tropic ocean
i mean
thats a 2.2% dps increase
roughly
considering that most upgrades are <1% for me thats big
balmy condor
2.3k is nothing to sneeze at
burnt nimbus
So for me going Exang/SS build at Pure ST is -1.5k dps, would u consider that worth it?
little root
?
warped plank
Hey gang, I've had a read back through should I focus expedient or strike through? Currently crit is 29% haste is 25%
I'm not too savvy with min maxing
little root
unless all your gear has vers mastery, with those % it sounds like you need to get higher ilvl before really focusing on min maxing but right now expedient haste stacking is best
vast forum
@warped plank u want raids or m+?
little root
^ also that lol
vast forum
strikethrough for m+, expedient for raids
little root
severe before strikethrough though for m+ if your crits not high enough tho
warped plank
Yeah my guild has only just killed heroic which we are super hyped about so I myself aren't the best geared rogue at the minute
Interesting that you're saying go crit, I figured haste would be the priority since the energy regeneration and dot ticks etc
strong jacinth
Is it worth to stack 2 x Severe 6% right now or just stack echoes for when rank3 comes back?
strong jacinth
i got 7 corruption atm, i got very bad corruptions
white patio
Haste is deffo the prio for raiding
willow pulsar
What is your crit, do you use spyglass?
willow pulsar
It's low then
strong jacinth
i shouldbe aiming 40% +
willow pulsar
I am at 52% and looking foward for improvements
willow pulsar
Depends, rn i have 3 strikes3
white patio
honestly if you're over 50% i'd say stack as many as you can
strong jacinth
so my question is, shall i get 2 x Sever 6%, or shall i wait?
willow pulsar
I have two severs 3 but on bad pieces, i am also w8ing
Patientcy is the mark of true assasin, my friend
karmic fjord
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Its very hard to make statements about stat trends in the current patch.
Please use a simulation to generate results for your personal gear situation.
inner leaf
So is severe 3 garbage for sin rogue aoe m+?
plush remnant
Anyone actually using gcb in raid even if it sims 1k higher?
long portal
I know one of the sim guys was looking at it last night. I expect its probably pretty decent with exped/ss/exsang
vast forum
gcb is decent, but requires you to stand still
plush remnant
Yeah they updated the apl and it sims higher for a lot of people. But he said it's assuming 100% uptime
vast forum
don't use if you're not sure you'll be able to stand still 😄
plush remnant
Wonder how fast it falls behind if you have to delay it a bit each time
vast forum
it's not about delaying
long portal
i'm sure you would delay exsang for gcb, like earlier in the xpac
vast forum
it's about dropping it and then moving out of it
ppl didn't delay exsg for gcb earlier
long portal
once exsang snaps the haste, is being in it full duration really that important?
vast forum
you delay gcb for exsang
well, haste also helps with autoattacks and energy gen but yea, it's mostly the snapshot
also poison tickrate
plush remnant
I meant delaying because of mechanics
If that would make other trinkets like vita and coral better
amber quail
In M+ wich is tor crit aim? I’m 43-33-45-3 by now(<60 corr) and minding to buy 3xServere R3
Dunno if is better to but strike R3 before
chilly marsh
you guys dont use TD in m+?
amber quail
Me, and it works
long portal
td is more fun, high crit build is just more consistent /shrug
tropic ocean
F
sweet rampart
I need to go get a golden lustrous plumage
tropic ocean
need to join your guild and be ur lootslave
@sweet rampart if u r good at pvp
easier to get from arena
sweet rampart
hmm what's the requirement for pvp?
sweet rampart
is it just a random drop chance from a cache?
tiny finch
is there a BIS set with corruptions for pure ST?
tropic ocean
expedient
tiny finch
full exp?
tropic ocean
no
tiny finch
or could i save some echoes for gushing wounds?
tropic ocean
1https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-exsanguinate/
tiny finch
Oof, wont be able to run it
just 1 expedient
used everything else on striketroughs lmao
outside this build if im not mistaken we were stacking exp / severes right?
