ah dope, that's what i'm doing as we speak
#assassination
strange python
lone junco
Make sure to click the box.
strange python
err, replace all enchants/gems?
lone junco
Yeah.
strange python
you got it
pulsar goblet
I just always keep 1 ss because pretty a much everywhere you can put it to use
And MA RNG is annoying lol
rigid mango
I mean that's entirely down to personal pref
lone junco
I found. Sockets and enchants are important. Which ones you use were very very close.
strange python
fair enough, i'm simming haste/mast/crit as very close anyway
rigid mango
iirc most bosses you'll do better with MA and no SS, but I kept my ss around for a long time for the sake of comfortability
lone junco
9 socket champs.
strange python
maybe about .15 off
lunar tangle
i mean i personally never used MA so i shouldnt be down grading it
lone junco
If all things equal. I pick crit for m+
strange python
yeah, for me, MA sims about 1k-1.5k higher than sub even with SS trait
but then again, this is on a single target patchwerk
rigid mango
unless you're into total min maxing, the difference isn't substantial enough if you prefer the playstyle of SS
pulsar goblet
SS gets a lot more value with more targets
lone junco
Yeah. 3dd + ma tb is strong for me.
Whether the SS targets are important or not is the q.
pulsar goblet
That's true
lunar tangle
thanks for the advice guys ❤
pulsar goblet
Like opening champions with 3 garrotes
rigid mango
Ofc that's nice
pulsar goblet
Totally useless but my parse
rigid mango
But at the same time having the insane ST damage for most fights is nutty imo
pulsar goblet
For sure
pulsar goblet
If I could reforge easier id swap to full DD when I would prefer
royal lantern
would recommend too do the same btw;P you do less mistakes that way
royal lantern
ik a shitton of people that do it sooo....
pulsar goblet
How do I know if I need to pad to be top DPS then
royal lantern
idk why people have such a hardon for dps metter
rigid mango
It's satisfying?
royal lantern
like, for this week the demonlock is #1 anyway
pulsar goblet
People like to compete with others it's crazy right
royal lantern
and on fights like mekka/opulence you cant go by dps cus mechanics destroy your dps
rigid mango
So?
pulsar goblet
Lol
rigid mango
It's still satsifying to see you're doing a big amount of damage
regardless of what the outcome of it
grave elk
Whats the pros and cons for master assassin vs subter with SS ? i have near identical dps for both builds atm with my setup
rigid mango
Instant gratification for your input of the game
royal lantern
my grafitication is the ap i loot from the dead boss
rigid mango
MA + no SS build will give you high burst, and most likely better ST damage
royal lantern
and the ap i get from the bonus roll
rigid mango
Granted you play with DD/NP etc
SS + Sub is better for multi dotting, awesome for m+
grave elk
yeah i have 2 DD and 2 NP
rigid mango
Same, getting cucked on the last two but yeah
grave elk
I was playing SS for m+ till i got outlaw gear to sim higher for dungeons
grave elk
my sim tells me treachorous cov beats a 2nd NP but i thought more energy regen would feel better if it stacks
rigid mango
And I love it, but for raiding I've grown to love no SS and MA isntead
The energy regen doesn't stack
btw
grave elk
ohh
rigid mango
Only the first stack of NP gives energy regen
grave elk
then im definitely gonna go treach
rigid mango
hence it simming as way 1st as a one of of the trait
but still at the top end as a 2nd and 3rd
grave elk
makes sense
yeah i like sin better then outlaw in m+ but im also new to outlaw so i think i just have that uncomfortable feeling cuz im still tryin to get familiar with it while dealing with mechanics
rigid mango
I don't like the general feel of outlaw as much as I do sin
but it is very nice to play in m+
Issue for sin is that the traits for raiding and m+ are so different, that you have to either have 2 sets or reforge
stable pine
Lawl trying outlaw and having 15k dps due to 9 rerolls in a row is feelsbad
rigid mango
Myeh
grave elk
well if ur in mid mob pull/bladefurry you dont wanna roll unless u have skull crossbones
just keep whatever buff u have mid mob or bladefurry and just worry about reroll for next pack
yeah i found having 2 good sets for raiding and m+ for sin was difficult. they usually ended up being same set and i cant drop 40k or more anytime i wanna swap for m+
stable pine
It helps if your raid days are next to each other so you reforged before raid then reforged the following day after raid then just M+ all week ezlife
strange python
currently running 3x dd, ttk, tc and NP. seems pretty fucking strong
with running MA, that G > mut > r should all be under buff right?
grave elk
yeah should fit righti n there
warm harbor
dont put garrote and rupture in your MA window
strange python
yeah
warm harbor
especially when your running TTK
strange python
meant to refresh before popping vend
so refresh, vend, vanish tb then spam envs
or do you vanish before env
warm harbor
yeah, you get high damage but also higher variance if you pop TB before vanish then env -> mut -> env (assuming ur mut crited)
nah vanish with 4-5 bc, env, mut, env (if 4 cb's)
its higher dmg but also high variance
warm harbor
its nice running like this cause you can get that second vendetta off without having to wait the extra 20 seconds
strange python
so ideal would be (dots reapplied) vend tb to be around 4-5, vanish env, then mut (hope for crit) env
cuz if that's done, then both envs should be in MA window
warm harbor
yeah thats how its done
strange python
good stuff, thanks for the info
warm harbor
no worries, gl with it
heavy skiff
In the opener if my tb gives me 2cp then i mut vanish env mut env
If tb gives me 1 then i vanish mut env mut
So i dont waste cp
strange python
oh yeah i know about that, i was talking about 2nd vend/van
heavy skiff
Oh k then it depends on how many cp u already have at that point thats it
elder talon
does anyone have a functioning weakaura that notifies you in some way when poison bomb procs? cant seem to find any that is working, all the ones i tried didnt work :(
old escarp
@elder talon I had one in legion that worked well. It got a little wonky if you had multiple PB procs in a short span. I’ll check my WAs to see if I still have it somewhere or if it died in the legion > BfA transition
That being said it was a more complex WA with with lua code that tracked some combat log events...a bit beyond my skill with WAs, so I don’t think I could recreate it
idle vigil
Recently tried out triple IP in keys this week
since fortified teeming
EB*
My damage is signifigantly lower tho
do you think its like not pulling enough mobs?
