I never said 8 is an absolute rating
#assassination
grizzled jay
grizzled jay
What argument?
fair blaze
Doesnt mean that u can insult us
vapid moth
That 395 socket TD dagger
fair blaze
Rotation, haste, not linking your rio/wowprogress etc
frozen pecan
w/e that diavolo guy is just big talk but can't back it up, too bad
slim hemlock
Thanks for the vid
grizzled jay
Answer my question
slim hemlock
Whats CT?
vapid moth
Crimson Tempest
grizzled jay
Crimson tempest
slim hemlock
Right. I've been using poison bomb
spice surge
Nobody is calling you an idiot because you were wrong about rogues, people are calling you an idiot because you act like one
vapid moth
@slim hemlock that's also situational. If the packs are small you would use PB more than CT
fair blaze
@spice surge +1
slim hemlock
I used it because guide said so, and I suck so passive was tempting
fair blaze
@slim hemlock in higher keys you would use CT except KR and ToS
spice surge
!ct
prisma monolithBOT
There is no specific week or affix that makes one or the other more viable.
CT vs PB is mainly down to your group, the dungeon itself and your pull sizes, with PB naturally having an edge in boss fights.
It's mainly the combination of affixes and dungeons that favour one or the other. High Tyr KR/Temple favour PB in general, due to low pulls and harder bosses.
In terms of Exsang vs TB; Exsang wins since it works well with SS traits and it's only 1 global on your priority target for some burst damage and extra energy.
TB usually locks you to that target to gain the most out of it.
grizzled jay
Well on 15 18 tyrannical boss after lust is over I can see difference
Whats wrong with that
vapid moth
There is no difference
grizzled jay
I dont get it
vapid moth
They both suck for st
grizzled jay
Ok then where is thr cutt off
So you don't know
Exactly
👌
Ok
But when do you feel the haste cause you say 11 is unnoticeable
So when is it
20?
vapid moth
I always say 15 🤷🏿♂️
grizzled jay
15 sounds about right
vapid moth
You said 11 one minute ago
grizzled jay
?
tawny nova
I thought 42 was the ultimate answer?
vapid moth
150% haste or no pull
grizzled jay
I said I personally feel a difference. But 15 is obv way more noticeable
So you are right
Never said otherwise
vapid moth
Oh so you're that type of argueer
vapid moth
Lmao
rose violet
Thank god this shitshow died
fair blaze
grizzled jay
It's alive
fair blaze
It was friend conversation ; )
grizzled jay
So tisu...
vapid moth
🙄
grizzled jay
Kidding jesus
spice surge
Dont joke about jesus 
grizzled jay
Oh
Sry
Great talk
Eh never said it was optimal really
In the end i cant get below 10 anyway
Gear and shit
rose violet
vapid moth
My disappointment is immeasurable
grizzled jay
When I started to push he was the first guy I saw daily streaming
So obv I watched until I didn't
rose violet
We all make mistakes
Now you watch people like Ashine and speed
Although speed hasn’t been playing his rogue lately
Shame
marble hemlock
the thing about haste in tyrannical is that there is no conclusive evidence that it actually makes your run any faster. the feeling (emphasis on FEELING) of most high-end rogues usually goes the other way, where they say that haste is not a desirable stat even on tyrannical weeks. obvious exceptions would be KR and Temple, and potentially underrot. no idea what @solar rose was playing in their UR22
i personally dont run any amount of haste in any key other than the 2 aforementioned ones
most certainly not in freehold/ML
grizzled jay
Maybe I confused you but one of the big guys did that. Doesnt matter anyway
Prolly testing
No harm
marble hemlock
the problem with claims like yours is that theres very little to back them up, usually its only "feelings" that are being taken as evidence for statements like "you definitely notice a difference of 3% haste"
and since people come in here to get answers to questions, when people like tisu or me read some of these questionable statements, we argue to the contrary
i dont even notice a 10% haste difference on ST, so good for you for noticing a 3% one
marble hemlock
but the difference between running 25% or 35% crit, or 5% haste or 15% haste, is barely noticeable right now
in terms of smoothness of the st rotation
its just that m+ is a very unique scenario where its incredibly hard to prove why A is better than B, but worse than C etc.
grizzled jay
Yeah too many variables
marble hemlock
so all we have to go on are the combined amount of experiences
and even inside that somewhat small sub-community of high-m+ rogues, we disagree all the time
and just because player A is more successful score-wise than player B, or player C does more overall damage than A and B, doesnt mean that any of them are factually wrong or right
so in that haste-case, id say: if youre struggling with boss-damage in your grp, going more haste might make the run faster/smoother. if you dont, prioritize AoE damage where haste is your least important secondary stat
the more 1-3 mob pulls you do, the more valuable haste becomes
grizzled jay
For sure
marble hemlock
or rather, the more time you spend on only hitting 1-3 targets
anyway, long story short
a difference of 3 or even 5% haste is almost impossible to notice from a gameplay-perspective :p
i think thats what tisu objected to
grizzled jay
Maybe it's language barrier and I didnt express myself correctly. But I dont think 8 is worse than 12. But that ST wise in long fight it feels better for me personally
I see how that can be interpreted like me staying it's better
marble hemlock
again, its just our disbelief that you actually notice a difference
cold obsidian
seli for president
grizzled jay
Now back to padding with EB
marble hemlock
dude
grizzled jay
Jk
grizzled jay
Ahahhaha
marble hemlock
110% efficient DPS
grizzled jay
In what universe did we ever think Sin was gonna be THE AoE stat pad
marble hemlock
well, EB certainly helped
grizzled jay
Yep
marble hemlock
but it was already pretty strong with SoB
grizzled jay
I guess its "easier" with EB
marble hemlock
its just very hard for most people to get the gear to make it work imo, and even then its arguably a case of "whos better at dealing prio/boss/aoe damage"
right now im in the camp of "rogue #1" in terms of AoE damage
but plenty of people disagree with me on that one
rose violet
Is that overall dmg?
marble hemlock
ye
rose violet
Jesus
grizzled jay
Yeah its amazing
marble hemlock
EB in ML/freehold is poggers
grizzled jay
Did 5M more in ML just with EB. But 100skill I swear
spice surge
EB+Sob is gonna be omega
rose violet
I guess that one was freehold
marble hemlock
ML
couldve hit 29 or even 30 if i didnt die like a dumb-dumb on 2 of the bigpulls
but i still suck at not taking damage 😦
grizzled jay
There there champ u ll get there
rose violet
I want pulls like those
The way we pull I can only get 24k
As outlaw btw
Big yikes
grizzled jay
Ouch
solar rose
I only really like a higher haste build in KR and temple w/ PB. I ran 8.5% haste in our World first 22 UR. Mainly because I have 395 w/ socket haste/vers legs. Wanted slightly more crit so had a high crit low haste ring. I pretty much scrapped the whole "15% haste thing" on tyranical, didn't really care for the difference on instances that weren't KR or temple. The way we pull UR was no exception. Still played high crit/high mastery.
marble hemlock
kk
amber quail
So assuming 6 targets pulls and bosses , you guys, in BORALUS pref to go 25c-22h-29m or 27c-18h-33m?