im trying to move away from tendies
patent topaz
expedient is the best for all ST specs
tiny finch
aye, was gearing for outlaw in m+, but i was wondering if that could be good for raid as well
tropic ocean
good for outlaw too
sweet rampart
Even throwing on my 3 exp's i bought only increases my dps by 1k, so i am not going to put them on until i get much higher haste and better gear
minor thicket
But if raiding and you’re not exsan build you can go severe and Expedient
tiny finch
ok, severe / exp. will sim for best outcome
steep obsidian
i wish most rogues didn't get screwed by the currency
tiny finch
expedients are a no go for me atm, will have to wait for next rotation
steep obsidian
so many druid paladin and monk friends has so much frigging banked
tiny finch
waiting for severes rank 3 though
minor thicket
I’m sure severe rank 3 is next week
tiny finch
ill buy 3, anf finish the outlaw set
and*
so i can start working on the ass build
since we are still 6/12 im not that worried, im focusing more on m+ atm
steep obsidian
i still have an expedident sitting in my bags and i have one already i probably should just bite the bullet and put it on a piece
and ditch tendies completely
minor thicket
By tendies are you referring to twisted apendage
tiny finch
yeah
steep obsidian
yah
minor thicket
Gotcha
steep obsidian
ive got a 110k heroic parse on maut where its my top dam
and sometimes you do like 80
lol
minor thicket
Generally if I have TA on an item and I get a expedient or severe. Should I cleanse the TA piece so I can put one of those on
steep obsidian
its not as bas as IS
steep obsidian
i used it for our first xanesh kill and raden kill because i had garbage corruption otherwise
tiny finch
yeah
winter gale
When excatly to use plumage ?
steep obsidian
i want to run it on Maut to see if i can 1 shot myself
winter gale
If anyone can tip me 😄
steep obsidian
its 2 mins like vendetta so with that?
dark token
why arent exang build peeps using galecallers over plumage? sims super well
steep obsidian
galecallers is complete garbage to use on anything with movement
dark token
thats literally how exang works it snapshots your bleeds lol
tropic ocean
xD
steep obsidian
im not dumb
tropic ocean
and the rest of ur dmg?
steep obsidian
xsang isnt all of your dam
dark token
well since you only use galecallers with exang
steep obsidian
how would you know if its better other then feelycraft though if you doing that?
i thought feelycraft was bad
steep obsidian
the sim is standing in it for its full duration?
dark token
and its been like this since uldir, galecallers was the gigabis of exang trinkets
yes
steep obsidian
that is waht i meant
dark token
oh no you get 1 more mut because 12s of haste
tropic ocean
gcb is bad whenever u need to move
dark token
no its literally just for the exang snapshot
dark token
you only use exang with galecallers and vice versa
steep obsidian
i dont know personally i hate the thing regardless
too many times boss or mob moves during the setup coz pepega tanks
dark token
i mean i guess rank 1 wrathion uses it
faint harness
@dark token not completely correct tho
faint harness
the simc usage of GCB was changed
steep obsidian
let me guess
steep obsidian
i dont evne have one or i would just check this shit thats why i was asking
and you give me feelycraft /shrug
last gyro
so if i don't have plumge is 460 gladiators worth ? have gcb 470 as well
tropic ocean
even at dps up i'd not use it
as that value can drop fast if u cant stand in it full duration
while u can still move around a mob with versa buff
or between mobs or w/e
sweet rampart
@last gyro what do you need to do to get the glad one? wowhead is not helping at all lol
dark token
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/uuhBULgYUzANKjVTqGES4X i dont have the proper exang gear yet so i just simmed with rank 1 rogue's expedient setup, seems like a decent boost
last gyro
open world pvp arena
steep obsidian
you can items you can use to upgrade a shitty one right?
