if you have coral/font, you will use them for some time until you get mythic raid trinkets, cus nya trinkets are somewhat average
#assassination
tropic ocean
@fiery cradle its not even echoing void exclusively
like you're not gonna compete against someone
fiery cradle
yeah but it still slams damage and is arguably the best all around corruption
fiery cradle
all I have is like haste from all sources and void ritual so could always be worse
ornate gazelle
Do we want to fit Garrote in the opening Master Assassin window?
fiery cradle
you can either garrote-mut-rupture or mut-rup-mut/mut-mut-rup, first is a little more consistent
pale verge
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > vers => mastery > haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
tawdry token
@ornate gazelle i think use ur toxic blade after vanish and envenom (3-4combo point > vanish > toxic > envenom )
rigid mango
No, TB > vanish > env.
tawdry token
nah 😄
rigid mango
That's what you should be doing
real bay
TB inside MA is a big waste
shut garnet
you’re potentially missing a 4cp env crit
to get a potential tb crit
big not worth
rigid mango
It's really small but yeah, suboptimal.
sharp viper
!trinkets
quick chasm
is there a haste point to get mut > env > mut > env in MA?
rigid mango
nope
rigid mango
^
distant halo
Just trying to learn this MA build, so apart from the opener we save 5 cp, tb > van > env > mut > (mut or enven depending on cp?)
Are we also making sure we have vendetta up for the vanish or doesn’t matter?
median hedge
vendetta before toxic blade
urban bough
guys i need your help i cant decide which spec i play. the last 3 seasons i played outlaw to 15+ mythics and now i decided to play assa but i also miss my outlaw and still wanna play assa-.- could you give me some arguments why play this and why play outlaw?
distant halo
What if ven isn’t up? Is it important to wait for it or should we just use van?
median hedge
vendetta and vanish are both on 2 min cd
i would hold them for when you have a tb
obv when ven and vanish are on cd you just tb on cooldown
distant halo
Well I’m taking perfection as a minor and it’s not lining up my vens with van, should I remove that minor since we should be lining them up?
median hedge
i'm not sure if vision of perfection is the best choice for sin, we like having really bursty windows where we just explode damage lol
distant halo
I’ve just seen a bunch of people take it as minor and it’s suggested in a few guides
rigid mango
For m+ or raid?
median hedge
ohh thats a good point zine
distant halo
I know simming is the answer but I missed most of the Essence patch so I haven’t got the chance to delve
Zine - raid
median hedge
i think in raid you generally want to hold em all together
rigid mango
You always want to align vanish and vend, i.e cd reduc does fuckall.
median hedge
so shortening its cooldown just means you have to hold it for no reason
distant halo
Okay so basically it’s a shot trait for raid and I should just be lining my ven with van every time?
Ok Thankyou that really explains allot
rigid mango
It's used in cases where you want a reduced vend CD, so doing echoes on zaqul
But very infrequently and so far nothing this tier.
distant halo
Okay that’s super helpful, I really appreciate it
I’ve been having those 30 secs Windows were I’m not sure to use or not and it never gives me consistent numbers
median hedge
yeah sounds like you were just making it more complicated for yourself lol
slender stag
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
distant halo
One more quick question, I saw someone before mention it’s alright to put garrote one opener, is that true?
Mut > rup > gar into your first burst?
On opener*
rigid mango
Mut rup mut optimally
If first mut doesn't hit for 4 Cp, you go mut > mut > rup > gar > mut
instead of mut > rup > mut > gar
distant halo
Awesome, Thankyou 🙂
So an optimal opener on pure ST with no SS and good mut Crits would be mut > rup > mut > gar > ven > essence > tb > van > enven> mut > (mut or enven)?
distant halo
Sorry what is WV and CLF?
full flame
Where could I find info on the mechagon rings? Trying to figure out which “then” to aim for?
rigid mango
Because you want it just when you pop your burst
So you essentially want blood > MA window ASAP
and pump big crits
also, backstab + haste proc argaen.
distant halo
You’re a god, thanks for all the help 🙏
rigid mango
👍
urban bough
guys i need your help i cant decide which spec i play. the last 3 seasons i played outlaw to 15+ mythics and now i decided to play assa but i also miss my outlaw and still wanna play assa-.- could you give me some arguments why play this and why play outlaw?
rigid mango
Both are really good in both forms of content.
Play whatever you prefer, there's people playing either in bleeding edge level content either way.
potent raft
i'm so bummed.. i got vita 460 but i can't get it to sim anything near 445 font+socket >_< i really want to ged rid of font
urban bough
so ok i think im staying with assa. So my question there is in myth i play with the traits 3 Echoing Blades and 2-3 shrouded suffocation and my last talent is hidden blades right? but i have some players seen playiung with the talent crimson tempest? is it worth to play with or is it juust a troll?
rigid mango
You play CT in everything but KR/siege/tyr tos
urban bough
but why CT and not hidden blades when i have the azerite traits with echoing blades?
rigid mango
Because it uhh, deals more damage?
urban bough
mhm ok i will try it thank you
arctic walrus
Hb wouldn’t even have an interaction with eb yea?
arctic walrus
Oh kk so eb applies first then hb
rigid mango
Afaik it does work like that ye.
