assassination

[tropic ocean]

when it was mathematically worse than using ct

if you get what I mean

[sour glade]

Hey, I'm looking for tips for M+ for sin, particularly on big AOE packs. I have 2x shrouded suff and 1x echo blades right now, I know I want 3/2 or 3/3. On a big pack I'm triple garroting into crimson tempest, then fanning and rupturing a few targets until only a couple are left then using mutilate/envenom. Is that about right?
One of my big questions is does rupture do the same dmg no matter how many combos you spend, just the duration changes? So should I be fanning once and rupturing even if it's only say 3 combo points on a trash pack that will die fairly fast? I think I've been fanning to 5 before rupturing which feels like maybe a waste.

[tropic ocean]

no, you dont rupture a few targets

including empowered garrotes u want 4-5 bleeds thats it

after that u only use fok or envenom

and you use ct when the dot is about to expire

to refresh it

[sour glade]

So let's say it's 5 enemies, I'm triple garrote, crimson temp, maybe one rupture and then just FOK and envenom?

Or no ruptures?

[tropic ocean]

depends on your haste

either 1 rupture or 2 rupture

to sustain energy

[sour glade]

K

[tropic ocean]

G1 G2 G3 CT FoK R1 BotE 5xFoK

thats ur 5 mob aoe rotation

[sour glade]

And I assume after popping BotE on AOE I'm just spamming FOK/Envenom?

gotcha

thanks!

[tropic ocean]

np

if theres a hard mob like confessor or whatever that u need to get rid of feel free to replace fok with envenom+vendetta into that mob

[sour glade]

Awesome, my next question was when to vendetta on trash

I keep not using it which is dumb

[tropic ocean]

if you use vision minor essence u basically use it on cd on hard mobs same for vanish just whenever needed on trash (safe for skips if needed)

[sour glade]

I'm so used to fury where I just reck/blood every 90 seconds in all scenarios

[midnight otter]

having played a few more specs now

[tropic ocean]

and just make sure that its ready when you're going to boss

[midnight otter]

fury is sooo easy lol

Sin feels pretty easy on single target but its pretty interesting on multi target

[lean marten]

@white wyvern i mean who really likes respeccing azerite or having diff sets for m+ / raid / pvp / visions. You wouldn't want 1 setup thats a top performer in all?

[faint harness]

not realistic

[lean marten]

3xSS seems to be able to

[white wyvern]

I think it would be boring if there was one build that was the best in everything. I don't like having to pay for it, but I like playing different builds for different content. I am always going to try and play the best build I can for the specific content. Min/maxing is fun.

[lean marten]

so other than pvp, why you on rogue? lol

[tropic ocean]

actually most ppl have different sets for different activities

I have one for m+, visions, raid and pvp

[white wyvern]

Because I like the class and it performs well in all content.

[tropic ocean]

for visions it doesnt matter so I just use 3x np 3x ss eternal palace 450s

for arena I just got a pair of carapace and nzoth heroic azerite

so I dont need to reforge my raid azerite all the time

who cares on 5 ilvl wont matter

[lean marten]

well for us casuals who want a good all-rounder. I'd say 3xSS is the play

[tropic ocean]

doubt it matters for real casuals at all

but yeah just play w/e

the difference in most things is non game breaking

on my warr I use tactician trait over hod which would give me more dps cuz I like the rotation more who cares

[lean marten]

im just a braindead 3x NP + Visions major player so

[tropic ocean]

think bote/botd major is better than vision major

for visions

or maybe I misundertand u

😄

[lean marten]

Thats all i swap is bote for visions lol

[tropic ocean]

the 3 np vision major build if u have access to mythic carapace/nzoth azerite has potential but I personally would only play it in farm as i saw from logs

its big rng

[rigid mango]

If you want a set for everything, that'll work. But it wont be optimal for everything so I don't see the point in arguing optimisation when you're arguing simplicity in builds @lean marten .

[lean marten]

Thats my argument tho, that 3xSS can be optimal and simplistic for everything.

[tropic ocean]

not optimal

simple yes optimal not

[sour glade]

Is engi helm good for sin in raid or arena? Looking at the powers it doesn't seem like I'd want it for M+, but trying to figure out if I should craft it for the others

I don't mythic raid so in terms of ilvl it'll be my highest helm option other than residuum pieces

[strange python]

its good for raid

[sour glade]

Thanks. That's how it looked to me, just wanted to make sure.

[rigid mango]

It's not optimal but it is simplistic. Sin isn't outlaw and what you need/want differs content to content, or even instance to instance.

3 ss is fine, but exsang wont be optimal (unless you have specific gear).

[sour glade]

Last time I was playing rogue a few months ago this seemed to be the deal:
M+: I want 3x SS 2-3 EB, maybe 1 NP
Raid: 3x DD, 1 NP, then TTK?
Arena: 1x SS, as much TTK and NP as I can?

Is that accurate?

[rigid mango]

Give or take, raid is flexible and a lot of traits are good, simming is the way

Pvp you don't want more than 1 np

M+ doesn't really want np but it's still decent as a single. Stuff like HoD or TTK are generally better.

[lean marten]

so prolly 3x SS + 1x NP

[plush saddle]

hi guys, whats the best aoe assas build

i have 3x echoing blades

but idk which talents are best

[tropic ocean]

2212221(or 3) @plush saddle

[raven kiln]

Is assasination far behind outlaw in m+?

Around 15 keys*

[edgy pawn]

decently geared not, lot harder to get the right azerite though

[raven kiln]

I See ty :)

[onyx wigeon]

what minor essences do you guys use for pvp? 😄

[edgy pawn]

#pvp

[onyx wigeon]

ah sorry 😄

[ionic hemlock]

im gonna need everyone to stop using assassin in M+ so my score can go up and in rank

cheers, lol 😛

Im just bad so its fine. I was comparing my fury war (alt) to a main technically I never play and iwas like wtf how's he doing better

[limber merlin]

Ttk = ?

[shell niche]

What stats do i focus for the exsang build? i got the bis azerite pieces for it but its still a 2k DPS downgrade compared to doubledose build

[lean marten]

ttk = twist the knife

someone said exsang doesn't sim correctly but idk for sure

is it still worse if u swap in TB

[fading walrus]

were the pins removed ?

im really curious to the rotation of Assas in raids on ST

and the role of bleeds there

[strange python]

they appear to be gone

you can just read a guide

icy-veins and wowhead have some

[fading walrus]

deal thank u

[strange python]

pins seem back again

[upper fiber]

I cant find the tooltip that says that if you hit an ennemy from behind , it hits for more damage...

[lean marten]

thats only sub bstab i believe

[upper fiber]

oh....wow . i feel kinda stupid now

[lean marten]

but melee classes in general do more dmg from behind since mobs can't block from behind

[flat tundra]

does partial blocks exist?

or isnt it just a binary check

[rigid mango]

Just a binary check

It's like a 90 degree angle infront of them afaik that's counted as "infront"

Sides and behind are normally not parry territory.

[lean marten]

the mechagon "attack from behind" even procs on the side attacks

[strange python]

I got a question so sometimes when i press my button lose energy but no cp is that cuz the boss parried?

[lean marten]

yes

[strange python]

Fuck me

Ty i thought it was some sort of lag

[flat tundra]

gotta get some hit rating

[lean marten]

unless its a bug but i've noticed that too

[ionic hemlock]

juggling hit rating or juggling corruption...🤔 starting to wonder all these "advancements" of the game.

