assassination

[cobalt pelican]

straight broke with the update

some of them using conditonals you need to manually go back in and 'add' the element cause they're not enabled by default now (glow/opacity/etc)

[covert belfry]

also which final talent is better for mythic+ ?

CT or poison bomb?

[rigid mango]

PB for kr/siege/tyr tos ct rest

[covert belfry]

tyr?

tyrannical?

[rigid mango]

Yes

[lofty onyx]

@civic palm is your wa good today??

[broken crypt]

bote -> vanish?

[civic palm]

@lofty onyx Was good yesterday and this morning.

[lofty onyx]

cool. Im gonna give it ago, previous set Im using completely busted.

[buoyant kraken]

Any smart person here that can tell me the logic behind simming higher with 0 NP and 1 Swirling Sands and 1 NP

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jGksJvH8jGUrXRrTEccenY

[rigid mango]

More crit = good for inf stars

inf stars = all your dmg

Tadaaa

[tropic ocean]

63k sim oof

[jolly spoke]

so whats our main essences go to now?

[tropic ocean]

world vein atm

For most

[jolly spoke]

i was life force iris and lucid

[tropic ocean]

Yeah

[jolly spoke]

so go vein instead of life force?

[tropic ocean]

i mean u can sim all essences in raidbots

See whats best for you/you end up with

But with 4-5 allies wv is big up for me over clf

[jolly spoke]

no idea how to do that lol.

i simed out at 45k

but as for adjustments no idea

[quasi scroll]

These bloodmallets... https://bloodmallet.com/index.html#rogue_assassination?data_view=azerite_traits&type=trait_stacking&tier=3

That's 475, are those accurate for ~440?

[untold current]

How practical is WV at the moment? Has anyone tried it in palace?

[jaunty crystal]

I'm guessing you got 63k because of that corruption? Otherwise I ahve no idea how you're simming that high lol.

[rigid mango]

Literally it.

Have it do casual 25k dps :^)

[cobalt pelican]

why would they be accurate for 440 if they're 475

[marble elm]

[strange python]

What's the opener with Worldvein?

like BotE?

[rigid mango]

[subtle imp]

can you not bleed/poison the unearthed keepers in uldum

[rigid mango]

Check the quick sim rotation

You cannot.

[subtle imp]

lame

[cobalt pelican]

just press it before vend

same spot as clf

[arctic walrus]

hmm don't think so

[cobalt pelican]

i didn't bother checking if it's worth delaying till after vend cause it's 18s rather than 20

but it's probably not

[arctic walrus]

well, it's entirely a stat boost, so you'd use it like you would blood

[rigid mango]

I don't see a reason it'd be worth saving for inside there tbh

Why would u use it after tb tho

Whe it's 18 sec

Why would u even waste a global of early vend there

Idk, I would just use it like CLF tbh

The fact that the sample log says this

for the standard CLF opener w/out 4 cp mut in opener

tilts me

after I fixed it and told fuu and was told that it wasn't worth pushing it

[cobalt pelican]

the only logic to using it after vend would be

it's an 18sec buff on gcd

so if you press first global after vend

all 18 seconds are spent inside vend

it's likely not worth but it's the only alternative to standard clf spot (which i did tonight anyway)

[arctic walrus]

No okay yeah you're right, now that I'm thinking it through

[rigid mango]

Seems kinda weird to waste a GCD there tbh

[cobalt pelican]

it's not that big of a deal, you rarely fit 20 gcds inside vend anyway

i don't think it's worth still but ye

think the essence in general is ass after a night of playing with it i'm already tilted enough to yeet it

[rigid mango]

I mean it's just bec of the thing that it's in the opening energy part

[ashen solar]

vanish > mut

[fleet whale]

in MoP to wod that's how it was done

[empty badge]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[honest needle]

did wow seriously reset the dailys and make it so people can do double dailys today

thats bs

[cobalt pelican]

you'll get over it

[civic forge]

it's just rep

the daily vision in vale didn't reset

so it's not really a big deal

[honest needle]

rep matters

[cobalt pelican]

it's like.. 200 rep

[honest needle]

still the game shouldnt allow it

I heared if u logout n back in it resets again

so u can keep abusing it

[rancid spade]

no

[cobalt pelican]

it doesn't, and if it does on na or something then people who do more than 1 extra set will get banned

either way it's not a big deal, 200 rep is such a negligible amount

[civic forge]

its ok we're all gna get banned for doing the reset of extra dailys

our comeupance will happen

[hidden bay]

#off-topic

[cobalt pelican]

ok sorry officer

[strange python]

But AP

[bronze topaz]

when did they fix shadowstep on racing flag?

[arctic walrus]

tuesday

[tribal marlin]

I'm pretty sure I legit stepped on a raceflag yesterday on our raid

but today I cannot anymore -.-

why the fuck

[bronze topaz]

blizzard doesn't allow fun

[fallow otter]

I blame the druid healers using it in m plus

[dull lava]

So I just simmed myself and I've always been crit over everything, and right now it's saying haste over everything with crit being my lowest stat weight. Did something change in 8.3 or is that just because of something I'm overlooking?

[arctic walrus]

op got nerfed

[rigid mango]

A lot of things changed

Using stat weights wont help you either

[dull lava]

@rigid mango Does that mean it's not worth it at this juncture to sim myself?

[rigid mango]

I wouldn't use stat weights at all.

There's a lot of use still, to use top gear to get relativly small dps increases as of now I'd guess

But right now everything's just up in the air really, everyone getting diff things good for them, a lot based on what corr items they rng'd etc.

[dull lava]

I'm using it primarily to find out what to gem/enchant

[rigid mango]

Yeah, use top gear

Never stat weights

Top gear does the math of potential stats gone etc from ench/gems etc

[dull lava]

gotcha

[pale knot]

Do we get residuum from this weeks key on Wensday?

[opal minnow]

no

[jovial canopy]

i think blue post says we do

https://www.wowhead.com/news=304897/what-to-expect-on-patch-8-3-launch-and-season-4-artifact-knowledge-corruption-it

@pale knot

guess not XD

[fallow otter]

Im just simming minor traits now, results should be interesting

[pale knot]

@jovial canopy ty for info

[jovial canopy]

soo are we gonna be running worldvien major now?

[rigid mango]

🔮

Sim use w/ever you want

comes down to encounter

😉

[jovial canopy]

fair enough

[shrewd night]

!warn @honest needle Youve been redirected enough. Next time you bring wow-general material into spec-channels, we're going to start muting you.

[topaz crow]

is it me or are the raid trinkets kind of lackluster back to M+ for BIS trinks?

[distant lava]

back to font coral

[topaz crow]

i got a coral and 455 inkpod for now

[ember pulsar]

Probably you will replace inkpod for torment in aoe encounters

[drifting cloud]

I mean inkpod wasnt bis in 8.2

[distant lava]

replace inkpod ?

the fuck are you running inkpod for

[rigid mango]

Why not

nearly as good as font

[plain moon]

I havent simmed in a while but ink pod was pretty far under font for me when i did

[rigid mango]

Sim wise yes, realistically the diff isn't huge

before log cheesing became a thing and people got reclear logs, nukkz was top loggin with ink coral so

Can't be too much worse can it

[plain moon]

I mean i think you can do well with either but i would say font is a step ahead of ink

[rigid mango]

I would say the diff is essentially negligable esp on prog

Defo becomes worse and worse the further into the tier you go though.

