assassination

[rigid mango]

(:

Have fun

[vast forum]

not sure if to play assa or outlul on it

[rigid mango]

Unsure tbh

I don't think I'll be there on sunday

[vast forum]

[rigid mango]

I need break

[distant lava]

go full EB yoppa

ez clap

[rigid mango]

And if neither dajkz nor loki is there

[vast forum]

i don't have EB azerite

[rigid mango]

[vast forum]

actually i could go 2xEB 2xSoB

which could be good for constant 4 targets

[rigid mango]

I suppose?

[distant lava]

SoB

[rigid mango]

Sob still seens underwhelming

Ngl

[celest swan]

i want to play assa on orgo now aswell

hade progress last week

[distant lava]

don't , this fight is so good for outlaw

[celest swan]

and now it feels jsut bad 😄

[vast forum]

ashvane helm, radiance shoulders

both are sob/eb

[distant lava]

ashvane helm If I bonus loot that this week

I'm killing myself

[celest swan]

ye ofc djamax, but it felt really bad to get hit by the nerf in progress

[distant lava]

and a few guildies in the process

[vast forum]

mdi fucked up outlaw 😄

just like zul fucked up sub

[distant lava]

just go do keys you'll still be top dog

[arctic walrus]

Is there any weakaura that can pop up when target is around 30% for inkpod/coral

[vast forum]

you can make a WA to trigger when target is under 32% hp or smt

[cobalt pelican]

ya should be really easy to make one

just two triggers, one for <= 31% hp and one for <= 29.5% hp or some shit that sets the opacity to 0

actually seems like you can just use conditions for it

[civic palm]

Yep.

[noble vale]

what are the boys doing on Zaqul? just palying outlaw? lol

i cant meme triple EB it untiol we atleast kill it once

[civic palm]

You put the pointy ends into the boss.

[ancient onyx]

if you're not playing assa on zaqul you're literally trolling

[noble vale]

oh thank jesus

they see the parses and want me to do outlaw

[prisma cypress]

what is proper trinket use with the coral/font combo

[ancient onyx]

perfect example of idiots that cant understand what the logs mean

or how the spec works

[noble vale]

im a very happy boy now

[ancient onyx]

do u have BotE rank 3 tho?

[noble vale]

yeah

[ancient onyx]

you're good then

[noble vale]

save ven and BOME for add when i go down?

[ancient onyx]

yeeee

[noble vale]

gracias muchacho

hmmmm, you think pp for 3rd minor on this?

[dapper plover]

i just spend 140 pearls to get akanas

lets go

[noble vale]

oh i see most boy sare running reduced ven

[prisma cypress]

anyone know how i should be using coral and font with respect to vendetta

[ancient onyx]

check pins

[frosty obsidian]

!potion

[civic palm]

beep boop

UF

[sour wasp]

unbridled

i'm a bot beep boop

[rare pond]

can you evasion barb on m behemoth?

[civic palm]

You can Cloak it.

nothing in the flags that says that you Cannot Dodge it though.

This ability can be negated via immunities, such as Aspect of the Turtle, Cloak of Shadows, Ice Block ect, however all players within the beam will still take damage.

[crisp hollow]

what pot do we use for ST?

[civic palm]

UF

[sour wasp]

literally 2 lines above

[crisp hollow]

nice

[slender urchin]

If envenom gets parried do you still get the envenom buff?

[civic palm]

Nope.

easy enough to test though, just mash a training dummy from the front and see

[arctic walrus]

You keep the energy and cp though

[civic palm]

and the bad feelings.

Just don't get your TB parried.

O _O

[cobalt pelican]

dummies dont have parry hacks

like the bosses do

[civic palm]

They're also not FAT.

[crystal vessel]

for SS with garrote, do I want to pandemic my vanish double garrote with the opener one? for vendetta buff? or let it fall completely and then double garrote?

[civic palm]

Usually.

Always let Empowered Garrotes (from Subterfuge) expire unless you are applying them after Stealth/Vanish.

[crystal vessel]

yeah during initial vendetta, with buffed garrote, I usually vanish with 3-4 seconds left and reapply the double garrote.

for the sub window.

[civic palm]

Let them fall off.

[crystal vessel]

let it drop, then vanish and double. in the new window.

got it

Thanks!

[civic palm]

👍

[honest needle]

is monk buff physical dmg super good for sin rogues ?

cause some 1 said im more bleeds its not good for sin

is that tru

[civic palm]

Look at your damage and find out O _O

[honest needle]

what would it b under

i domnt kno how to find it

[marble elm]

Parry got buffed this patch change my mind

[cobalt pelican]

bleeds are physical damage envenom/poisons need the dh debuff

[marble elm]

Guaranteed parry on 1st side hit with an icd

[cobalt pelican]

if you're raiding just.. have both

[civic palm]

tan bars are physical

[honest needle]

so monk buff is a big increase for us

[civic palm]

Both are.

[noble vale]

is it toxic i just cyclotroniced the other rogue in the raid on zaqul?

it ticks for a lot btw LOL

[civic palm]

Yes.

Very fucking toxic you shitter.

[noble vale]

it was our 2nd pull, i had to do it once lolll

[civic palm]

heh

Zap that shield my dood.

or during Puncture.

[noble vale]

big zapper

[honest needle]

so am i wrong im telling my guild they should put the monk on radiance in the group with the top dps

and they are putting the monk in the opposite group

to me that makes no sense

[civic palm]

top dps doesn't make much sense.

as the dmg needs to be even

[honest needle]

our tank is dieing cause adds are dieing to slow. So by them giving us the monk healer would give us better dps

[vale quest]

Currently w/ the bg week what is best way to farm honor, queue as merc?

[honest needle]

@civic palm

so if are tank is dieing due to adds dieing slow wouldnt that make logical sense when we have top dps and a warrior in our group with execute

to kill add faster ?

[civic palm]

If you need that small amount of damage, then yes.

How far off is the slow group?

[honest needle]

the other group has it dead

when we still have 20 percent left

[civic palm]

Sounds like better balancing would help over worrying about the DH/Monk buffs/debuffs.

Can't hurt though.

