calm grail
Uhh I forgot... Combo of OP and
#assassination
hollow stone
Heed
hollow stone
Hmmmm. That "might" make the diff. I think i would go ttk w op over ditb w op
Not ๐ฏ that its better
But i think it would be
But ttk w heed v ditb w op would be a toss up
Op is... op
It feels so good
inner pulsar
THat is going to be close
TtK is better on its own, as DitB is overvalued by the sim
Because it assumes constant perfect positioning, which you are unlikely to get
I will say, if I get the Fetid chest, I will probably run double archive, I don't want to go back to SS in raid
molten scroll
Yo guys, would u say double dose + shrouded suffocation or 2x shrouded suffocation ? (both at same ilevel)
hollow stone
For what content? Raid dd m+ ss
inner pulsar
Then DD+SS
inner pulsar
I mean I would
molten scroll
okok thanks
inner pulsar
@hollow stone Would you run it as Archive or SS though?
inner pulsar
Yeah
hollow stone
Maybe when i get fetid chest i just stop playing my rogue in m+ cause im cheap
inner pulsar
Haha
hollow stone
My group wants my mage more often than my rogue anyway
inner pulsar
Alrigth, lunch time
median mason
Melee raiders lul
polar trench
gentle ginkgo
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/5fRwTCsyNLwM2zVHmgSkXc swirling sands proc rate QQ
and also if you are not using SS trait master assasin talent goes over subterfuge
strange python
not necessarily
gentle ginkgo
yeah 1 dmg over xD
gentle ginkgo
I guess it depends on which situation u in
I believe Im gonna play master assa in fetid mythic to burn adds faster
dapper swan
Hey couple questions, does double dose stack if I have 2 pieces of gear with the azerite trait, and should I run 2x DD or 1x DD and 1x Blightborne Infusion
rocky notch
yes dd stacks
dapper swan
Is it good to run 2?
cold meteor
dapper swan
Or should I run 1 and Blightborne infusion
It's just a general question not looking for specific numbers, just if running 2 is the way to go
Ty
median mason
Run 2 unless blight is higher ilvl I think
dapper swan
ty
prime stirrup
Im at the point where RA is destroying my haste value
I guess blizz doesnt want you walking into raid with 23.5% haste before RA buff
shy escarp
well it's better than my old outlaw setup, where haste had negative value
on MT at least
prime stirrup
for what content?
prime stirrup
if youre mythic raiding youre probably 375+ at this point
safe matrix
it depends on the level of content that you're doing
shy escarp
I'm just a heroic level raider that does some M+ and I'm 370 now
nimble tartan
What are your guys neck level now
gleaming eagle
dang
fresh ginkgo
shy escarp
just hit 26 yesterday, but I've been in war mode the whole time for that sweet 10% bonus to everything
fresh ginkgo
been playing day one tho
i feel like i should be higher
but i dopnt wq anymore
or even island
cause fuck islands
nimble tartan
Same I havent wq or done an emissary in weeks
shy escarp
nah, grinding azurite power is fucking horrible. way worse than artifact power felt
lean coral
they need to make more ap come out of dungeons tbh
shy escarp
and artifact power felt pretty shit to grind too
prime stirrup
only AP grind i do is emissary and the weekly crap of expos. I dont go out of the way to farm and im 27.3
fresh ginkgo
i started to do caches for azerite gear now
nimble tartan
Yeah cause its 2 ilvl and like +2 stat lmao
proper zealot
My Heart of Azeroth is Level 29.3. : )
lean coral
nerd
nimble tartan
29 dansgame
fresh ginkgo
nimble tartan
I finally leveled an alt to 120...first alt of bfa...it feels good to do the initial gear up
proper zealot
I should maybe play an alt, but I hate levelling. I also don't want to worry about Champions of Azeroth reputation again.
lean coral
i have an alt and the i realized theres 0 way to catch up on reorigination
and its stupid
you can do 1 stack a week
prime stirrup
you can catch up on RA stacks
shy escarp
I got my rogue and paladin up, tried to do hunter and I just have 0 desire to do any of the leveling grind and gear up again
lean coral
cant get a stack the week you get the piece
nimble tartan
Yeah I'm not worried about ra stacks cause I'm just gonna gear it up and do heroic uldir with it
U can get boosted fast with the arathi rares and timewalking rn its nice
Just tryna get somewhat geared so I'm not an uber leech in a heroic run lmao
fleet whale
that "state of the rogue class" thread in reddit is strange... people in the comments seemed to get the impression that Sin was fast-paced in Legion? Smooth, for sure in antorus. Fast... no
proper zealot
Probably "fast" by comparison to what it is now.
nimble tartan
We had a lot more energy regeneration
nimble tartan
Kb energy regeneration as well
proper zealot
Mhmm, all of the Artifact traits and higher Haste levels, too.
prime stirrup
I really enjoyed sin in antorus. felt so nice not being energy starved and able to weave no GCDs into rotation
prime stirrup
I also really really miss my 226% mastery
fleet whale
yeah, crit with BB was so nice
which is why I think blizz should add a passive 10% crit for assassin
nimble tartan
It's also probably they had the high from multiple PB procs they runnin on that HIGH
proper zealot
Well Haste became good in the pre-patch, which was when I started playing Assassination. I had been playing Subtlety up until that point.
lean coral
i stopped playing then
raided antorus way too long
plus they somehow made mythic aggramar even more annoying
proper zealot
For sure. I had stopped before that, but re-subbed for the pre-patch because I wanted the mount.