sharp token
could be your stats as well
bleak spoke
@primal gazelle seli streaming a 15 fh pug with hidden blades
sharp token
3x EB you want to have a lot of crit
primal gazelle
link to his stream pls
lime carbon
I'm trying to make a macro #showtooltip
/cast Vendetta
/use 14
/cast Vanish
/cast [talent: 6/2] Toxic Blade Everything is working except for toxic blade. Am I doing something wrong or can you not make a macro with TB like that?
lime carbon
ah that sucks
desert vault
Oh yeah this is prolly better for ss over ttk huh?
bleak spoke
bigliest of memes
desert vault
EB+Blight over EB+TtK this week right? Same ilvl.
primal gazelle
I can buy helm next week too and hope for eb/ss
lone junco
EB peaks for Jesus.
round harbor
i got the oppulence helm last night so i might use that in the mean time
primal gazelle
My guild is gonna let me mooch off their M Conclave kill so I can get the 415 eb ss chest 😈
round harbor
i have two of those
lone junco
I need to pug raid my rogue.
round harbor
what guild are u in
primal gazelle
Strawberry puppy kisses
lone junco
Friend zoned
forest nacelle
for the skill exsanguinate, does bleed out 100% faster just mean consume DoT and deal the remaining dmg as the amount of time that was consumed on the DoT
?
visual quartz
makes your rup and gar deal the entire dmg at twice the speed I think, also is a huge energy gain as it ticks faster
so 24secs, x ammount of dmg, with exang is same dmg 12 secs
forest nacelle
it just looks like its just consuming the debuffs, and dealing the dmg in one hit.
for each
visual quartz
be sure to use it as you apply to get full benifit
steel terrace
just checked bloodmallet, should we really swap haste and mastery already?
bleak spoke
@primal gazelle now do a rank 1 on the fight by padding with dungeon build
civic palm
@steel terrace IF you weights dictate as such and the comparisons between loot are pointing in that direction, then sure.
wary ice
exsang halves the remaining duration and doubles the tickrate of all current bleeds on the target
@forest nacelle
its uses include: fitting 1 and change Empowered garrotes into a Vendetta window and Doubled energy generation
steel terrace
@civic palm i dont get it sorry ahaha what i meant was: Should i look for haste and mastery in my dungeon farms?
im queueing for my stat weight atm
civic palm
and what I mean is, only if the stat is better for you than your other stats.
If you don't know what that means, then don't worry about it that seems fine.
civic palm
Seems fine, your Crit still has decent value but its clear that haste and mastery are winning for you atm.
warm harbor
TheToad careful with simming galecallers, your haste value may actually be larger assuming you dont have 100% uptime during your galecallers window,
covert crag
oof
ashen ermine
Big oof
steel terrace
i think im struggling a lot with my haste tho, 13% w/out galecaller or other buffs
i'm kinda always out of energy after toxic blade spam with gale
ashen ermine
Are you pooling?
steel terrace
mmm actually on non-pull toxic blade no, i dont. should i like stop mutilate and only aa ? or just slow down the mutilate
ashen ermine
Well when you pool yeah you're essentially just autoing so when you pop your tb you have energy to get envenoms in your tb window
steel terrace
ok, i will consider it for next fights 😄 ty for the tips
strange python
just gonna run ivus/dice till i get plume
i dont like gcb
basic galecaller's question inc that's most likely been asked 5000 times
on my second vendetta timing with SS should i hold it to sync with vanish
or just use it on cd
i use it on cd
what's the max amount of time i should had it off cd
if you have movement coming up and u cant use it
ember verge
does Shrouded suffocation really smooth things out ? or should i pick tidal surge since it sims higher ?
formal willow
Hey guys, so most guides tell me that Nothing Personal has huge diminishing returns after one stack of the trait, but bloodmallet and hero damage show the increase with the second trait almost as big as the first? what should i believe now?
ember verge
actually i am asking myself the same question because raidbot told me to stack those nothing personal
spice surge
The first one is more powerful but the second and third are still good
rigid mango
^
spice surge
It was being undervalued in simc until recently
rigid mango
They're still top tier, just not as insane as 1st one
spice surge
So must guides havent updated since the release
If raidbots tells you its better, follow that
ember verge
what about shrouded suffocation
warm harbor
When you get 3 stacks of NP the stock is incredibly powerful when paired with TB
ember verge
should i keep one for gameplay ? or should i pick something else ?
if it sims higher
warm harbor
if you're going for dmg, usually trust the sim
drifting cloud
if you dont like MA you can still run subterfuge without ss
its probably better than runnins ss when you have way better traits
ember verge
they want me to take tidal surge actually
drifting cloud
what the hell is tidal surge
ember verge
and the difference is kinda low
formal willow
for m+, shrouded suffocation is still best choice i think
ember verge
that's actually what i thought @formal willow
hollow stone
Eb > ss for m+
drifting cloud
well you didnt say it was for m+
hollow stone
But they achieve different things
drifting cloud
and were not really mind readers :d
so if you talk about traits 90% will assume its for st in raid
ember verge
yeah sorry
it's just that it feels that 90 % of the content nowadays is multi target
even in raid
formal willow
if i want a good allround build so i can do well in both raid and m+, would ss+toxic blade be viable? or should i go for exsanguate then?
ember verge
i haven't been on the raid as melee, but as an sp i multi dotted a lot
drifting cloud
even on rasta ss I just for padding
warm harbor
alot of fights this tier are ST for melee
champions (to a degree), grong, opu, conclave, mekka, blockade and jaina
drifting cloud
just open top assa logs, every fight where people ahve more than 1 ss its just there for padding
rigid mango
Or they prefer the playstyle
rigid mango
But it's how they prefer playing
Who are you to determine their priorities
lmfao
1k less dps, sure, but ss is a playstyle some people enjoy more than MA
warm harbor
1 ss w/ sub isnt that fair behind plus it is MUCH more reliable
drifting cloud
well I said more than 1
because how the azerite from raid is, youd have to be really unlucky to have more than 1 ss on your azerite simming as highest setup
rigid mango
Get used to it
It's a preference argument
There'll always be people on either side
fleet whale
Sigh... DD and NP is better for ST, but that doesn't mean SS is unviable or bad for your raid
spice surge
Idk for ST its not really about preference. In my mind 800 dps loss (which is with what i would lose with my setup) isnt really reasonable
SS is obv not "Unviable" but its a very mid-tier trait for ST
rigid mango
AAAAAAAAAAnd you just fueled the argument
They have different playstyles, people prefer either
Saying one is better won't help
drifting cloud
yeah play pure dps class and prefer to do less dmg
pulsar goblet
Real talk though why does everybody base everything off single Target only when that is like rarely ever the case
civic palm
When someone asks which is better, you don't bring your feelies into it > _>"
warm harbor
all bar 2 bosses are really ST
pulsar goblet
For certain fights like mekkatorque sure
civic palm
Also the influence we have for MT ain't great due to options and distance.
