Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
#assassination
prisma monolithBOT
strange python
!azerite
hollow talon
hey dudes is there any numbers like herodamage for zandalari
should i race change for that sweet 1% dps increase
shy dust
Race change for the amazing looks
devout osprey
twist the knife vs Double Dose
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/e59KQpnhBhRad39m6qVvK6m ah dont understand. Ah was at 16k yesterday...
strange python
those traits on bloodmallet, those are only for MA
anyway to make them for subt? or just sim
robust cloak
hey guys, is there any resource that lists a big bunch of skips that are possible and how to do them? i know a few of the more basic/common ones, but there are a few ones i've seen on streams and such from the 15+ range that i don't know how to do, for example theres a way to skip the elemental miniboss in shrine that i don't know
and would like to add a few of those to my m+ knowledge
flint fable
Hey @brisk aurora big fan of your logs, any tips for an aspiring rogue player?
rustic ether
if i dont get conclave chest this week im going outlaw and losing my dignity
fringe phoenix
stone crescent
Hmm my mastery and crit are my highest stats now as assa, anyone have an idea why? only on 21% haste
real bay
depends on a lot of things for me mastery and crit starts to take over at close to 20%haste , either way they are close
it doesn't really matter use what sims best
stone crescent
got it, thanks.
Btw, thoughts on TTK? Everyone here says it's good but its not really up there in bloodmallet or herodamage
I have the choice atm to replace my last shrouded suff trait with it, but not sure if I should cause 1 point in shroud seems pretty good
just for the cp
grizzled jay
Just sim?
stone crescent
okkk
grizzled jay
Also hero dmg and all that use different gear than you would. That's why personal sims are always better. Those sites are more about giving you an idea of what is good
bleak spoke
what a lucky day https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/qQatp76YRxPQDqeBpiF7Zd
real bay
415 
bleak spoke
i got jadefire shoulders 8D
grizzled jay
Yep. Literally warforged pieces with sockets and wf weps and bis azerites every raid. And I get gold. Let's hope this week goes better
I have some sockets. I'm simming 24.112 smth like that
bleak spoke
good luck 😮
i was simming 23.9 this morning
then there was a small chain of miracles
real bay
just get lucky 4head
real bay
I did and it gave me a 420 howlis socketed
real bay
no dagger
bleak spoke
oh
i'm actually wearing one i think i'm drain bramaged
socketed weapons are so pleasant
real bay
won't replace till next tier lul
steep obsidian
RNG BARELY EFFECTS YOU
cobalt gyro
yes
worldly iron
rtb rng tho 
obsidian sierra
civic palm
Since it rolls +15 the "Titanforged" tagline is forced.
drifting cloud
@obsidian sierra tf doesnt have a cap
full pagoda
Hey guys, I asked yesterday but nobody reallu answered, what's the best residum usage for a piece. I'm curious which pieces are the best to buy with? Kinda bot sure
full pagoda
Well both but I'm in a need if M+ pieces right now
worldly iron
then I dunno
champions drops a great headpiece and jadefire drops a pretty good shoulderpiece
for raiding, that is
worldly iron
lucky 
full pagoda
strange python
For M+ Opulence Head, Conclave Chest And Rasta Shoulders gives you 2xSS, 2xEB, 2xTTK. Those are the Ones I am using when I I play Sin in M+
winter moss
@worldly iron did you extend
strange python
To roll from M+ I would go shoulders
winter moss
okay
bronze kelp
yep, its totally depending on the content you are playing
strange python
Roll for Chep or Gorak? Or should I just sim by adding the string of item data for my top gear and see?
ember violet
is assassination with 3x EB better than Outlaw for M+?
real bay
define better, for what affixes, level, which instance
ember violet
maybe I should rephrase it, when is assassination with 3x EB better than Outlaw for M+?
but broadly speaking Outlaw is a better pick, especially on non tyrannical weeks?
cobalt gyro
with TTK traits assassination is effectively a better sub rogue
real bay
assa blasts pretty hard this week tbh
only lose on reaping
which really doesn't matter most damage is in the low hp mobs that die fast
ye
cobalt gyro
on any serious push key, i'm going outlaw
ember violet
im currently doing sub 10 keys so it probably doesnt matter if I play outlaw or assa after all
cobalt gyro
outlaw has easier gearing
assa needs a lot more traits
outlaw it's just wits + whatever else you got
(obviously optimal gear is better but 1 wit is all you need to do "good enough")
real bay
double outlaw this week perhaps got a bunch of 16 keys 
bronze kelp
going with assa this week, got my dungeon slice sim dps raised by 1k so its 31,5k on outlaw vs 30,2k on assa.
assa is just more fun so as my assa gear got better, outlaw will perform a bit better, but a lot less fun ^^
real bay
probably stay assa im too lazy to swap
worldly iron
outlaw is cool but it kinda makes me wanna kidney shot myself irl
real bay
the other guy will play outlaw
charred lantern
what azerites and talents do you run in fortified guys?
bronze kelp
on mass aoe for sure
charred lantern
i see
real bay
garrote does a lot even with 1 ss
real bay
20.9k my highest
bronze kelp
so i got decent garrote dmg while silencing 3 mobs
worldly iron
subterfuge is generally the better talent for m+, no?
real bay
always
worldly iron
MA doesn't see much use in m+
bronze kelp
the 6 second silence component is the key for me
real bay
unless you do a meme build
bronze kelp
hm... asking my self if MA could be a thing for huge aoe 🤔
chilly obsidian
probably not
real bay
hidden blades MA build
worldly iron
MA hidden blades 
chilly obsidian
might be fun lol but not entirely optimal
bronze kelp
hm... brb simming XD
worldly iron
not even remotely optimal 
real bay
after a few seconds you are out of steam
shy axle
Bought my second 415 chest item with residiuum. Got the 2 worst possible. GG
chilly obsidian
optimal schmoptimal i guess if you wanna see big numbers briefly
shy axle
but happens, lets see next week
worldly iron
vendor is rigged
worldly iron
vendor is rigged
safe relic
worldly iron
I'm at like 23.4k with my shrouded and ttk
empty tide
one de de ?
