pretty good until u got mythic zaqul
#assassination
empty tide
robust light
and you need to have done the proff quest collecting the raid things
empty tide
and if you do not plan on raiding mythic, its the best helm
ancient onyx
it sims lower than HC zaqul for me
left moth
i got heropic zaqul im happy wit that for now
holy fk i suck at typing
if only i learned 10 finger system when i was young
ancient onyx
same, i often type something it looks good then i look at it after i send it and yeah... it has a lot of typos
left moth
hmm idk, would take forever to get used to it
low junco
i should reroll my enchanting to jc to get the ring
but
one ring costs around 80-100k
so cba
arctic walrus
@quasi pewter yeah idk for us during 2nd and 3rd add I barely have uptime on her
low stacks during addphase might be more worth it
untold current
scarlet sequoia
no
sour wasp
jeez
scarlet sequoia
hell yeah
arctic walrus
I didn't realize blood was that behind clf for me now
sour wasp
not even 50k 
quasi pewter
@arctic walrus true yea, we just didnt really need any damage during addphase so i just let it stack until p4
quasi pewter
had like 33 stacks in the end
mellow lantern
So on a aoe pull, do you guys DOT more than 3 targets?
sour wasp
garrotes for days yes
scarlet sequoia
@arctic walrus go human bro
arctic walrus
I had to go dwarf for dispell
scarlet sequoia
what on zaqul?
ancient onyx
@empty tide idk why but no matter what setup i sim Eng helm is worse
empty tide
what you using clf?
when i was using lucid as major eng helm was bad for me, cause of overwhelming power
now that im using clf as major haste is good again and eng helm went sky high
empty tide
24% here 
ancient onyx
i guess the game just doesnt make any sense sometimes 
empty tide
ikr
arctic walrus
Fury to be fair you guys got to be excited weeks ago, now I have a delayed reaction
And no, azshara los dispells
sour wasp
was wondering why would one play dwarf
violet mural
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
sour wasp
who cares, it's all about the aesthethics
empty tide
DPS
marble elm
@arctic walrus did you change from human to dwarf back to human back to dwarf
drifting cloud
marble elm
pretty sure i've been parried more this tier
than all of my time playing this game
combined
blizzard buffed parry and this is not a conspiracy this is FACT
opal oyster
Raidbots is suggesting me to use font + galecaller, any tips on how to use them? Font i saw on the pins, gcb i think that i should use when i'm energy starved, or should i use gcb with CDs or something else?
cobalt pelican
press gcb when it's off cooldown and you got nothin else goin for you in life probably
opal oyster
got it, ty
odd rampart
you guys do log review here, right?
sour wasp
yessir
odd rampart
aight, i got my first ashvane kill with a guild I'm trailing for and i feel like my dps is a lot lower than i need to be
I got a lot of arcings but i still felt like i was falling behind constantly
low junco
420 chest and shoulders?
odd rampart
yeah i purchases new ones after raid lol
odd rampart
no
low junco
do mut > rupture > mut > garrote > clf > vendetta > Tb > vanish > env > mut > env
sour wasp
idk if it's worth to garrote brineys like you did around here
odd rampart
but rupt is fine on them?
cobalt pelican
garrote is definitely not worth it
unless somehow your guild takes like 15 seconds to kill them
odd rampart
naw they're solid on that front
hazy iron
You can drop small ruptures in them for energy regen assuming you mut first
But normally we just ignore them
odd rampart
is FoK worth to spread poisions i've been doing that too
hazy iron
If you’re running DD not really
sour wasp
you didn't pool for a couple tb's, i also see 2 ruptures applied back to back in a 1 sec span which i presume was some fat fingering
hazy iron
Probably parried
brisk frost
if your team has enough cleave to kill bubbles without you, just tunnel boss
me and our other assa dont hit bubbles a single time
sour wasp
but yeah, i think a big theme is garroting bubbles in this parse
cobalt pelican
overall your play looks pretty fine tbh, your gear is kinda assbutt and you waste tons of energy on random shit
brisk frost
yeah, never ever garrote bubbles
cobalt pelican
feinting might feel like an epic gamer move but it's really not worth it
sour wasp
rotational it aint bad
hazy iron
Probably arcing
odd rampart
arcing
hazy iron
But should hold cd’s til you know you don’t have to run out
odd rampart
ok
brisk frost
@cobalt pelican using feint, especially on proge on bubble waves is only good thing imo
rogue cant die tho, but atleast im using it
hazy iron
It’s like the upsurges, wait til they go out, then channel font
cobalt pelican
it's during the shield phase so it's not arcing
and a dd is cast like the global before poison knife
brisk frost
then nvm, didnt go that deep
cobalt pelican
i'm not going to strictly say don't feint but like
rippling damage is
very predictable
and very like
if you don't die
nothing is going to surprise you afterwards
you have healers for a reason
unless they can't keep up
there's no benefit to a dps trading damage for healing in a situation with entirely planned damage that will never kill you under any circumstances
sudden ocean
Is there a way to sim your second minor essence without having it unlocked atm?
sudden ocean
big thank
odd rampart
k tks, i think the knife throw was because i was outranged by people trying to line up their briny
i really dont remember tho
cobalt pelican
yeah it's possible but you'd just dumped energy the global before i highly doubt you were nearing cap
just avoid pressing the button if you can
besides the opener which just seems like it was misclickered tbh most of the damage lost is from energy wasted on feint/random casts of low damage abilities
mystic charm
Is there any significant difference between the old and new MA opener, or just personal preference ?
cobalt pelican
minor gain with the new one which is why it exists
shell pollen
to anyone with both font of power and razor coral, how are you timing the use of each one with our CDs
final dust
Sooo this happened
https://gyazo.com/d1b15c46f57b2d7df99ddedc59c4d1e6
left moth
this pic makes me wanna kms
arctic walrus
Please hand that over
left moth
wait thats actually yours?
