assassination

[royal lantern]

or something like that

[obsidian girder]

im now a shadowdamage healing rogue

[potent oracle]

maghar orc is nice for rogue ?

[ripe nimbus]

Yes

[royal lantern]

if you like the race its nice for rogue

[sturdy python]

I really want to see the trait prio damage thing Koji was working on

[nimble tartan]

Any cuties online rn

[ripe nimbus]

U

[primal gazelle]

well during reaping, 5 procs of eb would give you 2200x5 = 11000 dmg + 6000 avg FOK hit = 17000 dmg to each target,

• Procs of instant poison = ??? idk how much dmg this is

its about half an envenom or more 😛

[wary ice]

@primal gazelle do you still use CT?

[primal gazelle]

ive never used ct

[lone junco]

Never?

[primal gazelle]

dont think ive used ct at all in s2

if i use 3 eb, i use HB

if i dont use 3 EB due to KR/TOS, i go PB anyways

[potent oracle]

Grommghar or Throghar , name for my maghar , cant decide 😛

[wary ice]

My still was in reference to S2

as in do you still use it from S1

is HB really that good?

[solid sundial]

how good is zandalari for rogues?

[primal gazelle]

its not that hb is insane

[ripe nimbus]

About as good as all the other races

[primal gazelle]

CT just sucks

[wary ice]

oof

[primal gazelle]

its literally terrible for reaping

and no ct = more ruptures and energy

[wary ice]

yeah not saying i disagree haha

I just liked pressing the CT button tbh

been PB or Outlaw all of S2

[primal gazelle]

if reaping come in waves youll have to CT multiple times just to keep up dots on all targets

HB also offers slight ST value

1-2%

[solid sundial]

CT is strong + enchoing blade you can deal 100k+ without and problem during reaping

any*

[wary ice]

by FoK @20 stacks?

[primal gazelle]

you dont stack it

just spam it

[wary ice]

on single target?

[primal gazelle]

oh

yeah

[wary ice]

got it

[primal gazelle]

id only use hb with 3 eb to

tho*

stick to pb/ct if you got 2

[wary ice]

I have 0 :^(

[primal gazelle]

then deadshot/wits for u

[wary ice]

My ass gear is ass for M+

lol

[nimble tartan]

Like my status if u have 4k dust

[primal gazelle]

@fleet anchor mentioned that outlaw with wits might possibility have higher priority dmg than assa with ttk? interested in seeing those numbers too

[wary ice]

Outlaw prio feels really good w/3DS

56k crits at 400ilvl

[vestal wren]

@primal gazelle iirc it was sth along:
subtlety - 30k prio damage
outlaw - 21k prio damage
assassination (with sob) - 20k prio damage
assassination (with 2x ttk - 19k prio damage

[primal gazelle]

rip to sub rog dreams as assa lmao

[vestal wren]

well subtlety styles on both outlaw and assassination in prio damage

[primal gazelle]

i mean if assa loses to outlaw for priority dmg....

what are we good for? LOL

[vestal wren]

it makes sense that both sub and outlaw are better if you think about it

[primal gazelle]

i thought envenom funnel would outdmg outlaw for priority dmg

i guess maybe cos outlaw can just focus one target, and assa loses uptime on "priority target" due to tab targetting to keep up ruptures etc?

[vestal wren]

koji modified the apl for prio damage

[primal gazelle]

so are those numbers, before or after the apl change

[vestal wren]

no with diffrent traits

it just shows that 2x ttk does agains common beleave not strike ahead in prio damage

iirc koji plans to bring prio_rotation to sin apl too (its in subtlety for quite a while now, probably not in the super near future tho)

mystler made some adjustment to prio_rotation for sub also recently, those are commented in #tc-updates

[wary ice]

Honestly really surprised by those numbers

[sick cradle]

Is it worth it to cap energy for a second or 2 if you have 5 cp and TB is coming up?

[strange python]

yup

it prob wont make much of a diff tho

since you'll gain that energy back during globals?

[primal gazelle]

put the ttk memes on hold lol

[vestal wren]

not sure what sim setup he used tho, i assume more bosses

so numbers are bound to the fight style

(the main conclusion is just that subtlety > outlaw > sin in prio damage)

with the margin between outlaw and sin beeing not to big

[gusty anvil]

Hey @vestal wren is there a fix yet for that extra line in the simc for troll racial yet?

[vestal wren]

nightly seems updated

[gusty anvil]

Okay. That on this disc somewhere?

[vestal wren]

raidbots discord, its linked on the raidbots site

[gusty anvil]

Okay thanks man

[vestal wren]

just klick on the link for discord

[safe egret]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[robust trench]

can someone explain why the bis trinkets are vers bonus on use. when vers is my last stat priority on ST

[fleet anchor]

@primal gazelle Well Outlaw has a rather significant benefit of only having to spend 1 trait on Wits and not having to compromise on traits/talents at all. Kinda a design advantage of the way Blade Flurry intrinsically works.

Basically only major trade off Outlaw makes is using Dancing Steel.

Which is a prio target buff in larger packs anyway. Just a ST loss.

[shy axle]

@robust trench because its much of it and it aligns with Vendetta

[cunning viper]

Does Master Assassin have an internal cooldown?

[safe egret]

I am trying to do the Master Assassin build and have some questions - ideally is your uptime on a boss fight for garrote and rupture both 100%?

[patent leaf]

is there a chance that sin got nerfed this patch? feels like my dps is really inconsistent now

[sturdy python]

@fleet anchor Are you still planning on posting your priority target damage findings?

Yes @safe egret

[shy axle]

@patent leaf no

[strange python]

as long as you can stealth, it activates

except with shadowmeld

yeah i watched some replay that rogue didnt pop it until the buff

[fleet anchor]

Yes Tawney. Probably not until tomorrow though due to my raid schedule.

[strange python]

which buff? @strange python

[sturdy python]

Alright, ty

You need a raise Koji

[strange python]

nvm

hoping for mekki bois chest today/tomorrow

[patent leaf]

idk if its eu servers only, but i went from having overall of 18k dps on 30 pulls on jaina to like 15k in 10 pulls right now and just all around feels like traits dont work sometimes

some pulls i have 22k dps, other pull i dip down to 15k

[sturdy python]

Take off and reequip azerite

[patent leaf]

nothing changed

[sturdy python]

Wouldn’t be surprising if your traits stopped working

[visual quartz]

yeah last night was rough for raiding, we had alot of ppl random crashing and 1-2k ms most of the night

[bleak spoke]

@primal gazelle I don’t like the sob, I feel this pressure to upkeep rupture rather than just snipe with ruptures

And these conflict with whether you want to env or put another rupture out which is probably hard to optimize and has to be done pack to pack

Gonna try to score rasta shoulders for ttk fok instead

And do 3 ttk 2 fok 1 ss

[safe egret]

For Master Assassin opener do you guys use toxic blade right after vendetta before vanishing or do vendetta vanish toxic blade like this-

Garrote
Mutilate
Rupture
Vendetta
Vanish
Toxic Blade
Mutilate till 4+ combo points
Envenom
Mutilate till 4+ combo points
Envenom

[bleak spoke]

ST I was suffering a little too you’re too reliant on the bounce back from second vend

And your opener is kinda weak compared to another ss

[strange python]

i tb out of vanish

[wary ice]

I TB before vanish then env->mut->env (mut)

[strange python]

^ thats a little riskier

[wary ice]

yeah

[strange python]

but it works if ur lucky

[pulsar goblet]

Got to risk it for the biscuit brother

[strange python]

this is true.

