dratnos is 100% worth watching
#assassination
wary ice
prisma garnet
ok cheers ill watch all his
primal gazelle
am i blind or is blightbourne infusion isnt on the herodamage azerite list?
spice surge
Its almost at the top
primal gazelle
no
icy ember
is there any downside to playing master asn?
i haven't played asn before so idk
well since legion
cuz i couldn't get shrouded sang on any of the NEW azerite
shy axle
in raids it is best talent (if you have the rec traits without SS)
in myth+ use SS/Subt
icy ember
well i am only playing it for the raid, so that is good
@shy axle can you look at my link? those seem like decent traits right
3x dd, 1x nothing personal
and 1x tc
and 1x twist the knife
subtle lynx
TC still top after 10% nerf?
civic palm
Top what?
subtle lynx
trait
civic palm
Yeah but literally No.1 or "a top trait"?
subtle lynx
Nevermind lmfao
pliant nest
whats tc?
icy ember
well has herodamage been updated? its treacherous covenant
rancid blaze
so MA is better to use in raid?
pliant nest
ah thanks
why did they nerf sub traits? it wasnt that good in the first place, was it?
pulsar goblet
pliant nest
yea but sub in general wasnt, right? so if they dont buff anything else in return, its just a nerf to sub
ah yea they did but i think that trait is only for aoe basically
real bay
MystlerToday at 20:06
The January 29 Hotfixes should now be available on both Raidbots nightly and weekly.
TC is still good
lost barely 100dps.
with 2 TC
vestal wren
TC for outlaw/sin is slightly worse and could potentially be replaced with spec traits, for sub we dont have good traits to stack so its not as easy
noone say sub trait was not op
lucid anvil
I have a 400 Lustrous Golden Plumage and a 375 Galecaller's Boon. Is there a way to test or know which one I should "on use" first?
vestal wren
ppl complain that they nerf a spec that seems to underpeform
pliant nest
exactly. its fine if they nerf a trait thats op, but they need to buff other st traits in return
civic palm
If required, yes.
pliant nest
well sub wasnt op at all so it just ends up being a nerf to a class thats already not great
civic palm
(something probably needs tuning, but I am not sure Blizz wants to crank something else up if it's not needed)
tough skiff
BiS traits right now?
hexed sail
what key level we have to do to get highest ilvl gear for next week chest ?
sudden pivot
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
trail bronze
@hexed sail 10
latent field
Tips for short lived targets like raptors in conclave?
civic palm
Hit the boss.
latent field
But then RL gets all mad 
civic palm
Yeah well stop killing the raptors and let the DoT classes that have to run into melee range do it.
thorn sinew
As a long time assassination rogue in m+ im thinking... Is Outlaw the play in m+ nowadays?
fallow estuary
Outlaw shines in low keys (0-15) esp. with the new 10+ trait
however
Sin will be quite good in higher keys and/or having tripple EB+Some SS
ruby idol
If outlaw doesnt get nerfed
Then outlaw is the play, but im almost certain outlaw is getting nerfed
And the 2 specs will be super even
thorn sinew
Im aiming for 3ss 3eb, buying a random shoulderpiece tomorrow cuz it's 1/3 that i get eb/ss combo :D still probably gonna get outlaw gear as a sidething
I think Ill stay assa, not enjoying outlaw as much
chilly marsh
herodamage is updated with nerfs ?
feral flower
!stat
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
terse rune
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
hallow coyote
Just TC, for Sin
quick scaffold
do I go for 100% elaborate plans uptime or 4/5 combopoint usage?
spice surge
4/5 cp, the overall uptime of EP isnt very relevant
quick scaffold
ty
desert vault
Did they remove azerite drops from m+ weekly caches?
civic palm
Patches ago unless they broke it this patch.
unborn root
Treacherous covenant stacks, right?
finite acorn
the stat part does yes
spice surge
With every trait in the game, damage/healing/stats always stack and anything else never stacks
unborn root
iirc the head is from the first boss, chest off mekkatorque and shoulders off jadefire?
So itโs super easy to get most of those
Mekkatorque gets easier with gear too, I think
Once the raid has enough stam and the healers can spot heal all the stupid damage that goes out
finite acorn
ive alrdy got rly good pieces on helm and shoulders both have DD so im gona buy random chest piece @415ilvl coz only one of em isnt upgrade for me and head and shoulder upgrades u get easily from 2 first bosses
pastel wasp
!bod
cerulean junco
TC still viable?
spice surge
Suprisingly when you add a lot of damage sources that doesnt scale with agility it gets comparatively worse
๐ฎ
plain cairn
@spice surge what are those dmg sources
spice surge
More azerite traits
hexed sail
what does pug stand for ?
oak inlet
grizzled jay
@finite acorn wish you luck brother. Getting a mythic chest aswell.
finite acorn
thanks mate you to ๐
fading vigil
@plain cairn youโre running without SS?
fading arch
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
lusty saddle
Toxic Blade or Exsanguinate? i have boons call does that mean exsang?
hearty oriole
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
thorny kettle
-_-
strange python
Is TC even worth running now that it's been nerfed?
finite acorn
its only 10% nerf it isnt alot
cunning spade
Noob question inc: was hoping someone can explain exactly how they achieve nightstalker empowered ruptures....the wording from guides I've read imply rupture applications leading into the use of vanish will empower them once vanish is popped but this doesn't sound right to me
plain cairn
@fading vigil yep, sims higher in single target
small island
how can ppl have 2 415 azerite from m+ already?
tribal marlin
cunning spade
ty @strange python
mystic fractal
my patchwerk sims are showing all secondaries as better than agility... that doesn't smell right to me?