prime stirrup
pre patch ruined my sin rogue for a week while i got ahold of more haste
fleet whale
Sin felt garbage when I dinged 120 I had to go sub for the first few months because of it
didn't feel good until like 355 ilvl
prime stirrup
I enjoyed sin early. probably because i was able to stack SS traits and they were op op
fleet whale
I wish I could keep the haste from uldir though lol
prime stirrup
outside of uldir my haste stat weight is 2.11 inside uldir my haste rating is worth 1.93
nimble tartan
thats still nice ๐
thin ingot
27% haste within uldir
prime stirrup
I dont share that sentiment omr!
im 30%+ haste. when i hit galecallers im sitting near 50%
thin ingot
57*% haste within uldir
thin ingot
dude no one doing M+ this week
prime stirrup
im simming higher with 2xSS/1xArchive over 2xArchive/1xSS. all same ilvl
im selling carries this week because bosses blow up and trash is whatever
thin ingot
naa i just enjoy doing them
but this week blows
my score is decent enough to get my 10s done every week
cobalt gyro
this week for m+ is garbage
torpid kernel
can we sim dagger in the back without being behind the target?
proper zealot
I started the week with a +11 Tol Dagor, and that wasn't very fun. Didn't help that the Demon Hunter in the group pulled extra every pack with Eye Beam. : /
cobalt gyro
managed to push score on a few dungeons so far at least
nimble condor
hello guys, can someone explain to me why im doing 0 damage in mythic uldir? https://worldofwarcraft.com/ru-ru/character/howling-fjord/ะคัััะพัะพัะธะฐะฝะฐ
i did sim myself
thin ingot
youre a panda
nimble condor
๐ฆ
proper zealot
If you're doing zero damage it means you're either dead or AFK.
Possibly both. ๐ค
proper zealot
Do you have logs that you could provide, though? Your Armory won't be of much help.
thin ingot
every fking mythic raider should follow
prime stirrup
i cant read russian. so i cant really look at your shit and tell you whats going wrong
nimble condor
mb w8 a sec
cobalt gyro
only thing i can really get out of that is ilevel being kinda low for mythic uldir
thin ingot
lol wasnt that spanish?
proper zealot
It's Russian.
prime stirrup
Inside raid no GCB 31.2% haste
GCB in raid. 49.87% haste =X no trinket/enchant procs
cobalt gyro
that must feel nice af
prime stirrup
i think were shooting for 18k club now
unreal bear
we can all agree that assa is one of the most boring specs to play in raid, right?
prime stirrup
I enjoy sin in raid.. ๐คท
cobalt gyro
idk it'd be more fun if i had more haste
unreal bear
i feel like much of the rotation is just pooling energy to maintain EP.
prime stirrup
i only pool energy when i have 4+cp and envenom buff is still ticking.
unreal bear
isn't EP prioritized over Envenom?
nimble condor
okay, so i have no logs, but usually im doing a 500k+ more than our tanks in raid, everyone except me is 375+ but is there really so much difference in damage between ilvls?
unreal bear
@nimble condor need more info than that.
nimble condor
egh like what?
marsh bloom
logs
unreal bear
armory wouldn't be bad. but you're probably doing your rotation very inefficiently.
marsh bloom
but i'm a shitty rogue don't listen to me
unreal bear
most rogues with low numbers usually have poor uptime on garrote and are energy starved instead of chaining envenoms to maintain EP/envenom
prime stirrup
uptime on garrote/rupture are key to ever having enough energy
marsh bloom
with 5CP do I use envenom or TB?
unreal bear
i'm not a 100% parser, but i usually delay tb if i have 5 cp
hollow stone
It wont screw your dps too much
Its better to tb at 5 than only get 1 env in your tb window
nimble condor
i think im doing it okay, i have no garrote trait so my opener is garrote>mutilate>garrote>rupture>vendetta>poison knife> mutilate> envenom and then just spamming mutilate envenom till poison refresh
unreal bear
garrote -> rupture -> garrote
marsh bloom
and pretty sure MA will sim more for you does it not?
proper zealot
If you don't have Shrouded Suffocation your opener goes:
Garrote > Mutilate to 4+ CP > Rupture > Vendetta > Toxic Blade > Mutilate to 4+ CP > Vanish > Envenom.
@nimble condor
prime stirrup
why PK that early? if you have the trait dont you only want to use at 30 stacks? if so that takes a lot longer to beef up and youre just wasting it. Only time i would use PK pre 30 stacks is if vendetta is about to fall off.
hollow stone
Im sorry for being an asshole, but did you even look at the pins @nimble condor? I dont even know where to start with that opener..
nimble condor
oh
unreal bear
im assuming since he didnt have TB in his rotation
marsh bloom
aye ggez she/he mean't TB
nimble condor
having problems with english
marsh bloom
try again
hollow stone
Ok. Phew. Thats one less problem :p
marsh bloom
lol
nimble condor
the fuck
marsh bloom
lol
safe matrix
wait why did that one go through
marsh bloom
LMAO
unreal bear
lmfao
nimble condor
xd
prime stirrup
lol
marsh bloom
rip
safe matrix
you guys cant say the word 'retard' because people can't act reasonable so its blanket deleted by the bot.
unreal bear
self insults are filter proof :x
safe matrix
regardless of context
nimble condor
i got it it was a joke
safe matrix
attempts to get around the word filter are insta mute
strange python
surpressing free speech ๐ฆ
marsh bloom
N word is blocked right?
unreal bear
nightstalker?
safe matrix
yes
nimble condor
nuggets
safe matrix
Go back to assassination talk, we have a word filter for a reason because people can't behave so its removed regardless of context.