[wary ice]

I feel like if you're not setting urself up for highest output with MA you're better off with Sbut builds

[rigid mango]

I thought this was assa

not outlaw

[harsh sphinx]

when they all crit feelsgood

[strange python]

bull, that's extremely true heh

[wary ice]

Env mut env feels dope AF

[strange python]

i usually g m r vend 4 combos tb vanish env mut env

[wary ice]

env mut mut doesnt feel any where near as bad as it sounds like it would when u have 3 DD

[strange python]

idk if that's wrong but it feels nice

[wary ice]

Thats my opener

[strange python]

yep

sometimes im lucky and that 4 combos is 1 mut right after vend is popped

then everything crits out of vanish which is pog

shit thing is, if i have to mut 2x before vanish, im pretty starved

[wary ice]

I'll pool a bit off opner

most openers have lust

and between lust and vend

[strange python]

this is true

[wary ice]

energy is a non issue

I also have 3dd 3NP

[strange python]

oh yeah, i'm running 3dd 1np 1tc 1ttk

just cuz chest problems

ill prob swap that tc to np once i get my 3rd np from mekkiboi

[safe egret]

so you can get the mut env mut env within the 3 seconds?

[strange python]

yup

no

its just env mut env

3 globals

[safe egret]

ah

[strange python]

so while vanished, youll have 4-5 combo points and env

then mut, if u crit, u get 4 combos, if not, u get 2 which gg at that point

cuz instead of getting off a mut env under MA, you get mut mut

[mint peak]

If we could get 5 abilities in 3 GCDs I'd cream myself but also have arthritis

[strange python]

LOL

[desert vault]

is there any easy way to compare overall m+ damage like there is with raid DPS using warcraftlogs? I'm trying to figure out if I'm in the ballpark for my numbers I do in m+ compared to other similar dungeon levels and players

[strange python]

yup

go on warcraft logs and look under mythic + damage

it should show class/dungeon and damage done overall, i think?

it may just be rankings, actually.

[wary ice]

@safe egret you delay the vanish after your vendetta; so it looks like Vendetta->Mut->(Mut)->TB->Vanish->[ENV->MUT->ENV]

[strange python]

^

[wary ice]

the only real problem

is when ur tank decides to go for a fucking walk right when u pop vanish

and u can only get 2 gcd's in MA

[strange python]

LOL

[wary ice]

😠

[strange python]

thats so triggering

i always keep SS handy for that but global zz

[safe egret]

ahh gotcha

i was curious how you had the 4-5 cp

while vanished

[strange python]

its from that mut right after vend

and the tb before vend

[safe egret]

kk

[strange python]

if both crit, you're at 5. if they don't, you're at 3

which is why (mut) is there, cuz if your first mut doesn't crit, do another to get to 4

then commence the dam

[safe egret]

you wouldnt perform the second evenom if your mut didnt crit though right?

k

[strange python]

correct

during MA window

if your first mut doesnt crit, then you have to do another

it's not worth it to do a 2env under MA at all

[wary ice]

THats why its riskier

[strange python]

yep lol

[wary ice]

cause ENV MUT MUT is a worse MA rotation than TB MUT ENV

[strange python]

its god awful

is gore splattered vest nothing personal and shrouded suff worth keeping?

i would

for m+

with*

[wary ice]

theres also a VERY slighty desync that will be more noticible in like 12minute fights

by delaying the vanish and TB

[strange python]

what traits should i play for m+ or cleave in general 3x fok and ???

SS

3x?

if you can get it sure

it's pretty nice on packs

[wary ice]

EB>SS> SOB apparently

[strange python]

yup

[wary ice]

since @vestal wren shared some relative numbers that puts sob > TTK

[desert vault]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/rankings/20#metric=dps&boss=11754&class=Rogue&spec=Assassination&bracket=12&affixes=204

[strange python]

and does it make sense to sort of mix in st traits?

are people really taking hb with 3x eb?

@strange python ppl do that a lot

[desert vault]

feel like I'm looking at something wrong cause those don't look like overall DPS numbers ...

[wary ice]

Dayvanie is

[strange python]

depending on the dungeon and shit

i wonder how that works out in cleave

probably big ass fok hits lol

[wary ice]

From what he was saying you basically ignore it

where it stacks it stacks

[strange python]

oh, it's more passive if anything

[wary ice]

and then every 20stacks in ST u just burst with it

[strange python]

oh thats interesting

[wary ice]

I actually kind of like it since it brings in the 3 dead traits in ST

[strange python]

LOOL, 4 target dummies, not a single crit out of vanish

zzzz

[wary ice]

yikes i didnt realize i was talking to a bad player this whole time

[strange python]

brb deleting wow

smh im striking out on getting m+ azerites

outlaw for another week it is

[wary ice]

Same tbh

Im just gunna Run MA in dungeons

🤷

[strange python]

i mean, i have 3x ss 1x eb atm, thats about it

[wary ice]

I have 3dd 3 np :^)

[strange python]

oof

[wary ice]

whats with this inverse pirate?

On the real though: is MP worth considering over EP?

I've seen alot of people using i

and have noticed DP being a large portion of my damage since swapping to 3DD + MA

[strange python]

thats interesting

[wary ice]

I simmed myself and EP was still higher; but unsure if thats like a thing with more mastery

[royal lantern]

but dd and MA dont change anything for your deadly...?

[wary ice]

since mines pretty low

Actually that might just be a side effect of actually raiding

Since in S1 i only did dungeons

the other things are still in play

[soft island]

Is anyone familiar with the timewalking trinket Vestige of haldor? Is it secretly op?