[pseudo hamlet]

How good is void ritual? Is it really nice? I've got 460ilvl with socket... thinking about purifying it because I've got some old boots(440ilvl). And I've got also 465 TD 12% and 470 with stackable critical 72x5... So I guess it's safe to cleanse them?

[drifting cloud]

you can try simming it compared to your crit boots if theyre both 35 corr

but yeah its a mediocre corruption

not bad, not great

[pseudo hamlet]

Do we have any good corruption table? I mean, to see which one are for sale/cleanse and which are to keep? Or just need to check everything with sims 🤔

[drifting cloud]

its usually better to sim because it just depends on what your other stuff is

for example im wearing 2x 6% mastery which is garbage, but I need to use it in my <40 set otherwise im not even at 25 so my raid trait activates

[elfin tiger]

can someone tell me how to use razor coral properly

do i just use it whenever available

[drifting cloud]

use it with vendetta and let it stack between them

[elfin tiger]

so on pull i apply it

then use it for next vendetta?

[drifting cloud]

ye and then just let it stack for 2nd vendetta

[elfin tiger]

thanks

i have a 430 one i assume its better than anything else?

[drifting cloud]

for st most likely yes

if you had like 475 socket spyglass it might be close 😛

[elfin tiger]

i use it with a 460 vita-charged

[dark crag]

Behind enemy is all 180°. Sub rogues know that

[ionic hemlock]

This is bullshit, how you suppose to get anything done with your insanity ticks so fucking fast lol

i can get like a full clear but i end up getting shit on cus alleria is the worse and Im already outta charges

[arctic walrus]

Do you have elite exterminaton

[ionic hemlock]

yeah

[arctic walrus]

Then how are you possibly full clearing with 0 orbs left

[ionic hemlock]

I don't know this is what I don't understand, I only kill what I absolutely need to kill

Maybe I should have taken Expansive Mind instead

[idle ember]

how much % healing reduc is wounding with master poisoneer?

[flat tundra]

30

[idle ember]

thanks

[glacial steppe]

im really enjoying the vision build tho, just wondering if its actually bad for progress cus of inconsistency and 1.5mins instead of 2 on cds (in case you need prio dmg every 2 mins)

[steep obsidian]

it depends on your raid comp prolly?

i think 90 sec vend works pretty well on quite a few fights

[glacial steppe]

we currently on raden

didnt try it there yet but we early in progress

first two orbs down, third on 20% i think

[ionic hemlock]

vision build?

[steep obsidian]

oh well

you might get an extra vendetta in raden i think

just depends if you can use on cooldown or not

[glacial steppe]

a vision proc on orbs could indeed help but its probably way to inconsistent? idk

[steep obsidian]

i had to hit orbs so it kinda sucked

[glacial steppe]

i have to aswell

cant even play my first vendetta really cus im third with big circle thingy

which is like 10-15s into vend i think

[steep obsidian]

just dpends what soaks you gotta do yar

id prefer to be on the soak group when ya knock the shadow thing around tbh

nightmare and vita sucks

[glacial steppe]

im shadowstepping to void orb when possible, walk balk with it while killing it and take circle

[steep obsidian]

or be a backup 😛

[glacial steppe]

ehh, we have one group for circle and void

its the same

[steep obsidian]

yeh

there isnt a circle on the 3rd orb with what we did tho

i dunno if other gruops kill the same as we do tho

i went nightmare nightmare void group

and if pepeple arent dumb you can pick up the nightmare while hitting the boss

[glacial steppe]

idk, we start with melees doing circle and once second vita orb spawns, ranges do circle and melees do orb+void bounce

[steep obsidian]

i was thelsat soak though so i could just stay in till like the last 2 secs or wahtever and dumb it out

and people would freak out coz it looked like it was gonna get dumpbed on the raid

[glacial steppe]

im third soak which works really well with our vita orb killtime

[steep obsidian]

you might be able to talk the rl into not hitting the first orb

[glacial steppe]

i can walk always to to the vita spawn, run back with it and arrive 2 seconds before i have to soak void

[steep obsidian]

coz that one should die easily

but melee is normally a cluster fk on that one

[glacial steppe]

i dont really mind if it helps killing the boss tho

[steep obsidian]

more boss deeps make sthe push easier too but yah

[glacial steppe]

we had too much boss damage iirc

well tbh, i usually ask for stuff like this so i can make somehwat sure that it actually wont fail

[steep obsidian]

i generally just look at a bunch of logs for timings and stuff

try and find a decent parse log using the build you want to and doing similar assignments mebbe

[glacial steppe]

kinda problematic cus we are just a casual 2 day CE guild, so we have people that get assigned for certain mechanics a lot, and some that dont get assigned at all cus you know, they suck

[steep obsidian]

dont worry i know that feel

[near plover]

!essence

[honest vessel]

!essences

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[signal summit]

Is it possible for frinds to run u through 5 masks even if u have only unlocked 3 masks urself?

[drifting cloud]

yes

[dusk tinsel]

what does r1 stand for in the mythic assassination rotation?

[signal summit]

rupture 1?

[dusk tinsel]

ok thanks

[glacial hinge]

!Essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[ionic hemlock]

dang, I really wanted the crit from a new belt but it seems like void ritual is winning the sim lottery lol

[swift sparrow]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[honest needle]

whats the current best way to grind honor right now ? brawl or bgs ?

[ionic hemlock]

I like all of it

[lethal heart]

brawl when its comp stomp

bgs when its bg week

[ionic hemlock]

World Quests (invasions/pvp)

[lethal heart]

and bgs outside of bg week aswell

[ionic hemlock]

just be flagged for wpvp and go ham

[honest needle]

so whats best this week

brawl or regualr bgs

so on opener u always wanna vendetaa then tb then vanish

why not tb vendetta vanish them envenom ?

[strange python]

you go from largest to smallest window

and also because tb does damage

i think

[honest needle]

so u always vendetta then TB

then vanish

dont u waste combo points

[brisk forge]

Tb gets dmg boost from vendetta

[honest needle]

ya but u waste combo points what happens when u mut mut rup gar then mut and u get 5

then u still vendetta tb

even at 5 combo points ?

[brisk forge]

Yes

[honest needle]

so its ok to vendetta tb at 5 combo points ?

that seems weird

[austere wadi]

Quick question for one of my raiders, can rogues cloak off the corrupted existence debuff on Raden?

[brisk forge]

More important to cast tb on cd

So a few cp isnt a big deal

[cobalt gyro]

Ya u don't care about tb loss really

If you can plan it to not waste or sit on tb, go for it but keeping it on cd is way more important

[steep obsidian]

@austere wadi you can shouldnt be needed if healers are awake but i guess it can be an issue if he gets tons of breath and lucid procs at a bad time

[eager solstice]

Any pref on profession for rogue in terms of dps?

[lost horizon]

leatherworking can get you some easy socketed pants+feet, JC for ring, brez for helm till better

[pseudo hamlet]

@eager solstice eng for awesome goggles (480ilvl) and other tricks, such as Nitro Boosts(which can be DPS gain if you move fast enough to another enemy!).

[pseudo finch]

This is kinds sad because it took me so long but just did it, my 1st 5 mask clear. Thanks to everyone for the dope advise you dudes post 🙂

[little sandal]

i see top logs using master assassin with vision of perfection the opener perfect everything great but then after vanish never sits with vendeta cool down so i should just use vanish to put rupture on the target and carrote

[edgy pawn]

youre looking at wrathion logs, right?