final dust
Yea
cobalt pelican
tomorrow is my day
probably
the only thing i' mreally hoping is that i don't loot a phial from radiance
woeful minnow
haha yes another week of neither font nor coral in both normal and heroic
left moth
just kill them on mythic 4Head
final dust
im still fucking shaking
ancient onyx
@cobalt pelican just equip it in only 1 slot 
tribal marlin
It was my turn for Font last week
not a single trinket dropped -.-
like it can drop for every spec of every class in the game and 0 trinket dropped last week 😦
safe fog
how do people here use CDs on Ashvane (not trying to 2phase RL stubborn)
dark crag
At opener and when they are ready
dapper wraith
can we immune behemoth barb w/ cloak? or need to eat it w/ cheat death?
teal mica
So for TB is it better to just use it on CD or should you hold it after you refresh bleeds so you can get as many envenoms in the window as possible?
civic palm
Plan better, TB on CD.
rancid bobcat
2 phase on first kill at this point is still a bit daring
You'd need to have some lucky farm to make up for mechanics
woeful minnow
you can cloak barb
just be careful that no one else soaks with you because they're still gonna take the dmg lmao
arctic hornet
Is it more important to line Coral or Font up with Vendetta?
Having some timing issues but maybe just my poor planning
sudden ocean
arctic walrus
Sad night for prog
opal meadow
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/n8KGdSNYkCqvTYEnVyiXrX
enginner helmet is that good huh..
quasi pewter
@arctic walrus how far are you?
tribal marlin
40 island to go Poggers https://i.imgur.com/rX3yQBk.png
@opal meadow yes 450 double dose + OP is huge
arctic walrus
People are being stupid
tribal marlin
zaqul ?
arctic walrus
barely getting p4 pulls
tribal marlin
Azshara ?
arctic walrus
We can't get a clean 3rd add without stupid deaths
Yes azshara
We just got our first real p4 pull of the night
quasi pewter
monday we had like 10 trys ruined by people not being able to hit 3rd add with spear 
tribal marlin
I'm still on zaqul xD
arctic walrus
how many wipes
quasi pewter
same guy missed 5 times
tribal marlin
but imma prog zaqul with Minor Lucid + Minor VoP and that's cool
arctic walrus
Yea like
If we can just get there
and practice for a pull or 2
it'll be dead
We basically had 2 nights of no prog
quasi pewter
sudden ocean
Vel you mentioned grinding manapearls once before, apart from dailies like algans and stuff is there a way to reliably farm them
meager nebula
rares/algans/scrying stones
quasi pewter
i think 250-300 pulls is pretty standard but we definitely could have done alot better before we got to p4 prog
arctic walrus
Yep exactly
We just had 3 good pulls before end of the night
Might die tomorrow if we continue this
quasi pewter
23 best so far?
arctic walrus
19
quasi pewter
nice
yea i guess you need to get some low % tries so everyone can figure out what to do etc and then its ez kill
fast nacelle
quiet elbow
If i'm using condensed life force with razorcoral, do you think it's worth holding vendetta off for a minute so that it syncs up with condensed life force and allowing for higher stacks before consumption with the trinket?
blazing kayak
would a 435 tides nothing personal be better than a double dose nothing personal 445?
drifting cloud
only if you dont lose a use
blazing kayak
also sin or outlaw in raid?
pearl pagoda
can sin cloak orgo puddles?
rigid mango
Nope
pearl pagoda
thought so
rigid mango
It's nature damage, but you can't
The stomp in p2 is physical, but you can cloak it
scarlet ingot
civic palm
o _o'
civic palm
yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeok
quasi pewter
rigid mango
Makes no sense
civic palm
This one very much doesn't.
river hearth
so I was looking on the website (Ravenholdt) and there is not real rotation advise for mythic plus. Any words of advice here?
Just keep rupture up on all targets, then use FoK, then use envenom for combo points?
or is it garrote on all?
hoary crown
Hey guys! We were progressing on ashvane yesterday, and at few pulls I held like 40 k dps and others like at minimum 33k is that just inconistant rotation or is it that much rng involved?😬
lost horizon
Swinging that far sounds like mistakes or mechanics
But consider that you have a bunch of different fight lengths on prog wipes
rich lily
Depends on how often you had to play some mechanics like bubbles or azerit chains
hoary crown
Yeah that is true, at most times I swinged between 37-38 to 40 and thats not that extreme!
runic tree
So I got socketed hands but they are the ones that increase dodge. Should I keep buying for better ones?
It is the socket what’s so important?
Or is it
rare pond
it's the additional traits
you want the socket on a specific piece of gear because the socket makes it better than the 445 mythic gear
with the right trait
hoary crown
You want poens
low junco
The equip effect is what u are aiming ofr while also trying for socket @runic tree
hoary crown
Which i spent 500 manapearls on now😡😡
low junco
also you to spend pearls only on gloves/bracers/boots/belt
everything else is useless
here are the names aswell
dawn dragon
!essences
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
daring cave
Anyone know how Sin is doing in M+?
true nexus
wow
bronze kelp
Sin is doing very well in m+
river hearth
Maybe it's because I'm running 13's but sin doesn't seem that great right now to me. I do way more damage in Combat...
sorry outlaw*
rigid mango
You also asked about how to even play sin rotationally in m+, I don't think your anecdotal evidence of playing the two specs when you're evidently inexperienced (and odds are, poorly geared) in one.
pliant snow
I guess this thing is rocking in m+ right?
rare pond
I'm no expert on it but I wouldn't think that it has enough time to build up in m+, compared to trinkets like razor coral
rigid mango
It's aight
Unsure on how good it is because I don't see a lot of people using it though
Might be better now for tyr, idk
civic palm
FoK doesn't apply it as quickly as abilities+AA on one target does.
