assassination

[delicate fern]

yeah im going check it now thanks guys

[tropic surge]

how much titan residuum do you get back if you scrap a 480 piece?

[distant lava]

1k

[rose violet]

1k iirc

[tropic surge]

kk thx

[strange python]

Sim the pins

[white wyvern]

@marble hemlock Sorry for ping, but what are your thoughts on R3 BotD in M+? Seems better than BotE to me when the R3 proc is just chained.

[marble hemlock]

Looks strong when you check the damage at the end of the dungeon, but then you gotta consider that youve used ~100 GCDs on BotD instead of using more Foks or envenoms

And using BotD on mobs that are close to death already when others in the pack are still alive, and using a GCD on only damaging that already dead target, isnt actually saving you any time.

[white wyvern]

True truee.

[marble hemlock]

i also found it a bit awkward to use since ideally you dont actually get the killing blow with it, but hit a mob that then dies within 1seconds of you using it

because that way you get the cooldown refreshed instantly instead of having a 5 or 15sec CD

[vast forum]

it's a 2 sec window

[marble hemlock]

since its either:
-kill mob = 5sec cd
-dont kill mob, dies >2sec after = 15sec cd
-dont kill mob, dies <2sec after = 0sec cd

[arctic walrus]

And you end up getting more focused in on trying to snipe correctly maybe even holding gcds

[marble hemlock]

yeah

pmuch vel

theres only 1 build i really wanna try right now

and thats a deeper stratagem build with formless void, with someone in grp running lucid, and someone running blood

yoinking lucid for st, bote for aoe

[arctic walrus]

[marble hemlock]

because deeper+lucid is still huge on singletarget

esp with multiple TTKs

[narrow comet]

@here something else today, I just like to thank everyone for all the help i got here. I mostly iddle and read but me being disabled and having to use a foot pedal and mainly clicking i am proud now to show how far I have come, something I did not think was possible
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/draenor/ròótz#difficulty=4
So a big thank you to all that helped me and you know who you are and for everyone else giving info out all the time. Cheers guys

[marble hemlock]

casual attempt to @ here the entire discord

[narrow comet]

because i am happy to thank everyone 🙂

[arctic walrus]

And link don’t work

[white wyvern]

works for me

Gratz man.

[marble hemlock]

yes it does?

and grats on improving 🙂

[kind steppe]

hey, frequently asked question prob so if there is an answer somewhere else tell me
what is the difference between condensed life force & bote + vision
which is better ( i guess it depends on stats and corrupt but for which stats and corrupt is it one better than the other )
And I suppose depends also on fight but I'd like to know here too for what fight is it better

[arctic walrus]

Vision blood isn’t a standard

[kind steppe]

I see BOTE a lot with or without vision

it's actually 2 very different playstyle for singletarget that's why I'm asking

[arctic walrus]

Yeah it’s just more practical than clf

You can just sim the 2 though

[kind steppe]

i do

[arctic walrus]

You don’t take vision due to a play style it would be due to a specific fight

[kind steppe]

clf sim higher, but if there is a trick like drop a lot of crit that get compensed by BOTE , sim won't lead me anywhere

and I find it strange that my clf sim higher when I see that not a lot of people use it

[arctic walrus]

Even for me clf does sim higher than blood but I still go blood because a lot of fights has more than one target and that pulls blood ahead

But it’s only Like 300 at the end of the day

[kind steppe]

and do you know why Bote sim higher on some people ?

[arctic walrus]

It might it might not I don’t have the sim of everyone in front of me

[kind steppe]

nah but I mean what is the reason behind the difference between bote and clf , is it about stat or corrupt

[cobalt pelican]

gear is really complicated rn

[arctic walrus]

Both probably

[cobalt pelican]

there's not really a simple answer

[rigid mango]

There's so many factors

I've a lot of crit based ones and bote sims higher for me

[dark crag]

Wv with 4 > clf > bote for me

[rigid mango]

You can't really give a lot of logic to gearing atm, I'd really just rely on sims and general knowledge.

[kind steppe]

aight

[dark crag]

It almost looks like blizz and simbot made a deal

[regal carbon]

Just wait til everything has a socket

[dark crag]

Gem sim here we go

I got 7 sockets already + 1 dagger in bag because of carapace one

[zinc zealot]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[raw oasis]

With R12 cloak proc, will WV value fall off relative to others?

Seems like my sims were decent with WV and after getting it they're nearly 1.5-2% down from BotE

[strange python]

depends on stats I guess, BotE is still 2k dps down from WV for me

[velvet forge]

@raw oasis if you get infinite stars procs you are fine no matter what

@raw oasis ❤️

@raw oasis or anyone, does rupture snapshot from MA or Vendetta or does it update dynamically?

[true nexus]

do you FOK at 2 targets every time?

in m+

[marble hemlock]

nothing snapshots other than nightstalker/subterfuge/exsanguinate bleeds

[velvet forge]

ok ty seli

[marble hemlock]

scaling with dmg increases, crit, mastery etc. all apply dynamically

exsang snapshots haste, subter/ns snapshot the dmg increase

@true nexus no

[true nexus]

@marble hemlock when then

3?

[marble hemlock]

its not that simple sadly

i usually mutilate on 2cp

if its 2cp mut -> mut again
if its 3cp mut -> fok to 4+
if its 4cp mut - > finish

to be energy efficient

on 3+ you can use fok to build, unless you start dropping bleeds and need cp

mut still has a higher cp/energy ratio on 3targets with regular crit, than fok

and you always switch between modes where either your damage per execute, or damage per energy or cp per energy are the deciding factors

for what ability to use

and then its different again based on what 2target situation we're talking about

2mobs that need even cleave? a boss+1add that dies anyway?

[true nexus]

🧠

[split furnace]

Finally dropped my Coral t.t

1.3k gain

[strange python]

for what

oh nvm

[raw oasis]

@velvet forge Just get good at the weekly chest.

[tall peak]

Is stacking echoing blades worth doing 3 or 2 for m+ with 3 shrouded

[marble hemlock]

depends on the dungeon, 3ss+3eb is still very solid for trash-heavy dungeons with high mob density

[true nexus]

who dropped your coral

and where did it go

[nimble mesa]

Question about the new cloak: I have an azshara font 450 that I'm still playing. At that stage, I'm wondering if delaying the burst window (vendetta, font, etc) to line up with the cloak proc would make sense 🤔 Any experience on those kind of thing? (I know it would need to be simmed in best case, but if people who have tried those kind of stuff always came up to the conclusion that it's never worth, it's already an element of answer)

[cosmic viper]

Hey can anybody help me with my opener? I have shrouded suffocation as one of my traits, I was watching a guide and the person was saying to use muta as an opener. I'm kind of lost seeing as I just came back to the game a week ago and I'm trying to get my rogue sorted

[nimble mesa]

Together with font it's like 7K + agility

[next solar]

anyone mind privately answering a quick question regarding some logs on mythic hivemind? Trying to figure out why my EK SS damage is so much lower

[coral wasp]

From what I've been reading, if you have shrouded suffocation you could take Subterfuge and get as much duration on garrote during those 3 seconds so it would look like garrote, mutilate, garrote, continue as normal until subterfuge buffed garrote falls of then vanish and do it again, but I think the best way for you to tell would be to try the different openers on a dummy tbh

[honest vessel]

i thought it was garrote rup garrote, you can always check the sim tables tho

[coral wasp]

oh yeah i def meant rupture there

[honest vessel]

:)

[chrome badger]

I have a question regarding raiding, why are there alot of assas rouges running boe major in mythic atm?

