So there is no more % from versa in twisted?
#assassination
jaunty arrow
nimble tartan
just go triple dd bro and this can happen https://i.imgur.com/Jnlf5lt.png
wild ledge
Just get better traits 
jaunty arrow
i have 3x ss already so will see what i drop next but 1 np is ok i guess
but DD is strong
i guess MA is better with 2+ DD
torpid sluice
even with 2x DD and 1 SS sims still tell me to go Subt ;_;
wild ledge
Wtf 
torpid sluice
Yip ;_;
wild ledge
How does that sim compare to if you were to drop that SS for another trait
MA would go ahead?
torpid sluice
other chest i have to replace that ss trait is eb/ss + sob/somethingiforgot
void gazelle
Do you know any sites beside wowanalyzer, for analyzing logs?
torpid sluice
so wouldn't help me at this moment ;p
wild ledge
@void gazelle people would answer specific questions about a log if you posted it
But if it’s just general advice like wow analyser then you’ll just get sent to the guides
spice surge
Lol, i've been saving my luck for mythic week
And bruteforcing luck since ill just buy a 415 piece wednesday
wild ledge
Good luck on bonus rolling first boss on Wednesday boiz 
wild ledge
Should have my engi helm done this weekend, and got the hc ss/echo chest
Other than that, a lot of wasted rolls
At least we can get azerite from WQs in the meantime
nimble tartan
i play ma only @gusty kestrel
i like it for all situations
its the best
even with ss for my character subter and ma simmed the same
Weird, for so long its been around 25 dps for me even last tier
dapper moat
i think i try out 2xdd 1xss with sub
bleak spoke
dang the more i mess around with MA the more i want to play it
the opener burst is hilarious
dapper moat
i cant go and change traits every now and then from 3xss to 3xdd...
depending whatever its st raid or aoe m+..
should have mained mm hunter 😄
nimble tartan
I hate that hiisi as well
I play outlaw in dungeons and its a pain
Especially since i know im not min maxed if i dont swap its terrible
And then theres pvp.. god
vast forum
Just play 3xSS then, st dps loss should be minor but aos gain huge
nimble tartan
Its why i usually do like 0 key content until my raid week is over
So then i never have to play sin
bleak spoke
my raid nights are mon/tues/thurs so i think until i get better azerite i'll change all my ST stuff to EB for the weekends for the forseeable future
monkaS
they should just remove reforge costs
and then it'll be so much less annoying
dapper moat
yeah
ill try now 2zss 1xdd with sub gonna be my raid AND m+ setup
after all theres much of multidotting in this raid anyway,..
spice surge
Not really
bleak spoke
Not much honestly
spice surge
Jadefire and p1 rastakhan
bleak spoke
Not much convenient multidotting
Like I’m driving my guild crazy cuz they’ll call swap on grong and I’m like it’s actually pointless lol
spice surge
I guess first boss too, but since you can just outdps it first week on hc i dont expect it to take long for you to zerg it on mythic either
You need to interrupt it though, on grong
bleak spoke
Like my rupture gonna tick for 5 seconds
Yeh I step to it and then garrote rupture kick it and leave
dapper moat
how about first boss when add phase?
bleak spoke
All the dhs and warriors are just wailing on it
dapper moat
but yeah in gonk my guild also screams me to go and nuke robot from far back 😄
nimble tartan
Like think about sin strengths
dapper moat
im like stfu , guys! 😄
bleak spoke
You’re not finna hold vanish for that so ss is so whatever
nimble tartan
We are like a top top tier st spec
With all st traits
Idk i just dont see any value in ss this raid personally
dapper moat
yeah might go master ass then, jesus
bleak spoke
When does siren spawn on the brother Joseph boat
nimble tartan
I mean subter still strong on st too
bleak spoke
Maybe won’t be horrible for stonewall
nimble tartan
I just rather continue to mut
dapper moat
u guys go at siren too,right?
nimble tartan
Bro its insane how much harder normal blockade is compared to heroic
bleak spoke
Cuz of the random yeh
I have a feeling that the fights gonna be really really scary on mythic
And probably buggy xd
wild ledge
And yeah ignore RL calls to swap on grong dude, you’re doing it right
Rogue privileges
nimble tartan
Naw i always swap pop a rup on it some dp
Insta go back
Get that younf energy for more muts
dapper moat
yeah.. i did not and i was effing sprinting all over the place and shadowstepping and then parced at 67... 😦
but now i stick to the ape no matter what
dapper moat
yeah.. its just, yeah..true ^^
wild ledge
Yeah ofc but it should be able to be covered. Can’t speak for every group ofc
The later ones it might be needed
spice surge
I'd imagine mastery is top stat with 3DD @nimble tartan ?
Or atleast a lot higher than otherwise
wild ledge
Does haste drop a lot when you change from SS, subt and exsang?
Wish I could play and sim
But you guys passing my day at work
nimble tartan
It is my top stat eleem
Last time i simmed it was like worth 2.61 for mastery and haste was 2.56 so its p close
I still gem and enchant for haste
The difference between swapping to and from is p small anyways
wild ledge
Cool ty
bleak spoke
i take it crit's worth a lot less with MA
spice surge
Not really, its only 3 seconds every 120 seconds
nimble tartan
Crit is still good yeah. All my atats are basically so close to each other (minus vers) that apart from rings its mostly just slap on highest ilvl gear u have with sockets
I think i have like 7 sockets on
bleak spoke
7 😮
wild ledge
The 415 dice isn’t 😡
nimble tartan
Its not mine i swear
cosmic field
I am new to a rogue, just saw the wowhead guide but i have a doubt using toxic blade or exsanguinate? with shrouded suffo its better exsa?
wild ledge
It’s fight and trait dependant, ex is more burst so that can be useful on some fights
Otherwise just sim
And sim different combinations of azerite
bleak spoke
415 dice wtf
tough egret
should i pick up a 3rd SS or take echoing blades for dungeons
dapper moat
btw on gongk when he tantrums i presume feint works on it or cloack?
dapper moat
yeah
wild ledge
@tough egret echo is very very good, I’d go as many echo as possible with at least 1 ss
Depends on key level and how many mobs are pulled tho. And if reaping is in play
Echo will be more value the more mobs you have
brazen nimbus
How much do you guys sim?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/v8txD3ecsuRMsNNtHpaK6T
i sim 17k but i feel its kinda low?
wild ledge
Probably fine for ilvl, do you have azerite with double outer ring traits?
icy pollen
How do you guys feel about shrouded suff? I feel like its way better than what it sims.