zinc zealot
Inkpod isnt good in mythic+ at all, at least for AOE, even with a socket.
river hearth
@rigid mango that's a fair point. I wouldn't say I'm poorly geared at 435 ilevel though. And I was asking for clarification on the rotation because that's what I've been doing for some time and it doesn't seem as effective as I'd like.
rare pond
I just don't wanna reforge for aoe traits to do mythic then swap back to st for raid
zinc zealot
@river hearth apply 3xgarrote from opener than 1xrupture. pop blood of enemy and spam FoK until your garrotes are about to run out. Reapply bleeds so you always have at least 4 bleeds up. Every other GCD is FoK
if there is prio target you probs wanna chuck some envenoms in there
with FoK as CP builder
river hearth
That's about what I've been doing. Why do you stop at 4 bleeds? Does the energy Regen essentially cap at that point @zinc zealot
sharp viper
you cannot spend your energy fast enough
zinc zealot
thats when spamming FoK will have the same energy loss as your energy regen
river hearth
Also, thanks for the help. I wanna focus assassin but until I can get better AOE I feel like I'm better off outlaw.
zinc zealot
so you stay at same energy
hoary crown
Assa aoe is really easy just get eb and ss
river hearth
When you said throw some envenoms in there does that imply that for pure AOE you would not envenom and would only use CPs on rupture or not use CP?
zinc zealot
Sin is only really good in keys that have high health targets where you can out damage others just because your sustain is almost the same as your burst
while others dps really drops off over time
jagged tulip
after benthic boots which piece should i roll for?
zinc zealot
@river hearth Envenoms are only for a target that *needs to die. Pure aoe is only using FoK even if you cap CPS
thats only if you have 3x Echoing blades though
river hearth
Kk. That makes a lot more sense as well. I assume it's FoK when it's 3 targets or more like most classes.
rigid mango
Not about ilvl, you can have high ilvl pieces with low crit, high haste and shite traits, para
zinc zealot
for 2-3 Targets still use envenom after every FoK
rigid mango
I'm still using 420 pieces
zinc zealot
But 4+ just spam Fok
rigid mango
Uhhh
No.
First of all that number is 5+, and most of the time there's one target that needs to die faster
So, if you're there to time it and not go for overall, weaving in envenoms is a gain a lot of the time
Unless they're all very equal hp states, etc
zinc zealot
Yeah. Thats for prio target, im talking about pure AOE
where every target has the same health
rigid mango
And I'm saying most of the time pure aoe has a prio target
And that number is still 5t+
Not 4
zinc zealot
thats not really true in high keys, maybe low keys yea
zinc zealot
well bursting down 1 target in a high key is not efficient for time at all
rigid mango
You also need 5 bleeds to go energy positive, not 4
zinc zealot
even aoe is the most efficient way to do dps
rigid mango
I'm not saying bursting one
I'm saying killing shit effectivly
If everything dies apart from 1-2 targets you're stuck at awk target number with all specs prob sprecced into aoe
Not low target
zinc zealot
I havn't really had a problem with awkward target numbers in any keys, its only really awkward when there is 1 target up and that is solved by chain pulling (eg. Motherload peacekeepers). Do you think its more efficient to burst AOE down 2 packs and do 1 peacekeeper. Or use all resources on the peacekeeper and double your pull time?
rigid mango
If you just prio'd down the peacekeeper time would've been more efficient when the first low hp things die
zinc zealot
The only situation you would enevnom is on a target that needs to die (like Void Emissaries)
or other targets i cant remember on the top of my head
zinc zealot
Yea, its not like i have the peices to run anything else
unless i want to run 3xMutilate 3xvendetta peices in a dungeon
rigid mango
Obv not.
zinc zealot
which would be "faster" based on your logic on bursting down 1 target that has the most health
civic palm
o _O
rigid mango
Smoothen out the packs.
civic palm
There's been a misunderstanding.
rigid mango
I'm not against the fok usage, I'm saying that playstyle is for going for overall and not looking to cut timer down, for most keys
It's an entirely valid strat, just suboptimal in a lot of dungeons/weeks, imo
zinc zealot
I still don't think that applies to how fast you time a key. Almost always the more damage your group did, the faster they timed the key. (There are some cases where this doesn't apply)
rigid mango
You can drop overall to do a key faster.
zinc zealot
Prio damage is important for targets that need to die though. Such as something that applies a stacking dot to the tank etc. but not for a random mob that just has more health.
rigid mango
It's good for both.
civic palm
All things don't have the same health O _O
zinc zealot
Whats one example where you can drop overall to do a key faster
rigid mango
Drop 3 eb ss for ttk
Or why would anyone ever play anything but 3 eb ss
Why would seli ever not play 3 eb ss
crisp steppe
Ur personal overall drops. Not the groups is the idea
rigid mango
crisp steppe
As a result of ur prio the groups overall goes up
Becquse youre never fighting a single mob thats left up
rigid mango
If you play for overall every key, I don't want you in my group 
zinc zealot
I don't think i want to run with you either
rigid mango
bleak spoke
I think there’s a misunderstanding here
rigid mango
I hope so.
bleak spoke
If your damage to a focus target is significantly better but you do less on smallies that would have died to passive cleave to begin with then the pack goes faster
Let’s say you play sin outlaw dh
In some pulls the smallies will always die on 1 condition - the dance after the second eye beam given the keys like say an 18 or something
So you want to redistribute your damage from spamming fok, which causes everything around a large mob to die say 4-6 seconds faster to the large mob
Cuz if you make it so the overall time of the pull is shorter, then you saved time though your overall is lower
zinc zealot
but thats not what i'm talking about
bleak spoke
This is not to say that you can have low overall and be okay
bleak spoke
This sort of play shouldn’t impact your dps by more than like 2-3k dps on aoe
zinc zealot
Would you use envenom?