So resume your normal discussions.
hollow stone
Better test it... zzzzz, if you have to ask, just dont say it -_- anyway, @nimble condor, magd gave you the opener you want to try to get used to using
unreal bear
thanks dad
prime stirrup
you know what im struggling to grasp here
hollow stone
Gcb, ss gear, haste
unreal bear
i had a dream i got gcb. then i woke up and had to stare at my fathoms deck.
unreal bear
sim it?
nimble condor
why vanish before envenom?
prime stirrup
i use 385 dice 375 gcb
unreal bear
@nimble condor MA
hollow stone
Because you are running ma so your env after van has 50% more crit chance @nimble condor
hollow stone
Ma is master assassin, far right of t2 talents
unreal bear
Master Assassin
nimble condor
thanks
hollow stone
Look at that anticipation. /flex
prime stirrup
#1 mythic vectis sin logs. He is using FoK on the add?? only thing i can think is because he has omega vector and add isnt in melee range??
nimble condor
oh but i do not XD
unreal bear
he probably used FoK because he put rupture on target and needed to apply poison
nimble condor
should i?
safe matrix
or did it out of habit
strange python
u dont fok at 2 targets
unreal bear
if you dont proc poison when applying rupture, you dont get the energy gen. /shrug
strange python
EVER
safe matrix
the apl change to fok was a pretty recent change
hollow stone
I know. But without garrote traits (ss), ma is PROBABLY better for you @nimble condor But sim it to be sure
nimble condor
thanks
safe matrix
it was typically 2+ for a while but thats changed now to whats in #tc-updates
so it could have been a force of habit
hollow stone
Maybe he just said.... fok it
unreal bear
during lust?
coarse knot
What is the ideal haste i should have im running 1500 without buffs
prime stirrup
yeah. my burst in lust is 39~ and im running similar gear as him
hollow stone
For sin, as much haste as you can get until the sims say otherwise
proper zealot
Sim yourself. There's no "ideal" number to shoot for. If the sim says it's your top secondary stat, then get more of it. : )
marsh bloom
simming now
hollow stone
There is no haste cap
prime stirrup
it starts to give reduced vaules
unreal bear
50k is pretty insane even in lust. can you pm me his parse?
prime stirrup
haste is my lowest stat for ST in raid atm
hollow stone
And how do you know that shanksy? I bet its because you simmed
marsh bloom
Still sim 200 more with TB/MA
hollow stone
Funny how simming helps w your stat weights, innit it
mossy flicker
anyone here is a good mm+ player ? need some advices
nimble condor
for next time, how do i save logs?
strange python
/combatlog
hollow stone
I have a speech impediment irl, just trying to pass it along to typing
nimble condor
thanks
prime stirrup
yes applejuicce. i know because i simmed. mastery is my highest stat weight at this moment
hollow stone
See guys, simming works
proper zealot
Sometimes I really get into it, and I simulate myself simming my Rogue.
You guys will never be as good as me.
hollow stone
Damn. Thats some insimtion right there
strange python
Doubt it mate
glass palm
Guys I got a question, whats the value in making bleeds finish faster with exsanguinate and how to properly make use of exsanguinate?
hollow stone
And the value is doing more dps
If you could choose bleeds doing 20k over 20 sec or 20k over 10 sec, which would you choose?
soft cargo
if u overwrite exsanguinated bleed does it lose the dmg?
lofty sand
In 30 seconds you usually would have only one rupture, imagine if you could speed up the time and have the damage of 2 ruptures in the same time window!
glass palm
the answer is obvious but what happens if you overwrite exsanguinated bleeds?
prime stirrup
if you overwrire the bleeds you lose the exsang dmg
lofty sand
You lose dps.
prime stirrup
so dont do it
hollow stone
Wait til xsangd bleeds fully fade then re-bleed
glass palm
i saw a rogue running exsanguinate and crimson tempest this week in m+, is this correct?
lofty sand
boy you really don't wanna read the guide do ya?
glass palm
and if yes how to use these talents in m+ scenarios
hollow stone
Piiiiiiins
strange python
my god
median mason
On cool down
prime stirrup
I run exsang + ct in m+ this week
glass palm
dude if i wanted to watch a video, i'd just watch it
lofty sand
So you rather have some randoms explain everything to you?
glass palm
just rather have a text to read instead of a video
prime stirrup
well check the pins
crisp steppe
try icy veins baido
median mason
Read the YouTube comments
prime stirrup
or the ravenholdt site
strange python
You dont have to watch the full video
prime stirrup
or icyveins
strange python
There are time stamps
safe matrix
Yes you run CT in almost all dungeons, except possibly tyr KR
lofty sand
There is a very nice text about it in the guide and the pins.
safe matrix
exsang too typically
prime stirrup
This discord has been set up so that FAQs are already answered. and your question is most definitely covered
safe matrix
eh, our m+ resources are currently a bit lacking
strange python
it most definitely is in the guide
soft cargo
actually there is very little written about exsanguinate
i came for it too
not even a 'when its best to use'
glass palm
the only thing in the guide that is said about cleave
its
Crimson Tempest, if the dot has less than 2 seconds remaining
Garrote, if the target will live long enough
Rupture, if the target will live long enough
Envenom, the priority target
nothing about exs
lofty sand
We answered your question about exsanguinate though
crisp steppe
I reckon you should check the icy veins guide and see if theres more info there. the ravenholdt guide is pretty barebones
lofty sand
Icyveins doesn't go on detail on anything does it?
safe matrix
nah
hollow stone
In m+ on trash, use xsang on cd on a prio target when your dots are on it. Its basically for energy regen then
safe matrix
the IV guide sucks for assassination
spice surge
I mean its best to use it on CD. Should we always specify that you should use your abilities on CD? Feels rather redundant too me atleast
lofty sand
its even more vague
spice surge
But idk
hollow stone
On m+ bosses, check the pins for xsang usage
floral frost
I have a SS chest at 340 and a collective will chest at 370, for m+ which one would you take?