[honest needle]

n there telling me its not about my parses mythic is about mechanics

lol

[civic palm]

Unless your healers are not that flexible.

[honest needle]

Im trying to help us kill shit faster

[civic palm]

or at all, in this case.

[wild stone]

Is focused resolve still best

[quasi pewter]

no

generally unbridled fury is best for single target

[honest needle]

@civic palm so with what im telling u doesnt it make sense to put monk for the dmg increase in the weaker group .

Im there top dps in the weaker group n we still cant kill it faster lol

[distant lava]

if you kill it too slow you need every dmg increase

hence putting the monk in your group

or am I understanding this wrong

[civic palm]

I am just saying that it doesn't seem like THE THING you need.

It will help, yes, but it won't make up the missing damage by itself.

[honest needle]

well i asked them to put monk in our group, and they said its about mechanics not my parses lol

[distant lava]

I'm confused

you said

you told them to put the monk in the group with the top dps

yet you're saying you told them to put it in your group , which is the weaker group If I understand correctly

[steel wagon]

How does cloak interract with arcing current on m oragoza

does it just prevent the dmg i take?

[honest needle]

yes im top dps. however our group is killing the add slower @distant lava

so what im trying to ask them is to give us the monk for the dmg increase

[distant lava]

I mean if your officers / RL are stupid you can't really do anything about it 🤷

[hoary apex]

on sivara, if you cloak barrage, does it still pulse damage to the raid?

if you get hit?

[civic palm]

Yeah I think I tried stopping the pulse tuesday and you don't take dmg but the pulse is still there.

IIRC

[ripe portal]

Yarp

[hoary apex]

ugh

[civic palm]

Quit getting hit

[hoary apex]

I want to utilize vendetta time 😦

[civic palm]

Just hold it for a moment if Barrage is coming up.

or just mash, walk out 1/2 the distance, and YOLO the barrage.

[rare pond]

so no

you can't dodge the barb with evasion

on m behemoth

[sudden ocean]

It'

is nature damage

I've delayed vendetta around 8 seconds to get full value in a no barrage no inversion window and it works just fine

[frosty obsidian]

how to open on behemoth

mythic

awkward timing on puffer

[rare pond]

you can choose to just vanish and reopen from the start and save cds from puffer

[slender urchin]

What would you do:
DoTs are good, you've pooled energy, you're at 5 CP. Do you:
(a.) Toxic Blade, waste the CP but get an immediate Envenom
(b.) Envenom, then mut/toxic blade

[civic palm]

No Deal banker.

You TB @ 5.

[slender urchin]

Cool, thanks

[vale quest]

so i just started this patch, how importan tis blood of the enemy?

because i hav not won 1 bg in several hours each day

[sour wraith]

2/2/2 better for m+ or 3 TTk/2 EB/1SS?

[ripe portal]

I'd sim yourself with r3 to ascertain the value. I know for me it loses out to lucid or clf major in ST situations.

[woeful minnow]

bote3 is basically bis until you have clf3

if you already have clf3 you don't have to bother

[keen spruce]

rogue opener with CLF, font, and coral?
I'm currently doing normal MA opener, pre pull font, CLF after first rupture, razor coral when it comes up?

[vale quest]

o i wont have clf3 for a while

[ripe portal]

I'd work on it in that case. Lucid 3 is also pretty strong.

[woeful minnow]

this is THE WEEK to work on it too

with the battleground bonus

[ripe portal]

Yeah

Bite the bullet and grind it out

[woeful minnow]

if you're horde try playing mercenary too for the extra honor

[vale quest]

i been doing that its decent, but i gotta find a premade

[dull osprey]

does blind remove stacks in the red world on Za'qul?

heard taht you could use taht to cheese a ally out of stacks

[lament oak]

What's the consensus on gambling vs waiting for specific for az vendor?

[vapid scarab]

always gamble

[safe sluice]

for M+ is it worth to drop 3x SS + 1 x EB to 2 X SS + 2xEB? Due to ilvl. upgrade from 420 to 430 of 1 of the pieces

[severe bough]

@winter moss u proud of me dad

[noble vale]

thats what i like to see

[drifting cloud]

[noble vale]

once its farm memeing is allowed

[drifting cloud]

looks like a progress wipe

atleast the background looks like orgos upstairs room

[noble vale]

oh deff dont prog as assa memecleave

[severe bough]

@drifting cloud progress wipe

my outlaw gear is ass

mostly azerite

I've tried, i do shit for dmg

[wintry mica]

in mythic+ with echoing blades do you wanna waste combo points to get 3 fans into the master assassin window at the start of the pull?

[civic palm]

in M+ if you have chosen Master Assassin you must leave the dungeon and rethink life.

[wintry mica]

yea thats what i figured

[lime marsh]

Is it safe to refresh subterfuge empowered garrotes, or do you let them fall off before re-upping?

[plain moon]

Does feint work of ashvane bubbles?

I assume so

[civic palm]

@lime marsh Let them fall off unless you are applying them fresh from Stealth.

[tacit wolf]

is there a guide on razor coral use? sorry been away from this disc for a while

[civic palm]

[tacit wolf]

thank you! forgot about those

[honest needle]

is there a trick on behmoth mythic to get to puffer fish faster and back besides shadow step

so i dont lose dps

we do normal rotation on puffer fish on opener with out wasting cds then pop cds once first puffer is dead right

[civic palm]

No tricks.

warlock gate to 2nd platform left pufferfish, step back but not when zap is going off.

[visual quartz]

When fight begins if your wasting your MA out of stealth on puffer that seems wrong lol

I just sit and wait till it dies 😛

[civic palm]

Yeah that sounds smart, why have 5cp first thing on the boss when you can maybe crit once or twice.

Could be better.

Dunno.

[visual quartz]

I dunno, for parses yeah. but now all your shit is mid proc and counting down when you hop on boss, feels bad when I do it

[civic palm]

Considering we're talking about Behemoth, parsing is basically that fight.

[vale quest]

does anyone have a tip for farming blood?

like a specific bg to queue

or something special

This is getting uninstall worthy

so other than blood and the elemental what is a good major to use

[quasi ledge]

Lucid or Crucible

[civic palm]

Lucid or Crucible for... president?