raw gull
stupid q, is it better for a nonrogue to stun a mob and then you DR kidney it for prey
or just you kidney
bleak spoke
Depends
Like do you have the ruptures out
Do you need to refresh elaborate planning
Is someone tunneling another mob for cleave
What comp do you have
raw gull
and do less in that stun but have the mob 'controlled' for longer
bleak spoke
Is one mob significantly more tank damage than the other etc
For pure dps purposes in an even pack I think the best example is underrot
zinc zealot
Yes i agree with you there
bleak spoke
In underrot once the swarmer dies you mongo cleave as hard as you can
zinc zealot
The bloodswarmers need to die
Thats an example where the mob needs to die
and you would ST it down
bleak spoke
But until the swarmer does you’re finishing envenom unless you’re missing energy
And you need to rupture off mobs to gain that energy
After it dies though there is one mob that will have higher hp than every other mob
short pivot
3ss 3ttk this week
bleak spoke
The maggot, which has 10-15% more base hp
short pivot
With MP for them juicy envenoms
bleak spoke
That’s the one I would spend envenoms that extend elaborate planning on
That would be sick plays if mp affected envenom damage
Back to the drawing board my friend
short pivot
😢
raw gull
about if a CCable add needs to die
short pivot
Dont use prey in m+
civic palm
Depends on if the Rogue is running Weak or Internal.
civic palm
Internal doesn't care if the target is stunned for 2 or 6 seconds.
raw gull
or just full kidney full prey
raw gull
it's in a niche scenario
civic palm
Yeah they're buffs/debuffs all their own.
bleak spoke
If you mean azshara
raw gull
i'm just wondering if you get more out of just kidneying and getting the burst window at the same time
bleak spoke
Yes you should be the one to kidney
zinc zealot
You should use Iron Wire
bleak spoke
In dungeons you play iron wire for control
raw gull
ya on azshara some1 said it's better to binding then DR kidney
but that's not creating any more value
that's just moving it
not someone in my guild but other place
civic palm
If the add dies then it dies, if you don't need the 10% DMG then something like HoJ or binding is better.
though Binding is nicer for the add groups.
if you cannot kill on the ward anyway.
raw gull
basically what i'm getting at is kidneying vs binding shot -> immuned kidney -> hulk runs with prey on the weak still on, is only valued by what your raid is doing in those seconds
short pivot
@bleak spoke the week before this a 2.5k rio rogue told me to run MP with 3ttk 3 ss and high mast, the results were rly nice with empowered foks and ttk buff
raw gull
and whether or not it's inherently better to have prey outside of binding shot
civic palm
Unless you're the ONE person to stun the Hulk, don't bother.
raw gull
that's my q, is if it is somehow better to binding shot then DR kidney for full prey
rather than just kidneying
i don't think so
short pivot
Always full kidney the hulk first for prey .
short pivot
Ideally hell die in that kidney
rigid mango
Idk why mp
civic palm
at the same time, if he dies inside a non-roided stun, it's all the same.
Will leave you on Azshara while the dorks deal with the Hulk.
bleak spoke
@short pivot idk I would consider mp if my tank wanted extra crippling slow but no other scenario
Also 2.5k isn’t that high :/
Most rogues I’ve met climbing have had glaring deficiencies in that range
Honestly even most rogues at my io have a strong identifiable weakness
zinc zealot
i mean. a week before this 2.6k was the highest rank
heavy trail
On some Logs ive seen the computation device on ilvl 430 instead of 415 is there anything i hav emissed?
civic palm
Yeah high level cards.
bleak spoke
Thought he meant last season but idk until the community pushes rio is meaningless right now
heavy trail
cards are still shown 415 on them 
bleak spoke
20s don’t feel as hard as 23s last season
bleak spoke
Even with emissaries vs reap
short pivot
Hmmm so u guys would say MP is useless?
bleak spoke
Doesn’t stop ppl from inting on 18s and 19s but lmao
heavy trail
So just craft yellow punchard untill you get a high one?
bleak spoke
I’d say it has a very very very niche use
raw gull
sorry was afk
short pivot
Cool thanks a lot
raw gull
had to do something irl for a moment
bleak spoke
But this might be one of the weeks where that niche comes into play
civic palm
MP having value is entirely in a niche.
raw gull
but the jist is it's not inherently better to stagger prey, right
and just not press binding shot at all
civic palm
Yeah either you do the 1 stun, or someone else does.
bleak spoke
Like if there is a particular mob that will catch your tank and reapply necrotic with 50% vs 60%
raw gull
yea
civic palm
If the add needs the 10% DMG then Prey Kidney, if not, then do w/e.
short pivot
Idk why that guys said that MP is specifically run for 3ttk 3 ss build
bleak spoke
I can’t think of any dungeon in particular which can’t be pulled in a better way for that to matter
Cuz he must have thought mp affects env
Which it does not
short pivot
Maybe trolling me to drop overall
raw gull
cause ya yu still get 10% inside the kidney window, which unDRd is the same prey debuff time as when it's running
civic palm
Either way the Hulk should never get to the ward on Normal/Heroic, and should never Slam on Mythic.
well, 1 isn't the end of the attempt on Mythic.
raw gull
yea
short pivot
But would you say 3ttk 3ss is the go to this week? @bleak spoke
urban gorge
hey guys, is there a cap on the stats as a sin rogue you should aim for?
bleak spoke
Err probably not
civic palm
Nope, follow your Top Gear results.
bleak spoke
This is a pretty mongo week
urban gorge
i noticed on the RH website that the stat priority is haste -> crit -> mastery for ST
civic palm
Also yes, 50% crit.
bleak spoke
You pull big and you kill even
civic palm
Follow your Top Gear results.
civic palm
Use Stat Weights to find your food option.