hollow stone
Ss
prime stirrup
for m+ its still prob better for ss
lofty sand
Eleem is right, if you have exsang and cds you should use them together, that should be fairly obvious. If your cds are not up and not going to be up anytime soon you use it.
floral frost
I also got a 340 SS head and a 370 head twist the knife , which one?
prime stirrup
stack as many as you can pretty much
hollow stone
Prob ss there too. For m+
brisk flicker
Should we stack mastery for m+?
hollow stone
Crit mast for m+ in general
prime stirrup
you might lose some ST dmg, but m+ isnt about the bosses. its about getting through trash asap
strange python
The method guy explains when to use exs on ST
Its not different on a trash pack since its a single target ability
100% uptime bleeds > exsanguinate
prime stirrup
and its not like TB where you want to tunnel st so you just hit it after opener and move on for almost all packs
floral frost
Checked my bank and found 2 SS pieces at 340, pretty surprised
2 SS > 55 ilvls combined on chest/head? Let's find out
unreal widget
should i be going down to 340 2x double dose with one SS or stick with 370 2x Archive of the titans with one SS?
for dungeon
rocky notch
SS>SoB=Archive>>>>>>>>>>>DD in dungeons
wtf is dd going to do on trash
when you're spamming fok
esp this week when you'll spend like 8 minutes of a 30 min dungeon on bosses
rocky notch
yeah and dungeon
unreal widget
SoB?
strange python
scent of blood
unreal widget
oh
rocky notch
definitely pretty close
cobalt gyro
dd is only ok if you're pulling small amounts to be safe or something
but you can't really do that in higher ones if you want to time it
prime stirrup
i thought SoB is only good on weeks like last. where youre pulling 3 packs at a time
if theres only 3 targets SoB is prob a dps loss
prime stirrup
ive only been doing carry runs this week. I havent done one for score
prime stirrup
me??
cobalt gyro
cause fort + sanguine/greivous is aids to pull more on
when every mob attacks people at random
rocky notch
???
prime stirrup
sanguine/grievous/fort is not fun at all. makes ghuuns even more of a pain
rocky notch
what in god's name do you mean mobs attack people at random
cobalt gyro
attacks like shoot, throw rock?
strange python
I still like how ghuun mobs can go through locked cells in tol dagor
prime stirrup
theres plenty of untankable adds in these dungeons
cobalt gyro
they just target people and attack them with those
rocky notch
yeah healer actually has to heal this week
god forbid
instead of just dpsing every pack
cobalt gyro
i was simply saying if you pull huge you deal with much more of that
rocky notch
people have to health pot
cobalt gyro
and 5 stacks on everyone is insane
kind jetty
hey guys what talents do you use for mythic plus and raiding?
lofty sand
There is a very good guide that covers these topics on the pins
kind jetty
ok buddy ill check it out sorry ๐
lofty sand
Is all good
cobalt gyro
crits
safe matrix
1 + every target hit with a crit
cobalt gyro
because of seal fate you can get anywhere from 1 to 5 cp from 1 fan
depending on # of targets obviously
strange python
Sometimes I come here and just watch
thorn grove
!wa
proper zealot
Venomous Wounds (passive) gives us Energy regeneration every time our Garrote and Rupture deals damage.
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
safe matrix
these are all passive that you can read about in the spellbook
venomous wounds and seal fate respectively
strange python
And the tick dmg scales with haste
glass palm
when using CR, is it worth it to maintain it on single target (the bleed) ?
proper zealot
Correct.
crisp hollow
yup
actually how many targets do you need to CT on to make it worth more than tab-rupture?
delicate crater
anyone use Scent of Blood for M+? Sims really low for single target but on trash it wins over all my traits
proper zealot
The point at which the initial damage of Crimson Tempest (multiplied by how many targets it will hit) exceeds the damage of a full-length duration Rupture, right?
Rupture's still important for Energy regeneration, though, of course.
little frigate
Hey lads, which dagger was main hand again? left or right?
proper zealot
Right.
proper zealot
What? Your main is held in your character's right hand. Is that what you're asking?
karmic ingot
The inventory slot is displayed on the left. Your character holds it in the right.
proper zealot
Yes, that.
marsh bloom
Exsg is better than TB if using CT and double SS for m+?
proper zealot
Mhmm.
gilded oak
Is CT still worth it in M+ when you have Scent of Blood? Feels like I get more out of an extra rupture on 4+ targets
kind jetty
prey of the weak talent doesnt wwork for bosses does it?
marsh bloom
so CGB is actually really good with exsg?
spice surge
Its good regardless
karmic ingot
I would run GCB + dice.
wind berry
got ask, is it worth to use Overwhelming power ? or should we just get heed my call ?
cobalt gyro
Gcb loses value with movement
karmic ingot
OP is pretty strong.
cobalt gyro
Tanks cant see your circle on the ground either so they might packs away etc
wind berry
But the fact that we lose it after damage taken undermines its value right?
delicate crater
MFD always the go-to for M+ over Vigor? It seems to win any sim i run
proper zealot
No.
strange python
not if u dont know how to use it
cobalt gyro
Mfd is really hard to be effective with
plain thistle
@wind berry its not every damage, its "avoidable" damage, still a really powerful trait
cobalt gyro
Because you have to make use of every reset
delicate crater
makes sense
cobalt gyro
Fun fact: my highest aoe sim used venom rush and mfd but I'd never realistically run that
hollow stone
I dont even know what venom rush does any more. Probably a sign that it shouldnt be used
delicate crater
I'm going to start running 2x Scent for M+ instead of 2x SS and see how I like it. The reset fairy has brought me higher ilvl AZ gear with Scent on it
vast berry
how should i use Sharpen Blades with toxic blades? only 1 of the trait
cobalt gyro
Run SS
inner pulsar
Venom Rush all day baby
cobalt gyro
It's too good to pass up in m+
strange python
@vast berry use it whenever
karmic ingot
Donโt drop all your SS for SoB.
You use sharpened blades when youโre at or near max stacks and wonโt cap combo points.
hollow stone
Still use tb normally, use dagger throw when at 29 stacks w ep up or as your last gcd in a vend @vast berry
kind jetty
does lazer matrix stack if use on 2 items?
inner pulsar
No
spice surge
Yes lazer matrix stacks, but reorigination array does not
inner pulsar
If you actually mean "Does Reorigination Array stack?"
hollow stone
Archive and LM traits stack, array buff in uldir does not
kind jetty
ok well i have the chpice on my chest either laser matrix or twist the knife. will i be best choosing lm then i already have one on my head
inner pulsar
Y'all know he meant the array buff! I guess I jumped the gun there though.
strange python
4-6 targets 40sec-1min
proper zealot
If Reorigination Array stacked while in Uldir... ๐ฎ
hollow stone
Yea. We knew. But trying to avoid follow up :p
inner pulsar
Fair enough
cobalt gyro
Uldir sets would be boring if they stacked
proper zealot
Well they're already boring.
inner pulsar
I don't think I'd seen someone asked if the actual Matrix part of LM stacked
hollow stone
If array stacked your high secondary would be too high lol
inner pulsar
Always Archive
inner pulsar
Zul would melt
errant mauve
So Iโm M+ SSx3 regardless of ilvl is ideal?
hollow stone
2250 mast on zul
strange python
no
hollow stone
Lul
inner pulsar
49% of our damage to Zul was eviscerate, 6 rogues
floral frost
So now that I have 2 SS, will I get 5 combo on every garrote?
And if so, should I instant rupture and then swap targets?
errant mauve
No CP doesnโt stack
proper zealot
No, the combo point bonus doesn't stack, just the damage does.
inner pulsar
CP generation doesn't stack
floral frost
Ah
cobalt gyro
Also if you're opening on multiple targets with ss you should spread garrotes around to make use of subterfuge and ss damage
sudden trench
Fk that would be broken af
floral frost
So I just do garrote on all targets as usual
hollow stone
I member looking at ss n being like, "that sucks youd just over cap cp if you ran 3, thats so dumb, feck dat trait". Oh how wrong i was
proper zealot
You'd just run Deeper Stratagem. ; )
cobalt gyro
God that sounds awful
delicate crater
If i sim 4-6 targets, 20-40 seconds it tells me 2x SS. If I turn up the duration past 40 seconds it tells me 2x Scent
cobalt gyro
And like I'd be energy starved
sudden trench
The rotation changes @strange python
hollow stone
I miss anticipation. That talent was my fave
strange python
@sudden trench Only a little bit lol
hollow stone
All finishers were 5cp. So nom
floral frost
I should run vigor no?
strange python
yes
sudden trench
Not everyone played it before you know
strange python
Im just saying its a minor change
floral frost
So I guess 3x garrotes, 3x ruptures, envenom then exsang on a pack with 3+ mobs?
inner pecan
no
errant mauve
Exsan only hits one target
inner pecan
if you're gonna exsg do it right after fresh dot application ye
strange python
in brackets is 1 target
floral frost
Thank you, that makes sense
errant mauve
So I simmed myself against another rogue.... I overall had higher gear at the time. We both had same 3 traits running all SS. Both had@all the same@talents. I sim higher, but when we go to the dummy he did 2-3k more dps than me over a 2 minute run.
inner pulsar
Juicce, run my 10 for the week for me
strange python
He's better stinky
inner pulsar
@errant mauve Also small sample size
strange python
Or maybe has better weapons / trinkets
errant mauve
In that run our attacks we identical, maybe 1 more attack hit on something for either of us
floral frost
Does having SS make Master Poisoner viable?
proper zealot
You're comparing one 2-minute target dummy session against tens of thousands of sims... ๐ค
strange python
@floral frost no
floral frost
And does it affect tier 7 talents? Running Poison Bomb now
inner pulsar
And every time your rotations were EXACTLY the same
floral frost
(thinking CT)
proper zealot
Okay, three against tens of thousands.
errant mauve
And weโd have almost identical hits
strange python
No @floral frost
floral frost
Thank you for the answers, currently learning how2rogue
inner pulsar
Every Rupture was done with EXACTLY the same number of CP, and refreshed at EXACTLY the same time?
strange python
of course it wasnt
inner pulsar
You know I know that
strange python
I know you know that
inner pulsar
Glad we know I know that
floral frost
What is the pandemic window of Rupture?
strange python
6.4?
errant mauve
Not exactly the same no... our hits were basically the same but our Crits and shit were different
floral frost
assuming max CP
inner pulsar
So then what is the question?
hollow stone
Ugh @inner pulsar i dont even wanna do 10s on all my chars this week
strange python
The rotation
proper zealot
๐
floral frost
Reading the guide, FoK is only used on 3T for poisons and 4T for building CP?
errant mauve
Seemed like our rotation was damn near identical with the same number of garrotes ruptures multilates and so on
strange python
not by 3k
hollow stone
So does messing up your rotation
strange python
Can u log a dummy?
hollow stone
Theres no way that you have identical gear and did the exact same rotation. The probability of that is just about 0
inner pulsar
Just for the record, how would we possibly be able to tell you anything of value without actually seeing a log of said "tests"
strange python
So im guessing that u can log a dummy
inner pulsar
You can
errant mauve
Yeah
strange python
Then we can only speculate
errant mauve
We compared our logs on the dummy, our gear isnโt exactly the same.
strange python
aha
keen hound
just because you have higher ilv does not mean you have better gear
errant mauve
Overall I had better gear but not by a lot maybe 3 ilvls
hollow stone
Like, it could be something completely unrelated like your latency
strange python
Traits?
keen hound
higher ilv =/= better
errant mauve
Both had same talents and same traits
inner pulsar
Crit level, haste level?
keen hound
trinkets?
inner pulsar
Phase of the moon?
keen hound
weapon ilv?
hollow stone
I feel like we're going nowhere with this
strange python
Because we are
hollow stone
Link logs or figure it out yourself
Maybe he was hitting his keys harder, everyone knows the harder you hit your keys the more likely you are to crit
inner pulsar
Careful now.....
keen hound
I would say just link the armories
proper zealot
Armory isn't all that helpful.
Logs would be best.
You could have the best gear in the world and have 0% uptime on Garrote or something.
safe matrix
you gotta link something substantial like a log otherwise people are just guessing what could be your issues
keen hound
it would be a preliminary examination. Yes, logs would be best. But I guarantee you the guy thinks his gear is better b/c it is higher ilv when in fact he has bad stats, bad trinks, etc.
cobalt gyro
I mean a 1 on parse doesn't mean a lot with a small sample size
I could pull 20k in a 3 minute once because i crit everything
proper zealot
No, but it could/would still reveal poor performance.
safe matrix
most people dont look at that, they look at your casts and what you've done
and critique your rotation
keen hound
on such a short duration parse (2 min) the biggest contributor is going to be the opener
safe matrix
regardless of rng
proper zealot
That's not necessarily true, either. He could get the opener down perfectly and then forget about Garrote or Rupture for the rest of the fight.
inner pulsar
Think he probably gets it at this point
proper zealot
Bottom line is we will need to see logs before being able to give any good advice.
hollow stone
dead horse meme
strange python
nop
inner pulsar
So negative, all the time
tacit wedge
Hello my sin friends
Is Bursting Blood potion any good in certain situation (big pull for eg.), or potion of agility all the way?
fluid orbit
Hi I have a question about the openner ! the Galcaller's Boon must be used before i put my DOTS (1 seconds before the pull) or after ? At the same time of the Vendetta ?
proper zealot
Use it right before you use Exsanguinate.
fluid orbit
I play with the toxic blade
proper zealot
Well the answer's still the same in that you'll go Vendetta > on-use Galecaller's Boon.
frigid kestrel
fluid orbit
And with a macro for start vendetta and gallecaller's boon ?
inner pulsar
Did you read the pinned guide?
inner pulsar
hahah
strange python
bruuuh
tacit wedge
The double Rupture makes me confused
inner pulsar
Yeah, lot going on there
primal gazelle
looks like an opener for someone who forgot to put on poisons
proper zealot
Dang, that log is an 87th percentile for his bracket... ๐ฎ
proper zealot
Obviously, I'm just saying. I'm surprised it's that high.
proper zealot
First thing he cast was Shadowstep. ๐
harsh sphinx
missing the first rupture, then did he get sanguine on him after he popped vendetta? guessing thats why cloak
inner pulsar
So many questions!
proper zealot
I would assume that's what happened there, yeah.
Time to bring in forensics. We'll figure this out.
median mason
Swipe
harsh sphinx
right after you use TB->G->R then envenoms, wanna make sure you doing have to refresh G and R after you TB
sry bad english there make sure you don't have to refresh G and R after TB
proper zealot
Huh? You don't want to have to touch Garrote or Rupture after you use Toxic Blade.
strange python
thats what he said
drifting elbow
why would u touch G and R after TB
proper zealot
You just want to spam Mutilates into Envenoms while the target has the TB debuff.
strange python
broo he corrected himself
harsh sphinx
yes sry thats what i mean if it came out wrong
strange python
chiiil
harsh sphinx
saying thats what he did a little after the opener
drifting elbow
he didnt tho
daring imp
but then how would we roast ya
drifting elbow
he did nothing after TB
drifting elbow
he got fucked with debuff thing but yeah
proper zealot
Popped his trinket and Vendetta and then Cloaked a couple of seconds later.
drifting elbow
getting roasted on opener 
daring imp
ought to cloak the debuff if it starts right off the bat coming on you
you don't wanna mess up opener
inner pulsar
Is he even still here to read any of this?
drifting elbow
replay was interesting
daring imp
@_@"
grim blade
Hey all, quick question. For on use trinkets (in this case Galecallers / haste trink), I noticed streamers (flawless) pop right before casting exseng. For TB build do you pop with your potion and then on cooldown? or pair up with vanish / vendetta?
drifting elbow
u just use with vendetta
daring imp
i pop on cd when i know my tank won't fuck shit up
harsh sphinx
daring imp
must've been debuff again
harsh sphinx
unfortunate but something you can def improve at
drifting elbow
well cant improve when being super unlucky with debuff coming onto u 2x
strange python
He could def cloak the first one though
proper zealot
Just gotta own the mistake at that point. Stay in and DPS the boss. ; )
sour wasp
does double dose get extra dmg from TB?
daring imp
Atleast should, it's nature dmg
tacit wedge
But the envenom applicate the nature damages from deadly poison
sour wasp
tooltip says "poisons the target" but it dals physical dmg haHAA
drifting elbow
....
proper zealot
Missed opportunities, Blizzard. : /
drifting elbow
doesnt poison at all when u havent refreshed poison buffs
skill itself is physical but poison dmg comes from coated blades with poison on hits
desert vault
What a tease today with alliance first mate trinket and azerite wq. I got an "upgradge" on trinket, avoidance. Pvp trait on azerite piece...
crisp steppe
any1 know if vectis takes dmg during intermission? (is it worth reapplying dots prior to intermission)
crisp steppe
so you're saying it takes damage, or are you saying you don't know but do it anyway.
prime stirrup
most bosses fall into 2 categories when talking about dmg reduction. 99.9% reduction. or like ghuun where he just heals all the dmg done to him. So either way its additional dmg, and energy regen
but im pretty damn sure that during liquify he still takes dmg. I believe he takes full dmg too
tacit wedge
What about checking by using addon like Mik scrollbar or just checking combat log if it keep ticking?
prime stirrup
Im looking at my last pull from vectis last night. He is still taking dmg from garrote/rupture during liquify. so its definitely worth to reapply
tacit wedge
๐
crisp steppe
@prime stirrup thanks I just came to the same conclusion after checking. appreciate that m8
maiden siren
crisp steppe
do I want to read that or not
crisp steppe
nice ๐
tacit wedge
Have to wait 8.1 
My rogue have 285ilvl shoulders for like 2 weeks now 
My warlock is hardstuck with 340 head 
cobalt gyro
it's not too dissimilar to the legendary vendor
crisp steppe
praise the lord
cobalt gyro
at least they didn't wait until 8.3
strange python
yeah this is nice
crisp steppe
@cobalt gyro my thoughts exactly
tacit wedge
@cobalt gyro They learned from Legion Legendary
strange python
nah lol
They just had so much negative feedback
That they decided to do something for the community
prime stirrup
it was such a good system though. I finally got duskwalker footpads as my 12th lego
cobalt gyro
i mean it was worse than legion legendary
at least legion legendary you could do anything
to get that drop
even WQ
strange python
yup
cobalt gyro
as a mostly m+ player it's nice that i have easier access to this
i basically only was able to get upgrades through luck in uldir pugs or my weeekly
strange python
like everyone?
prime stirrup
ya. we could go entire tiers without getting good azerite pieces from m+ cache. this is definitely a good change
cobalt gyro
kinda, i don't have a guild so it's a bit more extreme
at least if you're raiding with a guild, repeats will be traded around etc
tacit wedge
Raiding 
proper zealot
Hmm, that's an okay change, I guess. Being able to buy a cache every two or three weeks that'll give you either a Azerite helm, shoulders or chest piece is alright, but I'm curious as to how long it will take to save for a specific piece, because those cost a "premium."
cobalt gyro
if you grinded it out
strange python
but we'll see
proper zealot
You get the currency from your weekly cache, though.
Spamming M+ won't affect that.
cobalt gyro
you get it from that and from scrapping purple azerite gear
tacit wedge
The only way to grind it is doing your weekly +10 and cleaning all 10 dung in MM and hoping for azerite piece to scrap
prime stirrup
I cant wait to go back to farming 50 m+ in a week! it will be like 2 months ago
proper zealot
Scrapping/disenchanting will help a bit, but not that much, because you still need Azerite gear in the first place, which is either coming from the caches you're now buying, or from raid.
strange python
well
proper zealot
Those 340 Azerite pieces from Mythic zeroes will likely reward hardly any of the currency.
(I would assume.)
I really don't wanna do world tours again.
tacit wedge
Blizzard wants us to scrap our 385 Mythic Uldir gear to buy a SS piece 
strange python
From the currency itself
But u will probably have to play like 5 weeks
to get a 385
proper zealot
Well the thing is that you're saving to pay a premium cost to buy a specific 385 piece, too, which won't be as good come Tides when the item levels go up.
Not sure how I feel about that.
whole dew
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
tacit wedge
8.1 will be the new scenario, armor for dwarves&BE and account-wide necklace I guess
And 8.1.5 the raid
proper zealot
Oh, I guess. 385 will be a bit low once the raid hits, though.
tacit wedge
Do we have the ilvl range of gear dropped in Zuldazar? Something like 395-415?
proper zealot
Pretty sure Normal is 385, Heroic is 400 and Mythic is 415.
rocky notch
this system will for sure scale with ilvl
proper zealot
I hope it does. ๐ค
rocky notch
"with the specific 385 pieces as long-term goals for top players."
this line pretty much says it'll give you top end gear
paper bough
Guess which trinkets sim highest between 385 deadeye spyglass, 380 lustrous plumage, 365 Harlanโs dice , fathoms
daring iron
depends on the fight, aoe or single
whole dew
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Do my azerite traits stack?
The damage part of azerite Stacks.
Other components can be assumed to stack however with some exceptions and limitations.
You can check https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/azerite-stacks/1t-t22-assassination for estimations.
proper zealot
I'd guess 385 Deadeye and Fathoms.
vital haven
spice surge
This change will essentially make it so people cant trade azerite again though ๐
Or well, atleast to people youre not very close with
proper zealot
I mean, the Azerite gear we have a lot of extras of now had better be worth almost nothing in this new currency when scrapped/disenchanted.
If I lose out because I didn't keep every 325 or 340 piece I've looted, I'm going to be disappointed.
spice surge
340 prob not worth anything, but you can just restore it
proper zealot
But that implies I still have the crafting reagents I got from disenchanting them, which I have most-certainly already sold. ๐
proper zealot
Hahahaha, I know that.
Could you imagine needing the exact crafting reagent?!
๐ฎ
It just means I'd have to buy a bunch of Veiled Crystals and Umbra Shards and stuff before being able to restore all of those Azerite pieces.
harsh sphinx
they already said i believe existing azerite won't count towards the currency, so don't bother hording / farming it now
proper zealot
Thank the Lord.
harsh sphinx
maybe heroic or something will but no 340 i believe
proper zealot
In Thrall We Trust.
Although...
This could be like the time they said old emissary quest rewards won't reward new Legendaries, and they did.
Can never really trust Blizzard.
tribal lark
Thrall ๐
proper zealot
What, you don't believe in Green Jesus? D:
crude hinge
turbid ingot
does shurouded suffocation sim right?
daring imp
well ... yes o_o
turbid ingot
hmm
slow finch
Question: So say I killed Taloc on Raid Normal with raid group #1. In that same week before reset on Tuesday, I go in again to Taloc Normal Raid with Group #2. I know I cant get loot the 2nd time around NOR trades from other players from group #2.
Question: But can I use a re-roll to get an item on the 2nd go around with Group 2 for a item drop for me from the re-roll coin? Or does it ONLY ever drop azerite?
turbid ingot
hmm thats good to know so would u take it over archive then? i feel like i get more out of ss
lone junco
in raid, you have no reason to not have 1 archive tbh.
2nd depends on ilvl over other traits.
turbid ingot
okay thx
daring imp
azerite targetting in 8.1 inc, i'll finally have 385 sob's & ss's
spice surge
385 isnt gonna be very stronk in 8.1 though, 415 from new mythic ๐
daring imp
oh well, it goes up when m+ season increases so, the example of 385 was just an example ๐ข
proper zealot
@slow finch You can go back and bonus roll bosses you're already saved to, yes.
gentle rapids
I'm looking through the sim apl and it uses arcane torrent during the subterfuge window of vanish, so garrote - torrent - garrote, am I actually supposed to do this?
quartz drift
if I dont have SS - do I use Master Assassin?
safe matrix
generally no though
stark yacht
!trinkets
inner pecan
aim for galecallers + high ilvl dice/spyglass or fathoms
hollow jungle
Whatโs your haste at?
dapper moat
21%
daring imp
sim fully buffed
muted jacinth
you have no archive or laser matrix active so you dont get array. also sim with exsang too to see if its higher. I just simmed you and exsang simmed like 100 dps higher. ideally change your helm to an archive lol that trait sucks
dapper moat
ah yeah ty m8
yeah got unlucky with daily cache, gonna try out my 355 azerite helmet
lean coral
anyone elses details not working anymore with this update
wintry parcel
I need opinions to sway me one way or the other. I am currently 1x Archive 2x SS. I just got 370 shoulders with Sharpened Blades. Raidbots shows those shoulders are better than my current shoulders with SS (355), but only between 10-40 dps. If it were in your guys' shoes, would you go 1x Archive, 1x SS, 1x Sharpened Blades or 1x Archive, 2x SS?
proper zealot
I wouldn't drop SS for 10-40 DPS, especially in a Mythic+ setting.
Especially not for Sharpened Blades.
proper zealot
It depends, really. That Sharpened Blades piece wouldn't be a DPS gain in a M+ dungeon over the SS piece it would replace.
As far as gaining 10-40 DPS single-target but having to use a Sharpened Blades power? No, thanks.
supple hearth
strong nimbus
guys i simmed my char , the result is 15.4k
but i can even hold 11.5k on a raider dummy
my rotation could be the problem ?
ruby idol
yup!
proper zealot
Your best bet is posting logs of your performance, that way we can look at those and have a better idea of what youโre doing.
fading spade
@dapper moat if youre trying to sim for raid, right now you dont have any piece with archive or LM active. it makes a huge difference
round harbor
Exsang is the best of the three choices
In m+
Gives you near infinite energy for the duration of the exsang
smoky lantern
stack haste or crit for m+
marsh bloom
do we use it with ct as well?
round harbor
Multistrike
marsh bloom
i've never heard of that ability
round harbor
It's a stat
sacred zenith
Even dagger in the back etc, all sorts of bleeds iirc
round harbor
Pound for pound internal bleeding is op
marsh bloom
I mean when should we use it
like after rupture garrote and ct are on it?
won't be much time left on garrote rupture then
multistrike is a stat??
proper zealot
I'd probably go Garrote > Garrote > Garrote + Rupture (on priority target in the pack) > Exsanguinate, because you're right that if you go Crimson Tempest over Rupture then you're not going to have a lot of time left on the other DoTs to get good use out of Exsanguinate.
Also, having the Exsanguinate rolling at that point helps you with the Energy to get back up to 5 CP for Crimson Tempest.
And no, Multistrike isn't a secondary stat anymore.
If the pull's big enough you're probably just going to go triple Garrote into Crimson Tempest, though.
royal forge
I miss multistrike
stoic aspen
how many targets in a pull in a m+ settings does CT need to outperform PB?
feels like whenever I run keys on fort week the tanks pull much smaller and CT feels underwhelming
since of course I don't know any DK's
proper zealot
It definitely shines on bigger pulls.
smoky lantern
is scent of blood decent in m+?
molten moon
Is anyone's Details add-on broken after the update today?
proper zealot
Yup, actually. I just updated mine and now it's gone in-game.
molten moon
....same and can't seem to load it
proper zealot
Oh well. It was getting boring constantly seeing myself on top for DPS. : )
molten moon
thats the only reason i play this game
proper zealot
This game's like a girlfriend that just won't accept that I've dumped her multiple times now.
loud kelp
guys, is incite the pack better than SS?
i have a chance to use 2 SS, with 1 AT
or 1ss, 1 incite, 1 at
proper zealot
Have you simmed yourself?