[vale quest]

how much lower dps are they than blood?

% wise

[quasi ledge]

I mean, literally replying to a question above

But you know

[civic palm]

I do, trying to figure out when Crucible would ever be the pick.

Without knowing what ranks someone has giving advice is useless.

[vale quest]

i have blood rank 2, i ain getting 3 for years

[civic palm]

and where's your Condensed Life Force, Crucible, Lucid, Iris?

just look at this, real simple.

Lucid Major is going to cause you drop a TON of Haste however.

[daring cave]

So in the guide it has old MA way and New MA way for rotation, which one would i go with rotation wise

[civic palm]

Newer is usually better without context.

[honest needle]

wait so on fish boss mythic u guys just sit stealth till puffer is dead then go boss

[civic palm]

Fuck no.

[honest needle]

wont u get taken out of stealth if u dont start on puffer fish

[daring cave]

ok so i wanna mul, rup mul garr

[civic palm]

Hit the pufferfish

[strange python]

how do i know the best benthic gear?

[civic palm]

Dump into it, you're getting your energy back from Rupture being on it when it dies anyway, leave it with 5CP.

@strange python

[honest needle]

so dont use any finishers on puffer at all ?

[civic palm]

What no, don't use CDs, Rupture is a finisher.

[honest needle]

just mut rup mut gar and then hold it ?

[heavy trail]

WHy is curse updating my regular wow with classic addons, breaking my regular ones

[civic palm]

mut mut rupture gar spam mut till it dies, move to boss with 5CP and max NRG, Rupture Garrote CLF Ven Vanish GO

[honest needle]

so just spam mut even if im at 5 combo pts ?

[civic palm]

It shouldn't take 20 seconds to die.

[honest needle]

i usually fit in 2 finishers before it died

[civic palm]

refresh rupture if it is

[honest needle]

dies

[civic palm]

use cyclotronic on puffers

[honest needle]

2 envenoms

[civic palm]

etc.

[honest needle]

o i shouldnt save that for boss ?

[fleet anchor]

I'd always recommend just using Raidbots Top Gear for simming Essence options

There are a lot of odd points depending on gear/trinkets/stats where certain combos win out

[civic palm]

I hit my quota for Raidbots promotions tonight so it gets no more.

[fleet anchor]

Haha RIP

[civic palm]

It's still the better choice of course.

[honest needle]

@civic palm so if rup and gar are on target just spam mut even if its at 5 pts untill its dead and hold it to rup gar boss. then do normal opener ?

[strange python]

bfa guid up to date for azerite thingys

?

[civic palm]

Depends on how long it takes your potatoes to kill the puffer man, remember that the buff has a good range so you can leave a few percent earlier.

[honest needle]

so use cyclonic on puffer

dont save it for boss ?

for after vendetta window ?

[quasi ledge]

Just play like normal on puffer, making sure it dies/you leave with 5 combo points. You can spam away all your energy as you'll get it back when it dies

[civic palm]

Don't burn CDs on puffer O _O the boss is the thing that needs to die.

[honest needle]

so save mech trinket for boss

instead of puffer

[civic palm]

I already told you what to do.

[honest needle]

Im just gonna mut mut rup gar then hold it the whole time till its dead

u said use blast some 1 else said not to

so im trying to find out what right

[open hazel]

whats the go to build for assa pvp right now?

[quasi ledge]

Pretend it's a boss, just don't use any CD's on it. Spam away all your energy and leave it with 5 combo points. That's it

[honest needle]

I was doing mut mut rup gar then jsut envenom rinse repeat till its dead. then do normal opener on boss without being stealth obviously

I didint kno if i was doing it wrong

[civic palm]

If you got your important CDs on the boss and didn't spent 20 seconds swimming there, you're probably fine.

[final dust]

Anyway to sim with neck 65 and 3 essences?

[civic palm]

Also refresh Rup/Garr before going to puffer and transitions.

[honest needle]

even if its not at pandemic window ?

its ok to refresh early

[civic palm]

You wanna let your bleeds drop?

o _O

Weird.

Pretty sure that's in the guide somewhere.

[strange python]

socket must have in benthic gear?

i guess?

[civic palm]

Basically

[strange python]

bis talent doesnt matter i guess

noo need to waste pearls?

[civic palm]

No you should not use the bad Benthic gear.

[strange python]

aight

[honest needle]

why are so many people using iris minor for me lucid minor sims higher

I was confused i saw alot of people running iris on most bosses

[balmy quest]

Well a lot of people who have hit 65 now are running iris as their 3rd minor.

Or are you talking about people without 65 as well?

[honest needle]

so with only 2 we should do clf aND lucid minor right

untill we get 65 neck

[balmy quest]

for single target that is usually the best for most people, but sim yourself to check

some fights aren't pure single target though

where blood and lucid can cleave multiple targets

[strange python]

Iris for ST PP probably for MT

[balmy quest]

so depending on what your team needs it might be worth while switching your major out

[honest needle]

ya i dont have blood

so i just been using clf for all fights

[balmy quest]

blood isn't really worth until rank 3 anyway

and usually there are better classes to do add damage than sin rogue with iris

so I always run CLF too

[honest needle]

should i invest time into getting blod

blood do i really need it

[civic palm]

Kinda late IMO, good 2nd minor though.

[honest needle]

or can i get away without it

[balmy quest]

You can get away without it. It is good for other content like M+ though so I'd recommend slowly grinding it out. Your first win of the day BG gives you bonus honour so some people just do that each day to work towards rank 3 blood.

[strange python]

Merc mode also. Hella Honor

[celest swan]

hey i guys think it worth it to play Shadow over Rogue on Azshara Mythic (Rogue has bit better Gear but both full benthic, i play them on the same level)

[winter moss]

play the class your raid needs the most

[rich lily]

pah, play the class you like to play the most, fuck the raid 😄

[honest needle]

do u also get honor from doing invasions in warmode right

[rich lily]

no honor

[winter moss]

conquest

[honest needle]

so whats the point of doing invasions in warmode

ahhh ok

[knotty kindle]

and more ap

[last basin]

can you farm bote honor in rbgs?