[plain moon]

Yeah, there is something to say about coral in getting burst at 30% which is prob the most important part of a fight

[rigid mango]

I mean you don't align coral to it

[plain moon]

but i guess font has a case for that on azshara where you can font a p3 add

[rigid mango]

but you try to align everything if you can.

[plain moon]

oh sorry i mt i meant to say inkpod there

at the end of the day there not a problem with running one over the other as theyre close enough

[teal geyser]

does inkpot scale with essences ?
never tried it but what about lining inkpot with coral and BotE to push inkpot crit even further ?

[distant lava]

works

[teal geyser]

could be a possibilty for certain fights to delay your cds and stuff when u wouldnt lose a vendetta ... :D
thx @distant lava for the info ❤️

[civic hatch]

anyone know if theres an optimal spec for visions or just raid spec

[verbal mantle]

M+ build, doing this as an outlaw

doesnt really matter tbh

[scarlet urchin]

I prefer M+ build if anything

[teal geyser]

yep would go with outlaw as well ... in some areas u got several times out of stealth and stuff

[unborn helm]

But, are we gonna use coral in the next tier?

Pls say no...

[rigid mango]

🔮

[unborn helm]

Uff

[hearty junco]

äny vulpera sims out yet ?

[rigid mango]

+- same as everything else

[vestal wren]

vulpera inplementation is experimental

[faint harness]

wait can you get other dmg buffs

[royal lantern]

the dmg is the same

just the animation is different

[faint harness]

This might be a wow-general topic, but i feel like they should buff the dmg part of it

[rigid mango]

Fucking 99% of people who say "this might be off topic"

guess what

[faint harness]

Discussions dies when you move it = fact

[rigid mango]

Win win

[faint harness]

Sure, well in the topic of ASSASSINATION, it did 0.5% of my dmg yesterday on mythic azshara (probably didnt use it on CD tho)

[rigid mango]

Still don't see how that's relevant to the spec.

[faint harness]

its a race option

for assassination

[rigid mango]

If only the average discord user could use ctrl f

🙏

[faint harness]

I have a lot of opinions on how these forums are being moderated, but if i speak im in trouble 🤐

[royal lantern]

and racial differences mean almost nothing dps wise

just stop and dont make zine angry ok?^^

[keen dome]

anyone else having Breath of the Dying rank 1 minor simming over other minor essences ? Is it purely due to the proc effect or maybe there is a dps bonus from removing the corruption from my stuff ?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vtk7mTQRAXqGUZVSRfQYnN

[shrewd night]

Its not working as intended right now afaik. Rank 1 is working as if it was rank 3 ingame.

[warm parcel]

In sim or in game

[shrewd night]

ingame, probably reflects in sims?

idk

[warm parcel]

Interesting that it would work like that ingame

Just makes it really good then

[crystal notch]

hey guys, any Toy I can Shadowstep to?

[rigid mango]

Seems as if the main one has just lost its function, wouldn't be shocked if all of them have.

[crystal notch]

that's stupid imo, we have only sprint and shadowstep, with toy you can shadowstep to safety location

[stable isle]

No more racing flags?!

[rigid mango]

Yuh.

[stable isle]

Damn I just got the rep the other week lol

[orchid solstice]

With the changes to CLF and WvR I still sim higher with CLF major into WvR minor... seems contradictory to other people’s experience in this discord, any ideas why?!

[rigid mango]

Sim for yourself

Gonna come down to encounter, no one here is optimised for the new patch nor how corruption plays out

no one is optimised for the scaling

and just bec wv sims the best doesn't mean it'll be used everywhere

it's really tilting to see the same message being posted every 20 min

[dense blaze]

hey is clf good

[rigid mango]

it is

So is lucid, blood, wv

I will try to TLDR what people will want where when I have the necessary information and know what the fuck I'm talking about, shit's getting changes and nerfed and 3 diff people see 3 diff results from their sims

[orchid solstice]

Apologies Zine!

[rigid mango]

it's aigh man

nothing personal

[faint harness]

Good trait

I played with wv in our EP reclear yesterday, underwhelming

[dire spoke]

underwhelming power

[graceful musk]

whats the trait setup this tier ?

[strange python]

same

np double dose

bbi

[arctic socket]

Go with what sims best

[sage forum]

Question for you guys.. in a situation like in an Orgozoa fight.. say my toxic blade is coming up but adds are also about to spawn. I want to maximize dmg on Orgozoa while also quickly applying dots to the adds. Is it better to hold TB to apply some garrote/ruptures to adds before going back to boss and then TBing?

[dark crag]

No

Never delay low cd cds

[next solar]

depending on how long the adds livee for it wont be worth it to dot them all up

[sage forum]

So okay say in that situation then.. I would TB first, then apply dots to adds (assuming they’ll be up long enough), even though I lose out on getting a few envenoms on main target during the TB window?

[dark crag]

You use tb and env boss

Boss dmg > add dmg

[sage forum]

Okay, so I guess you kind of just lose out on add dmg there other than using fan, cause by the time TB window is down adds are going to be too low to make it worth dotting

[next solar]

tb and focus boss, never swap off a target that has TB applied

[sage forum]

Got it, thanks squad 🤙🏼

[next solar]

and depending on how long adds live, you wont benefit from energy regen or actual dmg if they dont live long enough, spending roughly 4-5 globals per add all the whilee waiting for garrote cd is way too much of a downtime unless they live for an extended period of time

[tropic ocean]

u dont garrote the adds

[sacred hatch]

no sims for vulpera ?

[rigid mango]

+- same as everything else

[sacred hatch]

ok

ty

[inner sonnet]

you guys should just pin the fact that vulpera sim changes are marginal and worldvein appears to be good but needs testing

then just every time you get the same questions

[wispy sluice]

Hey guys would. You guys say its still bis to Play eternal Palast rank 3 essence? I dont wanna farm it 🙃 im 11/36 of rank 3

[cobalt pelican]

go farm it

[inner sonnet]

one hc run will get you to 32/36, then you only need 1 mythic boss or 2 normal bosses

[wispy sluice]

Can i get them in hc and mytic in the same weeek?

[cobalt pelican]

you get bonus ones for doing mythic, but that's it

it works like, you normally get

12 for radiance mythic for example

7 of those are the heroic ones, 5 are the mythic bonus

if you do mythic first you get 12

if you do heroic first you'll loot 7, then loot only 5 on mythic

but it'll be enough to get you past 36 anyway

[true thistle]

!essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[subtle salmon]

guys hows sin rogue's AoE?

[shut garnet]

it is amazing

well, it's insanely good in terms of consistency after a couple of seconds of spreading bleeds and FoKing etc etc

with 3ss 3eb

the only downside i suppose is that it isnt burst and it's quite monotonous after a while, not much going on really you're pressing fok with the occasional rupture/envenom

[subtle salmon]

outlaw's aoe is better?