fleet whale
Also note that a lot of people use ss because of what is available to them
warm harbor
and mindset from the previous tier
pulsar goblet
That's just wrong or you haven't done the raid
spice surge
?
fleet whale
had i gotten the helm off the first boss, i would be running 3 DD and 3 NP right now
but alas, i didn't
spice surge
Jaina has no multitarget, blockade you're there to kill the boss and let your ranged deal with adds, otherwise you fuckup the sea swell/get debuffed
warm harbor
most fights for melee you should be focusing on ST
fleet whale
i did get the heroic version like 2 weeks ago, decided to traded cause our healers need all the help they can get
warm harbor
opu/grong/conclave yes you get a bit of cleave but its better to optimise your ST
rigid mango
@spice surge jaina defo has aoe, when people are blocked shit's hectic
albeit I wouldn't count it as proper aoe
drifting cloud
dude hes talking about mythic
rigid mango
but there's defo multi target
rigid mango
I thought hta was the case^
coarse quartz
any sims for zandalari troll yet
warm harbor
nah valentine dont think so
fleet whale
idk about the dps racials, but i'm actually not a huge fan of the heal they have. I would prefer stone form or torrent over it any day
for pve anyway
sick owl
Does the DH 5% Magic debuff effect poison dmg?
warm harbor
yep
sick owl
Thanks alot
fleet whale
i would go as far to say that it may be more important than the monk debuff (you want both though all the time)
rigid mango
Yeah possibly
fleet whale
but in just about every decent raid you'll have both
spice surge
Nature damage is like 60% of your damage
drifting cloud
yeah you lose so much not having one youre better off somebody being on an alt
just for the debuff
rigid mango
I just assume most prog teams play with a monk tank etc
and DH's there are an abundance of
lime carbon
should I be running 3 np and 2 dd or 2np 2 dd and 1 tc?
drifting cloud
and the problem with DHs is that most guilds usually only have 1 or 2
because you dont overrecruit them
rigid mango
I mean
I think monks are still some of if not the best prog tank
Thanks to the fact that it's VERY hard for them to get bopped
warm harbor
depending on your build poisons can dominate your damage.
drifting cloud
like I said just depends on the guild honestly
warm harbor
if you run 3x DD 3x NP then poisions are a huge amount of your amount
drifting cloud
one of our tanks is always dk, other one jumps between pala and monk, but mostly been pala this tier
warm harbor
if you are running one or more TTK's then poisons again will dominate your dmg
drifting cloud
but our only other monk is a healer so if he cant make a raid our tank has to play monk then otherwise we lose too much
and monks just arent broken this tier like they were in the past
rigid mango
I agree not broken, but I'd still put them as the top, if not in the top tier atleast
one of if not the best
drifting cloud
well everything except druid and dh is top tier 😛
drifting cloud
but I dont know enough about tanking to tell you how the other classes rank
warm harbor
we've recruited a bear tank recently and he is performing quite well, that roar is such a nice piece of ultility
really nice for mekka prog atm, having it up for nearly every wormhole
drifting cloud
doing mekka without 2 dks 
warm harbor
we've got one and it gets the job done
got around 3 dps druid that keep them in check mostly
drifting cloud
all 3 have roots or is one playing knockback?
rigid mango
Yeah gonna be same for us when we get there
warm harbor
all roots
drifting cloud
like 1 dk 2 druids is borderlina mandatory on that fight
not aggramar mandatory, but it makes the fight alot alot easier
rigid mango
We're probs gonna have 1 dk and 3-4 druids
warm harbor
yeah agreed, shamans can kinda fill the role aswell
drifting cloud
1 dk tank*
warm harbor
the dk tank thing isnt so bad because can alt can fill the role just fine since they take next to no dmg
so guilds dont need a dk main tank for the fight, making it much easier to bring one along
drifting cloud
yeah and how the fight works, the alt tank barely has to tank at all
because you can just swap back for stack resets if you want
warm harbor
personally really enjoying mekka prog, pretty nice fight for a class with little mechanical responsiblility outside of shrinks and bombs
drifting cloud
whats your best try
warm harbor
15%
that was first night of prog around 2 hours left in the night
so should get it this reset
drifting cloud
I found mekka alot of things, enjoyable wasnt one of them 😛
fleet whale
i think he's a cool fight
drifting cloud
the whole fight is just kinda, can your raid survive for 2minutes after he lands
on our 1st kill we went into last phsae with 18 people and somehow killed it even tho we had way way better transitions
fleet whale
and i like how blizz is willing to try different things for raid fights
warm harbor
yeah but i enjoyed that aspect, its pretty intense
drifting cloud
but people just die at 25%
fleet whale
but as always people will have different opinions on things, a lot of people seem to like NH but i honestly found it quite boring
rigid mango
dw I'm still stuck at people dying because our healers don't have the output for paku's wrath
:))
warm harbor
I like this tier how alot of the fights are the end are a climactic mess (for prog kills at least), opu, rasta (even though its easily as FUCK), mekka, conclave
fleet whale
no boss will ever top blackhand for intensity
drifting cloud
archimonde? 😛
fleet whale
way more intense than arch
warm harbor
starting playing late legion so never got to experience BH, heard it was nuts though
drifting cloud
yeah you had to class stack like crazy for dps
only melee in was rogues and warrs on first kills
fleet whale
rogues cleared mines
drifting cloud
and without 2-3 boomies p2 was x3 harder
undone sand
[FR] Salut, je recherche une personne pour m'aider à m'améliorer avec mon Rogue Assasinat 😃 dispo en mp
[EN] Hi, I'm looking for someone to help me improve with my Rogue Assassination 😃 available in mp
supple hearth
@undone sand what questions do you have? If you have logs you might post them here and I'm sure people will give constructive criticism
fresh shuttle
Has anyone else found the following two issues?