bronze kelp
?
empty tide
@safe relic your shoulder simcs better with NP than DD?
real bay
I think I'd be 25k but I refuse to use unstable catalyst
shy axle
@empty tide NP in general sims the best since the buff, but you have to take trinkets etc in consideration. They are nearly equal, but you have to decice - one burst or DD over the whole fight
empty tide
yeah i mean, he already had one from his chest, but idk
2-3x NP simcs extremally bad for me
1x NP is godlike tho
shy axle
I sim best with 3 DD and 3 NP
more than 1 NP is worth since the buff
maybe try simming it again
real bay
depends, never suggests more than one for me
shy axle
ye of course, it all depends always
real bay
Have 3 on my gear
chilly obsidian
wait im dumb when did np get buffed?
shy axle
haste interaction few weeks ago
empty tide
guess NP gives you a more bursty build
empty tide
does the combo from conclave and rastakhan works on Atal'Dazar and kings rest?
real bay
wish there was an actual visible buff for the set, it's dumb
cobalt gyro
ye
real bay
why hide
strange python
So basically KR AD & ML. That ring, Cloak and the combo is super bad in M+ anyway so
cobalt gyro
not ML
cobalt gyro
it's worth it for the main stat
strange python
Sorry then :P I still stand by my later statement about the items themselvea
150 agility? It is not. No crit or Mastery on ring = not worth it for m+ at all
Haste on cloak = not worth
cobalt gyro
haste/crit isn't awful for m+
strange python
Well this is sin part of the discord so. I assumed he wanted to know if the combo was good for Sin
cobalt gyro
Think of it this way, it's effectively a ring with 150 main stat if you're using it in AD / KR
shy axle
haste/crit still not awful. Yeah I get it "YOu OnLY waNT MAstERY anD CRIt" is repeated here for Myth+, but haste is still not awfull, you still do have value from it, Sill #1 ST. Not bad having some haste
royal lantern
having 4%more mastery doesnt make a item not worth it......
oh no
it happend
MA is now 0,8%over subterfuge
😦
real bay
been using monkey cloak instead, nothing else 400+ , crit 32% anyways
cobalt gyro
if really want to math it out, put your weights of the three stats together, subtract what you're losing from your other ring, and compar that to 150 main stat
nimble tartan
i think the last thing i need is a helm from mythic and id gain like 440 dps
so id be at like 26.6k~
i have some tittyforges above base
but not on important pieces like weapon so im closin in on the PEAK
strange python
I mean. Sure we say Crit heavy Mastery 2nd. Becouse it is the best. By far. If you cannot accept that it is on you, but no reason to take others with you down the ignorance tunnel
quick ice
FYI, testing shows ML counts as Zuldazar for the Loa set, last time I checked
royal lantern
idk why people always think that X is slightly better means that Y is ussules/worthless......
cobalt gyro
seems like they look at like
crit > mastery > haste for aoe and take that to be haste = 0
strange python
I never said haste is worthless. I said crit mastery is better and that agility is not important. And that the haste vers ring is bad
quick ice
you know what's worthless for AOE? Intellect
cobalt gyro
right, and all i was saying is unless you're trading from a perfectly statted ring with a socket, chances are vers + haste (150 agi) is better 🤷
royal lantern
last time i checked a huge chunck of our AoE dmg is from FoK/EB
wich is not boosted by mastery
cobalt gyro
there's quite a few outlaw rogues envious of you tho
royal lantern
same with vers, mastery ONLY affects bleeds/poisons, how much dmg in trash groups is your bleeds/poisons, how much is FoK/EB?
empty tide
im using 3xDD 1xTC 1xNP 1xTdK
royal lantern
2xDD pals unite
low junco
i am literally
sitting on the bench
for my guild
and i dont have chance to get items
royal lantern
maybe mekka will drop his chest when we finaly kill him
empty tide
hey i hate you
you have the gorak tul shoulders
the best shoulders in the game for sure
warped gate
mekka hc chest is probably better no?
low junco
i got
cobalt gyro
right but nothing is as hilarious as this
low junco
like
nimble tartan
i got the chest on mekka for offspec now my outlaw is poppin off
nimble tartan
ive bonus rolled champs and stormwall as many times as i can
royal lantern
well, you ASKED FOR IT
nimble tartan
and ive not seen
a mythic helm
im stillw earing engi helm
in 2019
i cant even imagine what my life would be like without engineering
empty tide
just drop it 4Head
nimble tartan
i have like 3k residuum though
royal lantern
thats why engineering is the only profession you need
nimble tartan
but i have bis shoulder bis chest
low junco
i cant get a good pull on mekka
cuz guildmates die on first 2 mins
and we have to wipe
nimble tartan
ye my guild reprog on mekka this week
nimble tartan
wiped like fuckin 8 times or some shit
royal lantern
uk what, 20sec-2min deaths are part of guild raiding
low junco
literally
royal lantern
every guild has the 2-3 people that always die too stuff, its normal
nimble tartan
why do you think you are on the bench
royal lantern
he doesnt play a ranged dot class
low junco
so i decided to step down
royal lantern
in world of rangeddotcraft
nimble tartan
well if you're behind on gear thats a valid reason
royal lantern
thats why he is benched
nimble tartan
maybe they dont want to invest in you right now
low junco
i am not really behind
like
i am on the same ilvl with the other rogue who is raiding
nimble tartan
if he has more pulls yeah
nimble tartan
ive been lovin blightborne
empty tide
i simced , it goes up to 26.6k with blightborne
literally the best shoulder in the game for rogue
cobalt gyro
it's actually cheaper rn for me to scrap my engi helm, buy the mats, and then craft another instead of reforging
this doubling cost thing is a joke
warped gate
idd, i hate the concept that they want to push that you should "lock in" a single talent set/azerite trait in general
cobalt gyro
wouldnt be as big an issue if, yknow
you don't go from being flavor to trashcanned
in 1 patch
charred lantern
guys does it matter on which the deadly nav enchant is?? should it be on main hand or does it matter ?