[shut garnet]

nope

[subtle salmon]

then why people say outlaw is better for m+?

[shut garnet]

well, from purely a damage perspective

outlaw performs a bit better on ST as they do consistent damage rather than spikes of burst with cds

due to them also only needing 1 trait to AoE (wits) whereas assa needs 2-3EB

[outer lotus]

Sin has to specialize for either aoe or single target and outlaw is good at both no matter what

[subtle salmon]

ahh

[shut garnet]

their AoE is also burst that needs minimal setup

so just fits some comps better

and just overall utility i guess

with acrobatic strikes, gauge

[outer lotus]

Also assa needs restealths, vanish for damage, no gouge

[shut garnet]

yep^

thats also pretty major

[tardy jay]

!rota

[steel hornet]

Speaking of which, can anyone tell me the meta for assassination in M+? I have 440 ilvl but doesn’t seem to perform that well in M+. My armory char is Jeagos-US on Zul’Jin.
I have 2 sets of gears whit either 3 EB or 3 DD i usually go with the 3 DD for Tyrannical.. icy-veins doesn’t really elaborate much on assa M+, should i mix it up? 2 EB, 1 DD, 1 NP and 1 blightborne? Why Shrouded Suffocation in M+??? Should i switch to subterfuge for aoe? Or Tyrannical etc...? Maybe DM me as well if the channel is not right enough for this type question

[rigid mango]

DD should never be used in m+

Literally

Shrouded is great because it does the highest boss damage of all traits on fast kill timers and works really well on cleave or heavy aoe

With the amount of restealths we're gettin this season SS is even better since you essentially stealth between packs

[autumn girder]

Assa "bis" list on wowhead is a good orienation?

[shut garnet]

mind linking it so we can have a look?

[autumn girder]

https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-gear-guide

[shut garnet]

uuuuh

[strange python]

thats like only gear from the next raid

[shut garnet]

the issue is "bis" isnt really a thing except the azerite pieces

[strange python]

which is pretty shit

[shut garnet]

because of corruption etc

and also that^

like, just sim for most optimal setup available for you

dont try to follow a "bis list" as they arent a thing really

[autumn girder]

yes for the guild i should enter the gear that is bis from the raid

ofc i will sim but they want it

[shut garnet]

bruh what

you get a new piece of gear -> you go to https://www.raidbots.com -> top gear-> if it says its better you wear it

you get new gear -> you repeat

that's it

[hollow stone]

@autumn girder does your guild know this isnt classic?

[obsidian mountain]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[hollow stone]

Theres barely any value in telling your guild what your “bis from raid is”

Especially with corruption

[strange python]

they probs just wanna know on which bosses to bring him

[brave vector]

Real happy to see early Sims are having shit like dice and spyglass beat font, but Jesus even 430 coral stomping everything

[shut garnet]

yeah like, loot sheets are a thing

that need filling

[hollow stone]

I wouldnt put much weight on general sims at this time. Sim yourself, dont use bloodmallet or w/e

[shut garnet]

but id say most bosses have pretty valuable loot imo

[hollow stone]

Or at least potentially valuable loot. And, imo, thats the problem with loot sheets

[tired trench]

Hi guys, i ma new hear

And was wandering if you can help me with some pointers

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/M72XxYmDvqajNLb4/#fight=3&type=damage-done

This is my latest log

[arctic walrus]

You don’t know your opener. You are overcapping cp

[tired trench]

One of the fight from the logg someone pulled without timer

So opener was non existent or really bad

And i do mess up the opener quite often 😦

That is just something i know i have to practice

[arctic walrus]

You don’t know anything about your cd usage. Bad cooldowns, no second font, bad corals

[tired trench]

That is why i am here 🙂

[dense axle]

hey vel, thats a bit harsh of a way to say that

you could say something like "get some weak auras that you like to track cooldown usage"

[shut garnet]

check the pins

they have aaaaaall the basic info you need

[dense axle]

thats also a valid answer

[shut garnet]

once you got the basics down, or if you got any questions that havent already been answered in the pins

feel free to ask :p

[dense axle]

@tired trench cooldown usage is really important to Sin, you'll want to get some good weak auras to track them. I like bigger icons of important cooldowns rather than tracking EVERYTHING

[tired trench]

Ok i look for some but is there a specific way to use them or mostly on CD

Or in combinations with other buffs?

[shut garnet]

look at the pins^

[tired trench]

Ok

[obsidian sandal]

I'm thinking about swapping to rogue for 8.3 but I'm feeling really discouraged looking at the essences required. BoTE is a thicc grind, and lucid also takes longer than most essences atm. Does lucid scale really well as it goes up or is r1 just the most important one?

[shut garnet]

lucid is like the easiest essence out of the lot to obtain wdym (and yes rank 3 is by far the best one duh)

you legit just do dailies

theyve even lowered the amount of dailies you have to do to get it

and yes lucid is BY FAR the best minor so thats a must

bote i wouldnt say is that major, it's fine if you dont have it i guess, depending on what type of content you're pushing and/or how high you're pushing

[obsidian sandal]

lucid takes longer than the rep ones for example is what I was getting at

[dense axle]

@tired trench biggest thing is to use 5 CP -> Vend -> TB -> Vanish in same GCD -> Env -> Mut -> Env (2-4 CP) and then pumping out a few more Mut/Env into that TB

@obsidian sandal Worldvein is pretty easy to accomplish with doign islands and it's simming pretty damn high these days. Iris is also easy if you just do some M+ weekly

[obsidian sandal]

and yeah obv rank3 is best but I was wondering if it was less meaningful compared to other essences. For example some essences get a huge boost at r3 compared to others, and I was wondering if lucid was a similar case or if it was lessso

[dense axle]

I believe it gets some versatility at rank 3 for the major

[shut garnet]

you're gonna have to say which type of content you push to know what answer you want

do you push high m+ or raid mythic?

[obsidian sandal]

high m+

[shut garnet]

how high is high

[dense axle]

youll get Iris pretty quick then

[obsidian sandal]

20ish

so not THAT high I guess

[shut garnet]

and you're gonna wanna play assa?

[obsidian sandal]

outlaw makes me want to cry

too much rng

[dense axle]

https://www.wowhead.com/azerite-essence-power/memory-of-lucid-dreams-104

[shut garnet]

then just get bote

[obsidian sandal]

I know its way better but

it makes me sad

[shut garnet]

you pretty much need it

[dense axle]

check out t5he minor. You just need rank 1

[shut garnet]

it is very bis

and you should aim to have all essences at rank3

because like

[quasi pewter]

Get rank 3 or you're trolling

[shut garnet]

idk, why wouldnt you?

[obsidian sandal]

robber I realize that haha

[shut garnet]

it would be legit trolling, exactly haha

[hollow stone]

Outlaw isnt way better. If you dont like it, dont play it (which i think is where youre already at$

[obsidian sandal]

but if I pick it up rn theres going to be a good stretch of time before I can do that

[shut garnet]

well of course, what did you expect?