umbral hemlock
imma bout to vendor this shit :>
steep obsidian
if you do pvp at a certain level
last gyro
yeah that as well
steep obsidian
my hunter has a 475 plumage that just sits on my bank
sweet rampart
what rating does it need? And is it a random drop after you reach that rating?
tropic ocean
and how do you not understand that
last gyro
i thought of the badge tho don't have that one, have the one that gives mainstat
tropic ocean
that 800dps gain is when u can get 100% of the buff
every time u use the trinket?
soo maybe shadhar
or maut
and
already dps loss in 2, 3 and more target cleave
so yeah use it on maut shadhar but even then
its not like u dont need to move there at all too
dark token
galecallers is literally only used with exang unless boss is about to die, hence any benefit from standing in it is only realized by muts/envenoms, neither of which are big damage in ST with the exang build. sure maybe its a 0.5% up instead of 0.7% like it sims but its still bis singletarget trinket
tropic ocean
so u link a sim
and then u say its only used with exsang
but when doing so
it will be less of a dps gain than the sim you linked
because sim uses it on cd
dark token
rigid eagle
hey guys, how much does the third SS boost bleed damage?
rigid eagle
only at 40% haste with exsang, and sim is already telling me to stop stacking haste...
patent topaz
- Avoids cooldown waste waiting for Exsanguinate on some fight lengths
dark token
yes
patent topaz
check quick sim, it uses on cd
dark token
for that fight length because there is an extra usage gained. if you read the apl it says use together unless you can get an extra use before the boss dies
dark token
yes and anywhere from 5:15 to 5:59 fight lengths it wouldnt. its only if they are close to minute intervals
cobalt pelican
talent.exsanguinate.enabled&(cooldown.exsanguinate.remains<6|cooldown.exsanguinate.remains>20&fight_remains>65 is the use line
tropic ocean
ok but how does it change that you will lose trinket-value when you need to move
due to it being a static buff zone
cobalt pelican
if it's ~1k+ dps upgrade to a 465/470 socket plumage
it's probably worth even with the loss tbh
i probably won't personally play it
but that's because i'm stupid
and i prefer feels to dam
dark token
^^^^
cobalt pelican
if the buffer is big enough between it and the next best thing you could prolly just press exsang and then leave it and have it be worth
idk if that's tru yet or not though
i've not checked shit for my own gear
it'd have to be really big for me to take any interest in it
plush remnant
If you save gcb for exsang. Are you using it right before pressing exsang, after, or something else?
plush remnant
Ty
verbal sparrow
any cd management tips on hivemind ? (Blood of the enemy more likely, if should I just pop it into adds and do aoe or just save it for bursting the boss)
I personally pop it on the cooldown to remove adds
minor thicket
Guys if I start getting some exped and severe contaminants is it safe to say I can cleanse a TA piece and replace it with those mentioned
I’m not Exsan build I prefer TB
wet ruin
so, since dmg/combo point of finishers is the same, and you are more or less gcd capped at this point (or at least during lust, high haste procs, etc.) can using finishers at 3+ be worth it during the gcd capped times since basically cp = damage and potentially losing cp from doing mutilate at 3 or 4 cp would mean lost damage
tropic ocean
wet ruin
yea, it was the opposite question though
hoary acorn
what's the opener with exsanguinate?
minor thicket
Pins
dark token
https://i.imgur.com/9zYEHHt.png ayy we got it boys. gambling always wins
steep obsidian
noice
high siren
can you get an azerite item twice, or is there some rng protection ?
steep obsidian
you can get the same one 4 x in a row
and i have
your rng protection is scrap it and get a little back
yes
and to ignore anyoen who asks you to trade them shit for their offspec they never play
rigid eagle
wish we got like 100 residuums for every 10+ run
instead of having to wait for each weekly reset
vital haven
the residuum system feels like its been totally abandoned by blizz
then again the whole azerite system feels like that LMAO
high siren
how much residuum do you get for scraping a 480 ?