[hollow junco]

blood of the enemy and CLF are usually the next best single target major essences behind worldvein

since that is true, there are two reasons to use BOTE or CLF

1.) the encounter sucks for worldvein because it never gives your group the opportunity to form a stack

[rigid mango]

They use it because it fits timers

Same reason for VoP's usage this tier

[hollow junco]

2.) you're doing osmething like wraithion where phases align better with cooldown stacking, see VOP / BOTE usage there

^

[rigid mango]

It's all about making the spec fit in certain windows of needed damage

Because of sin's inherently great CD reliant burst, making the spec fit into X or Y window can be very beneficial for progression

[chrome badger]

ah fair wrathion has 1.5 min down phase meaning it alligns better with him]=

[rigid mango]

On wrathion you get an extra vendetta in the dmg phase

each time

On stuff like drest, it fits with the debuff timer, stuff like raden it fitted better with certain strats, stuff like carapace it's handy for timers again

[chrome badger]

so 2 vendettas in each down phase?

[rigid mango]

Ye.

[chrome badger]

danm thats nice

[jaunty arrow]

Maybe on skitra u can use vop too

[rigid mango]

idk skitra's a joke

[lapis osprey]

How do you handle vendetta having reduced cd with VoP and vanish?

[rigid mango]

Oneshot boss, no one cares about logging

That's a topic of discussion atm.

[shut yacht]

Related to that BotE/VoP usage: where does Vanish happen? Should it be just held for the next?

9h, nvm

[rigid mango]

It's debated atm

Some numbers seem to be showing just using it on CD.

As you can see in #tc-research

[cobalt pelican]

vop minor is kinda hot

at least in my gear, before any apl changes even it's only like -500 from iris as my 4th minor

and it's way more flexible

[rigid mango]

Cns gamers only

[cobalt pelican]

🚮

[chrome badger]

Going to try that tonight 😉

[cobalt pelican]

i think for tonights reclear i'm gonna try vop minor on everything

wrathion is obv, maut idk lol but it lets you drop vend before the burn phase which is ideal for me

skitra is memes

[honest vessel]

spicy

[cobalt pelican]

i'm on 3rd orb set for xan so i can get 3 vends before it and not have 1 during it

vex i'm probably going to vend the ascendant in intermission even

so like boss -> ascendant -> boss -> boss -> last phase

[chrome badger]

with 3 double dose at how many targets will you start fan of knifing?

[cobalt pelican]

5

[chrome badger]

Thank you learned alot in the past 5 minutes 🙂 appriciated 🙂

Just to check it is use BOE major and then vanish right?

[honest vessel]

yup tb-bote-vanish-env

[ocean ore]

if MA talented right

if not, vanish to refresh garrote

yeap?

[odd heath]

yep ^

[chrome badger]

does raidbot sim it like that or is ther a different APL for it?

[rigid mango]

Honestly there's a lot of work going into just this, APL wise atm

So I'd wait and see another week maybe, then it should be ridden out quite well.

[chrome badger]

Nice! 🙂

[rigid mango]

Because of the variables that are current trinkets and such, this hasn't been a thing before

[cunning blaze]

When using breath major, u just pop it on cd?

[tropic ocean]

try to execute as much with it as possible

and always use >80% hp

[civic hatch]

If I have a non buffed garrote ticking and vanish garrote, do I garrote a 2nd time if the duration is already 23sec+

[tropic ocean]

buffed one will overwrite so y

[wind falcon]

blood of the enemy or breath for major (generally speaking)?

debating grinding out rank 2/3 blood of the enemy this weekend due to double honor in bgs

[rigid mango]

Bote is BiS for m+ and super useful for raid

[ocean ore]

can someone explain to me what means Garrote Snapshot in my wowanalyzer logs?

[rigid mango]

You snapshot a garrote with subterfuge

i.e vanish

[ocean ore]

humm got it

ty

[floral shoal]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[patent topaz]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jsuuCy9RxPiCuffjxQ1yYN clf > vop > bote major for me

[honest vessel]

wack

[patent topaz]

guess im ditching font for void titanshard too

[bleak spoke]

void titanshard yikes

don't you mean vita

[rigid mango]

Void is epitome of simbait

Any fight you take damage it's dogshit

[bleak spoke]

just don't take any damage

[patent topaz]

my trinkets are dog

[rigid mango]

[patent topaz]

people always ask if I mean vita when I say void

but I mean void

[ocean ore]

vita is love

void? meeh

i take it with bonus roll..... i aimed to raden Fweapon

feels bad

[patent topaz]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jdAudqUzWZ7oK5HPwCoV7d

[ashen osprey]

Rip neo

[ocean ore]

ty my friend

i think... just think is because the combo proc

not about void by himself

[patent topaz]

some weird stuff

ill run this setup, see what it does

should try to get mythic coral though

oof

[ocean ore]

coral >

[crisp hollow]

does expedient corruption make vita a strong trinket for us? I see some sims with that doing some high numbers

[keen crescent]

Hey, what configs do u use to sim st and aoe?

[ocean ore]

i think so, i have expedient 3 and use a vita 445 simc more than any other

[crisp hollow]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/nWcmAjHYCdNeYWjsTgLnKz like this guy for example

[ocean ore]

@keen crescent ST = patchwerk 5 min

[crisp hollow]

AoE = patchwerk 10min 5 bosses

or 90s

up to you

[ocean ore]

holy this simc is huge

[crisp hollow]

i basically sim M+ shit with 5boss 10min

M carapace dagger definitely contributes

[honest vessel]

vita is already good, and yeah, expedient makes it even better

[crisp hollow]

but otherwise I can match that corruption

[honest vessel]

same with dragonscale

[crisp hollow]

and don't get near that

[ocean ore]

haha no way i get this dagger

[scarlet sequoia]

@crisp hollow vita is always the best

coral+vita is bis

no matter what

[crisp hollow]

interesting

always thought Font would last forever

we're on track to kill raden tonight so lets hope

[ocean ore]

my wrathion 475 simc higher than font haha

[honest vessel]

coral lasts forever, but like i only got expedient 1, and a bunch of racing pulses and vita/dragonscale both sim better than font for me now

[patent topaz]

guess ill coin wrathion, just to potentially get rid of void shard

[honest vessel]

im still coinin him for that daggy boi

[ocean ore]

if u dont have coral @patent topaz try sim spyglass

or something

else

[crisp hollow]

pugs are comfortably 1phasing ashvane mythic just keep an eye on group finder throughout the week

[ocean ore]

yeao

look for it always on reset day

[crisp hollow]

reset day and sunday/monday probably your best bet

either people trying to get it fast or panicking they don't have it

i can't put a socket on AEP shit right?

[patent topaz]

[kindred skiff]

The Shroud Suffocation azerite power - does the damage bonus work when cast outside of stealth? or is both bonuses ONLY from stealth?