HB is just a more braindead version of CT
CT has higher highs but actually meaningful skill increase to manage those gains
urban bough
ehhm sorry whats EB?
rigid mango
Echoing blades
urban bough
yep that was a dumb question xD
snow storm
i do have doubts about CT as you get 3x EB, if you have enough targets a single fok did more damage than CT last patch
urban bough
yea thats what i thought too @snow storm
rigid mango
You stack mastery giga high tho
arctic walrus
A dungeon isn’t a single fok
rigid mango
SS is still your main damage
And you really pump a lot of value into it and CT
And you have essentially never ending aoe
Uncapped
urban bough
SS?
rigid mango
Shrouded
urban bough
ah ok
sterile hare
hmmm, just got a pretty interesting AZ choice, i play a lot of m+ as assass double DH atm, and got a trait called "stronger together" which can give up to 4 allies 464 main stat or 390 secondary stat, think this could be a good choice rather than a second "nothing personal" ?
broken meteor
Yo guys whats the best race atm for pvp and pve?
tropic ocean
pvp orc? i guess
or human if you are alliance?
for pve it doesnt really matter a lot just play what u like most
sterile hare
nelf is pretty solid in arena, as you can shadowmeld the maledicts
snow storm
nelf is like having an extra vanish so you don't need to save it for blind sap
next raptor
what essences do i run for raiding as assass? i'm using blood as major, dying as minor and lucid dreams. i don't have my 3rd minor yet, but i'm close. i have almost every essence at rank 3
rigid mango
If you have them all, just sim it
next raptor
my sim runs CLF as major over blood, but i'm not a fan of CLF due to the nerf that took place and the long cd
strange python
how is the formless void as a minor
rigid mango
Pretty meh I think?
tropic ocean
@next raptor i dont use clf major at all anymore either wv or bote
bote lines up pretty good in many encounters when u want to push
and wv is nobrainer with 1min cd
rigid mango
bote feels good
And I hate WV
And until shadhar I don't see a real reason to use it
tropic ocean
its not a "feel" thing maybe its worse in overall but its gigantic for many encounters
rigid mango
Yus.
tropic ocean
several bosses that have essence usage just like azshara
rigid mango
Also WV feels fucking atrocious, the one use inbetween vendettas feel fucking horrible
tropic ocean
idd
and its only really good when ur raid is actually playing for raid
and not egoistic but meh
quasi pewter
Bote is the way
cobalt pelican
just play vop major and it might proc on psychus it might not
rigid mango
cobalt pelican
tbh though i think clf is better for the first 3 bosses i imagine bote would be better for hivemind, idk for shadhar i'd have to look at the general cast sequence
xanesh has 0 relevant abilities so theres no way bote is better
but bote d oes make a flashy pow
rigid mango
big poof
cobalt pelican
that's pretty gross
rigid mango
Yeah think everyone lusts p2
quasi pewter
Dont think i spiked so hard in dmg meter ever before
rigid mango
Blood gaymers unite
plush remnant
What type of bosses would blood beat wv?
wild mural
I think trill was using bote & vision on drest’agath
onyx crane
would N'zoth count as a helterskelter fight for simming?
rigid mango
A what?
onyx crane
when you sim you can put in several encounter types
rigid mango
You're gonna confuse yourself more than anything trying to sim fight to fight
onyx crane
well I am already confused when I sim
plush remnant
Stick to patchwerk so you can reduce some of that confusion
tropic ocean
@plush remnant probably every boss with movement/adds
or where super hard burst is needed
e.g. hivemind for ravager
or nzoth due to movement
plush remnant
I tried using wv on xanesh and it felt really bad. Had to move out of if almost instantly most of the time
That seems like a blood fight
tropic ocean
on xanesh its pretty playable just need to have proper tanks and "gamble somewhat" or make a good decision
to slightly delay i think
plush remnant
Tanks new to the fight so blood until movement starts to become less a sporadic
Thanks!
tropic ocean
yeah probably
when everything is set xanesh is very much patchwerk besides the occasional dodge for the ground shit
scenic nacelle
daring basalt
Cheers
ruby wind
!weakauras
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
tropic ocean
depending on group i just rup 2nd 3rd 4th tentacle
And pop vendetta when it has 4 stack
Then pump with coral
real bay
we dont use cds for him at all, jst gigablast trinket at 5 stacks
then pop cds on nzoth
tropic ocean
But but but logs 
mossy sable
Anyone have a WA that tracks bleeds and poisons on a target? I already have a bar that tracks Vendetta I just need to know the uptime on my bleeds and such
daring iron
when running bote and master assassin, when is the best time to bote on the opening and afterwards
mossy sable
I'd assume after maybe? You get all your dots and such up then boost the crit hit after?
I may be wrong (Likely am)
daring iron
ah there's a pin lol
tropic ocean
@mossy sable u want to pop bote before vanish so u can have a high chance to hit critical with ur envenoms/mutilate during the increase crit dmg
🙂
strange python
@tiny ember you keep hitting the filter, that's why your messages are being deleted
hushed maple
Daddy Zine?
sage ice
can we cloak Stygian Annihilation from maut?
ripe rivet
Guys, I'm returning from 8.1 so I'm pretty new to this corruption thingy, I was wondering, does Echoing Void stack ? And is it playable with 65 corruption ?
latent gazelle
I see that ring in my wet dreams and my nightmares
tropic ocean
giga ring holy
distant lava
that ring
cerulean walrus
Holy fuck
dark crag
Only 430, weak
arctic socket
That ring how the fuck are you so lucky 
tired trench
Anyone know if the Dagger from Carapace any good?
arctic socket
Weapon wise if it high ilvl it’s good 
tired trench
Yeah i meant the corruption effect on it
If its any good compared to the other corrupted effects
arctic socket
It’s alright but other corrupted effects still our preform it best thing to do is sim it with your current gear and see what corruption you should use.