bleak spoke
3ss heavily skews how much damage some three mobs take
zinc zealot
That stat weights changes based on what essence you are using anyway
short pivot
And u dont need that much prio as well, hmmm
bleak spoke
I’d probably play like 222 ss eb ttk this week
But really I probably just play outlaw with the groups I’m in :/
zinc zealot
must feel luck not getting 3x peices with vendetta trait in a row
and actually being able to choose your traits
bleak spoke
I mean I’m using last seasons azerite for sin
short pivot
Yeah same all 445s have been garbage for me till now
bleak spoke
I’ve got good sin raid pieces
zinc zealot
Sin is good for ST
bleak spoke
And pieces from the raid are strong for outlaw
zinc zealot
cos all 3 peices in there are basically bis
rigid mango
I just need more pieces w eb @ 445
bleak spoke
Yeah I don’t have any 445 eb
rigid mango
Got gold tasseled yday
bleak spoke
That’s good
rigid mango
bleak spoke
Unstable flames is very strong
It has pretty high uptime
Theoretically pistoleers would have been more fluid for azerite traits for sin dungeon but that’s whatever
rigid mango
Ye
short pivot
One last question, im running 35 cri 7 haste 47 mast, should i swap around rings for a bit more haste for bosses this week or not worth?
rigid mango
I thought it was goraks/pist
bleak spoke
I like 11% haste on my gear to meet the equilibrium at 4 bleeds
But that’s not a popular choice nowadays less so with lucid probably
short pivot
So on tyr that doesnt need to change yeah?
bleak spoke
Idt tyrannical vs fort affects gearing as much as ppl think
bleak spoke
Like at the end of the day you might move around some azerite traits but really the difference isn’t that much
Yeah
civic palm
But only if you are doing 3EB
If you 2 | 2 | 2 everywhere nothing changes.
Unless you have POOR Haste.
bleak spoke
I don’t think 3 eb is very necessary unless your group has little cleave
bleak spoke
Cuz 2 eb still pumps packs kinda
civic palm
1xEB is still an annoying amount of damage even.
bleak spoke
Like you won’t get eye watering damage on aoe like with 3 eb but every pull should have you competitive with any class or better
civic palm
Ye
short pivot
Cool thanks a lot bois
bleak spoke
3 eb gains value when everyone in your group sucks and you need to pump out every scrap of aoe dam, or if they’re really good and you snipe their cleave before it happens kinda
civic palm
Yeah you if you get to smash the fuck out of FoK for extended periods of time EB just seems to keep ramping.
bleak spoke
Yeah the dpet on like a 6 pack is like 100k with my scuffed azerite from last season lmao
tribal marlin
I did it boyz !
rigid mango
Gz miki
tribal marlin
Now I have no idea on what 3rd essence choose for m+ 😦
I want protocol but I'm 15 oscillator away from it lol
I think imma just go VoP
dense cedar
I haven't even reached 60 yet 
rose hill
Did anyone r3 the blood of the enemy last bonus honor weekend?
(Wondering how long it’s likely to take on average).
winter aurora
boys what is our opener on aoe packs in m+ with iris essence? 3 buffed garrot's and iris insta after that?
rigid mango
3 g rup and then iris probably
orchid berry
@rose hill I actually had a shaman in my m+ who got rank4 (yes, you read that right) within the first two weeks of 8.2 so it's definitely doable. Whether you will remain sane during such a grind is another story though 😄
humble silo
!ui
orchid berry
I would say you get anywhere between 1k-2k honor per hour when grinding bgs, depending on the map, the speed and whether you win or lose. Spamming bg's in 5man premade will most likely bring this number up quite a bit, since you're winrate can get much higher.
inner surge
sorry for a very possibly overused and many a times answered question, but what does 'Master Assassin talented the new way' mean?
humble silo
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
arctic walrus
Over SS
orchid berry
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
distant moon
when to activate ashvane trinket in the opener? and activating again on second vendetta for the crit buff? or just when it gets 20 stacks
dense cedar
The site should just remove old way
since no one ever uses it after they ask the difference anyway
its just making people take longer to get to the same point
mighty elm
@distant moon
Imagine rolling for 3 shoulders and all 3 times that get shitty underrot shoulder
sharp viper
i don't trust my luck so I'm saving for gorak tul now
placid mulch
What’s the agreed upon best way to sim m+ sin traits? DSlice / 5 target patch / hectic add cleave?
I know it’s all pretty much whack but is there a best of the worst scenario?
rigid mango
@mighty elm sang monst 
steep obsidian
who needs to save for gorak tul amymore
steep obsidian
i did shard 2 garbage chests to get that though
mighty elm
I’ve sharded 55 pieces my dude
tight condor
What would you say are the trinkets I should be aiming to get? Been struggling with them for a while
dense cedar
55...
tropic ocean
@tight condor for raid, azshara trinket and ashvane trinket
tight condor
How does the poked sized one compare to it?
Does anyone have a quicksim of their character i can compare myself to?
sharp viper
pretty decent for progress since it is flat out damage and usable while moving
tropic ocean
not sure how a quicksim of someone elses character will benefit you
but here you go
sharp viper
oh damn 435 mechagon ring
signal summit
A sp in my guild got mecha rings 440 and 435
tight condor
I just dont get how I can sim that low compared to you, i get 37,5k
I suppose pretty much my azerite, trinket and essences would count up to almost 10k dps
tropic ocean
-azerite
-trinkets
-weapons
-benthic
-sockets
sharp viper
^ this
tropic ocean
i'm lower ilvl but most of my gear is socketed
also the ring set from mecha is a big dps gain on every boss you can proc it on
tight condor
Is benthic gear that strong?
tropic ocean
i'll show you
young portal
Yes
tight condor
Never looked into it so much
And since i had 445 pieces instead i dont know how much difference it would make
young portal
Benthic would still be better I would've thought, but definitely worth running a gear compare sim and dropping the benthic pieces into a set
tight condor
My gear feels so horrible lol
young portal
The lottery of it can be frustrating though, took me 199 sets of boots to get crit + socket. Took me ~50 sets of gloves to get socket, which I then got 455 crit/haste + socket gloves from WM not long after. But it is what it is, definitely recommend going for it tho. Worth it in the long run
tropic ocean
this is what happens if I remove my 415~420 benthics
and replace it with 435-445 gear
gain 6 ilvl lose 5k dp
dps*
tropic ocean
well your major essence isn't the best
tropic ocean
what server are you on?
tropic ocean
you can use your alts to farm the tokens and open them on your main
boots should be first then belt wrist gloves its a big dps increase even on ilvl 400 ish
tight condor
Are those without sockets worth it too?