light kestrel
Nah it's probably about right, quite a few classes are hitting this wall
my warrior for example has every stat above str by at least 1 point. Mastery started over taking haste for me though
spice surge
Its been that way for assa since late-uldir
It was amplified a lot by adding extra traits onto your gear, none of which scale with agility, but scale with secondaries
mystic fractal
makes sense
i didn't go hard in uldir so i guess i missed bleeding edge stuff
but ive gotten super lucky and my ilvl has gone up like mad since raid drop
old lagoon
what gem do you guys pickup on oppulence?
spice surge
https://imgur.com/QnhBi9R @old lagoon
old lagoon
Amazing
steel wagon
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
short token
which gem do we take on opulence?
analog glade
Opal
short token
@analog glade do u know which color that is?
halcyon tulip
did they buff SS today? swear its10% more than this morning
analog glade
Idk
maiden onyx
Anyone know if Simcraft is dead, or will they update it eventually?
lone junco
Most use raidbots these days. It is always the most up to date version. and unless you are doing large batch sims, desktop version is just more cumbersome.
short token
so if i hit the adds on opulence with fan of knives deos that count? i mean i just did 25k that seems absurdly low
*count for the opal buff i mean
barren sleet
Sorry if this has been stated but didnt see it in the pins, Does the dot damage stack with two Nothing Personal traits?
lone junco
@short token yeah. you just fok the adds with the opal.
last week it stacked 20x and capped at 40% bonus
lone junco
the combos are pretty close. if you use SS traits you must have Subterfuge. else MA is fine. Both can use TB/Exang
hollow stone
Not based on your sim. Do what you want
icy ember
so being MA i should pool almost ALL of my energy before vanishing and blowing 2 envenoms ASAP right?
icy ember
so that would be 1env, 1 muti, and 2nd envenom
lone junco
Tb Vanish Env mut env that is
lost sentinel
damn, 13 shrine nailed us, all the casters... needed some better management of them... evne though I had like 50 interrupts and more than the DHs
fading wigeon
i take opal right?
short token
shrouded sims 2% lower for me than other traits, yet i see EVERYONE on the log ranking running it, i don't udnerstand it
lone junco
yeah 2ss 2dd ++
subterfuge/Exang and Subterfuge/tb are split
gronk has a vanish GG. so there is a little extra there.
short token
vanish gg?
lone junco
and goldmember boss will have a 40% buff vanish gg as well. makes for strong execute
icy ember
what is gg
lone junco
do you play assassin?
icy ember
no i dont
short token
i do
lone junco
its the double garrote from Shrouded
icy ember
oh
lone junco
opener is grg . vanish is gg
short token
oh
lone junco
sims favor dd . any time there is a 2nd mob, or a vuln phase SS has strong potential
tough skiff
BoD lack of haste gear, what we gonna do now?
primal gazelle
most piece in bod has way too much verse
shell wind
when it comes to maximizing my dots' durations before exsanguinating, are there any tips and tricks to how to do it most efficiently? it feels so bad to refresh already long dots
lone junco
negative
opaque tree
did Treacherous Covenant get nerfed? ๐ฆ
sacred citrus
any good WAs then?
peak saffron
plain thistle
opal
inner vale
austere scarab
So for Opulence we don't x4 Garrote the adds? We just stay pumping ST?
opaque tree
i haven't been, they don't live long enough
fok for combo points and you can rupture one or two if they're close to you, but I just stay in one place and pump out envenoms
don't live long enough to multi dot everything
echo jay
does it matter if deadly or quick goes on MH or OH?
sturdy python
No it doesnt
echo jay
ty
slate sedge
Hi team. I know SIM SIM SIM is the answer, but what is everyone's take on the ring/cloak set bonus? Worth or not worth?
pine garnet
sour wraith
so is TC still the way to go with the upcoming nerfs?
vestal stump
This is gonna be tier where I get a dagger at the end rip
smoky fiber
that was last tier for me ๐
vestal stump
I got shoulders tho so that's nice.
haughty lily
Sooooo dumb question but what is the aoe rotation for SS
i looked at the guide but i didnt see multitarget
copper remnant
And hopefully proc of pb ^^
lusty gale
"Step on pets during the Ring phase to reach the barrier faster" The tip from the website for the Jadefire encounter could some please elaborate more on this?
What pets i cant recall any
Okay how does that help?
oh
oh step is for shadowstep
thanks i get it now
hazy geyser
so i finally started simming better for toxic blade i got a couple of questions do you try to envenom before every toxic blade? and do you try to reapply bleeds before toxic blade even if it will delay it ? also if you use toxic blade on cd and a bleed runs out mid toxic blade do you reapply bleed or keep doing mutilate envenom until toxic blade runs out?
OH and do you pool energy before every toxic blade to have more envenoms
oh 2+ is nothing i already get that just from normal rotation
olive dagger
I got a 390 Yu'lons trinket. I know it's not amazing, but with the aoe potential is there ever a good time to use it? I already have an on use 2 minute stat trinket, so having a second one is meh
hazy geyser
speaking of trinkets why the fuck is a 365 galecallors better than a 385 oscillator
the V.I.G.O.R trinket
olive dagger
I mean as far as equipping it over something else - like, with a 10 dps difference single target I'd rather use an equip, but is it really strong in M+ or in big aoe situations?
hazy geyser
yea i guess but a 385 has like +60 agility
static hedge
Should i only take 1 treacherous covenant? or as many as i can get
hollow stone
Got the fist weap off grong. Rip sin
lone junco
390 socket dagger worked out nicely.
only 7 sockets now though
was cruising for a 99% on king rasta man. but tried to cloak one of the "get out" mechanics. and got gibbed
wild stone
Ok, never used it will take some learnin
Does ravenhold not show new rotation with 3 DD/MA
wild stone
Sorry, never used MA. Always Subterfuge
cloud iris
Yo guys, even tho the difference is very small, bloodmallet has DD higher then covenant, but herodmg doesnt.