May have to remove the corruption from it 
hexed falcon
hey guys does someone have a weakaura that tracks rupture/garrote and starts glowing once it can be refreshed (6s,3s)
arctic socket
!WeakAuras
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
arctic socket
^^^
hexed falcon
oh thanks
shy axle
is that with 1 or 2 daggers?
hushed maple
@rigid mango Daddy?
night vale
I have the 470 and 455 daggers and my tentacles do between 10-20% of my dmg on single target... when I juts had the 455 one it was more like 6-10%
lilac sparrow
Why simc cast detection?
strange python
because it builds echoing void so use it when u have downtime
edgy brook
might be a dumb question..but does gushing wounds scale with sin rogues mastery?
royal lantern
they removed interactions with class masterys and trinket/item proc effects on bfa launch
cus it did some weird stuff in legion allready
rigid mango
Aight let me get home and I'll rummage through them
hushed maple
thank you daddy
😄
my opener might be still a lil scuffed, tho
we were too many people for my poor PC 😄
rigid mango
That's the third daddy strike stop 
hushed maple
xD
hushed maple
cobalt flame
Are there sims for mechagon rings anywhere? cant find any
hushed maple
me suck
bitter nacelle
This any good for sin?
hushed maple
sim
rigid mango
not the effect no.
bitter nacelle
Well i plan on it but didn't know if it was even worth simming tbh
fluid thistle
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > vers => mastery > haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
fluid thistle
!help
drifting cloud
just press translate at the top you dummy
rigid mango
Yeah I know but it fucks about
still stays german on somet things for some reason
either way, you fucked up font coral
drifting cloud
maybe because its de.wcl link then
rigid mango
it is
drifting cloud
change url
rigid mango
this is just a bit of a clown fiesta
raven mica
That’s called full panic mode
civic palm
Pianoman
shy dust
That’s the ultimate defensive cd
civic palm
No SPRINT though... 6/10
long hill
no feint 5/10
civic palm
No FoK 3/10
long hill
No detection 2/10
lusty folio
crucible of flame is simming higher than worldvein for me
is that correct?
feels weird
civic palm
You have 3-4 WV raid friends chose? Flames is also not crap so it will be decent at least.
mint echo
hey guys, if i want to sim for a m+ dung, how can i do it? (combat length, targets and so on...)
civic palm
@lusty folio Line it up with as many things as possible, aim for having it active every Vendetta.
cold meteor
Hey, does someone can explain why there is a 2k dps diff between these 2 sims ? The only thing that changes is that I purify my gloves.
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/fgkMvDCneq5tzfykmECjwX
lime path
hello friends, what's better for solo play in visions, Vision Hunter or Experimental Destabilization?
jaunty crystal
why hasnt' my mind flay ever done that 😛
tbh it probably has, but just not on a kill lol
warm parcel
@cold meteor
cold meteor
Getting less corruption affect it ? Didn't know that
warm parcel
Have you read your artifact traits
warm parcel
Thatd be the reason
cold meteor
ye ye it is
wet spindle
Hello, i have a slight issue. atm i have total corruption of 88 which is real bad.. i can do 73 if i swap my wrist but i honestly dont know if i should cleanse any of the items :/ (The corruption is messing with me real bad)
tropic ocean
just unequip worst corruption item
you dont really want much more than 40 for progression as its really nasty
wet spindle
I mostly do low m+
and i dont have a replacement for some of the corrupt items :/ ithought its a high enough upgrade
Ill just play outlaw till iget normal items... got corrupted dagger with a +60 😦
hushed maple
I tend to forget, what kind of dmg the stuff does to me
thats why I mostly press both def cds
:c
dawn root
What's the corruption on the other item not the dagger?
unborn pendant
Embarrassing confession time:
I just discovered that you can use Garrote outside of stealth
unborn pendant
Sure
But I legitimately didn't know Garrote could be used normally until today and I just relearned my rogue
tropic ocean
time to blast
unborn pendant
This was a monumental discovery for me
tropic ocean
unborn pendant
So anyway
I started blasting
Went from like 40k openers to 140k openers
And my rogue is pretty undergeared
arctic socket
tame tangle
No you didn’t lol
arctic socket
Something doesn’t seem right 
tame tangle
arctic socket
If only
wet spindle
the other items i have corrupt on are wrists, waist and boots @dawn root
lusty folio
what's the optimal way to play assassination in a fight like hivemind with 3x echoing blades trait?
just spam fan of knives and apply dots?
warped hollow
Has anybody raided with Thing from Above yet? I'd rather not have to cleanse my echoing void, but I just got rank 3 twilight devastation.
neat siren
May be a dumb question, but i have 445 Coral, 430 Font, and 475 Galecallers. Any suggestions on which two to run? Obv not on fights where we move a bunch, then galecallers would be hard but in general
subtle tundra
normally i'd say sim yourself
but
galecallers is shit with either coral and font
coral and font
neat siren
Thank you, much appreciated for the response @subtle tundra
real bay
don't cleanse stuff you get higher resist cloak soon @warped hollow lol, never know when you get another EV
warped hollow
Yeah, but I'm also raiding tonight as well and I don't have a replacement weapon. In a bit of a bind
rancid bobcat
nevermind misread
vast forum
tbh if galecaller was a good trinket, font+galecaller would be decent
winter gale
For mythic progress we are better with below 40 corruption? Should I sacrifise myself and go higher if I just got 75 corruption infinite star?
i would be 2xGushing Wounds 1xInfinite Star *
arctic socket
For prog always stay below 39
harsh anchor
I just read:
Night Elf: The passive stat increase from Touch of Elune is pretty good and Shadowmeld is another helpful ability to drop combat and restealth in non-raid content. Furthermore, with the Shrouded Suffocation azerite power, you can get one more empowered Garrote.