empty tide
i tried to keep a set of same azerite for assa and outlaw
cobalt gyro
it doesn't matter
charred lantern
i see thanks
empty tide
it procs more often on main hand doesn't it?
cobalt gyro
it does not
quick ice
no
empty tide
hmm i see
worldly iron
SS
buoyant coyote
makes the rotation and opener not slow
empty tide
i hate using MA
expecially when your first two envenoms on openner doenst crit with like 85% crit xd
buoyant coyote
i refuse using ma xd
quick ice
the worst thing about MA is when you do the vanish-TB-mut and only get to 3CP
clearly makes vanish-env-mut-env superior
fair blaze
You can use mutilates after first rapture and then press TB before vanish
It's more stable than ravenholdt opener, because you can have the accident like you mentioned above
wraith dragon
pretty sure it was like thatt on Ravenhold some tine ago, not sure why they would changed it
fair blaze
nah
devout jolt
i pop tb after vanish: gar - mut - rup - mut - vend - vanish - tb - enev
fair blaze
@devout jolt you won't fit one more Envenom in MA window if your Mutilate hit 4 CP
devout jolt
touche
fair blaze
@wraith dragon I think that TB after Vanish was from the beginning of MA popularity
Not sure tho
devout jolt
i justy felt getting the tb with ma but i guess its a multiplier for enve
winter gale
For exsang usage... I use it on CD but rupture needs to be above 20sec?
devout jolt
so if the planets aligned, with MA, tb before vanish could get enve - mut - enve in the 2nd MA window
winter gale
Or minimum of 20 sec?*
fair blaze
@winter gale Rapture >20 secs, garrote> half of duration
strange python
I’ve had the best results with MA and those traits
winter gale
@fair blaze does that means I can or I need to refresh both no matter how long they are? If they are for exmple on like 14,15 sec... Do i wait them to tick until refreshing point or refresh insta if exsang is ready?
strange python
Should I be using 2x NP or 1x NP and 1x Blightborne. Noticed people saying here that blight is the nuts now?
Single target
quick ice
blight
strange python
Blight sims higher for me, but in real world I find I get better results with NP
I’ll try blight tonight
winter gale
@fair blaze
fair blaze
?
quick ice
I haven't seen NP sim higher before tbh
fair blaze
Ohandza i answered your question above
If your rapture is below 20s and you have exsanguinate in 2 secs, you refresh rapture and the same way goes with garrote, then you press exsa
vast forum
You don't refresh garrote too early for exsg
Maybe a few sec outside the pandemic window
But not at like 12 sec remaining
vast forum
Sims showed it to be a dps loss to force garrote before exsg
fair blaze
And from mystler or someone at IV or wowhead
vast forum
Minor, but a loss
fair blaze
Yeah
But i said that he should refresh garrot
Only if its below the half duration
So if garrote basic dur is 18s
So he should force only below 9s
And it shouldnt be a dps loss
cold horizon
Anyone have an issue where nothing personal doesnt apply the poisen... got 2X the trait and made it 3 bosses in thinking i was terrible before i realised its not being applied in any of my logs
quick ice
sounds like the azerite bug
wraith dragon
wait, what bug ?
wraith dragon
ok, thanks for the heads up
worldly iron
stable good game
winter gale
Is exsang still better for m+ if I play with 3xss?
worldly iron
@winter moss no reclear this week talked to the 2 officers (the GM wants to reclear as well but 2 vs 1) and both are adamant in extending for progress
gonna see what the other guildies think tonight, since I've only spoken to these guys so far
rocky ruin
spice surge
Internal only applies if you can stun the target
worldly iron
nice for raptors on conclave
bleak spoke
Kind of a weird optimization thing, for MA played with a TTK I think you should start G M R Vendetta mutilate tb (as usual) but then from here can have a branch in the decision tree where after that TB if you don’t have 5 cp you just envenom and then mutilate to 4+ again, at which point you either have 4 again or you might have 5, letting you vanish for specifically a 5 cp envenom. Seems like there’s no downside to this since it’ll never been long enough to actually desync your vanish from vendetta/tb windows
Just gives you another bite at the apple so to speak
lime carbon
Anybody here that's able to look at my logs and see where I could improve?
stable fog
hey i got a question that i think i know the answer too but just wanna make sure.... 2xEB and 2xSS or 1xEB and 3xSS for mythic+ keep in mind this week is fortified
bleak spoke
SS is miserable if your tank chain pulls which is required to time higher keys on teeming
cobalt gyro
Tbf if you're running sin this week you're trolling lmao
stable fog
well it aint that bad really as i play nightelf i can shadowmeld into stealth and vanish between pulls
but yeah i play sin..don't like the outlaw spec and im doing fine on keys in the 13-15 area mostly
cobalt gyro
It's not too bad if you're running 1 ss trait with 2 eb and 3 ttk
Then you don't really care about re stealths cause your damage is a lot of envenom
stable fog
got the gear for it but not the gold...currently at 40k reforge price
cobalt gyro
Yikes
ruby idol
Wait im playing sin only this week! :)
cobalt gyro
But why
ruby idol
For fun
desert vault
I am having fun with 3x eb, 2x ttk and 1x ss this week
lucid dock
For low M+ (ilvl 380ish) is it worth giving up DD traits for ss?
Trying to get the most out of some fairly terrible pieces for traits
cosmic pier
why is the MA opener vanish >tb > mut >env instead of tb before vanish and get 2 envenoms off?
oak pilot
Sup guys, I was dreaming insane damage crits and shit. Then I came up with something.
Has anyone tried Assa FOK with the Legion Cape & Hidden Blades & Nightstalker & Flying Daggers?
old escarp
But when you get back to back 80k and 65k env crits in MA window feelsparseman
dark crag
Tb mut env is not far off
oak pilot
@dark crag I'm thinking if it would be worth trying out for World PvP for example 😄 If that still works, 115lvl rogue could do shit tons of damage.
dark crag
Legiondarys stop working after 115
oak pilot
Cuz we're talking about 1050% + 400% + 50% + 50%
dark crag
No, every 120 will clean the floor with you
solid nova
The damage is additive, not multipliable, it was nerfed a long time ago.