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/nSvuu7wNzuHeq2ZYZi8C49 Do you guys think its worth to take shrouded suff as trait anyway, even though it sims 1.7% less?
spice surge
SS is a cleave trait, so if you're going for pure ST then no
icy pollen
But most bosses do have some sort of adds/cleave, so do you think its generally worth using shrouded suff?
spice surge
Cleave or burst*
Most? In uldir yes, in battle no, not really
Rastakhan if you're staying up (which you shouldnt) and jadefire is basicly the only ones where cleave dps would matter
Because you're not gonna vanish for a grong robot unless you get really lucky with it spawning close to the boss and champions is basicly just zerg the boss
light narwhal
is there a list anywhere for sin trinkets like which ones are the best etc etc.?
icy pollen
you can cleave against blockade, gong and conclave pretty good i feel like
spice surge
Because they are too far away from the boss and dont line up well
icy pollen
so you can wait till a add spawns near you
conclave, you can use it when all those raptors spawn
feel like thats gonna be a huge dps increase
I'm probably just very biased towards shrouded suff tho, since I really like the trait
queen pawn
Hey Guys i'm haveing some trubles... i've runned most of 8.0 with SS now with higher gear, had my hands on DD traits. It feels good the only problem is that i feel i'm doing much less in AoE scenarios. So after running some sims i've checked that MA sims the same as Subterfuge, but as "the internet" says MA gives more burst. How do you guys manage AoE /Cleave situations with MA. I'm going to Garrote - FoK - Rupture - switch target - FoK (1 or 2 depends on crits) - Rupture - Garrote -switch target and repeat to have the 2 bleeds on 3 targets... i'm missing something? Or is that?
dapper moat
Either way swapping cost too much for me to min/max so i propably just keep 2xdd 1xss. It makes life more easy in m+ and world quests 😂
spice surge
You dont go MA if you're going to go into aoe scenarios mekkla
In a strict aoe scenario ss is much better
But regardless, the gameplay is basicly the same except you dont garrote 3 targets, you just rupture them
icy pollen
@dapper moat they made switching azerite cheaper
well, kinda, the cost decreases now every day instead of every 3rd i think
queen pawn
@spice surge i'm not running SS anymore due to HUGE il between my azerite gear... ATM i'm running 2 DD with 1 Scent of Blood. I've readed taht MA gives more burst due to more krit more burst with FoK but SUB gives more sustained due to more EP windows . Then in m+ i'll run SUB and just limit my self on rupture the targets
spice surge
MA does not give good aoe burst unless you're running fok traits
Its fairly useless without it (on aoe)
And even then, its not really a thing anyway since the garrotes from subterfuge just does so much damage
dapper moat
Agree, Eleem.
real bay
20k garrote ticks, feelsgoodman
spare dust
Thats a lot of ticks
queen pawn
so running with subterfuge is Garrote switch garrote switch garrote, then rupture then TB then FOK and rupture to 3 3 targets? and putting some envenoms in the middle?
so it is worth anyway with subterfuge garrote 3x even without SS
wild ledge
Here you go 
What you're gonna do, is as simple as you're gonna garrote one, garrote two, garrote three, rupture vendetta exsanguinate! yeah? then you're gonna fok fok, rupture again, you're gonna vanish, reapply garrotes, especially on the target you don't have, and that's it, then you're gonna ct (crimson tempest). Look at my damage, right now, fucking 40k, it's fucking over dude. Oooh. How the fuck though LETS GO
vestal wren
uff that musclebrah video is hurting
spice surge
There's also the joshXmusclebrah remix
wild ledge
Need
queen pawn
Will i'm not running bleed build... i used till yesterday dropped azerite stuff with DD for poisons... the problem is that when i used to do AoE with Bleeds i was doing insane from 30k to 40k too, now that is not the case with the build i'm running... i guess i've just have to drop one SS again
spice surge
Idk if its allowed to post it here though, its just a mp3
vestal wren
if its not offensive i dont see any harm
vestal wren
who muscle or josh?
spice surge
josh
wild ledge
magic mural
Why would you fok fok rupture after 3 garrote? And then only CT the first time after like 8 globals?
blissful saddle
vestal wren
oh to enyone watching this video, the gameplay footage/suggestion is just straight out wrong, use it at your own risk
sullen pagoda
But he has 30 armor sets do u have Kappa
vestal wren
i mean its a good video if you want to have a lough
real bay
havent played my rogue a lot in bfa so far just switched back and even i see its wrong
wild ledge
Yea was just memeing, in reality you wanna get ruptures and ct rolling earlier
Idk which exact order on 3 targets
vestal wren
exsang is also quite wasted in the video 😉
real bay
3 is quite irrelevant as most groups are bigger
magic mural
Yeah that is what I meant. Like there isn't a fixed opener anyway, except 3 garrote.. Depends on talents, enemies (is there a big one to exsang), target count, Azerite traits. (vanish isn't worth with 1 ss and 3 eb, but 3ss 0 eb could be worth, etc)
vestal wren
then again, i like his enthousiasm.