paper kelp
1k
high siren
okay, could have been worse
tropic ocean
@wet ruin was more meant like one of the few persons that can actually help u with that will be in that chan 😛
wet ruin
yea, I posted it there
just wanted an opinion as well before posting it there
is there a way you can actually see how many cp you have wasted during a fight
tropic ocean
in wcl
tropic ocean
wet ruin
so in a 3 min fights its quite a bit
cobalt pelican
everything besides seal fate is kinda just
and garrote now i guess
is mistakes
but cp value just generally isn't that high i don't think
wet ruin
yea, I was mainly looking at seal fate
well, itsn't cp = the damage you do with spenders
so envenom, rupture, ct
cobalt pelican
only envenom really
like
having more cp doesn't = more ct damage or more rupture damage since they're maintained anyway
idk how the cast damage for ct works but i imagine pressing it more often isn't that great
i'd be interested in whether elaborate planning uptime is actually a relevant thing now though
wet ruin
thats true actually
but for envenoms at least
you can get a few more casts in
which I don't know if it would be a significant gain, if any
cobalt pelican
a few more weaker casts that could be mutilate globals though right like, if you follow the logic that you're gcd locked you don't want to be using more weaker globals
you want to be using less, stronger globals
you want to condense your gcds down to the maximum amount of damage you can, because you can fill them regardless
elaborate planning is interesting kinda though cause up until now the value of it has been so negligible that 'whatever you get by playing normally' is just accepted i think, but you could probably choose to keep it up now if you wanted to
i just don't know if it's worth at all, sounds stupid but eh
wet ruin
I get your point, but is mutilate better than a 3 cp envenom
wet ruin
according to tooltip 2 cp envenom is already better
cobalt pelican
mayb
wet ruin
I actually understood you wrong I think, and now I realize what I said
but if you look at it this way, assuming those 26 cp lost from doing mutilate could be envenom damage, since you are casting a mutilate instead of the envenom, it should be more damage right
cobalt pelican
but then you'd quickly run into the issue where like
wet ruin
or maybe not all 26, but even half of them is 13 cp worth of envenom dmg
cobalt pelican
you're trying to 'predict' seal fate rng
paper kelp
youre basically relaying on rng at that point
paper kelp
if you think seal fate cp are wasted
wet ruin
you just finish at 3+ where you are 100% sure you won't miss seal fate cp
wet ruin
what do you mean if I don't get any
paper kelp
seal fate procs on crits
wet ruin
yea, thats the point
paper kelp
unless you have 100% crit you cant say for sure how mayn cp mutilate will give
wet ruin
if you don't get seal fate
wet ruin
so lets say you do mutilate to 2 cp, then you mutilate again and you are 100% sure you will be 6 or less
if you mutilate to 3
then you have a change your next one gives you 4
and you lose 1
but if you envenom
you don't lose the 1
and 3 cp envenom is more damage than 1 mutilate
wet ruin
then you do 4 cp envenom
yea
if you finish at 3+ you guarantee you don't lose cp
that is outside of exsanguinate windows where you would want a 5-6 cp rupture
or maybe just 3+ for the envenom
cuz if you do that for rupture then you are wasting a lot of globals on rupture
cobalt pelican
if you're finishing at 3 idk what you even play
vigor again?
mfd?
play deeper just for exsang setup?