I got wrist with the 'chance to send oudroplets' one
tight condor
Understandably
tropic ocean
and for your character you can do some improvements, I don't know what gear you have in bags but from what you have equipped
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kQ6wqaUE1X7x3DrcoU4S5E
bold elk
got belt and boots w socket, wrist w/o socket doesnt catch up to my 440+socket H+M wrists - so you pretty much go for socket. burned 70 pearls yesterday 
warm sable
Loyal to end 4 😊
tropic ocean
farm token with alts and send them to main
young portal
As said above, get the tokens on your alts first for the day. Try to save as many Pearl's on main to upgrade
Ah^
tight condor
Which tokens do you mean exactly?
warm sable
Mana pearls so get benthic token
spring yoke
You can buy the benthic gear on an alt and send it over
You get around 70 pearls for doing the introduction of nazjatar
young portal
Benthic tokens? so do your dailies/WQ's/rares/Algan on alts first to get Pearl's. Use those to buy benthic tokens and send+open on main
tight condor
Ah that's what you mean
spring yoke
You can also use an alt from the opposite faction to feed ur main
Just keep ur current pearls to upgrade the benthic instead of buying them
Unless you don't have 120 chars
tight condor
Yeah I got like 5 of them
spring yoke
Gl rolling benthic then ^^
tight condor
Thnx ill let you know how it goes 😂
umbral fiber
Can some1 tell me the "standard" Azerite Setup for m+ again? 2TTK, 2SS and 2EB ?
rigid mango
Yep.
umbral fiber
Aight, thanks
rigid mango
That's very standard and works always
Removing 1 of them and adding to another for certain weeks is also a thing
umbral fiber
Rn im running 3ss,2EB and 1 TC but I just noticed I can get some TTK+SS pieces
umbral fiber
It feels bad in pugs sometimes cause the tank chainpulls and I need to "waste" vanish to apply ss garrotes
modest tendon
Why is it a waste?
real bay
no restealth
modest tendon
In high keys do tanks not chain pull at all if they have an assa?
umbral fiber
depends
modest tendon
Surely the tank should chain pull every other pack if possible? It makes keys go so much faster
gentle zodiac
where can I find benthic priority? I'm not sure which pieces to upgrade first
bleak spoke
I tell my tanks to chain pull on their own safety
young portal
@gentle zodiac run a droptimizer sim
bleak spoke
If the silence is valuable then they shouldn’t
But if I were to play more shrouded traits I wouldn’t feel that way
modest tendon
How many do you run?
bleak spoke
1 usually
But I also play assa in keys mostly as a pocket pick for prio damage funnel
The dmg pattern isn’t reliant on stealth but energy balance of bleeds on poisoned targets so chain pulling can often be beneficial
So yeh if the tank wants silences on the mobs I ask for restealth
And I’ll use vanish as a defensive cd for the tank and only vanish for dam on bosses or very specific pulls where I have to push damage out
Cuz you get the same energy from rupture and garrote
pliant token
Hey guys, has someone a idea what I am missing to get a legendary log? (Last kill) https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/blackmoore/serokon?mode=detailed&zone=23#difficulty=4&boss=2298
pliant token
Clf :D?
pliant token
Ahh ok thx. Yes seems to be a lot potential in gear opti. But asked myself if my rotation is ok
verbal mantle
if you're playing with Subterfuge you should apply garrote twice instead of one
same when you're a refreshing it
@pliant token
lusty narwhal
verbal mantle
@pliant token
tropic ocean
top gear sims bbi on gorak tul higher than nothing personal
even though its my only nothing personal 😮
tight condor
What is the benefeit of the double garrote then?
tropic ocean
highest dot time for buffed garrote
upper ether
is it worth taking undulating tides over twist the knife?
upper ether
it does sim higher tho
rigid mango
Like I said, simbait
upper ether
ah ok thanks
dense cedar
For Azshara do we use our cloak for the personal LOS?
quartz depot
you can just feint if you have nostacks
sturdy mesa
What traits should i go for in m+ as, assass mostly i know EB is extremely good rn what should be 2nd/3rd choice
signal summit
ss and ttk
hushed arrow
Guys is it possible to have gear for pvp and for m+? Like 50/50 opti for both? And how would it look like in traits and stats?
signal summit
u dont go np or dd in pvp tho
royal lantern
np is....ok for 1x, dd is a nono, get ttk for pvp
cobalt pelican
you could prolly play something like 2ss 1eb 3ttk build
you'd have 1 wasted trait in pvp but like
it honestly rarely matters
half of the people who pvp don't really understand what traits do and think scent of blood is amazing so
rigid mango
I don't know shit about pvp, just read the basics in the guide
Last time i checked dd was there, mb
dark crag
Why is dd bad for pvp, is it nerfed there?
royal lantern
DD is just losing value cus you are not spamming muti all the time without any problems, and your main way too get a kill is too go kidney>M4D Envenom with all cd's and then pump in envenoms too score a fast kill
tulip iris
??????????????????????????????????https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jAxcTAnsPTm2DMmMVmUSeW
is this real?