doing sth rly wrong and then be like "40k, its fucking over dude, LETS GO"
solid nova
my eyes.
real bay
pepega
languid ore
Wow. Best rotation. Been doing it wrong all along
willow pulsar
That's why they removed shuriken toss trait. So broken
vestal wren
tbh the toss trait wasnt to bad, it was just hard to get and noone rly wanted to play it
dark crag
He probably also had warmode talents
fair blaze
Fatboss said in his video, that cloaking magma trap on Jadefire masters won't knock you up, but i did them 2 days ago and i was sure that i got knocked, can someone tell how it is for real?
willow pulsar
No, cloak prevents this effect. 100% sure
vestal wren
you need to use cos before stepping on them
fair blaze
Ty guys for clearing this out
deep solstice
Does cloak remove chilling touch stacks on Jaina?
dark crag
No
wild ledge
No
deep solstice
Fun. Ok thanks.
dark crag
Only mages can?
wild ledge
It might prevent you from gaining more? But it doesn’t reset
Probably depends on source
deep solstice
Similar to the fetid debuff maybe
wild ledge
I definitely stayed out of an ice block longer than everyone else when we wiped to the wall transition
deep solstice
My guild is starting back up at mekkatorque in a few hours. Figured I would ask before dieing to something dumb.
vast forum
that musclebrah video induces physical pain
dark crag
Don't trample small one, don't get trampled, run behind boulders with bomb, learn to handle robots
buoyant coyote
anyone here thats good at WA?
languid ore
Have you checked wago. What you need is probably already on there, and pretty.
languid ore
Not even the slightest, sorry.
buoyant coyote
damn 😦
sullen pagoda
over 20k finally https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/anmSFAt9rxCu4UnVad4xqQ
Pog
wild ledge
Traits?
wild ledge
It ain’t a bad mix for this early
sullen pagoda
yeah
gonna have enough next week after m+ cache to buy mythic chest
hopefully something sick
mental obsidian
bis with those 2 talents
but without it s 3rd from the bottom?
wth?
could someone pls explain
rose perch
3rd from the bottom is SS without subterfuge at all which really sucks yeah
subterfuge is hugely multiplicative with SS
fading wigeon
Hey everyone. Why would a rogue open like this on champions of light. He parsed a 100. Just curious.
vestal wren
well 3x garrote for padding
fading wigeon
Ah gotcha
mental obsidian
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
spring iron
vestal wren
azerite traits stayed like they are, you can use !azerite to get a link to a summery about them
stat wights are like always, you need to sim them
real bay
garroting the adds on champions is def pad but it does still boost your ST no? just gotta poison them too
spice surge
Not really
vestal wren
you gain slight higher energy regeneration so i would say yes
spice surge
or rather, not very noticeably, especially if you have to poison them after the garrote
vestal wren
however you usually dont want to kill the adds, so this is pad
spice surge
and have to run inbetween them
fallen bobcat
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
real bay
3x garrote fok hope it does it but yeah padderino
spice surge
If you have to fok its probably not worth it
lone junco
im still using Prolonged power. So I just add 5% to my rank. that means I get 98
strange python
how do people get 50k+ dps on opulence?
spice surge
With my current haste (~17%), my garrote ticks roughly every 1.3s during hero. For one garrote to make up the 45 energy it costs, it would need to tick 6.5 times, which takes about 8.45s
So if you get lucky and apply your poison with garrote (or the melee) you get 21 total extra energy for that one global spent
strange python
can u take multiple gems?
lone junco
youll see the 300k dps peak
vestal wren
the dps garrote does will be added to your dps tho
spice surge
If you can attack it more (IE its right next to your prio target) and you can keep up poison for the entire garrote then you get more
Well yes obv, but he said it was a boss dps gain
lone junco
@strange python 1 opal stacks 2 % per mob hit. so you fok the trash. it caps at 20x. or 40%
lone junco
so you vendetta vanish gg
lone junco
ye
that particular log is neat. the 40% lasts long enough that exang is not necessary. so he has 2ss subterfuge and also TB
lone junco
spice surge
I think the opal was grey/whitish
lone junco
it was white
lone junco
its not pad. its boss dmg
royal lantern
fading wigeon
Who's log are you guys looking at ?
lone junco
just look for rank 1 heroic
its the 50k dps rogue
mythic will be neat prob. raid will sit capped at 40% bonus dmg for 2-3 min prob
bleak spoke
Wtf the opal is blue for me guys
I think on mythic prog I’ll probably play subtlety for that fight
And pretend I still have shuriken combo cuz of opal
prime bison
So opal is the best gem for logs on the opulence?
vestal wren
i assume opulance logs will be put off allstar
prime bison
It’s like press FoK on the adds to have +dmg
mental obsidian
Rupture, refresh with 7.2 seconds remaining at 5 combo points
i got a WA that lights up at 9 sec remaining
is it bad to do it before 7.2 sec remaining
fair blaze
Not so much, if you play with exsanguinate you will often have situations when you refresh earlier than 7.2
rose perch
it's bad to do before 7.2 seconds except when you're planning to exsanguinate though yeah
real bay
you can probably edit the WA to show it at 7.2
spice surge
Its fairly bad to refresh before pandemic yes, because you are essnentially wasting damage that you've already spent combo points and energy one
The exception being exsang
rose perch
it's not the end of the world or anything but you'll do more damage if you don't!
drifting cloud
of all the things you can fuck up, that 1s of rupture isnt gonna be the end
rose perch
yeah if that's the worst thing you're doing your dps will be great
but the answer to is it bad is yes
latent field
Opal was blue for me 🤔
mental obsidian
what if I refresh rupture after 7.2 sec
latent field
No damage loss if you have 5 combo points then
strange python
double dose + covenant trait head dropped 
terse rune
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
queen pawn
i do not understand why with EB in aoe sims i sim less then scent of blood... Any clue? as for AoE it should be the best!