i guess you get the flat damage on finishers regardless
but eughugg#
plush remnant
Only time you'd actually use a 6cp finisher is if you 100% crit at 2 cp
No point taking deeper at that point
wet ruin
I mean, not really though, cuz since you don't need the energy you gain 5% extra damage on finishers
plush remnant
On 6cp finishers that barely happen since you use at 3+
wet ruin
there is a point in deeper
when you are gcd capped vigor does absolutely nothing
but deeper gives you 5% damage on finishers
- you still want to do higher cp ruptures
cobalt pelican
i'll double check it to make sure nothing broke in a sec
this isn't changing ct spend or anythign
wet ruin
what change did you do
cobalt pelican
it's literally just lowering the threshhold to spend on env
wet ruin
are you gcd capped all the time though, cuz I meant it more for when you are gcd capped
where the energy waste won't matter
wet ruin
sure
wet ruin
but I don't know if he is even gcd capped all the time
cobalt pelican
so ~5 open gcds
cobalt pelican
it just doesn't really make sense to do
wet ruin
can you run the 3+ one in quick sim
cobalt pelican
like if your choices are: a 6cp mutilate with 1 cp waste and 5 mutilates OR 2 3cp envenoms with no waste, and 4 mutilates
shur
wet ruin
I don't know maybe I am missing something but as I see it, those mutilates are casted instead of envenoms (or some of them) and an envenom will do more damage
cobalt pelican
it's not a direct swap
of mutilates for envenoms
it's not like your choice is spend 3 cp on envenom or lose 3cp for nothing
wet ruin
I mean you won't be losing 3, but you just lose 1-2 here and there
inner leaf
if i wanna specialize in M+ should i just g et all severe 3 and a couple of strikethrough?
cobalt pelican
sim has 20% seal flate cp overflow
quick sim is being obnoxious with the apl input
tardy tinsel
I usually play outlaw and got a couple daggers to try assassination out, all my gear is crit/vers with severes and strike through corruptions. Is there a way to make all these stats viable for raid without farming haste gear? Or would I be better just staying outlaw?
wet ruin
how so
cobalt pelican
it won't accept the full thing and snippets don't work
what info did you want from quick sim
wet ruin
just the rotation
cobalt pelican
click envenom at 3+
scroll down to action priority priority list dropdown
and then sample sequence table
wet ruin
yeea, but its just prettier in the raidbots 😄
cobalt pelican
severe/strikethrough isn't bad for assassination, it'll work fine for raid
yeah it is but meh
i checked that it was behaving as expected
it goes down to 5% seal fate cp overflow
and up to 98% ep uptime, 92.6% env uptime, from 96.5/94.5
wet ruin
oh right, the envenom buff is cp based
cobalt pelican
yaa
wet ruin
maybe thats part of it
paper kelp
it would be
cobalt pelican
i doubt 2% envenom buff uptime is all that important
it's more just like if you think of a sequence of casts that's mut to 3, env, mut to 4, env, mut to 2, mut to 4, env that's 11 cp envenom damage, 3 envenom globals and 4 mutilate globals and if you think of a sequence like, mut to 3, mut to 7, env, mut to 2 mut to 4, env that's 10cp of envenom damage, 2 envenom globals and 4 mutilate globals
so that'd mean
hmm
i'm really bad at explaining
paper kelp
wasting one global
wet ruin
yea, I get it
paper kelp
for little damage
cobalt pelican
eventually you run into the situation where 1cp envenom damage has to be bigger than a mutilates gcd worth of damage kinda in a really simplified version
fallen sapphire
Guys we just made Drest go splat on mythic and just having a go at Ily, just wondering when is the best time to pop cd's? save for boss or blow on organs?
wet ruin
so I guess the reason is doing envenom at 3 while the chance your next mutilate will bring you to 6 cp is higer than giving you 7
paper kelp
yes
wet ruin
so the envenom at 4+ is really more what I was trying to do with less cp wasted, but its a loss as well
paper kelp
you lose maybe a bit more cp but 1 cp env is less dmg than mutilate
so in the end wasting 1 cp for a mutilate isn't losing anything
wet ruin
yes
cobalt pelican
4cp env is close enough that it might be worth if you made the condition more complex
but meh
even if it got closer to even
it'd only work for 0dd setups
and then it's like
complicating something simple
paper kelp
with deeper its env at 5+ right ?
spring topaz
That moment you kill carapace first time and looting chest and dagger 😂
wet ruin
can you try that with raz profile, the 4+
although I think he tried env at 4+ and it was a loss actually
I guess it depends on crit levels
since losing 1 cp is better, but losing 2cp might not be, but that will only happen if you muti on 4cp and crit with both attacks, so the chance is not really that high
leaden burrow
Anyone how often rp 3 procs ?