[crisp hollow]

only from stealth

no +CP on application or bonus damage

if outside of stealth

[honest vessel]

lul nice grizzled

[kindred skiff]

Thanks

[crisp hollow]

SS traits are really niche in raid encounters, bis for M+ tho

Ra-den being patchwerk + 1 SS is super fun tho

[patent topaz]

void shard still sims almost 1k higher than wrathion trinket

[crisp hollow]

god damn how low is your crit

[patent topaz]

32%

[crisp hollow]

that's super weird

do you have % crit damage or % crit all sources?

[patent topaz]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ubNgZE7JfDSsxefvvynawr I swapped both of those corruptions for tendies

[tidal gorge]

Probs because of set bonus rather than void by itself

[patent topaz]

maut hc, NP pretty hype

have to say I like vop major

[crimson palm]

just got this beauty

[crisp hollow]

triggered

[true nexus]

weird i wouldve thought daggers would've had higher impact https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/nNXxQQJ1rtrN7LE7FWKEhr

[patent topaz]

nice bracers, jealous

[true nexus]

they do 1- 1.5m per dungeon

not awful

o you mean those other ones

nvm

[high charm]

My 455 socket font is still better than mythic vita trinket :)

[scarlet sequoia]

yeah for you, but does your font give your whole party 290 haste

[patent topaz]

does anyone in the world actually use the raden trinket set, feels like bait

[lethal heart]

dont think you play that as rogue

dont know about other classes

[patent topaz]

im using wration + vita even though it sims 500 less for me

[ocean ore]

warrior maybe use it

haste proc plus crit proc

plus huge str

[lethal heart]

pretty sure

coral is just too strong

for any melee

to not use it

[ocean ore]

yeap

[patent topaz]

isnt coral agi only

[ocean ore]

until they nerf it

or not

nope

[lethal heart]

nah

[drifting cloud]

warriors never unequip coral

[lethal heart]

its strength aswell

[ocean ore]

agi and str

[drifting cloud]

rogue actually might on a blue moon

[lethal heart]

coral isnt really great for mythic nzoth

but idk what else are you gonna use

unless you have like weekly chest 475 dice/spyglass

[patent topaz]

inkpod? no clue

[lethal heart]

idk if its that great

[stable isle]

subt simming 800dps ahead for me, do i delay vanish for garotte pandemic or fire and forget?

[high charm]

ya vita buffing the party is true value tbh

[sweet inlet]

is there a certain crit chance that makes it more worthwhile using FoK on 3 targets or even only 2 targets?

[rough yarrow]

is anyone else simming higher with breath instead of blood as main essense?

[patent topaz]

im using vop major right now

[split furnace]

coral usage

is after the first mutilate ?

and then before every vendetta?

[digital timber]

Breath sims lower for me but on fights with adds, I like it. I'm doing prog on xanesh right now and getting good resets/buffs on the adds. I'm hoping to try a vop build if I can get it to sim well with azerite I have available.

[stray imp]

hey guys what is the bewst essence combination for single target?

[shy dust]

Whatever sims best for you.

Could either be BOTE, CLF, WV (with a caveat that it works worse in fights with movements), or even possibly breathe. All of these are major options

With lucid minor always being taken.

[opal minnow]

BOTE is a popular choice in mythic based on warcraft logs. unsure if its fight-based, if it just sims highest for everyone, or if they just hate using clf and don't have WV allies/too much movement

[stray imp]

thanks for the quick answer

[rough yarrow]

how u open with breath? cant see anything on pins

[opal minnow]

before vendetta then on cd

[vagrant tapir]

Trying to decide on m+ trinkets

Have a 445 coral, a 450 font, a 475 torment and a 460 segments

segment wrather

also got a 470 Cannonball Runner

[subtle tundra]

coral + torment

[vagrant tapir]

Sometimes its hard to capitalize on torment, it takes so long to ramp

I find myself having it proc at the end of packs a lot of the time

So I'm either wasting the proc, or stopping dps at the end of the pack to wait for the next one to proc it

also got a void twisted titan shard but its trash

[split furnace]

on skitra the corals stack remains after he spawns the copies?

[vagrant tapir]

yup

[split furnace]

oh wounderful ^^

ty

[upper elm]

which traits should you run as assa rog on tyranical for keys between 16-19, still suffocation with echoing blades, or should I put double dose on one or two azerites

[tribal marlin]

not DD

might swap some EB to stuffs like HoD or NP

[buoyant kraken]

whats the deal with so many people stacking nothing personal?

[tribal marlin]

NP is only really good for keys where there are a lot of mini-boss / priority target

It scale off mastery haste etc...

it's overall a good trait the best one for bursts

benefit from Minor VoP tho

[rigid mango]

@buoyant kraken wdym

[patent topaz]

VoP major was pretty fun tbh

in the raid

[upper elm]

Im new at assa, playing him for 2 weeks now, and started to do keys last week. Got 2k r.io on forti week but I've noticed that my boss dps was really low while running 3xblades 2xsuffocate and 1 darkness thats why I'm worried to run anything on tyranical

[buoyant kraken]

@rigid mango i just saw a lot of rogues in top guilds that are taking 2-3x NP where they could have gotten a HoD for example

[rigid mango]

Dunno, they may have some logical reasoning for it

Unless there's some reason to spec into more burst within CD windows

There's not really any reason to take something that's kinda uhh, sub optimal.

[true nexus]

more damage taken on psychus

or something

[patent topaz]

I feel like my sim is pretty low for 471 equipped

[sweet inlet]

Is there a way of simming a piece of gear i do not have?

[true nexus]

gear compare

[rigid mango]

Gear compare, or knowing how to do item ID stuff.

[true nexus]

you just look it up and set the ilvl/socket/enchants to what you'd put on it

[sweet inlet]

specifically an azerite piece at 15 ilvl lower but with SS and EB

ah ok thanks!

on raidbots right?

[true nexus]

yes

[sweet inlet]

thanks

[patent topaz]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/5Zb2NfmPXrwK22B4upBTut coral would be 2k dps over 460 humming black dragonscale

oof

[upper elm]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/q6b44YQJe7vxWe7WFN6c1Y

[untold current]

Just got the vita trinket. Anything special I need to to keep in mind when playing with it? Time coral around it perhaps?

[quasi pewter]

no

[vagrant tapir]

How big do the pulls need to be for using CT to be worthwhile?

[honest vessel]

not v big

ct for most dungeons

pb in siege/WS/tyr tos

[inland escarp]

^and KR

[lethal heart]

4-5 mob pulls makes ct better

or well

good enough

[full flame]

My sim has haste proc t3 pants and mastery t3 gloves sim within 40 dps. What would you use? Seems like haste proc is more consistent for energy regen

[tropic ocean]

haste

it also increases procs of other corruptions

[wet ruin]

when is it worth going outlaw for carapace

is it only for last phase dmg

[lethal heart]

more for p1 really

and p1 is useless

last phase idk

you dont really do add damage coz they flop insta

and boss damage is weak as outlaw

outlaw utility is pretty sick for the fight

having vanish in p2 is nice

and extra range + hook are very conveniant

[wet ruin]

I see

and you go full single target as assa right?