spice surge
Depends on what aoe you're talking about
If its 4-5ish targets then scent is amazing, but you dont really get anything more from getting more targets after that
But EB gets better and better the more targets you add
queen pawn
you right i use to sim on 4 targets
spice surge
And also the more crit you have
Since whenever you get enough targets that you can reliably crit 5 times with every fok cast then EB is godlike
rose perch
I'd stay away from DD in M+ - especially if you combine it with EB, as the two traits are fundamentally at odds with one another
rose perch
Like DD by itself has value on 2-4 targets because you'd mutilate then, and EB by itself has value on 2-4 targets because you'd fan of knives then - but if you're playing both, they can't both get value
queen pawn
i think you are wrong, as on 1-2 targets u go with Muti but on 3+ is ever worthed more not useing Muti but go on to FoK due to CP building. I've got to try that out in m+ it sims good in ST and really good on 5targets aoe scenarios (just doing those sims). To me it seems a god compromise to not fall behind on ST. I'll try that out in some m+ tonight.
fickle viper
You need a lot of crit for FOK to actually surpass the expected amount of CP that you'd get from mutilate
On something like 3 targets
hallow walrus
Hey guys! When i dont have up any cooldowns like Vendetta/Exs/TB, what has more priority? Spreading out my envenom buff as efficient as possible or have another Finisher in my EP buff?
thorny kettle
W/o cds I'd suggest making sure your rupt is maintained. Dont really want to rupture while vendetta is up unless absolutely necessary
spice surge
You shouldnt really focus on either the EP or envenom buff uptime
thorny kettle
Make sure rupture and garrote are up, and envenom anytime they have more than like 3s?
spice surge
What you're looking for (especially when running multiple double dose traits) is to get as many of your mutilates inside envenom (and preferably EP too) as possible
Which can often coincide with the things you mentioned, but not always
fading vigil
@rose perch hey
fickle viper
@queen pawn these are average expected values of fok vs muti, per energy and per global, so if you've got enough energy from many dots up then you can consider the per global column
bolded is the 'realistic' crit % you get generally
so you dont need a lot of crit for FoK to be better if energy is an issue, but if energy isnt an issue then Mutilate averages more CP at realistic crit values until like 5 targets
queen pawn
thanks a lot
fickle viper
And what dratnos was saying was that, on top of this stuff above, taking DD traits pulls you towards wanting to press mutilate more (at low target amounts where its sometimes quite equal)
Whilst EB does the opposite
It pulls you to pressing FoK more at low targets (even though the CP value might be worse, the extra dmg value in that case makes up for it)
[5:38 PM] Dratnos: I'd stay away from DD in M+ this though
so u just want some EB, and then you can safely FoK as of 3 targets without feeling bad about it ever pretty much
strange python
is the opal gem called opal?
royal lantern
opal of something something
mental obsidian
Vendetta on cool down
Vanish paired up with vendetta
how can I do that if they dont line up
royal lantern
in a raidfight
you wait the ~20sec with vendetta
@strange python Opal of Unleashed Rage
prime bison
should I wait for SotS trinket when I play with Exsg?
or I can use exsg on cooldown
Haven’t played with exsg. before 
spice surge
The answer is in the pins 😃 Under FAQ and galecaller's boon
pseudo finch
Sorry, multiple traits of Nothing Personal only buffs the dmg of the dot and nothing else ?
spice surge
Yes, its the same with every trait.
Damage/healing/stats always stack and everything else doesnt
royal lantern
doesnt change the fact that i dont drop shit ;P
prime bison
Oh so do I every raid. Thank you, the answer was too obvious.
What do you think about crit trinket from dazaralor? Has anyone tested it?
bold mural
should i run 3xeb in m+ or is it worth swapping 1xeb for np+ec?
desert vault
does cloak work on Jadefire mini game I presume?
visual quartz
Or just do it, its so fun
bold mural
well i didn't try that first time i just went the normal route
desert vault
i always miss the first one for some reason
tranquil basin
Cloak makes you able to go through ring of peace on jadefire yea
royal lantern
you should use cloak too disable the mines
just step behind a mage/dh
but yeha, in theory you can go trough ring with cloak
fickle viper
he meant the minigame wqhere you face the clones
and dont think cloak works cause its phys?
vestal wren
you can use hs if you are low
next wolf
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
hallow walrus
In M+, my current items let me go 2x EB 1x SS OR 1x EB 2x SS, what would you prefer?
chilly obsidian
So is dmd fathoms still pretty decent?
vestal wren
yes, but once you got a decent raid/m+ trinket its not
so i would not recommend buying one
chilly obsidian
Havent played in a bit and I still have mine. Wasn't sure if it got nerfed or anything cause I dont recall seeing it on bloodmallet anymore
vestal wren
its quite low on herodamage too, given it cant compete with higher itemlvls
strange python
need a quick answer from someone pls
what's better in tol dagor
echoing blades or SS
gentle raft
Does Nothing Personal stack? my sims telling me to take a 2nd NP over SoB
loud galleon
I dont see why not Echoing Blades, but, I feel like SS would be good for the single target fights.
tall pecan
hey dudes, trying to figure out what to do with these raid and dungeon mats. are the traits on the engineering goggles pre determined?
loud galleon
Now, I have a question. Im getting about 11k at item lvl 379 what am I doing wrong single target?