And azerite traits? I haven’t any SoB 😆. Plz answer also in pvt cause need to go asap TY
I’m trying 1xEB-1xSS-1x NP/EB
But head is 375 😭
rose violet
This needs to stop
strange python
lel
bright path
What is EB?
solid nova
Echoing Blades
bright path
Ty
unkempt karma
wise star
370 with socket is an upgrade though
spice surge
Significantly better than the 375 one as well
alpine hazel
i looted a 380 Dice yesterday with socket xD
think im aint gonna swap that one for a while xD
lunar whale
I feel like I don't know when to press Toxic blade, any dots I need to watch out for or just press it any time it comes up?
royal lantern
press when off cd, try too not re-apply bleeds with it up, get 2 envenoms or more out
lunar whale
Oh, that explains things. Thanks for the quick reply!
solid nova
!affix
prisma monolithBOT
Affixes: Tyrannical - Raging - Volcanic - Infested
solid nova
tribal marlin
hello ! How many rupture do you place in a big aoe situation ?
I mean when do you spam CT insteed of multi-rupturing ?
earnest token
You want to have 3-4 ruptures going atleast cause that will give you the energy regent to sustain your FoK/CT spam in aoe
I think it was around 6 targets when you just start using CT over envenom
tribal marlin
Ok thx
spice surge
Ct over envenom is 4
tribal marlin
I use to rupture every thing on like 10 targets maybe I wrong
sweet oasis
Poison bomb and toxic blade both sims higher than Ct & Exsang, should I trust the sims? (that is both in Patchwerk and M+ sims)
spice surge
If you have pb then yeah, rupture everything.
tribal marlin
I mean CT only does 2-3k damage on all target
(direct damage portion)
So I was really unsure but imma believe no worrie 😄
spice surge
A good rule of thumb on big packs is to rupture if you don't get 5 cp and CT if you do
tribal marlin
ok
spice surge
If the pack stays alive for a bit that is, if it's about to die just CT
tribal marlin
yes yes for sure, i really thought about specific case where I'm sure targets will live all the duration
woeful field
is it possible to dodge the Severing Axe of Kula the Butcher in King's Rest with Evasion ? And is there a Method or something to know who gets hit by it ?
lethal heart
yes you can
you have to kind of
play a bit first person, scroll your camera really close
to see who is he facing towards
no other better method sadly
woeful field
okay, so she looks in the way of the player she throws it at
woeful field
well i kind of can work with this 😉
jagged yoke
is elaborate planning the best by far?
slim olive
Yes
jagged yoke
how about the last tier of talents?
vast forum
PB is the only one that works on ST
CT is best for sustained aoe
HB can find uses in burst aoe imo, but it's almost never picked in pve
vast forum
but CT and HB have 0 use in ST
i guess HB actually causes you to use FoK on ST on max stacks, but the gain is miniscule
vast forum
shout out to @vestal wren for all the work he does for us 😄
vestal wren
thanks 😃 if there are any ideas for bot commands let us know, the majority is fairly fast implemented
dapper moat
have there been any theories about 8.2 azerite traits are the same old traits like SS and DD going to hold up, meaning should we get those 415 piece azerite items with these 8.1 strong traits or are the new ones simming higher?
fathom falcon
I've got a question about mythic plus dungeons. What is the best spec and how is the rotanation to it? My talent skill is 2212233 now. Greets
bleak spoke
so i just picked up a galecallers, what's the best way to use it on dungeon bosses? (running 3xSS/exsang/CT)
do i hold exsang for it
sturdy python
Check pins
primal gazelle
Last nights convo was more exciting than when I called out @marble hemlock for a 1v1
10/10 would read again
solid nova
Take the memes and shit posting to off topic. The spec channels isn't the place.
dapper moat
so the new 8.2 azerite traits goes to the own azerite wheel?
solid nova
8.2 is more than a tier away, anything can change between that time.
Guessing for changes that are so far away is impossible. Focus on what's coming sooner.
fathom falcon
@solid nova i dont understand what you mean with "shit posting to off topic" ...? Is this phrase for me?
solid nova
No.
fathom falcon
Ah.
latent gazelle
i may be blind but i didnt see anything in pins. is there a list or anything of what to shoot for gear wise from BoD?
surpass personal loot?
supple hearth
the gear to shoot for is whatever sims best
herodamage is still using current tier gear. You'll have to wait for them to update it for next tier
latent gazelle
okay. i figured it wouldnt come out till the raid actually dropped.
was mainly wondering about which azerite psieces/traits.
supple hearth
herodamage will have it when its available
latent gazelle
roger ty
devout glen
anyone really good with elvui?
normal ridge
Why ppl use exanguinate and not TB in m+ high?
devout glen
will do more if u have 2 or more shrouded and its actually useful on aoe since it doesnt stick u to 1 mob
old knot
whoops, i didn't go exsang because i thought we needed galecaller's boon for it
spice surge
!ct
prisma monolithBOT
There is no specific week or affix that makes one or the other more viable.
CT vs PB is mainly down to your group, the dungeon itself and your pull sizes, with PB naturally having an edge in boss fights.
It's mainly the combination of affixes and dungeons that favour one or the other. High Tyr KR/Temple favour PB in general, due to low pulls and harder bosses.
In terms of Exsang vs TB; Exsang wins since it works well with SS traits and it's only 1 global on your priority target for some burst damage and extra energy.