[spare viper]

Are there any reasons to go Subterfuge over MA? I see Sub > MA on HeroDmg and on SimC but very few people playing it according to logs

[strange python]

it feels clunky to play with the raid build and the difference is usually minimal

but the sims should be correct

[spare viper]

I see. Thx 🙂

[tidal gorge]

I dislike the haste proc corruption because it only lasts for 4 seconds

More likely to get wasted if you have to move

[tropic ocean]

it has very good uptime tho so

[robust light]

Why are the top parsing sin rogues running blood major on ST fights when CLF sims qutie a bit higher for me?

am i missing some kind of synergy or

[rigid mango]

better for timings and people like it better

also sims better for some people

[robust light]

when is best to use it for ST?

with MA

[rigid mango]

just before vanish

tb > bote > vanish

[robust light]

aight ty

do we hold blood for vendetta+vanish?

[amber trench]

yes

[coral wasp]

Is it weird that subterfuge is simming higher than master assassin without any shrouded suffocation or is that pretty normal?

[robust light]

@rigid mango what sorta build would bring blood simming ahead of clf? its 500dps diff for me so its kinda big. not sure how others can have blood sim more since my gear is pretty similar to what most run

[rigid mango]

Very crit based corruptions alike mine

[robust light]

only thing i can think is running a low crit build?

ah yeah i guess

which wouldthose be

the dmg procs?

[plain moon]

Does anybody know exactly what spells proc engi helm trait? Just realized it said all spells when i got to to proc off a shadowstep. Should I be using random spells off cd for more procs?

[true pelican]

those procs have a ppm so you're not gonna get more procs by spamming skills

[plain moon]

Ah I see

[next solar]

that feeling when you get benched on xanesh over 1 of 4 warriors 😦

[proud salmon]

what minors are you guys running for high m+ this season

about to do a 19 junkyard with bote major , lucid , breath,vision minor

but maybe something is better than vision?

[quasi pewter]

those r good

[raven mica]

I prob woulda taken like conflict instead of vision or something, maybe iris

[arctic walrus]

With ss it’s pretty good to take vision so you separate your vendetta and vanish conveniently

[tribal marlin]

https://i.imgur.com/wtz5XHm.png

major VoP

mmmh

only 2 NP here

[quasi pewter]

yes

[tribal marlin]

Major VoP is the future

xD

[quasi pewter]

it is

[inland escarp]

pretty versatile as well

[tribal marlin]

https://i.imgur.com/NAj9ie0.png

fun that Font + Vita sims equal to Font + coral tho

[hoary apex]

vendetta affects empowered garrotes right?

[arctic walrus]

yes

it is in fact a rogue ability

[honest vessel]

sim tables are showing no 2nd garrote in subter window ever for me, i thought i should've put two in to max out the duration
like i get that it takes your existing garrote and then reaches pandemic limit on the vanishes, but what about out of stealth on pull

am confused https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/oWCvAEABtnQ2TM3HGMFtsh/simc edit nevermind i get it the first vanish hits pandemic in the pull anyway

[patent topaz]

I am a vop major supporter

sims higher than blood, 100 dps lower than clf for me with 2 np 2 dd 1 ttk 1 gizmo

[tidal gorge]

Yeah, sims higher for me too. Not by much but probably more fun to play. I kinda hate font and would love to get rid of it

[patent topaz]

2 np pushes it up i think

[tidal gorge]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/i2ya9RkDRTNbzbJraHCG9Z VoP vs
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/e9NS8xKQ4S3qxMdqsBXMpu current (+500ish if using HoD on shoulder)

[tribal marlin]

sin simulation is just a big mess

[faint harness]

played 3 np vop minor yday

was decent

really good for ilgynoth (mythic) tho, it felt like

had vendetta for every part of the fight

nothing personal top 3-4 dmg

[modest tendon]

How does this build work then, is it just have as many NP’s as possible then go vision major, why wasn’t this done previously?

[faint harness]

it might be that the higher azerite levels has pushed its dmg enough

also every piece in the raid has NP

or close to

[modest tendon]

How does vanish work with this build? Is it still synced with vendetta?

[faint harness]

well the one miki has been exploring is using vanish on cd

with TB

[patent topaz]

I held vanish for 3rd vend

idk

[faint harness]

it might also have something to do with crit levels

[modest tendon]

Well the stat corruptions seem pretty good

[faint harness]

cus i play bote major with the vop minor build

and using bote with vendetta + coral stacks puts me at 90% crit ish

so dont really need vanish for it

and bote is up for every vendetta

[patent topaz]

have you tried simming subterfuge?

[faint harness]

well the sims for this build are "broken"

so i cant

[modest tendon]

I consistently sim better with subt now as well

[faint harness]

it delays vanish for every 3rd vendetta

subt/MA are both within 200 dps for me

but if you add any adds then obviously subt wins out

[onyx hedge]

Quick question. Vita charge is better when you have GW infinite stars right?

[tribal marlin]

I do believe it's good in most case

but something wierd happens to me with the simulation of Vita + Font

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/qRT3NDrHGABK8RvxjW3G7F

"new" is the exact copy pasta of the default APL which can be found on the github

while "Mikihîsa" is well whatever raidbot choose to do.

Non-sense, this only happens when using Vita + Font

[faint harness]

isnt the raidbot one without the custom line that made the bot cast font pre-fight

[tribal marlin]

might be this, but I thought it was in raidbot since quite a while now

[faint harness]

i honestly dont know, that custom line is perma-added to my raidbot sims

[tribal marlin]

also it does work well with font + coral

[faint harness]

2 on use in that case

but ye

nah its not that

very strange indeed

[tribal marlin]

very strange and might under sim the font + vita combo

like for quite a lot :/

[signal summit]

@modest tendon u should check how long the fight is for vendetta usage, if u can afford to hold it for 3rd ven without losing a vanish go for it, otherwise use with tb

[modest tendon]

interesting

ty

[signal summit]

np

[rancid spade]

IS > TA for Sin?

[inner sonnet]

always depends on the circumstance

[distant lava]

on shadhar

[inner sonnet]

TA is better for everything except a 5min+ pure ST fight usually

[distant lava]

and xanesh below mythic

yes

otherwise

no

[maiden raptor]

u guys running the usual 3SS/2EB/1TTK or 1NP on tyrannical weeks?

[inner sonnet]

I cut down on EB on tyrann, 3 SS / 1 NP / 1 TtK / 1 EB is usually my aim

KR I dont even bother with EB I just go almost full ST with the Sub/3xSS included

[maiden raptor]

sounds like a good idea. gotta see if my azerite pieces support that. thanks for the input

[tribal marlin]

I'm trying out a 2xNP / 2xTTK / 2xSS build recently

with VoP minor ofc

It really surprisingly good for some keys, the burst is really huge.

[night vale]

i tried 3xSS 2xHeart of Darkness 1xTTK on KR 20 last night and giga stacked mastery

it was really good

usually i just run 3xEB 3xSS

[tribal marlin]

I kinda dislkike hod

I know it's a good trait with overall pretty high dps value but idk, NP is such an insane burst of damage

it really delete anything you Vendetta on, feels great

[tropic blade]

When checking almost all high progress rogues and guides I see crit haste as being the go to for single target however I am seeing mastery and vers being weighted higher I know 'sim yoself' but I seem to get better results from crit haste but worse sims - any reason for this?