Its not as big as you think
old escarp
Real talk though. 3s 50% crit MA feels really bad. Those 3 globals every 2 minutes don’t really pack much oomph and vanish doesn’t necessarily feel like a dps CD with it. I wish it was 5s honestly
oak pilot
Alright, Thanks @solid nova !
misty shuttle
help lol can someone look me up and tell me what the heck im doing wrong? im so confused when it comes to tallents az traits and how to get more dps out of my char. i raid mythic for my guild and seam to be falling to mid and lower on dps chart by end of fight
dark crag
Also lowlvl vs 120 was nerfed too
solid nova
^
dark crag
The only lowlevels who survive 120 are pala with bubble hs
hallow coyote
Spent seals on Champion and Opulence, got AP both times
Did get the Opulence Crown that's a dps downgrade over my 390 Laminaria hat
nova basalt
Hey does Kimbel's Razor Claw's bleed effect use haste ?
sturdy python
The bleed itself shouldn’t, it’s a Ppm trinket however so it procs more with more haste
lime carbon
@misty shuttle 2 things right off, get rid ss and tc on your helm and replace them with double dose and nothing personal. Get rid of subterfuge talent and switch to master assassin.
misty shuttle
should i go toxic blade as well then?
sturdy python
Sim your gear and talents on raidbots.com
SS is not very good on st so exsang is also not that great.
misty shuttle
on st ?? what is st
solid nova
Single target
misty shuttle
ty for helping im not as bad as i sound just willing to hear new ideas cuz i feel stuck dps wise and want more
cobalt pelican
i don't recommend doing that without actually simming
ss tc are the single target traits highest on cowl for me (granted i play nelf so i get a little extra out of it)
but the difference can be extremely negligible and on most fights if it is dd np ma isn't great
wary ice
Anyone got some time to review some H logs?
topaz crow
@cobalt pelican are you simming 100% uptime on TC or are you averaging out your uptime across fight to get the most accurate representation?
Personally i dont like TC for raiding progression because damage is gonna happen and it gonna hurt and pry lose uptime and maybe cost your life.
I can take a look if ya want
chilly moth
Should I be aiming always gor 5cp envenoms or its okay to casting 4cp envenom when I dont want waste CP oor i should cast throwing knives(or whatever thas spell name is) At 4 cp to get 5cp envenom🤔
wary ice
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/hQCkN1Lg7TvMjtYB/#view=rankings&playermetric=dps&boss=-2&difficulty=0&wipes=2 ; I'm doing a lot better than last week; which was mostly gray parses :^(
Not sure why i did so bad on CoL - dont really remember the fight; Grong I think I did good on; Jadefire I think I did good on; Oppulence i got ruby duty but otherwise i think i did fine; Conclave is still a shit show for our group; and rhasta I m not sure how to handle the add phases as MA
Mostly looked to make sure im hitting my vanishes right and im not stupid on my CP generation this week
topaz crow
4CP enevenoms are fine i'll even hit a 3cp enevenom to keep EP going while i have major buffs going
quartz depot
does blightborne infusion simming higher than 2nd NP make sense or no
spice surge
Yeeessss
fair blaze
@wary ice There are 3 rogues, can you tell your nickname?
strange python
Can you just add a data string to sim top gear. I wanna know if I should roll for Gorak or Cepht
sturdy python
You can yes. Gear compare is also an option
cobalt pelican
i sim at 90% tc uptime since it matches most fights that i participate in
fair blaze
@wary ice Try to work on planning
cobalt pelican
to be honest a lot of tc downtime comes at times in fights that dps output is generally not super relevant too
fair blaze
Sometimes you use TB and then you refresh dots
lime carbon
Anybody here care to look over my logs and offer any pointers
solid nova
Dot refreshing during TB is still better than letting them fall off though
fair blaze
Yeah
But refreshing dots before TB coming off cooldown in pandemic range
Is better than refreshing them in TB
Right :D?
solid nova
Well ofc 😄
fair blaze
Also on Opu
You didnt pair your vend with vanish
For higher parses you should consider taking subt and some SS pieces for fights like conclave, masters, CoL
wary ice
One of my major issues from last week was holding CDs so i focused on just hammering TB on CD this week to get used to that timing between them; will def work on bleeds before them.
I remember hat vend on OPu it felt bad - I think I just missed pressing my vanish and didnt notice till like 40 seconds later
And yeah I figured SS +sub would do better on the cleave-ier fights I just dont have any - my equipped peices are the only pieces i have
Or rather; My ST sims ~4% higher with these peices than the 385 s I'd be dropping to
fair blaze
Yeah but jadefire masters arent clearly ST are they :d?
Also
On jadefire and opu
You wasted some CPs from Mutilate
That means
You cast Mut on 4+ CPs
And thats it probably
wary ice
Got me there.
Thanks for the advice I have a pile of stuff to workon for next run between this and other people's pms :^)
solid nova
Not using pots 
fair blaze
Maybe he is poor hooman
lime carbon
Anyone mind taking a look at mine
fair blaze
So
Starting right now
On grong
You did
Garrote mut mut envenom
How about rapture :D?
solid nova
Yeah your opener isnt correct, you delayed rupture way too long
Your tb windows are rarely getting a 2nd envenom in too
lime carbon
Usually on my opener I use envenom first to get it in the ma window then rupture after that. So I should switch that?
fair blaze
Yes
sturdy python
Pots cost too much
lime carbon
Ok that's an easy fix
sturdy python
Prolonged power!