TB usually locks you to that target to gain the most out of it.
spice surge
@normal ridge
fluid mist
Hey Guys, i got a question. Isn’t this a bit of a low Sim for 5 min patchwork for my ilvl with how “iDeal” my gear is
spring sage
Hello all,
How do you maximize the utilization of elaborate planning? I have trouble especially when toxic blade is on cooldown and I need to refresh rupture. Should I try to get 1-3 envenoms before toxic blade is up or use envenom as a filler and pool energy and combo points just before TB comes back up? Also, do you refresh rupture before using TB to gain EP and then go full burst with it?
sturdy python
Dont worry too much about EP, the most you can do with it is envenom when it has like .5s left but its minor. Use TB on CD, should have bleeds refreshed prior to using it so you dont need to during the buff
2 or more envenoms into each TB
Holding TB too much can result in a lost cast over a fight which is bad. Depending on fight length you might be able to hold it for a couple secs here or there but thats situational
spring sage
Hmm, the problem is that if I don’t ”combo” with EB my dps is about 1-1,5k lower than simmed dps. With careful utilization of EP I got more than simmed dps. It is just very hard way to play 😛
fluid mist
Losing a cast is a big dps loss tho
spring sage
But I agree on what you said about tb
sturdy python
What do you mean combo with EB ?
Theres no way you lose 1.5k DPS by not clipping EP with envenom
fluid mist
@sturdy python could you take a quick look at my Sim and see if you see anything strange?
primal gazelle
74k sustained dps 😮
sturdy python
Im not the best at looking at sims, everything looked fine though
spring sage
I mean that you get 4-5 combo points and then pool almost max energy. Then you cast rupture or envenom and then you can get 2 envenoms with eb in a row
sturdy python
18k isnt really low
Yes and thats fine to do as long as bleeds dont fall off and youre not losing TB time
But its not a huge priority at all anymore
Early Legion it was because of how much higher Envenom damage was and EP being longer
spring sage
So you just keep bleeds on and pool before TB to get 3 envenoms on that window?
sturdy python
Might just need a higher ilvl trinket and morte sockets, Mosh. Nothing wrong with the sim tho
fluid mist
I can’t get a higher ilvl dice for The life of me
sturdy python
Im not enough of an authority to say Synergia
fluid mist
Thanks for taking a look tho 😃
sturdy python
I try to pandemic bleeds and pool before TB comes off but Im not that good so
Could ask Eleem or Seliathin when you see them around. I dont think the APL pools
spring sage
No problems Tawney 😃 . I haven’t found this more advanced stuff from YT or Icy-Veins. Also there’s no mention of on ravenholdt. Usually the guides are quite basic stuff 😛
fluid mist
I think The difference is marginal tbh synergia as a general rule of thumb Tb on cd to not lose a cast
sturdy python
From what Ive gathered here the sims were done and pooling has basically no difference over 5 mins, it was so minor
For EP clip that is
spring sage
Well it’s 10% more damage and if you get 3 - 4 finishing moves in a row you are doing 10% increased damage for about 10 - 15 seconds
sturdy python
Youre doing that increased damage no matter what
spring sage
The point is ofc not staying energy capped
sturdy python
The benefit is you will get one more envenom in a window by clipping
but you also technically lose some uptime on EP
So Rupture>Clipping with envenom could be only 7.5s of 10%
spring sage
Yes, however you get more envenoms with EP
sturdy python
Vs 8s of 10% without clipping, you just lose that one envenom
Ofc youd really want it more like 7.9999s of 10%
But with server lag ya know
I def dont think clipping is anything but a gain as long as nothing is lost but supposedly its so minor its not worth worrying about
Could always edit the APL and test tho
@fluid mist you might try to top gear sim different weapon enchants. Crit is fairly low on your stat weights so try mastery OH enchant
fluid mist
Ah good point!
sturdy python
Im assuming your array is crit?
fluid mist
Mastery used to Sim very low for me. No array is haste.
fluid mist
I do have Some mastery heavy rings i could switch out. Should up my Sim a bit
And haste/mast boots
sturdy python
Definitely where top gear becomes handy
fluid mist
The reason i was asking is i see people with like 4/5 ilvls higher equipped Sim close to 20k i know at this point 4/5 ilvls equipped is big but almost 2k dps is a lot
solid nova
Sockets count for a lot too.
sturdy python
Those people youre referring to have like 8 sockets yeah'
fluid mist
Rng has not been kind to me besides getting The 385 boon :p
sturdy python
Well Boon is nice lol
fluid mist
It was not even from weekly chest :p just forged in The run
It was a shrine from hell tho :p
sturdy python
At least it had a present at the end lol
topaz laurel
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
round mirage
Good evening everybody, I’m looking for a mentor for Assa rogue 😊
strange python
does nothing personal stack? Im guessing if it does, the dmg does but not the energy gain?
dark crag
Yes
lost horizon
@round mirage it's a lot to ask for someone you don't know to invest a significant amount of time into you
read the guides, use the resources here, put effort in yourself and ask for clarification on things you're not getting
sour wraith
!m+
prisma monolithBOT
Use the fight style Dungeon Slice (Beta) for a M+ simulation on Raidbots.
sour wraith
didn't there used to be a specific string to sim for m+ stat weights?
round mirage
@lost horizon obviously I’m not willing to ask somebody to waste time on me, I’d like to know if anyone has some suggestions for a beguinner rogue. I’m already surfing through the guide but any additional suggestion is more then welcome 😊
lost horizon
!stats @sour wraith
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
sour wraith
appreciate it @lost horizon
lost horizon
@round mirage no life changing tips really, get used to the class/spec, read and understand the guide and then don't be shy to post up with questions
you're probably gonna run into snarky responses if you ask really simple questions but understand that people in here have probably seen those questions 100s of times
and even the simplest of questions should still get answered
dark crag
fickle obsidian
stable island
for Zul's Dark Revelation does cloak of shadows also remove the aoe damage to the raid or no?
safe matrix
no
it for all intents and purposes just causes the ability to go off early, and make you immune to your damage component
simple rivet
!pvp
should you stack verse in pvp
buddy is telling me yes, but everything I read says its the worst stat
simple rivet
Ah good call. Thanks
fluid mist
@stable island if you are going to cloak it off make sure you still do that on The edge of The platform and not while standing in The raid btw
sand ledge
Running 2x Blade of fan and 1x shrouded suff 383 equipped the deeps feels good
hybrid chasm
would you guys (in a low energy situation) rather cast low cp envenom for EP uptime during burst (exsanguinate) or lose some uptime during the burst & have 4+ cp envenoms?
clever niche
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
austere scarab
CT as finisher worth at X targets, where X = ?
spice surge
3 for dot upkeep, 4 for cp dump
austere scarab
tyvm
yep
helping a weekend group with Zek, they got no aoe
so I'm thinking it's fine to use until adds are dead? lol
dark crag
Go outlaw
safe matrix
The adds don't really live super long
Outlaw is the best at dealing with the warriors and sub is the best at dealing with the weavers
tough lantern
in Shrine should i swap out a SS for Echoing?
primal gazelle
follow your heart
jagged yoke
do u guys spam envenom at max points? or wait for elaborate planning?