[tropic ocean]

@little sandal u never use rupture or garrote with vanish when using master assassin

when u use vision of perfection u use vanish with 1st, 3rd, 5th vendetta and so on

[little sandal]

ok ty u save it then i was doing it right

may i ask in what fight vision of perfection is good

[tropic ocean]

wrathion

maybe drestagath if u struggle with adds

[little sandal]

ok ok so only wrath and every other fight bote ld cns ls

[tropic ocean]

well it comes down to what your raid needs and killtime as well

the difference between cns and vision is not very big

so if your fight ends shortly before ur vendetta comes of cd vision might have been better

or to meet certain pushs/dps checks during the encounter

[little sandal]

makes sence ty for the help 😄

[round hamlet]

Whats everyones go to for mythic plus? Are we rupturing every target or just focusing down priorities. I have an 18% twilight dev so thatll help in cleave

I originally wanted to do a BoE, 3x Echoing blades build with my twilight dev to see some devastation but only a dream

[strange python]

3x ss is insane

[raven kiln]

This might be a wiered question... but what guide is the most accurate for assa rogue? Usuly i use wowhead nowadays

[tropic ocean]

Wowhead

Icy veins

Ravenholdt

@round hamlet i never play td

I think its insanely overrated, super pad, very ninja pull and in weeks like this counterproductive af

[charred harbor]

whats the usual mast/crit i wanna aim for? ive been simming myself and its telling me i need to drop the amount of mastery i have to vers and haste when im at 19% haste and 5% vers with 55% mast and 41% crit

and i feel with the lower mast all im doin is hurtin my envenom

[cobalt pelican]

why does your envenom matter

[wet ruin]

so if you wanna go for logs you go TA and pray for rng?

[cobalt pelican]

kinda, yeah

as the tier goes on more and more of the top log spots are just taken by god pulls

[charred harbor]

[cobalt pelican]

you can get pretty high with just decent play still for sure, just not the tippy top

[wet ruin]

I find it hard to get 99 without the rng, on heroic that is

[cobalt pelican]

depends heavily on gear still but i have no issues especially in heroic

but my gear is kinda decent so i guess that prolly has something to do with it

[charred harbor]

ya our other rogue manages to get 99s on mythic but hes like its kinda tough but on hero hes like

[cobalt pelican]

heroic is kinda just memes tbh

[wet ruin]

I don't know, maybe I am just bad but also my corruption is kinda meh

[cobalt pelican]

do you still do guild heroic, like are your kills decently fast? are you changing your build for heroic?

i play kinda dumb shit cause bosses die stupid fast

the only boss i just don't ever do well on at all is carapace and it's just cause i don't carry m+ gear when raiding

[wet ruin]

no, just boost heroics

kill timers are not the best, but that shouldn't be the problem

[cobalt pelican]

on heroic it likely is

well, there will be other things

but especially the first bosses like

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/draenor/plode#difficulty=4

look how fast things die

you either get 1 font vend

or 2 vends with vop

and have to swap per boss

some people play exsang memes for the huge opener

kinda just depends

[eternal turtle]

quick question, my WA tracks garrote / rupture time left on enemy, but it messes up when other rogues apply it aswell, how can i make it so it only tracks when i apply it?

[wet ruin]

yea, I see the SS build for those fast kills

I am not running that

[cobalt pelican]

there's a weakaura option for each trigger called 'own only'

[wet ruin]

I am also not running more than 39 corruption so that is a factor as well

[cobalt pelican]

well, yeah

i think most people play up to like 79 on herioc with no issues

kinda understandable to not do it in a boost though

[eternal turtle]

there's a weakaura option for each trigger called 'own only'
@cobalt pelican found it thnx

[charred harbor]

i just made my own for that @eternal turtle

worked out

[wet ruin]

haven't really simmed shorted fights, is GW still good on short fight as well

putting aside the broken TA damage if you get procs

[charred harbor]

also would running double carapace daggers be optimal? or just one?

[cobalt pelican]

depends on what your other gear is

gw is still pretty good on short fights for sure, just less outlandishly good cause way more of the damage is centered on the first vend which it doesn't amplify at all

[wet ruin]

mhm

[charred harbor]

no GW corruption, have Infinite stars r2 but kinda stayin away from that at least on the fifa world cup that is xanesh mythic

and runnin echoing gloves that i prob shouldnt tbh

[strange python]

Are they supposed to look like this? Wtf blizz

[rigid mango]

This seema like a #transmog question

[strange python]

Well i thought since they are the assination legion artifacts , you guys would know how they would normally look like on a forsaken

[misty hazel]

For m+ would you guys go 3x SS, 2x HoD 1x EB/NP or just go 3x SS 3x HoD?

[arctic walrus]

1 eb

[misty hazel]

Alright, just leave the NP out?

[vast forum]

depends on key

[strange python]

Interaction between NP and vision How does it work

[arctic walrus]

procs it at a lower duration

[strange python]

does it do the same damage if proc with viison?

or i guess it scales down as well no?

[arctic walrus]

damage per tick is the same, but you get it for like 7 seconds, or w/e vendetta's duration is from vision

[strange python]

mk sounds nice thanks

[sterile ocean]

Should i be running vop in miner?

[ionic hemlock]

Is there a legend for all these acronyms ? lol

[distant lava]

not really

which one don't you understand

[ionic hemlock]

the HoD kinda threw me

Well I still don't know what it meant

I thought for M+ though it was 3 echoing blades and 3 shroud of suffocation hah I didn't realize whatever HoD was needed and EB/NP for that matter.

[icy ember]

heart of darkness

[ionic hemlock]

ahh

[strange python]

there's this https://www.wowhead.com/guides/assassination-rogue-glossary-abbreviations-common-terms and https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/wow-rogue-abbreviations/ for general stuff

but they dont have azerite in it etc

[mossy valve]

Do you guys know is blood of the enemy is like uber required for high m+ keys? Also I saw in the guide vop was lower prio, but I’ve seen some high end rogues run it this week in my 18-20s. Just their preference or is it good?

[ionic hemlock]

Is corruptions strong enough to warrant using over stats? Just wondering because I was trying to sim an M+ with new gloves which has twilight devastation 3 but my rings still do better, one ring has twilight dev. rank 3 and the other has strikethrough rank 2.

[strange python]

how did you sim?

try 40 sec patchwerk, 6 targets, no bloodlust

[ionic hemlock]

yeah i turn off all buffs, hang on I will pull it up

[mossy valve]

Also, Can you unlock the other colors of the mage tower appearances on an alt rogue who didn’t get the mage tower appearances himself? I have 3 rogues but the one who got them is still 110 lol

[ionic hemlock]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/75cm7NqUSJZUD1nvTSKVVv

[subtle salmon]

assassin rogue guys can solo visions easily ?

[ionic hemlock]

I don't know about easily, but yes they can solo it.

[subtle salmon]

i guess its gonna be harder compared to a ret pala right?

[mossy valve]

It’s pretty good

Not as good as my dh but pretty easy

I’d say Ret pally level but I don’t play ret

[subtle salmon]

compared to outlaw?

harder?

[mossy valve]

Just whatever you like tbh I don’t think it’s much harder or easier especially depending on azerite

[subtle salmon]

im leveling up alts so their azerite is gonna be bad xD

[strange python]

@ionic hemlock try this instead https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bqe8ik1jZTCXuyJ433S78D

almst the same but essences different and no heed

[mossy valve]

Does anyone know a really good m+ video guide?

I know genji made one for earlier in the expansion but I wanted an updated one

[strange python]

idk about guide but you can watch morningbryg and seliathan on twitch

[mossy valve]

Okay thanks man ill write those down

[ionic hemlock]

Sounds good, I will try that

[mossy valve]

Do you know @strange python how good blood of the enemy is in m+? Can I get by doing high keys with Fovused beam major or botd major?