-
Tricks macro (@focus target) not applying, and responding with "invalid target" since latest hotfix patch. Working on one of my guilds rogues, but not mine or another persons.
-
Reaping sometimes not awarding energy per bleed on them. Can have 4 garrotes , Crimson Tempest and a few Ruptures on different reaping mobs, and sitting at little to no energy, as opposed to when killing the mobs themselves, having abundant energy. I'm the only assa in guild, so the others can't tell me if they're having this issue or not too.
undone sand
I have the logs of my raid of the evening, you want the logs? 😃
rigid mango
I've not had any issue with the first one
cobalt gyro
if they're not being poisoned then ya you're not going to be getting any energy
rigid mango
I used to have issue with it just randomly not even being pressable, it didn't respond to me
^
cobalt gyro
I also haven't had any issue with tricks except when tank is mounted/I used neural
fresh shuttle
The mobs are being poisoned/bleeds are applying
I'm just not getting energy. This isn't on every pack either, it seems random.
rigid mango
I used to have issues when it just randomly would react as if nothing was focused
fresh shuttle
For trick it displays my friendly as "Invalid Target". Was working flawlessly before the hotfix
rigid mango
What hotfix?
fresh shuttle
As in the latest mini patch a couple of days ago
cobalt gyro
i've not really had issues, you typically start a reaping pack with low energy regardless and it takes a bit to kick in
civic palm
Tricks working last night, something on your end.
undone sand
@supple hearth is good ?^^ ( I speak French, I hope I understood what you told me (here are the logs of my evening raid)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/w1pv6XMdPrRNYkZW/
fresh shuttle
It'll work when I use the spell, but my focus target macro wasn't working last night. Was the first time it didn't work. Nothing has changed on my end since the gap of it working then displaying "Invalid Target". Was just curious if others have found the same issue. As mentioned, it's also a fellow guildie that's finding the same, as Outlaw. The other Outlaw doesn't have an issue though, with the same macro
To clarify sorry, the spell will work right out of the spellbook, but not via focus target macro
visual quartz
I dunno, i use a mouse over macro and it works great. unless the boss is oversized and my mouse is on him no matter what 😛
fresh shuttle
I might rewrite it, delete the old one and try again.
visual quartz
tricks and step
fresh shuttle
Yeah I prefer focus myself
civic palm
Sometimes the macros do just break for no fucking reason and you have to rewrite/import them.
rigid mango
Normally it's just re-dragging it onto my bars
fresh shuttle
Hoping that's what's happened. Still confused on the no energy return for some reaping mobs. I'll record my next few dungeons and see if there's something odd going on, but before the patch I had no issues, got energy per bleed tick as normal.
supple hearth
@undone sand your English is fine. I'm not great at analyzing logs so I won't be very helpful but this is the right place to post them. If nobody helps out you might try posting them again another time
rigid mango
He's using translate^^
undone sand
@rigid mango yes xD
rigid mango
@undone sand Do you know anything you want help with?
supple hearth
I think he just wants tips based on logs to improve
rigid mango
He just entered with saying he wanted help
supple hearth
Right and then he posted his log
rigid mango
Aye after you asked for them
undone sand
@rigid mango Yes, I watch my raid performance tonight (normal ..) and I find that I have a low dps compare to my mates with the same ilvl ... I play my class only for 5 days
@supple hearth Thanks for the information, I will see in the channel if people can help me 😃
leaden seal
Does Master Poisoner talent buff the poison dmg of Double dose?
sturdy python
Nope
rigid mango
It doesn't? interesting
@undone sand You let your bleeds fall off, rupture and garrote. You only had them on the target (grong) 75%and 88% of the time, they should both be near 100%. You're also wasting alot of combo points, you don't need to use mutlitate if you're already at 4 combo points, you should be using Rupture/Envenom at 4-5 combo points.
leaden seal
@undone sand you are using you Toxic blade at the wrong time. Why are you opening with Garrote > Toxic Blade > Garrote > Rupture?
rigid mango
@undone sand http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
undone sand
Translate is coming xD
rigid mango
Try translating that as much as you can^^
leaden seal
https://www.wowhead.com/spell=196864/master-poisoner wont buff the dmg of https://www.wowhead.com/spell=273007/double-dose ?
rigid mango
It's a poison, I don't see why not?
spice surge
No it doesnt buff it
rigid mango
Ah nvm
spice surge
Double dose is not a weapon poison
potent oracle
what should i do to obtain a 400 itlv azerite PVP armor ?
rigid mango
Do PvP?
strange python
Do you hold your second vendetta for vanish to come off cd or just use it?
rigid mango
@strange python What are you using, MA or sub?
strange python
Sub
undone sand
Thanks for informations @rigid mango / @leaden seal
iI'm going to test on model to try my rotation!
potent oracle
or what rank should i take to obtain 400 items
potent oracle
wow
potent oracle
and azerite armor ?
leaden seal
@potent oracle Rated Arenas at 1850 - 2000 rating drop ilvl 400 gear.
potent oracle
i see people with 415 pvp azerite armors
supple hearth
@rigid mango thanks for helping
leaden seal
What is your current arena / RBG rating @potent oracle
rigid mango
no probs man
potent oracle
1,4
rigid mango
as for azerite I'd assume 2100 or glad is 415 azerite?
supple hearth
@potent oracle need to be 1800+. Gear scales with rating
This resource has a table
spice surge
End of match is not the same as the weekly reward
potent oracle
what about the azerite armors ?
spice surge
Can only drop from the weekly chest or conquest cap, from pvp
As the table giggle linked says. its 1.6k for 400 azerite from weekly and 2.1k for 415 azerite from weekly
Assuming you get lucky and get an azerite piece to begin with, since its entirely random
fallow carbon
I see the herorotation addon under additional resources on the website. Is it worth a damn to learn the assassin rotation? I'm playing like crap on this alt right now >.<
bleak spoke
with ma is it better to rupture second before or after toxic blade
or do you mean literally after vendetta's over
and just ride completely ST until it is
bleak spoke
okay subterfuge it is
prisma crescent
@bleak spoke LOL
hollow stone
so first like 25 sec is full st, then you go up, get buff, then you multi dot
yeah, ss better fo sho
warm harbor
@prisma crescent why run MA on jadefire?