sour wraith
it doesn't hurt to wait unless you would cap energy afaik
jagged yoke
ah ok so its not that bad to do either really?
steep obsidian
if you spec tb you want to fit as many envenoms in as poss in that window
strange lichen
so when simming, it's showing double dose and twist the knife are better than SS and EB, do you guys think simming is correct? just wondering cause pretty much every log i see, sin rogues all have at least 1 SS trait
rustic ether
for P U R E single target yes shrouded suffocation can fall behind form double dose
@strange lichen
primal gazelle
ss is good cos it’s versatile and offers both ST and aoe value, that’s why most rogues use it
fair blaze
@strange lichen also its smoother to play with 1 SS
deep glacier
so I am main sub and I really enjoy it but i cant for the love of god understand how to play assa.. am i stupid
solid nova
What part of the guide in terms of rotation do you find unclear?
shy drum
2x DD X1 archive or x1 dd x1 archive x1ss for raids
brave gyro
I personally like having at least x1 SS, but
lapis chasm
what azertite traits are good for M+ ?? Still SS ?
brave gyro
EB is good too
fair blaze
Ss, eb, sob on forti weeks
slim hemlock
Do you use CT in single target?
slim hemlock
Pretty new to this class, just chckin
strange lichen
Would anybody look at my logs? I recent changed from outlaw..I did heroic taloc just see what I could do. With my gear, I thought I would destroy it..but didn’t. So I’m obviously doing something wrong..any help would be great.
merry orbit
Just wonderig, how you use Exa inside rotation? I mean you refresh rupture and garrote?
Yes
fair blaze
Exsanguinate?
strange lichen
fair blaze
Try to refresh your dots to max duration using pandemic
@strange lichen you fit only 1 envenom in your tb window, also u mutted three times
merry orbit
So always make full duration with pandemic, and then press exanguinate? Can anyone confirm that too?
fair blaze
Finish at 4+ CP
@merry orbit tbh its the best wat to use, but if your garrote is longer than half duration and rapture is longer than 20s is acceptable to press exsa
@strange lichen if u use subterfuge, cast 2 garrotes after vanish to have 24sec with emp garrote
unkempt solstice
I've been trying the maxdps addon for rogues, and it seems like there's alot of time when i'm just waiting to hit 80 energy to envenom.. is that normal?
fair blaze
@unkempt solstice probably your addon pool energy for EP uptime
unkempt solstice
rotation is actually alot slower then I expected.
merry orbit
We dont have too much crit and haste, to get energy
unkempt solstice
I'm trying to shoot for Double Dose and all my azerite pc's till I get at least 5 stacks of the uldir buff, and even then that's only good in uldir, i guess?
unkempt solstice
Archive isn't as good as DD without the uldir buff though, right?
unkempt solstice
should I be shooting for aoe traits, or single target, assuming 1 set of gear?
merry orbit
Get shrouded sucfocation it's best allrounder
unkempt solstice
I have TtK, SS, and DD right now
fair blaze
For example 2 SS and 1 archive is pretty good on m+
And pretty good on raid
But it will probably force you to play exsanguinate
unkempt solstice
Yeah, i'm not sure how Exsan works, so i haven't tryed it yet.
I'm using a 2,2,1,2,3,2,1 build right now
fair blaze
Well
In easy way
Exsang reduce your dots duration
To half of them
But they still
Do the same dmg
As dots with full duration
And value of exsa is increased with SS and vice versa
unkempt solstice
sounds like it forces you to reapply dots more often.
fair blaze
Yep
Is it bad?
Still if you want to do dungeons you will need to switch to exsa cause its better
TB isnt as worth as exsa at m+ scenarios
Just get yourself a good weakaura and get used to dots
And you will be fine after few days of playing 😉
crimson condor
So... just ran about 10 FH keys at 10+ trying to get titanforged dice. Then I go help carry a friend through a +2 FH and get ilvl 360 titanforged dice....
Et tu, Blizzard?
that's the way to put a positive spin on it 😄
strange python
Hi on what affixes and Dungeons we are playing CT and on what we are playing poison bomb.
spice surge
!ct
prisma monolithBOT
There is no specific week or affix that makes one or the other more viable.
CT vs PB is mainly down to your group, the dungeon itself and your pull sizes, with PB naturally having an edge in boss fights.
It's mainly the combination of affixes and dungeons that favour one or the other. High Tyr KR/Temple favour PB in general, due to low pulls and harder bosses.
In terms of Exsang vs TB; Exsang wins since it works well with SS traits and it's only 1 global on your priority target for some burst damage and extra energy.
TB usually locks you to that target to gain the most out of it.
green pollen
anyone there?
civic palm
Nope.
civic palm
After the opener segment you mean?
lost horizon
Line up with vendetta
green pollen
but what does it exactly mean
civic palm
It's in the guiiiiide.
placid beacon
Question guys, do you clip Elaborate Planning or do you spam and not look at it?
lost horizon
It means hold vendetta til vanish comes off CD, then use them
@placid beacon clipping is better
Only spam if you would otherwise cap energy
placid beacon
Cool thanks, just wanted reassurance
civic palm
Mostly make sure EP stays up during the times in which you have heightened damage.
green pollen
@lost horizon yeah i get this, but after using them together just follow standard rotation?
lost horizon
If you use two 2min CDs together
They'll come off CD together
So you don't even need to stress they'll just line up next time
green pollen
sure, but right after popping both of them im just doing normal rotation, right? keeping rupture and garrote up, building cp for envenom, using toxic blade on cd and so on
civic palm
Yeah nothing changes other than you have a small burst of energy.
So you will get more finishers during that time.
lost horizon
You should also make sure you get a full TB window into vendetta as well
Or an exsang
civic palm
considering the duration of Vendetta and the low CD of TB that should be relatively simple
lost horizon
I've seen people hit TB with 10sec left on vendetta CD 🤷
civic palm
mmm
green pollen
ok, last think: during the opener im using vendetta after first rupture and vanish when garrote is <5.4sec so that means vendetta will be up to use again before vanish
do i just wait for vanish and pop them both?
civic palm
Yeah just wait, though most fights don't last that long nowadays.
spice surge
sidenote: After you've cast garrote from stealth (so either on pull or with vanish) you need to let garrote tick out completely and NOT refresh it at 5.4
Because if you refresh it at 5.4 you will lose the empowerement on those 5.4 seconds or just lose 5.4 empowered garrote seconds
lost horizon
If you're not using SS you don't double garrote anyway though
spice surge
Well you can, the difference is abysmal small, but the alternative that isnt double garroting is using garrote out of stealth and then vanish garroting for a full dot
cobalt flame
Are the sims for new raid available somewhere or is it too early? Idk if it can be simmed properly from ptr or something
for trinkets i mean mainly
civic palm
Not yet, wait till the 22nd for accurate information.
will probably take 24hrs or so to update the lists
spice surge
They typically do some sort of balancing update like a week or so before, so most sims done before become fairly obsolete.
civic palm
Yeah.
spice surge
Hence the wait, to see if there are some changes
civic palm
There is a crit trinket that I can't see being bad though.