[obsidian sandal]

what

[dense axle]

@obsidian sandal you only need Lucid rank 2 for the major. Rank 3 just adds some leech

[quasi pewter]

You can play with lower rank but work on r3 asap

[obsidian sandal]

thanks wolf

[dense axle]

<3

[obsidian sandal]

I feel like you guys missed the point haha

[dense axle]

he's asking minimums to use guys

[tired trench]

What is TB @dense axle

[shut garnet]

the point is you need most essences are rank 3

[dense axle]

Toxic Blade, talent

[tired trench]

Oh right

[shut garnet]

they're easy to get, some easier than others, and theyre mostly useful

[dense axle]

but he doesnt Robber. Lucid only needs rank 2 to be just as effective

[obsidian sandal]

robber I get that but I was asking if r1 was going to be ass in the in between time

[shut garnet]

bro please dont even try to justify not getting an essence to rank 3 because ur lazy

[obsidian sandal]

I cant just instantly get r3, so theres going to be keys where I have lower rank esences

im not?

Im just saying that in those weeks before I can get r3

[shut garnet]

not you

😛

[obsidian sandal]

is it still worth

[dense axle]

yes

[obsidian sandal]

and the answer was yes

[shut garnet]

sure you can play with rank 2

[obsidian sandal]

yea

[shut garnet]

but just get rank 3

[hollow stone]

@tired trench i highly recommend reading through the wowhead guide as it sounds like youre missing some basics. Get the basics down and see how you improve, then optimize later

[rigid mango]

Wait what is this shit lucid is HUGE at r3

[obsidian sandal]

[shut garnet]

🙂

welcome zine

hf

[rigid mango]

🤡

How about we shut this down if it's as bad as it seems

[dense axle]

@rigid mango yeah, I forgot the versa bonus on the minor

[rigid mango]

Yeah the vers is bonkers my man

1k dps upgrade or smth back in the day 👴

[white wyvern]

Peperidge Farm remembers.

[shut garnet]

tldr if you're gonna actually wanna be competitive, which by the sounds of it you do

you need to get your hands on all the stuff that'll make it easier for you to do shit

because sure you can play 20s without essences if u rly want

but why?

theyre not there to make life harder lol

[dense axle]

@obsidian sandal dont skimp on the pearls. To purchase rank 3 you need 50 of em

[rigid mango]

Don't ruin the meme maiev

[shut garnet]

[obsidian sandal]

my question wasnt "can I just stop doing dailies" it was can I do m+ while working towards getting higher ranks or should I just wait :(

[rigid mango]

Nah just get your 3 dailies done

[shut garnet]

that is highly dependant on ur group

[hollow stone]

You can do m+ with no essences if you want

[shut garnet]

i wouldnt wanna take someone with r1 and r2 essences

[hollow stone]

It just kinda seems like a silly question

[rigid mango]

Lucid is used as a minor for literally everything and they take 30 mins tops

You can do m+ with whatever tbh

[rocky ruin]

did they change something with the race flag?

[quiet parrot]

Bloodmallet has been updated... its showing Ancients' Bulwark, Endless Hunger, Blightborne Infusion, Champion of Azeroth are now our best ST traits.
Would we still want to try and get 3x DD on top of those?

[dense axle]

probably ignore champ of azeroth cause it's on like no gear

and it depends on how Ancients Bulwark works. If the sim assumes youre sitting there the whole time, but in fact you move for boss mechanics that one goes way down in usefulness

and can you actually get 475 azerite with that trait? How high does the heroic warfront azerite go?

[fair otter]

Sadly most of the "bis" traits that bloodmallet shows you can't get above 455

[hollow stone]

Things like bloodmallet and herodamage are GUIDES based on all gear available to that spec. Use them as indicators but you need to sim yourself. Your weights will be different

Sim + brain = max dps for you

(Like sea and drew said; theyre the brain part of that equation)

[quiet parrot]

very true, i normally go with what sims best for me anyway

[minor thicket]

guys where would i find info on racials? curious about vulpera rogue as opposed to troll

[rigid mango]

Just as shit as everything else 😉

[minor thicket]

really eh

[rigid mango]

Fucking up 1 tb has a bigger impact

[minor thicket]

so is there are benefit or all preference

[faint harness]

app app app, no furry talk in assassination channel

[rigid mango]

just use utility/looks

[shut garnet]

certain specs have certain benefits yes, but not major enough for people to care really

[rigid mango]

All racials are +- same for dps gain

[shut garnet]

unless you're doing some mdi shit

[rigid mango]

Belf is handy for m+ etc

but yeah, just use w/ever you prefer honestly.

[shut garnet]

except your dick shrinks irl if you play vulpera

[rigid mango]

except your dick grows obscene amounts of pubes and becomes a furcock if you play vulpera

[shut garnet]

[rigid mango]

But yuh, pref views or just utility

[onyx crane]

Vulpera gets 8 more bagslots so they are better hoarders

[sand whale]

I helped my healer out in temple today as a vulpera 10/10

[hollow stone]

When was the last time you ran out of bag space tho...

[rocky ruin]

Is it bug with racing flag atm or did they remove that we can shadowstep to them?

[hollow stone]

They removed that @rocky ruin

Rip flag

[rigid mango]

[rocky ruin]

I didnt found anything the only thing i found was the issue from the 14th january
some older items may fail to cast their effects.

[strange python]

I'm absolutely garbage at rogue

Good day everyone

[hollow stone]

See ya on dh disc

[minor thicket]

gotcha so leaving troll and losing beserking isnt that big a dea

deal

[hollow stone]

Correct. Race will not make or break a char. You do you brotha

[gusty mirage]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[mighty elm]

can you no longer step to race flag?

[quasi pewter]

correct

[mighty elm]

[outer lotus]

wanna try some sin m+ in the offseason. what would be the better azerite setup? 3 SS, 2 TTK, 1 BBi; or 2 SS, 1 EB, 1 TTK, 1 NP; or 2 EB, 1 loyal, 1 ttk, 1 NP, 1 SS

[real bay]

second one imo you dont want to go without EB and loyal is useless

[rigid mango]

Idk can't just say whatever is closest to that

And yes I understand you like your webpage and all fam but tone it down a bit will ya

[unborn rampart]

Sure.

[rigid mango]

It's not an issue, it's good

Just like, it's not as simple as that 😄

[unborn rampart]

Fair point

[rigid mango]

I agree 3 eb ss is the bebst but he has 3 kinda mediocre sets

Nothing can really be compared

Also I'd probably go 3 SS tbh

[shut garnet]

that doesnt add up to 6

🤔

[outer lotus]

forgot a blightborne infusion in that lol. thanks, i know my azerite is far from optimal for sin

[rigid mango]

Meh 3 SS is more than fine fam

Just gonna suck a bit on huge pulls

[dense axle]

so how are the sims saying to use Galecallers? on CD with TB?

because if we have coral or another on use trinket it gets weird. I imagine we want to use Coral with Vendetta

[rigid mango]

Do a quick sim and scroll to the bottom

[dense axle]

yes but I'm lazy

[rigid mango]

You don't wanna use it with another on use that isn't font

Font enables double on use, not coral

[dense axle]

hmm, ok

so font+coral or what coral + alchy trinket?