bleak spoke
you barely get the full vendetta on her before she jumps the first time anyway
hollow stone
yea
bleak spoke
i had some success playing exsang and vanishing after multisided
warm harbor
you should hold your vendetta for the multi-sided strikes buff
bleak spoke
like uh i'd do 5 cp rupture on guy after coming down and then vanish 3 gs rupture on lady
and then something like 1 envenom into kidney on one of the tigers
prisma crescent
@warm harbor Well, I'm going to be running MA for Opu but dont want to spend 50k in reforging just to swap for Jadefire and back
bleak spoke
feels
warm harbor
yeah fair, in that case yes still cleave for the extra resource generation
bleak spoke
i have to play outlaw on opulence cuz otherwise our adds don't die
sigh
at least i get the opal now
warm harbor
but the opener is super simple, you should still be saving your vendetta for the multi-sided strikes buff
@bleak spoke you were ruby as sin?
warm harbor
damn strange, sin is terrible for ruby
bleak spoke
i was also consistently 1st on damage for 20-soemthing wipes but that didn't help my case either
big shrug
warm harbor
talk to your guild haha, outlaw is amazing for ruby and sin is amazing for opal, your guild got it backwards
warm harbor
yeah fair
bleak spoke
tbh having blade rush is so nice for that fight i don't even really mind
when you push faster and neither sprint or step are up it's so awks haha
also the good old second vendetta into instantly swapped is some infuriating shit
prisma crescent
@bleak spoke Have you tried getting lucky?
bleak spoke
yes
cobalt gyro
solution: never use vendetta
bleak spoke
swapped often enough to maintain dots on both
cobalt gyro
(^:
bleak spoke
for one of the pulls
was sat at like 33 or 34k dps in the corner room
and then like 10 people died to crush so lol
2 hours wiping to reclear on it last night, big fun
warm harbor
Opu seems to be where a lot of reprog happens for guilds hahah
bleak spoke
it's not down again yet 😃
i want both the crown and dagger so bad
crown is ttk shrouded 8D
warm harbor
just get conclave chest like a real man
warm harbor
very true
bleak spoke
when we're wiping on reclears
prisma crescent
Prog Opu tonight, 415 dagger is mine
bleak spoke
i wish you the best of luck
prisma crescent
JK bonus roll AP
fallow carbon
Killed it last night, got AP for dayssss
bleak spoke
i got nothing on my kill
rancid spade
nothing personal x3 OP?
bleak spoke
not even a brez to loot the gold piles 😦
leaden seal
Why ruby for outlaw on oppu over opal?
warm harbor
a lot more apm
but if you have classes such as DH, warrior, even some hunter specs than opal for OL is fine
bleak spoke
can actually upkeep buff
rancid spade
nothing personal scales with mastery and versa right?
warm harbor
haste
warm harbor
+haste**
bleak spoke
mizerok did some computer stuff on it yesterday
and haste apparently isn't quite as powerful as believed for it
fallow carbon
They made me grab the ruby on Opulence last night, It was a legit struggle to keep that buff going until we got to the middle. >.<
bleak spoke
@fallow carbon https://www.twitch.tv/ashine/clip/ConcernedLaconicWrenGrammarKing link this to them
i actually was a warlock last tier @robust lake
robust lake
wow i found u out
bleak spoke
highly do not recommend. boring and dangerous at the same time
robust lake
great as a raid leader im officially off of red gem duty
fallow carbon
my problem isn't the gem on opulence, it's just that I can't seem to do the rotation correctly so my DPS is shite
robust lake
sorry hunters ur life sucks now
fallow carbon
Apparently I'm doing the wrong rotation on the dummy, simcraft has me at close to 20k but I was doing 16k on the fight >.<
on mythic no less, it was embarassing
robust lake
do u have logs
fallow carbon
yea
bleak spoke
^
robust lake
mayb we can look
bleak spoke
easier if you post logs
fallow carbon
bleak spoke
those are for rasta
fallow carbon
oh woops
bleak spoke
that is not
the standard opener friend
http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/ you want to look at 1 or more shrouded suffocation for tox blade
basically you're taking advantage of the subterfuge window to extend your empowered garrote to its max duration
so your first 3 globals are garrote rupture garrote
this also wastes as few combo points as possible
after which you're sat at 3 cp and you vendetta tox blade and finish with envenom immediately, giving yourself the poison buff so your subsequent mutilates proc DD
robust lake
u also want to not overcap on combo as points much
like try and use abilities at either 4 or 5 cp make a weak aura for it if its hard ti tell
i get a gunshot noise whenever i hit 4 cp which us annoying but it helps haha
fallow carbon
I'll have to do that, that log is the only reason I even found ravenholdt haha, I realize that I was doing something massivley wrong
bleak spoke
and you don't want to vanish until your garrote that you extended to 24 seconds has finished ticking in its entirety
bleak spoke
so the toxic blade rotation feels super smooth because when you vanish with some combo points you can garrote rupture garrote to actually extend the rupture on pandemic properly (as your third cast of rupture) and immeidately after you get toxblade back up and you have enough cp and energy to envenom again
and then when your next vendetta comes up, you just wait until you have vanish again so you can vanish to apply empowered garrotes before you vendetta a second time
robust lake
but ywah i think fixing your ss, opener and combo point wasting will help u a lot
bleak spoke
between vendettas just maintain your bleeds and toxic blade on cooldown
warm harbor
pool for TB though
bleak spoke
it's quite simple and you won't run into any hurdles until you try to min max
robust lake
yah energy pooling might help too but i think fix other parts first
bleak spoke
but rule of them is no matter what you're trying, tb on cooldown
regardless of combo points
robust lake
yes true
rancid spade
nope pool for tb
bleak spoke
only exception is if garrote or rupture will drop off in its entirety
fallow carbon
ty 😃 I'll be putting this into play here in a bit once I get off work on the dummy, so I can get this sorted !