Wich one should we trust?
primal gazelle
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4r8p2S1o9KzUDFzRS6AbgK i honestly love triple dd
i dont like holding cds to sync up vanish and vendetta
wild stone
Going to take a lot of getting used to...
grizzled jay
Just sim yourself. Those sites are meant as a general rule
primal gazelle
MA master talent ๐
wild stone
So breaking MA down barney style.. You use Vanish when at 4-5 CPs to Envenom?
ember forum
got some purps today boys
grizzled jay
Garrote Mut Rupture vendetta TB into 4+ CP Muti into Vanish Envenom muti envenom
grizzled jay
Sick gear ๐
primal gazelle
covert to the ma dark side
ember forum
for MA i've been : Garrote -> mutil -> rup -> mutil -> vend -> TB -> vanish -> enven -> mut -> env
bursting for 60k +
grizzled jay
That seems fine
primal gazelle
sims does a different rotation
it does vanish->tb mut envenom or something like that
grizzled jay
I just dont like delaying TB at beginning too much but have no evidence it's a dps loss
primal gazelle
its also playing it safer, in case it doesnt crit and youre fucked and have to envenom at 3 combo point
grizzled jay
I'll do your opener today
ember forum
dude
on mythic jadefire, i vanished and had 91% crit
and didnt crit a SINGLE mutilate
i was like x_x
primal gazelle
joke enough for pugs to kill it?
grizzled jay
Interesting
visual quartz
Does scent of blood Agi increase stack?
ember forum
yes
so fucking easy for pugs
legit zerg boss the whole time
and save 3 kicks for the adds when he res's them
grizzled jay
Sweet
primal gazelle
have 2 sets of gear
wild stone
gonna take a few weeks :/
Well I guess as assassin and 3DD i wont be screwed by not being in stealth..
with the chain pulls
grizzled jay
You need some SS and EB for m+ or as he said, go outlaw.
Depends if you wanna push tho. If you want to do your weekly and fuck off, anything works
lone junco
id rather just fuck off.
grizzled jay
Any of you bought a mythic Azerite?
low junco
yes
grizzled jay
Any good?
low junco
there are decentish azerites but most of them are garbage imo
grizzled jay
Yeah ...
low junco
got a garbage one myself
sour wraith
are you all buying 400 or 415?
grizzled jay
For the sake of M+ i might start getting random 400
@low junco I specifically put myself through a 13 pug last night to be able to buy today
Dunno if it was worth my mental sanity
low junco
i find it difficult to not leave a pug above 10
people just go nuts with aoe dps and forget about the affixes
grizzled jay
Everyone was 1.8k so it went somewhat ok
But we aren't yet all fully informed on routes
low junco
teeming without infested might be bearable
grizzled jay
Hate explosive with a passion depsite nerfs
low junco
explosive is easy only if somebody else destroys the explosions :D
from my experience most of people do kill em so i dont really have to worry about
grizzled jay
Man work is slow. Wish I had a gaming laptops here
low junco
same, will probably watch method going into mythic BoD in an hour or so
wild stone
Feel like going outlaw with wits trait for m+ would be easier then finagling with 3DD or some SS and echoing blades
Ss*
low junco
outlaw is overall better tbh
wild stone
Got a 395 from mythic mother
grizzled jay
I'll give outlaw a chance
low junco
it lacks on single target dps tho
wild stone
I loved outlaw
It's simming within 100dps to sin.. Before I got 3Dd though
For st
It blows sin out of the water with aoe by like 8k
low junco
๐ค
wild stone
Double cleavage
grizzled jay
It's a select and forget trait. Not very interesting but what can ya do
wild stone
Don't mind dd.. It's learning MA that will be tough. Especially no more vanish ss
Such a second nature
wild stone
Kek
grizzled jay
I love bod
low junco
got benched because i acted like an elitist
grizzled jay
Haha NN man
low junco
apparently telling the other rogue that he should fix his rotation is elitism
grizzled jay
Did you approach the situation like a gentleman?
gaunt isle
Any assa Trolls (race) here? do you guys macro berserk to vendetta to have it line up each time or use it separately?
strange python
Well onokena, did he beat you on DPS despite having wrong rotation?
low junco
no
strange python
Then id tell you to go fock off aswell ๐
low junco
let me bring the logs a real quick
:^)
its not about the dps tbh if it was about the dps i could've been a main raider @strange python
strange python
So its about your attitue then i guess?
Being humble about things goes a long way
sand whale
waiting on dem logs
low junco
@strange python feels more like because i failed myself on uldir when i was the only rogue in the guild
attitue isnt a problem with me i think
strange python
how did you fail yourself in uldir?
low junco
rerolled from warrior one trick to rogue couldnt farm gear fast enough etc etc
nimble tartan
tfw almost 400 ilvl ๐ฆ
honest iris
is crit better than mastery for m+? I feel like they are about equal
strange python
@low junco where dem logs at? ๐
gaunt isle
Tripple nothing personal is about the same overall % dmg but gives huge burst because of the 2 energy per sec per trait, so 6 energy per sec for 20 sec with three @round harbor
underrated trait
light kestrel
damn, our healer left in an 11 FH, we did the remaining 60% trash and reapings with out him had the druid go heals and wiped the bosses out
got a 400 dice
strange python
gz
light kestrel
Thanks! Dk self heals are pretty cheesy
round harbor
unrated but its all in burst window, which could be good or bad
nimble tartan
lost horizon
And I'm here with 370s rip
nimble tartan
i actually got 420 wrists i did so many 10s today and that was the only tf i got
lost horizon
That chest is nasty
nimble tartan
wait nvm that writs was a bonus roll from boss
ye dude i ripped the random mythic piece
and lucked out
i was wearing a dd ditb 375 b4hand
lost horizon
I've gotten a cloak and a belt from heroic over these 2 weeks
I got a cloak and a belt from wpvp and darkshore warfront
inner pecan
we competing for big sims or https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kNy3kNDRLWMtnmXAuotafd
lost horizon
Fucking rip LOL
cobalt gyro
this shit crits 20k
lost horizon
Then another cloak from M+ box
cobalt gyro
what teh fuck lmao
nimble tartan
i need weapie ๐ฆ
real bay
400 ilvl monkaS
@gaunt isle energy regen off NP doesn't stack just damage
Like all traits
if it did it would sim a lot more
Thought it was common knowledge
torpid sluice
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/3M175fTyTGC8P8upUuti3j
Meh, lower ilvl haste+vers ring is better than crit/haste, prob due to the gem? :c
fickle viper
is this a good trinket? 