They could nerf the values and ruin it though > _>
Will see.
spice surge
Its just awkward timing on it, it has like 1 min and 40s cd if you want to use it at max stacks
civic palm
Yep
spice surge
Maybe TB can finally have a friend with equally odd cooldown
civic palm
Imagine tracking a trinket unironically O _O
royal lantern
i hope there 2 trinkets that are actually good this tier
dont want too farm GCB and dice for the entire expac
haughty flame
++
shy drum
It’s a little hard to catch up, an opening on a boss should be double garrotes, wait for garrote to finish. Vanish then double garrotes and pop vendetta ?
civic palm
Pretty sure that is covered in the guide, especially when to use Cooldowns, though it can change depending on the encounter you are on.
civic palm
AGI is safe, Bursting is fine for entirely Single Target use.
timid cradle
ok thanks
brisk frost
does exsanguinate also boost dagger in the back? it's a bleed effect also
lost horizon
i don't believe so
yeah definitely does not impact ditb
is it bad that i went and checked?
ebon tapir
for TW which lego would you use other than Mantle. Ravenholdt?
storm canopy
In M+, how many targets do you start to spam CT instead of rupturing everything?
civic palm
You ain't CTing shit without the energy from Rupture.
storm canopy
right, i meant after a few ruptures
you dont want to rupture 12 targets id assume
you just rupture enough to sustain energy, no?
civic palm
Most of the time people are asking when you CT over ENVENOM and not Rupture.
civic palm
Either way, you want your ~35NRG/s so you can FoK on GCD, and then after ~7 targets CT comes closer to winning out over your Envenom DMG.
You're gonna have to see where it settles FOR YOURSELF though.
Just see how much your ENV is doing on Average, and how much the initial hit from CT is doing.
spice surge
@civic palm Upfront CT damage is higher than envenom at 4
civic palm
Your Mastery/AGI/VERS/etc. is going to move those numbers around a little.
astral plover
Can some1 please help me with this https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/5GdW7AdzqSqN7RgdHZ6VBw
Is it even worth doing this
latent sorrel
not sure what you want help with, but you should try simming that gear with master assassin
strange python
Hello guys, do you have some tips for vectis mm for rogue ?
dark crag
Kill add, don't stack debuff too high
You can cloak before vector expires and don't get a stack
ancient sonnet
is it normal for PB to sim like 800dps higher than CT for dungeon slice?
dark crag
The sim mobs don't step out of pb
dark crag
Also set amount of targets, some dungeons have different target counts per affix
Per pull
Can you please change your avatar to a not cursed image?
fluid mist
Killed mythrax tonight 😄 any tips for ghuun? We have 4 raid days left :p
dark crag
Everyone needs to learn to run orbs
fluid mist
Is that even doable in 12 hours
pastel wasp
ghuun itself isnt really hard
just things can go wrong very easily
real fight starts in P3
lost horizon
@fluid mist it's doable, but not likely if you're getting there this late
People can't fuck up
fluid mist
Well we shall see i’d settle for 7/8 basically had to replace half The roster due to people quitting etc
And we only raid 2 days so CE next tier Will do 😄
jaunty crystal
4 raid days is gonna be real tough, but I wish you good luck.
dmg really only matters in p3 so try to have your CDs up for that of course. Other than that try to have the soak/NoSoak weakaura so you don't get MCd 😛
if there are bursting boils during a blood feast and you can't soak try to be in the middle of the feast
I've seen lots of people get MC'd during feast lol
if you get infested try to get away from people and ask for a dispell
surreal solar
SS better than Archive/LaserMatrix without uldir?
safe matrix
first stack of SS?
surreal solar
yeah
safe matrix
and yeah
typically
SS isn't the strongest trait on ST, but there isnt a whole lot of ST focused content outside of raid
and SS is really strong in m+
surreal solar
should i stack it until we get the 4 trait pieces?
*guild is done raiding, we do M+ alot tho
safe matrix
for m+, EB and SS are the best two traits
it kinda depends I think
SS is definitely better with the smaller pulls of some dungeons, but it will always be relevant
so 🤷
desert vault
I have it where I can run 2x SS and 1x NP on Tyrannical and 2x SS and 1x EB on fortified weeks. I'm liking that setup.
rustic ether
how strict is feints "aoe" jurisdiction?
is it just ground animations? or is it also raid wide dmg like grongs tantrum?
safe matrix
its typically raidwide damage too
I think blizzard has made a few things not proc it though
rustic ether
i need to get better at using feint. i havent had it on my bars and im hitting 15 keys lol
midnight vortex
PB or CT for underrot this week?
quick echo
!ct
prisma monolithBOT
There is no specific week or affix that makes one or the other more viable.
CT vs PB is mainly down to your group, the dungeon itself and your pull sizes, with PB naturally having an edge in boss fights.
It's mainly the combination of affixes and dungeons that favour one or the other. High Tyr KR/Temple favour PB in general, due to low pulls and harder bosses.
In terms of Exsang vs TB; Exsang wins since it works well with SS traits and it's only 1 global on your priority target for some burst damage and extra energy.
TB usually locks you to that target to gain the most out of it.
safe matrix
probably CT since its teeming
depends what level though, you might need boss damage
if so take PB
rustic ether
KR ToS and Seige prolly want PB
midnight vortex
How many ilvls is it worht to go down for shrouder suffocation?
kindred cedar
Any bis azerite list for new raid available yet?
dark crag
Since 370 azerite is easy obtainable, i would say 15
kindred cedar
Saw the azerite list in announcements, but what piece is the to go for each slot? any of them better or they all equal?
sturdy python
You are doing M+ and have never used Feint?