bleak spoke
yes hades but what i'm saying is if you fuck your rotaiton somehow and misjudge yoru pooling even though you've done so you should just tb as it comes up
better luck next time kinda deal
rancid spade
pool like 110-120 energy before tb and try to get 3 envenoms in the tb duration
bleak spoke
also in terms of sins, capping energy is more serious than capping cp
bleak spoke
using tb at 5 cp isn't necessarily encouraged but it's almost lossless
fallow carbon
What do I click into the logs to see down to the level of order of abilities / capping / over CP that ya'll are seeing
robust lake
yes tb is an exception is mutilating past 5 cp tho
fallow carbon
so I can better self-inspect in the future
bleak spoke
for ease of use wowanalyzer.com will help you out quite a bit
but we're looking at casts
under events
fallow carbon
You guys are my hero's 😃
robust lake
for energy or combo points
resources
then click in combo points or energy
you can see where ur at max
and how long
etc
and then casts also good
for ability type
bleak spoke
https://wowanalyzer.com/report/Yq2bWxmaH9PznMrk/26-Mythic+Opulence+-+Kill+(9:06)/10-Rìvìn for a nice well put together interface
suggestions page usually has some nice stuff on it
river zinc
can anyone take a look at this log and let me know how bad it was?
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/NkxwYHDm7yQ9Kp8t#fight=last&type=damage-done&source=40
fading wigeon
ok galecaller is just awful on jaina lol
bleak spoke
whoah do not vendetta after you vanish
with master assassin
you want to vendetta and then set up for your vanish
cuz you get 3 globals in the MA window
you want to maximize the output from those three globals
@river zinc
either you want to at 3+ cp vanish into toxic blade envenom mutilate, or toxic blade to 4+ then vanish envenom mutilate envenom
so you can actually get output from having all that nice crit
river zinc
Awesome thank you!!
rancid spade
is it me or the NP trait is not dynamic with the versa stat?
im testing it with the medallion
quick ice
It should be? Can you post log/screenshot?
river zinc
@bleak spoke So it looks like I only messed up that first Vendetta, but also I notice there are points in time I casted 4xmutilate in a row..should that ever happen or am I messing up?
bleak spoke
maybe that's why medallion sims lower for reason than plummage :^)
no
you never cast more than 2 mutilates in a row
cuz you overcap beyond that
river zinc
Does Double dose show up as mutilate in the logs?
bleak spoke
no
bleak spoke
yeh it's weirdish
river zinc
cobalt gyro
that's 2 casts
river zinc
so thats normal?
bleak spoke
okay yeah that's 2 casts
cobalt gyro
unless you casted twice in the same millisecond twice in a row :P
bleak spoke
mutilate off the gcd now
wait wait
how about
blindside off the gcd
wait that would actually be so fun
using off-gcd blindside to fix 4 cp before envenom
etc
or to extend from 3 cp to finish
bleak spoke
sigh
undone sand
I need help, do you know the l'addon of the pics? she runs from right to left
He uses the spell once or twice? I have the video if needed ^^
edit *
cobalt gyro
@bleak spoke actually the shittiest reason for the gcd change they could've given
bleak spoke
ugh
mossy adder
Is there any reason some top logs with MA arent using vanish tb mut envenom abd instead doing vanish envenom mut envenom?
Like many of them have a different opener that used in the ravenholdt guide
bleak spoke
cuz envenom muti envenom is more rng but has higher potential output
basically why go for the safe option which loses against other parses that are using env muti env 100% of the time as opposed to when u get unlucky
river zinc
thank you by the way..just trying to figure out why im only getting blue parses on overall
probably because people have 415 azerite now
and im still in 400..and I messed up that vendetta
potent oracle
anyone can explain me pls ? i dont have aoe damage , and dont know what i am doing wrong 😦
open parcel
Have there been any sims done on which loa blessing would be the best for the Zandalari racial?
harsh sphinx
finally got the dagger from opulence 
cobalt gyro
dam
bleak spoke
that's hot
harsh sphinx
made it to the club, hope to get the fang aswell in a few 😄 https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/v4CiobZnSN5TwJxXexrjs2
bleak spoke
so close yet https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4h3vP19LrpMfxzaG6Jjzmv :x
bleak spoke
set bonus too
harsh sphinx
true that
harsh sphinx
ya i think it does but
civic palm
More-than-likely at this point.
bleak spoke
yeh not having enough crit feels kinda bad
bleak spoke
cuz that's what the sim's telling you to do :^)
but no
not really
crit works for almost every scenario anyway
willow chasm
sick ty
warm harbor
its stacks quite nicely, can run 2 or 3
coarse quartz
energy and damage?
warm harbor
just dmg, but the dot is very powerful
coarse quartz
i see
warm harbor
i run 3 NP's for mekka atm and its around 15% of my dmg
coarse quartz
im about to start mekka so yeah
warm harbor
15% of dmg and only has around 12-14% uptime, so its insane burst
coarse quartz
trying to see whats the best sing targ traits
warm harbor
if your about to start mekka its probably one of the better/best fight for the 3x DD 3x NP w/ MA builds
coarse quartz
MA?
warm harbor
master assasin
hard estuary
warm harbor
dead eye'
rustic ether
you can skip last wave of reaping in underrot right?
by talking to bronn in the final boss room and killing a tick pack?
rustic ether
doing an 18 and trying to figure out how to do it easy
hollow stone
Just do it with the boss. Like a boss
warm harbor
the final boss of UR is one of the harder bosses to do with reaping due to how you have to move thus shadow smashes can cuck you
rustic ether
is the teleport to the beginning too long? like i dont understand how its not easier to just tele and kill a single tick pack
warm harbor
well its a full loading screen, plus running to magni/tick pack, but its worth checking out the timings, could be wrong
that being said reapings are a bit more painful this week due to teeming
rustic ether
yeah i just havent done that yet and it seems like a no brinaer but being told form a few sources not to, makes me think im missing something
warm harbor
skipping the last reaping can be a tricky one because reapings dont exactly take that long (especially in terms of UR because they tele to you) and running to a mob/loading screens can often offset the time saved
rustic ether
also where do i go to learn how to make WAs
i need to make some WAs for abilities in dungeons
because dbm aint cutting it on some trash
cobalt gyro
I learned a lot of it by just fiddling with it myself tbh
rustic ether
siege fish boys conal is silent lol
ugh that sounds like work i like reading lol
ill try tho
fallow carbon
On a target dummy doing 13k i'm so bad at this lol
rustic ether
speaking of WAs why do my weakaurs sometimes just yeet themselves
they just disapear
civic palm
They're rebelling!!