Or is it possibly I have Twist the Knife x2
obsidian mountain
wild ledge
thank you world quests
tranquil basin
Currently switcing to assa from sub, what do i pool energy for? after doing my opener, which windows am i looking to empty my energy into? i currently don't have any shrouded trait, but i got 2x nothing personal, 2x double dose and 1x twist the knife
royal lantern
for some reason i only generate 1 CP with ss right now?
civic palm
SS?
royal lantern
shrouded suffocation
civic palm
Not in stealth > _>
strange python
Garrote outside buffduration.-
strange python
Then start in stealth.
royal lantern
didnt happend the entire expac, but for some reason right now i only get 1CP the last 6 pulls
civic palm
inb4WrongGearEquipped
true lantern
^
strange python
^
royal lantern
nope, 2xSS and subterfuge
true lantern
Then you arent pressing garrote from stealth
civic palm
Some macro casting a trinket you got there?
royal lantern
even if i would mess that up, suberfuge gives you a 3sec window
weak tundra
maybe your SS gear broke
civic palm
Unless you are exiting stealth without attacking.
strange python
You must be doing something wrong
weak tundra
try repairing
royal lantern
im the guy using shroud, and gear is fine
spice surge
Using a trinket from stealth breaks stealth without subterfuge
strange python
/rl, UI is messing with you
spice surge
But unless you have logs we can just keep guessing 🤷
true lantern
^
royal lantern
i have vigor and kimbuls claw, not a active trinket you use prepull
like i said, yesterday everything was fine
true lantern
I mean theres not much to mess up so im just more confused than anything
royal lantern
just notice the last few pulls that i only get 1cp
strange python
SS nerfed, heard it here first!
weak tundra
try sitting in stealth for like 1 more sec after everyone opened
true lantern
im still getting my combo points from SS
weak tundra
pretty sure something like that happened to me aswell before
solid nova
Correct gear 
Repaired gear
Reloaded UI
Relogged
Not a trinket
Im all out of ideas
If its not any of the above
true lantern
^ has a point
loud galleon
Yeah I have 2 SS's and am only getting 3 CP.
spice surge
The CP generation doesnt stack from more than one trait
solid nova
Thats normal lol
spice surge
Damage/healing/stats always stack, everything else never does. For every trait in the game
solid nova
Damage stacks
loud galleon
From Outlaw.
solid nova
CP generation doesnt
true lantern
^
solid nova
1 SS or 3, CP generation is exactly the same
civic palm
uhhuh
true lantern
so theres something with your opener, are you sure nothing is macroed to your garrote
royal lantern
nope, nothing
true lantern
then im not help idk
solid nova
I dont get why vanish garrote would work but normal opener wouldnt unless youre doing something different
civic palm
Unless he's magically not in stealth for his opener.
solid nova
Record your opener showing ss not applying with vanish garrote straight after to apply
Something is fishy
civic palm
Can you still G G G in the opener?
chilly obsidian
Try relogging and restarting wow
strange lichen
Thoughts on no SS traits and running MA instead of Sub for BoD?
spice surge
If it sims higher, do it
hallow walrus
what is MA
strange python
master assasin talent
strange lichen
Yeah I have 2 DD, 1 Np, 1 TTK, and Rezan bleed trait..shows itv sims higher on ST
true lantern
what is EP
strange python
70k envenoms 
true lantern
damn 70k
strange lichen
And 1 TC trait
spice surge
Or get 3x DD and crit like 25k with it 👌
strange lichen
I think if I swabbed out some gems, enchants ...I could hit 70k+ envenom np
Dropped haste and picked up mastery
royal lantern
allright
royal lantern
i did HS out of the raid and changed my traits and swaped back again
now it works
im confused as hell
civic palm
weird
royal lantern
i just reset all traits and took them again
solid nova
Very odd
spice surge
I had a similar bug during our raid, my nothing personal traits stopped working as well
On rastakhan
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/B6D8JZ9fPmwAgyMV#fight=30&type=damage-done&source=10
3 casts of vendetta, 0 damage from nothing personal
Even though i had 2 traits equiped
Big unlucky
thorny jasper
azerite bug has been around since 8.1
you have to go find out which piece isnt working and go reforge it iirc
very common it happened to my hunter on all 3 of his pieces on tuesday
its good to have a piece with a passive on it that u can check before raid bc it just happens sometimes
true lantern
ty for the info didnt know that was a thing
thorny jasper
im not sure if its just 1 trait sometimes or if its the whole piece it would be helpful if someone knew
i know that on our last reclear of uldir i didnt get a single overwhelming power proc all night
but the main azerite trait was working
teal kettle
for m+ if you guys had to double up on SS or Echoing blades which would you choose?
strange python
im using fan of knives and +crisom tempest still low dmg on several mobs,any tips?
royal lantern
our aoe is slow
you dont gonna out dps a DH that is doing meta>eye beam>skillbarrage in burst aoe fights
hold garrote/rupture on ~3-4 priority targets in sustained aoe fights, then spamm CT, if there are under 4-5 enemys just hold the CT dot up and spam envenom
lost sentinel
feels bad when a DH or frost mage is outdpsing simply cause the mobs die before garrotte can even get close to expiring lol
lean coral
keys you're doing are too low level then
lean coral
currently have 2 SS and 2 EB for my dungeon set
lost sentinel
I got 2SS, 1DD/+barrage(engineering helm trait), 1 SOB... still haven't gotten a new shoulder piece
strange python
lucky guy shay
torn niche
hey guys im having some trouble with my AZ traits is stacking 3 SS still the bis im not sure if im using the wrong sim profile but when i run raidbots its telling me to drop to 1 SS and use other gear
spice surge
Herodamage.com have azerite rankings
tough wedge
So when do i play what spec in higher m+? is there one thats better than the other on something or are all specs about the same?
spice surge
Depends on what dungeon and how you pull, you can make all 3 work
The one that gets the best results for the least amount of effort is definitely outlaw
tough wedge
So in the case of reaping for example and say 10+ which spec handles reaping mobs the best meaning higer aoe dmg
spice surge
Depends on what dungeon and how you pull, you can make all 3 work
tough wedge
Aight
warm geode
hi, asking again, with EB we FoK over Mut with 2+ targets?
pastel vault
yeah
buoyant stream
howdoes the dps on assassination rogue looking
true viper
How do you aoe at sin, legit never played it in pve content
spare nacelle
AP - gives slightly more
tawny shell
Has anyone tested mekka trinket using on CD vs holding it 30 secs for venndetta?
short token
so is CT baseline for m+ now?
oblique jackal
CT?
forest marsh
Crimson tempest
strange python
@royal lantern had that issue sometimes where ss gives 1 cp, not sure what causes or fixes it
tepid flower
Why would the sim recommend vendetta for an aoe (4 boss, 20 sec) fight? Especially 2 of them? Energy regen aspect? Does that stack?