Currently at

Haste 1631
Crit: 1564
Mast: 765
Vers: 574

[crimson palm]

All stats are good for us

[night vale]

with corrupted gear/essences/trinkets, its really difficult to answer cause stat weights vary from player to player. Like Kjanko says, usually our stat weights are pretty even though.

[whole onyx]

710 haste in raid gear 😮

[faint harness]

At some point i turn to feelycrafting when it comes to haste

Simply dont like how the spec plays at very low haste levels

[viral aurora]

Which trinkets you guys running, tyrannical contra fortified weeks?

Also. How do you play around with the Razor Coral? Wait for certain amount of stacks or a certain window?

[swift sparrow]

how you use breath in pve as major on cd ? or 80% and 20% only ?

[viral aurora]

Well, like someone Said recently, above 80 on cd, below 20 on cd. Inbetween, only if you think its 30 sec until boss or mob reaches 20%.

[swift sparrow]

ye makes sense

thanks

[faint harness]

Snipe dmg increase whenever possible

[rocky ruin]

Guys did know how to sim feet with twisted appendages if i dont own them myself?

[faint harness]

Gear compare

Name of the boots -> add corruption and ilvl

[rancid spade]

should i clean this dagger?

[faint harness]

Sim it

You can do top gear, choose corruption threshhold and copy/purify items

And it sim all the different options you have

[rancid spade]

sims higher cuz of the ilvl but i already have 58 corrup dont wanna play with 78

[faint harness]

Yea but you sim it vs the other corruptions to be certain

Put max amount of corruption at 58 if thats what you want to run with

[rancid spade]

rip

[onyx hedge]

If they were the same ilvl

Would you want the n'zoth shoulders or the gurak tuls?

Seen 3x DD x1 NP x2 Heart

[topaz vine]

So I've done all my visions in a group.. but today i wanted to do all the masks alone.. everything works out fine.. untill the last boss... where he resets when i vanished.. wtf is that xD can't have all the other bosses work out fine with it, but not the last one xD

[scarlet sequoia]

u cant rly vanish bro

[topaz vine]

on any other i can ? xD

[scarlet sequoia]

idk tbh never vanished on a boss myself

but makes sense that u cant

[topaz vine]

but then make it like that for them all.. not just for the last one

[scarlet sequoia]

true

[patent topaz]

think there is a very small window where you can vanish and hit the boss quickly before aggro resets

but id never vanish on a boss im trying to kill solo

[topaz vine]

Might be. just thought it be fine because i did it on the others 😆

[faint harness]

it works if you're quick

but i wouldnt do it myself

[brisk forge]

Idd, never vanish on solo bosses, not worth the fuss

[lost wharf]

I think the others ones have they eye buff. I don't think Thrall does

[onyx hedge]

Black dragon huming scale decent for anything ?

Obviously not raiding, M+ i wouldnt presume so and pvp nah, but i could be wrong

[crimson palm]

Sim it

For me, 460 Vita > 475 scale > 430 font

[narrow comet]

Yeah same order for me

[ocean ore]

you cant vanish any boss or add if u are fighting alone

[narrow comet]

@topaz vine If you have a Shard of the black empire, it procs on bosses and the tentacle keeps you in combat with the boss, so that might be why you could vanish on the others. I had it happen on Thrall also, noticed on the others the tentacle was up alot on my next run

[ocean ore]

everthing will reset, except true visions one

[topaz vine]

ahhh okay ^^ well i do but with no corruption.
i vanish often when i solo stuff with no problem.. most of the times it works. but not always.. it always works on the other bosses in vision .. 🙂

always wondered why it only works on some.. might be the small window?

[ocean ore]

maybe u can hit the boss until he reset

but, gotta to be fast as fuc

[narrow comet]

You removed your corruption from shard?

[crimson palm]

Honed Mind III seems to be outperforming the rank 2 TD

[topaz vine]

on one of my daggers yes.. i got a IS that was better xD

[narrow comet]

Hmm, i remove nothing because next week x will be OP with this dev team 😛

[topaz vine]

well.. its only hc daggers and I go there every week. also it makes me use more aoe gear that i coudnt before because the 2 daggers took me to 696969542424 corruption xD

[narrow comet]

haha

I run a 5 mask with 59 corruption

because i forgot to swap shit lol

[topaz vine]

i do it with 58.. if i hadnt cleansed the dagger i would run with 68 + to do the same dmg xD a little too much for my taste in visions and mythic raid. xD or for my healers anyway xD

[narrow comet]

Once you have gift of the titans, 3x EB and 3x SS with Crimson, i found it pretty easy although will fail stormwind prolly with 5. I run solo

[topaz vine]

what I find annoying is the damn slow.. orders me to stand still in 80000 things on the ground. 😆

[subtle tundra]

you dont need aoe to solo visions

1 eb is enough

3x ss

and 2x np

[narrow comet]

aye prolly, for me it works just kiting them

[subtle tundra]

killing a pack in 10 seconds and then restealthing is better

i killed rexxar in 9 seconds

with 5 masks

[topaz vine]

i just change my gear when ever im on a boss or the trash ..

[subtle tundra]

269k dps

[narrow comet]

I will swap some other pieces in Varas and give that a go than see if its better

[topaz vine]

Reminds me.. have they changed how hard the corruption hits? I feel like it's alot harder to run with 60+ than it was in the beginning..

[narrow comet]

Maybe that i can do also swap gear, but i already struggle really hard being disabled and footpedal rogue :P, i still made it but it's a lot of effort

[subtle tundra]

pretty sure they havent changed anything, also you shouldnt go >60 corruption unless you want to log hc or something

[narrow comet]

I noticed that also, Grand Delusion is proccing way more, thought i was crazy

[wet ruin]

@topaz vine you can vanish if you have something else attacking the boss, for example tentacle, guardian of azeroth, etc. So I am assuming since you have a follower in the other zones thats why it worked as I assume it counts as a pet or something like that

[topaz vine]

oh no i dont. i am 58 at most now.. some lower.. but i'be done bosses with 82 in the beginning.. and now i gets so hard over 60.

oh yeah! i got that follower guy ^^ might be why.. but its like that outside the vision aswell.. sometimes i can vanish and it doesnt reset.. and out there i got no helpers .

[wet ruin]

like someone said, there is a very small window where you can attack and they don't drop aggro, but I wouldn't risk it

you certainly don't need it

I've been clearing org with 5 masks solo while I am killing every single mob and I still have half bar + 1 orb left and I am not even doing big pulls or anything

[topaz vine]

nah. I just do most stuff in groups.. so the vanish is in my fingers . i really have to concentrate for not doing it 😆

[wet ruin]

its just knowing how the vision works and taking advantage of it

[narrow comet]

I learn all the time, especially here 😛

@subtle tundra with 1 x EB you don't swap gear i assume

[topaz vine]

Does anyone else have that odd bug where you shadowstep to a old target?