raw fox
i missed sin
rustic ether
does anyone have the WA that tracks all interupts AND spell reflect
also is there an easy way to know if feint will actually do its job
thorny shore
How much SS will be nerf next week (8.1.5) ?
fleet whale
No SS nerf to my knowledge
cobalt gyro
on the PTR the tooltip says >garrote from stealth deals xyz more damage every (x) seconds
on live it's just "deals x more damage"
inland path
anyone can help me come to the conclusion for my gear set up?
swapping to ss with 1 garrote trait is about 900 dps loss
however i feel in somefights it should pull ahead
rustic ether
are there any confirmed class balances here?
civic palm
There are none.
spare flame
Can anyone give me some insight on running Subertfuge without any SS traits. Im heading into Mythic Rastakahn and while I sim a little higher with MA it seems like Subterfuge is strong on that fight
rustic ether
open with three garrotes on all three targets. however thats only for parsing.
for actual progression you might just want to stick with MA
spare flame
I just really hate it, the feeling when you just dont crit is the worst
red zealot
Thoughts on 2 dagger in the back or 2 Twist of the Knife?
civic palm
Never DitB
empty tide
gutripper is good, expecially for progression
but there are some better traits like overwhelming power
meager nebula
Dagger in the back sims better than it actually performs
honest iris
do I take hidden blades for m+ if i have 1x echoing
empty tide
dagger in the back simcs like you are behind the boss all fight
i think you need 3x echoing to even play hidden blades
and its just on some dungeons
like freehold
rustic ether
there are at least BM hunter balance tunings
so i assume theres going to be others
ive also seen people say theyve SEEN actual dmeo nerfs not just them predicting them
civic palm
Quite the assumption.
drifting cloud
demo trait nerf is the only balance change isnt it?
rustic ether
where is that at
steep obsidian
cobalt gyro
it'll be much less stupid
drifting cloud
it was in a ptr patch like a week or two ago
rustic ether
okay so dont lambast me for being late because this was like 2 months ago but theres an SS CHANGE
Shrouded Suffocation Garrote cast from Stealth generates 2 additional Combo Points and deals [210 * (1.27 * (1 + Versatility) * 1.14)] additional damage every 2 sec for 18 sec.
is that just the wording because theyre anal?
additional damage every 2 sec for 18 sec.**** was the new addition
drifting cloud
just an updated tooltip afaik
rustic ether
mk
civic palm
Correct, updated tooltip to make it more obvious that it influences the actual ticking DoT and not something weird.
New tooltip, really.
calm depot
is toxic blade really cast on cooldown regardless of state (low energy, rupture/garrote about to expire, etc)?
also, when your rupture falls off and you're at 1-3 stacks, is it more efficient to rupture sub 4 stacks or wait
drowsy flicker
Hey guys. First post here. Lifelong Rogue here since the very end of BC. Love my class and whatnot. I was never a hardcore raider but do raid weekly with a team. My guild is working on Jania Heroic and our best was a 10% wipe. My dmg is not where it should be and Id like some suggestions. Other than "your weapons suck" (I know) what can I do?
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/P3nFZApmxYaDRQrB/#fight=17&source=79
bronze kelp
@calm depot you should have rupture and garrote running, but thats a thing you can plan.
calm depot
yeah its mostly for if i mess up
bronze kelp
dont spend TB with very low energy, just pool some energy before. between 80-120 so you can spend as much energy as possible in this window
and sure you want to spend it into to envenom as often as possible
also you ideally want to use TB and after that a 5 CP envenom to get the buff
calm depot
i guess while im asking, im slightly unclear on how envenom works. the tooltip talks about instant damage but also shows a dot legnths. is there a dot element to envenom?
oh wait, thats how long the buff is, im very dumb. ignore this.
bronze kelp
😉
heavy trail
@drowsy flicker you are wasting combopoints casting mutilate @4 cps
And your opener is totally fucked up, there are many very basic things, check the pins in this channel and read the guide in depth, many many basic rotational misunderstandings
woven prairie
Hey im looking for some help looking at people's dps from my guild, since I'm not confident most people will seek decent help. I main warrior so I'm not familiar with details for most specs and just want someone to look over our logs for this week and tell me how people can improve, their mistakes, what they can do better, etc.
I am asking for Melohan
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/gQvjFMdW1nAw8pax - First 3 M
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/nyV1Gm3tACJYZf89 - M Opulence
If you could also ping me in discord with your responce since I'll be going to every class discord with this.
Any and all help is greatly appriciated!
hot copper
@woven prairie can't properly check logs on phone but the first thing I'm seeing is relatively low (75%) garrote and rupture uptime.
Should be 100%, does a truckload of damage and gives us energy (which means more damage)
woven prairie
Also he played outlaw on op i just didnt want to double post if anyone knows about that : ^) ty for the help!
fiery cradle
dot uptime
he can vanish garrote grong + 2 adds for more damage
thats just quickly looking, i can take a look a bit more after this league game
woven prairie
np take your time ty!
real bay
sometimes you can sometimes you can only 2 targets
at least as alliance lul with bigger room
rigid mango
Just with a quick look through he seems to hold vendetta way too much he should just be using it on cd
Esp on a fight like grong where I don't think there's ever that bad of a line up when it comes to vendetta line up
heavy skiff
Should i rupture all witches in WM? I feel like i do shit dps there
warm drift
I think yes cause of energyreg? But could be wrong
warped gate
@woven prairie grong's the only thing i can comment on, but there should have been 3 vendettas in that fight time. like this:
toxic blade seemed fairly ok. at most there would only be one blade missing compared to optimal. but yeah garrote/rupture uptime is a bit lower than you'd hope - though this can drop if you're having to move due to mechanics a lot too. so strictly looking at the uptime% isn't everything.
also, no pots
winter gale
If I want to play m+ more often and serious can I stay assa or should I go outlaw? I preffer to play assa since i am more used to it and can perform better but if difference is big I will go outlaw.