[merry sparrow]

yes

I know they're not optimal but between scent of blood and swirling sands what traits do you guys think its better for m+?

[winter moss]

swirling sands

[merry sparrow]

ty

[vestal abyss]

why is nothing personal so good? it scales with versatility where of which we should have very little

[winter moss]

making you main cd that enhances dmg

also do dmg

dmg + dmg = dmg²

[zenith hatch]

it deals like 900k dmg if used 3x in fight on its own

[vestal abyss]

oh okay

but its still worse than double dose right

[winter moss]

in doubt

[vale quest]

i somehow got 10k honor toda

[vestal abyss]

meh i dont have any gear to sim yet but im just bored at work

[winter moss]

thats why i copy a /simc in a pastebin before i log off

to not be bored at work

[balmy quest]

Guys I got Gorak Tul's yesterday (3rd roll) and finally a good log on Ashvane I'm so happy

[fossil forge]

Do u guys use CLF off cooldown of save for vendetta

[placid dawn]

pins

[tropic ocean]

@fossil forge using on cd, saving to line up with vendetta if its the last of the fight(so I can't get another in)

[bold elk]

does my rpture refresh change with more haste? or is it static at 7.2 seconds remaining at 5 combo points, or 6 seconds remaining at 4 combo points?

[tropic ocean]

duration doesn't change with haste

[bold elk]

oke

thanks

[tropic ocean]

it ticks faster iirc?

[rigid mango]

Yeah it does

[vestal abyss]

it ticks faster but the duration stays the same?

[rigid mango]

Yep

[crystal pilot]

does anyone actually use CT? seems pretty bad imo

[rigid mango]

It's just not good enough

In a world where EB is a thing, it just doesn't see use

[crystal pilot]

i've never actually used it

just had it applied on me in wpvp so i was curious

[rigid mango]

It was used in s1, and I've seen very niche usage of it nowadays

[topaz vine]

Not gonna complain about having bad trinkets anymore 😆

[crystal pilot]

uhh yeah

thats pretty batshit

[topaz vine]

XD

[summer marten]

not even 455, vendor it

[topaz vine]

Yeah. Gonna go back to my 415 lurker. My guild miss healing me all the time 😆

[strange python]

is it worth stacking echoing blades for mythic+ or is 1 trait fine?

[tropic ocean]

depends on dungeon affix

but usually 2+

personally I use 2/2/2 and switch for kr/tos to less eb, and more eb in fortified or fortified/teeming non kr/tos key

[strange python]

2/2/2?

[tropic ocean]

2eb 2ss 2ttk

(echoing blades, shrouded suffocation, twist the knife)

[strange python]

cool thanks

[pale cave]

best traits for pvp?

for essences i went Condensed + BotE

[lucid yew]

not sure about traits but I saw people going for Conflict + lucid dream in 2v2 arena

and 3s ofc

[pale cave]

hmmm

looking

lucid makes sense you can really run yourself dry if you aren't smart

Assessing my talents, azerite traits, essences for pvp

[lucid yew]

I'd suggest you to check Tmpikaboo-Tichondrius

[pale cave]

i found this
https://www.worldofwargraphs.com/pvp-stats/azerite/rogue/assassination

what do you mean check him out? In what way?

where ?

[rigid mango]

#pvp

Is where you want to go for pvp stuff regarding rogue

[pale cave]

ah!

[rigid mango]

sin specific too 😄

[pale cave]

cool, thanks guiys

[obtuse ruin]

I just realized there actually isn’t a single azerite item with shroud echo and overwhelming power combination. Wtf

[rigid mango]

Quite specific

There's only one helm with ss and eb afaik

Fluid machinations is the only one with the specific combo

[obtuse ruin]

Don’t think it’s got overwhelming tho

[rigid mango]

It doesn't afaik

But if you're running that build you're honestly better off going flames 😄

[obtuse ruin]

Maybe but if I want to go the full pad build triple ss triple echo I’ll have 0 overwhelming

Feelsbad 😂

[rigid mango]

I mean if you're going full pad

You want flames anyways

More crit for 3 eb = better than op

[obtuse ruin]

True

[atomic willow]

so if your gonna run sin on mythic orgoza cuz you don't have outlaw weapon would you run something similar to the TTK build......like ideally 3 EB 2 TTK and 1 NP? Then after all bleeds are up you just span FoK and pump envenoms into the boss?

[rigid mango]

I think you just run 3 eb and as many ss as possible

fill in with the rest accordingly

Depends on your group, though

[drifting cloud]

sin aoe build is atrocious for orgo

you do same boss dmg as tanks

using it on prog is straight up inting your guild imo

[rigid mango]

The guy w rank 1 log did same as a boomy

and not far ebhind everyone else

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/d4RgNaBnHWbF7ztJ#fight=5&type=damage-done&translate=true&target=100

I don't think it's that bad

[drifting cloud]

its probably better if you play sub no joke

I just dont see a scenario where this would ever be the go to thing to do that would help your guild the most

[rigid mango]

if you lack add damage it's for sure viable

[bright smelt]

do we have any idea how much value the pufferfish effect on wrists actually have? If it compares to 10ilvl or something

[rigid mango]

It's about the same as frost damage

[bright smelt]

just managed to get a soc pair but not sure when to replace

[rigid mango]

+- rng

[drifting cloud]

viable sure, it just looks good on meters, doesnt seem to acomplish much

[rigid mango]

ofc it does, if you have ST pumpers

I don't see a reason it's that bad

[drifting cloud]

its just a worse version of outlaw in every way?

[rigid mango]

After nerfs, unsure tbh

[drifting cloud]

and then at the end when you ignore adds

you are playing what st with 5 aoe azerite traits?

[lone mirage]

Guys is it make sensei for you to replace 1ss and one ttk by doubledose and nothing personnel? For tyrannical week

Ive now 3ss 2 eb 1ttk

[rigid mango]

No.

You don't ever want dd nor np for m+

[lone mirage]

Ok thanks!