Does that mean I SM into a 4th emp garrote?
subtle tundra
you can shadowmeld to get in stealth and use garrotes as if you just stealthed
so 3 more garrotes
spark cloud
as far as dungeon trinkets go, which ones should i shoot for? i only do arenas and m+ i dont raid
mighty elm
Feels64CorruptionOnProgressMan
subtle tundra
harsh anchor
So 6 empowered garrotes?
Or just 6 baseline.
My question is regarding empowered considering the 4th after sub and SS will make your empowered garrotes revert back to normal dmg.
merry sparrow
versed bobcat
Is 68 corruption on progress ok? I got double stars and no possibility to activate my heart of darkness
tropic ocean
lucid conflict vision
versed bobcat
In my case, below 39 means 23 (no hod)
versed bobcat
Yes and when I take 1 piece off, I got 23 left after resistance (with no essence), which means not having hod - trait
outer lotus
What happens when you hit a dummy with 68?
versed bobcat
I just did 2 m+ keys and a normal clear on 68
spark cloud
does anyone recommend dungeon trinkets i should use?
outer lotus
I timed like 20 14+ keys with 68 corruption and it didnt kill me even once
azure bridge
if you feel comfortable with 68 on progress go ahead :pepeLaugh:
cobalt pelican
the slow is the most impactful of the corruption effects tbh
if it's not relevant to what you're doing you could prolly play with 26
68*
but surely your pieces have traits besides hod
since all of the raid pieces have like np or dd in their place
azure bridge
just blame your healers if you die to corruption
versed bobcat
Vexi chest :/
cobalt pelican
ah
outer lotus
I wouldnt bring 68 corruption to mythic progress but for hc or m+ it should be fine
versed bobcat
Yea so in mythic progress I'll just put on my 440 void ritual bracers to get hod working
drifting cloud
how can you only be 68 or 23
surely you have something to get a better sweet spot
drifting cloud
whats the corr on r2 is again?
outer lotus
50 i think
cobalt pelican
68 to 23 is like.. 45 though
outer lotus
So 100 - 37 is 63
cobalt pelican
which isn't any corruption
so worst case he'd have to
cleanse a shit item
unless he only has insane gear
which might be the case
outer lotus
Maybe he miscalculated and it's actually between 63 and 23
Not that it makes a difference
halcyon zealot
think it’s worth following sim and dropping down to 1 Double Dose to pick up 1 heart of darkness? for a ~85 dps upgrade, i’m seeing on logs HoD is nice to stack but idk bout solo
obviously 85 dps is nothin just idk if any of you have been playing with HoD and prefer it to DD
cobalt pelican
i prefer anything to dd personally but i just follow sim regardless
winter gale
79 corruption for 71.5k dps or 53 corruption for 68.3k dps ? I would also need to purify some items
cobalt pelican
85 is in the region of 'cba if it costs money' though
winter gale
difference is 4.4%
cobalt pelican
depends on the content and how much you care about faceplanting
79 is way too high in any situation where you dying can impact the people around you
drifting cloud
halcyon zealot
yeah i’m at a 5g reforge atm so i’ll mess with it in raid tonight
i play with 43 corruption rn, sticking it out til tuesday when we get the 8 more resist to push below 40 again
burnt maple
Hi all question... With TB coming off CD soon, if rupture and/or garrote are going to run out during the TB window, is it better to just refresh the bleeds even if they are outside the pandemic window to make sure you won't have to refresh during the TB window? I assume using TB as soon as it's off CD and making sure you pool enough ahead of it is more important than having your bleeds pandemic refresh but I'm not sure.
placid kindle
the fk, 465 plumage downgrade from 445 font KEKW
cobalt pelican
you can refresh bleeds if they're like 1 global away from being in pandemic range just before tb, but it's not a significant gain
dslice is like.. ok, people generally don't recommend it though cause it can be a bit weird sometimes
void pecan
Anyone else getting weird stat weights the more gear they get?
umbral mauve
i am like 47 crit 14 hast 49 mast 5 vers or something, but corruption is why is it like that, got r3 +12% crit thingy
umbral mauve
it isnt where you check logs and you got like 40% crit on envenoms
subtle tundra
but you'd get 4 cp mutilates quite often
maiden raptor
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > vers => mastery > haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
burnt maple
@cobalt pelican Thank you! So if a global away from pandemic then ok to refresh before TB, otherwise just prioritize TB and don't mind bleeds running out while in TB and just reapply after the TB window..?
cobalt pelican
reapply during the tb if they're not close enough to be reapplied early
burnt maple
Ah ok so keeping up bleeds takes priority over trying to fit in more envenoms during TB.
cobalt pelican
yeah
burnt maple
Gotcha thank you!!