i mean hard mode combination rings seems better than 440 and 430 socketed rings
tulip iris
but there is stat difference between ilvl too
dark crag
Weak
dark crag
No ashvanes this week and just 2 inkpods
desert vault
Is that the main reason to be running mechagon? Rings? I have only run it once just to see it
I have gotten lucky with two really good 445 rings for raid, but have nothing for m+
upbeat hazel
dense cedar
You get the extended rupture also
rigid mango
Garrote
tall narwhal
guys is it normal that with my current gear setup, assa ST 5 min patchwerk fights sims only like 2k dps more than outlaw
i always thought assa is way beyond outlaw on pure ST fight
vast forum
nah
dense cedar
whats ur gear?
tall narwhal
i simmed that with subterfurge
gonna run MA sim now
my essences are crap
that i know
vast forum
i mean, unless you have a somewhat optimized char, anything could happen with sims
sub could outsim assa if you have all the right traits for sub and all the wrong ones for assa
tall narwhal
gotcha
i think i have it pretty good for outlaw when it comes to traits
and for assa idk... like why doesnt sim select NP trait out of 2 possibilities i think
instead it takes triple DD
tall narwhal
god damnit i really like playing assa
but with the gear/traits that i have, seems like it's gonna be suboptimal compared to outlaw
desert vault
And all of the stuff in mechagon can wf, tf and socket right?
crystal vessel
One of the top rogue sims is subterfuge.
upbeat geode
if you dont have traits that are better than shrouded suff you have to play subterfuge
crystal vessel
(Above person doesn’t have SS traits)
royal lantern
MA is fine and everything
except when you get that 1 ''vanish into 0 crits'' pull
and think about doing alt+f4 too get a new pull, cus fuck that shit
tall narwhal
i have that feeling when playing assa in m+
and tank starts to chain pull
and i cant get a restealt
h
then im like
royal lantern
just fok 
cobalt pelican
ya he.. does?
i've not seen any sim where subterfuge with no ss is like.. better
i've seen sims where it's p close though
upbeat geode
this weeks tanks dont tend to chainpull as much, because leaving combat also drops necrotic, so you also get more restealths as sin
upbeat geode
having crip poison +FoK also helps the tanks on necrotic.
necrotic tyranical is one of the few weeks where i switch to sin
tight condor
How can I sim other essences?
sharp viper
top gear
tall narwhal
well when i run dungeon slice
with my current gear options, both specs are very close as well
outlaw is 51k dps
assa is 49k dps
modest tendon
Dungeon slice is a bit shit though 😛
tall narwhal
😄
kindred skiff
Trying to decide what to use for m+ this week. Since it's tyrannical I wanted to go with the NP option on head instead of EB, but not sure if I lose too much aoe damage for trash that way. Any suggestions?
upbeat geode
i would EB on head(just to have 1) and NP on chest if you want a NP somewere, since you wont be mutilating in trash anyway
modest tendon
So you really not have a better shoulder piece?
kindred skiff
I have a few more options for azerite pieces, but thought the 3 selected already were the best ones
Hmm that's true Eshalda, thanks for the advice.
sharp viper
i would go with eshalda wrote + the glad leather mantle with tk and SS
modest tendon
Eb ss on head, ss ttk on shoulders, ss np on chest
kindred skiff
I'll give it a shot. Thanks a lot!
upbeat geode
azerite has become a harder puzzle than the puzzle quests in Naj
kindred skiff
Should see my shadow priest, i have 20 different pieces im trying to optimize for this and that. Horrible stuff.
modest tendon
Customisation is a benefit and a cost of assa, just go outlaw if you want cookie cutter
kindred skiff
Nah, I don't like playing outlaw. played assassin since I made the char, dont think it's changing before Sub gets a buff
modest tendon
I’m alternating between outlaw and assa, outlaw is just better but I’m determined to make assa work because I think it’s more fun haha
sturdy dust
Does anyone have a link to a high sim where a rogue is using Subterfuge?
strange python
I plan on streaming rogue keys tonight. Would anyone be willing to take a look at it at tell me what I'm doing wrong? New to rogue, and I want to be prepared for my guild's raid on Friday.
rigid mango
Easier would be linking logs tbh
strange python
I can do that, I'm using ExRT, and I log everything
last ingot
For M+ this erek (tyrannical) is 2-2-2 good? (Eb-ss-ttk). Or should I take 1 less eb in exchange for something for the bosses? (12-14 level keys)
upbeat geode
dropping 1 eb is fine this week
turbid ruin
It's kinda just about getting 1 of each important one i feel
upbeat geode
but ofc it depends on what your gonna take instead, and what dungon you will do
strange python
Would I drop the link here?
fathom wyvern
is it worth running 1x ss trait for m+ or better to go 0 and MA over subterfurge?
covert schooner
hey guys im new here, i have a question about raidbots, it constantly tells me to go for mastery as main stat but i dont see anyone doing that and is driving me crazy
worldly iron
don't sim for stat weights, use top gear
also, subterfuge is the go to for m+, MA doesn't really do much
covert schooner
@worldly iron thank you, i was using all the utillities and stat weight was killing my sanity
fathom wyvern
better swap out my only TTK in m+ for a 2nd SS trait then?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/iSBH3G5caBFLboSs5UA3Vo ran a sim to show traits, 5 targets 40 sec
but like, how big is the ST dmg gain from 1 TTK trait over overall worth of 1 extra SS trait?
cobalt pelican
ss is a very good single target trait
covert schooner
i find ss damge to drop a lot after initial burst when i use it
cobalt pelican
well yeah, it's loaded into a 40 second window and then does nothing
covert schooner
i prefer sustain
last ingot
Ty. Is the preferred essences for M+: iris major, lucid dreams and purification beam minor? (Not having a lvl 65 neck so far)
covert schooner
dunno if it is better to hit 70k then drop to 30 or staying at 35 whole fight just my prefference i guess
cobalt pelican
i'm not saying ss is inherently better than ttk st but i'd say they're very comparable and it'd mostly depend on fight length which would be 'better' st, but ss has value that expands the course of the dungeon
you won't go down to 30 though
like, dps is measured across the fight length to the point you look at it it's not measured moment by moment
sour wasp
is 3dd 3ttk possible?
cobalt pelican
if you do 2m damage in the first 40 seconds
sour wasp
for st obv
rigid mango
Unsure.
cobalt pelican
don't think so
rigid mango
I think ttk and ss are similar boss damage wise in tyr dungeons
sour wasp
yeah, was thinking about that
rigid mango
Depends whether kill timer aligns with vanish or not
SS wins on fort weeks afaik, though
40 sec of raw burst 
covert schooner
i think it probably gets ahead when clearing but progression fights tend to be longer and if it doesnt hit vanish again is a lost of dps
crude topaz
Hi guys, i've been reading the suggestions for Raids & M+
Have i done this right? I'm using the top set in Raids and bottom for M+
covert schooner
i guess if the other trait is subpar you should run ss on raid
rigid mango
But what are you comparing it to, ttk?
cobalt pelican
looks okay ya, you need more helms though or alternative pieces
rigid mango
If so, probably not.
cobalt pelican
cause neither your raid helm or m+ helm are actually like good
cobalt pelican
i'd b surprised if gutripper on your raid shoulders was better than unstable flames too but that varies person to person
crude topaz
@cobalt pelican Ok, i will be able to get a 445 helm from Titan Res next week. Or hopefully a raid drop this week. Thanks!
@rigid mango ill try that too
cobalt pelican
not really
rigid mango
Didn't think so
cobalt pelican
and rolling helmet is kinda eh
it's like a really awkward time cause
if you just want to do m+ you kinda will end up rolling head
but for raid it's just kinda butt unless you get the one that doesn't suck
sour wasp
@rigid mango ss obviously ahead by 1 dps for me on st
rigid mango
crude topaz
So where should i try get helm from?
stable yarrow
Orgo shoulders is good for m+
cobalt pelican
the one from opulence was p ok
cobalt pelican
ya it kinda is now
cobalt pelican
kinda just depends where your priorities lie, you can roll helm and maybe get something ok for both or you can roll another slot if you're aiming for bisserest raid pieces
but if you're gonna roll another piece cause raid takes priority try getting one of the lower ilvl helmets with something useful on them
like mythic opulence can't be hard to kill now right
do groups even exist for that
crude topaz
My issue is i Riad, M+ and like to PvP.
cobalt pelican
unlucky
crude topaz
lol
rigid mango
Welcome to sin (:
upbeat geode
make a 2nd rogue, saves you reforge costs
crude topaz
urghh, only just geared this 1 🙂
My mage and rogue are both at the same point now, so i have to pick 1 to focus on
hollow junco
it's not so bad on sin
a spec where you pool a little bit from time to time anyway
cyclotronic is especially not that bad because you can do it while moving [out of fire]
wheat vigil
Yeah cyclo is well worth it for me. Rank 3 iris is good, 1-2 can be annoying
hollow junco
cyclotronic also should be used outside CD windows, so you don't have to worry about gcd perfect usage, only that you get enough total casts in throughout the fight and that you dont overcap energy too hard or let dots drop during
wheat vigil
Great for getting some damage in on azshara while you’re going los for the nuke
lean wing
cast while moving is fine
i died so many times on m+10 before having level 3 beam
but this dumb trinket where you stay 4 second like a bum
"fun"
wheat vigil
Basically the one from guldan
solid nova
@lean wing Iris?
wheat vigil
I mostly stopped using it when they made it break stealth
You should get a full blown marvel v capcom super combo finish for killing a boss w/iris
lean wing
@solid nova yes. but only level 1,2. level 3 is fine
wheat vigil
Do you all normally vanish off sivara’s javelin on mythic or just eat it
jagged wigeon
BoTE rank 3 isn’t better then Iris rank 3 for AoE?
sour wasp
nah
wheat vigil
Depends on # of targets I think
jagged wigeon
Yeah but BoTE 3 is BiS for outlaw in M+ I just don’t play sin in M+ only raids
sour wasp
bote is bis for outlaw since you're wasting too much time with iris as outlaw
assa doesn't have that problem since we cast 2 spells/ minute
rigid mango
Bote still seems better tbh, does similar aoe numbers, but much better ST
undone talon
!essence
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Essences overview: https://bit.ly/2XaZOVd
heavy trail
I just got the BOE island done after a few tries so now will get bote lol
scarlet sequoia
imagine not having rank 4 already
rigid mango
I meant it like
scarlet sequoia
rbgs do count
rigid mango
Raz is in the r1 rbg group
Iirc
Also, you seem to be wrong
So that's even more funny
crystal vessel
looks like another small indie company failure.
rigid mango
crystal vessel
achievement doesnt include rated battle grounds.
sour wasp
didn't raz just say they count?
crystal vessel
yes.
sour wasp
i'm still at 14800 honor since 2 weeks
rigid mango
I've not even got r1
sour wasp
lmao it's painful to grind
rigid mango
scarlet sequoia
think im at 150k now
crystal vessel
I have my R3. so doesnt really matter to me.
rigid mango
Cool.
crystal vessel
would have been easier with rated. lol
rigid mango
worldly moon
So Sims says CLF is highest, but tips in ep(icy veins) says to use lucid dream, what are you guys thought on essecene pick?
rough yew
Do you have two essences?
Like major and minor?
Use lucid on minor
CLF r3 major or iris for m+
If you don’t have CLF r3 use r3 flames
Aw fuck I’m in the wrong channel again
Gdamnit
heavy trail
BOTE is just cooler though, the laser beam is so meme... lol