[bright smelt]

the haste is pretty much useless and energy regen you get via ven. wounds when you have dots up

[rigid mango]

Swapping 7k add damage for 3k boss damage @drifting cloud

[bright smelt]

and DD is just shit

[rigid mango]

in that case, anyways

I don't think it's as bad as you're making it out to be

[bright smelt]

unless pure single which 75%+ of dungeon isnt

[rigid mango]

if used in the right comp, it's fine

[drifting cloud]

I think its the worse option a rogue can offer on that boss

[rigid mango]

I think it's atleast equal if your comp allows you to

[faint harness]

Just wait until MDI comes back and 3 outlaw is on the menu

[rigid mango]

[faint harness]

its what the have planned their routes around

they might test new shit, but in the end, i think they'll stick to outlaw

[rigid mango]

We're not talking m+

[faint harness]

HUH

[rigid mango]

Orgozoa.

[faint harness]

Oh

just play sbu

sub

[rigid mango]

Yeah

[faint harness]

(:

[rigid mango]

noty

I will on some reclear in a monht or smth

idk, I think atleast for me

We're gonna be lacking add damage and I'll probs play that degen shit

[drifting cloud]

but just go sub then

[faint harness]

Sub for add dmg?

[drifting cloud]

who am I kidding, sub in 2019

[faint harness]

I did orgozoa as sub yday

actually

topping boss dmg, hulk dmg and joint bottom on zoatroids

[dire spoke]

cool

[faint harness]

its def doable (:

The logs for assa seems to just be full on add dmg

[rigid mango]

Most aye

I'm thinking dropping all DD and just foking to build

not going the degen eb build but just ignoring muti most fight

[faint harness]

go bleed build?

and spread em

[rigid mango]

might go 1 SoB

[faint harness]

an old guildie of mine is doing EB/SoB build

[rigid mango]

Aye I mean I might do that too

[faint harness]

is that the degen build

[rigid mango]

it's sorta down to what we need

Yeah, that's the degen build 😄

[drifting cloud]

its basically like ele shaman

some of them do 15 mil to adds

some of them do under 5 and do 45k to boss

except here youre swapping azerite

[faint harness]

they just swap talents

[rigid mango]

Yeah idm

[faint harness]

[atomic willow]

THANKS ....we are lacking add dmg so thinking i will throw a cpl EB and SoB in there

[faint harness]

might try assa next orgozoa kill tbh

with the scuffed bleed build

[rigid mango]

yah unsure what i'll play

Outlaw is more or less just as good as doing boss damage even after nerfs

It's just add damage that will lack

and sicne we had 4x we need to reshape comp

[cobalt pelican]

if you actually have 4 outlaws like

even after the nerfs

the ads will always die in time

unless something is severely wrong

[rigid mango]

Nah I mean like, I think max 2 of them are staying outlaw

neither is me

I know for a fact my outlaw was very underwhelming and that I'm going sin

Just more about what I'm doing as sin

[sacred rock]

Sorry for interupting, but I am a fairly new to Sin and I was wondering if there is currently a large gap between MA and Subterfuge builds?

[dense cedar]

Not really

MA is better

but only by a bit IIRC

This might've changed tho

[rigid mango]

MA is better, but not by far ye

Generally better for raiding

[sacred rock]

I dont really raid M, so its more for a bit of relaxed fun with my Ragtag HC gGuild , but I do prefer subterfuge. Thanks for the answers 🙂

[drifting cloud]

yeah its like a 1% dps loss if even that much

can be less if you have some really weird azerite pieces

[crisp steppe]

Main thing for me with subterfuge is that it delays ur second vendetta s etc by 20 sec

Or u skip out on first vanish

[drifting cloud]

I have the stupid ss/siphon chest and MA+siphon and subt+ss sims +-50 dps for me

[crisp steppe]

That can end up being pretty sizeable. Or not matter at all

[faint harness]

depends on kill times

as yuzh

[sacred rock]

Our kill times are not exactly short :/

[peak musk]

are only 2DD traits enough for the "m r m g"-opner?

[rigid mango]

Yep

It's not about DD that much though, it's more about efficiently using your MA window

[peak musk]

hmm kk, thx ... was searching but haven't found anything 🙂

[prime geode]

is crimson tempest on fortified weeks worth it ?

[rigid mango]

Nope

In a world where EB is a thing CT is just meh

[arctic walrus]

What makes haste so good when you run your friendly neighborhood rock

[rigid mango]

The minor PPM and Major attacks

are both affected by haste

[arctic walrus]

Yea figured

[sacred rock]

Is there anywhere that list best traits for the different builds, my sim keeps telling me to use 3xDD for subterfuge and no SS for some reason. (it might me being stupid and not ticking something)

[rigid mango]

Link the sim

[dense cedar]

Linko lunko

[sacred rock]

never mind, it was the latter in my former post.... I am as smart as a hunter pet...

[rigid mango]

😄

[dense cedar]

Cunning pets op

wait

[tall narwhal]

is dribbling dmg affected by vendetta ?

[arctic walrus]

Nope

[tall narwhal]

ok thanks

[rigid mango]

If it's not a rogue ability

It's not affected by tb, MA or vend

[tall narwhal]

gotcha

[dense cedar]

How big is the difference from being in Delirium for dps than not being in there?

[rigid mango]

A lot

[dense cedar]

I see

[rigid mango]

Many number

[tall narwhal]

excuse me guys, im trying to make my gear work with assa

[dense cedar]

Since I don't go in to it

[rigid mango]

I will on mythic

but not hc

[dense cedar]

Was wondering if I should be as harsh about my parse on myself

[rigid mango]

Nah

[tall narwhal]

i dont get one thing - with my current gear setup, top-gear sim doesnt select any NP traits, even though i have 2 available

[rigid mango]

It's like opu last tier

ignore it

Parse wise.

[tall narwhal]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bbnp9s3wZpTJJTXQqrFcZq

does that make any sense ?