It's very annoying in raid 😆

[crystal vault]

Anyone with a pov of 5mask. Want to see that 3xSS 2-3xNP + exsanguinate Burst

[tropic ocean]

nope but I use macro for shadowstep so

not using exsang but

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BShMJGvO5EA

[crimson palm]

You can blind the big guy at rexxar pack

It makes the whole pack much much easier

[tropic ocean]

idk he dies in few seconds

😄

[crimson palm]

idd but headbutt is fkin annoying xD

[cobalt pelican]

doesn't do too much tbh

as long as you're not by a trap

[tropic ocean]

what I do I go garrote him rupture him vendetta exsang

[cobalt pelican]

taking void pool sanity drain is kinda w/e

[tropic ocean]

2-3 envenom

ded

[crimson palm]

but then you don't have vendetta for rexxar?

or are you running vop

[tropic ocean]

vop

[cobalt pelican]

oh that guy

i just get hit by that guy

and get annoyed

[crimson palm]

XD

[cobalt pelican]

sometimes i even get knocked out of the playzone

and take some burn damage

[crimson palm]

i blind him and kill the small ones

[cobalt pelican]

cause fuck it why not

[crimson palm]

and you can position near an egg cluster

so you don't get knocked afterwards

there's one right next to him

playzone knock is not that annoying

i got knocked down behind the house XD

fucking cancer to get back on road

[idle ember]

It's a pretty dead theory but I also noticed a big difference in corruption damage. But my own opinion is I lucked out and snagged a R3 stars week 1 and had tons of corruption. A lot of my team werent so lucky and barely had any. My 90 parse on our first Maut kill is buried in "pre-nerf" but I had taken a whooole lot more healing than my fellow dps.

So maybe as more people (half my raid is blue/black) run it, you notice the damage more.

Just having to self sustain and not be spot healed. Idk.

[outer lotus]

Did it on my warrior yesterday and he headbutted me outside the area and i almost died to it

[tropic ocean]

idk I just dont care about any mechanics in visions by now

and with rank 15 and even more sanity resist its

netflix n kill

when titan procs I just pull like 15 mobs and fok them

leeching poison keeps u alive and u cant lose saniy so

[crimson palm]

im running cheat death cuz pussy

[open reef]

Which sites on the top DPS classes do you trust?

[quartz rune]

Warcraftlogs

[supple monolith]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[rigid mango]

They are all flawed in one way or another

A mix of wcl and common sense normally does the trick

[rotund pier]

Condensed Life Force, Breath, & Blood major all sim around within 400 dps apart for me. Should I still play Blood?(looking at logs it's pretty much all Blood)

[scarlet sequoia]

ye prolly better to play blood if its within that little dps

[rotund pier]

that's what i was thinkin

[crimson palm]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/24#dataset=75 am I looking at something wrong or are we really that bad compared to others

[faint harness]

check boss dmg

(i havent seen it myself)

but i would assume its a different story

[cobalt pelican]

we're mediocre, but not as bad as the generic graph indicates

[compact rover]

the 2 classes i play right at the bottom

the way i love it

[marble hemlock]

"damage to bosses" is generally a more solid comparison of how valid certain specs are

and we're doing fine there

since overall damage always includes all types of adds, and obviously we do somewhat poorly there, but every raid that has some brain capacity realizes that you dont need the entire raid to switch to adds but just stick a few specific classes on them

and then you just need some pure st-dps that actually kill the boss, and we do very well on that metric

[cobalt pelican]

the larger issue is that there are cleave friendly specs above us on damage to bosses consistently, which just makes them strictly better specs more or less right now

[marble hemlock]

vendetta is also one of the strongest 2min CDs in the game, and a lot of fights are structured around cd assignments this tier

[gusty mirage]

for cleave fights just put on your m+ gear

[marble hemlock]

we can solo growths on carapace, vendetta is very solid on nzoth due to how timers line up (1st basher, psychus, 4th basher) etc.

[hollow stone]

Should just go dh like every other rogue

[faint harness]

I remember in legion when it was the opposite

"DH is just a fake rogue"

[upper elm]

Will 1xEB be enough on tyra on dungs like freehold?

[strange python]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/24#dataset=90&metric=bossdps
Fire, Arms and BM over rogue on bossdamage, and all those got pretty sick cleave too.

Sometimes it is like that, rogue isn't really a top pick for raid rn. But pretty decent nonetheless.

And @marble hemlock while guilds should keep in mind that assa performs certain important duties very well, many Casual guilds simply won't keep that in mind when looking for people. Which is what most people apply to

[faint harness]

Guffin, coincidentally those 3 specs are considered "broken" atm

[gusty mirage]

Will 1xEB be enough on tyra on dungs like freehold?
@upper elm tbh you could skip the 1 EB altogether and just run 3x SS and use CT to buff your aoe and pump ST if you really wanted to. What level keys are we talking about?

[strange python]

Push Sure, just adding it cause someone Said to look at Boss damage

[upper elm]

17-19

[gusty mirage]

I'd carry an EB to help melt trash faster then

[strange python]

Not saying rogue is Trash or anything, or that those classes are balanced well

[dark crag]

There won't be any balance anymore

[gusty mirage]

1x EB + CT is more than enough for trash on non fort weeks imo

[marble hemlock]

outside of the 3 broken classes

[dark crag]

Doesn't matter how broken dh and such are. Patch is over

[marble hemlock]

theres 2 more that almost every raid likes to bring

and those 2 are destrolocks and assarogue, for their strong cds on st/cleave respectively

[faint harness]

rogue is one of those for us at least

but if the decision is between DH and assa rogue, we would bring the DH

[hollow stone]

I dont think dh is one of the “busted classes” from a raid perspective tbh

[marble hemlock]

whethers its raden void anomaly damage that you can carry pretty hard with vendetta, or popping organs on ilgynoth, being able to blast bashers pmuch by yourself on nzoth etc.

[strange python]

Aaah Mate, idk. Sure many guilds Like to Bring one, but many of those I talked to for this tier were like "we don't want a second rogue, rather take DH/Arms as melee." And I get that

[faint harness]

unless you run a veng DH as tank you must have a havoc

[marble hemlock]

dh is a jack of all trades kinda spec

and certainly very solid

but except for nzoth psychus dmg, theres really nothing that DH stands out on

[hollow stone]

Yea. You need one for chaos brand. And they are solid. But i wouldnt put them on the same level as fire, arms, and bm

[marble hemlock]

where you would say "we need a DH for this"

[faint harness]

got to play ilgynoth M last night cus was benched on first kill, did top dmg on boss and organs with the vop minor 3x np build

certainly decent

really strong for those kind of fights

@hollow stone havoc is certainly up there even without chaos brand cus of how they scale with RPPM procs (corruptions)

[hollow stone]

Im well aware. I had to main dh again this tier

But they arent miles above

[gusty mirage]

[hollow stone]

My rogue still does more s

St*

[inner sonnet]

if you have 3x NP traits, is it worth trying out VoP major?

[gusty mirage]

vop major is meh af for rogues even with 3xNP

[hollow stone]

And thats even w missing weeks for mythic farm kills

[faint harness]

depnds on fight, has niche uses

altho im a big fan of the tripple NP vop minor build

[gusty mirage]

vop minor though is a good play if you're running 3xNP if the fight lets you maximize your vendetta uses

[faint harness]

especially on a fight like carapacci, where you can vendetta boss, vendetta 2nd round of gazes and vendetta growths

[gusty mirage]

I will say though, don't be afraid to test different stuff out. Go into a normal and just mess around w/ diff essences/trait builds. I do it with keys all the time, I'll jump into a 10-12 and just try new stuff out. Makes the game a bit more fun 🙂

[faint harness]

i feel like assassination needs a bit of experimenting to be fun, at least at this stage of the expansion

[gusty mirage]

[lone kayak]

Does it seem like Rogues are running a wide variety of essences? I'm simming BotD (R3) as highest DPS on Boss fights without WV+3. But I don't see other SIN rogues running the same combination? I'm experiencing a lot of variance from what SIM is telling me and what everyone else is doing... any suggestions

[gusty mirage]

I feel like a lot of rogues are just trying to find the sweet spot for their essences, plus corruption and the boss mechanics change things too. Corruption adds a lot of variables that the only real answer is to sim it and try out the top essences for you and figure out what's most practical for your playstyle/group's kill timer/etc etc

[keen dome]

for me also BotD is simming highest. Nice change from CLF for so long !