fair blaze
Its better to have energy regen and some kind of passive dmg from start
wary ice
IDK what happened on that grong opener tbh
solid nova
Could probs macro trinket with vendetta too with same CD
Saves the slight stagger you have every time you use it
wary ice
They are macro'd
fair blaze
Also you wont need to refresh garrote during TB if you use proper opener
You wasted some CPs on Rastakhan
lime carbon
Yea I thought about a macro but honestly I don't know how to make them unless I can find one already that I can copy paste
solid nova
``#showtooltip
/cast Vendetta
/use 13```
fair blaze
Tbh its hard to analyze your logs when you are playing with MA and you dont kill mekka blockade itp
wary ice
IDK why they're staggered like that
solid nova
Or 14 depending on what slot you've got
wary ice
I have that exact one rich
fair blaze
These bosses are the best for analyze ST
wary ice
I'm pretty sure mine is #showtooltip /cast Vendetta /use 13 /use 14
solid nova
Yeah
wary ice
I'll double check it when im home
lime carbon
Thanks Richard I will make that macro when I get home
solid nova
No no i gathered both dw
lime carbon
So basically from the sounds of it I just need to change my opener
solid nova
Ye
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
arctic harness
You shouldnt use 2 on use trinkets tbh
fair blaze
Someone are cheesy for ilvl LUL
solid nova
He doesnt have 2 on use
lime carbon
You said to pool to 100 energy before using tb?
solid nova
The macro is just off
sturdy python
Use Tb on Cooldown. If you plan properly you can pool before
solid nova
With the apm being so low of the spec, pooling isnt this crazy mad mechanic 😄
fair blaze
If your TB is coming off CD within 3 secs, just stop using Mut
And you will fit 2+ more envenoms
coarse carbon
Anyone have a macro that will allow me to put a single button on my bar, and when I’ve selected Exsang it’ll show/use exsang; but then when I swap to TB it’ll show/use TB?
solid nova
/cast [talent:6/2] Toxic Blade; [talent:6/3] Exsanguinate```Yeah, had one from a google search but it broke after yesterday for some reason.
solid nova
P sure 🤔
coarse carbon
Thanks Richard
solid nova
lime carbon
Ok so switch my opener and watch my energy before tb comes off cool down and make a macro. Thanks those are easy changes that I can do immediately.
lime carbon
I have plenty of pots. Problem is, if raid lead doesn't call for second pot I have a hard time remembering to use it. I'm old.
fair blaze
If you dont bl at pull
solid nova
Use it with 2nd vanish
fair blaze
Use at BL
solid nova
If you forget
fair blaze
Otherwise with CDs
solid nova
^^^^
vast forum
the day has come when MA/TB sims higher for me than subt/exsg 
coarse carbon
That’s a beautiful day Yoppa
lime carbon
Good point, I'll just start using it with second varnish
vast forum
no it's not
lime carbon
Vanish
vast forum
i like exsg way more
solid nova
tru
pastel vault
exsang could be nice after the 3x garrote rupture, gives energy to spam for a while
fair blaze
How can you use 3x garrote with rupture
pastel vault
like on m+ aoe
fair blaze
Its rather 2x garrotes 2x ruptures
coarse carbon
I’ve still not had a build where sub+TB sims higher than MA+TB
See a few players run it, but seems more quality of life on opener than anything
fair blaze
Tbh on m+ you have a lot of energy regrn xd
pastel vault
Ill try that next m+ 😃
fair blaze
3 mobs with dot pack and you are gucci
pastel vault
it'd give enough energy to spam fok a ton during the exsang
fair blaze
Of course only when your fok crit 3 targets pepega
coarse carbon
Oh on m+ Exsang + 3 SS is super nice.
azure elm
Hey. So I got a quick question :p Bloodmallet is a source I use frequently. It says "Nothing Personal" is the best of all if you have 3 of it. (Like I do), yet the guide speaks of SS and DD. Which source should I trust more in this case? 😛
coarse carbon
The thing to keep an eye on is how much DPS you gain per stack of NP.
pastel vault
the first NP trait is really strong
spice surge
Besides, NP and DD are equal execpt for the first trait
fair blaze
I’m not sure if raidbots correctly sim haste value from NP
spice surge
But just sim yourself, ideal setup doesnt use any SS for ST
fair blaze
Cause still TC sims higher
pastel vault
it was recently corrected and works properly niecerg
fair blaze
For me
coarse carbon
If you get more DPS from a single TC than what a 3rd NP adds... go NPx2 + TC for example
spice surge
Raidbots and herodamage use the exact same source code
lime carbon
If I start using rupture on my opener instead of envenom do I want to wait on a 5cp rupture or go with a 3cp rupture? On the opener only.
spice surge
IE they're identical
idle ember
When is the best time to use Galecallers during your opener with SS?
azure elm
aight. Thanks guys
coarse carbon
@idle ember when you have a maximum rupture and garrote up, then you GCB -> Exsang
idle ember
Thanks!
coarse carbon
So... G -> R -> G -> mut (for 5cp) -> R (maximum pandemic rupture) -> GCB-> Exsang
lime carbon
@fair blaze ty
hardy forge
as we are talking about openers, what would be the difference between those MA openers:
- Garrote > Mut > Rupture > Vendetta > Vanish > TB > Mut to 4-5 cp > Envenom (...)
- Garrote > Mut > Rupture > Mut > Vendetta > Vanish > TB > Envenom (...)
I see most of the people with MA using the first one but the 2nd one seems better on paper to me, feels like it makes sure Envenom fits into the MA window, am I missing something?
spice surge
It basicly doesnt matter
Also, the first one is more likely to have a 5cp envenom than the second one
coarse carbon
The biggest difference to me is that in option 1 TB has a high chance to crit for 2CP. Then that better ensures a 5CP envenom as you only need one hand of Mut to crit for the 3CP.