[rigid mango]

Resimming it for you to see if there'sa big diff or not

[arctic walrus]

No I am

[rigid mango]

nope

[distant lava]

no I am

[dense cedar]

Oh no

Shrouded

rip

[arctic walrus]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/qfqtByPSYE9f1cYkd73CwZ

Something's not quite right

[rigid mango]

Seems about right

vel wtf

[tall narwhal]

?:

[arctic walrus]

I DON'T KNOW

[upbeat geode]

this what you get when you ask for help, you lost 25K dps

[tall narwhal]

haha

[dense cedar]

That main hand weapon tho

[distant lava]

you picked a folly dude

[tall narwhal]

well i mostly play outlaw 😄

[dense cedar]

Nice not using abilities

[rigid mango]

Fucking

[tall narwhal]

but

i did parse a top-gear sim

[rigid mango]

Dumbass vel

smh

It seems correct

[tall narwhal]

where there are daggers in both hands 😛

[cobalt gyro]

Need 2 daggers to cast mutilate so that sim is basically afk

[distant lava]

yeah, on a 5 min fight ?

I doubt that

[upbeat geode]

does simc even support not having daggers equiped?

[cobalt gyro]

It does, as you saw above

[distant lava]

it's not picking np for me either @rigid mango @arctic walrus

[cobalt gyro]

It just does nothing, because yeah you'd be afk doing nothing

[bleak spoke]

did the apl get editted last night

[rigid mango]

Np is meh nowadays

[bleak spoke]

i'm simming like 400 higher

[rigid mango]

uhh

[cobalt gyro]

np is ok if you have mastery

[rigid mango]

I can sim my shit

[bleak spoke]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ucHcGxqA28oTGnsugrYSjA

[rigid mango]

Yah but mastery sucks

so

🤷

[cobalt gyro]

Tru

[rigid mango]

gimme back haste mastery stat prio

[bleak spoke]

nah mastery is great

[rigid mango]

[bleak spoke]

i miss mastery being biggets stat

[arctic walrus]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/3wiWY4p19ittHMVYSASRaS

[rigid mango]

It's my worst stat

[arctic walrus]

I can offer you 500 more dps

[rigid mango]

did u pick 2 daggers this time vel?

[arctic walrus]

:^)

[rigid mango]

[arctic walrus]

I'm a gud rogue

[rigid mango]

casually picks folly for sin

[distant lava]

can you offer me 500 dps aswell vel ?

[rigid mango]

this seems good

[arctic walrus]

Only if you spam islands for me

TO BE FAIR

[distant lava]

[arctic walrus]

he had it picked in his simc string

so I missed it

[cobalt gyro]

I mean... You can swap weapons in combat

Is the play to equip folly for aoe

Then swap back once it procs

[rigid mango]

[cobalt gyro]

[tall narwhal]

thank you kind sirs

🙂

[bleak spoke]

odo ur

actually trollin

[sour sigil]

pandemic on rupture is always 30% of the duration right so if i do a 1cp rupture (8 sec) i can refresh at 80,3=2,4 sec without losing dmg and with 5 cp (24 sec) 240,3=7,2 seconds?

[distant lava]

idk if you are a complete idiot

or a mad genius

[cobalt gyro]

Imagine in a gigapull in m+ though sub

You open g g g

Swap to folly for fok spam

[arctic walrus]

You guys can't mut with a folly? losers

[tall narwhal]

@arctic walrus what did you change if i may aks ?

[arctic walrus]

Just go iris minor over flame

[dense cedar]

Iris minor op

[tall narwhal]

ohh

thanks

[sour sigil]

pandemic on rupture is always 30% of the duration right so if i do a 1cp rupture (8 sec) i can refresh at 8 x 0,3=2,4 sec without losing dmg and with 5 cp (24 sec) 24 x 0,3=7,2 seconds?

[dense cedar]

spam

@sour sigil Why are u doing a 1cp rupture?

[tall narwhal]

still gambling for socketed benthic crit boots

[dense cedar]

Good luck

[tall narwhal]

[sour sigil]

Vansolo it's an example i'm just making sure thats how it works

coding a weakaura that tracks pandemic windows on multiple targets

guess i'm just gonna test it

[rigid mango]

Pandemic is always 30%, yeah

[sour sigil]

thank you

[robust light]

hey guys, i have the choice to go 3xDD, 1xgizmo, 1xTTK, 1xNP or the same with 1xBBI instead of the NP. in sim it wants me to take BBI and i trust that, however do i still want to have atleast 1 NP like i see everyone on top logs having? they all have atleast 1 NP.

[rigid mango]

1st NP is very high value, yeah

[robust light]

so why does it sim less than 1 bbi

[rigid mango]

but NP scales off of mastery, and mastery is currently generally the worst stat

[robust light]

i dont change any other triats or ilvl. its on the same armor piece

just bbi or np

[rigid mango]

thanks to essences

[bleak spoke]

because it has less value than the bbi

but i would take np anyway for prog

[rigid mango]

Same

[crisp steppe]

sims have 100% uptime on bosses

[bleak spoke]

^

[robust light]

since when was mastery bad? ive read here loads mastery is good

[crisp steppe]

in reality you might not have 100% uptime. you wil lhowever have 100% uptime during vendetta

[rigid mango]

I'm telling you generally atm

[bleak spoke]

np gains value when you can't stick on the boss

[rigid mango]

mastery is underwhelming

CLF values haste, crit and vers

[crisp steppe]

anyway swapping the BBI for NP or the ohter way around is probably not going to change ur life. play either and see how that works out for you

[rigid mango]

Nothing on mastery

[bleak spoke]

i feel like playing with blightborne has changed my life

[crisp steppe]

🔫

[bleak spoke]

actual random TBs where i just get 4 envenoms

and its likle

man what

[robust light]

think ill go with BBI then

i dont progress (currently a casual pug hc pleb)

[bleak spoke]

blightborne feels really good

[rigid mango]

bbi has higher highs and lowe lows

[bleak spoke]

which is weird to say about a stat proc

but

[rigid mango]

np is a constant, pretty much

[bleak spoke]

it does

[robust light]

https://gyazo.com/a4b18cd1e84035036892dcce6c4a2645 the difference is qquite big tho tbh

[bleak spoke]

yeah blightborne slaps

[rigid mango]

Is your crit in the gutter?