[rigid mango]

I mean tbf u don't wanna use gcb at all

atrocious trink

[cobalt pelican]

there is no specific use for any trinket in the sim besides coral and font

galecallers will just be pressed on cd losing priority to any of the above

[dense axle]

ok, so on CD with TB sounds like it

[shut garnet]

[dense axle]

I'm too old to understand what that meme means

[next solar]

its looking like worldvein + haste is going to be super strong

with stars just being broken lo

[rigid mango]

[dense axle]

I assumed galecallers is only that high because A. no tuning pass yet and B. M+ gear now can get higher than coral and font in ilvl

[rigid mango]

Can't say anything for sure yet

[twilit hollow]

wasn't galecallers simming that high due to simming with infinite stars?

[dense axle]

yeah, I even managed to roll a Tier 3 Stars on some boots

well perfect then

dude, in the EP heroic we did for AP last night, stars was my top damaging ability...over Envenom

for trash and all bosses combined

[next solar]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kDHHwPSRWCRnNbppw24NC3

[rigid mango]

yuh anything that gains more

vers

crit

haste

It'll just want, because of how ridic much dmg it gives

[dense axle]

so our crit% effects stars?

crazy

[rigid mango]

It's really fucking stupid but unless inf stars gets nerfed we're heading into this shit show

[dense axle]

it DID get nerfed...25%

so now it's only double the next one, not triple

[rigid mango]

I'm assuming it works like CLF, vers increases dmg, haste increases ppm, and crit the crit %

and yes I know it got nerfed lol.

[urban junco]

Whewww.

[rigid mango]

And no it's about 6%~ higher than Ev now I think.

EV leading by another 7%~ until the third

iirc

[dense axle]

arg, logged off in my PVP gear, cant check my sims

[cobalt pelican]

should be lash > ev > stars for us post nerf if you have enough time to farm a ton of m+

might be a massive pain in the ass getting a full set compared to just dumping on a tier 3 belt or something though, depends how low the corruption rates are

[dense axle]

wait, just because of dps/corruption? I thought stars was still ahead in pure DPS terms

[cobalt pelican]

if something is ahead in dps/corruption it's ahead in pure dps terms, it just makes it objectively harder to obtain at an appropriate corruption level

[rigid mango]

Aw shit havn't even seen lash of the void

[ebon roost]

are corrupted items dropping from m+ currently? i'm a bit out of the loop.

[rigid mango]

nope

[cobalt pelican]

wait

oh

breath rank 1 was simming like rank 3 aswell for a while like they added the bug

i didn't know that

[rigid mango]

Yeah was whack

[cobalt pelican]

i got rly confused for a bit and thought it was just going to be ultra turbo insane if it was simming this high at rank 1

now it's only going to be baby insane

[dense axle]

we ever goiugn to want it as a major? or just a minor

[true thistle]

welcome

i have one question for m+ this patch

is this atm our top?

[rigid mango]

Is what our top

[true thistle]

cuz atm i am at blood of the enemy

[rigid mango]

Use blood ye

[true thistle]

so for main blood of the enemy, rest stays?

lucid dreams and purification protocols?

for pasives till 4th?

[rigid mango]

Nah vop/strife > pp

[dense axle]

man, I really gotta get my strife going. @rigid mango do you know if I can just farm a chest this week and get 5 more tokens next week in my chest?

I have 1600 rating from season 3, so I'm not sure if I'll need to re-farm that in S4 or if it'll kinda carry over for essence purposes

[rigid mango]

[next solar]

did the ppm on stars also get nerfed?

[rigid mango]

Not afaik

[true thistle]

@rigid mango would you please tell me what vop and strife mean

[next solar]

dh ppm seems significantly lower than rogue for some reason

[rigid mango]

Vision of perfection and conflict and strife

Bleeds can proc it I assume

[next solar]

weird, ive been on this boss training dummy for nearly 5 minutes and it hasn't proccd >.>

[rigid mango]

[true thistle]

thank you senpai

farming rank 3 is like 2resets?

[rigid mango]

which one?

[true thistle]

strive

[rigid mango]

1600 + 3 resets

[next solar]

we're doing our 16 next week then farming 6's

[true thistle]

for m+ azerite beam > blood of the enemy (rank2)

aye?

[cobalt pelican]

yes

[next solar]

forsure, the dmg buff on r3 is what makes it so stronk

[true thistle]

12k/30k atm

if only this honor came from arenas 2v2

[fleet whale]

if you play alliance it isn't so bad

[true thistle]

for the horde

vulpera lifestyle

[dense axle]

so are M+ rewards capped at +6 this week?

then a +15 for the weekly cache next week

[robust gull]

notorius i heard people say stars doesnt proc on training dummies, for whatever reason

[rigid mango]

next week yeah.

[idle ember]

Galecaller is showing pretty high on bloodmallet, I have a 445 but it's still 1200+ lower than my 435 font on sims ... ?

w patchwerk

[urban junco]

They updated the ilvl. That galecaller is 460+.

[rigid mango]

because of infinite stars

[urban junco]

Hah.

That makes sense.

[strange python]

Whats the best AT for assassination rogues atm

[cobalt pelican]

arena tournament

alpha testosterone

[arctic walrus]

arena tactics

[strange python]

Azeroth traits i meant 😄

[versed mica]

is sin rogue decent for visions?

[pulsar cairn]

!Essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[next solar]

yeah im doing a few fights on heroic ep right now, the ppm seems to also have been nerfed

[sweet peak]

has there been any BiS lists released by chance

[rigid mango]

They aren't really a thing so no

[sweet peak]

fair enough

[untold current]

Is there a bug with Breath r1 in the sims? Simming significantly higher than beam or conflict with bote major

Or was that an in game thing?

[cobalt pelican]

there was a bug with it that caused rank1 to function as rank3, it was implemented into the sim cause people didn't know how long it'd take to get fixed

[untold current]

Ahhhh I see

So technically the sim is correct for now

Or was the bug fixed?

[cobalt pelican]

i believe it was fixed both in the sim and in the game as of like

today sometime

are you simming on the nightly build

[untold current]

Yep

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/tQiJpkYMKqwekknrTmqyNB

[cobalt pelican]

weird, not sure if it didn't reach the nightly then or if rank 1 is just that bonkers

could be, the essence is pretty guod

[untold current]

I will find out tonight in raid

[cobalt pelican]

seems like the change didn't make the nightly build to me, looking at my own sims

so i'd recommend playing one of the alternatives and resimming tomorrow for confirmation, or just experiment if you feel like it i guess

[magic fossil]

3rd minor for single?

[rigid mango]

Whatever sims best fam

[stray folio]

Blood mallet shows condensed life force not being best anymore is this true ?

[arctic socket]

Keep it going

[dapper dock]

I thought blizzard lowered the requirements for lucid?

[cobalt pelican]

they did

4800 follower xp

down from 6000

[dapper dock]

Where did they lower it?

Rank 2 still need 3000

Nevermind blizzard has a typo. Quest says 3000 but it's 2400

[near coyote]

Remember when you only had to be better than the other dps in your guild. Now you compete against the world... Feels bad man

[fleet whale]

leeching poison meta for Maut

[safe canyon]

@near coyote unless you're getting fed loyal death and have echoing/stars that isn't happening at this point

[raw lotus]

What major essence does it look like we are running going into this raid teir?