[turbid zealot]

no idea

[ripe nimbus]

Why u guys wasting residuum trying to get sin M+ gear. U know u can just stockpile it till next season right it doesnt have a cap

Im at like 5k residuum

[turbid zealot]

true

[royal lantern]

why do i even bother too get gear in this expac, next expac quest gear is better

[turbid zealot]

ooof

im sitting at 6k since i have wwhat i want

[primal gazelle]

how do you know blizz wont use different TR for season 3 gear

[ripe nimbus]

Thats a bit different bud. U can just play outlaw and do fine in M+ ur trying to optimize a worse performing M+ spec essentially just wasting residuum

[spice surge]

They've said they're gonna rewamp the azerite system

So i dont think holding will make a massivedifference

[primal gazelle]

every piece is gonna have every trait available in the new tier

whats the point of stockpiling TR

[ripe nimbus]

Everything is just going to be unlocked dont need levels to get traits the vendor and azerite armor isnt going anywhere

[mint peak]

I can't wait until 10.1 so I can finally care about gear all you noobs trying to DPS now smh

[primal gazelle]

imagine saving up 3 months worth of TR just to buy 1 piece of gear 4 months later 🤔

[ripe nimbus]

Imagine gambling on gear for sin M+ when u can just hit swap spec and not gamble and waste TR

[primal gazelle]

you act as if there isnt a bis outlaw traits to "gamble" for

[ripe nimbus]

U can get those all from raid

[spice surge]

You say that like outlaw is strictly better in m+

[mint peak]

What if people...want to play Assa in M+....

[spice surge]

Which it isnt, especially when people start to get more gear

Since outlaw is allergic to gear scaling 😄

[primal gazelle]

even if i get sin bis, ill still spend my TR for outlaw/sub bis, just to have more options and variety to swap around playing different stuff

saving TR for 3 months when you dont even know if blizz might change how TR works is just stupid

[ripe nimbus]

Sub bis

[primal gazelle]

method doing azerite funnel runs was dumb af, allowing them to buy 3x 415s first week of mythic

blizz will definitely fix that

or require different types of TR for season 3

[cerulean walrus]

Or increase the cost again

[ripe nimbus]

Or u know they wont because they rarely fix anythin lol

[wary ice]

??

Thats a hot take crit

[ripe nimbus]

The cost is going up def. But u can easily save enough to afford at least 2. Most likely 3

[primal gazelle]

sub is insane for high tol keys still, ill spend my TR on bis sub traits if i get sin/outlaw bis

[ripe nimbus]

There are still bugs in game that ive reported in alpha

[primal gazelle]

minor bugs yeah

[cerulean walrus]

Maybe they're features

[primal gazelle]

azerite is a big deal

compared to your bugged quest giver or w/e

[wary ice]

What makes sub so good for Tol?

[primal gazelle]

1st and 2nd boss

and 2 shadowsteps for the last one is good too

[wary ice]

oh sick u dont open the gates to get that dope damage

trash doesnt matter cause of cannons?

[primal gazelle]

yea

spec entirely ST

[wary ice]

thats actually really cool

I'll have to give that a shot

been looking for an excuse to be blue

[primal gazelle]

you can open the gates before the 2nd boss, and drag the mobs into the boss for the sub pad

and 1st boss on high tyrannical gets brutal

takes 3-5 min on a 20+

sub is best for that fight

[wary ice]

I love that fight on prot

cause ur basically a DK the whole time

[royal lantern]

''cries in 0 leach gear on his warrior''

[wary ice]

leech is a meme;u just VR all the lil bugs

but not the place for it sorry

[bleak spoke]

yeh to this day haven't matched the damage i could do with sub funnel at like 375 or 380 gear on sand queen when shuriken combo lmao

[primal gazelle]

its crazy how fast they nerfed first dance trait

meanwhile they let warlocks keep their OP trait for all of progression into the next patch

meanwhile sub gets a "hotfix" nerf

[patent leaf]

it was also crazy first week into heroic doing 28k constant dps on the boat on blockade and finishing with 23k dps

the trait was broken honestly

😄

[primal gazelle]

not as broken as warlocks explosive potential trait

the lock in my guild simmed 33k st

now he sims 29k...

[patent leaf]

cool and what about the actual dps

cuz locks in my guild sim 32k and i still outdps them in the long term

or come close

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/79mtDRb4zdPkaZ1V#fight=7&type=damage-done

tell me this wasnt broken 😄

[stark ingot]

hey i just rogue for fun as an alt so im not up to date on everything, i see for sin people are 3 eb 1 ss and 2 ttk. dont want to stack ss anymore?

i have 3 ss 3 eb atm

[primal gazelle]

those locks in your raid werent even demo

[wary ice]

UR locks sound bad tbh

[patent leaf]

thats literally week 1 of heroic

[wary ice]

Our demo locks avged 28-33k

[primal gazelle]

week 1 of heroic when nobody has double traits

sounds like a great indicator of class balance

[patent leaf]

even better, imagine doing 21k dps mainly as ST as 391 with no double traits

[flat ocean]

honestly they couldve not nerfed sub and it would still eat shit to sin/outlaw

[patent leaf]

🤔

[flat ocean]

lmao

that spec is fucking garbage

except you had double traits

[wary ice]

I like sub; but its current iteration just feels like playing Assassination with a REALLY fast vendetta and no Venomous Wounds

[patent leaf]

i wish sub was a thing

[primal gazelle]

this was my first stormwall kill, i dont see how 21k is so impressive?

[wary ice]

whoa is that a feral?

I havent seen a feral in 3 years tbh

[primal gazelle]

82% parse at 21k as sub, vs my 61% as 20.5 as sin

a higher 80-90 sin parse would prob beat out your sub parse there

how is that op? lmao

[patent leaf]

hows that laminaria damage looking like

[hollow stone]

Implying that sin pads on the boat phase, the phase thats also st?

I dont..

[primal gazelle]

damn bro, your sub st lost to a FERAL

how does it feel?

wait jk, you beat him by 200 dps on boss

still dont get how that makes sub overpowered in any w ay

[rigid mango]

sub op? what?

[flat ocean]

sub is hot garbage

and its staying that way

[primal gazelle]

idk he linked a stormwall log saying sub was "broken" first week of raid cos he did 21k dps

[flat ocean]

He thought first dance trait was op

but it made them barely viable and then got nerfed

they have 0 scaling and just do raw damage

kinda shir

shit*

[patent leaf]

mate, u have the weirdest flex ever

lmao

week 1 also that was the highest dps rogue log

[primal gazelle]

im not even flexing

[bold hearth]

Careful, he'll charge you for that log analysis

[sterile ocean]

if sub is op now i wouldent mind switching if needed

[primal gazelle]

i just didnt understand your "flex"

[patent leaf]

it wasnt a flex

im implying the scaling was gonna go out of hand

thats how stats work

[primal gazelle]

how is 21k dps out of hand? lol

[wary ice]

Wasnt TFD Haste mostly just for Energy Regen?

My understanding of the spec is superficial at best

[visual quartz]

ppl that play it exclusively but dont know how to play it, those ppl make me sad

[solid nova]

If only there was a place where you could talk about sub

[safe egret]

It seems like toxic blade only lines up with 1st (opener) and 3rd vendetta vanish window. is that expected? to use vendetta vanish without toxic blade on the second 2 min cd window?

