poisoned*
#assassination
vestal abyss
What you lose when you TB before envenom:
- A TB crit
- 1 global TB uptime
What you gain:
- A 75% chance for a second envenom crit
hazy sphinx
How much dmg does a TB crit do
vestal abyss
quite a lot
hazy sphinx
Cmon
glass vessel
like 20k lol
arctic lake
so many
wheat zealot
"Dont cargo me"
exotic glen
interesting
vestal abyss
wowhead is blocked at work for me, but you can just check the AP scaling for both
strange python
rofl
glass vessel
not wortht he crit GCD during MA
hazy sphinx
I prefer getting 1 dollar with a chance at another dollar if I just have to wait 1 second.
vestal abyss
We had this discussion before and i was in the double envenom camp, but i dont remember the counterarguments
exotic glen
yeah
hollow stone
Yea, i think michee is right lol
exotic glen
you guys do what you want
glass vessel
this is partially why the discord exists is to talk and find out about these things
hazy sphinx
May make or break a log though.
From orange to purple. Or in somes cases, from gray to whatever is above that.
spice surge
"arguments" this is a discussion that can be solved by doing the math. One is factually better than the other, tb during MA is on average better
strange python
Then mess with the APL and force it to use TB before vanish
Then compare both sims
hazy sphinx
That requires technical knowledge that I do not have.
strange python
Like it could literally be 50dps difference rofl
exotic glen
you could try asking someone to sim it instead of claiming your solution to be better then zid
glass vessel
if APL proves that i'll shutup, im curious to see it if someone can do it
hazy sphinx
I meant I'd learn how to do it myself.
strange python
Ok then ill try to force apl to use tb before vanish
hazy sphinx
So I don't have to rely on your false claims and unnecessary insults. Don't cargo me bro. Get out of here.
glass vessel
my dad can beat up your dad
hazy sphinx
Michee are you sure? That's not a question, it's a request.
exotic glen
my socks are crustier than yours
hazy sphinx
😃
hollow stone
He'd have to dig up my dad first
hollow stone
Rogues live in the shadows, class fantasy baby
inner pulsar
Triage Rogue is the new class fantasy
hollow stone
Ive gotten orange parses on every boss for triage rogue, ama
hazy sphinx
Cause if not I'll have to eat my words and apologize.
glass vessel
that's out of line zid calm yourself
exotic glen
i already stubbed my other toe listening to you
glass vessel
can someone mess witht he APL to tell me how many licks it takes to gt to the center of the tootsie-pop pls
inner pulsar
Also, TB before Vanish if you like living on the Edge, hoping for that sweet sweet 4 CP Mut
exotic glen
ill stub them when i want
inner pulsar
Which you will probably get using MA
glass vessel
let the sim decide
hazy sphinx
Confirmed, Cargo doesn't let his foot dangle off the edge of bed at night for fear of 4 CP envenoms.
glass vessel
anyone mesing with the APL
inner pulsar
I doubt very seriously if it makes a big difference though
glass vessel
yea the difference is extremely small, i aint denying that
hollow stone
If you have 25% crit before ma, you have a 56% chance to get a 4cp env. Beat them odds
glass vessel
but better is still better. would like to see what wins out
i chase the orange parses baby
vestal abyss
1.3*(1 <env crit dmg> * 0.75 + <env non-crit dmg> * 0.25> ) + <mut crit dmg> * 0.75 + <mut non-crit dmg> 0.25 + 1.3(<env crit dmg> * 0.75 * 0.75 ) #won't envenom again if your mut didnt crit
vs
<tb crit dmg> * 0.75 + <tb non-crit dmg> * 0.25> + 1.3*(<env crit dmg> * 0.75 + <env non-crit dmg> * 0.25>) + <mut crit dmg> * 0.75 + <mut non-crit dmg> *0.25
calculate it friendos
hazy sphinx
Yeh, let me just pop this into my phones calculator.
glass vessel
..... my math says all of that = 2
inner pulsar
I'm in the Perennially Purple camp, so I dont think my TB placement on the 2-3 vanishes you get in a fight is going to make a big difference in my life
exotic glen
if you read the apl tho its fucking weird
every vanish use is different
even refreshes rupture on one
hazy sphinx
Could the APL be... wrong?
exotic glen
i didnt say that
hazy sphinx
Did I quote you bro?!
vestal abyss
i think it just coded as priority above everything else
so its just on cd given that garrote is up
hazy sphinx
I asked if it could be... wrong
exotic glen
i hope your mom tells you she doesnt love you
hazy sphinx
Damn, we haven't spoken in months.
quaint flare
hazy sphinx
I should call her.
exotic glen
regularily
strange python
CAN someone tell me why seliathan top 1 m+ rogue is suggesting me from his stream 2seconds ago to go 3x SS for m+ and everyone here is saying ss is worst trait for m+ ???