[arctic walrus]

who knows

clf, wv, breath, bote all look good

[raw lotus]

Ive been going back and forth between wv and bote

[lusty narwhal]

are you guaranteed to get a piece of gear from assaults?

[arctic walrus]

No

[lusty narwhal]

Im like the only person in my guild that got nothing rofl

[arctic walrus]

And not guaranteed to corrupt

[lusty narwhal]

robbed.

[cobalt pelican]

what do you get from the handin if not a piece of gear

i thought you always got like a box or some shit

[arctic walrus]

Nothing I think

[cobalt gyro]

visions + resources

and a kick in the nuts if there's no gera

[rancid bobcat]

i got a nice cephalohide equivalent piece from the new uldum assault

[light pebble]

after getting 3rd minor, which setup do u think is best to run for raid?

[light pebble]

how do i sim essences

without hitting the cap

[rigid mango]

Pay money

[strange python]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/

[civic palm]

Also by knowing what is bad and not simming that stuff.

[fervent beacon]

ftw completing a 11 wcm as sin with int offhand dagger and first time playing sin since the launch of bfa.

[digital zodiac]

when should i be using BOTE in my opener?

[cobalt gyro]

usually, once you're in range of the boss

[dire terrace]

so is WV looking to be the new major?

or bote still

[brave vector]

[neon sedge]

For single target CLF is still simming the best for me. What about you guys

[jaunty crystal]

I think it was slightly lower than worldvein for me

Like just 100-200

[arctic walrus]

Will depend on your wv ally count, but yes otherwise clf still wins

[jaunty crystal]

Think I used 4-5

[wooden kiln]

Hello guys, do you think that the Exsanguinate spec can come back in raid or it still won't be any decent? If I remember well, all azerites pieces have a SS trait

[sudden brook]

whos is the sin explainer in here

[quasi pewter]

No

[light pebble]

how good is breath of the undying on assassination as minor for M+?

i just simmed and it seems pretty bad

but people keep on telling me its insane

[quasi pewter]

Thats because its rank 1

[light pebble]

yeah ik, they were saying rank 1 is op though

so idk

[quasi pewter]

It was bugged so it was acting like r3

Its fixed though

[light pebble]

ah ok

[woeful carbon]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[rocky ruin]

Floating Race Flag work

i just brought it and shadowstep work on it again

but it will place at current location so is kinda fucked

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[graceful musk]

!essence

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[runic basin]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[prisma roost]

I'm seeing mixed responses regarding what potions we should be using at the moment for single target, between Unbridled Fury and Focused Resolve. I've been using UF, but I've recently been hearing a lot of people saying Focused Resolve is the way to go now.

[quasi pewter]

you can sim

but most likely still unbridled

[rigid mango]

Dunno why resolve'd suddenly win.

Unless just crit with inf stars

[prisma roost]

lol, haven't been lucky enough to get inf stars

in fact, I have literally only gotten two pieces of loot to drop and both have been azerite pieces.

but thanks for the input. I only asked because the last time I did a quick sim, Raidbots auto selected Focused Resolve so I was like?

[rigid mango]

Should auto select unbridled

[cobalt pelican]

it got changed back to focused resolve

not sure why, could be an oversight from the old profile from t24 start or could just be straight better

not checked any of the potions myself

[prisma roost]

yeah just quick simmed again, definitely on Focused Resolve

once servers are back up I'll see if the regular sim works with my simc copy/paste

[rigid mango]

You can just change it on raidbots

[cobalt pelican]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/r5mMUNLLTQDCfJoWqC6x7W

this is on the stars pad profile

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/m5iNmgxCxZVkMcodMacZdo

[prisma roost]

jesus haha

[cobalt pelican]

and my current shitty gear

seems like focused resolve might just be better with any damage corruptions

for now i'd just recommend using unbridled if you don't kn ow though, it's simple and versatile

[prisma roost]

Yeah I manually changed it now, Unbridled does sim higher for me but only slighly

yup, will do

[cobalt pelican]

can revisit when the tier actually starts

[prisma roost]

for sure, and once I actually get some drops haha

much appreciated, thanks gang

[quasi pewter]

focused resolve should also scale better with gear in general

[onyx crane]

I've been away for a few months have there been big changes to assa ?

[rigid mango]

Nope

[onyx crane]

is it me or is the legendary only good for the raid and vision stuff

[arctic walrus]

I'll take a 500 ilvl cape for a lot of content

[onyx crane]

but stat wise some dung cloaks are better depending on your gear

[minor thicket]

So I’ve been simming my gear I have a pair of 420 pants with corruption that has the perk of mind flay. They are simming higher than my 445 with a socket.

Does this make sense or is it broken

I find it hard to believe

[onyx crane]

maybe some corruption perks are op

[minor thicket]

Yes their are OP ones

But mind flay isn’t one of them

[gray solar]

ofc its better

[arctic walrus]

Yes and you rolled one of them

[gray solar]

they want you to use the new system

[minor thicket]

Why would it be better it’s significantly lower Ilvl compared to 445 with socket

[cobalt pelican]

because it hits hard

dam

magic

[arctic walrus]

There are literally no cape drops anymore Khululy

[minor thicket]

Gotcha

[arctic walrus]

You won't find someone running a cloak -45 levels because it doesn't have haste on it lol

[rigid mango]

Think of them like benthic now

Just that every slot has a chance to get benthic

[minor thicket]

Gotcha ok

[dusky tinsel]

Be farming for stars like mad before raid next week

[rigid mango]

Meh other effects seem very good too

[arctic walrus]

Mindflay was +600 dps on my dk of all things, 420 vs 450 socket

[cobalt pelican]

we're all moonkin spriest hybrids now

woo

[arctic walrus]

shit's strong, all there is to it

[surreal solar]

Mindflay is doing wonders for my M+ tanks dps (not to mention my own) they’re probably going to hit Infinite Stars again soon

[arctic walrus]

infinite stars, echoing void, and mindflay are all very strong

however I don't see mindflay getting nerfed, maybe just for the high haste classes

[surreal solar]

Mind flay just doesn’t have an enormous proc rate like stars does, echoing is the health cone right?

[tropic ocean]

echoing void might be superior on cleave as well

if u dont desperately need st

[surreal solar]

If they’ve fixed echoing so it does proc, I need to find some pieces

[rigid mango]

Just make it not proc off of shit like sprint/sap/shroud etc

dumb af

[surreal solar]

Wait, it can drop off of sprint? That’s hilarious

[outer lotus]

Yea echoing void is dumb like that right now

[rigid mango]

It's unusably in m+ unless you have a 2nd rogue without it

[outer lotus]

Blinked on my mage in the uldum hub and hit horde with echoing void and guards killed me

[surreal solar]

I accidentally poke people in uldum all the time, thank the world for vanish cause I’m not even trying there’s just so many sitting on things

[unkempt solstice]

The keep moving this tiome up by an hour.

they really screwed up this patch, apparently.