YOu have done your healers a disservice
primal gazelle
Cheat death got nerfed in 8.1 so you better get used to using feint with elusive
spice surge
Or if you dont just use leeching
pastel wasp
eh
spice surge
4Head
latent field
Nerf?
spice surge
It doesnt reset on death
pastel wasp
oh thats fine
sturdy python
Ofc but Feint is baseline and useful in many ways, not having it on your bars is crazy
And Elusive has its uses
latent field
No doubt, feint is strong
primal gazelle
Feint with elusive is kinda mandatory in most high keys
sturdy python
I dont think thats true, I see people running cheat death in most
Things like KR its needed though
latent field
Think it’s dependent on the dungeon and the affixes
latent field
What?
sturdy python
Have never had that issue lol
primal gazelle
Proc*
sturdy python
Unless I stand in multiple big things
primal gazelle
You can die to a dot that ticks immediately after the proc
sturdy python
The point is for it to save you from you screwing up
latent field
Or to take a big hit
primal gazelle
i use feint religiously to mitigate everything
sure i can just yolo dps without it
pale agate
I'm kind of torn on cheat death. on one hand it has definitely saved entire runs for me. on the other hand it's often a dead proc.
sturdy python
You shouldnt be getting hit that often
latent field
How much energy are you dumping into feint?
sturdy python
Elusive is good for single target abilities you cannot avoid and are unhealable
No not literally
primal gazelle
how is that not the point
when youre doing high keys and any mechanic can one shot you
sturdy python
The point is cheat death vs elusive
And youre arguing cheat death isnt taken in high keys
which isnt true
primal gazelle
so you try your best to mitigate and help out your healer
sturdy python
Ok, sell elusive vs cheat death to me in Freehold
latent field
Cheat death is better for unavoidable one shots
primal gazelle
LOL
2nd boss
powder shot
hits for 120k
1st boss, azerite shot
also hits for 120k
at 17+ keys
how do you not use elusive for that?
pale agate
i thought base feint already worked on azerite shot?
pale agate
it is targeted but it';s also an aoe
primal gazelle
the poison pool spawns same time as a azerite shot, if you dont pre-feint and you get shit rng you will be 1 shot
latent field
There are other good buttons to help with these mechanics
primal gazelle
same with powder shot, if you get hit by a keg smash same time as powder, also 1 shot
elaborate on these "other good buttons" that youre referring to
primal gazelle
that video was before the nerf
sturdy python
...
primal gazelle
not really, cheat death saves u once
verbal blaze
it's important to note that elusiveness gets it's power from SINGLE TARGET abilities
primal gazelle
azerite shot is every 8 seconds
verbal blaze
so like frost bolts, or like bleeds
primal gazelle
cant save you a 2nd time
verbal blaze
otherwise in the case of like powder shot, elusiveness is only giving you a small DR increase
verbal blaze
still good, but probably not cheat death good
sturdy python
Youre using it on CD
sturdy python
To prevent every other azerite shot?
Without even knowing if elusiveness is required to work?
pale agate
@verbal blaze how does elusiveness benefit you in the powder shot case? I thought you were already getting the 40% DR from aoe in the base version. are you saying you get additional DR on top of that if you take elusiveness?
primal gazelle
pretty sure powder shot is a single target ability
pale agate
oh sorry I was thinking azerite shot from the 1st boss
verbal blaze
yes it's multiplicative, I don't know exact numbers nowdays but that's how it worked in the past
if both the AoE and the elusiveness proc both work on a mechanic
dark crag
It is divided now
verbal blaze
is it?
dark crag
Elusive is only single dmg
verbal blaze
if that's true then elusivness is actually useless on AoE mechanics
primal gazelle
isnt that obvious from the tooltip?
verbal blaze
fair enough, I'll take your word on it, I just came back to rogue after shelfing it in tomb
pale agate
it can't work on the same mechanic right? because that would then mean the mechanic is both AoE and non-AoE at the same time
dark crag
Yes
civic palm
If the AoE has a hit and a DoT it would mitigate both components.
pale agate
oh good point, that's actually pretty common
dark crag
The dot tick
sturdy python
IDK All Im saying is Elusive has its place but saying its required at high keys is pretty misleading
dark crag
15 sec cd
sturdy python
As its not being played more even after nerf
civic palm
That due to CD not having a meaningful nerf to its overkill absorption.
dark crag
To be honest the def row is so busted since bfa
sturdy python
Exactly
Cheat Death still does its job
If it needs to do its job more than once every 6 minutes then either unluck or bad
civic palm
That or your item level is too low/content is too hard.
or your healer doesn't have group CDs.
etc.
primal gazelle
cheat death only saves you from one hit, if theres another mechanic/spell coming your way, its useless
sturdy python
Not true
primal gazelle
saves you from an azerite shot, but you can die to the poison on the ground immediately afterwards
civic palm
Cloak it you potato.
sturdy python
DR for seconds after as well
primal gazelle
or saves you from one frost blast in an aoe pack of 10+ but you get hit by the barrage and die anyways
sturdy python
All of that is normal Feint
civic palm
Rogue has the most broken defensive options, use them.
The idea that CD even reset on death was madness IMO.
sturdy python
Maybe not azerite shot
One key has elusiveness in the top 10
Guess which one
And as for Azerite shot the tooltip says its an aoe cone
Its just pointed toward a player
civic palm
and then cast and as melee there's enough time to not get hit.
spice surge
Except when feint and cloak doesnt work 😄
plain ferry
does feint work on the mythrax raid dmg when people leave the voids?
dark crag
Yes
plain ferry
nice... ty
pale agate
btw is it possible to vanish in order to cancel azerite shot if he targets you?
civic palm
IIRC it's begins being cast the moment it targets you yeah?
steep obsidian
there is enough time to pop a cd
pale agate
I thought he looks at you for a split second before the shot goes off
steep obsidian
before you get hit i think
civic palm
Yeah but it doesn't track you ye?
steep obsidian
it targets you if thats what you mean?
pale agate
hmm not sure. it would be more likely to work if it DID track you though right?
civic palm
No I mean the cone tracks you.
steep obsidian
i have no idea about the question though i dont do m+ enough
civic palm
So it;
civic palm
- Targets your character.
- Is then stationary.
- You can move without dragging the cone with you.
steep obsidian
i watched a vid coz i was curious the only thing i saw was ranged standing max ranged because it doesn't seem to reach that far
might be an idea if healer struggling
civic palm
Because you forget to repair them and die constantly.
rustic ether
i literaly fucking repaired and died 2 times in WM
spice surge
Gotta move out of the yellow goo at drangleic castle
civic palm
Gotta drop your FPS to 30FPS so you're not losing durability hitting the ground 👌
balmy stump
you guys use toxic blade and poison bomb for m+?
rustic ether
for small pull dungeons
balmy stump
i feel like the exan + crimson is annoying
rustic ether
it all depends on key levels and what your tank is pulling
balmy stump
like 13+
average pulls i guess
how much is the difference in dps if i prefer TB+p bomb
civic palm
If you use Crimson Tempest poorly PBOMB will be an increase.
rustic ether
@balmy stump if youre tank is pulling more than one groups form time to time in the dungeon i feel like thats a good sign that you can swithc to CT
as for exsanguinate its better than TB most often than not
TB locks you in on a target for 9 seconds to do the same dmg as exsang does but you can change targets once you use exsang
cerulean junco
Is 2 Echo and 1 SS ideal for m+?
civic palm
It can be.
cerulean junco
Ok thanks
prisma monolithBOT
There is no specific week or affix that makes one or the other more viable.