winter moss
in all honesty
play the fuck you want
playing sin due missing outlaw gear, 35k overall
ember saffron
quick question when its perfect time to use blood elfs racial? Its on CD or any special advise?
quick ice
unless you need to purge something, use on CD when you're not on high energy
mental gust
Just recently changed from outlaw to assassination. And I have one question. I know om supposed to pool energy at some point, but I cant understand when?
royal lantern
you focus more on raiding? sin, more m+? outlaw, but both are 100%viable for all content on highest difficultys
thats my opinion about that
austere mauve
Hello, i'm new here, i mostly play assa, for raiding and mythic + § i have a question, do we really want to 3 stacks azerit traits according to heroDamage ? (3x nothing personal for patchwerk and 3x shrouded suffocation for M+ cleaving) or do we want to have at least 1 shrouded suffocation for example (since the +3 combopoints is very important imo)
warm drift
M+ is something like 2x SS 2xEB 2xTtk, 1xss 2xeb 3xttk or 3xss 3xeb. All depends on affixes and groub setup. Correct me if im wrong
3xttk setup gives you prio dmg, 3xss 3xeb aoe and the other is the balanced one
austere mauve
ok so u dont play with NP?
solid nova
@austere mauve No, you should look at the value of what the traits give you, not just generically whats better overall as a stack.
For example based on HeroDamage:
3NP = 2,896
But the first DoubleDose is worth more than the 2nd NP., which would give you more dps etc.
When in doubt 
solid nova
Ya
austere mauve
oh ok ty
real bay
dat feel when you try outlaw but go full pepega. Haven't played it since legion
16 shrine made me think about trying it 
solid nova
magic thorn
Can someone explain me why i use toxicblade after vanish with the master assasin opener found on the ravenholdt guide ?
gusty coral
Crits
magic thorn
on the ticks? does master assasin snapshot ?
dry thicket
Tb does good dmg i believe
steady grotto
quick q
am i better to use tb on cd and line up gale callers when I can or wait for gale callers to come off cd and then use tb?
waiting for gale callers leaves about 12 secs with tb not used
well probs less in reality
steady grotto
ooh
i didn't know i could do that
ty
do i have to open the full report to see it?
covert crag
Do quick sim, click full html report, then action priority list, then Sample sequence table
steady grotto
cheers buddy
covert crag
😃 👍
magic thorn
So if tb doesnt tick and master assasin doesnt snapshot, why do i use tb after the vanish in the opener ?
spice surge
Because it does damage? 🤔
dark crag
Ma is a crit window, you don't do that for dot dmg
desert vault
I had fun dropping a ttk this week for blight, that crit is just so good
lament dove
I guess what he means is , why not TB vanish envenom muti envenom, instead of vanish TB muti envenom, how does that TB do more dmg than another (TB empowered) envenom?
bleak spoke
they really have to make a pin for that question
it's cuz of rng
either your vanish env muti env will pop off or the muti won't double crit and then you have to muti again
and ppl don't like that much
but it does do more damage if it does crit so that's why it's in top logs
i prefer env muti env by far. if i'm playing ma i want to see big boom on the meters
if i tox blade in ma i might as well play subterfuge
the rotation's still smooth as hell like a minute deep into the pull
devout jolt
^ this
me and another Rogue were using both different openers, sometimes he was on top, sometimes I was on top, end of the fight we were pretty much the same
potent oracle
guys anyone can explain me the AOE rotation for mythic + ? , i have the treits but dont know the rotation
devout jolt
what traits are you uding?
hollow stone
Fok
sonic bridge
dot all mobs
granite mason
sonic bridge
What traits are u using
potent oracle
ability*
sonic bridge
Shrouded x3?
sonic bridge
Use garrote 3 times > rupture and fok then dot all mobs
potent oracle
this one x2
but should i spam fok ?
or dot all mobs with rupture 5 combo points ?
real bay
dot a few after garrotes and fok
potent oracle
like , fok till 5 combo then rupture 1 moob , fok to 5 combo points , rupture another one
like this ?
sonic bridge
You only do 3 garrotes in opener and then use the normal garrote on primary target
Fok to 4/5 CP then rupture/envenom/CT
also depends how much hp ur mob has
you shouldn't spend 4/5cp ruptures on mob that has 10%
rough thunder
What is Fok ? just wondering
sonic bridge
aoe
sonic bridge
DD is trash for m+ overall
real bay
you literally never muti on trash
rough thunder
alright
real bay
with EB yes
sonic bridge
yeah yeah
rough thunder
And then should i go for unstable flames or head my call x2
sonic bridge
heed
rough thunder
alright thanks a lot
nocturne gate
Fan of knives=fok
austere mauve
do we want to use crimson tempest this week boys ? i used it yesterday its pretty good
in a +12-+13 i had very good dps, over 30K overall
rough thunder
which means replace poison bombs tho..
worldly iron
I kinda want poison bomb for minibosses
did a +15 freehold yesterday and ludwig takes like a week
we timed it though
rough thunder
i wanna try later on CT
worldly iron
I've always preferred PB 
rough thunder
same but i wanna give it a try for fun
worldly iron
it's p fun on reaping
austere mauve
yes its good for reaping and bigger pulls
golden relic
HB
rapid onyx
So I’m trying to get better about not wasting combo points and stuff, as well as being better at my rotation... is there like, a decent rotation addon that can help with that? I’m not entirely sure what wasting my points means, but uh I’m trying to learn
golden relic
Wasting points is for example, you are on 4 combo points and u mutilate which by default gives 2 and your max combo points is 5
so you are wasting 1 combo point
rapid onyx
Oh that makes sense
golden relic
therefor it is better to use a finish moving (unless you can use a 1 Combo point ability, like garrote, if its needed to be refreshed) on 4 combo points
and then continue to build combo points like normal again
golden relic
the positive part of that is that u will never kno if u waste 1 or 3 
no bad feelings
strange python
is it worth to only use mutilate once if u could afford two or more and enevom ? and if rupture is running out then use like 2x mutilate ?
silent silo
I would get weakauras to track your bleeds, cp, energy, and cd's. It puts everything in the middle of your screen so its hard to miss
golden relic
I dont understand your question mugi