fickle viper
feels like thats 1 trinket slot that wont be changing for the rest of the tier
heavy haven
dumb question guys does dagger in the back dmg scale up with our mastery?
because its bleeding
fluid mist
I got a 405 socketed dice yesterday
And here i was feeling special :p
Bloody 425 boon haha
jade grotto
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
warm blade
Even if you have a double dose trait, do you still FoK as a builder in 2+ target aoe if you have a echoing blades trait?
molten finch
So I have 3x DD but tbh it feels so much better opening when Iโm getting my SS combo points. Am I the only one?
molten finch
So instead of garrote>rupture>garrote for finishing move combo stack into sub garrote bonus, how do you open comparatively with 3xDD
Iโm not far behind you with 2xDD 1SS in patchwerk, 19,700-
icy ember
@molten finch you should watch dratnos' video on openers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQp-93zBjuo
molten finch
Havenโt seen this will watch now
icy ember
it is top tier IMO
rose perch
someone had a good suggestion in the comments btw - it's the pinned comment
warm blade
With 2 double dose and 1 echoing blades, what do i use for my aoe generator?
molten finch
With a trinket like gales, mid fight would laying this down before or after bleeds apply make any difference or would the haste uptick apply regardless
I think that depends on how many targets in pack
warm blade
yeah should have rephrased my question cause i know its anything over 1 for EB but like still use mutilate at 6-7 with DD
molten finch
Itโs 5+ mobs before youโre switching delm@mutilate to foKs no?
warm blade
based on the dratnos vid
but i just dont know when i should use one or the other if i have both
fluid mist
!trinkets
fluid mist
noice.
sinful lotus
Hello everyone, is the TC nerf live? (It looks like it is on Herodmg), and does that still make it our top pick?
serene hinge
how much of an increase does your highest stat have to be for it to be worth enchanting it onto both weapons?
cobalt gyro
it'd probably have to be insanely higher than the others
serene hinge
like .5 probably not high enough?
buoyant coyote
Why do ppl take ruby as rogue?
marble trellis
I took it because im a nice guy :D also you can keep stacking the debuff with poison blade and shadowstep back if you need to run out with debuff. Also.you do not die because rogue....
dapper bough
fuck this weekly cache -.-
sleek iron
After first exsang my exsangs donโt line up with my garrote rupture times
Is it better to refresh both before exsang even at the expensive of wasting a few seconds each of overlapping the timer
If so, by how much
real bay
guess it all depends on fight length/do you miss a exsang cast by delaying it multiple times , if you do I imagine it's better to refresh them early
solid nova
Aslong as you're refreshing within your pandemic timers you'll be fine
Should be enough wiggle room to find a suitable timing
sleek iron
So you wait until youโve refreshed with pandemic before exsang
Even if it means you donโt use exsang as soon as itโs up
solid nova
Well you're unlikely to be holding it for a long while as pandemic timers are more than enough
wispy thorn
hey boys, were u guys able to figure out if u could evasion coin shower? im only asking here because it seems some people talked about it in this spec channel
night vale
with echoing blades how many targets do i FoK at?
rose perch
@warm blade i have no idea if you have both tbh - my guess with 2DD 1EB would be fan at 3+, maybe 4
@night vale 2+
warm blade
tyty
royal lantern
for sims
how much covenant uptime you think is real? cus i dont wanna go with 100%
solid nova
Well theres plenty of 100% uptime logs
solid nova
Big chest 
royal lantern
im gonna do it
head and chest will be easy too get BiS
and idk how hard it will be too get mekka on farm
pseudo hamlet
Forgot to do +10 this week, but was lucky enough to finish +7 and got this:
vestal wren
gz
pseudo hamlet
Thanks, was very lucky.
solid nova
Nice dude
arctic harness
This might be embarrassing, but I'm watching Yliajo and it looks like he's using Garotte without stealth, is that possible?
quick ice
all good
drifting cloud
๐ค
real bay
if you use subt then you always want to use it from stealth
arctic harness
I was wondering why my damage was so bad, but I only switched to rogue this patch
thin patio
nani !!!
arctic harness
Was parsing green/blue all the time and it was pretty frustrating
dapper bough
i also started rogue this patch ... what i find most annoying are the tanks running everywhere everytime
real bay
conclave is pretty monkaS tanks keep moving them around , models are so small it's not easy to see where the boss is facing, raid taking plenty of cleave to the face
great success
dapper bough
I did jaina with pugs... on the pull jaina kept walking back and forth, so fucking annoying jesus
quick ice
actually, she does that even with guild groups ๐ฆ
solid nova
Did you sim it
solid nova
So how is it bad? ๐
solid nova
Upgrade = good
Downgrade = bad
buoyant coyote
NO MEMERS here?!