[strange python]

morning tried them all not too long ago and was fond of botd i think

[summer valve]

comp stomp is coming up in 10 days

[strange python]

but i havent tried anything of that myself

[summer valve]

if you want an easy way to farm bote 🙂

[strange python]

it's just too satisfying to spam those 5 foks with blood

[mossy valve]

Oh really it’s fast?

I’m gonna farm rank 3 on my main cause I already have rank 2, unless you guys think rank 3 isn’t super important

[summer valve]

i mean you're basically just beating up on AI stuff

just farm r3 on main, then buy it with essences on alts

[mossy valve]

Okay dope

But breath of the dying is okay for now?

[strange python]

until you have r3 bote yea

[mossy valve]

Okay dope

[strange python]

its just a lot of work i guess

to snipe

[summer valve]

yeah

[mossy valve]

Ahh I feel

I just use minor on dh so it’s easy

Oh oh also

Is icyveins up to date for corruption? I saw a really high end rogue run stacking mastery proc

For m+

[strange python]

can you link it

but its updated by seliathan i think

[mossy valve]

Yeah sec

https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-gear-best-in-slot

Basically I’m just wondering what the best corruption for m+ are, and I have mastery proc ones so was hoping those were good lol

[icy ember]

twilight dev rocks in M+ and it isnt restricted by ilvl like other corruptions

or mindflay

[strange python]

yea td, gw, crit

[mossy valve]

Yuck lol I was hoping something else would be S tier for rogues but I guess I feel that

Took me forever to farm on dh

[summer valve]

stat corruptions scale better with gear but TD is nice because it shows up on meters and can just randomly delete stuff

[brittle dirge]

hey guys having an issue

can you not see Ruptures bleed on a target?

all my other dots are showing fine

[silent parcel]

What should I change gearwise do do more dmg ? Feels weird sitting at 469 ilv and simming 15k less than people at 472

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wQcN9ZLVqgSfBkgfxRrZB8

[strange python]

if you post your top gear sim it's easier to help

but 465 dagger is yuck

[brittle dirge]

whenever i use rupture nothign shows up on the target

[strange python]

do you use default ui or anything else

[quasi pewter]

if you have as much expedient as you do

you should propably go full haste

do a top gear sim

[silent parcel]

Simming higher with mastery enchants than haste

[quasi pewter]

also daggers only 465

hc coral

[silent parcel]

But doing top gear sim rn will post once its done

Takes forever to do the 3rd part though ^^

[brittle dirge]

@strange python i use elvui

does elvui hide it?

[strange python]

nooot sure

but maybe you can add it in the options?

or you clicked on it funny and it got blacklisted

[inland gull]

is there a way to check what % a log would be? only got in details xd

[silent parcel]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/uStv3U5TKq2uXPuBPEoSrP

Here is top gear sim

[orchid solstice]

So is it confirmed that IS scales with haste cause i keep hearing that... if so does it also scale with other stats

[inland gull]

all corruption scales with vers

[steady owl]

Twilight devastation does way more damage for me as outlaw than assa, does anyone know why? Does it have to do with haste?

[echo cargo]

haste affects ppm of TD + stars

[maiden patio]

can someone please help me

[arctic walrus]

With

[maiden patio]

i suck arse

pvp and pve

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/hfkgQTXzCs5pCWHRzGWpmk

[strange python]

@silent parcel it's not much but maybe try this https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ud9iRp1oyKB7RLNYzVFa9W

[maiden patio]

i literally tried everything from icyveins

[eternal turtle]

!help

[maiden patio]

forget pvp.. just pve..not sure what im doing wrong. i spread my garrotes/ruptures..

still cant sustain decent dps.. always last

[steady owl]

Ok thanks

[strange python]

@maiden patio you got no essences

[undone pasture]

All your essenses are r1?

[strange python]

you got shield trinket

you just need to farm essences and get better gear tbh

[quasi pewter]

@silent parcel you just have very few sockets and some low ilvl pieces

[undone pasture]

And never use bote below r3

[maiden patio]

wait essences makes that much of a difference?

[strange python]

yes

[silent parcel]

@quasi pewter So basically I just need to get luckier

xd

[quasi pewter]

or get some sockets from visions

[silent parcel]

Done 1-5 mask this week only got 450 hands with socket

[quasi pewter]

also if you dont mythic raid ur gear will always be behind mythic raiders

i mean buy sockets

[silent parcel]

Oh yeah, working on it

[quasi pewter]

can easily get 1 per week

[silent parcel]

Yeah, need 2k more so should get it tomoro

[maiden patio]

@strange python so i should farm the R3 essences listed on icyveins @undone pasture https://www.wowhead.com/guides/assassination-rogue-azerite-essences

[strange python]

yes

[maiden patio]

omg.. thank you.. i knew i was missing something

[strange python]

and your trinkets are very bad

for pve

[maiden patio]

okay ideal trinkets?

[strange python]

should probably farm EP for coral

eternal palace

ashvane drops it

and then maybe vita from ra den

current raid

[maiden patio]

okay essences and trinkets. thank youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

[strange python]

np

[strange python]

in a 3 min fight my font / harlans sims higher than coral / font or coral / harlans wtf

[distant cypress]

Hey, what setup do you guys use for 5 mask horrific visions ? 3 x ss + VoP major + BoTD + Lucid + Iris minors ?

[sour glade]

M+ minors? I'll be running blood major. Breath and Lucid seem no brainer, but for the last one, puri proto, C&S, or VoP?

VoP would make vendetta and blood line up on bosses but seems less useful for M+. Puri proto is tons of dmg on my fury so I figure it's the one but just wondering

[ionic hemlock]

hmm, i can't seem to get the same numbers on this sim

[arctic walrus]

@distant cypress botd major is good in visions, vop not really that quite helpful in visions. YOu can go with blood major as well, but the bosses will already be melting if you have 3ss/3np. minors can be lucid cns and pp

@sour glade protocol isn't that great of a minor for sin, vop is actually the most versatile for m+ and you should run it cuz it desyncs your vendetta from vanish and can let you vanish on trash more often

[ionic hemlock]

I don't what I am simming wrong, but one guy simmed me gets 182k and I sim and I am getting 164k

[true nexus]

what lenght of fights is CLF better for

than bote

[distant cypress]

thanks @arctic walrus

[drifting cloud]

@true nexus I use it on dog since we kill it exactly 4min so its double vendetta

only

think I might have also used it on raden

its a suepr small thing either way, most people just stay bote

[dark token]

wtf how did i do 92k overall in this dungeon when i usually do 75-80k

https://i.imgur.com/HZj4vsf.png

[drifting cloud]

its not 92k? 😛

its 76k without cannon

I guess if you were dpsing instead of shooting it id be slightly higher aswell

[dark token]

derp, bad math

[true nexus]

You can remove cannon

From details

Permanently

[strange python]

should i opt for a vita build if its equal in dps jsut so my raid also gets the vita haste proc?

[marble hemlock]

ofc

[maiden raptor]

really how do you remove it?

[strange python]

and what if its a 500 dps loss?

[true nexus]

Ill link you when i go up to my pc

[drifting cloud]

500 dps compared to what lonewolf, font?

[maiden raptor]

sounds good ty

just @ me or w/e if you can

[dark token]

Details.SpellsToIgnore [263193] = true removes it right?

[true nexus]

yeah something like that

[celest swan]

comes MA vs Subterfuge down to sim dps?

subterfuge sims 800 dps higher for me without any SS traits and i see the majority in logs is on MA, thats why i ask

[drifting cloud]

800 is a boatload, use subt

for most of us its alot closer

[maiden raptor]

@dark token i'm actually pepega but where exactly do you put that to remove the canon?