[solid nova]

Toxic blade on CD

Its literally that straight forward

[wary ice]

Ur missing timings if tb is desyncing with vendetta and vanish

[bold hearth]

For 2nd Vendetta window you use TB before Vend comes up and then hold Vend/vanish for the next TB

[safe egret]

oh so it shoul dline up for every 2 min cd window?

[wary ice]

TB cd is 24s; V/Va are 120

every 5 tb's will be empowered by V and/orVa

[safe egret]

k

[flat ocean]

I think depending on the fight you can hold TB

But normally you hold vend/vanish

[bold hearth]

Probably better to hold Vend/Vanish

As long as you don't hold Vend/Vanish for a total for 2 mins over the fight you're not losing anything

[flat ocean]

I think oppulence is the only fight i hold TB

for 2nd vend

Lines up so i get 4th room buff for the whole tb

Cause we leave it at like 1:59

Still might not be worth it

just feels good

[bold hearth]

Also means you're probably losing 1 more TB on the boss in last phase

which will be worth more

[flat ocean]

Nah doesnt affect last phase really

[bold hearth]

depending on how long you're holding it

[flat ocean]

Would matter more if there wasn't like 10 seconds downtime between the bosses

Anyone a Ztroll rogue?

Feel any good?

[strange python]

They sure are ugly

[lusty narwhal]

^ obvs plays belf

[flat ocean]

Who doesnt lmao

[lusty narwhal]

Ztroll is cool

[strange python]

bloodelfs are like half the size

they are massive

[flat ocean]

Is the bleed affected by mastery?

[wary ice]

Def rolling a Ztroll

[strange python]

No

[wary ice]

Unsure what to roll as though

[strange python]

its whitelisted

afaik

[flat ocean]

Damn

I expected that for VW but not the mastery

Wonder if that makes crit>bleed for sin

[stuck knoll]

Check tc research

[sturdy python]

Probably but you can sim it now on the nightly

[ripe nimbus]

Probably the bleed is pretty meh

[stuck knoll]

Fuu sent strings if you wanna check

[smoky bluff]

zandalari lowers my dps

blizz, buff'em

[stuck knoll]

Who tf cares it's like .2

[sturdy python]

I think the glider makes up for it

[flat ocean]

How do you sim as ztroll?

[smoky bluff]

check #tc-research

there is some instruccions there

[strange python]

Male or Female

[lusty narwhal]

Yeah i lost like 100dps but its fuck all

[potent oracle]

guys yulon + tol dagor trinket is good for mythics ?

[lusty narwhal]

Ztroll alpha race

[royal lantern]

female zandalari look like normal trolls

and they cant be the alpha race btw

[potent oracle]

like yulon trinket is worth ?

for mythic or raid ?

[rose wharf]

Quick question foir Traits: 2xSS+2NP with 1EB/Scent or should i go for DD and Twist regarding M+. ( an abit ST, still trash matters)

[royal lantern]

DD is basicly ussules for m+

[lusty narwhal]

Unless tyrannical

[royal lantern]

you spend more time on trash in tyrannical weeks too

[flat ocean]

thats why outlaw is the pogchamp in M+ atm

trash kings

[stuck knoll]

👑🗑

[rose wharf]

i dislike outlaw

[flat ocean]

in M+ its fun as

Rolls mean fuck all

[rose wharf]

With 2 SS i can prob play exsan again

[tight meteor]

how do i look at how many envenoms i cast during tb on a log

[strange python]

How do i enable Combopoints on the enemies nameplate in ElvUI, all my settings were reset with the latest update?

[cerulean walrus]

Yeah nameplates got messed up with the new UI scaling

Why on the nameplate though? Combo Points are universal now and not target based

[shrewd plover]

We can up combo point in fight out with FOK ? Its new ?

[cerulean walrus]

What?

[strange python]

Does anyone know if simc accounts for shadowmeld with ss?

[cerulean walrus]

Probably not

[tight meteor]

@shrewd plover bug

[shrewd plover]

yes but its work ?

and i can spam FOK in stealth

[solid nova]

@strange python It does

[tight meteor]

yeah its a bug

[strange python]

Well i always had it on enemy nameplates, so i can see how many cp's i have, instead of always looking in the middle on the screen

So for nighelf rogues. Is it better to go with SSx3 or SSx2, DD?

[cerulean walrus]

It would probably still be best to sim

If it accounts for Shadowmeld simming is still the answer

[primal gazelle]

Optimal boss opened in m+? Fok to 5–> open on boss with 5 cp envenom —> double garrote?

[solar quarry]

which gem do you guys take on oppulence

[fiery cradle]

ruby

[mint peak]

Ruby because I'd go Outlaw if I wanted to cheese adds and my guild kills em all in 4 seconds anyways

[fiery cradle]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[primal gazelle]

Someone smart pls do the math for the optimal opener with this fok bug 😂

[fleet whale]

i take opal if other people have ruby

[potent oracle]

nothingpersonal stacks ?

or i only need 1 ?

[fleet whale]

it's fine if you stack them

[potent oracle]

i have 2

3 mutilate , 2 nothing 1 rupture treit

for raid dont know if its the best

[bleak spoke]

damn is there a way to calculate scent of blood uptime with more than just the one stack

so like time spent with 2 ruptures out or 3 or etc

[turbid zealot]

what does snapshotting a gorrote actualy mean?

[spice surge]

The garrote from subterfuge does 80% increased damage

[turbid zealot]

ye

[spice surge]

That 80% increase is active until you either refresh it or it drops of

[turbid zealot]

so would i have 2 drop it then reapply with vanish garotte

[mint peak]

Yeah you basically don't refresh an empowered one early. Let it fall off then varish-garotte, then let that one fall off before your non empowered garrote

[turbid zealot]

ah ok

overall how much would that increase my dps?

[mint peak]

A lot

[turbid zealot]

ty

have been scratching my head why i cant get high logs on wow progress

thats why im askin

[rocky ruin]

that mean you let 2 empowered garrote fall off and then follow up with non empowered garrote

[turbid zealot]

yea

ty

[slow mortar]

Wait hold up.
Is Nelf(meld+garrote with SS traits) > Worgen(+1% crit)?
Also if you overwrite a regular garrote with an empowered one, is the entire 1.3x duration garrote is empowered? I wanna say yes but who knows

[plain thistle]

yes, you get the entire duration empowered

[peak saffron]

there's a FoK bug?

[nimble tartan]

Ok heres what u do

Garrote one

Garrote two

[peak saffron]

also, does anyone know which Loa buff is best for sin rogue yet? I'm assuming it's Paku or Kimbul

nevermind, I see raidbots still doesn't support the racial yet. guess we'll wait and see

[hollow stone]

Its likely paku

But we'll see

[gusty anvil]

the racials are there

race=zandalari_troll and zandalari_loa=paku in the line below

[quaint sequoia]

any race sims yet?