Sorry, i meant "nothing personal" for vendetta.
spice surge
Compared to what?
With all traits damage/healing/stats always stack, never anything else.
sturdy python
20 secs isn't enough to benefit from scent
tepid flower
ahh, ok. Thanks!
strange python
why everyone tells me in pug to take ruby of focused animus
or whatever its called
sturdy python
One person in the group should take Ruby
Anymore than that is pointless
So max 2, one for each side
And it should be a spec that hits all adds in last phase with aoe easily
hybrid hound
urban salmon
Any keen Assassination players rolling around the Discord today?
sturdy python
If you are not the Ruby person take opal
vernal mauve
Is shrouded still good?
sturdy python
Yes
modest badge
there any bad trinkets in new raid?
vernal mauve
Is it going to be better then Incite of the pack?
sturdy python
Sim to be sure, fairly certain that's a yes
cerulean walrus
Tfw I still have a fathoms
sturdy python
Same here lol
modest badge
can fathoms be upgraded yet?
sturdy python
No
vernal mauve
Okay, I just wanted to make sure. Sims showed shrouded is better
sturdy python
Not surprising incite isn't very good for us
round harbor
Yeah 400fathoms would be insane
cerulean walrus
It would break everything
sturdy python
I'd instantly swap to inscription to sell them
cerulean walrus
Anchors that would tear a hole into the fabric of space
strange python
who said they were getting 70k envoms, i call bullshit
cerulean walrus
I get 50k envenoms
sturdy python
Think they said they had multiple ttk traits
vernal mauve
my buddy got i think a 90k envem
cerulean walrus
I get 65s sometimes
sturdy python
With vendetta and tb seems possible
vernal mauve
I think ive just seen 40 k 😦
cerulean walrus
Lion’s Guile makes it pretty easy too
strange python
outside damage increase windows, id like to see the log
cerulean walrus
Did he say outside of increase?
strange python
not sure, only glossed over it
cerulean walrus
Then assume it was
strange python
whats the point in mentioning it then if thats the case
round harbor
???
That's like when someone says they can do 200k as sin
Surely they aren't talking about over an entire fight or dungeon. It's a snapshot of a time when they were doing that
strange python
@strange python it was me
icy ember
hey for multi target, you guys no longer take crimson tempest? according to the guide anyway
round harbor
Where does it say that
icy ember
well it reads that way
round harbor
Could be
icy ember
idk, was just curious as i'm trying out asn for raids
probably not going to use it anyway during the raid
round harbor
You take pb in every raid boss
strange python
with 3x ttk and every cd + pots ive gotten over 80k envenoms too
highest was 100k+ but it was with 25% opulence buff
pretty sure if i went with ns i could hit about 100k with vanish-envenom without opulence buffs
hmm
3x ttk and mp?
3x ttk and sub
here u go
with subterfuge
nightstalker would buff it even higher
hmm
i really like ttk traits
but there are not the best ofc
empty tide
i got a 125k envenom on opulence
strange python
ill take back what i said then
round harbor
double dose is stricly better though =/
strange python
i take what i have
never ran ttk, just 2x dd
my 5ring azerites are uhh, okay
sims telling me to use master assassin now
round harbor
if you dont have any shrouded, then probly
round harbor
Laser matrix 🤔 🤔 🤔 🤔
empty tide
strange python
well this one is using ttk, but laser sims the same
empty tide
135k*
strange python
with nightstalker it's well over 200k envenom
round harbor
you dont have any chest that has two traits on it?
empty tide
was using MA
round harbor
just buy a random 385 tbh
round harbor
it likely wont effect you being able to buy a 415 any sooner
strange python
even 370 5ring azerite is a big upgrade to 385 4ring
round harbor
yeah that too
strange python
873 residuum and i did a 15
that'll put me just at 1720ish
isnt it 365 residium this week
from weekly?
800ish with a 15
round harbor
yeah youll need to scrap 1 piece of azerite
round harbor
but you should hit the 1725 mark
strange python
yeh i could always just do a few m0's
just scrap ur old 385s
for 35 residium now
or so
i recieved none of them post change so i dont get the residuum 😦
m0s then
yeh that'll have to do
do full leather group and pray they give u some azerites
could be worse
u know whtas worse
spamming shrine 5s all day and not get gatecaller
dropping your ice cream on a hot day?
i dont really want to live in a world without ss
just so fluent
also even without master poisoner, mastery simming highest for me
didnt think it would happen
spice surge
Theres not a single scenario in pve where you'd use master poisoner
strange lichen
@strange python same for me, I dropped SS traits and went MA..going to try it out for a while. I know initial opener is crazy burst
unborn rampart
how do sin rogues handle the mass rush of reaping adds? just spam CT?
strange python
dno if there's rly a special number of ruptures
i have a few scent of blood traits too
unborn rampart
3x garrote + rupture go to town ig uess
strange python
i normally keep Ct bleed up
and get as many ruptures as possible up
and once i have a shit load of ruptures then i'll start spamming ct
but dno if that's the optimal way
spare narwhal
Does raidbots effectively simulate timewarped trinkets? Want to see how a 275 windswept trinket matches against my fathoms deck trinke
forest marsh
A 275??