buoyant coyote
Memes not allowed
solid nova
You simmed it, its better, therefore is good
buoyant coyote
Isnt this where ppl bash me for getting a shit item and meme about it
solid nova
Haste vers isnt the end of the world
solid nova
Just because its not haste mastery, doesnt mean its bad
lament dove
cannot wait to try out my new 410 cannon trinket, fml
quick ice
๐ฆ
lament dove
my other trinket is a 390 overcharger btw (at least it's socketed)
I'm starting to feel like some old lady who adopts every stray cat, only with trinkets
royal lantern
do you love them and give them cute names too?
pulsar coral
400 spyglass and 400 galecallers from m+ today
vestal wren
well nice gz
pulsar coral
ty
arctic harness
I want that 425 loaded dice
fringe estuary
Whats the SS/EB from again? waycrest is chest Iknow that
solid nova
@fringe estuary https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1TcnSMOzeAEAwz2lsg7zod_UA0-I10FqTVJ3MelIatXM/edit#gid=0 Conclave and Waycrest ye
fringe estuary
ty
honest basin
From what I've gathered haste then crit are the very best stats. Is there a known point at which their values decrease making it useless to stack full haste crit gear only?
solid nova
No you just need to sim your stat weights and follow them
honest basin
Yeah that's what I've been doing but I was wondering if there was a known percentage value for some stats
rose perch
There aren't really breakpoints no
solid nova
Nope, no caps, its all dependant on your other gear pieces and traits
honest basin
Alright, thanks then
quick ice
yes
sinful lotus
Hey, did raidbots just reset/get updated/go live Just now? I'm simming 700 DPS lower than I was about 2 hours ago.
solid nova
Have you got comparative sims?
cobalt gyro
I have 3x double dose, should I be pooling energy to cast as many mutilates as possible inside envenom/TB? obviously I want to cast as many envenoms inside TB but i mean more to maximize DD damage
sinful lotus
I didn't save/screenshot them. I don't think i made a mistake, and I haven't changed any gear in the last 2 hours. But was around 19.6 and now i'm at 18.9. Doing all the Sims again to check.
Could it be the TC nerf? or did that go live in Raidbots earlier this morning? I'm using the Nightly build.
sinful lotus
Ok, that's it then
I had the TC piece on, as you see it;s 18.9
Without it I jump up to 19.5
vestal wren
TC is now close to the top other traits for outlaw/sin
so that means it is not nessecery the best trait anymore
sinful lotus
So, based on this Sim, would you go ahead and follow the recommended Azerite swap? Go from NP+TC to DD+NP?
eager kernel
solid nova
keen pumice
hollow matrix
@sinful lotus SOOooo i just had the same situation as u, but i've simmed a lot and got weirdly different results. Someone please check me on this if I'm wrong, but when you click 'Use optimal raid buffs' then go to SIM with any TC piece - At the end you can clearly see on the right, I believe it sets your TC uptime to 1% for some reason....
Whereas, if you hit nothing or click like 90%, you'll see it at the desired %, not to mention it's general gonna be ranked a lot higher than before at 1% (at the bottom bottom of the list lolz)
I'm seeing 1% uptime for TC next to more than 1 link so far, maybe I'm wrong about the exact cause, but in any case - Look closely my rogu frenz, u da bes
cold rampart
!trinkets
fringe estuary
Wait that guide shows freehold is the helm for SS/Eb but its not
solid nova
!sims
prisma monolithBOT
BfA Simulations:
Herodamage: https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/
Bloodmallet: https://bloodmallet.com/index.html
hollow matrix
!sims
prisma monolithBOT
BfA Simulations:
Herodamage: https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/
Bloodmallet: https://bloodmallet.com/index.html
hollow matrix
Lemme know what you guys find, confirm/deny, about TC in the sims as i stated just above - It can be very easy to overlook imo, and can get us all swapping to subpar builds real quick. I do propose we don't tell all the other lame classes tho, cuz we da bes
lol
solid nova
Same link, depends what content you're doing
cold rampart
m+ ss ?
solid nova
You can also run a m+ sim with dungeonslice
@hollow matrix Raidbots defaults the sim at 100% uptime for TC
You're probably seeing bfa.covenant_chance="1" and think its 1%
That's 100%
1 = 100%
0.9 = 90%
0 = 0%
Etc etc
shy axle
what do you guys think in regards to myth+ comp, staying assa or switching to outlaw?
hollow vine
id imagine that assas will pull ahead the higher the key
hollow matrix
Richard what you are seeing their always says 100%
solid nova
What
hollow matrix
im talking about after the sim has finished if you click the 'use optimal raid buffs' button
you will see u got fooled
solid nova
Link a sim so i can see then ๐
hollow vine
What are peoples opinions on Scent of blood?
hollow matrix
At the right, I highly doubt he willingly chose to sim with his TC uptime only at 1% of the time during the fight
solid nova
Yeah i see
hollow vine
ive managed to get x3 SS and x3 SOB at 400 ilvl
hollow matrix
Notice TC is at the bottom of the barrel on the list
same happened for me
idk, u might be able to just not click 'optimal raid buffs' - But i always sim it at 90% and it's always stayed at 90% at the end when i do
vestal wren
it displays it wrong on the result page
hollow matrix
maybe
it only gave me 1 result that included TC and it was at the very bottom, and so far past garbage compared to the rest
vestal wren
its right if you have it set to not 100%
hollow matrix
I'm inclined to disagree, but that was a good while ago
hollow matrix
ok yea
hollow matrix
im thinking u have to manually set it or something
vestal wren
you cant unless you use advanced sim
maybe custom apl works too, but not sure
it did ignore custom apl if i put it in
hollow matrix
yea, again im no sim or rogue expert - i just love playin it and this discord community has been awesome, so in the off chance i can save someone here a headache thats what a win
vestal wren
i would re-run the sim and see if it still shows 1%, if yes i would go ask in raidbots discord
the option is new so it could be that raidbots displays it wrong
merry orbit
@Fuu you arฤ wise man, what you think about chest traits for sin rogue for raids? Head+shoulders are dd + tc right?