[lusty narwhal]

Check TC research channel. Can sim with nightly build

Not sure if its entirely accurate but its something

[dark crag]

does jaina reduce haste on mythic? my energy reg felt so bad if i look back at stormwall

[strange python]

No

Hm I get a 0,4% increase from akunda

everything else is a downgrade to belf

[golden relic]

dafuq does akunda do

[strange python]

its the heal one

so the sim doesnt make sense

I must've messed smth up

[obsidian ruin]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6sAjoCjyixbSHfH6DptWar

if anyones interested

[cerulean walrus]

Uhhh yeah I don't even have to be in stealth for FoK to give combo points out of combat

[obsidian ruin]

im just assuming they are implemented

fuu said they should be

[lone junco]

next time run it with Blood elf. undead. troll etc.

[obsidian ruin]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wPnBPuzqZhhGGjStywn6jZ

[warm harbor]

nub question but does shadowmeld proc sub

[obsidian ruin]

w/ belf & maghar orc

[visual quartz]

pretty sure shadowmeld procs SS not subt though

[dry widget]

in raid gives you 3 cp + ss @warm harbor no subt

[warm harbor]

aight thanks

[lone junco]

@obsidian ruin rip

[heavy skiff]

there is no way to make ur tab detect mobs that have garrote on it and skip them right?

cause im sick of having 3 targets

g tab g tab g

and i g the same mob twice

i mean why blizz why

[visual quartz]

tab target doesnt even work the way they actually says it does

[heavy skiff]

nope

[pulsar goblet]

Honestly in a pack of 3-4 it nevers tabs to the same target

[heavy skiff]

it happend to me

on 3 targets

[pulsar goblet]

Like on 4 targets g tab g tab g tab r

seems to always work

but maybe im lucky 🤷

[visual quartz]

if a mob circles behind your cone of los it could happen, mine also never hits the same twice with 4 mobs unless that happens

[heavy skiff]

so i cant be in the middle of a pack?

this also happens a lot to me if i want to ggg vanish ggg

in that case i gust give up on tab

and try to click em

can u configure nameplates somehow so that the ones with g show at the back?

[strange python]

I'm sure you can custom make smth like that with plater

[vocal ocean]

Anyone know if the gift of the Loa bleed works with exsanguinate ?

[lone junco]

@heavy skiff left click them.

Top secret method.

I literally pick out the elites.

[round harbor]

Yup

You can tab to the closest mob to the middle of your screen and it works outward

IDK if that's default or what but it's what I've seen

[potent oracle]

alchemy trinket is worth ?

[cobalt gyro]

if you haveb nothing better, sure

but it's kinda average

[icy ember]

it is the only decent one, you mean

[dense imp]

Hey friends, what’s the optimal m+ build for assa? I see OL is the go to but I don’t have any swords

Sorry if it’s been asked a ton

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[stable pine]

!wa

For those who’s using Afrnar’s WA - how can you tell if the garrote is empowered?

[round harbor]

@dense imp if your just starting out any combo of eb/ss/ttk will work. As you play more and more you'll learn in which situations you'll want different traits on pieces of gear that you specifically have

[lone junco]

@stable pine mizerok kit is nice. I remove the E bar and cps. But love it overall.

Shows EMP for the subterfuge garrote.

[stable pine]

@lone junco cheers - will check it out.

[little sandal]

its Kimbul's Razor Claw good for assa?

[strange python]

Not that good

[lone junco]

Check the charts. And I think meh.

[strange python]

Hey guys, with 3 x DD does anything change in the opener or regarding vanish??

[scenic nacelle]

are you running MA?

[strange python]

Yes

[scenic nacelle]

I think it's the same

[strange python]

Okay thankyou.

normal MA opener

[silent silo]

Can you vanish the brawlers guild bosses for ma?

[red zealot]

So question is it gonna be killer if I dont get a SS but I can get 1 Np 3 DP and 2 Treach?

[warm harbor]

is DP suppose to be double dose?

[red zealot]

yes sorry

[warm harbor]

then yeah that set up should be fine for ST running an MA build, however be aware your dmg will be severely lowered during times of TC downtime

[spiral blade]

Probably asked an answered already but , Zand Troll racial good enough to switch over for assasin

[red zealot]

Thanks figured id ask atleast I know SS is great for anything 2+ targets but d id see a few on WCL of rogues not using it on like jadefire etc

[crystal vessel]

3 NP is BIS?

[eager haven]

@silent silo some you can, some it’ll reset. Happened to me earlier

[supple hearth]

@spiral blade you can sim in raidbots I think. Check #tc-research for discussion on it. It's not in herodamage yet.

[hollow stone]

Racials are minimal. If you like a race, play it

[rustic ether]

zandalari troll racials is the new opulence question

[hollow stone]

Got a 93 on opu tonight. Ruby boiz fo lyfe

Lolol

[river zinc]

i was under the impression that Kimbuls razor claw is good, but it never sims higher even at higher item level.

[rustic ether]

its decent

[bleak spoke]

Parsing well with ruby always makes me vaguely sad

[warm harbor]

opu is off all-stars so who cares

[crystal vessel]

15 ilvl better than bis stats?

for azerite

[warm harbor]

you mean traits? azerite only has main stat

[scenic nacelle]

Racial sims are out and it doesnt look pretty

[obsidian ruin]

Ye unfortunately reflects the sim i posted earlier

[halcyon grotto]

Anyone else noticing heed my call not doing any damage since patch?

A hunter buddy of mine is still around 5% overall damage with it. Didn’t proc for me once tonight in BoD

[primal gazelle]

oo this grave bolt change is so good for EB dps

massive dps increase for me 😄

[cobalt gyro]

ya

[primal gazelle]

now they come to melee range before casting grave bolts

this is actually huge

since EB has a small radius

[cobalt gyro]

yes

https://i.imgur.com/WqWTEw4.png

mfw mediumpump pumps harder

[bleak spoke]

Pumping as intended

[crude bay]

Wiping as intended?

[cobalt gyro]

he has 425 daggers too

compared to my 410

[bleak spoke]

That would be enormouspump nudo

[crude bay]

true

or just nudo ❤

[civic palm]

#off-topic 👈

[cobalt gyro]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[rose loom]

If I'm not planning on pushing higher into m+ would it be worth to keep rolling 400 azerite pieces for better traits with residuum instead of upgrading to 415's?

[icy ember]

no

[round harbor]

why not rng the best gear possible

[bleak spoke]

another timed shrine 15, would have counted before change too

assa's actually so incredibly good here

[royal lantern]

*assa is incredibly good

[bleak spoke]

yeh

but it's more pronounced in shrine cuz of the silence

ttks feel hella nice

[ripe mesa]

hey guys treacherous covent or nothing personal?