vast forum
reapplying rupture outside of pandemic to make sure you're not casting it during TB proved to be a small gain in sims
spark cloud
Would activating Lustrous Golden Plumage put Galecaller's Boon on a bit of a CD or can i stack em together with burst? I dont have a galecaller's so i cant test
vast forum
can't overlap them
most (if not all) trinkets induce a 20 sec CD on other on-use trinkets
spark cloud
so in terms of dungeon trinkets i should get the plumage (since that one is apparently top choice) and for my other trinket get one that isnt on use?
because i dont do raids
vast forum
yea that sounds good
although double on-use isn't as bad in dungeons usually as you can alternate on-use trinkets between packs but i wouldn't recommend galecaller's in any situation
spark cloud
okay sweet thanks
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite overview: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
full sandal
!help
subtle tundra
yes
wide delta
lol my sims tells me to go for more mastery and versa
cobalt pelican
very cool
unborn pendant
By 140k openers I guess I meant "I got the best damn RNG ever that one time on a training dummy" since I'm usually only averaging like 100k peak openers.
harsh sphinx
well ya. when you vanish on the dummy your meters will skyrocket
cobalt gyro
you have to have crazy corruption
cobalt pelican
ya you basically have to blow both vends into psychus
compact zinc
whats the max on the cloak this week?
cobalt pelican
8
compact zinc
thanks
mossy sable
Should I be wearing my 445 Humming Black Dragonscale
Raidbot says running [Lustrous Golden Plumage] and [Torment in a Jar] are better
cobalt pelican
then probably not
woven oar
Has anyone ever gotten any use from Exsanguinate or is it literally the biggest meme in the west.
tiny granite
it used to be a viable build but its just not as good these days
vital haven
i miss triple Shrouded suff exsang build
tiny granite
so yes if you're asking if its "ever" gotten use. yes.
knotty pond
quasi scroll
Is there any view in wowlogs to see what your haste % was over the course of a fight?
or average haste/rating?
I'd occasionally glance and see it at 60% with procs but wondering what the average haste was for the fight
mossy sable
Hey so for Visions, which tree would be better to go for first on Sin?
Destabilization or Vision Hunter
shy dust
Anyone know why vendetta and vanish aren't synced together for sub
uses wv major at 2:02, vendetta at 2:04 then vanishes at 2:19
also doesnt open with a max duration garrote
mighty elm
i assume its cuz you got enough crit
sim it with unbridled fury instead
you got crt pot, coral and deadeye , thats alot of crit (:
distant halo
@shy dust how are you getting 68k with subterfuge? I’m on mobile it won’t show me what azerite you’re running, could you tell me please?
shy dust
It just sims that way. They’re relatively close the two of them.
distant halo
What azerite traits are you running in that sim?
rigid mango
Subt outscales MA.
I'm really confused why it desyncs
It's not even a font coral sim
shy dust
Zine the man i was wanting to check but was afraid to ping
Yeah i highly doubt its a dps loss to not sync them
rigid mango
There's a bunch of funky shit with no ss subt atm
I think it's probably way better than it is in sims rn
distant halo
Wait so you don’t even have a SS and yet sub is simming better for you?? I’m not sure how that even works
distant halo
Yeah but how is his sim at 68k with no SS in a sub build? I’m tearing my hair out because I just swapped from sub and I couldn’t even get my number over 50k :/
rigid mango
Becuase like I said, it naturally outscales MA
The higher you go the higher % based damage gets
distant halo
Wouldn’t he be recommended to get one SS trait then or am I missing something? I get it outscales MA but I thought if running sub you HAVE to have a SS
rigid mango
No you don't.
I'll say it again, it's % based damage Vs Flat crit %
Regardless of SS traits it will NATURALLY OUTSCALE
You do not need SS traits to make it hurt more since it naturally gets more and more damage each time you add on stats
distant halo
It just seems like sin changes everyday I look at this and yet I still can’t get close to raid dps numbers
rigid mango
Yes, the general consensus is 1 SS trait to make subt better, but that was before it activly oustscaled MA.
I mean it's really not changin that much
But if you're simming 50k you're simming less than slightly optimised people were last patch, before corruption even was a thing.
distant halo
Yeah which is why I’m tearing my hair out. I’m not a bad player, I got to 2.6k io before I took a break so I know it’s probably not me that’s failing but it’s something to do with my gear or essences, I just for the life of my cannot work out wtf is different, considering my m+ build and rotation is still working very well
rigid mango
Because your gear is shit
You being good has nothing to do with you being unable to find upgrades in your gear
mighty elm
wtb 1 link to your sims ognametaken
rigid mango
Unless your skill is holding you back from obtaining that gear through raid per say.-
distant halo
I would if I was at home and not work, but ill@happily kink to be laughed at
I’ll happily link*
mighty elm
did u log out in correct gear?
distant halo
I can’t remember what set I had on, I have sin m+, outlaw m+ and sin raid, can’t remember what I had equipped
mighty elm
rigid mango
Bruh you using wq trinkets
normal trinkets
non socketed rings
How are you expecting to keep up with anyone when you don't play the content that's giving you the gear to do 68k
mighty elm
and you do need to level up them esseces
distant halo
What do you mean?
rigid mango
Like you barely try on it
I don't see how you try to compare yourself to anyone raiding mythic when your gear isn't even r3 essences
distant halo
I mean all I really do is m+ and yeah I’ve been away for a few months while I was moving house. I’m working on leveling essences but after moving to alliance all my quest progress has been reset so I have to get through all that before jaina will even give me a quest to get the r2 lucid dreams
rigid mango
Like my dude you have r1 lucid
mighty elm
wait, lucid isnt gated behind jaina? or am i drunk
distant halo
So r3 lucid and 2 trinkets from heroic EP will make up 25k dps?
rigid mango
no
Your entire gear will
You realise your gear is like, really bad even for last tier, right?
You're an alt in 8.2.5 essentially.
distant halo
This is current gear though from this patch?
rigid mango
Doesn't mean it's not on the level of last patch.
distant halo
I’m not sure what you’re saying. I understand there are better trinkets from EP and essences to do, but the rest of my azerite and gear is recent and stated for sin? I’m happy to take criticism I’m just not understanding whats shit about the rest of the gear?
rigid mango
No what I'm saying is even if this was 1 patch ago
You'd be shittily geared compared to optimised mains
shy dust
He is saying you are very undergeared
and you shouldnt be comparing yourself to people with much better gear
and essences
rigid mango
What I'm saying is your gear is essentially atrocious
rigid mango
Like rip slagcheek aka rae, raids at higher than top 100 level atm afaik.
He's always been optimised and he's now keeping up that standard
By the looks of things you're raiding normal?
shy dust
oh not anymore
rigid mango
left*
eager river
he's at my level now 🙂
shy dust
eager river
ya, we're carrying 2 other rogues
mighty elm
shy dust
But also just relooking at the Sub opener with no ss on raidbots
it doesnt open with a max duration garrote either
eager river
i wish zine
rigid mango
I know
distant halo
So all in all I should just level my essences and raid heroic EP for coral and ink? That should take me up to current standards?
eager river
coral still bis for sin yea? or font maybe?
ink is being overshadowed by spyglass already, at higher ilvl ofc. from what ive seen so far at least
shy dust
coral is very broken for sin
arctic walrus
Smh if you’re throwing shade @ me
rigid mango
Your gear is lacking because you don't hav the essential r3 essences, you don't have the corruption pieces, you don't have coral/font/inkpod, you don't have high lvl azerite (mine is currently 30 ilvls higher than yours, that jump is huge), you don't have essential non-special items that just give raw stats, you lack sockets, you lack high lvl mainhand
You got me?
Your gear is in quite literally every single way A significant downgrade.
distant halo
Wait what ilvl is your azerite?
rigid mango
what's 450 + 30
distant halo
Jesus Christ
mighty elm
is there any 80k+ sims yet @rigid mango
rigid mango
Nope, think low 70's is the highest I've seen
mighty elm
rigid mango
I'm ignoring all sims over 39 corr
rigid mango
idk gotta have some benchmark
mighty elm
he knows wsup
warm parcel
Our bm and dh are 81
faint harness
i can match ur sim with 33 corruption
mighty elm
well gotta push them corruptions to compete with my bois
crisp hollow
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jZ9MWTsaMYUctx49Lk4WdR is this dagger corruption any good?
mighty elm
wtb echoing 
near apex
heard nothing bad happens when ure being chased by a man and the eye is half of the screen 🙂
rigid mango
Idk mast proc isn't bad but don't think it's anything special
crisp hollow
replaces void ritual for now at least
mighty elm
feels like tentacle does more dmg than the sims show always tho, not sure if its same for all corruptions
lilac shuttle
"Dungeon slice"
mighty elm
rigid mango
Wait didn't u say it was an interesting day earlier
and then you ask me a pepega question
crisp hollow
the dagger was a dumb question?
grave elk
when running MA for raid. what is the rotation with vanish during fight?
crisp hollow
compared to other corruptions, as context?
rigid mango
@grave elk have bleeds up, vend > tb > vanish
crisp hollow
ones I don't have?
rigid mango
You can sim just as well as I can can't you?
crisp hollow
sorry, "is X corruption a desirable one generally"
if we're being pedantic
is what I should've said
grave elk
@rigid mango and after vanish just go env-muti - env?
near apex
sha'dar
rigid mango
yup, shad and xanesh.
mighty elm
tell me this tantacle didnt do 50k dps for 1 min https://gyazo.com/bb1e1157d29b63dba686c375c27cc1b1
rigid mango
Also yeah, TA is fucking weird
Man I just need to sleep longer, cba NA times always hurts my head
mighty elm
crisp hollow
so whats the logic of subterfuge without SS @rigid mango
rigid mango
Are you trolling or genuin question
crisp hollow
I thought it was mentioned earlier but I was in a key so just skimmed
rigid mango
Skim again.
rigid mango
No thanks.
faint harness
I would assume its cus all secondaries boost garrote dmg
while the 50% crit is static and as you gain more crit might lose value (?)
just spitballing
mighty elm
rigid mango
Bingo.
crisp hollow
interesting
crisp hollow
I did read your shit but it never mentioned garrote
faint harness
I have 41% crit unbuffed atm 
crisp hollow
which I didn't consider
rigid mango
???????????????????????????????????????
crisp hollow
because its usually so inconsequential
rigid mango
WHAT ELSE DOES SUBT DO
crisp hollow
THATS WHAT I WAS ASKING
crisp hollow
Was literally like
rigid mango
Never waking up this early again
crisp hollow
confused
faint harness
any angry gamers in chat
mighty elm
rigid mango
fucking
IQ leeches
bruh read the ability
Why the fuck do u think it works so well w SS traits
even on ST
crisp hollow
if we're being completely real here I learned it empowered garrote just now
rigid mango
mighty elm
faint harness
amazing
crisp hollow
I thought the ST benefit was extending it to max duration
faint harness
mighty elm
push send me that sim, wanna see what 33 corruption is blasting me
faint harness
this is why you dont just read guides but think for yourself too
mighty elm
is it EV 
faint harness
EV2 + TA2
rigid mango
Ev gamers 
crisp hollow
why think for myself when Zine can think for me at the cost of a little verbal abuse
rigid mango
Cost me vital braincells.