[tropic ocean]

@gusty mirage vop major is strong 🙂

[gusty mirage]

is the buff really that significant for rogues @tropic ocean? I haven't tested it on my rogue yet as a major, but I've been enjoying the increased proc rate on my warr

[tropic ocean]

if u have some mastery corruptions its very strong

[gusty mirage]

well lucky for me all I have are stat corruptions inc mastery ones

I'll def give it a go though 🙂

[tropic ocean]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/h8r7xwj4RPpA6Vky#fight=2&type=damage-done

e.g.

[gusty mirage]

holy shit

[upper elm]

lucky for me I've got leech corruption recently

[tropic ocean]

on maut some other rogues poppin vision major too

[rigid mango]

Vop major is strong with rng and the minor being good

It's bad on fights where the minor is bad

[dark crag]

Bow down to my r3 versa on dmg taken

[tropic ocean]

but afaik u want the 12% mastery corruptions for it

[gusty mirage]

I've been using lucid major for Maut because the leech helps so much on the shield phase

[hallow coyote]

I thought Leech didn't work on shields though

[faint harness]

it doesnt

[cobalt pelican]

vop major is the future

[hallow coyote]

Like I could have sworn I'd seen this exact conversation happen in this disc once before where a guy was taking Leeching Poison for Obsidian Skin

[faint harness]

im all for vop minor, vop major? not so sure

[cobalt pelican]

and to add another layer onto my outlandish claims, vop major 3np3ss is the future

[gusty mirage]

Maybe its confirmation bias or the lack of a dmg essence hitting me, it seemed to help me

[faint harness]

probably lack of dps

[hallow coyote]

I had 3 NP in 8.2 and it made VoP major incredible if very RNG and kill timer dependent

[gusty mirage]

not hitting myself for a 100k breath of the dying probably helped

[strange python]

interesting that 10min fight is cut down to 5 with im guessin, the cloak proc @tropic ocean

[cobalt pelican]

you just beat a second full intermission by a bit now

some of it is the cloak some of it is just natural gear upgrades

[vagrant tapir]

on 2 targets with 3xSS and subt, should you garrote rupturex2, or garrote x3 and then rupture

[rigid mango]

g1 g2 g1

(if they'll survive full length)

[tropic ocean]

@cobalt pelican idk 3 ss 3np exsang might be the psychus pad play

[rigid mango]

probably?

if you can time it really well

Even with exsang tbh

[tropic ocean]

just tried vision major

25% uptime

just needs to proc on the right mobs

[strange python]

can it proc from fok or is it just from targetted spells/autos?

[tropic ocean]

afaik can only proc on ur target

[cobalt pelican]

yeah it's only on your target, and if you have no target but fok hits at least 1 it becomes your target by default

no idea if it can proc if you target a friendly and fok or something like that though

[tropic ocean]

just need the pvp helm and im in 80k club too

:]

[solar fable]

I have a quick question about my single target opener with 3x SS (I dont have optimal azerite yet for sin rogue.) So I start with Garrote, rupture, garotte etc. However, at the end of the first garrote, I should vanish and refresh it. My question is doing this will make Vendatta and Vanish no longer sync up, should I delay my second vendetta when this until vanish comes back up, or should I just use vendetta irregardless. Thank you in advance for your help

[cobalt pelican]

delay unless kill time means you'd lose vendetta from delaying

[solar fable]

thank you again for your help

[zinc coyote]

Psychus pad play*

[tropic ocean]

no exsang

no like

[zinc coyote]

Yeah honestly I wasn’t expecting to do it but nobody really put dmg into him yet so I went in on the pad haha

[tropic ocean]

i should really do heroic with some guild

so I can play vop and vendetta first psychus

[zinc coyote]

I think I only had 2 NP on as well last night

Get the right set up going and prolly add another third or maybe half of that dmg honestly

After all, are we doing it right without padding?

[tropic ocean]

if boss is dead yes

pad as much as u can

and get mced in the end too

before u vendetta coral and pumppppppppp

[fading wigeon]

Is it good to run crippling poison on trash packs this week in m+ to help tanks? and then switching to deadly during bosses because of tyranical?

or just dont over complicate it lol?

[rigid mango]

Huh?

You can use both crippling and deadly, you know that right?

[gusty mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/not-sure-if-serious-superman-gif-4858754

[rigid mango]

[gusty mirage]

the meta play is to use wound poison only, just in case your group miss heal interrupts

[runic tinsel]

Is 3xss always better than switching out one for eb in m+? I feel like I do better with 2xss 2xeb than 3xss 1eb. But that might have been because waycrest favors eb over ss

[rigid mango]

1 Eb is a really awk number

[marble hemlock]

yeah

[gusty mirage]

yeah 1 eb is really kinda meh unless its a large pack that's tightly packed

[marble hemlock]

2ss+2eb would be the better option for most cases there

or go 3ss and drop EB entirely

[arctic harness]

Even when using BotE you would drop EB for M+?

[rigid mango]

For some dungeons yes

in most cases you want EB still yeah.

[gusty mirage]

BotE makes EB better, but it does more than that. So it's not absolutely necessary to run both simultaneously

so you could still run bote w/o EB

plus EB loses a lot of its value in like KR for example (outside of the blobs)

[arctic harness]

But the blobs is the best part

[gusty mirage]

tru

[marble hemlock]

it is very likely that by the end of the season we will run without EB entirely

[rigid mango]

You think so?

[high nacelle]

what number do we FoK at with 0 EB?

[shy dust]

Instead of the EB you’d think ttk?