[brazen lintel]

El Sim it <3

[ripe mesa]

good idea

[worldly iron]

I don't like TC I always prefer how consistent NP is

[real bay]

1v1 NP wins easily

is 39-40k overall in AD good

never looked at overall much cause I'm pepega

[ripe mesa]

i thought that but simming atm

tc is better for me apperantly quite big actually

[real bay]

you have one NP already?

[ripe mesa]

well 200 dps not that big

yea

i have 1 np so probably thats why

[real bay]

y

[ripe mesa]

thanks for making me look haha

[worldly iron]

assuming that's with 100% TC uptime?

[ripe mesa]

yea with 100%

[worldly iron]

that's the reason I don't like TC, don't want to have it drop off

[ripe mesa]

haha i guess np dosnt stack

[real bay]

good for burn phases it does like 60k dmg with one trait

TC is kinda meh

[ripe mesa]

yea well i have 1 np and 1 tc now

[worldly iron]

damage from NP stacks

not the energy though

[ripe mesa]

oh ok thanks guys ill try it in a real world and see what i prefer

best way to test

[worldly iron]

speaking of burning, I almost crit 100k yesterday with envenom

98k, so close

[brazen lintel]

ilvl?

wth

i can only do that on opulence :(

[worldly iron]

was on an opener, I'm 409

[ripe mesa]

im only 404 atm

[worldly iron]

I have TTK

[brazen lintel]

ye same

i usually crit around 60k on opener

[worldly iron]

2x TTK and it lets me crit massively on opener

[ripe mesa]

i need the dice trinket seems everyone has that

[brazen lintel]

is that trait good?

[worldly iron]

well.. it's alright, I've just been forced to play it

progressing mekkatorque (reclearing this week) and I've yet to recieve a single piece with DD

[brazen lintel]

:(

finally got the CotL mythic helm yesterday

[worldly iron]

I have SInister's Gladiator Badge at 400

[brazen lintel]

felt pretty good

[worldly iron]

so that's why I crit so hard

just pop it with vendetta and let TTK envenoms blast

[brazen lintel]

i wanna try that out now

:(

[ripe mesa]

i guess i gotta farm M+ free hold haha

[worldly iron]

TTK is nice for Opulence

lust + crit into TB and TTK envenoms on the big golden boi

[brazen lintel]

oooo

[ripe mesa]

i dont pvp atm so rip im never getting that trinket

[brazen lintel]

is that the vers trinket?

[worldly iron]

so yeah, my azerite loadout is 2x TTK, 2x SS, 1 NP and 1 Blood Rite

it hurts me 😦

no, it's the agi pop

[brazen lintel]

ahhh

[worldly iron]

I've got the vers trinket at 390 which lasted me a long time

[brazen lintel]

lol, i need kr trinket

so hard

[real bay]

405 plume and galecaller

[bleak spoke]

stilll haven't seen a plumage since the one i got from week one at 390 D:

[real bay]

with avoidance

[brazen lintel]

i hate galecaller

its so broken but so annoying to use

[bleak spoke]

i have a love/hate relationship with it

[real bay]

same, I don't use it it sims only 50dps more

or

close to that

[bleak spoke]

weirdly i like it in dungeons

[worldly iron]

while I really enjoy SS gameplay, I really wish I could play MA for certain bosses

game pls

give me some azerite

[ripe mesa]

can get nice boosts from opener with gale

[bleak spoke]

fixes situations where you mismanage your energy

and you're energy negative for a large pack

instead of having to dot up every 3/4 globals you can just continue as tho nothing happened

[real bay]

how bad is the TD cannon trinket

[bleak spoke]

yes

well depends

[worldly iron]

absolutely

[ripe mesa]

i have it

[real bay]

weekly was 410 socketed

[bleak spoke]

if you're fighting on any slightest hint of elevation

[ripe mesa]

need to replace 415

[bleak spoke]

gg

[cobalt gyro]

anyone have any issues with weakauras etc atm?

[bleak spoke]

it will fire into the ground

[brazen lintel]

this might be a weird questoin butis it normal to have lower dps than ur sims?

[bleak spoke]

@cobalt gyro seem to be updating kinda slow yeh

[cobalt gyro]

like

[bleak spoke]

of course, sims are played under ideal conditions

by a roboto

[cobalt gyro]

my outlaw one is just not tracking BR cooldown

[brazen lintel]

oh thank god

[cobalt gyro]

or blade flurry

etc

[bleak spoke]

wat

go check if they're like

actually tracking the right spell

if they're legacy auras hit the convert button

there was an update recently

[cobalt gyro]

i'm using miz's OL suite

[ripe mesa]

invocation of yulon or cannon?

[bleak spoke]

they sound equally unappealing but yulon i think

[ripe mesa]

cannons at 415 and yulon is 400 socket

[bleak spoke]

yulon doesn't bug out really

stat budget from socket is very high on trinkets

lots of times even a shit trinket with socket will outsim a really nice one at a higher ilevel

[ripe mesa]

ill test i want hld

from freehold

[cobalt gyro]

huh, seems like timers are busted in general

wtf

[bleak spoke]

you mean the dice?

dice is kinda whatever imo

like it's nice ST

i'd much rather have a spyglass for dungeons

@cobalt gyro how much crit do you run on your sin set

[cobalt gyro]

like % or

[ripe mesa]

ah ok haha

[harsh raven]

Finally got the missing piece where MA sims better than Subterfuge for me

Is the opening with MA in the guide correct? Vanish > TB ...?

[vast forum]

Yes

[harsh raven]

Reason I´m asking is that I´ve seen several people talking about Vanish > Envenom

[vast forum]

Vanish>env>mut>env is after opener

[harsh raven]

aaah, so they meant during regular rotation

[vast forum]

Though i'm inclined to believe with the new fok bug we should open with 2cp and go g>r>m>vendetta>tb>vanish>env

[strange python]

I just use a WA to track procs. If I have 50% crit before/during the vanish/Vandetta window I go vanish>env otherwise I go vanish >TB.

50 with procs + 50 from MA. 100 % Env mut Env is better

[pliant nest]

What new fok bug?

[bleak spoke]

t

wait that doesn't cap e?

if you don't take the muti between g and r?

[vast forum]

Maybe it overcaps like 5 energy but it prevents overcapping of 1-2 cps which is probably more valuable

[bleak spoke]

yeh

feels like it has to be more accurate than opening muti

that's actually so yikes

[pliant nest]

Hey @vast forum what fok bug were you talking about?

[cobalt gyro]

hit fok

you get combo points

hit or not

[pliant nest]

So even if theres no enemies around?

[cobalt gyro]

yes

[pliant nest]

Ah ok thanks!

If theres 1 enemy around do you always get 2 cp then?