tropic ocean
5 rppm
mighty elm
fk u delouza 
tropic ocean
its ok, I wont rage or tilt, I can coin once per week
cobalt pelican
i opened your stream for like 2 mins rise
cobalt pelican
i'm kinda curious about 6cp but
wet ruin
for 6 you will for sure be wasting a lot
cobalt pelican
yeah it p much guarantees overflow every cycle
wet ruin
yea
unless you can garrote from 5 to 6 even if its not pandemic, but don't know if the gcd wasted will be worth
probably not
glacial steppe
once again no chest or dagger, hate my life
glacial steppe
i'll never get cara chest and dagger on mythic 
paper kelp
I'm never getting past raden on mythic
vast forum
bis 
paper kelp
think about people who will never see mythic cara
glacial steppe
i cant even use them until mid to late june tho
frozen karma
glacial steppe
and id rather take 2k dps increase per item instead of idk 200-500 especially we are about to kill Nzoth a second time
which would be quite helpful there
more tilted about the fact that my guild fucked over my really good pulls .-.
lofty belfry
Hello there, I had a question about stats I should focus on as a Rogue Assa MM Raid, with Mind Flay and Expedient build ?
On Warcraft Logs I've seen all and nothing, people with 3k crit score and 1k haste, and people with 2k haste and mastery but 900 crit... don't know which stats I should seek in MM+
uneven summit
Unbridles or Resolve
paper kelp
resolve in pure ST
unbridled on the other fights
by pure ST its for the duration of the pot
lofty belfry
I play outlaw in mm+, my question is only for raiding
but thanks, I'll sim and follow it
frigid briar
anyone actually swapping to GCB?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/mcN4aKXHdKkpn5KckoKeh8
fathom flax
I think gcb and coral suffer from the same problem, they really well but there’s a high potential to lose it, dropping stacks on coral or having to move out of gcb
They sim really well*
frigid briar
yeah, bote will be the play on most fights anyways
fathom swift
There's 1 or 2 fights where it lines up awkwardly but most you can easily get full uptime of it
rigid eagle
holy shit that's one hasty boi
feral creek
carmine osprey
Trying to find out if both non lethals being on at once is still on alpha and/or confirmed as a bug?
cobalt pelican
i don't think they've confirmed it's a bug
so it's a 'believe it to be real till they randomly say it's not' for now
still functioning as far as i'm aware too
toxic remnant
what's the bis azerite traits for single target? 3 double dose? 1 shrouded suff, 2 np?
cobalt pelican
3ss 2hod 1bbi probably, kinda depends a lot on other factors unless you mean access to every item in the game
lime edge
but for sure the bbi shoulders, right?
shut geyser
severe/strikethrough isn't bad for assassination, it'll work fine for raid
@cobalt pelican this is not true
cobalt pelican
ok thanks
shy dust
It not being BiS
cobalt pelican
nobody does, because good rogues have access to all gear?
shy dust
Doesn’t mean it’s not good
shut geyser
its not good
shy dust
cobalt pelican
ok well
crimson palm
vital haven
I did @shut geyser
Before i bought expedient i played with severe and strikethrough
Its a fine build
Hell i still use two severe pieces
Couldnt buy enough expedients lmao
lime edge
anyone here have a fire mage
mellow loom
3ss 2hod 1bbi probably, kinda depends a lot on other factors unless you mean access to every item in the game
@cobalt pelican so I run 2xDD 3xNP should I be looking at SS instead?