inner pulsar
She doesn't want to hear from you
quaint flare
hazy sphinx
SS is the best for M+
glass vessel
@strange python it was a troll. 3x SS is insane
hazy sphinx
Dude went out and did some damn research
Came back with facts an assertions. Holy shit
glass vessel
does that dude stream? im bored want to watch some rogue m+
exotic glen
he does
inner pulsar
Go ask Seliathan how he gets 4 garrotes in a Subterfuge window
exotic glen
strange python
@glass vessel fuck u man dont troll ...
strange python
@glass vessel
glass vessel
i said SS si the best lmao
exotic glen
@glass vessel
vestal abyss
@glass vessel
strange python
@strange python yes and u confused me its not funny ..
glass vessel
aw fack
hollow stone
Its because of all his haste @inner pulsar .. cause of gcd
inner pulsar
Wait, did you just @ yourself?
glass vessel
uhhh haste doesnt affect our GCD i thought?
exotic glen
@exotic glen
late niche
why is shrouded suffocation so low on bloodmallet's Hectic add cleave
strange python
@warm shadow i did hahaha dont mind that
strange python
xDDD
spice surge
@late niche #tc-updates Aethys post
exotic glen
yeah what eleem said
glass vessel
because hectic add cleave is tiny adds that dont last long enough to make it worth @late niche
spice surge
No
late niche
oh ty
inner pulsar
Alright, alright, I don't want Richard to come in here and shake his finger at us for trolling people
spice surge
Its because of what aethys said
exotic glen
well intentionally giving out wrong information is like
the exact opposite of why this discord exists
inner pulsar
Except when the correct information has been posted in this Discord 5303828282 times
glass vessel
no restealth well that's lame
inner pulsar
And all you have to do is read for more than 2 minutes, and your question will be answered
exotic glen
they're building a dungeon profile tho niko
glass vessel
nice meme
hazy sphinx
I'm getting a fuckign dagger today.
glass vessel
no youre not
hazy sphinx
Watch
glass vessel
youre gonna get a pair fo fuking bracers and you're going to like it
or a cloak
cloaks are nice too
inner pulsar
But, credit to the guy for going to do some extra research
vestal abyss
i hope i get shoulders
frozen karma
I really want a decent azerite piece
exotic glen
i hope you get a fan of blades azerite piece zid
hazy sphinx
On my way to get that dagger
frozen karma
haven't gotten one from m+ cache yet
inner pulsar
Also, if he even has 3 SS traits at an ilvl to make the conversation worth having, I'd eat my hat
hazy sphinx
Gonna get the PvP one first.
exotic glen
what type of hat
hollow stone
Still thinking ss for this week's m+ affixes on high keys? Im think i might run my st gear w ct
inner pulsar
ANY type
glass vessel
scrapped my 325 galecallers because i was tirede of it looking at me wrong
hollow stone
Trash should fold hard this week
exotic glen
you would still go ss
hazy sphinx
This looks like an outlaw week.
exotic glen
applejuice
inner pulsar
@hollow stone SS is terrible for M+
glass vessel
would still run 1 SS
exotic glen
maybe go for high ilvl scent if you have one
solid nova
Imagine if rules took 2 minutes to read 
glass vessel
regardless of affixes in M+
hazy sphinx
Oh shit he's here.
exotic glen
richard save me
hollow stone
Im talking just high keys, like 12+
exotic glen
still ss
glass vessel
still at least 1 SS. it's way too good
inner pulsar
Hold on a sec, before you go getting on me, I was not present for this particular act of trolling
glass vessel
BAN HIM
inner pulsar
Well, I just wasn't online yet....
hazy sphinx
solid nova
Nothing else
hazy sphinx
From the PvP chest
strange python
Ok
hazy sphinx
Oh shit he's here
exotic glen
i hope you accidentally delete it
hazy sphinx
drum roll
exotic glen
with no item recovery
hazy sphinx
the buuild up
strange python
https://gyazo.com/36403d87735beb4dbbd91b6f320df319 Tb after vanish
hollow stone
Im so excited
strange python
glass vessel
FUCK
hazy sphinx
OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
exotic glen
lmao
hazy sphinx
OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
hollow stone
Ahhhhh
solid nova
TLDR: Who won?
exotic glen
intredasting
hazy sphinx
"cargo has left the channel"
hollow stone
33 deeps big diiiiiick
inner pulsar
Lol, exactly as predicted, TB before is better, but by an insignificant margin
exotic glen
@glass vessel fuck u too buddy
exotic glen
are you an idiot niko
placid elbow
Blood Rite vs Scent of Blood
hazy sphinx
we won
elder gulch
385 double dose or 340 SS?
glass vessel
oh ROFL
exotic glen
tb before vanish won
hazy sphinx
You don't deserve this victory anymore Niko.
glass vessel
misread. still havent had coffee
exotic glen
well guess you can post this in #tc-research channel then
elder gulch
385 tentacle-laced Spaulders vs 340 gold-tasseled Epaulets
hazy sphinx
Got 2 azerite pieces this week.
frosty gyro
Don't tentacle laced have DD?
hazy sphinx
Both aren't bad.
elder gulch
yes
hollow stone
I cant wait for this same argument in an hour. