lmao
#assassination
spice surge
tired thistle
Nope always just open with Garrote and its been happening in Arenas aswell as Raiding and its happening right now in ToT
primal gazelle
i heard theres an achievement for +15 in time for every dungeon in 8.1
is that true
short terrace
Why am I missing so many auto swings?
tired thistle
So even wierder its gives 1CP on the opener but if used again with Subterfuge the second one gives 3 cps...
short terrace
Why are my abilities getting parried by the training dummy?
civic palm
Stop standing in front of it.
short terrace
I'm not, I'm behind it
last crown
can someone take a look at my zek logs and tell me wtf im doing so wrong?
the lower dps rogue
civic palm
1 your traits are bad
Your weapons are 10 item levels lower.
He has six slots to your two slots.
Too be fair this isn't a complete fight either is it?
Wipe @ 45%.
wtf is this?
civic palm
Depends entirely on your current weights.
heavy briar
Im lacking hastes rn as i just leveled up my rouge
but people are bitching to get agi gems
civic palm
Crit is very safe if you use the same gear for M+ as you do for Raids.
heavy briar
when i think haste is better
civic palm
AGI is probably better or near your highest weight if it isn't AGI.
last crown
traits are the best i can get right now sadly, cant answer for what that is youre looking at, since i dont know what it is
last crown
might have been a shit tab
civic palm
Why are you casting Poison Knife at all though, is the issue here.
last crown
sharpened?
last crown
so...mostly gear the issue then?
last crown
right, but i cant do much about the gear i got so far
civic palm
It's good to have a plan for improving.
last crown
well right, but i can control if im misplaying, not what gear has dropped
civic palm
Your crit seems a little low what is that 20%?
last crown
yes
civic palm
Do you have other options for the DitB and Sharpened Blades traits?
last crown
yes, but they simmed much lower
civic palm
What are they though?
last crown
i could rearrange my traits to run Archive+Sharpened+Shrouded
but cant ditch sharpened, no shoulders
civic palm
DitB assumes 100% backstab in the sims.
So if you have something that is near it there's a good chance it's just better.
last crown
can run Archive+Sharpened+Laser
last crown
for shrouded yes
civic palm
Same item level?
civic palm
Yeah OP is pretty good even when you have like 30 fucking % haste.
No control over that though.
last crown
was simming almost 1% above any other options just because of overwhelming power
civic palm
Sure sure.
last crown
Think Archive/gut+Sharpened/gut+shrouded/gut is better than the current OP stack?
because of reality not allowing for the OP stack to really match up to sim?
civic palm
Will depend on your practical fight lengths as well as most run longer than the SIM time when you are progressing still.
last crown
seems my envenom damage is generally way down vs top parses as the biggest outlier, but my guess is that's due to weapons more than anything else
velvet kernel
Anyone want some help ?
little sandal
hey guys im on hearo damage and checking m+ traits and shrouded suffocation sims way more with mark for death why its that
clear vapor
around 18k would be my guess
errant mauve
what are you stats and traits/talents
strange python
coarse knot
I’m on my phone rn so I couldn’t link it
But I know my stats are like 23% crit 35% haste and like 28% mastery
strange python
20 crit 18 haste and 35 mastery
coarse knot
I’m talking with origination array
strange python
oh lol
coarse knot
If anyone has those stats without origination you’d be a god
errant mauve
SS heavy for fortified teeming I’d say
last crown
why the fuck is my dps so low what the fuck
coarse knot
Bad traits or bad staats
errant mauve
If go 2SS 1archive
coarse knot
Yep
last crown
i have okay traits and okay stats but 365/355 weapons
still dont think it should excuse blue parses, but maybe im underestimating gear
coarse knot
Bad rotation also
last crown
i look at top rogue parses and im doing almost the same amount of moves and at the same times, my damage is just nowhere near
errant mauve
Syrr what fights is sin optimal for in uldir mythic
coarse knot
Mm I only go sub for Zul
distant hinge
ya that what i thought for SS thought i read somewhere DD was good but that might have been for raids
last crown
i used to be a top10 US parsing rogue back in MoP pulling blue parses makes me want to jump off a building fuck
errant mauve
Word, that’s what I was thinkin... I need to@learn sub
distant hinge
i have 3 Archive so i stick with that for raids
errant mauve
I go 1archive 1 SS 1dd
In raid
I like having ss for opener
Although 2dd would probably dps higher for me I’d imagine
coarse knot
Yes
errant mauve
I just like how smoothe the opener is with ss
coarse knot
Tbh I’d always try to stack atleast 2 traits with 1 archive
I’d say DD is more of a TB build
distant hinge
so no 3 Archive for raids?
errant mauve
Yea, I should run exan more but I suck with it I think... I have 370 gcb 375 dice 385 spyglass for trinkets
coarse knot
Spyglass is insane from what I’ve heard I don’t have one
I have a DW and dice
Both 370
errant mauve
The spyglass upped my dps quite a bit
I run spyglass and dice atm for raid and M+ although I should use gcb for M+ most likely
coarse knot
Mmm trade dice for Gcb
errant mauve
Gcb and exan
errant mauve
Lol yea
I want to push keys this week but it seems like a nightmare
Teeming fortified with explosion lol
coarse knot
It’s not that bad with smart people tbh
errant mauve
Yeah I’m tryin to break 1500 atm
I’ve timed 15 Waycrest like 4 times I think and I got another 15 Waycrest key
Blizzard hates me
lone hamlet
Guys how do u split cds on fetid?
distant hinge
ya fuck this week
errant mauve
On cd typically right after a knockback or add kill
distant hinge
those 4 should never be together lol
errant mauve
It’s really not bad, just annoying
Especially if everyone isn’t workin on the explosions
lone junco
friendly reminder that if you are doing timewalk. this is hilarious.
distant hinge
ya i mean can still get a 10 but not 11-15 like last week lol
errant mauve
I need to go xmogging I have none
distant hinge
lol
supple hearth
how to get 100% active on mythic mother 🤔
civic palm
Man...
spring iron
winter moss
@spring iron haste > crit > mast = vers
cunning needle
what is the mythrax change?
velvet kernel
Orb does not spawn on melee
civic palm
characters flagged as melee
velvet kernel
What do u mean by that
safe matrix
hpals and mistweavers are considered melee
cunning needle
so mythrax you can have melee within 5 yards of each other
civic palm
No you just take your raid as is.
civic palm
Nah.
safe matrix
vast kelp
does anyone have a weak aura that tracks scent of blood stacks/how many ruptures you have up
civic palm
Yeah for Scent you can make your own I am pretty sure it's in the Templates.
For tracking Rupture itself there are some options on WAGO.
vast kelp
i mean i have a rupture timer just looking to track scent of blood stacks or how many ruptures i have ticking on big M+ pulls
either one will show me the same info, im just braindead with making weak auras lol
civic palm
Just check, super simple.
New > From Template
EZ menus from there.
Check for Scent itself.
random ice
does someone know a good assassination streamer ? for m+
bronze kelp
seliathan
most other rogues switch more often to sub for dungeons
incarnated is his twitch
random ice
ty
quick ice
Don't right click the boss on the way in?
civic palm
Don't macro Garrote with something dumb.
shut pollen
Someone has some quick advices for m zek encounter? Usually I play outlaw in hat fight but yesterday I was forced into Assa coz we were lacking boss damage in order to phase him.
harsh sphinx
if you wanna pad save vanish for triple garrot + CT for first add phase
shut pollen
It’s worth to spec into ct just for those 2 add phases?
I mean they die pretty quickly anyway
buoyant coyote
i havnt <.<
warm sable
dry thicket
If you wanna go for Boss dmg, go sub and focus Boss in add phases
quiet crescent
Dang that mythraxx hotfix
Could've a used that yesrday. Orb spawned in mythraxxs hitbox I never noticed it. I killingspree/bf him and add I pop in and out of the orb 5-6 times kill everyone swiftly
quick ice
yeah I love when bosses fat asses cover the entire mechanic 😃
quiet crescent
Everyone was like wtf was that. Our main tank was cracking up, was like I think it was poorly timed killingspree
high siren
is fetid doable with 6-7 melees? or does it rely on rng ?
edgy latch
fierce tinsel
hey guys, can you help me with Crimson Tempest? I haven't played it ever , only been using poison bomb so far, but now that I am doing 13+ keys, and especially this week I have a feeling that CT will be much better. I have 2 SS traits. So my question is: I triple garrote, then rupt ? or I triple garrote then CT ?
quick ice
My dodgy guild got fetid 1st kill with 7 @high siren.
high siren
okay, thanks guys
fierce tinsel
@lament dove so after 3ple garrote, I CT, then I FoK and apply rupture, FoK rupture etc? and before CT runs out I CT again? Something like that?
quiet crescent
I hear fetid is doable with that many melee. Wasn't for our guild. 😆
We went 4 melee and everyone else played their alt arcane mages
lament dove
@fierce tinsel something like that, yes
main blaze
stack them melee on mythrax yo
fierce tinsel
thanks 😃
worldly ledge
fierce tinsel
g g g CT garrote again ?
short arch
On fetid would you use tb or exsang on small adds? Also when you guys use CDs like vendetta or vanish? Im thinking about using vendetta on pull to have it ready at 2nd adds and use vanish on first add (ready for burn phase or third add if needed)
lost horizon
Sorta depends where your raid is having trouble
You wanna be flexible to fill in where you're having trouble
First adds all good? Then vendetta on pull and use on 2nd
Having trouble on first adds? Hold it and use it for 1st+3rd
2min CDs are nice and flexible like that
short arch
No problem on adds, I mean we already beat fetid but I want to up my overall dps.
lost horizon
If you're looking to pad then only use big CDs on big add since it'll last longer
Ideally don't get put on little adds at all
Or just use CDs on boss after 50% for better dmg lol
short arch
Yeah thought about saving second vendettas and vanish for burn phase
Though being on small add will still be suboptimal I guess
slender berry
just got this on my twink .. wtf
quasi ledge
Your "twink"? :p
cosmic pier
downed mythax after 16 wipes tonight, 80 total. that nerf was an actual joke
with only 6 melee and 2 melee healers
vague patrol
cosmic pier
also means melee can chase boss and keep tunneling until just before phase 2 big add spawns
lost horizon
I mean if you have few enough you can do that anyway and just be spread
Or well could* doesn't matter anymore
winter moss
mythrax is freeloot now, bring all the melees and no ranges
ez gg
only healers get bubble
topaz notch
u trolling? @winter moss
winter moss
no the mythrax hotfix: the mind control bubble no longer targeting melees
topaz notch
anyone know why wow anylzer dont support assassination rogue? i mean they support feral druid
thats a weird hotfix, what the hell
winter moss
because apl not updated
spice surge
@topaz notch Because they need somebody to be responsible and work on it
winter moss
and it's a lot of work
spice surge
and nobody has done it /want to do it. Assa wasnt supported through legion either
topaz notch
i dont know if theres another way for me to find out my average stat gains from trinkets
spice surge
95+% of players that ask for tips on their logs either use TB too infrequent (so like every 32 seconds instead of 25) and low uptime on their dots
winter moss
^
lost horizon
Rupture refresh in TB
winter moss
lost horizon
That's another one I see a lot
lone junco
Avg stat gain from trinket sounds a problem for like top gear.
winter moss
amen
topaz notch
well it shows me how good a trinket performs at a boss compared to another tho?
winter moss
well, the top 3 goto trinkets perform almost the same on every boss
topaz notch
anyways, its bad to refresh rupture during TB?
winter moss
yes
topaz notch
i kinda figured it doesnt matter since such high dmg is from dots
spice surge
Its minor, but its better not too, because your envenoms do more damage
If you let rupture fall of thats worse though ofc
winter moss
plan ahead: tb comes of cd in 5 sec, is rupture above 17 secs or nah?
if not refresh, bomb env in tb window
considering 17 sec is a huge window
spice surge
17 secs? hold up
spice surge
Thats just clipping an awful lot of rupture
winter moss
incl movement tho
topaz notch
where did u find the mythrax hotfix news? i cant seeme to find it
spice surge
No notes
winter moss
it's double the time
spice surge
Only updated ingame
spice surge
Wowhead posted about it
topaz notch
ahh
spice surge
People did the boss and realised melee wasnt getting targeted anymore
lost horizon
17 sec refresh yikes
winter moss
eg.: zek voz darkness
lost horizon
If TB is up in 5 and you have 17 sec of rupture, you'll TB with 12 sec remaining which is fine
winter moss
i cant im bad at movement 
winter moss
heck xd
sinful flint
When I have 5 CP (no DS) and garrote is not applied to the target, which is the better option: Refresh Garrote OR Envenom -> Garrote?
lost horizon
Don't let garrote fall off fully in the first place, unless it's snapshot
If snapshot, plan better
sinful flint
Its more about target switching
sinful flint
so 1 CP is worth more than 1 sec of garrote?
winter moss
one cp can be converted in 16% AP while 1 sec of garrote is 6%
sinful flint
I see, thanks for the actual answer I was looking for
winter moss
but we hav pandemic timers so
lone hamlet
Guys do u refresh your gar/rupture prior to exang if both are at ~15 sec
sinful flint
Rupture yes Garrote no
Rupture total timing is 32 sec, you would be wasting half of that when its at 15
winter moss
garrote is 18 sec
quick mafs
losing 3 secs
hell im bored at work, im sorry for my unuseful sentence
sinful flint
Garrote is actually 23.sth with pandemic
winter moss
yeah with pandemic
lost horizon
My 23 wasn't meant as a correction btw not that anal, just mobile is slow
sinful flint
thats why rupture is 32 not 24
winter moss
yeah but pandemic starts @ 5.4secs
so if you refresh you will lose 9.6 secs if ~15secs dot
sinful flint
Yeah because 18*1.3 = 23.4
Refreshing rupture is def. worth it because you're essentially doubling the strength
winter moss
rupture definitely
sinful flint
Depending on whether you have high CP refreshing garrote will be too
winter moss
yeah but thats a very exact scenario
winter moss
so we both argue the same point
winter moss
you're right
tropic pike
Could someone please help me understand what I am doing wrong?
Log for Mother
My PC froze in second room so it got a little bit scuffed but otherwise i believe i tried my best and would like to get better
weak tundra
don't pick crimson tempest on mother
lost horizon
I'd recommend a different fight as an example
Mother has a lot of downtime which makes it really annoying to sift through logs for
Though I'm on mobile so I'm fucked either way
spice surge
He just sat on boss all fight though
weak tundra
also, your opener is wrong, you exsang even before vendetta
tropic pike
I was last group
lost horizon
Oh did he? Lmao nvm
weak tundra
might want to check ravenholdt guide for that
also no second rupture application before exsang for the longer duration
on your second vendetta you rupture after popping exsang, idk
tropic pike
yeah that was due to lag
spice surge
@tropic pike Your uptimes on rupture/garrote are fairly bad, they should be 95%+
You missed a cast of exsang because you didnt use exsang on cd, same with vendetta/vanish
weak tundra
easily fixed by reading up on guide and practicing on a dummy
tropic pike
I was hesitant to rupture in vendetta because wouldnt i get a shorter buffed garotte?
since im running 3x ss aswell
weak tundra
you want to apply your bleeds beforehand
tropic pike
i recorded my fetid but no file was created :X
was using/combatlog
deleted the file after mother tho so is that maybe why?
dapper moat
So better to use vanish an vendetta on cooldown, if u are uncertain theres time to wait both to come off and use together?
spice surge
They have the same cooldown, barring the opener where you use vanish 15~ seconds after vendetta you always use them together
rigid shadow
My rogue is currently 351 equipped, but I still hold onto my 330 Shoulders for that Shrouded Suffercation. Not sure if this is worth, it seems really good. Other talents I currently have acces to is Double Dose - Thunderous Blast and Poisoned Wire.
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@winter moss
zinc zephyr
how many trash mobs do you guys rupture up? I'm using 1xSS trait, exang, CT
strange python
Probably max 5 because of energy overflow
But if you run Scent, as much as possible
how fundamental is CT>PB in m+
because i hate the play style of it so much
like how much more dmg in overall do you think it's gonna be
is it insanely massive as to where i should just force myself to get good with it
or is PB not class breaking
Depends how ur group pulls
lost horizon
You should learn to play CT
If you're okay with not getting the most out of your setup though just play with what you like
dusky inlet
PB is % proc though?
I actually meant to run CT last night to compare, will do today
Seems like a no brainer on fort with big pulls or even normal pulls in like freehold
next maple
Hi guys ! i've a question about trinkest. Wich trinket is the best in Uldir MM, with an exsang/PB spec ? I have : Gladiator's badge 370 // Harlan Dice 360 // Construct overcharger 385 // Fathom 355
I ask this because i have different results between Sim & bloodmallet
next maple
Raidbot tell me Overcharger is the best, but this trinket have 0 value on B M
wheat zealot
What trinkets are best for you can vary
next maple
okok
marble hemlock
no
pop vendetta on pull, vanish first add, vendetta 2nd add, vanish 3rd add, vendetta on boss-burn
is the "optimal" use of CDs imo
(assuming youre on the big add)
stable oxide
Are we talking about logging? or killing the boss?
Kinda depends on how your group does the boss and when the bloodlust is used
And if we are talking about getting high logs or killing the boss 😛
I mean, my guildleader was furious when he saw me using vendetta at the start xD
Cause wants me to use it at the first and third add 😛
In my guild we do, Cooldowns on first add - bloodlust on second add- cooldowns and pot on third add.
stable oxide
The only problem on mythic fetid is damage on the adds
slim olive
Depends if you want to vanish double garotte the boss and add which might not always be possible
stable oxide
and with SS you will have more burst damage where its needed
slim olive
^ That too
slim olive
I've found as Sin on Fetid a lot of our damage is easily lost
stable oxide
now my guild does 2 adds
slim olive
aka add's dying too fast and shit
There is a reason why a lot of sin rogues are put on the big add
But it entirely depends on your raid comp and what your raid needs
Regarding prog
stable oxide
Sin rogues are put on the big add because vendetta is a huge waste on small adds
slim olive
yeah
stable oxide
and melee running around is not good on fetid
spice surge
If you're on small adds you might aswell just play outlaw or sub tbh
stable oxide
cause you can be blocked by people with the debuff
marble hemlock
assa is pretty decent on small adds actually
stable oxide
Subtlety is really good for small adds
marble hemlock
sub is decent, but very crit-RNG heavy
so for progression i suggest asking for a spot on big add, or if youre on the small one, just spec TB and play it similar to how you do vectis
stable oxide
I've seen logs where sub are actually doing more than arcane mages on small adds
opaque grotto
@marsh bloom if you don’t care about parsing I ran 2x DD and MA for our fetid kill and used vendetta on 1st and 3rd adds
We lusted 2nd add
delicate crater
If using Double Dose with MA, do we just use the non-SS opener in the Ravenholdt guide? nothing "special" for the trait?
marsh bloom
I don't use DD
spice surge
Yeah, DD doesnt affect the rotation at all
opaque grotto
Well, do you use MA?
marsh bloom
no
opaque grotto
What traits do you use
marble hemlock
sub can go super ham on small ones, or do shit damage if none of the evis crits
marsh bloom
I use 385 Meticulous/375 Archive
opaque grotto
Are you sitting on big add?
marsh bloom
I use one DD
marble hemlock
anyway, i feel that if youre asked to pop your big CDs on adds just so they die, that means your overall dps might suck so youre not gonna kill the boss if everyone has to expend every cd on the adds
we usually do CDs on first, pots on second, BL on third
marsh bloom
I haven't touched the boss yet
opaque grotto
Nah, my guild does cd’s on first, lust on second, cd’s/pots on third and the burns the boss with plenty of time left
marsh bloom
we kill theb ig add last
opaque grotto
Yea but you should have a few dps dedicated to only hitting the big add
marble hemlock
well, most guilds split CDs so you have some up for every add, at least thats how you had to do it early into progression
opaque grotto
Like me and 2 affliction locks sit on the big add and then we split the raid between the other 2 adds
marble hemlock
so we had hunters+mages blasting 1st/3rd add, DH do 2nd or something along those lines, usually taking into account the CD-timers so people could still pop them once on boss at the end
opaque grotto
That only matters really if you care about parsing
The boss is at like 35-40% before we kill the 3rd set of adds
So we can comfortably kill him without CDs
marble hemlock
not really concerned about parses, but thats what was necessary to kill the boss back when we were first progressing it so it wouldnt eat the 4th eggs
opaque grotto
We do the safest strat possible so we don’t spend an hour reclearing him
marble hemlock
im sure the gear upgrades and everything made the boss a lot easier now, we just dont like changing strats for parses or smth
but boss-damage did matter
opaque grotto
Yea if everyone is alive the boss is easy as shit
opaque grotto
With people being 380+ ilvl
marble hemlock
when spawns werent fixed, killing them in time was a pain
opaque grotto
Yea Vectis is a meme unless someone fucks up real bad and ends up with 2 vectors
Yea for the healers
marble hemlock
yup
opaque grotto
Yea nowadays you can tank a second immuno
Not every time but once isn’t the end of the pull
marble hemlock
most guilds figured out CD assignments early on and just stuck with them, which is where my suggestion came from
opaque grotto
Oh yea we’re losing array
marble hemlock
which was vendetta on pull, vanish on 1st, vendetta on 2nd, vanish on 3rd, vendetta on burn
marble hemlock
with 1+SS traits, vendetta/vanish are basically doing teh same dps per add
so its very consistent damage to the big one
marble hemlock
scent dream
spice surge
i mean, your 8.0 azerites are gonna be garbage in 8.1
You'll replace them with stuff with lower ilvl (if you cant get same ilvl) real quick
Because 2 traits >>> 1 trait
Well yeah
Its the same as now
Relatively
marsh bloom
The first add is dying way too fucking quickly lol
and the second set just isn't dying quick enough
simple rivet
Hi all. I'm a long time outlaw player that is brand new to assassination. I'm looking at the skills and rotations, specifically at Poisoned Knife
Icy veins mentions "Poisoned Knife when Sharpened Blades Icon Sharpened Blades is above 29 stacks."
Not sure if I'm missing something, but is Sharpened Blades a passive or something? Talent? I can't find it, and I'm not getting any sort of stacks attacking a dummy
Lol, okay there we go
I thought I was blind
opaque grotto
Google thinks you’re blind
royal lantern
azerite trait, every autoattack gives you more dmg on your throwing knive, stacking up too 30times
simple rivet
WHOA, in with the Google already
First message, yikes
Sorry for wasting your time
Jokes. Thanks though guys
cold dragon
Why do the top parses on Mythrax use Vendetta on pull then 4:30 later?
lost horizon
@cold dragon link what you're looking at
lost horizon
👌
shell night
What traits should I use in particular for M+? 3x archives?
hushed abyss
can someone tell me why Shrouded Suffocation is always the last pick for azerite traits, when i use the bloodmallet string? is it really that bad?
hushed abyss
means that the bloodmallet string for AzeriteTrait addon is bullshit?
spice surge
Bloodmallet always run with default profile (master assassin)
Which means that SS is terrible, whereas herodamage has alternative talents if a certain trait synergizes with it
So use herodamage
halcyon tulip
when the hell did they buff taloc trinket
spice surge
Last week
fresh ginkgo
zinc furnace
can anybody please share a single macro which uses and tooltips either Ex or TB, picking whatever is currently talented?
spice surge
/cast [talent:6/3] Exsanguinate; [talent:6/2] Toxic Blade
top secret. I use Shift 2 for Exang and Shift 3 for TB. Caa razy
primal gazelle
are the new ilvl rewards from WQ in 8.1 on 12/11/2018 ?
or are they for 8.1.5 when the new tier comes out
spice surge
Ilvl prob with new raid, but who knows 🤷
More traits with new raid or in 8.1? Who knows 🤷
Azerite currency new raid or 8.1? Who knows 🤷
Its just so wierd to not have them line up
spice surge
Pressumably they give everything the new outer ring, so they drop from basicly anywhere
shut pollen
!wa
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Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
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https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
shut pollen
I'm searching for a wa that tracks garrote if empowered or not by subterfuge, and when I cast it outside of stealth I wish it could track the cd somewhere else without hindering the timing on the dot
wise mortar
Make an icon that shows the cd, a bar that shows the dot, and a lit up bar to show it as empowered? Are you trying to track it on current target or multiple?
strange python
just started fetid prog, does any one have any tips?
cold dragon
@fresh ginkgo I'd say the buffed taloc trink is good if you dont have a titanforged m+ trinket. Especially in Uldir where you want reorigination array on haste
smoky tulip
Sorry if I missed this being mentioned before, but are we supposed to refresh our dots before we exsang, even if they aren't in pandemic?
strange python
like does any one have any tips with the cd management for Fetid prog?
dense quest
are you on mut mass?
cold dragon
@strange python My guild had us use 2 min (vendetta) on pull, then on second adds (I was on small add) so I popped that vend on Mass, then last one on boss. I took Toxic Blade + Master Assassin because we had enough damage on adds and I sim higher dps with that setup
strange python
Thanks
elfin fossil
Guys
Can someone look at my logs and see what I can improve? I got it down, but just generally I guess. PM would be preferrable.
finite yacht
so if i simmed and the difference between two pieces was .4% i can assume thats within margin of error and just pick whicher right
blazing forge
hidden halo
On PTR during testing now, you can't vanish and apply SS empowered garrotes
summer aurora
@hidden halo what you mean Vansih wont put you in "SS Stealth Mode" so it empowers them ?
marsh bloom
you have to post them @blazing forge
hidden halo
Yeah, Vanish no longer lets you cast "SS Stealth Mode", if you vanish during combat and garotte a target from the stealth, it will put garotte on a 6 second cd and not be empowered.
not sure if intentional or a ptr bug.
tidal jetty
that has to be a bug
hidden halo
apparently if you wait until the "Vanish" has gone and ur in actual stealth
it works as normal
subtle tundra
static sparrow
How overvalued is ditb
lone junco
@hidden halo ive seen a log where the guy mashed them together and it landed as Garrote/Vanish, aka not ss.
his garrote landed 0.03s before vanish
hidden halo
nope, im doing it seperate
past vale
can someone help me out plz? so i am new to rogue this xpac. i plan on mainly doing mythic plus, i only have one piece of gear so far that has archive on it but the same piece is my only SS piece as well. i also have a different piece that goes in the same slot that has dagger in the back. when i sim these pieces, i am not sure which is best bc it goes back and forth between archive and dagger but i always read up on how important it is to have an SS. What do i do?!
lone junco
@civic palm inb4 the Dungeon slice, M+ sim value for NE shoots through the fucking roof for racial stacks.
civic palm
You get like what, 5-10 uses?
But it's ONLY good on extremely long trash.
or when you don't get to restealth.
lone junco
if you can get 3g out of it one time. it will be >>> all other raicials
even if it is at t= 25
after first stack drops
civic palm
Yeah.
lone junco
well in M+ the boss is first, but same thing. there are zero actions worth more than a gg on a boss.
its worth like 80k with a normal garrote at like 10k. ish. (havent checked in a while)
civic palm
Ye
lone junco
so what, you basically run vanish exang chop chop. then rupture as garrote is ticking out you legit just back out. meld stealth and refresh after it drops push it another 23s.
yeeaaahh. thats the equiv of 3 5cp env crits
worth just stopping and refreshing.
funny rotation though.
civic palm
or if the bosses take long enough save the Meld for another EX.
lone junco
exang doesnt excite me much if its not overlapping a trinket or buff imo.
civic palm
Sure.
civic palm
Yes
lone junco
shiiit. use at 1m 3m 5m aligned with gcb at 1 2 3 4 5
vanish at 2 4 6
grats tyrannical NE
guranteed that the alignment of exang slides to 1min use
with trinket alternating vanishes.
civic palm
at the same time Vanish is just better since you get every bonus from SUB and SS.
lone junco
i was assuming full meld into stealth
civic palm
mmm
lone junco
not the half ass meld garrote.
civic palm
Can you on bosses in dungeons?
lone junco
thats what i was told. but idk
civic palm
I imagine you have to wait for every DoT to fade and the boss NOT hit you with anything, ever.
civic palm
Yeah.
lone junco
i can break fear twice a week though
smoky tulip
Yo, so how much of a dps loss is having Galecallers and Lions Guile equipped at the same time?
lone junco
which? wow in general?
smoky tulip
Can you only have 1 on-use trinket up at a time?
lone junco
@smoky tulip compared to what? and you should sim your combo.
civic palm
Just Stealth and Shadowmeld and Subterfuge and Shrouded Suffocation.
lone junco
I have another trinket I can use with GCB
civic palm
Giving half of something and maybe half of another?
lone junco
lets look for a log.
smoky tulip
I have simmed my combo, I have GCB and Lion's Guile and Frenetic Corpuscle all 370. Lions and Corp have a gem socket. It's telling me GCB and Corp are better
But I'm just trying to undrstand why? Lions and GCB are top 2 trinkets on Bloodmalet
civic palm
Either way seems like it's being looked at my the TCers now so that's good.
lone junco
@smoky tulip i would use the Guile on pull, let it stack as you run through your opener gg. then a vanish gg gcb exang.
smoky tulip
Vend only last for 20 secs, so no use having 2 onuse trinkets
it has a 30 sec cd once you equip though?
lone junco
hold the vendetta until it is stacked some, so it overlaps the Guile and the Exang
smoky tulip
oh i get what you mean
lone junco
it is front loaded double trinket.
but that is huge for short fights.
i dont have one, else i would dabble with it myself.
note; sims are notoriously bad at /use trinkets.
unless the apl is crafted for them, they just hammer on cd.
I have seen logs with a vendetta/guile vanish gg exang. and its not even done stacking by the time the exang ends.
leaden thorn
Got a quick question currently progging fetid is it better for me to placed on the mass or the small adds?
lone junco
this is a mythic fetid log actually.
it all lines up so nicely.
with the double garrote at each vanish
pliant nest
that is a long link
lone junco
it happens.
for scale. that vanish gg exsang on the mass is :
233k dmg
that pretty impressive tbh.
the vanish GG exang on Fetid during bonus dmg. 295k.
lol
manic stirrup
Hi does anyone know why the sim does garrote->rupture->garrote->toxic blade->envenom? the envenom wouldnt even be 5 combo points? also, why not garrote garrote rupture?
glacial grotto
is it possible to get a decent rank if you're not on mutated mass for fetid?
quiet spruce
I'm on fetid as well. Guild making me go sub for it to provide add dmg
Would sin only be good if I'm put on mass add?
forest grotto
yeah sub blows up corps and sin does really well on mass
cunning needle
https://ptr.wowhead.com/rogue-changes-tides-of-vengeance
am I failing at reading comprehension or are they adding garrote as a talent in 8.1?
civic palm
Just datamining weirdness.
spice surge
The only change to garrote i know of is that it now requires a melee weapon
But thats only relevant in pvp when disarmed
cunning needle
KK thanks
lone junco
@manic stirrup any of the double garrotes are using at least 1 ss trait.
steep obsidian
Man I love the mythrax change I’m drinking the ranged tears
After doing fetid with 7 melee fk en
dark crag
Now we need the fetid circles reduced by 50%
civic palm
heh
sullen sphinx
If you hit a rupture during the EP window does it snapshot the extra damage from ep for the whole rupture
marble hemlock
no
marble hemlock
if you have EP up, all your damgae is increased by 10% during that time, and if its not up, you dont get the bonus
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
twilit elk
so when i sim TB vs Exang, TB is about 150 dps more, but everyone i see is running exang. Is it a prefrence or does one pull ahead in real world settings compared to sims
manic stirrup
@lone junco but why garrote rupter garrote, why not garrote garrote rupture?
errant mauve
what makes exan GCB so much better in M+ than TB?
median mason
I think you want rupture up early for energy regen
errant mauve
@strange python what makes exan and GCB so much better than dice/spyglass with TB in M+
manic stirrup
ok then another question is why does the sim envenom so early? before 5 combo points?
strange python
Read the guide
@errant mauve Because exsang grants u a lot of energy and burns down prior target
crisp steppe
because the single strongest trait benefits exsang more
the trait that for most situations will dump on all the other traits
errant mauve
most pack pulls though get kited away from the GCB though dont they?
manic stirrup
Im surprised SS sims high for me, I thought it only grants me bonus if I use garrote from stealth? for a boss, how many times is that going to happen?
errant mauve
so dice/deadeye would be better than GCB/either of those others
should i keep exan even without GCB
strange python
GCB is literally the BiS for dungeons
crisp steppe
I think gcb is likely to be better in m+ than running double static trinkets
strange python
???
inland verge
I dont see lions guille on https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/trinkets/1t-t22-assassination i got a 385 lions guille vs a 365 gold plumage
inland verge
BOYS
inland verge
we made it thank you
crisp steppe
😃 gz
its gonna be good on bosses but it provides less burst for trash than other on use trinkets
manic stirrup
the guide doesnt explain the opener. Why does it do toxic blade into envenom with 2 combo points?
crisp steppe
yeah
errant mauve
me? yeah
crisp steppe
but on many trash packs its pretty irrelevant
strange python
How is it irrelevant
errant mauve
when i take exan
crisp steppe
its solid but snapshotting doesn't really help you much when the trinkets duration last the entire exsg anyway
errant mauve
so 375 dice and 385 deadeye which should i pair with 370 GCB
crisp steppe
on big packs exsg isn't that big
strange python
How does it not help you
rofl
It provides a lot of energy regen
Extremely useful when you run high crit
But I guess it isn't that big
errant mauve
so id assume deadeye with GCB in M+
crisp steppe
idk I honestly don't think GCB is BiS on m+ at all
strange python
Its not like sin rogues that push 20+ keys use it
spice surge
@manic stirrup None of the opener has tb into 2 cp envenom, idk what you're talking about
Are you forgetting the extra CP from SS traits?
visual quartz
Garotte and rupture at end of vendetta does not snapshot damage for duration correct?
strange python
no
lone junco
@manic stirrup g (3) r g (3) vendetta mut (5) r. Pushes out max pandemic rupture and max pandemic garrote at the same time with minimal cp loss.
G (3) g (6?) r. Wastes a few cps. And still not max
wild gyro
I do
But I run 3x385 SS
If you run SS/SoB/Arch or something then it may not be worth
zinc pewter
On m zekvoz do you guys run CT or PB?
manic stirrup
@lone junco in the opener in the guide it says g r g ven toxic envenom, is that not 2 combo points?
strange python
no 5
civic palm
In the guide which opener are you looking at?
manic stirrup
oh wait it assumes SS, I get it now
civic palm
👍
manic stirrup
sorry
strange python
@zinc pewter run PB
manic stirrup
@civic palm do you know why SS sims so high (even in my own sim), since it only gives bonuses to stealth garrote and how many of those do you get in one boss fight really?
twilit elk
if you play TB are you suppose to play master poisoner
manic stirrup
@strange python im just trying to understand the value of SS, what am I missing?
strange python
It buffs garrote used from stealth
manic stirrup
but that happens 3 times at most for most bosses in uldir
strange python
no lol
manic stirrup
right, what am I missing?
strange python
...
manic stirrup
ok so the amount is so big, that, even though its only 3 times its still better than other traits?
strange python
wtf u mean 3 times
civic palm
Just remember that Subterfuge alreadys SIMs as well as Master Assassin in Single Target, and there are very few instances of pure ST in Uldir. Add onto that Shrouded Suffocation making Subterfuge even better and it's not too difficult to see.
Add on top that that bosses should be dying faster and the value on Sub/SS/Vanish goes up again.
spice surge
Most uldir fights are longer than 2½ mins though, so its a lot more than 3 times
manic stirrup
but vanish is on a 2 min cooldown?
spice surge
Once in the opener, then on vanish
strange python
rofl
spice surge
Then on second vanish, for 24 seconds
visual quartz
SS always buffs garrote, Sunterfuge buffs from stealth
spice surge
Each
strange python
ss doesn't always buff garrote
Garrote cast from Stealth generates 2 additional Combo Points and deals x additional damage.
visual quartz
right, mixed me up hah
manic stirrup
is the description wrong? missing a comma?
civic palm
Shadowmeld also gives you a slightly empowered Garrote every 2min.
errant mauve
ok so, for raid 1archive 1DD 1 SS sims 300dps lower than 1 archive and 2 DD but with SS opener feels smoother... is it worth keeping the SS trait or should i swap to 2DD
strange python
Play what sims higher
manic stirrup
so SS only buffs stealth garrote. So vanish on a 2 min cd, lets say the boss is 5 min long, thats 6 buffed garrotes with subterfuge?
strange python
no
errant mauve
is 300dps really that much of a difference though
manic stirrup
and you are saying 4 buffed garrotes per fight is already better than other traits?
strange python
what does the sim say?
spice surge
1 trait of ss basicly doubles the damage of that garrote from stealth
strange python
like this is such a flawed way of thinking
like dks only throw dragon 2x per fight
is that talent shit
?
yup
manic stirrup
sim say SS is higher for me, Im trying to figure out why
lone junco
I clipped a log earlier. Vanish gg exang on fetid is 295k dmg.
Just 2 garrotes.
What effort do you think you have to do, to come up with 275k extra damage (above the base garrote)
That's like 5-8 crit monster env.
In 2 little garrotes.
errant mauve
so i have a question about garrote and rupture uptime... even though id have it constantly on the training dummy for the duration of the session it tells me the uptime is only 88% and 91% why if its on the target the entire fight is it saying the uptime isnt 100%
errant mauve
does it have to do when its refreshed? time left on current debuff and when the next tick proc will occur?
spice surge
You probably just didnt have 100% uptime
strange python
you dont let garrote run out unless its buffed by SS/subterfuge or exsang, and you dont let rupture run out unless its buffed by exsang
errant mauve
i refreshed each cast at 4-6 seconds left
im on a training dummy so its all im watching
wise mortar
A few seconds when you are waiting on combat to end after you're finished?
short token
does anybody have mythic ghuun experience? how should i sim the fight to maximize dps? hectic cleave? heavy movement? light movement? i'm NOT running orbs
civic palm
Gotta get that fat DPS on the first 5 tentacles 👌
short token
we just killed mythrax
civic palm
mmm
short token
we have 2 dh's a monk and warrior solo'ing
and then pairs for the others
the two rogues in the guild aren't running
civic palm
,<
short token
i don't understand u wanna know who the healers are?
a resto pally a holy priest resto druid and resto sham
they're not
@gusty kestrel do u have any advice for how to sim for best results? should i focus more on aoe or single targ in your opinion
tidal jetty
st
short token
ok ty
tidal jetty
the aoe dmg you can do as assa wont really matter
short token
lol so that won't be for a while
zinc pewter
@strange python PB over CT on m zekvoz even if group struggling with little adds?
short token
@NUTCRACKO my raid lead told me to maximize aoe, so i went CT but as we geared up and adds started dying faster i went back to PB
manic stirrup
hi I just finished a boss and my ilvl rank is 38 which is pretty bad, any ideas why? https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/1ZqMLpT6CtWBdHbm/#fight=last&view=rankings
cunning needle
looks like keys are back on the menu
spice surge
@manic stirrup You're not casting your toxic blade nearly on cooldown so you miss out on casts over the fight, same with vendetta/vanish.
Your opener is wierd, you are not using potions nor flask
manic stirrup
Ive been delaying toxic blade until I get more energy is that ok?
manic stirrup
so just use on CD immediately?
manic stirrup
I thought you want to pool cp and energy so you get more finishers while toxic is up? guess that doesnt matter
marsh bloom
Why wouldn't it be good to Spam CT instead of using Rupture/Env if there's 6+ targ
spice surge
For example, afte the elevator, you used your first TB, then you waited 37 seconds until you casted the next one, then 43, then 31
So you essentially made your 25s cd into a 43s cd
You want energy before tb
But you dont delay tb
marsh bloom
You want to pool before TB rather than delay it
spice surge
But its not like you need 150 energy, just not 25 and you'll be fine
manic stirrup
@spice surge got it
spice surge
The max amount of TBs you could cast with that fight length would be 13, and you casted 7
Check the guide in the pins or right at the top here for the opener
zinc pewter
@short token ya we’re progressing and CT feels better, thanks!
manic stirrup
@spice surge btw how do you know that the max cast is 13? is there a page that lists it?
manic stirrup
I wish wowanalyzer works for rogue?
spice surge
So in this case 319/25, which is 12.76, so 12 and then +1 because you use one in your opener
Its just a rule of thumb and not an absolute way to calculate it though
fringe ginkgo
That explosive nerf looks sexy
marsh bloom
What explosive nerf?
fringe ginkgo
marsh bloom
oh wow
fringe ginkgo
maybe not a dead week after all
normal flint
for fetid prog we save vendetta for the big add?
rare garden
this is probably a dumb question but i can't find an answer: if I pandemic refresh a garrote with a vanish garrote, does it keep the extra damage for the full duration?
errant mauve
what trinkets would you guys say are BiS for uldir raid
rare garden
fathoms and one of galecallers, dead-eye, dice
marsh bloom
I think Dice is the better than galecallers dead-eye
sturdy python
Yes @rare garden
marsh bloom
Even from SS Tawney?
lost sentinel
garrottes overwrite the old with whatever traits/talents the new one has
supple hearth
ya why not
marsh bloom
I think raidbots makes haste weights shit
vocal harbor
wiped on 0% with 37k. just me and off tank alive with immunities, ONE MORE ENERGY to cast envenom and we would have downed it
supple hearth
choose ur two top simming stats then @marsh bloom
silent flare
so im 372 itm level, im following the icy guide to the T and i cant seem to pull over 10k steady dps. while i see others pull 15-16 at my itm level
olive shore
what traits are you guys using for high m+ keys?
tropic pike
The best way is to post a log so others can help @silent flare
lethal heart
@olive shore shrouded archives scent of blood
shut pollen
@marsh bloom you don’t simply spam CT because without ruptures u won’t get any energy back since it doesn’t prox
marsh bloom
I mean once you have enough ruptures on them
but I can see now
how that would be bad
since you only get to put up 2 ruptures until CT is back on pandemic right?
what is CT pandemic?
safe sluice
You don’t play for pndemic on CT...
safe sluice
Since you spam it when ruptures are up
marsh bloom
Well you have to use it every like 2 ruptures
Then by that time you'll be reapplying ruptures/garrotes I think
safe sluice
I don’t know what your aoe situation is but or they die before needing to reapply rupture or you swim in energy/cp’s that you spam it into oblivion anyways and then they are death again. Depends on your set up though.
safe sluice
Specificly for you question I thought I saw somewhere that if you need to reapply it was 6 sec if you are playing around pandemic. Can be completely wrong about that.
lethal heart
you can get up to 45-50% crit right now with trinket/weapon proc
with like 30-33% base crit from gear
safe sluice
That’s why i said that it depends on your set-up
If you are running with dh-mage you don’t even run ct imo.
lethal heart
thats not true
safe sluice
What’s the point, you are not even there for the cleave
lethal heart
assa rogue is currently best aoe sustained dps in the game
with stuff like 1 shrouded + 2 scent
or 2 shrouded + 1 scent
safe sluice
I have aoe to sustain when i run that combo
Might be that i don’t run 16+ keys though 😉
lethal heart
it is that
safe sluice
No*
lethal heart
and dh's very rarely play fel barrage
or well at least dh i play with
idk about this week in specific because this week is bin
static tapir
winter moss
fel barrage loses value in higher keys and they switch away from the talent
spare nebula
also, if you really wanna do some disgusting aoe on packs that will last a bit (fortified weeks and/or highish keys 12+), remember that vanish is better used on trash packs. Once you have ruptures out and first 3 garrotes falls off, vanish and refresh a new set of 3 garrotes.
then just continue spamming fan of knives + ct
spare nebula
nelf 
blissful hull
Is SS simming correctly? Running Double Dose/ Blightborne Infusion and AotT all 385 but according to the sim Exang would be a side grade? Thoughts? Kinda prefer the Exang build to burst adds etc.
round harbor
Even on tyran you should be vanish garroting on trash lol
spare nebula
true -- just trying to push the idea of trash that doesn't die too fast in order to get full value from the second set of garrotes
xD
round harbor
Ikr
lost horizon
No you hold vanish for when tank loses aggro ofc
round wadi
Guys do u know the number of target u can rupture without losing the first one?
I'm lazy
spare nebula
huh?
clear vapor
I dont think you will run into that problem in a situation where fok isnt the best builder
lost horizon
Better question is how much downtime do you lose running between adds that aren't close enough to fok
round wadi
What's ur parse on mythrax lol
lost horizon
LiNk Ur LoGs
round wadi
U don t lose time
round wadi
For the question u had earlier
lost horizon
lost horizon
Wat
You have to move between adds if they're not close enough to FoK
Unless for some reason you spawned a line where you can run along it and just connect the dots
lost horizon
What's that do?
lost horizon
Or more importantly, can you spam it enough times to get to every single add?