CT vs PB is mainly down to your group, the dungeon itself and your pull sizes, with PB naturally having an edge in boss fights.
It's mainly the combination of affixes and dungeons that favour one or the other. High Tyr KR/Temple favour PB in general, due to low pulls and harder bosses.
In terms of Exsang vs TB; Exsang wins since it works well with SS traits and it's only 1 global on your priority target for some burst damage and extra energy.
TB usually locks you to that target to gain the most out of it.
tribal marlin
Hello so I came here few days ago to make sure I wasn't doing wrongs. I was asking if I should spam CT on big pulls or try to rupture everything because I was not sure.
I just checked a full sample sequence on raidbot with 10 targets patchwerk and I saw that raidbot rupture as most enemies as possible and use garrote on CD.
My question is : is it a high win ? and if no, do you have any idea how many dps you loose when just spamming CT and rupturing to get energy ?
primal gazelle
10 target sims isn’t really optimized for aoe, it still needs work imo
tribal marlin
yes I was guessing that too
primal gazelle
It focus a bit on dealing “priority” dmg as well
tribal marlin
but it still does rupture on 6 target and also garrote
I almost never use non-empower garrote
primal gazelle
idk what the number is but I personally don’t garrote if there’s 4 targets or more
As for ruptures, just keep up enough that you’re getting at least 35 energy per second, enough to spam fok, I think 5-6 ish?
tribal marlin
yep should be 5 for 35/tic
graceful hawk
shrouded mantle or resounding protection for pvp?
tribal marlin
the sample sequence only use rupture on 6 target but it also refreshing it in pandemic (was 2mn sim) AND use garrote on CD so CT was only once every 10-12sec
primal gazelle
Towards the end of the pack when mobs are at below 30% health, I don’t bother keeping up 5-6+ ruptures anymore, just spam fok and ct, as the mobs die you’ll gain enough energy to keep spamming
tribal marlin
yes I see
I'm trying to optimize my dps for high pushes
I feel like I do good but not best
primal gazelle
Sometimes I even 5 pt rupture a dying add just for the full energy bar for more fok spam
primal gazelle
Oh lol
tribal marlin
I play sub when I can on fortified 😄
Sin on tyrannical because sub ST is garbage
I mean if you play sectec and co
also i'm NE so I get a lot of value with 3XSS
primal gazelle
I just like padding meters
tribal marlin
haha ok ok
Well i'm doing 18-20k ish on overall but I think I win a lot of overall damage on bosses
primal gazelle
ss only scales up to 3 targets
graceful hawk
hello guys i hate to interrupt but im at a snag with my azerite power choice for my shoulders on tier 3.. would you recommend shrouded mantle over Resounding Protection or vice versa? i am looking do to optimal survival in PVP
primal gazelle
Eb pads for wah more
Why do 18-20k when you can do 22-24 😛
Ofc most of it is meaningless dmg
But still fun in my book
tribal marlin
playing shit like 3eb 2 SoB 1crit trait seems quite fun for next season
imagine rupturing 5-6 mobs then you only spam FoK for like 6sec with Vanish into meld
primal gazelle
does meld proc MA?
primal gazelle
OP
primal gazelle
I wonder if it’s worth to keep rupturing if you have 3 traits of sob
tribal marlin
or 1 vanish every pack
It's probably even worth rupturing with 2-3 cp xD
With 3xSoB at 385 you get 400agi/rupture
at 6rupture it's 2500 agi it seems quite insane
imagine the dps if you open 6rupture into vanish + meld for 6 garrote (with 3SoB + 3SS)
lethal vapor
I tend to do fairly well dps wise when it comes to overall parses but when it comes to item level they just flat out stink. Many thanks to anyone willing to take on a noob and make him better.
steep obsidian
you will probably get a better response if you ask something specific
lethal vapor
Specifically what am I doing so wrong compared to others at my item level range. Is it a gear issue, bad rotation, a skill issue,...perhaps all of the above. I can take the critiques...I really just want to improve.
steep obsidian
you aren't going to get a good ranking as sin even if you play perfect with a group that takes ages to kill the boss es
especially at your ilvl
lethal vapor
So a quick look in your opinion is that its more our raid group as a whole taking longer then normal to kill bosses?
steep obsidian
from the log i looked at you arent doing anything that wrong
¯_(ツ)_/¯
not wasting cp opener looked ok although i dunno why youd run dagger in the back and swirling but if they sim the best for you thats fine i guess
lethal vapor
Yeah I wish I had better traits at my 390 gear. Is it worth farming 375s with better traits?
steep obsidian
wait
why are you casing poision knife
you aren running the trait that gives you stacks to castit?
lethal vapor
oh Taloc only when I have to go at range and cant be at melee on elevator.
Usually I run in and melee make the healers heal me.
lethal vapor
Appreciate all your help. One last question. Do you happen t know off hand if it is best for me to go back and farm better traits even if its 375 gear vs my current 390 gear for azerite pieces that is?
lethal vapor
Thanks again Deadbod.
terse rune
Hey guys, i got a question. I had a break with playing wow and I am wondering why many top assa rogues only have about 7% haste now? last time I played, everyone was stacking haste and now are people socketing mastery/crit? what has changed?
latent field
Are you looking at raids or m+?
low junco
in multi target fights you prioritise mastery/crit
latent field
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
low junco
you are probably checking m+ players
terse rune
oh yeah they probably had their m+ gear equipped^^
stark mirage
Anyone using raidbots Dungeon (BETA) option for simming m+ ?
fringe narwhal
This is a randoms opinion but looking at dungeon slice it focuses on too long of a boss fight and too many small cleave (2-3) pulls
unkempt osprey
Does poison bomb trigger the lightning shield on Aspix + Adderis ?
slim hemlock
Probably would
unkempt osprey
Figured the rogue I was watching used cloak, thanks anyway my man
slim hemlock
I honestly don't know for sure, my splitting ice cleave on my mage cucked me once.