[cobalt gyro]

BB is crazy

[robust light]

no my crit is huge

35%

[rigid mango]

Define huge

yikes

yeah

So what's your mastery at

I assume you're an outlaw reroller so it's low

[robust light]

yep

mastery 30%

[rigid mango]

oof

[dense cedar]

outlaw reroller oof

[bleak spoke]

i mean........ https://i.imgur.com/0xBqlnV.png

[rigid mango]

There's your smoking gun

[bleak spoke]

my crit's fine but it still wants that

l0l

[rigid mango]

Nah wasn't his crit

was his mastery

[robust light]

every time i sim it just wants me to get more crit

[dense cedar]

Crit op

[rigid mango]

Just wait until u get clf

[robust light]

i sim enchants and gems all the time and its always GET CRRIIIITTT

[rigid mango]

it'll want it even more :^)

[tall narwhal]

i like to play both specs, meaning outlaw and sin, the problem is constant reforging though

[robust light]

even with my high crit xd

[tall narwhal]

[dense cedar]

Benthic boots make crit super wew

[robust light]

i have full benthic

[bleak spoke]

yeah crit was already even for us kinda

[dense cedar]

plus Sin crit interaction helps with the flow

[tall narwhal]

i got the chills today, saw item upgraded and then read increased crit dmg boots

[faint harness]

Crit da bomb

[tall narwhal]

but it was just extra avoidance

better luck tomorrow

[bleak spoke]

feelsbadman

[dense cedar]

Remember Legion haste

[bleak spoke]

okay wtf my stats are fucked https://i.imgur.com/Kh15P5f.png

actually scuffed lmao

[robust light]

is the font + coral combo huge ? i see so many rogues running it

[faint harness]

looks like mine, ish

[robust light]

and i dont have either :/

[rigid mango]

Yikes

Mine are like

hast=crit>vers>>mast

[sour wasp]

same

[faint harness]

i hate ur name

[rigid mango]

Same-

[sour wasp]

mine?

[faint harness]

yes

[sour wasp]

same

[arctic walrus]

Vers not top stat for you guys

[bleak spoke]

idk though when i try to use a crit mastery ring over what i have it balances out

[dense cedar]

I've only rolled once

[bleak spoke]

and becomes a loss

[faint harness]

i have gambled shoulders 4 times since raid release, 3 pistoleers and 1 sanguine

[dense cedar]

Got Tentacle Shoulders

Not daring enough to roll again

4 downgrades vs 1 upgrade

[arctic walrus]

2 pistoleer 1 sanguine 1 gorak tul

[bleak spoke]

2 sanguine then i got my goraks

[faint harness]

Not going to go for goraks anymore

fuck it

[sour wasp]

are pufferfish bracers equal to frost ones on st?

[arctic walrus]

Time to save for next tier though

[sour wasp]

just got them

[arctic walrus]

ceph not good vs blackwater

[bleak spoke]

i can't seem to convince myself to just save lmao

[faint harness]

the dps difference between mythic orgozoa and goraks is 200 dps

[bleak spoke]

yeah ceph gets owned by blackwater for me

[dense cedar]

@sour wasp at zero movement yes iirc

[short jacinth]

My guildmate rolled gorak first try, stopped playing 2 days ago ...

[polar cape]

Thats sad

[short jacinth]

Very sad

[faint harness]

(:

[polar cape]

But expected thats how you get bis azerite

[sour wasp]

same really, the secret is to not give a fuck

[sour wasp]

yikes vers

[dense cedar]

71 vers btw

wait

[polar cape]

laugh in conflict and strife

[dense cedar]

in raid gear

0 vers btw

[arctic walrus]

1% vers

[dense cedar]

My raid set up actually just doesn't have vers lol

[bleak spoke]

damn you must have many mastery

[arctic walrus]

I don't think so

32% according to wlogs

Maybe with loyal

[dense cedar]

44% mastery :)

[sour wasp]

@rigid mango you play pufferfish right?

on st

[rigid mango]

I do

Aye

[sour wasp]

are they equal to frost on st?

[rigid mango]

more or less, aye

[dense cedar]

ignoring my answer qq

[sour wasp]

i'm sowwy but zine is my wiki here

[rigid mango]

They're very close

[dense cedar]

[rigid mango]

It's about RNG it seems

[arctic walrus]

Zine is mean don't be his friend

[rigid mango]

Even on ashvane where there's a decent amount of movement it was within 0.06% dmg

Vel

They're too close for me to care enough to rng for frost

[dense cedar]

I'm excited for when I have gear so that the reason my dps is bad is because of myself

[rigid mango]

dw yoppa just got 2nd minor so I'm forever 2nd rogue again

I'ma just rename my details real quick again

[open stag]

What benthic item should I target next? I have the boots and gloves already.

[rigid mango]

Back to second rogue I come

[sour wasp]

wrists

[rigid mango]

my dude

[dense cedar]

Belt if ur scared of rng

[sour wasp]

or maybe belt since they're easier to get

ye

[rigid mango]

Rng

[dense cedar]

while one of the belts isn't useful most of the time

it does the big deeps for the times it is

[rigid mango]

I'm full time pvp'er now anyways

to #pvp I go

[dense cedar]

oh no

[robust light]

https://gyazo.com/93d0561d2280295d85646e1370318950 @rigid mango mastery worst stat btw hehe

[sour wasp]

conch hits like a truck sometimes

[robust light]

im meming tho, i know its cause i have really low mast

[sour wasp]

60k crits wtf

[rigid mango]

idk I think my mast is too high anyways

I'm just comparing current mastery values to late 8.1.5 mastery values

[sour wasp]

are intentionally playing with no haste cuz you are maso like that? @rigid mango

[rigid mango]

I've got like 21% haste or smth

wdym

I just play 5% in m+ (:

[sour wasp]

you were memeing your "no haste" couple of days ago

ah

[bleak spoke]

i think that's too low tbh

[rigid mango]

mine's a bit low aye

Sims want me to get more

[bleak spoke]

when i go under like 8-9% haste in m+ i feel like im lagging

[rigid mango]

When I go over 5% I wanna puke

[dense cedar]

[rigid mango]

I like pain

[bleak spoke]

man like i'm still of the opinion that 11% is accurate

[rigid mango]

9% tops

[bleak spoke]

11% for e neutral @ 4 bleeds

[arctic walrus]

Optimizing m+

[bleak spoke]

spending 35 energy every global

[rigid mango]

Meh, idm 5 bleeds

I just fuck that shit up, run 1 quick nav and 2-3 op

ez pez

[bleak spoke]

man what

quick nav is depleted

[sour wasp]

depleted?

my dude still likes it

[glad compass]

with the master assasin opener, when you open with mutilate and it doesnt give you 4 combo points do you still rupture or do you mutilate again?