[brittle lantern]

all those poor QA people

[deep solstice]

bnet is up

servers not yet tho

Lots of minors simming within 100 dps of eachother for me, so def seems like it will be pretty gear dependant for now. IE no cut and dry best 3rd yet.

(well, prob purification in nyalotha)

[cobalt pelican]

don't see many worlds you don't play execute minor as your last

[deep solstice]

ya once it's rank 3 it will be leagues ahead

[cobalt pelican]

i think even before you'd need a pretty specific gear setup where the extra 10 corruption res does nothing to have anything else compete

[deep solstice]

ya for sure, it's close enough dpswise to be worth it if it gets you to a corruption breakpoint

at rank 1

[unkempt solstice]

hopefully there rebalancing the 2 really broken corruption affix's :

[deep solstice]

ya if they bring echo and stars in line with the rest, I wont have to feel so bad about my rank 2 deadly momentum belt

360 extra crit would feel great if there werent stupidly op alternatives

[surreal solar]

I’ve got a rank one mind flay and everything else I’ve gotten feels really meh

[deep solstice]

the mind flay does nice damage, but proc rate seemed way too low on ptr. still feel the same on live?

[surreal solar]

It’s about once a fight on trash, sometimes more, on bosses it’s like 1-3 every minute

[deep solstice]

hmm, that isnt terrible ST then. .. ~3k dps

with any luck

[surreal solar]

The pally tank I run M+ with has a rank 3 one, it comes out to 20% of his dps overall

[deep solstice]

ya for tanks the effects are huge. There are a few way better ones for tanks tho

IE echoing void is even more broken for tanks, the one that does a beam is really solid too

I think it's base 18% of their health? b

[gusty mirage]

unless they changed it, it should be 1.5% of their total health

[left moth]

do we know which 3 azerite pieces we want for raid?

they all look terrible tbh

[arctic walrus]

possibly slithering loa, then 2 from last 2

[deep solstice]

echoing void is 1.5% rank 2 2.5% rank 3

I am talking about the void beam one, it's a higher % but doesnt stack

For raid you will want the raid pieces, they have good traits for sin and outlaw, and chest/shoulder are higher ilvl than anything else you can get (though mythic version may not be obtainable for most for a while yet)

[left moth]

are the traits good tho? we get 2 np from last 2 bosses with dd and ss

doesnt sound good to me

[deep solstice]

heart of darkness is actually pretty good. You'd take that over second NP

[oblique smelt]

Doing a 19 Tol'dagor tonight. Going with a BM hunter and a Balance druid, just wanted to get a better idea of what kinda setup i should run. (i havent done many high keys in BFA) Found a video from Dratnos, hes running SS traits, CT, Toxic blade. He says that he could have run Exsanguinate to kill ghuunies (yea bit old video). Do i still wanna run a setup like that but with Exsanguinate since no ghuunies. Or should i just trust in the others to do a lot more aoe damage and just run single target setup to kill bosses? i know last boss can be a bastard for healing

[rigid mango]

Just very mediocre kinda.

[gusty mirage]

don't use exsang

[rigid mango]

+1

[deep solstice]

ya it's boring, but even the heroic nzoth one gives.....248 passive secondary stats. It's fine. not amazing but, good enough value.

[oblique smelt]

Thought so

[gusty mirage]

CT would be the play imo, because the extra ST dps you'd get from PB wouldn't make or break a run

and you'd kill trash significantly faster

[oblique smelt]

Thinking blood major? ( think i saw it in pins)

[rigid mango]

Blood + lucid vision/strife

[gusty mirage]

as long as its rank 3 its the play, if not go iris

[rigid mango]

Slap CT on there, stack SS and EB traits

[gusty mirage]

giga aoe dps

[deep solstice]

Man,. . I just did a droptimizer for heroic next week....Feels bad that Azerite and weapons are the only real upgrades without corruptions

[outer lotus]

just get sockets 4head

[gusty mirage]

@outer lotus

[deep solstice]

ya RNG the heck out of it

[oblique smelt]

Alright thanks guys. One more question can the sand traps on first boss be cloaked? like can i clear a bunch with cloak. I could see my group struggling with that

[deep solstice]

yes, you can cloak them

but if everyone is stacking on tank they arent really a problem

[outer lotus]

save cloak for upheaval though

[gusty mirage]

imo you'd be better off with your tank clearing extra trash outside (esp w/ teeming) for more room

and saving cloak

[deep solstice]

you can do it without clearing the extra trash if people are stacked. Easy to accidentally pull the parasites though

[oblique smelt]

We don't normally do high keys, we just doing a 19 this week for a 15 key in chest next week. And lets say the healer and the 2 other dps aren't top tier players

[gusty mirage]

yeah def clear extra trash outside then

gives you more room for error & to move around

[rigid mango]

I mean if you just care about the shit for next week

just play round killing the bosses

Shit timing it wont matter

[final dust]

@oblique smelt That might be wrong

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/622138539886510110/667941970605244456/QPOcU45yARCARSAQSgUQgEUgEfrkI1EL3u0NAQW3ypXgY7Y9b0YSUHL8ZlAAAAABJRU5ErkJggg.png

[rigid mango]

Slap PB on there instead of CT

[oblique smelt]

Yea we aren't planning on timing it, if we do well then we take it

[gusty mirage]

puggin a +20? time to kill myself @final dust

[final dust]

I would say to do a 20 just to be safe

[gusty mirage]

wow tagged the wrong person lol

[oblique smelt]

Yea i have seen that wording change now, and then others are saying that they changed it again so that you get a 15 for doing a 19 this week

[gaunt yew]

[gusty mirage]

@gaunt yew I'm sorry

[final dust]

@oblique smelt Ye ai know I saw the other post I was just saying to make sure you get the 15 u want I would do a 20

[pliant apex]

for raid purposes, i should be fine running subterfuge right?

[gusty mirage]

you should only run subterfuge if you're using SS @pliant apex

[oblique smelt]

We had a group do a 20 this week, so we will have at least 5 15 keys next week which can be spread out across a lot of people. And with some HC gear the 15's would probably be easier (a lot of us have timed 15's before)

[gusty mirage]

no other reason to, esp in raid

[pliant apex]

@gusty mirage even single SS ok right?

[gusty mirage]

yeah with 1 SS you use subterfuge to maximize the empowered garrotes

[rigid mango]

SS is suboptimal but fine.

for raid

[oblique smelt]

Does tricks still redirect threat in the cannon? still watching Dratnos' guide

[gusty mirage]

yeah it does

[oblique smelt]

op

[gusty mirage]

just don't do what I did my first time back in 8.2 and cannon the enchanted emissary

[oblique smelt]

i've done that before

[onyx crane]

when did double dose and nothing personal not became BiS traits?

[rigid mango]

They are?

[onyx crane]

idk

I am so out of the loop idk what's up or down anymore

[rigid mango]

So what's your question exactly

[onyx crane]

eh nvm all these different guides with conflicting information are confusing me

[daring basalt]

sin still viable for raiding in 8.3 ?