[dark token]

https://i.imgur.com/zduNXGR.png

[maiden raptor]

awesome thanks a lot

[dark token]

https://i.imgur.com/aDhaKox.png can i socket my coral with the momentos thing even tho its a season 3 item?

i want all sockets

[celest swan]

nope u cant

[scarlet sequoia]

thats a lot of crit

[dark token]

yup

[true nexus]

not one 470 item

feelsbad

[ionic hemlock]

Battle for Naj just stopped running ?

[celest swan]

in the sim, it uses vanish garrote after blood of the enemy (with subterfuge) is this correct?

[wide linden]

@dark token what's ur crit%?

[ionic hemlock]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/hXpoh6S4riTUbqjpks5Kjm I need trinkets, rngesus really hates me

[dark token]

40%

this is my m+ set

i dont do mythic raid or get good luck with 475 boxes so /shrug i guess this is bis for me

[main blaze]

Whats the patchwerk 6 target sims for?

[ionic hemlock]

M+

[dark token]

i quit sin

this other sin i just played with had rank 4 TD and perfect m+ azerite

no way i ever get that

[ionic hemlock]

who is that?

[true nexus]

IS visions minor on heroic nzoth bad

[quasi pewter]

td is kinda cringe

[sonic iris]

how is shrouded suffocation traits and garrote in aoe compared to outlaw

[steep obsidian]

alot of it depends how your tank pulls and how big tbh if you pulling small and your tank lets you restealth between every pull garotte will do a lot overall

eb is the big aoe trait for sin

[wispy vault]

Hey, kind of new to the disc. I was going through pinned messages to try and find it, but running VoP minor with master assass would you save Ven and BoTE for vanish or just go ahead and use on cd?

[drifting cloud]

if youre not using them on cd why are you playing vop? 😛

[wispy vault]

Was using it for the nice lineup BoTE and vend... but I see

[drifting cloud]

also usually subt should be better if youre running vop minor

[wispy vault]

Do I need ss traits? I feel dps is a lot higher with ma in the opener

[drifting cloud]

if were talking st, why are you playing vop minor to start it

its almost never the choice

unless its better for certain fights

[wispy vault]

Hmm not sure, I was just was looking at logs and it seemed it was in there a lot

[drifting cloud]

was it wrathion logs? 😛

its not that common outside of that fight

[wispy vault]

I see, just a fluke. Thanks 🙂

[sterile ocean]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/pQocPpYvJpjpP8vmgefNdX

[untold atlas]

so do i not use breath of the dying for raid or dungeons

according to ravenholdt i dont use it as a minor or major?

[quasi pewter]

you always use breath of the dying

[untold atlas]

as a major or minor

like the information im getting is confusing me

still trying to find just a straight to the point essences i use for mythic + and raids

and the variations i swap between

[quasi pewter]

the guide was last updated on 14th of january which is before 8.3, slightly out of date

you usually use breath as minor

can be good as major too though

[untold atlas]

ok so what guide would i want to use

because ive looked at a couple but im still like confused

[quasi pewter]

about what

[untold atlas]

on the essences i should use for raid/mythic + and the essences i swap out for in certain situations

[quasi pewter]

for m+ you want to use blood of the enemy if you have it rank 3

minors are lucid breath always, and either conflict iris or vision of perfection

[untold atlas]

does it matter of the rank for perfection?

[quasi pewter]

its really easy to get rank 3 anyways

and it gets better ofc

[untold atlas]

so major i have rank 1 blood and some others

[quasi pewter]

blood should only be used if you have it rank 3

if you dont then i would use iris as major for m+

[untold atlas]

ok for raid?

i feel like for raid breath would be a major?

[quasi pewter]

since you dont have blood other good choices are condensed life force, worldvein or breath

but depends on what rank ur essences are

[untold atlas]

umm i have rank 1 blood rank 3 breath rank 1 essence atm

rank 3 lucid

[quasi pewter]

essence is iris?

[untold atlas]

yea

and rank 3 flame

[quasi pewter]

for raid i would just do a single target sim

and see what sims best

but i would assume breath major would sim best for you

[untold atlas]

im like brand new to melee so sims and shit is completely new but i understand how to do em

[quasi pewter]

yea for raid just do a patchwerk 5 min sim

and put all the essences you have as major and minor

in top gear

[untold atlas]

ok

[quasi pewter]

for m+ its a little more difficult

but propably use breath major in ur case

and minor just whatever you have highest rank

[sterile ocean]

@quasi pewter is there anything wrong with my sim? jw

im specced for raiding

[quasi pewter]

looks good but you should have some different corruptions for some bosses

[untold atlas]

thanks vibe appreciate the help

[quasi pewter]

stars isnt good on all of them

but i guess its only 2x t1 shouldnt make a huge difference

[sterile ocean]

yeah i got a bunch of corruption gear but its kinda whats best for me atm

[untold atlas]

so i do want to farm a bit for rank 3 perfection>?

[quasi pewter]

it doesnt take long to get

i would recommend getting it

if you dont mind grinding, i would go for blood of the enemy too

best essence for m+ and one of the best for raiding too

[sterile ocean]

@quasi pewter

[untold atlas]

yea im kin the process of getting it sorta so i plan to grind for it

[sterile ocean]

i got a bunch in my bags basicly waiting incase i need to swap em

[quasi pewter]

yea for like hivemind just put something else

vexiona etc

[sterile ocean]

yeahh

next week i can put a belt with vers

vers corruption

and down the road i got a belt with rank 3 stars

[sonic iris]

the top logs are using bote

is that the best essence or are the logs cheesed?

[dark crag]

and yes

[onyx hedge]

um

:I

Do i here 1mill, 1 mill

[subtle salmon]

guys is assassin good for visions ?

[rigid mango]

Yes, one of the best in the game

[subtle salmon]

better than outlaw?

cause outlaw feels so clunky to me

sin is so smooth

[strange python]

play whatever feels better for u ive done 5 masks with both and personally found it easier as outlaw but that could be just me

[subtle salmon]

hmm

outlaw has better aoe right?

[strange python]

yes but dont pull too big

[rigid mango]

A lot better than outlaw, if we're talking masks

[subtle salmon]

CT is not that good for AoE?

as assassin

[rigid mango]

You just rely on killing trash with a cleave setup and cheesing bosses through raw damage

It is, but you shouldn't use it

Assa plays diff

You just pull smaller but shred it and never risk anything

And also just clap the living shit out of bosses

[subtle salmon]

hm

so i dont go all in as assassin

[lusty narwhal]

Unless youve got bulk EB but thats hard now since raid gear doesnt have it

[vast forum]

EB is bad for visions

unless you have 2 different gearsets

1 with EB, 1 with SS/NP

[upper fiber]

HI boys ! I was wondering if it was good To have 2x Twisted Appendage Rank2 ? Does it stack Well ?

For single target.

[scarlet sequoia]

it just stacks

[upper fiber]

Oh ok i see ...!

Means**

[scarlet sequoia]

it does more damage

[upper fiber]

Thanks mate ! :)

[scarlet sequoia]

np

[tender folio]

Guys when it comes to simming for myth+ are we using dung beta option or hecta cleave ?

[tender folio]

Don't be shy, I wont biye

bite

[dark crag]

Maybe

[quiet cypress]

Hey, new to rogue, quite curious, what would be the best heirloom weapon(s) for leveling?

i'd say i'd go with haste since that should be better for single target, right?