[cobalt gyro]

no

[winter gale]

Guys I bought a chestpiece yesterday and got my 3rd DD trait wich makes my setup : 3xDD, 2xTC and 1xTTK. Couse of that I lost 1xNP and 1xSS. I simmed myself and with MA talent im doing 2.1% more dmg, some 600 dps more wich is great. But whatever I read ppl suggest atleast 1NP.
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vfmDg4GxMU5yCmodshLGiT

Should I stick to this sim result or get one NP back?

[royal lantern]

if it sims better for you you should stick with it

[winter gale]

And do I lose anything if even one add is included due to not having subterfuge to fast dot em?

ss*

[royal lantern]

tbf, in the current raidtier there is almost no fight where you need too garrote multidot

maybe grong if you dont delay the kills and rasthakhan on pull

[winter gale]

Y, mostly its singletarget

[royal lantern]

everything else is pretty much pure st where subterfuge garrote on multiple targets is not avaible/doesnt really matter

[winter gale]

Ill just keep it then like this and switch when needed

Im on Mythic Rastakan atm anyways

Ty @royal lantern for ur time

[royal lantern]

you can take subterfuge on rastakhan when you want more deeps i gues

but even he is a pure st fight, on p1 the siegbreaker needs too die fast, after that you always only go for 1 target

[winter gale]

Or I can stay since im in death realm and adds in 1st phase die quickly

Y,y

[royal lantern]

melee in deathrealm, lul

[winter gale]

Thats the order 😂

[fiery cradle]

i hope ur talking about heroic

[winter gale]

I speak about mythic but we had only 1hr on it

Maybe that will change

[fiery cradle]

yeah i mean melee really shouldn’t have to go downstairs unless ur stacked on melee

[winter gale]

Then most likely ill be out when we get back there.

[royal lantern]

pretty much all guilds i know use the ''build a gate wall and afk dps with ranged''strat for the deathrealm

(not like its different then ussual, ranged dps is always afk dps)

[fiery cradle]

thatnis the meta

[winter gale]

Death's Door at entrance?

[royal lantern]

yeha

[vestal wren]

btw. the win from starting wiht 2 cp is somewhat around 10 dps

so the bug is not rly impactfull

[vast forum]

It's a qol bug tbh

Maybe exsg opener could change to rggvr-exsg

Still doubt it will be a noticable gain

[warm drift]

fok keeps you also in stealth, that wasnt before or?

[royal lantern]

nope, stealth broke when you used fok

tbh, that seems all like a bug

those are changes that should be in the patchontes otherwise

[vestal wren]

it is a bug

[warm drift]

yeah i wonder how blizzard can fuck those things up

[vestal wren]

new patch brings always some suprises

[ripe nimbus]

because in a game with a billion lines of coding adding/changing anything can have any affect on any part of that coding

[royal lantern]

^^^^^

[vestal wren]

dps wise, its quite 🤷 in pve

[warm drift]

in pvp it is kinda abusable

[vestal wren]

did not test it in pvp

but i can see it beeing more of an issue there

[warm drift]

stealth bugs + combopoints in stealth

lul

[vast forum]

Opening with full kidney while keeping mfd for an env during tb

[warm drift]

kinda big

[spare dust]

What bug are you talking about?

[vast forum]

Also out of los and filling your cps

[vestal wren]

@spare dust try using fok anywhere without a target (it will generate 1 cp per use)

[spare dust]

Oh ok, i will :3

[minor bay]

is it a few ruuptures and then literally spam fan with eb on reaping packs or is it worth to fish for bomb procs/elaborate planning uptime? Assuming there's no prio target

[spice surge]

you need 4 bleeds up at all times to sustain energy

Or to "snipe" low hp mobs to get the refunded energy

[minor bay]

but after that is sorted out

I mean i do 100k + just spamming fan

[spice surge]

If you need to aoe yeah you spam fan

If you need prio damage you envenom

[unique flax]

do i use hidden blades on st?

if talented

[heavy skiff]

Ye

[unique flax]

do i wait till it hits 20?

[heavy skiff]

At 20 stacks

[unique flax]

say if its a boss fight

i just use it when the add spawns right

[heavy skiff]

If there are adds spawning at some point

Safe it 4 there

[unique flax]

roger that tyvm

[sterile magnet]

Hey all, Im running into a weird situation with my azerite traits. I'm mainly basing this on mythic mekka btw. Anyway top logs and sites like bloodmallet are showing that multiple copies of NP are the way to go, however in Sims I do most St damage running 1 NP one ttk and one bbi with 3 overwhelming power. Anyone know why NP is performing so well on mekka?

[solid nova]

You should look at the values each trait adds in terms of DPS as for example, 1 DD is worth more than 2nd NP.

[spice surge]

I like how you're refering to the bis setup as "a wierd situation" 😄

[manic veldt]

I have a question for mekatorque mythic . When i have the BIG shunk on me . Do shadowstep on boss trigger on other player or not cause im not "moving" ?!

[spice surge]

Overwhelming power is very strong

[sterile magnet]

Sorry the options both include 3x DD (so 3x DD with 3 x NP vs 3 x DD with ttk and bi and one NP)

[strange python]

So you have 1st boss, Gorak Shoulders and Ceph chest?

[sterile magnet]

Yeah so basically my gut and this theoretical tripple overwhelming power sim is telli me it's better but the logs are showing that more NP is better

[strange python]

Omg

[sterile magnet]

Yeah I do

[spice surge]

Its not that twist is better than NP, its that overwhelming power is so much better than the other alternative that it outweights the difference

[strange python]

You have BiS

[sterile magnet]

Yeah I got both shoulder and chest from first random 415 pls don't hate

[strange python]

Just embrace it! I got my 3rd spywarp in a row 😂

[winter gale]

Cephalohide chest is bis? @strange python

I got it yesterday and almost deleted it due to my previous one having one NP

[grizzled jay]

For M+, cephalo enables you to play the elusive 3TTK 1SS 2EB build

[echo crest]

!azerite

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o

[spice surge]

All azerite pieces have 3 dps rings on them, only looking at 2 of them is rather silly

Especially with how incredibly strong overwhelming is

[echo crest]

for single target what are the best traits 3 mutilate 3 vendetta?

[royal lantern]

3xdd 1xnp 2xtc probably

[fallow estuary]

3x mutilate / 1x blightborne / 1x NP / 1x tc

gameplay whise i'd swap the tc for 1x SS tho

ss feels to smooth

[real bay]

yeah and you likely won't get 100% TC uptime

[echo crest]

in numbers i swa NP is worth 3 why people dont use it at least in raw numbers on blood malet

[fallow estuary]

No its noth worth it even in raw numbers

[spice surge]

Ideally you'd want 3x NP, 3x DD and 3x overwhelming power

But there isnt 3 pieces with all those 3 on them

[manic veldt]

I have a question for mekatorque mythic . When i have the BIG shunk on me . Do shadowstep on boss trigger on other player or not cause im not "moving" ?!