And frozen orb that was cast before the shield was on.
sturdy python
Tank should be pulling them apart though
fringe narwhal
Ya cleave usually does
fringe narwhal
Ya sometimes had similar issues with many classes in legion due to almost every class having passive cleave.
vernal shadow
Anyone else having SIM favor crit a lot more? To the point that my AOT is procing crit lol
cold tulip
Hi, i am looking for a Weakaura that tracks my bleed and shows how much my Exsang will do. The only one i found shows how much exang is doing when i popped it.
spice surge
Vendetta should be before the tb and envenom yeah
dense blaze
That potion
sturdy python
You're playing with subt or MA?
sturdy python
Tb yeah
dense blaze
so that is with TB, exsang is irrelevant
cold tulip
using TB is not good when specced into Exsang 😄
sturdy python
But it also doesn't garrote twice, was the previous garrote in pandemic?
dense blaze
It was in pandemic
slim hemlock
Are you supposed to garrote twice? :o
royal lantern
with ss yeha, free cp and longer buffed garrote timer
silk stump
you guys open like garrote garrote rupture or garrote rupture garrote? with SS
royal lantern
its in the guide if you check, garrote>rupture>garrote
cus then you sit at 3 CP for TB>envenom
slim hemlock
What if using esang (m+)
shy escarp
same thing I think. just instead of TB > envenom, you'd do Mut > Rupture > Exsang
slim hemlock
Does TB give CP? lol
shy escarp
it does
royal lantern
TB: garrote>rupture>garrote>vendetta>tb>envenom
exsang: garrote>rupture>garrote>vendetta>mulitate>rupture>exsang
correct me if i said something wrong
slim hemlock
Wish I could have my own personal pins for this kind of thing.
So when you exsang, do you still refresh on pandemic? Or does that replace the exsang buff?
silk stump
you let expire
royal lantern
dont replace bleeds when you used exsang
royal lantern
4 or more if they stay alive for a longer time
silk stump
for ST are you guys going DD + NP in the new pieces?
royal lantern
CT isnt really worth it when you do a m+ on a tyranical week with a dh and frostmage that burst shit down in 4sec as an example, it needs big pulls or enemys that stay alive for a longer time
slim hemlock
Oh actually another dumb question.
When are you supposed to vanish for better ST damage?
dark crag
After the opener to extend ss buffed garrottes and later in combination with vendetta
If specced ma you use vanish to pump envenoms into tb
sturdy python
The specific openers are in the guide also
royal lantern
@silk stump DD + NP are the best traits for pure ST right now yeha, but idk if stuff will change when the next balance patch before the raid comes out
sturdy python
And keep in mind there's very little pure St anymore
slim hemlock
Found the guide confusing, but I'll read it again as I get more familar with the spells
royal lantern
tbf, its weird, cus SS is good for burst aoe, but not really for raidfight aoe cus you need stealth/vanish for it and stuff like that
lost horizon
If the adds on that particular fight line up with vanish it's pretty nasty
royal lantern
yeha, but then you have fights like zekvos^^
ss is great for mythrax yeha, the 1st add spawn lines up with vanish garrote, wich is perfect
royal lantern
burst aoe yes,our sustained aoe is good
cerulean junco
Just started gearing up a rogue @blissful zinc6 getting energy starved any ideas? Keeping bleeds up
cerulean junco
Oh I gotcha more energy management. Thanks
lost horizon
You may also have low haste
cerulean junco
Think around 1050 or so. My crit is awful at mid 500s
uneven bolt
ty boi
lost horizon
@cerulean junco Crit helps a bit, but definitely follow your stat weights
Crit/haste impact the 'feel'
But you're going to have to play around energy, that's just how sin works
vivid bone
paper heron
When is ss worth dropping for eb. If I’m mostly running pugs m+ these days should I just stick with SS since pulls are generally not too big ? I’m running keys around 14/15 usually
wanton mortar
im going 2 ss 1 eb this week since its teeming and its a lot of big pulls
lost horizon
Probably safest assuming you can get restealths
primal gazelle
triple EB if u are a true padder like me
lost horizon
With pugs though you can't really get a feel for how big they'll pull, which is what EB really depends on
hot flume
What does EB stand for already pls ?
quaint flare
Echoing Blades
hot flume
Oh yeah thank you
cerulean junco
While we’re talking about EB I’m having to run 2x eb and 1x ss. Is there a point where it’s more valuable to spam knives with 2x EB
Didn’t see anything about it in pin
After your garrotes and ruptures up on priority targets
lost horizon
You mean without dumping CP ever?
lost horizon
Doesn't seem like it would be worth ever but I don't have sims or math to back it uo
I don't know offhand how much dmg EB gives strictly
But compare that against initial hit from CT and you can see if it would ever be worth
cerulean junco
I’ll do some digging tonight thanks for the help
spice sorrel
I think at a certain point it may be worth to just keep CT bleed up as one global of FoK won't be greater than the bleed from 10+ targets (or whatever that breakpoint is)
fringe narwhal
Ya I was thinking that whenever you reach that point if it does exist you would want CT
Which then it doesnt
sturdy python
There was a point pre nerf where finishing was a dps loss
But you see how OP that was, probably not reasonable now
violet sonnet
Should I drop my one SS for Reorig array when i raid?
Or just keep archive of the titans always
merry python
you want the buff always
pliant nest
so i hear ppl found a bug to exploit temple. can someone explain?
strange python
hello? any1 here
slow mortar
the 385 forest crit proc from ivus is minutely better than fathoms? showing anywhere from +0.1-0.5% (other trink is 385 gcb)
spice sorrel
You talking about skip for temple?
primal gazelle
the exploit is to clear the dungeon in m0 first
so all the doors/paths are cleared
then do it on a +20, dont kill any bosses, do last boss first, clear rest of the dungeon with the buff, ezclap
ops did i reveal too much
spice sorrel
And then get dat sweet sweet banhamma
fringe narwhal
That's probably not bannable or anything
spice sorrel
This is the freehold thing on steroids
primal gazelle
besides, the only thing to gain is IO score, which is meaningless in blizz's eyes
fringe narwhal
This is a bit more than that right? Wasn't the just skipping the pig and mini boss?
spice sorrel
It was just rp skipping
primal gazelle
clever use of game mechanics yolo
fringe narwhal
They care a tiny bit about leader boards
spice sorrel
Just like ole Ivus
fringe narwhal
That only works for working as intended
primal gazelle
ivus gave players obvious gains, like TR and free loot
doing this will only gain io score
fringe narwhal
No
primal gazelle
not like the 370 dungeon piece will get you anything lawl
fringe narwhal
Higher keys give more loot