vestal wren
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
hollow vine
what is TC short for?
hollow vine
oh that one ๐
sinful lotus
@hollow matrix Ah interesting, will have to check it out! Thank you ๐
merry orbit
Yea i see it couple of times, but i wanna be sure to I goodbye understand info, and on theory miarฤ bursty gameplay without ss and exa can be better. It's only patchwerk simulation
devout moth
why is my sim so low compared to yours
hollow vine
i have x3 SS + x3 SOB.. i feel this works quite well on most fights in the raid and really well in M+. are they any other must have traits other than SS?
merry orbit
More bursty gameplay*
vestal wren
the theorie is:
TC is a good trait and stacks well, but sins other st traits are also good. So tl;dr: is use the ones that are best on the pieces you have and aim to get the azerite pieces that have good traits
merry orbit
Head, shoulders are easy to say which are bis, dunno about chest. Dd+ ss or dd + np? Then change 2t talent to crit or garrote. I'm thinking good?
vestal wren
i would just sim it
hollow matrix
Just sim'd this and i made sure to click 'Optimal Raid Buffs'(it shows TC uptime will be sim'd at 100%) - but u can see at the end of the sim its at 1% and devalues the hell outta TC https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/aWVpjfSc76in5s5PhVbHxj
I sim'd pretty much the same gear earlier, with TC set to 90%, https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/hDuY9gCc6FFwcPittpVbwE
vestal wren
i assume its a display bug
hollow matrix
TC is bis
vestal wren
the simc report is dissabled
i would go there and report it as a bug (or just ask)
sullen pagoda
Why dont u sim 5min like normal people
quick ice
might be expecting long fights?
vestal wren
fight lengh should not be an issue
hollow matrix
cuz we are gonna do the last 3 bosses on heroic tomorrow and from what i can tell they are roughly maybe 7min, 7min, 9min
just helps take into account how many times you'll get your main cd's i think
of course its not a science so dont hate
we did one last night my b - but yea just tryna inform the rogu broskis to pay attention at the end what it has sim'd your Covenant buff uptime % to cuz its wonky
like if u stack NP like some do and u get 1 less vendetta or watevs its kinda big
anyway gl hf โค
vestal wren
remember TC got nerfed this means the top traits can be euqally strong
hollow matrix
its probably gonna be bis for anyone not using insane ilvl gear
robust light
u guys gonna bother going CT this week or just go PB cause tyrannical
vast forum
I think imma start playing pb more
robust light
i cant decide cause with reaping the aoe is huge
but its kinda pad
cause other ppl deal with it fine usually
where i can be doing more st
vast forum
Yeah, also big pulls allowed with this week's affixes
But with sob and 2xeb, using cp on ct means less energy and less agi
vast forum
And i'm inclined to believe that being energy starved during reaping is a bigger dps loss compared to losing ct dmg
You should go ct definitely if u don't have eb
Don't take my word for any of this tho, it's mostly feelycraft
robust light
yeah
vast forum
I'm also not sure about the numbers but i believe that at the number of mobs reaping provides, a single cast of fok with 2-3 eb does more dmg than a full ct
- the dmg is instant, so ct loses value if they die in less than 12 which is often the case with reaping
At least in the 13-15 key range that i did last week cuz i'm a pleb
verbal mantle
I saw very good weekly chest reward here, you guys lucky
merry orbit
Ofcorse with pre pots nothing changes? Still pots for Agi?
verbal mantle
yes
uneven summit
placid dawn
@fringe estuary Your weapons are not enchanted, you are not using any raid buffs, you have 3 echoing blades traits that do fuckall for single target, you have crimsom tempest talent that also does fuckall for single target, you are using toxic blade while having 3 SS traits
rings are not enchanted either
fringe estuary
Don't use tb?
placid dawn
you can use TB but you have to sim if its better or not
to be honest, the other things i said are the most important
sterile chasm
Boys i get 400 ilvl galecaller should i use Exan now?
placid dawn
since playing exsanguinate is much harder than TB you probably will do better with it anyway
high siren
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/nFjsYVoFq2z19Vdqx7xZ9e so close to 22k ๐ฆ
verbal mantle
Nice
frail dome
copper kestrel
If I'm at 5cp & garrote is off and toxic blade is up. What's the ability order? (Assuming rupture is fine)
crystal vault
whats your stats this week for m+? crit-mastery-low haste? and SS + Echoing stacking as much as possible?
high siren
@copper kestrel you shouldn't have let garrote get off at this point
copper kestrel
Fair enough. I need to do a better job with boss jumps/switching
On Monkey if garrote is at 12s when the add pops, should I just re-garrote/rupture before swapping?
verbal mantle
I didnt kill a single boss yet, not sure of the answer here
sturdy python
That's going to depend on how long the add lives and how long you have left on bleeds
Would be better to have dots rolling on boss the entire time but waiting too long without hitting add isn't going to be good either
high siren
I guess
hollow vine
how many EB traits are optimal for M+?
rose perch
3
rose perch
Those are good too ๐
rose perch
I think 3SS 3EB is my dream personally
Scent is good too though idk
Glad you like them (:
hollow vine
am i right in saying that crit is more valuable with EB triats?
old escarp
Would you still agree outlaw for high tyrannical weeks?
rose perch
Yes kintashi until maaaybe like you're wiping to dps checks
Idk even galvazzt type bosses, 
leech is kinda insane
old escarp
Sin admittedly feels meh on reaping but it's mostly just pad. My comp has plenty of aoe. That being said I don't have EB traits yet and my outlaw traits are bad
rose perch
Yeah I think the theory that reaping is easy and shouldn't be worried about too much is solid
I think that chain- pulling is better now though, re-stealths are harder to come by or more costly to facilitate, and pulls are bigger
vast forum
gold-tasseled epaulets 415 POG POG POG
rose perch
vast forum
i disenchanted ALL of my shoulders to have exactly enough residuum to buy a random shoulder
it was worth it
old escarp
Thanks for the insight. Your pull patterns have been a huge help so far this expansion!
shy drum
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
thin patio
@vast forum pog !
merry orbit
For all of you mastery on simming a little bit higher than crit? For me is like haste > mastery >= crit > vers.