[royal lantern]

remember that NP is bound too a cd

wich binds you too 1 target with a, well, huge cd, and you cant always use vendetta on cd too

[echo crest]

yeah right and there probalby is associated with a perfect fight for that cd

[fallow estuary]

@spice surge 3x NP / 3x DD and 3x OP is far outsimmed for me with 2x NP / 1x Blightborne / 3xDD / 3x OP

[spice surge]

yes i know

[royal lantern]

DD is only ST too, but you use mulitate all the time,even when you switch targets

[echo crest]

true

so i should aim for 3 DD and then between NP/SS/BB/TC

[fallow estuary]

DD is not ST only

you mutilate on 3 targets aswell

[echo crest]

yes thats was what he said

[fallow estuary]

Missunderstood it then, sorry.

But yea - you want 3x DD + X

[winter gale]

I just simmed myself once again after I saw what u guys typed. I changed 2xTC to 1xNp/1xTC and got 1% dps increase. So my setup is now 3xDD/1xNP/1xTC/1xTTK

Sounds good

[fallow estuary]

the problem with blightborne is

its incredible powerfull

for me its worth 2x NP traits

but

only one piece in the game has it

its a shoulder from dungeons

which means you need to gamble it

[echo crest]

so for simming what percentage you use for TC?

[fallow estuary]

you sim 100% uptime

[royal lantern]

most people sim with 100%

[strange python]

Yes it sucks. But it is the same for Ceph. There is one more piece a PvP piece but still. Both Gorak and Ceph are gamble

[royal lantern]

reality is probably like 80% in raids

[real bay]

you have to gamble cephalo too

just get lucky 4head

[royal lantern]

i have ceph

use it for sin m+#

[slim socket]

@manic veldt it doesnt trigger

[echo crest]

yeah need to see, pot/hs everytime you go below 20% xD

[strange python]

I allways sim 80 or 90% why would you sim 100% that is not realistic

[echo crest]

true

thats why i asked

[fallow estuary]

It really depends on the fight

[echo crest]

and for m+ i heard now its quite some changes

[fallow estuary]

most farm bosses 95% is really realistic

[vast forum]

95 is realistic

[fallow estuary]

i wouldn't use it in hard progress anyway

we're at jaina now

[vast forum]

80 is too low

[echo crest]

yeah with amount of mitigation that rogue has

[fallow estuary]

i'll pass TC thanks.

[royal lantern]

in raid fights you pretty much always go from 100%too like 30-20%in 1 hit and then need too be maxed out fast

you only stay low hp when stuff goes wrong/you do mechanics wrong

(most of the time, not all the time)

[echo crest]

in m+ ss is still king?

[fallow estuary]

3x ss + 3x EB

[royal lantern]

EB is king, SS is good

[echo crest]

because new affix right?

[vast forum]

Eb/ttk

[real bay]

this week could go 1x SS

[vast forum]

Ss is not as good as before

[strange python]

1xSS is good. 2sSS locks you and your group from chainpulling

[vast forum]

Tbh chainpulling with necrotic might prove difficult

[echo crest]

ttk?

[winter gale]

Do u guys use garrote in single target only to refresh it or do u use it sometimes for 5th combo point even if its good on duration at that moment?

[strange python]

That is true Yoppa. Was speaking more in general tho but ye. This week might not be the best idea

[winter gale]

Or maybe pool energy till it comes close to being refreshed?

[real bay]

don't refresh it too early

[fallow estuary]

You don't wanna use it to get a 5th combo point - that was only viable with the old set bonus which lowerd the energy needed to cast garrote

[winter gale]

Thank you ;)

[echo crest]

so on boss weeks you still mantain 3EB but not worth to use 3 SS and i should use some single target trait for tiranical?

ofcourse EB is good m10+

[real bay]

Rather use 3ss than 3 EB for tyr

EB does nothing

[bleak spoke]

EB doesn’t help kill bosses

[echo crest]

but the EB you will use on mobs and affix ss goes to waste on mobs and affix cuz they die to fast

[real bay]

2ss 2 TTk 2 EB is always good

at least you have some st

[echo crest]

TTK is good for m+?

[real bay]

you can spam big envenoms on big mobs

[echo crest]

oh right priority targets a bit like sub

[ripe nimbus]

pretty sure sub and outlaw both have better prio damage

[echo crest]

sub yes outlaw i doubt

maybe

outlaw is good for m+ now?

or sin still better?

[ripe nimbus]

yes its arguably the best M+ spec in the game.

[quaint sequoia]

still no race sims?

[royal lantern]

0,something %

there you go

[echo crest]

but for raid sin still best right?

[royal lantern]

pretty much yeha

consistant dot based dmg is always good

[thorn sinew]

Any fellow zandalari who has info on which of the bleed or the crit racial is better?

[strange python]

they

are about equal if im not mistaken

[thorn sinew]

Do they proc on FoK?

Like, each individual hit?

[opaque pagoda]

Hey guyz! I tried a 14 motherload yesterday with 2xss,2xeb and 2ttk (since rng gave me outlaw only azerites for m+ the whole season till now) and since im pushing 20+ keys i need to start playing assa as well ..the problem is i did smthing wrong and i cant figure out what

I finished with 28.4k, the mage at 36k and dh at 32k... What stats should i be aiming in a week like this with that build?

[rigid mango]

Why do you "need" to play assa, arguably outlaw is better atm

[opaque pagoda]

I said need because at some instances i may be needed in my grp to play as assa for the st push

We played as mage rog demo till last week

[rose violet]

Not motherlode tho

[rigid mango]

But outlaw can go st az pieces and still shaft you on aoe damage

[rose violet]

And if you want to push st dmg

Do you really think 2x eb is a good idea

[rigid mango]

Stat wise, crit is a hard need for eb, stack as much as possible, mastery right after, get to 9-11% haste bur nothing more

[opaque pagoda]

Ofc not but i have nothing else on sin xD

[rigid mango]

Sooo play otl?

[rose violet]

Then you’re better off playing outlaw

[wanton wolf]

Was your boss damage ok for the dungeon?

[opaque pagoda]

Appart from the 2nd boss yes i was first

[wanton wolf]

Well you've done what you set out to achieve then.

[rose violet]

[rigid mango]

Honestly, if you're looking for ST damage in m+ and it's not temple/kr

where you can sacrifice some aoe traits to get ST shit

outlaw will perform better

Sin is very good at aoe OR st, but lack the combination

Well, not lack, but get outperformed by an outlaw

[opaque pagoda]

Im just trying to figure out why im that far away from other sin rogues i see in m+ and cant figure out why since i was almost on them in last season

Reaping and outlaw change with wits destroyed my mind :p

[rigid mango]

I mean

I'd run as much aoe as possible for any dungeon that isn't KR/Temple

[opaque pagoda]

I think i will stick with outlaw for almost all the dungeons and i will give it a go again in a kr or seth next time

[rigid mango]

If you like outlaw