mighty elm
did everyone and their nan buy EV? or they just good gamers?
faint harness
I can reach 75k sim dps with 58 corruption
rigid mango
good gamer here
faint harness
but thats EV2+EV3
rigid mango
nty
faint harness
on some fights
rigid mango
random damage + random damage = random deaths
mighty elm
zine
mighty elm
well im a god gamer, i never died at 64
rigid mango
I'd rather just play consistant shit
mighty elm
??
rigid mango
I play whtever my Rl says
mighty elm
putting this boi on block
mighty elm
tru
faint harness
nope
mighty elm
tbf tho, im radin casually atm, havnt progressed past shadhar, so maybe i tune down correuption after that
rigid mango
Nah, you push it higher
faint harness
you could probably play 58 corr on xanesh with little issues
rigid mango
no reason to use it before
but like, xanesh maybe(?)
is the first fight
where you might actually need to push corr for dps
mighty elm
are you raidleading zine?
rigid mango
I help out
mighty elm
what is this non dps whoring mentality
faint harness
Lol
rigid mango
I literally got told yday
faint harness
yea zine ur not a true dps
shy dust
Zine
faint harness
you lack the whore mentality
mighty elm
faint harness
are you a programmer
rigid mango
Progamer*
shy dust
not at all
mighty elm
but yet u hold dps
faint harness
like we've only raided once this tier
faint harness
so progressing maut tonight, no way im running 58 on that. Just gonna kill myself faster
undone pasture
Remember to pop all cds once sheild starts
faint harness
just gonna cloak vanish window
mighty elm
depending on grp dps tho you could lose out on 1 vendetta :S?!?
crisp hollow
had infinite stars clap me on maut a couple times
undone pasture
I am a hc pleb but committing suicide then reeing healers is fun
crisp hollow
that 2nd intermission burn gets real when you're at 10 stacks
rigid mango
idk just cloak vanish window after 1st env chunks you
feint the rest
Feint runs out as tb/bote drops
ez clappers
crisp hollow
elusiveness I'd guess
crisp hollow
on maut?
faint harness
yourself
rigid mango
Elu stops that
crisp hollow
isn't all the damage incremental anyway?
faint harness
the fight does seem like a joke tbh
crisp hollow
you pop cheat death then the next hit kills you anyway
faint harness
well we did like 3 jokey pulls, and the debuff mechanic is not an issue, and that makes it heroic with more hp
rigid mango
I'd say look up the "int the last add into maut" strat if you're not already doing it
crisp hollow
I guess he's technically harder than wrathion but wrathion being super cancer skews my perspective of maut
warm egret
I just came back to wow after a year off and have been only playing for a month so my questions may be stupid. I haven’t been lucky to get any corruption gear yet. I sim 42k dps. But even doing my rotation correctly I do around 33k dps on Maut. Is it just me doing something wrong?
faint harness
so you would say maut is more difficult than shadhar and hivemind
rigid mango
No, not even close
but hivemind isn't much harder
Shadhar is just numbers
Xanesh is football teams and interrupts
warm egret
I pulled a little lower than I usually do this time
I used to main a prot warrior so I’ve only played rogue since December
warm egret
Should it be open mutilate rupture garrote
undone pasture
Xype pls go back prot the world needs tanks
rigid mango
Your opener should be
Lucid is just used way later, when you go under 70 energy iirc.
onyx hedge
Vita charge any good?. Got 455 coral 435 font. Not sure if its better
will sim if people say it could be but i need to know cause it needs to go up for roll if not
or the void one
crisp hollow
unless something changes, you're using coral and font until shadowlands sadly
onyx hedge
that aint sad
shy dust
I doubt it beats out font
warm egret
I’m swapping to blood of the enemy I’m just 1 mark short for my r2
crisp hollow
thats extremely sad fuck AEP trinkets
rigid mango
Font is possibly gonna get kicked on its butt by stuff like vita
ornate gazelle
Are the new corruption essence resistances not meant to stack? with multiple on, my resistance is only showing the 10 total. Bug? Meant to be?
shy dust
they don’t stack
ornate gazelle
That's duuuuumb
rigid mango
It says "unique" on them
onyx hedge
Wtf u mean fuck Ep trinkets, they are good as
ornate gazelle
Booooo
onyx hedge
big numbas that is good
ornate gazelle
lol
ornate gazelle
You can
onyx hedge
Big numbers better Pepega
warm egret
@rigid mango my stat weights are extremely close. Is it because I haven’t gotten my Ilvl farther up?
raven mica
Sin stats weight are: yes.
rigid mango
Tldr font can lose to vita if you have enough gw/is
warm egret
So it’s just try to have a even amount of all?
crisp hollow
its "run what you get through raidbots and see if it has a higher number on it"
raven mica
But what if the item isn’t in your inventory yet
crisp hollow
between cloak, neck, azerite, mechagon rings, and weapons (purely weapon damage which is ilvl) there's very little you have to actually care about statwise
warm egret
I was using all crit enchants then I got humming dragonscale. Now it wants me to run all mastery
Cus I had haste as top now it’s bottom
raven mica
Welcome to assassination stat weights.
warm egret
Alright so it’s fuck it and wear whatever is best
shy dust
Sim whats best and wear it
raven mica
It’s not outlaw where it’s: mastery bad, haste ok, crit/vers good
warm egret
That’s what I’ve been trying to do.