[dark crag]

Dagger

[lethal heart]

@tender folio there is many ways to sim m+

depends what you're looking for

i'd say best way to sim for m+ is

sim single target 2-3 minute fights with bloodlust

[dark crag]

Stats for leveling don't really matter

[lethal heart]

and then sim 4-5-6-8 target 40s to 1 minute cases

without bloodlust

and then compare/see which traits perform better in certain scenarios

m+ is very dynamic and its not black and white

[quiet cypress]

@dark crag aighty, thanks i'll just go with haste then :p

[tender folio]

@lethal heart thanks for the info ^_^

[dark crag]

I would go for crit

[tender folio]

Also what do you guys think about Twilight Devastation in myth + ? Is it good or should we focus more on those stat increases as assa rogues ?

[high nacelle]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[sour glade]

Got two pairs of boots, almost same ilvl, same stats, one is tendies 2 one is 12% haste. tendies for arena haste for pve?

Actually I guess tendies for arena, whichever sims higher in pve. heh

[hallow kraken]

What's a good overall damage for m+?

I've been doing 65-75k overall at ilvl 468

Just trying gauge where I'm at

[warm drift]

There are so many factors for the overall. Dungeons, group sizes, keylvl, groub setup, corruptions etc

But i guess for a pug its a decent number.

[lethal heart]

@scarlet sequoia

bro

thats only piece

i had haste on

[rigid mango]

[lethal heart]

not even upset tho

[strange python]

33% crit 20% haste 41% mastery. do i push haste even though i have loaded dice ?

get a bit confused with everyones opinions being different based on items

[inland gull]

what content?

[strange python]

i get told to stay at 20%, i get told to keep pushing haste. - raiding

[drifting cloud]

theres no opinions, only sims

[strange python]

Am i expected to get two sets of gear to optimize mythics AND raiding ?

[drifting cloud]

nobody has ever said you need to stay at 20% haste

[strange python]

is this corruption good in any content?

[drifting cloud]

not for assa

[inland gull]

yes, fore insane high keys as fire mage

:D

[rigid mango]

It's p aight for pvp afaik.

[unkempt solstice]

with logic loop of division, do you want overclocking, or shorting bit band?

just got the 465 division ring.

[drifting cloud]

overclocking

[icy ember]

hey bros, just wondering when the best time to pop BOTE as asn?

[scarlet sequoia]

@lethal heart unlucky bro

[unkempt solstice]

I can't get the damn daggers to drop outt TD

Swear i have no luck on those.

[obtuse perch]

boss fights where you use vision minor, what happens with vanish? Do you use just use it on cd?

[quasi pewter]

yes

unless you need the extra damage in an upcoming burst window

[pseudo hamlet]

Is the ravenholdt opening for subterfuge without SS right? I mean: Garrote -> Mut to at least 4 CP -> Rupture -> Vendetta -> Mut -> TB -> Mut to at least 4 CP -> Envenom?

[rigid mango]

If it says with SS, it's with SS

If it doesn't, it's not

😄

[pseudo hamlet]

I thought that we should've use Vendetta just before Envenom. Thanks for clarification!

[raw oasis]

So with the corrupted mementos sockets that you can buy, can you use them on an already socketted item for double sockets?

[arctic walrus]

no

[glacial steppe]

IS is such a bait corruption, idk

5:30 and it does like 1,4mil

as T3 corruption

[subtle tundra]

wow, we've known this for uhh 2 months

[glacial steppe]

I had no IS until earlier this day, so I didnt bother either

just tried it now

[sour glade]

So for raid do I want subterfuge or master assassin? The raid azerites I have that have more double dose and what not don't have shrouded suff on them so it makes me think MA is the way to go?

[drifting cloud]

both of them are viable and sim close to each other, really depends on your gear so you should just sim it 😛

but when theyre simming close most people just prefer to run MA

[sour glade]

Right on. Thanks!

[drifting cloud]

but on some gear slots with specific corruptions subt can sim 500 more than MA or even more

[sour glade]

So I've been using Subterfuge in M+, if I raid for the first time tonight on this toon I don't wanna be too shit. Let's say I'm running MA, and I'll be running BotE major.

Ravenholdt guide says opener is Mut till 4 cp, rupture, Mut again if still in MA window, garrote, Mut to 4+ combos, vendetta, TB, vanish then envenom/mut spam.

So where do I blood? Instinct is right after the vanish, but just wanna make sure

[hollow bridge]

@sour glade i believe you want to BOTE then vanish and envenom on the next global

[sour glade]

Oh okay, right. I was thinking BotE after to not waste a GCD of it, but if you BotE from stealth you're wasting a GCD of MA

Makes sense, thanks

[true pelican]

vanish isn't on gcd so you don't lose a gcd

@sour glade

[sour glade]

Oh right, thanks.

Sorry, pretty much a total noob at rogue.

[nova viper]

Does anyone know if there is a fast way to farm lucid dreams?

[strange python]

nope

there isn't

if you don't have a main with it

[nova viper]

I dont

I have r1 on my DH and thats it... I hated nazjatar

[drifting cloud]

12-16 days of 10min dailies

you can brute force it, but its not really worth the time imo

https://www.wowhead.com/item=170085/naga-deployment-orders by farming this

[hoary crown]

Link your best -40 corruption sim!! ^^

[paper gazelle]

Hello guys, I'm not a rogue but I want to help a friend of mine, do you have an ability that allow you to cancel the snare from the living miasma on M Shad'har ?

[scarlet sequoia]

no

[paper gazelle]

Aww, I feel bad now, I though he was lying to me when he said cloak/sprint didn't work 😄

[rose aspen]

you can vanish it and it will bind to another player (which is not cool)

[hoary crown]

Exactly how big is expedient for assa?

[near plover]

!essences

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[drifting light]

I wonder if your corals also bug on ilgynoth as much as mine? We killed ilgynoth today and I couldnt use my 18 stacks on the last phase with vendetta 😄 Just cause it "reapplied" buff on him isntead of letting me use already stacked coral

Made me do only 94 parse cause I had no fucking crits at all

[elder cargo]

Hi All, Have a question you have prop heart a 1000 times. How do i effectively use my Razor Coral i.e against wrathion. Do you just let it ramp up to as high as possible or do you reclaim the crit every vendetta window?

[drifting cloud]

every vendetta

[magic thorn]

What potion do you guys use for m+ and raid ?

[elder cargo]

Thanks

[south horizon]

Hey guys, i know we should always sim ourselves to find out what our best upgrades are, however im struggling to figure out why my 430 font is simming better than a 475 vita. Looking at bloodmallet, wcl, other sims, it appears that it should be better, but cant figure out why it is not simming well for me

What is it that makes vita pull ahead?

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/9RDqFnv1WvQAxtboe7eXyJ
Sim for reference

[drifting cloud]

vita buffs the group and you probably dont use font as good as the apl

also % haste

would pull it ahead

you can also put a socket into your vita but not the font

[south horizon]

Yeah, those are fair points. Thanks :)

[rotund torrent]

Hey guys anyone knows any WA specific for rogues in Mythic Nzoth? like this rogue WAs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1npRzN-9JY

[scarlet sequoia]

why would there be rogue specific WA for nzoth

[lusty narwhal]

What about that video is rogue specific for nzoth

[arctic walrus]

hey I think I know this guy

[distant lava]

idk vel I've heard he's a disgusting furry

[arctic walrus]

seems like the kind of guy to have a pikachu pf on discord

[rigid mango]

Yeah really insane if only names were similar, seems far fetched thpo

[quasi pewter]

seems like the type of guy that doesnt share weakauras with his fellow rogues

[rigid mango]

Imagine being that dude

[leaden garden]

Is Lucid major ever a thing for any content? Just hit 120 on my asa

[arctic walrus]

no not really. the only strong thing about lucid is the minor

[leaden garden]

Okay gottcha, thanks. Whats general the best majors? Considering what to buy for the new currency

dont have bote r3 on any char sadly, but all other

[keen dome]

Botd, iris, c&s would be good choices

Majors only botd or WV

[leaden garden]

Aha so Wv is good, cool

[crystal vault]

is there a chance apl will fixed for that 3xSS + exsanguinate + deeper build?