spare narwhal
whoops sorry, 375 windswept trinket
strange python
sim really doesnt like my 3rd double dose
round harbor
wait peki youre alliance lol
i was like where the fuck u get that helm from
kinda unlucky to get that though i guess since bis helm is off first boss
inland ridge
morning @strange python :)) xx
inland ridge
when did u sleep
strange python
every day of my life except yesterday and today monkas
round harbor
first boss helm is for sure better than that one at an even ilvl, but also considering that youll get the mytghic one relativly fast
assuming you raid mythic
which im pretty sure you do
strange python
i mean depends how highly you value treacherous
dd/np + overwhelming its the same
strange python
really depends on the content i suppose
strange python
i get what you're saying, but lets use this weeks m+ affixes for example, where my uptime on it is less than 50%
in a vacuum, yeh its better
we'll see how mythic prog goes
round harbor
to each their own, but even in m+ id use it
the times where it wont be active are at the end of a pack
not nessecarily during your big damage windows
proven wasp
Does galecaller's boon stack with lust?
mighty elm
how accurate is the Dungeon Slice (BETA) simming for dungeons? mastery sims pretty low and haste and crit is super high?
still pewter
@strange python you wrong
strange python
rarely, but not here
still pewter
Just dont use dd 4head
strange python
probably a reason its not called triple dose
nimble tartan
I love double dose
oak inlet
in general, are we looking for 1 SS, 1 NP, a few TC, and a few DD?
prisma crescent
This has prob been asked a ton but Echoing Blades > SS in M+?
sturdy python
Sub is doubtful, it's just not doing well outside it's niche.
urban salmon
Is Shrouded really only beneficial with Exsanguinate?
sturdy python
No, it's good with tb too, esp the first one.
I was using 2 SS and tb was better st
urban salmon
I have the rare opportunity to pick
sturdy python
It's all very situational
sand ledge
It's all about that one button like killing spree or secret technique
urban salmon
1 SS and 2 DD or the other way
nimble tartan
Ss in 2019 
sturdy python
Sin does better sustained aoe than sub. Sec tech isn't going to be that huge
Sim it Sab. DD is better St, ss shines in multi
sturdy python
Variance?
sturdy python
I've never seen that
The margin of error is something like 0.05%
It does the exact same for thousands of iterations and then averages that
urban salmon
I'm aware
sturdy python
Then you should know it won't vary by thousands between sims
Unless something is being changed
urban salmon
I reforge my azerite and retalent so I can just draw straight from game data rather than using talent calculator
sturdy python
The data for raidbots is pulled from game data...
urban salmon
Unless I use talent calculator instead of copypasta from simc
sturdy python
I don't understand what you're saying
St Sim is accurate though, you should use to decide
urban salmon
Instead of doing a straight dps sim I was trying to use talent compare
And things got wonky
Just running each iteration as a sim with relogging in WoW works best I guess. 5 attempts later and DDx2 and SSx1 with Toxic Blade pulled ahead.
robust light
could someone sendme their tricks macro? my focus one doesnt work
sturdy python
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
civic palm
👏 ... 👏 ... 👏
icy ember
is exasanguite AOE or is it single target only?
royal lantern
ST only, aoe exsang would be nuts
round harbor
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast Sinister Strike
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast Dispatch
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast Ambush
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast Roll The Bones
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast Between the Eyes
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast Pistol Shot
that should do yer just fine
its what i do 
sturdy python
lol
civic palm
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast Sinister Strike; Dispatch; Ambush; Roll The Bones; Between the Eyes; Pistol Shot
This does not work.
echo night
Cause you need to vanish before ambush
civic palm
Riiiiiiiiiiight
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast Sinister Strike; Dispatch
/cast Vanish; Ambush
/cast Roll The Bones; Between the Eyes; Pistol Shot
echo night
I wouldnt make a macro like that
royal lantern
^,you should use tricks 2-3 sec before pull anyway, and the other stuff is just all skills in 1 macro?
echo night
True story
royal lantern
eh, sometimes its better too hold tricks instead of using on cd
echo night
Btw, is 3x SS 3x EB the best way to go atm for M+?
rose perch
With reaping I've sometimes regretted having it on cd as a wave is spawning
round harbor
??
royal lantern
like, on stormwall brokcade you want tricks when the 2 priest switch sides
royal lantern
or in m+ with reaping
rose perch
Yes stabz I think that's nutty although only one piece with that combo from raid, other two slots have to be residuum
round harbor
Hello from raid is good too for the same/tc combo
Helm
Holy fuck
Phone typing
Ss/tc
echo night
I would actually love 1x SS/TC just for some more umpf
royal lantern
turn autocorrect off ;P
round harbor
But yeah trees every reaping and Earth ele every reaping is pretty fucking nice for stacking it up fast
And just a few seconds to mongo without worry
Which is all I've found it really takes to clean things up
echo night
Would ya say reaping is less of a pain in the ass than infected?
round harbor
10millions times easier
echo night
Sweeeet
royal lantern
you can just pull with reaping, dont need too slow down like with infested
round harbor
People are already doing 20s with shit azerite week 1
echo night
Im sensing that reaping will get buffed somehow
echo night
Good xD
royal lantern
its sometimes really easy, and sometimes really shit,deepens on the enemy wave that comes
sturdy python
Think the 20s being done are like TD tho right?
royal lantern
many elite enemys=stuff can go south pretty fast
sturdy python
But still yeah I tihnk reaping is easier. Maybe not for random pugs though
round harbor
Yeah all TDs but a 20 to this season is like what 23-24 s1?