[arctic walrus]

you mut

[rigid mango]

wdym lettuce

[bleak spoke]

like not having crit/mastery enchant in dungeon feels so aids to me

[dense cedar]

@glad compass u either mut or make urself feel bad

[bleak spoke]

man 2.4k dps increase if i get a second minor

[arctic walrus]

Low crit in dungeons is what really gets to me

[bleak spoke]

big true

when you fok 3 times

and get 4 cp

[arctic walrus]

exactly

[bleak spoke]

its just like

[rigid mango]

I mean

[bleak spoke]

man what

[rigid mango]

I just run that shit for ST

to patch up haste

and run full crit mast for everything else p much

I think I'm at near 45% of either baseline

• deadly nav

[bleak spoke]

Vel how close are you to 65 neck

Fair enough zine

[rigid mango]

I should try out different values tho

[ancient onyx]

i used to have 50% mastery before i got new ring

[bleak spoke]

I’m just of the opinion that a base number for haste in a dungeon makes more sense

And that you get more out of crit and mastery procs

[rigid mango]

Aye I've just been fucking about with getting it as low as humanly possible

I'm not even trying to optimise atm since I'm lacking the azerite to even start to

[arctic walrus]

I think I was around 45-50%

[bleak spoke]

That’s like 55k ap?

[arctic walrus]

around 60 i think yea

[bleak spoke]

Man I’m 75k off of 64

Idk if I have the strength of will

[rigid mango]

I'm 22k off 63

[bleak spoke]

But literal 2.4k dps increase is just beyond insane

[arctic walrus]

I think it's like 1.5k for me

[rigid mango]

Which one, flames or strife?

[shut pasture]

can someone give me a garrote mousover macro

[bleak spoke]

Checked flames strife and iris minor

[arctic walrus]

Iris minor slave

[rigid mango]

Iris minor is like

[bleak spoke]

Flames did best for me

[rigid mango]

Wait, how far ahead is it?

for u vel

[arctic walrus]

bigly ahead

[bleak spoke]

It’s 5% haste that’s a lot

[rigid mango]

[arctic walrus]

I think I simmed it a bit ago lemme check

[bleak spoke]

Think of it as literally adding 6 sockets to your gear or something lmao

[arctic walrus]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/rTzgXH59tcfaLFZJsn85af

Okay not that far behind flame actually

[rigid mango]

Aye but like

iris loses value if u swap

Albeit you can play around it

but I'm gonna avoid it if I can, tbh

[arctic walrus]

I always thought it was fast to stack imo

still drop it I guess

[bleak spoke]

That zaqul helm is hot

Your shoulders are still 445 on that too so it’s even more lol

[arctic walrus]

nah I added the +5 in the trait thingy

[rigid mango]

How do you even give yourself the 3rd minor

I've forgotten

[arctic walrus]

in your string go down to the neck line

[bleak spoke]

Just set your neck level to 65

[arctic walrus]

They need m+ mechagon already

[bleak spoke]

True

[rigid mango]

Ah neat

[arctic walrus]

lacking in the rings department

[rigid mango]

Dude those mechagon rings

are brutally strong

It's so insane when you look at the numbers

[bleak spoke]

There is a trait in there which is literally blight borne but your highest secondary

[arctic walrus]

If I can get the behind the target one it's +300

[bleak spoke]

I haven’t done mecha this week yet but I have the nature damage proc ring in my bank

[arctic walrus]

logic loop has 0 logic

I have nature dmg too, but rock boy demands more haste so I feed it

[rigid mango]

That haste proc ring

is so stupid

• the behind

[bleak spoke]

It’s 3 sockets isn’t it

[rigid mango]

Aye

[arctic walrus]

What I really need is that forged up

[rigid mango]

Saw someone witha 435 socketed one

yday

[dense cedar]

what counts as "behind"

[arctic walrus]

cuz they were so nice to scale it up for us

[bleak spoke]

Jesus

[rigid mango]

[dense cedar]

outside of parry or?

literally only behind

[rigid mango]

idk actually

[bleak spoke]

Probably backstab

So like a 120 degree angle

[inland plover]

How can i improve my dps further except getting a higher weapon?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/9azd18VdAmCaAvXL1YBGiL

[arctic walrus]

I'd say 180

[rigid mango]

Yep

iris for me too

smh

[bleak spoke]

Smh my head

[rigid mango]

It's just because my haste is low

And It's telling me to re gem haste anyways

1 sec time for 40 min sim

[arctic walrus]

Idk man

[rigid mango]

[arctic walrus]

I have full haste gems, haste ring, and it wants me iris

[bleak spoke]

It’s just too many stats I think

[arctic walrus]

clf snorts haste like it's cocaine

[rigid mango]

idk what's your haste at

baseline

[arctic walrus]

22 I think

[dense cedar]

@inland plover Gloves Benthic

[rigid mango]

Yeah that's low just like mine

I'm at 21% or smth

[bleak spoke]

i just dont understand how my haste is my lowest stat

[worn storm]

how do i tell if i should use vanish on toxic blade or envenom ?

[bleak spoke]

it has to be the rings

[rigid mango]

What's yours at?

@worn storm look at the opener in the guide

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/

[dense cedar]

New way

[worn storm]

i did

[dense cedar]

btw

[arctic walrus]

3 op, haste nav I'm giving him all I got

[dense cedar]

also like

if u can't envenom

u can just mut

from vanish

[rigid mango]

You genuinly have BiS azerite too vel

smh

[bleak spoke]

24.85