[hollow bridge]

@crystal vault what build is this?

[scenic marlin]

what is the best site to read up on sin atm?

[rigid mango]

Wouldn't use deeper if I were you. SS and exsang is aight

[crystal vault]

probably cant tell without sim working correctly for that. maybe with enough expidient + racing pulse you dont need vigor anymore.

[languid sail]

is torment in jar any good for m+?

or dice/spyglass better?

[ionic hemlock]

when would ya use exsanguiate just for visions?

[sour glade]

I got a 445 vita trinket in normal tonight and figured it would be good but it sims lower than 460 electromental and 430 dead eye on ST. Guess it's not too good on sin?

[dusk narwhal]

BotE is used only as a major when we have it at rank 3 it looks like? Otherwise its Iris? This is for M+ or is it affix dependent?

[arctic walrus]

yeah only blood

[thin bone]

any particular reason to play vision minor instead of iris minor

on st fights

dont you want to have the MA buff from vanish?

[arctic walrus]

for what situation

[thin bone]

st fights

[cinder field]

cast more vendetta basically @thin bone

i personally play it with 3 NP and line up vanish every two vendetta

depends on the fight, on your assign & co

[thin bone]

wont u say getting that MA buff with vendeta in a burst window is has more value than that?

if I only play 1 NP

simming just feels like a big maze tbh

and since I never played assa prior to 8.3 im really struggling to get a concept of what makes this spec works the best

[cinder field]

First of all it depends what gear you can work with

[thin bone]

can get a hold of mostly all traits tbh

at any number of stacks

[cinder field]

Simming is simming, i mean you need to understand your encounters first

[thin bone]

I just cant figure out which combination is better tbh

[cinder field]

Is it about ranking or progress?

[thin bone]

i'd say progress

[cinder field]

Well, depends on the boss, on your assign. If you can set up any azerite playstyle, it will change on the boss

[thin bone]

lets go more simpler

its a target dummy

[strange python]

U guys make WoW sound extremely complicated when in reality its not

U use vop minor if ud get another vendetta off in your killtime

[cinder field]

For example, N'zoth, i personally play vision minor with NPx3 because you'll be able to drop 2 Vendetta at the last phase and your NP dot will work while moving out of the boss for anguish, paranoia and shit

[thin bone]

ok

[strange python]

And also sim if subterfuge isnt better for you
For most people it sims higher rn so u dont even need to lineup vanish with vendetta anymore if it does

[thin bone]

will try that

[swift sparrow]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[icy ember]

@rigid mango yo wassup bro, just looking for a definitive answer as to when we are supposed to use BOTE as singletarget raid assassination, I appreciate your response pls sir, I suppose it has something to do w/vanish

[rigid mango]

With vendetta my dude

[icy ember]

can you run me through a simulation on what you do w/asn?

[sharp viper]

vendetta toxic bote vanish pew pew pew

[drifting cloud]

mut, rup, mut, garrote, vendetta, tb, bote, vanish, envenom, mut, mut/envenom

would be the whole opener

so yeah you bote on 5 cps after tb during vendetta and then vanish afterwards, thats about it

[kindred forge]

Ok, just got back in the game from a long break (isolation ftw) and can you guys please tell me what BoTe stands for? I am trying to search in Rogue Abbreviations on Ravenhold but no success 🙂

Ah...... I guess Blood of the Enemy

[cinder field]

[potent pelican]

does feint work on Anguish (Nzoth) initial damage without talent?

[faint harness]

Probably not

[rigid mango]

it does not.

[potent pelican]

tyvm 🙂 is there any sheet or smth for feint working and not working abilities for m+ raid or i need to test it / ask here in a future

[faint harness]

Its kinda obvious to me

and if you're unsure just try feinting and observe results

[marble hemlock]

its not obvious at all sadly

and incredibly unintuitive

with some abilities being feintable on hc but not on mythic, and vice versa

[faint harness]

what can you feint on hc

that doesnt work in mythiuc

[marble hemlock]

dunno, i just feint more than i should, but it was a thing in crucible

and i wouldnt be surprised if it was a thing in the more recent tiers as well

[runic walrus]

Hey guys quick question, I'm having some trouble snapping the Saurid in AD to our tank as assassination, I feel like I'm missing something. Sometimes when I fan pull them EB will procc and hit the big Screamer that I've sapped. Other times i've pulled with poison knife and they all teleport, some times only the one I hit with the knife teleports and the rest stay there. I feel like I'm missing consistency which when doing some higher keys gets toxic real quick.

[marble hemlock]

depends on what pack we're talking about

generally speaking, if you hit one of the saurids, they are all linked

so just throwing your knife is enough

unless your healer is a druid, has hots rolling on the tank, and is not in catform

[runic walrus]

ok, the one that I noticed I have trouble with the most is if you went down the bridge from spawn, then took a right, the double pack there. I usually sap 1 and blind the 2nd screamer.

Ok so throw knife should just work for both packs?

[marble hemlock]

you mean groups 21/22?

[runic walrus]

yes 21 and 22

[marble hemlock]

the only time you should snap those is when coming down the stairs from volkaal

(which never really happens anymore)

this one is gonna snap all saurids for sure, and put skyscreamer in combat

[runic walrus]

We've basically been snapping all of them

[marble hemlock]

yeah

but you shouldnt be the one setting it up

if you come from the center area the tank does it himself

[runic walrus]

I stealth around the middle pack and tank has been sitting on the perpendicular bridge

We havent been pulling middle pack this week cause of bolstering.

[marble hemlock]

i mean

http://puu.sh/FnTWL/9437db5c64.jpg

you either come from volkaal

and tank snaps on the right side of the stairs

then you snap pack 2 with the mob i just marked

or you come from middle

where you just sap the skyscreamer and the tank pulls the group himself

and then pulls the other grp as well

its kind of a waste of a dps to have the rogue do the second snap of the group up top when you snap to position 2

at most you go over to blind the screamer

if its nonbolstering and you pull both packs with saurids

you just garrote bottom screamer, fok, step to upper screamer, garrote fok again

cause saurids wont jump immediately

that way you get garrotes on both

so it might make sense for you to set up the pull that way

to get more prio on the screamers

[runic walrus]

Yeah ok, I guess we've just been trying to do as many saurid in one go, then pull the other two screamers together

and I keep fucking it up haha

[marble hemlock]

well, doing it in one pull is faster on time

but obviously not feasible this week

[runic walrus]

Ok so we just have to bite the bullet and do 2 pulls I guess.

[marble hemlock]

this week, yeah

[runic walrus]

So just to make 100% sure attacking 1 with poisoned knife should snap them all? For future weeks (and my sanity)?

[marble hemlock]

yes

[runic walrus]

Also thanks dude for taking the time! Really helpful info!

[marble hemlock]

and im sure you already know but in case you didnt

http://puu.sh/FnU5u/2b7a2db245.jpg

hitting the marked saurid

snaps the saurids, without the skyscreamer getting in combat

tanks can do it themselves from the snapspot, or you do it for them

[runic walrus]

yeah we got that one down, monk tank lightning that when I get the ones down the stairs.