sturdy python
Random pugs who pulled one pack at a time will probably find reaping harder
royal lantern
a 10key right now is bettwen a 13 and 14 key last season difficulty wise
echo night
Hmm, easy enough
Will get easier in a few weeks when people starr reaching 395-400 ilvl
round harbor
Next week I think people are gonna be getting baseline 20s
round harbor
With more azerites and good affixes
ruby idol
TD is unique in that its a joke of a dungeon
royal lantern
wath are all the outlaws doing in the superior sin channel btw?
sturdy python
Theyll probably make the cannons not work on them at some point
Dont see how they wont
ruby idol
So the scaling up doesnt really make any difference in there
round harbor
Yeah
royal lantern
everything is hard for casual man
ruby idol
Because they dont utilize cannons the way pushers do
royal lantern
thats like, the deffenition of a casual
robust light
@sturdy python ty
ruby idol
Its not tho, some things are intuitive and not difficult regardless of skillset right
lone junco
So i have a few options. Play the healer myself. Swap to BloodDK and pull myself. Find better friends. Or just accept the shitty play.
honestly we always have at least one offspec or alt.
tough lantern
wq still only way to level rep with champions?
round harbor
I mean there isn't a whole lot of more than 6 mob pulls
That are meta pulls atleast
Outside of reapojg of course
Ur maybe with second boss room, skele packs which are a joke, kr blobs, fh quite a few pulls, motherlode you really don't want much more than 6. Maybe two pulls after second boss. Shrine maybe two pulls with 6+ elites
There is more. But yeah
It's not super super common
lone junco
i mean. we pull pack, by pack.
thats why 3ss is so godly.
3-5 over and over and over.
tough lantern
even better w/ shadowmeld
round harbor
Shadowmeld Xdxdddxd
lone junco
w/e. just bitching to bitch.
round harbor
Yeah I mean depending on the key one pack at a time is ok
It really safe but you don't get to see big numbers which sucks
fickle obsidian
round harbor
Just pug if you want to do higher
lone junco
grats on the sockt
round harbor
Rogues are near 100 pickrate in keys
lone junco
If no one is on tonight. Ill pug. sounds fine.
this one was something else.
explosive orbs everywhere.
2h
ugh
round harbor
Yikes
lone junco
I should play with people that beat me probably.
honestly, I beat them, cause we pull like bitches.
round harbor
Are you us horde
lone junco
yeah. Thrall US Horder
round harbor
I'll run some shit with you sometime
I like to put and it'll help your score so you can get into better pugs easier
dreamy plover
What stats should be prio for high end m+ is it still mastery?
buoyant flicker
nimble tartan
what if blzizard let us m+ on all dungeons that were out since m+ inception. If the dungoens were created or out with mythic + system in place they should let them all be playable throughout time with current affixes....
see yall in neltharions lair with reaping POG
zenith gust
guys, the crafted trinket is any good? i mena, are the sims right? cuz it sims like shit to me. the 385 i mean
lone junco
Alch stone?
zenith gust
y
plain jacinth
It sims like shit because it is shit.
lone junco
depends on what you have access too. but yeah. its not simming incorrectly
@marble hemlock in a perfect M+ world what are your 6x? 2g 2fok 2rupture?
marble hemlock
depending on boss, ye
hard stump
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Azerite Season 2 changes: https://bit.ly/2U86I7o
raw fox
Hey guys so I was throwing my logs into wow analyzer and its telling me that im wasting CPs generated with garrote
But on certain fights I open up on 3 targts with 3 SS garrote, just gotta accept the fact that those points are going to be wasted right?
spice surge
There is nobody maintaning the assassin (or any rogue spec for that matter) module for wow analyzer
raw fox
Ah. But garroting all possible targets still king dick right?
spice surge
Yes
sturdy python
yes
raw fox
Im thinking 3 ss and echoing would be nice
rustic tree
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4zabt82dk1FvJPaxLgSSf8
Can anyone explain why DD would be better than a 2nd SS when specced into subterfuge? I have no words, makes zero sense to me.
cerulean junco
Is there a weak aura that tracks empowered garrotes/rupture
high shell
Is Boon still bis with toxic blade or is it only with exsanguinate?
rose perch
@cerulean junco haven't used it myself but I recently heard this one does that https://wago.io/AcVGRZAuG
cerulean junco
thank you!!
rose perch
@high shell it's got more synergy with ExS but it could be best for you with TB too - sim it!
rancid bobcat
does NP energy gain stack?
rose perch
No it doesn't so you really don't want more than 1 copy of the trait
(@rancid bobcat )
icy ember
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/3jtE4otqD1iPfdXcHesr3z does anyone else get these results when comparing toxic blade/exsanguinate? it is 1% superior here, im not certain why
im just throwing together an asn set
rose perch
not surprised that TB is simming a bit better for you with only 1SS, sim's probably right
icy ember
ya it is a weak SS as well, 370
just throwing something together for the raid, the 1st 2 bosses are asn
my other pieces are much better, but no shrouded sang unfortunately
inner pecan
stoic violet
This question seems pretty obvious, but I figure better safe than sorry when it comes to my rotation. Is the Nothing Personal trait and the trinket Invocation of Yu'lon affected by the 30% nature damage buff by toxic blade?
sturdy python
Trait should be, trinket no
stoic violet
Huh, bummer, just had a second to test and you're right. Sucks, considering it says its dealing nature damage.
civic palm
Trinkets are not buffed by things like that anymore due to idiotic stat scaling that caused issues in Legion.
olive dagger
If my energy is not capped, I'm meleeing, and I don't have any temporary buffs up, I'm not losing damage by doing nothing, correct?
civic palm
goawaymastery
torpid oar
hey guys which is more accurate herodamage or blood mallet. Both are showing SS at different levels and has made me skeptical of which one is the correct one.
prime stirrup
Herodamage shows their sims, and the gear they are using. Last i checked (start of BFA) bloodmallet didnt show sim datat
proven frigate
Blood mallet uses master assassin so SS underperforms