I’m used to prot warrior where it’s max ilvl and run vers
crisp hollow
sin is mast/haste/crit GUD, vers good but not goodest essentially, but even that skews depending on what someone is wearing
velvet nacelle
i'm curious, the wowhead assassination rogue guide says to use vanish with master assassin with vendetta and toxic blade... but without shrouded suffocation or subterfuge, what's the point in pve?
raven mica
Huh???
velvet nacelle
ahh duh
shy dust
Master assassin gives you 50% bonus crit for 3 seconds after breaking stealth
shy dust
So big damage
raven mica
remember when it was 100% for 5 seconds
warm egret
So if I have 5 combo and tb comes off cool down should I just burn the 5 on envenom and mut 1 time and then use tb so I don’t waste points
velvet nacelle
makes perfect sense, i just read the giant bullet points of caveats and forgot about the MA bonus
@raven mica don't make me sad
crisp hollow
it’s ok i just discovered subterfuge affects garrote after playing rogue for 3 CEs this expansion
life happens
tooltips are hard
shy dust
@warm egret it’s fine to use tb at 5 cp
raven mica
You also probably didn’t know that it also extends shadow dance’s duration from 4 to 5
shy dust
You discovered that the garrote empowering talent made garrote stronger?
tropic ocean
@crisp hollow do you do 140k openers now?
warm egret
And refresh garrote at 4 sec and rupture at 3?
velvet nacelle
@shy dust DISCOVERED
tropic ocean
@warm egret 7.2 rupture 5.4 garrote when played properly
shy dust
You refresh within the pandemic timer
raven mica
Wait wtf am I doing in the sin channel
crisp hollow
i discovered the stealth extender talent makes garrotte stronger
velvet nacelle
i just came back to bfa after quitting in month 2 of this expansion
...i'm not sure i made the right choice
tropic ocean
you definetely made the right choice
warm egret
Ok will do. Thanks for the tips guys
shy dust
Give it a shot maybe you’ll have fun
velvet nacelle
my most recent wow experience was legion back before everything was on the gcd
raven mica
Hah nerd go grind nazjatar for 2 weeks for rank 3 lucid
undone pasture
I discovered toxic blade makes poisons stronger
velvet nacelle
i'm barely simming like 50k in dungeons after a WHOLE week of playing
that's like SEVEN days guys
yeah i'm only at like 15k honor for blood of the enemy
i went super hard this week to get rank 2 and burnt out so took a few days off
raven mica
DAMN DUDE you halfway there already after a fuckin week
crisp hollow
@tropic ocean i don’t think i’ve hit 140k opener yet, probably 120 but my weapons are dook
raven mica
I’d relax for a bit
tropic ocean
55k big
velvet nacelle
@raven mica i honestly wouldn't have felt the burnout if the last few teams i got weren't complete garbage
we got ROLLED in AB and mines by moderately geared alliance so i was like "uh... yeah, i think i'm good with pvp for now"
raven mica
You’ll need to go back to eternal palace for CLF, do nazjatar for lucid (rank 1 has most of the benefit) sin doesn’t need visions, focusing iris comes naturally
Do y’all use CNS in ST situations?
velvet nacelle
got lucid and got iris
tropic ocean
you dont need to farm clf im pretty sure
velvet nacelle
my trinkets are garbage right now
tropic ocean
and yes with corruption getting buffed by vers conflict is giga
velvet nacelle
just farmed for ilvl
raven mica
CLF still is winning higher than worldvein for@me
tropic ocean
well then idk whats happening
raven mica
Sin trinkets are still font of power and coral
tropic ocean
cuz even with 1 ally wv is a big up over clf
crisp hollow
whoever told me font and coral being bis still isn’t a sad thing can catch these hands tbh I’m still farming ashvane to replace my 430 because guild extended on azshara for damn near 3 months
raven mica
SAME DUDE
crisp hollow
first to prog her then to make sure the bench got CE too
velvet nacelle
font of power and coral? good to know
eager river
raven mica
Well I know suffering because I had to play sin on azshara with full extendo for almost 3 months
velvet nacelle
i just have a few random 430s right now
raven mica
Shadow get outta here
eager river
crisp hollow
yeah i hate that entire raid tbh
shy dust
Coral is our strongest trinket even now Despite it being from last tier
raven mica
Balanced right
crisp hollow
it should’ve been torment in a jar
velvet nacelle
font of power: channel magic for up to 4s...?
raven mica
Yes you fucking sit there and Stand still to channel a spirit bomb for 4 seconds
And you don’t even get to throw the spirit bomb you just get agi
raven mica
Fun that you get to use 2 on use trinkets ya?
crisp hollow
because the buff is so long you can pair font with another on-use (coral) to get the most of your vendetta window with both of the massive stat increases
raven mica
Coral and font
velvet nacelle
and both are from last tier?
raven mica
Yes.
One is from the last boss too
And mythic azshara is the biggest baddest bitch I’ve ever fucking progged on
So you’re gonna be stuck with a 430 unless you pray to the titanforge gods
velvet nacelle
eh i have 430s now, i'll be happy with them
crisp hollow
not even mythic lol, compare heroic azshara to heroic nzoth