[rigid mango]

I would love to try a 3 SS TTK CT build

With insane mastery stack

I think 1 NP could replace a TTK too for that matter

[marble hemlock]

dont think ttk+ct is the play tbh

just too much overlap in CP usage

but

3ss 3hod exsang build

[quasi pewter]

hod is really strong

[marble hemlock]

might become viable again

hod will become better and better anyway due to corruptions

its easier to acquire as azerite as well

and youll be st pumplord

with bote exsang

[quasi pewter]

hod is better than ttk in prio even i believe

[marble hemlock]

any 2min fight where you get double bote vendetta subterfuge exsang

you will demolish any other dps

ill try it once i get my last piece

i got 475 galecallers from weekly as well

[drowsy snow]

sounds hot

[rigid mango]

Hm that actually sounds giga fun

[quasi pewter]

i simmed hod vs ttk and i dont see a reason to play ttk if you can get hod instead

[marble hemlock]

you just hold 2nd vanish/vendetta for op proc or smth

or just use on cd

[quasi pewter]

it did more prio & more overall

[marble hemlock]

galecallers isnt actually that bad even on aoe

if you run a stat+ct build

gcb+bote is pretty good aoe

[rigid mango]

Puke

Have been meaning to test exsang w my current setup

[quasi pewter]

i can finally restore my 480 eb ss piece but idk if i even wanna play 1eb

[rigid mango]

Na 1 eb is scuffed but

It's still high ilvl SS piece

[quasi pewter]

im gonna cuz its 15 ilvls on my ss hod piece

[rigid mango]

I'm rocking 1 eb which is scuffed but w/e

[quasi pewter]

but idk i think if i had 480 ss hod i would play that instead

[rigid mango]

Don't have better pieces :)

[marble hemlock]

well, going from 450 to 480 is a 25% dmg increase from the trait

so ~10% more eb/fok damage with a single piece

for now EB still holds its own on aoe

[quasi pewter]

3ss1np1hod1eb would be my setup now

[rigid mango]

I wanna get more interesting corruption

[marble hemlock]

but itll become less and less as corruptions make up a bigger part of the damage

[rigid mango]

That's not bad tbh, will rip bosses to shreds

[marble hemlock]

and between firemages and demonhunters that are stacking TD or flay, we wont be able to keep up on aoe either way

[rigid mango]

I'm running what, 3 ss 1 ttk np eb

[quasi pewter]

t3 twilight for that aoe or 2x mindflay t2 for siege and some other stuff

[rigid mango]

Np feels really good for some reason but I think it's just feelies

[quasi pewter]

hmm idk

[marble hemlock]

id run NP on tyrannical weeks but not fort

cause no BL on bosses on fort weeks

[quasi pewter]

i dont actually have a choice

[polar cape]

Exang with some 12% haste O.O

[quasi pewter]

darkheart robe has ss np as only option

[rigid mango]

Idk I should run HoD instead but legit cba reforging

[quasi pewter]

maybe i get carapace loot finally

next weeks reclear

[rigid mango]

Ye carap chest is p nuts

[marble hemlock]

yeah, ideally you get carapace chest

[rigid mango]

But wont be getting that for a while

:)

[quasi pewter]

but first gotta kill nzoth 🙂

[marble hemlock]

i forgot to get bonusrolls before we killed carapace this week 😄

[rigid mango]

First seli has to kill nzoth

Then I can get chest

Maybe

:)

[quasi pewter]

if we had killed yesterday

i wouldnt have had bonus rolls

i completely forgot

[marble hemlock]

yeah

[quasi pewter]

need kr and waycrest for my assa score

[marble hemlock]

idk

[quasi pewter]

did those as outlaw last week

[scarlet sequoia]

are u discussing m+ traits or whats going on

[rigid mango]

Ye

[marble hemlock]

i think the assa play is to stack flay/gushing for prio/st

[scarlet sequoia]

ah

[marble hemlock]

let others do the aoe pump

we still contribute with ct and everything

[rigid mango]

Ye I'm running gushing and flay

[marble hemlock]

flay is pretty damn good

[rigid mango]

Idk mast % must be good too

[marble hemlock]

for m+

even on overall

nah

youd rather run crit%

and crit

for bote

[rigid mango]

Even w/out eb?

[marble hemlock]

ye

just sim a 3ss 3np build with bote

[rigid mango]

[marble hemlock]

crit will be highest

not mastery

@lethal heart ran it earlier i think

[rigid mango]

Fuck NP

I'm talking like HoD build

[quasi pewter]

my vop major 3 np build was also crit highest

[marble hemlock]

doubt thats gonna change it

if anything, np should favor mastery over crit

[rigid mango]

Probs not

But that just means my severe ring comes into woek

:)

[marble hemlock]

ultimately itll be

crit+vers

to scale corruptions

[quasi pewter]

i got a 445 severe 2 boe ring for 100k

pretty worth

[marble hemlock]

cant run one

got gushing ring :x

[quasi pewter]

hehehehehe

i have like 42% crit with food

[lethal heart]

i got tagged

[rigid mango]

Ye got gushing + severe rings

[marble hemlock]

theres 2 gushing boots on tn ah right now

7mil/9.2mil

[lethal heart]

not worth

for me at least

[marble hemlock]

yeah

was talking about

np/ss exsang build

[lethal heart]

im gonna loot 485 gushing boots from carapace next week

[marble hemlock]

and how crit was highest, when youd think mastery would be

[lethal heart]

ye i thought mastery would be decent

but

i even havae

12% mastery ring

and mastery ring proc

and it didnt sim higher

so idk

[marble hemlock]

mmmh

might just be because of that

that mastery isnt as high anymore though?

[rigid mango]

imagine I got those boots for less tahn 4 mil

[marble hemlock]

if you run low crit and bote but have high mastery, i wouldnt be surprised to see crit high up

[scarlet sequoia]

swear gw is overrated

[lethal heart]

might be

[marble hemlock]

you do?

[lethal heart]

idk

i dont have any

[scarlet sequoia]

same bro

[rigid mango]

idk I have 2 it's p consistant

[scarlet sequoia]

idk maybe its just for me, 460 t3 expedient boots simmed 200 higher than 475 gw boots

[marble hemlock]

http://puu.sh/FfqIO/6f4a26fc0a.jpg

[rigid mango]

ye but ur build is all around expidient isn't it

[scarlet sequoia]

eh i just use 2 rn

[upper elm]

what would you think about 3xss 1xttk 1xeb 1xhod for this week

[scarlet sequoia]

infinite stars gamer now

[marble hemlock]

50 corruption vs 35 corruption

🤔

and its an underrot

so its not like pulls are small

[lethal heart]

the much better thing about gw is that its never in useless place either xd

and good for st

[marble hemlock]

and more consistent

[quasi pewter]

also reliable

[lethal heart]

whereas td is hehe nice proc on dead mobs

[marble hemlock]

and cheaper

[quasi pewter]

opposed to td

[rigid mango]

yeh

[lethal heart]

oh i see your fire mage popped combust there

hehe lets get 7 td's

[rigid mango]

idk I feel like GW is giga blaser

Blaster*

[lethal heart]

when mobs are dead anyway

[quasi pewter]

i managed to td between 2 packs that we pulled

hit 0 mobs

[marble hemlock]

GW doesnt look like much

but considering how much corruption it costs

its not supposed to be

but every piece is just a steady ~3% dmg increase

[quasi pewter]

you strafe once its just zooming past everything

[peak jungle]

!essences

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[marble hemlock]

yeah

that as well

[lethal heart]

i mean there comes point where you might be pulling so massive

td is worth

[marble hemlock]

i was talking about that

that i think TD is too inconsistent individually

but when you have 5people playing it

[quasi pewter]

it still did ~10% of my overall most dungeons

[marble hemlock]

that makes up for it

i mean

10%

for how much corruption?

[quasi pewter]

75

[marble hemlock]

yeah

i get ~6-7% gw on average

for 35

[lethal heart]

im pretty sure if anything you'd wanna play raden weapons at least for outlaw

[quasi pewter]

i just dont have anything else

[lethal heart]

because they're really sick

[marble hemlock]

lash is broken

[lethal heart]

ye

it is

[marble hemlock]

gonna get nerfed eventually

[lethal heart]

doubt

[marble hemlock]

its just too rare right now