[marble hemlock]

yep

but yeah, the other 2 screamers on the righthand side are too close. theyre not linked, so with a ring of peace or smth you can seperate them enough for them to not trigger combat

[runic walrus]

Nice, yeah we might see if we can leverage that at some point since the old plan didn't work out too well

Thanks again dude!

[primal turret]

Wich are the BiS azerite for a st fight?

[pseudo hamlet]

@primal turret "simming is best", but I guess it'd be something like 1x NP, 3x DD and 2x HD

[vast forum]

always depends on gear, i sim higher with 3x DD 2x HoD and 1x BBI than any NP

and i assume swirling sands might be better than hod

[ionic hemlock]

Not ideal I know, but for trait essences, could a m+ build still work if your just doing maybe first boss or heroic pug?

[gusty mirage]

I mean anything works for heroic, it's not that bad

but no running EB outside of any boss but hivemind is essentially just dead traits

[lean marten]

3xSS can still manage, but yeah EB are worthless unless u cast FoK

[blazing badge]

Guys, help with opening pls ) My opening now is
Garrote - Garrote - Rupture - Vendetta+Trinket - BotE - Toxic Blade - Mutilate - Envenom and so on.

it feels like BotE is in the wrong place

[scarlet sequoia]

it is

u could start by checking the pins

[true pelican]

https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-battle-for-azeroth-raid-dps/

[blazing badge]

Guide does not have BotE in rotation

i see opener for m+ aoe in pinned

good

i dont see one without master assasin for solo target and with bote

[rigid mango]

g r g vend tb bote env

[blazing badge]

thank you

why toxic blade before bote?

[terse orchid]

TB initial damage is negligible. you want the BOTE to get some juicy strong envenoms out

[blazing badge]

i mean tb => bote or bote => tb

if i use it like u said

i lose quite a lot of energy regen

[unborn pendant]

I currently have BotE, BotD, Lucid, and Iris at rank 3 on my rogue. BESIDES CONFLICT, what's a good Rank 3 to purchase next?

[harsh sphinx]

[unborn pendant]

Conflict is an important disclaimer because I don't have that shit on anyone yet lmao

[harsh sphinx]

worrying about energy regen when lucid exists

[unborn pendant]

Should I get Worldvein next, maybe?

Or maybe PP?

[cobalt pelican]

depends what you want them for

if it's raiding honestly just force them all to level 3 in the sim and see what's actually playable

for m+ very few of them are useful besides the ones listed and vop

[dark token]

unbound force

[cunning blaze]

Any reason alot of rogues are using bote ahead of breath major/clf major? It sims like 1k below for me in comparison with those 2.

[lilac obsidian]

If you're not geared yet (not quite 120, but will be a fresh 120), which is better to use? Master Assassin or Subterfuge? I'm guessing MA is better for ST and Subterfuge is better for AOE due to multi-garrote?

[dark token]

it depends on your characters stat allocation. crit heavy characters will prefer subterfuge and haste heavy characters prefer MA

but in general yes subterfuge always wins aoe

but the real answer is

[subtle tundra]

he isnt even lvl 120, simming is pointless

`get at least 1 SS trait and play subterfuge as a start

after you get decent gear start simming

[lilac obsidian]

SS as in Shrouded Suffocation?

[rigid mango]

Yes

[lilac obsidian]

Awesome. 🙂

[flat wadi]

do yo uvendetta on pull o nraden hc or after first orb?

[dark token]

dont kill the orbs, thats the ranged job

unless your group blows

or is super melee heavy

melee tunnels boss instead of orbs even in mythic

[harsh anchor]

We make our DHs and warriors go to orbs and rogue stays on raden

[flat wadi]

its alt run and pretty melee hevy

[hushed maple]

does it make sense to go r3 & r1 stars?

[flat wadi]

is it ok to envenom with 4cp during vendetta?

[subtle tundra]

its always ok to envenom with 4cp

[sour glade]

So I really want to use subterfuge for raid over MA because it feels more comfortable for me, and when I sim they're about the same, but I lose 1500 dps if I lose a TtK or DD to gain a shrouded suff, which makes the opening rotation feel pretty wonky.

[quasi pewter]

you can use subterfuge without shrouded

[sour glade]

Yeah I know but I'm super used to the M+ shrouded suff boss opener, and without garrote giving 3 combos it looks like the rotation becomes like garrote once, Mut to 4 CP, Rupture, into vendetta TB Mut to 4 CP then envenom

Just feels wonky, but I guess I could get used to it

[quasi pewter]

[sour glade]

I guess if I do this my BotE goes right before the first envenom, whether that's before or after the TB?

[quasi pewter]

bote is always after tb before envenom

[sour glade]

Right, so in this example I might use it right after TB or I might use it after the Mut that may come after the TB?

[quasi pewter]

before envenom

[sour glade]

Gotcha

[vapid delta]

team

on raden mythic do we fok on the 2add spawn+boss and envenom prio add

[quasi pewter]

no

[vapid delta]

or do we just mut prior

[sour glade]

One more question about subterfuge with no SS: The opener says you're only doing 1 garrote here, I guess because you're not getting the SS boosted dmg so you don't care about the slightly longer duration. So on opener and vanish it's just 1 garrote, right?

[quasi pewter]

yes

[sour glade]

Thanks.

Alright, I found another question: I'm supposed to use TB on cooldown, so that means no delaying it, even for Vendetta and Blood, right?

Or do I delay if it's under a certain amount of time? Also, I can't decide if I want to run iris or VOP minor. VOP syncs vendetta with my blood and desyncs it from vanish, and the 90 sec CDs feel natural because I'm used to playing fury war, but I want to make sure I'm running the right stuff.

[quasi pewter]

generally, if you are going to delay one for the other, you are going to delay vendetta/blood for tb, not the other way around

you should usually just run the minors that sim the best

vop minor can be useful on some bosses because of timings

wrathion for example

[crimson palm]

generally, if you are going to delay one for the other, you are going to delay vendetta/blood for tb, not the other way around
unless you lose a vendetta cast due to the delay, depending on boss kill time

[quasi pewter]

that is why i said generally yes

[vagrant eagle]

guys m+ azerite, fortified week, is it worth having 2 SS and 2 EB or should i stick to 3 SS and no EB?

[cobalt pelican]

swap whenever you want to swap

[vapid delta]

OI lads

anyone have good ERT note for drestagath mythic kill order?

I will send 1 picture of my feet in return

[cobalt pelican]

kill sets of 2 then the ones that aren't in sets of 2

high iq move

[vapid delta]

too simple high iq shit for me

[strange python]

Why swap then?

If both are lower ?

[leaden garden]

Hey guys, is it 2 or 3 envenoms I should fit in per TB window?

minimum

[scarlet sequoia]

no minimum

but 2-3 is ideal

4 with good crits

[leaden garden]

Alright, cheers!

[leaden garden]

Another question, is crimson tempest good for m+? I kinda just go with bomb by default

[quasi pewter]

it can be good yes

both are viable

[whole mantle]

BotE sims higher than CLF for someone?

[royal lantern]

bote is better this raidtier by default

many fights with burst windows etc

[strange python]

Nzoth setup - https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/aXczjswsARsGgxWTQFt2f1
How is changing to subterfuge add 800 dps??

[cobalt pelican]

because it does damage

[strange python]

feels so bad

[quasi pewter]

[vagrant eagle]

!essences

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[near nacelle]

hey guys, quick question, do you know if TD proc off dots?