cobalt pelican
interestingly replacing all of my expedient (rank 19 atm? i think) with a sev/strikethrough mix is only a 2.8% dps loss
before any other gear like using crit heavy gear, replacing vita with spyglass, etc
cobalt pelican
use whatever is best of the gear you have fronk
cobalt pelican
like those azerite traits are only best if you have access to the pieces and the rest of the supporting gear
lime edge
¯_(ツ)_/¯
vital haven
I still havent gotten rid off 2 severes
lime edge
didnt get rid of this weapon for a long time
mellow loom
Yeah atm I sim highest with VOP major, 3x NP + strikethrough/tendies
lime edge
got it off my 1st pvp weekly
mellow loom
But I wanna work more towards expedient build
vital haven
If you have expedient pieces sim them and see if it works out
cobalt pelican
you can buy expedients without transitioning azerite for now
which is likely going to be your best bet if you don't have good azerite f or the exsang build
topaz valley
has anyone ever simmed full it corruption + nothing personal / vop ?
real solar
on mythic wrathion, we can survive standing in gale blasts ye?
faint harness
Yes
You can also ignore every first intermission
With cloak
Instead of running to safe spot you run to where hes going, pop a vial and be ready with hp pot, and cloak when theres like 3 ish seconds left on his cast
agile spire
Should i play assa or outlaw on Nzoth progress? i cant really tell yet if we need prio dmg or not since we barely make it out of phase 1
faint harness
Well, if you need th dmg, outlaw might be better
agile spire
have to see when we actually get to that,ty
faint harness
Ye theres literally no other adds that matter
harsh hound
How many Expedients will i have to get before it starts outperforming my other corruptions? This is my current setup, any recommendations for what i could do? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bepWWiXByiC7niAeZrrhad
Dont mind sockets and stuff i know for the optimal i should change sockets, but i mainly play outlaw and the difference in switching sockets is around 150dps
shut garnet
you could keep simming expedients from the vendor and see what the result is
dusty roost
@agile spire will depend more on your raid composition. How many mages and hunters do you have? Sin will outshine most classes on boss damage if you're able to prioritise it. Enough Mages and BM hunters will allow for so much passive cleave that you'll be able to ignore adds. Our raid team ran 2 sin rogues because we had the other stuff covered and needed the extra boss damage.
nimble marlin
You should try siming with deeper stratagem aswell and you need SS traits@harsh hound
harsh hound
@nimble marlin im simming with SS traits on head shoulders and chest but its worse than DD
Currently have Raden head, Ilgy shoulders and either carapace hc chest or vex chest
fathom swift
Expedient is good with most gear but it really pulls ahead with exsang/ds
nimble marlin
@harsh hound 1 sim
coming more
Just overlooking your gear, you need more haste heavy items
harsh hound
I see, as said i mainly play outlaw, thats why there's a heavy amount of Crit and Vers but ty alot for helping. Will try it out for sure!
nimble marlin
No problems dude
minor thicket
He’s got pretty heavy haste items
I don’t see how it gets better except getting the Mechagon rings
nimble marlin
as he wants full expedient build
minor thicket
Yea I know.
minor thicket
His haste items now are high
minor thicket
Yea the big difference between your gear and his gear is you have Mechagon rings and 7 expedients
What I’m saying is he needs the rings and more expedient
His current haste items are all high haste no?
nimble marlin
Ye i looked further into it, only 2 items without it
hollow jungle
why is CT the go to on a ST sim? what's the interaction
just that many more bleeds ticking?
cobalt pelican
ct ticks faster the more haste you have
people have absurd levels of haste
it tick real fast
pb mostly stays the same
hollow jungle
figures
is the enhang opener w/ deep strat just dbl garrote>rupture>vendetta>exhang ?
nvm, found in pins
outer lotus
PB has a fixed proc rate per finisher right?maybe it also has something to do with deeper strat cuz you have fewer but stronger finishers instead of many weaker ones like with vigor
grizzled mist
what's the refresh window for Garrote?
minor thicket
Isn’t it under 7 seconds. But let the empowered garrotte fall off completely
fathom swift
5.4s is pandemic window
plush remnant
Raz's guide also says if exsang is about to come up to refresh if >15 seconds left on Garrote and it isn't empowered