Playing on toxic blade and 3x dd, tc, np sob with master assassin t2 talent
hollow vine
that will be because of your personal stats... if you have little mastery it will sim higher for you
merry orbit
I mean like on 1000 stats i need like 50% haste 30% mastery 20% crit. I'm not saying about stat value for me right now
median notch
wow so SS top again?
sturdy python
There's no set stat goal, Mieta. Too many factors for us
Some situations maybe, Kingmavros. Not the best st trait though
fresh coyote
Got gold tassled epaulets too....on my boomy with worthless traits
lone junco
am I the only one that dislikes DD/MA/TB? numbers aside, I actually enjoy the SS exang with vanish gg rounds. much less disappointing than vanish non crits.
lone junco
Plus once you use Vendetta TB, you need to follow through with actual damage. whereas the vendetta vanish SS. it rips whether you are there or not.
real bay
those fat garrotes feel good
lone junco
I dont mind boss downtime with SS, run out run in whatever.
but boss timings matter. Like I vanished on Opulence around 2 stacks, cause I thought It would be back up for 20x. it was about 10 sec short when boss died. so I came in green.
hollow vine
is it more beneficial to be running exang over TB if you have 3 SS traits
lone junco
its not that much different.
SS = = Subterfuge.
the tb and exang are kinda close.
I just dont enjoy TB windows.
hollow vine
fair
lone junco
guess thats why I fell off the outlaw train. High contact time is punished on bosses.
especially for new bosses, when tanks are still sliding around.
devout jolt
Think I will be trying Exsang tonight, sims slightly higher than TB
merry orbit
@devout jolt how many ss traits you have?
merry orbit
Jucy proc mate :D
devout jolt
@merry orbit 2 equpt but have gear for 3
merry orbit
Simming with 3x or 2x?
lone junco
Ideally, ill have 2ss 2dd 1vend 2tc
merry orbit
With TB or exa?
lone junco
would work with either
devout jolt
currently i have 2x ss, 1x dd, 1x np, 1x tc and a fluf trait
merry orbit
I mean... I think it's like two builds, poison and bleed like it was back in legion. They are almost the same on Sims, like 2% diff or so. But on exa burst is much higher, and this can be a key on mythic progress
lone junco
looks like 2dd 1tc 1 vend and single shoulder with archive/ss
I have seen some bonkers logs with SS and DD running Subterfuge/TB.
so thats where im going prob
devout jolt
exsang sims 0.2% higher then tb for me but as Noobe says, I feel I'd get more out of exsang than the tb window
merry orbit
For me TB with ss stack is strange i mean you may want one to have more flaw on rotation but no more better have 3rd DD or tc or np
fallow estuary
Seeing everyone Sim 20k++ makes me sad
merry orbit
Everyone will have Agi drop in some moment its normal, i mean happens
fallow estuary
Cleared NHC/HC - done multiple +6's first week and here i am with 1x bad azerite piece and everything else is still uldir equip
frosty horizon
Just weird seeing it as my worst stat I guess.
merry orbit
On rangeds int is worst almost all the time :D
Just dont mind IT, and will be all fine
hollow matrix
@frosty horizon TC has a lil to do with it i think ๐
merry orbit
How i can sim ss trait with subterfuge and toxic blade? I compare to other traits with another talents?
frosty horizon
Yeah makes sense, Iโll try swapping my helm to tc and see how that effects it
lone junco
@merry orbit when you use gear compare, scroll to the bottom, there is a trait section, select Subterfuge and MA, TB and Exang. it will iterate all 4 combos.
if you also do gear swaps, then you will need Smart Sim. if you have a fixed gear set, you can probably do all 4 combos at 30k or 100k iterations.
copper kestrel
Any obvious best race for alliance for PvP and PvE? Came back recently and still Human
merry orbit
@lone junco i know that, i want to sim only raw trait
Maybe not SIM but compare sth what is not on the page
bold hearth
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2Kd8iKgqW5J77rHAvURFSe yep agi is pretty bad for me
hollow stone
Idk what youre asking if noobe's answer wasnt what you were looking for
crude bay
dull osprey
Before I get 
ed or 
ed, is there a definite priority to secondary stats that stacking one or two = success?
hollow stone
No
hollow stone
Everyone is different based on the stats they currently have
solid nova
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
hollow stone
Thats probably as close to what you want as you'll get
dull osprey
Gotcha. Thanks guys
hollow stone
But yea, simming is way more accurate. For me, currently, mast is top stat but it's third on the "basic stat prios"
dull osprey
Yeah same. Thats why I was asking. Was wondering if there was a point that stacking pure haste/crit would supersede the sims
solid nova
Not really
If you stack a stat enough it would devalue and something else will benefit you more
hollow stone
Not for pure dps, at least, i feel most comfortable around 20% haste so i usually aim for that. For example, my gems n enchants are haste atm even tho mast is technically better
dull osprey
Okay cool. Looks like Iโll need to get some mast gems/chants
hollow stone
But thats preference, not ideal dps minmaxing
lone junco
lost my book wtf
solid nova
Yeah just sim stat weights when you get new ger
lone junco
cant type and gify at the same time.
solid nova
Quick /simc copy/paste into raidbots, make a coffee and sorted
lone junco
or pay for premium and be done with it ๐
solid nova
Tru
dull osprey
Iโm a cheap college student
lone junco
round 2.
dull osprey
I pinch pennies everywhere
solid nova
Then i suggest option 1, the coffee
dull osprey
In progress
solid nova
@lone junco If its not a gear comparison/sim, i genuinely dont know what else is the answer
lone junco
We have a few guys that attempt to feely their way through BFA dps using charts and graphs. Probably has to do with apprehension or perceived difficulty with simming, but With 6 dps traits and 3 secondary traits, ~ 4 talent changes, and possibly separate completely different secondary itemization.