However if your TB doesn’t crit, it’s still highly likely both Mut’s will which again gives you a higher chance of 5CP envenom
silent silo
I use MA most of the time and I like to get to 3-4 CP TB then vanish. Seems better to get the most envenoms in the MA window
pastel vault
I messed with APL to do 3 different openers,
- simc current opener
- garrote > mut > rupture > vendetta > tb > vanish > mut > envenom > mut
- garrote > mut > rupture > vendetta > tb > mut > vanish envenom mut envenom
coarse carbon
Additionally, the first option lines up significantly better with your maximum pandemic windows on garrote and rupture as when TB falls off, your next GCD can be pooled for a second or two to refresh garrote
pastel vault
1 and 2 simmed the same within single digit dps, 3rd lagged behind
hardy forge
Ok, thanks, I see now
pastel vault
3rd is bad because fairly low chance of 5 CP envenom I think, that's all I could think of for why it's not as good
2nd is viable because of tripple double dose crits with double mut in the MA window
hardy forge
"One" more dumb question,
As far as I've noticed DoTing balistas on Jaina M is worth it, to do it as efficiently as possible damage-on-jaina-wise do I want - just after opener - to wait untill TB runs out and then just go for 5 CP and use it on rupture on balista? She usually seems to freeze a balista when there is like 1-3 sec of TB left on her, so going for an instant rupture on balista as soon as possible would be a waste of those 1-3 sec. On the other hand if I DoT balista as soon as possible I get this bonus energy regen sooner. Also do I want to DoT every balista for as long as it is alive just to have this bonus energy regen? Do I want to leave just rupture or both rupture and garrote?
lime carbon
So is it better to roll with 3 np and 2 dd or 2 np and 3 dd
spice surge
Dotting another target for simply energy isnt worth it
Unless you want/need to damage the balistas, its not worth doing
It doesnt increase your jaina dps
hardy forge
Ah, well then, how about putting rupture ~5 sec before balista dies just to get energy return?
spice surge
the energy return is the exact same regardless of if the target dies or stays alive
You're spending 5cp and 25 energy to get roughly 100 energy back (depending on haste)
Instead of just envenoming which does more damage than that 1½ mutilate you would get from the energy refund
coarse carbon
You’re not getting a big enough net “gain” of energy return I would imagine. You’re wasting 5CP on a ballista rupture that could be an envenom on Jaina; which also puts up envenom debut.
Plus you’re wasting movement time, losing white DPS
Debut = debuff**
wary ice
debutt 
hardy forge
Aight, understood, thanks
coarse carbon
I don’t believe ballista damage counts toward your overall DPS, just as spark bot damage isn’t recorded on Mekkatorque.
Also the same with the “off boss” on conclave. Only the damage of the kill boss is recorded.
hardy forge
Balista damage doesnt count to logs, just thought it improves Jaina dps in a way
coarse carbon
You’re more likely better off using the CP’s on envenom (as it can crit for big numbers), taking the envenom debuff for your poison damage, not losing auto damage due to movement, and keeping EP up.
Versus the 30-75 energy it would return for the effort of moving to a ballista to apply rupture.
hardy forge
Pretty sure that the energy return is 100+ tho
coarse carbon
Sure, if used 100% ideally prior to the freezing of the ballista. I’m not at home to do a bunch of math on it, but I’d imagine the 100 energy refunded to you at a perfect usage rate still would not be worth the loss of the above mentioned. I’d love to see some math on it though!
primal gazelle
normally, 5 cp 25 for 100+ energy back is worth it imo. However in this situation it is not because damage on ballista doesn't count and you would need to apply poisons to the ballistas as well, at 30% proc, it takes 3-4 auto attacks to apply it, which could've been spent on Jaina, not including the uptime you lose from running back and forth
5 cp rup last 24 secs, deadly poison last 12, so you would also have to use throw knive 12 secs in to reapply poisons to gain energy
soo its completely not worth it
magic thorn
Hey Guys just did the First Boss and i want to imrpove myself.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/xnkTFKPg1At6H9pN#fight=1&type=damage-done&source=10
What can i do better, what do i need to watch out for ? Im Roguethree
lime carbon
My haste sims at like 2.75 and my agility sims at like 2.18. I've been eating the 70 haste food instead of the feasts. Is this the right play or should I always opt for the 100 agility?
magic thorn
2.75 * 70=192 // 2.18 * 100=218
lime carbon
@magic thorn didn't realize that's how the math worked (I'm terrible at math) good to know thanks.
strange python
Current Gear + Gorak sims 150 better than Current Gear + Ceph. Is that still true even after implementing the real value of TTK with 3xDD?
scarlet wing
how strong is hidden blades with 3 eb this week?
i saw it yesterday and the assa deals 41k overall in ur
primal gazelle
who 😮
scarlet wing
morning
primal gazelle
morning does 20 keys
primal gazelle
im starting movements over here
HB FOR LIFE
41k overall in a UR is pretty good
my highest was like a 38.6k in 19 UR
but that was 3 weeks ago at 402 gear 🤔
scarlet wing
this week we need fucking damn much aoe damage
coarse carbon
Running what trait setup?
scarlet wing
3 eb 2 ss 1 ttk
tough ridge
Would you guys say that it’s worth switching to images/blocks as Assassination on Jaina normal/heroic? Aren’t we better off just keeping Jaina humped?
hard cove
hi should i take nothing personal over trechorous covenant ?
primal gazelle
im guessing 39% is buffed with your trinket right
cos 39% without any sockets is hard to get
royal lantern
@scarlet wing thats only true for 6days from now
then most demonlocks roll another fotm class/spec
scarlet wing
i have 5 sockets @primal gazelle but its buffed with 6 true
39% is rly good
true @royal lantern
primal gazelle
morning sustaining 110k dps for a 60 sec pull here
with 3 EB and hidden blades
those filthy outlaws wouldve been out of BF charges 😛
primal gazelle
eyebeam/skillbarrage is good for like 15-20 sec pulls
once the pull gets longer their burst withers down
royal lantern
ik, but i did he use it at all
golden relic
the variety of azerite trait combos for assa with the mix of ss, eb and ttk and how many of each is quite pog acctually
primal gazelle
good dhs dont have fel barrage talented tbh
golden relic
its not boring like ds ds ds wits and also it caters to the dung
royal lantern
*skillbarrage
primal gazelle
but avade is a 3k io player soooo hes prob better than all of us anyways
royal lantern
''allright, MA sims 0,8%better then subterfuge for me now, time too take it''
vanish>no envenom crit>2cp mulitate
fuck that talent
srsly
primal gazelle
@royal lantern the clip starts with the DH eye beam for 100k dps actually
strange python
So if im reading a lot of peoples opinions correctly, would I be right in saying SS&Sub>DD&MA for raiding/single target? Ive been running the former but can switch the the latter... Or should I just sim?
obvs this is like 2+ of either trait
dark crag
Play what you like
cosmic pier
theres only a couple of percent dps difference so if you find that you enjoy the playstyle of one over the other, do what you enjoy
i personally run 1 ss +sub just for the opener + add cleave with vanish
scenic shale
how good is blightbourne infusion of assa?
cosmic pier
pretty solid, DD likes crit
scenic shale
what is the abslute optimal traits assuming they are achievable, 3 dd 1 np and 3 overwhelming power
what other 2 would fill?
dark crag
Tc
cosmic pier
3 dd 3 np is pretty good, since tc isnt ideal for prog
dark crag
Whatever you can get your hands on
scenic shale
3 np? really?
cosmic pier
but yeah must the top traits are prety close, so a mixture of DD/np/tc is good
just try messing around with uptime yourself. in raidbots you can set (i like to go for 90% for prog), when you try that tc is very close to the other traits. once you consider that, you then weigh up whether the downside is worth it for prog
especially if you dont have all your defensive traits yet on 415s
but if TC is all you got its still very good
just gotta think about the practical application
dark crag
There is a reason tc pieces have no rp defensive
scenic shale
im thinking np wont be absolute bis for jaina prog
since ill have to hold vendetta here and there
ill for sure have 1
full pagoda
4th or 5th week in a row, I am super lucky https://gyazo.com/10e27132a6a0e6e6fd698afdccf6733f
vagrant tapir
Why did TTK become so valued in m+?
lament dove
maybe a pin is in order about this:P
vagrant tapir
about ttk?
lament dove
yeah cause a lot of people are asking about it
vagrant tapir
yeah its not immediately obvious
lament dove
it's because you can snipe off higher level mobs so the group as a whole dies faster if there are no longer living mobs
a little bit like sub aoe
vagrant tapir
like for bolstering?
vast forum
any group with uneven mob health
strange python
sorry, nub question, what is TC?
vagrant tapir
treacherous covenant
vast forum
or targetcalling
strange python
treacherous it will be.
vagrant tapir
definitely treach
marble hemlock
TTK is love, TTK is life
golden relic
when u gonna drop poisen bomb seli and just play HB for the memes that maybe arent acctually memes
a good week to welcome it
cosmic pier
after watching that vod from earlier im gonna try it tomorrow night
golden relic
just remember these days boys and girls
when MA was questioned and HB was questioned and TTK was questioned
golden relic
no, i mean all those things get questionmarked by ppl in this discord
sage forum
How do you guys feels about Unstable Catalyst? I'm newly switched to Assassination, and I have one chest that is slightly better than another in terms of Bloodmallet, but it uses unstable catalyst. Does that get tricky with high mobility fights?
cosmic pier
im down to try different shit. been trying just about every combination of azerite traits, might as well throw talents into the mix
vagrant tapir
imagine if blindside was viable 🤔
cosmic pier
i wish it was for ST, i miss having execute. the legendary wrists were so good in legion
cosmic pier
@primal gazelle do you use fok at 20 stacks while fighting bosses?
primal gazelle
yes
bleak spoke
How much of your overall is HB % on pure ST atm? @primal gazelle
primal gazelle
its 3-5% usually
bleak spoke
Literally equal to pbomb then except it’s good in aoe and you can control the damage from it
It buffs your aoe more*
primal gazelle
pbomb is free and cost 0 energy/gcd, so gotta keep that in mind
bleak spoke
Not implying pbomb isn’t alright in aoe
primal gazelle
hb isnt insane for ST, its just in the "not bad" territory
bleak spoke
But so is pbomb
primal gazelle
yaa
storm pilot
Yo, do we refresh our bleedings before pandemic if tb is comeing up to get more envenoms in the tb?
primal gazelle
better than CT which offers 0 st value
bleak spoke
It’s a whole talent row that does like up to 5.5% overall depending on how lucky you get during Tb windows
And like 2% if stuff moves around a bunch
How much crit are you running atm dayvanie
primal gazelle
42% with food
bleak spoke
I think I might get a meta assa setup going. Played a handful of 15s/16s as outlaw yesterday and I kept running out of blade flurry charges
near willow
xD 42% lul
bleak spoke
Do you drop ilevel for crit
sage forum
Is Nothing Personable something we should stack? Bloodmallet is telling me to, but Ravenholdt calls it a one-point wonder
primal gazelle
if it has a socket yeah
bleak spoke
Damn all my really nice gear is haste mastery ;-;
primal gazelle
like i wear a high crit + socket piece over 15 ilvls non-crit piece
bleak spoke
I guess I’ll track down some nice dungeon setup with regards to stats and just slam out 10s or something
storm pilot
Yo, do we refresh our bleedings before pandemic if tb is comeing up to get more envenoms in the tb?
bleak spoke
You’re not supposed to but I do it because it’s better than the alternative
Aim for your bleeds to last long enough so you can get the whole Tb out without any garrotes or ruptures
If you have to refresh a bleed in Tb do it because dropping a dot is worst case scenario
golden relic
just refresh them later on the cycle of bleeds before TB
like refresh on 1 sec instead of 7
and it wont overlap most of the time
rotund sparrow
Good Morning
the assassination attributes are now rod and mastery for single?
hast*
royal lantern
what
no
crit and mastery CAN get even when you reach higher crit numbers
like ~25%
but even then 
bleak spoke
The feels when your sim recommends a different gem in every socket
primal gazelle
how much do you think the Belt 420+Socket BOE with high crit/low verse is worth 🤔
golden relic
180k
royal lantern
when you have only 1 slot
golden relic
na
m,aybe 200
over 200 is a stretch
might get sold eventually but the raids been out for ages now and there is m+
primal gazelle
hmm
i sold a 415 socketted on my server for 700k
area52
that piece is pretty much bis for my 3 EB set up so im looking to buy a 420+socket
golden relic
i mean
id try snag one off trade
try hustle a price
ppl that put that shit on AH are poor and dreaming theyll sell it for that much
especially now
cunning viper
Hey guys, short question here.
I don't have a shrouded suffocation trait anymore.
3 DD, 2 TC, 1 NP
Is it worth to swap from subterfuge to master assassin?
I simmed it and just have 20-100 dps difference
Just wanted to know what others think
golden relic
depends who you ask
clear blaze
sims higher, didnt like it. so i went for ss in helmet and kept subterfuge - its not always about highest sim dps
golden relic
i like MA today, yday i fucking hated it and disowned it
clear blaze
plus depends on what boss ure progressing imo
cloud iris
guess who got cephaloide today pog
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
strange python
my gm told me im toxic and have a bad attitude because I said we should not worry about who is second potting and rather who isnt doing mechs
ama
solid nova
@golden relic Nope
golden relic
but it was ama : (
solid nova
Then disappear to off topic
golden relic
https://gyazo.com/48e2ebf10992de65cd8ac2fefe7367b8 @primal gazelle this the type of desperate dude u need to find
golden relic
420 only
stable oxide
On warcraftlogs I see people doing alot of different stuff with traits
Whats better 1 NP and 2 treacherous Covenant, or 1 Treacherous Covenant and 2 NP
And don't say Sim yo self :P
I heared people saying that you only 1NP but on the logs I see some using 3 NP
lucid carbon
good?
mint peak
NP is good even if you stack it. If it's your best build then its your best You figure out what's your best by...simming
sturdy python
Bis raiding shoulders so yes Kvalm
mint peak
That guide only references raid drops I guess
sage forum
Could any rogue here proficient in Assass and Outlaw have a quick chat with me please? In messages, can't talk. But I
I'd love to have a one-on-one convo to go over some questions
real bay
Vest of reverent adoration 
desert vault
there is nothing better than DD/BB huh? Dang, that is sad 😃
hollow stone
I dont think rh guide was updated after the tc nerf like a month ago or w/e
And there you have it
mint peak
I got a 425 Yulon's and it pumps on reaping
covert crag
I feel like itd be good, esp on fortified
lunar tangle
idk if im missing anything or for any reason just wondering if my dps is good for my ilevel
or if i can make any changes or improvemetns
mint peak
Did you sim your head with TTK instead of SS
sturdy python
Looks fine, would probably need different traits to see huge improvements
mint peak
Sorry meant the chest, not head*
round harbor
yeha was gonna say that too, ttk on the chest probly higher than a second SS
lone junco
My 3ss 2ttk was pretty great yesterday. Will just let the monk/warrior handle the mass aoe.
round harbor
in m+?
lone junco
Anyway. The q is exang vs tb. So I'm picking tb. For the 4th target. So tb into FOK env.
I don't pug much. So my gear suffers for it.
Aka. Not trying to fix my problem.
bitter nacelle
Would anyone be willing to take a look at some of my logs and let me know what im doing wrong? I almost always top DPS charts but my parses are always sub-50 and i don't understand why, especially since i've always parsed high
valid spoke
Can you solo Coin Shower on Opulence with Cloak?
round harbor
no
solid nova
round harbor
its physical
cosmic pier
nah just cloak it 4Head
round harbor
i think bop/bubble/turtle are the only defensives
lunar tangle
maybe if i go MA that would make a bigger difference
finite dagger
which gem i should take on opulence?
round harbor
oki see it now
yeah thats weird
opal, unless your guild needs a ruby holder in which case u can do that too
ruby on mythic is tougher to solo though
youll likely need assistance
finite dagger
thank you
halcyon falcon
I've been running 2x DD, 1xNP, 1 blightborn infusion (I like it a lot), 1 TC, and 1 TtK (not my choice, but it's the best I have atm) and master assassin. feels good
mint peak
Try Top gear with TTK and MA instead of Subterfuge. Might not be better but worth checking
proven wasp
Should I be looking for more crit or haste when using dd and ma? In my opener I sometimes can’t get 4-5 combo points and it becomes very scuffed
halcyon falcon
sim for your stats...but sometimes crit doesn't happen and it does kinda suck
leaden garden
Hey guys, is asa good compared to other melees atm? Not played in a while, considering rolling a asa rogue
pulsar goblet
Yes
granite mason
is very stronk
leaden garden
cheers for the fast replies guys
strange python
so yulons sims higher than 400 gcb, ivus, 390 rezan, 385 socketed vigor
thoughts?
switched around some stuff now gcb + dice are simming higher, but isn't gcb really situational? like standing in the aura to get the full extent of the buff
mint peak
GCB will always sim higher than in practice. It's great for champions or Grong but there's a reason you rarely see it on the later bosses
strange python
right, due to the movement i could only assume
mint peak
It can be good for Jaina too since last phase you're mostly just burning
strange python
okay so i'll sim all of my trinks and see which come up second
mint peak
Yeah you can swap in GCB on those fights you know you'll have time to sit on the boss
strange python
looks like dice & 385 socketed vigor is next up
it's about a 350 dps loss which isnt anything
so another Q; in terms of gear/enchants, i can only sim so much (4m iterations) would stat weights be an option to look at for enchants?
i have a ton of 400/415 gear, so i don't think all of it will fit
rigid mango
No boss is "bad" for MA, there are bosses where Sub + SS are good, maybe better (mainly fights where you can consistantly get 2-3 Garrotes off per vanish). MA is a stable set up that just gives you more burst comined with your vendetta.
lunar tangle
never said MA was bad but there are rarely any bosses in dazar where MA would be better than Sub except for maybe opulence jaina maybe mekka is what i can think of
lone junco
@strange python just use top gear to pick your traits talent and trinkets. When that is done. Equip that stuff then use top gear again for the enchant sims. Crit. Haste or mastery.
rigid mango
I mean I'd argue that MA is better for most bosses