[rigid mango]

Nope the 0 changes to the spec made it entirely unviable for all content

[tropic ocean]

@oblique smelt next week 15s will be around 19ish key lvl this week so it wont be as easy if u just did 15s 😛

[rigid mango]

Think new raid HC gear was implied to be the reasoning for its "ease".

[daring basalt]

Sounds good

[pliant apex]

@rigid mango is SS is suboptimal for raid, whats ideal

[rigid mango]

DD NP Loyal Blightborne etc

That'd be a filtered word, don't use that one 😉

[pliant apex]

is sin best for raiding this patchj

[worthy moon]

My bad =X Collapsing Void is really dumb.

[rigid mango]

Idk fam ask me when we've actually seen the raid

[worthy moon]

Got 445 legs with terrible stats that replaced my 455 BiS stats with socket

5k DPS increase ST

[rigid mango]

Welcome to corruption my dude

Benthic+

[strange python]

I hope I get void ritual on every piece

[rigid mango]

Grindable RNG benthic, get used to it.

[stable nest]

any of the new essences good in m+?

[arctic walrus]

rank 3 breath will probably be as universal as rank 3 lucid

[wary ice]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[next solar]

Yup. Gonna be grinding 6s after we do our 15s. Still waiting to do more sims after raidbots updates for stars nerf

[dry galleon]

if crucible sims the highest for me how would i use it, just on cd or any special way like using it when i have master assassin procced

[royal lantern]

master assassin is for rogue abilitys only

doesnt work with trinkets etc...

[halcyon falcon]

anyone know if Master Assassin is going to remain BIS or subterfuge and SS traits are going to swap to the top?

[next solar]

We won’t know

[halcyon falcon]

figured it was too early

[wispy iron]

!essences

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[onyx crane]

how good is Inkpod for assa

[cobalt pelican]

medium good

[hidden bridge]

Why is wrathion trinket so bad x_x

i just wanna be able to use it

[civic palm]

Is it?

[hidden bridge]

its not great

[onyx crane]

is hear of darkness worth getting once?

[tropic ocean]

[strange python]

Hey guys, what is best pvp build for BGs? Is it assassination?

[cobalt pelican]

probably yes

[hidden bridge]

I'm getting a lot of mixed signals from logs. Some people let garrote and rupture fall off during their opener and reapply like .5-2s after they drop

And some people refresh at like 2-3s left

Does it really matter which one I do

Is getting another envenom better than refreshing your dots?

Or is it such a small delta that I can do whatever

Also not sure to what extent the loyal to the end cheese stuff is contributing to these differences

[cobalt pelican]

there's no good reason for your bleeds to drop during the opener, the original garrote and rupture cover the entire tb window

and a single envenom inside vendetta is.. not worth either bleed falling

[hidden bridge]

And to clarify I should have like ~20s of time between vendettas that I can delay toxic blades to make sure I don't have to refresh bleeds during the duration of TB right?

Since I can only get 4 toxic blades off between vendettas

Or is it better to get 5 toxic blades off and not worry about dot refreshing interference and delay vendetta by like 5-6s

[cobalt pelican]

the first sentence reads really confusing to me

like, the fight doesn't end the second you use 2nd vend

you'd need to measure to exact fight length to see how much wiggle room you have on tbs but that's just not realistic

tb shouldn't really ever be delayed if you're not super confident with how long the fight is lasting, and that rule takes priority over all others

[hidden bridge]

I meant it as a 'do you delay some TB's for optimal usage so that it lines up exactly for your next vendetta'

[cobalt pelican]

no

[hidden bridge]

Or just TB on cd and delay vendetta

[cobalt pelican]

delay vend

[hidden bridge]

If I have rupture falling off in like 8s and my TB is up

Is it better to just TB and refresh during

Or wait for the refresh

[cobalt pelican]

press tb, refresh rupture as needed

generally you can like

leave rupture till the last few seconds to see

and you'll run into situations where you know for example

i have 5cp, tb is still rolling and i know i'll be able to get a rupt refresh with only like 0.11111 seconds downtime on it if i fire envenom first

and in niche cases like that yeah sure go for it

but those sorts of things are like

very very very very very much unimportant compared to consistently doing the basics right

[hidden bridge]

I feel like a lot of the niches will be less important as crit goes up too

I have a lot of times where I could, for example, get an envenom off, but rupture is falling off in say 2s

[civic palm]

That's still very random, even @ 50% crit.

[hidden bridge]

so I either risk the envenom inside say TB or EP, and hope I get a 4cp mutilate

Or just refresh and miss the envenom

And I'm struggling figuring out which decisions are correct in these niche scenarios

Cause It's really hard to tell which does more damage over a whole fight

[cobalt pelican]

you can refresh rupt below 4 if you really need to

it's not something that's normally advocated but like

[civic palm]

You don't track your Crit, don't rely on it.

[cobalt pelican]

the damage doesn't change and you can roll forward the lowcp with a proceeding rupture

[civic palm]

You can Garrote ~> Rupture after a TB window easily enough.

[cobalt pelican]

but you just need to understand that envenoms inside tb are not the be all end all of rogue dps, you'll frequently run into tb windows like this

where envenom is like what,

<50% of the nature damage inside tb

[hidden bridge]

Yeah. I'm probably trying to learn too many different scenarios

Probably best to just get more experience first

[cobalt pelican]

so if you're sacrificing any general energy income/tick damage for it it's generally a loss

[hidden bridge]

So I have a better understanding of how things can line up

[cobalt pelican]

that's why while there ARE definitely gains in niche scenarios they're like

the last thing to worry about

and something you just generally get used to by playing a lot

[hidden bridge]

Yea, makes sense. Thanks

[empty badge]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[true fulcrum]

!essences

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd

[hidden bridge]

One quick thing tho, is it bad to TB at 5 cp?

[civic palm]

Not really no.

[hidden bridge]

If i'm like 30% energy and TB is coming up in like 2s

It seems like it might be worth to just store energy

And TB at 5

[civic palm]

You're better off going into TB with 5CP than going into TB with 0CP.

[hidden bridge]

Gotcha

[civic palm]

Well, 1-2 from TB.

[hidden bridge]

And having energy to actually use inside TB

What do you guys use for gcd?

[civic palm]

A bar.

[hidden bridge]

a WA?

Or what addon

[cobalt pelican]

normal actionbars show the gcd fine

since every single ability starts spinning

[hidden bridge]

I hide my actionbars xD

[cobalt pelican]

you can add the same effect to weakauras i think

[civic palm]

grey bar

[hidden bridge]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[hidden bridge]

Is that one of these?

[civic palm]

Guess :3

[hidden bridge]

I'll just scalp the WA

[cobalt pelican]

dam

[hidden bridge]

Oh

[cobalt pelican]

yoinked

[hidden bridge]

You're mizerok

ROFL

im just gonna borrow the gcd bar

[civic palm]

Take it :3

[hidden bridge]

I've been using a modified version of one of those

Added a health bar

Where should I put gcd 🤔

[civic palm]

You want it somewhere near your energy to consolidate information.

[hidden bridge]

I can probably stick it right under

[civic palm]

So just move the g/r/e/tb/v bar down a little and slap it there.

ezpz

By like, 3 pixels.