Puny human Brains just cant keep up.
lol at using Bloodmallet for single trait conversations.
at that point you might as well just say shit like "I prefer" cause you are ignoring the numbers anyway.
afk back to work. cheers
dapper bough
is the "prepot gem" from opulence's crown any good ?
keen inlet
Noobe r u okay
there needs to be
a hot tub channel
for the first month of each raid
where regulars can hang out and not get triggered by the plebs
"what r simmin y i do that"
lone junco
im never ok.
almost.
its been a while, but
took most of 2018 off. prob cause i hated uldir bosses.
that and workstuff
all the same
obsidian sierra
I did today several mplus and topped dmg meter most time overall. Aoe i was 1st or 2nd same as st - did play 3 eb 2 ss 1 dd . So i would say assa still viable (did 11-14 keys)
2k grps average
lone junco
@keen inlet lol. I didnt recognize cause your gross avi head and the "" "" " " " "name.
void pecan
Oh noobe. You should know better by now to even try during new raids.
lone junco
@void pecan i still use prolonged power due to cost. So I FEEEL like im trying, but tbh, meh.
void pecan
Yeah.. I just log in for raid day now. Try to kind of min-max but, no thanks.
The casual life.
lone junco
I try to do 1 M+. If i do 3, its a busy week.
wooden crown
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
obsidian mountain
!wago
lone junco
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
earnest token
When we run exsanguinate do we hold that 3rd cast to line up with vendetta vanish or hold vendetta/vanish for the 15ish seconds and just Exsanguinate on cd
spice surge
Hold vendetta for it to line up with vanish+exsang
stark ingot
What are you guys running for m+? crimson tempest was underwhelming on reaping packs
raw fox
Did the kultiran cannon get buffed?
Idk i should trust this sim. I have a 370 harlans, a 380 plumage and a 395 tiny jar
lone junco
Is that a ST patchwerk sim?
raw fox
Yeah.
lone junco
I like the Subterfuge TB tbh.
raw fox
more about the trinkets than anything else
Should I sim differently? Even though a lot of bosses here are ST
outer vortex
Quick question about engi helm - seems like its trash due to our traits being better than the engi ones right?
plain thistle
400 ilvl with socket, ofc it will be better than 395 tiny jar or your other options
outer vortex
i cant find a gear combo where its better than my current 400/400/385 setup
even the 415 is within the sim margin
static sky
yeahy, i use it for now but there are better options
its not terrible by any meeans tho
lone junco
Socket monster
supple hearth
Hi I just wanted to take a moment to tell Noobe how I have a crush on him. Also assassination is a great spec.
plain thistle
๐ค
vestal wren
@hollow matrix to give you feedback about the dispaly issue, this was the response.
deft owl
guys, quick noob question, is the wind damage from paku avoidable with cloak?
simple meteor
btw guys is mastery better then versa on multitarget 4+ since now we spam more fok and versa scales better with fok?
umbral hemlock
what is the strongest with the right traits in raid; TB or Ex? In theory
indigo ginkgo
so is the treacherus covenant ! still bis after nerf ? cuz on toltip it say one things and on mmo other
plain thistle
not our bis anymore, but still a very solid trait
ripe nimbus
What u mean not BiS double dose and TC are still the best single target even after nerf.? Unless I missed something
real bay
or 3x DD 2xTC 1xNP
gray bone
Yes clickerino it is
patent topaz
press F to pay respects
vestal wren
avoidence is cool
plain thistle
@ripe nimbus before the nerf TC was better than DD, thats what I meant by "not bis anymore, but still a pretty solid trait", ofc you can use both if you get the pieces
vestal wren
TC is still rly good tbh, just close to the strong other traits
ripe nimbus
vestal wren
sin/outlaw have the option to not go TC hence their traits stack well
ripe nimbus
Xd
plain thistle
yup
solid nova
plain thistle
๐
umbral hemlock
twist the blade>dagger in the back?
plain thistle
wait, thats my gear or yours? I dont remember having a 400 helmet
lol, we have almost the same gear, but my helmet is 390
cosmic pier
vestal wren
tfd change put me down 20k -> 19.6k :/
plain thistle
@gusty kestrel but, do you have this bad boy?
cosmic pier
holy fuck
solid nova
Spicy
plain thistle
๐
vestal wren
@plain thistle what about this?
solid nova
Ooooo
plain thistle
damn, I want that, still using taloc trinket
vestal wren
it replaced my darkmoon trinket finally
solid nova
Jhonwei with Taloc trinket
Jhonwei with Plumage
strange python
Hey guys I c alot of rogues playing wiht the exanguisite talent and triple garrote trait
Is that bis now or?
brazen bane
so i havent played since uldir, did anything change for assa rotation wise?
like anything major
royal lantern
nah, not really
ripe nimbus
solid nova
Big
night vale
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wSqwMJGjjudCF5xrwJonyC
Is this sim alright for my ilvl? seems a bit on the low side, but i used to play sub and have no idea what imm doing xD
ripe nimbus
Looks fine
night vale
okay cool, just about to start raid, simmed lower than Sub, but suppose i have more chance of hitting this sim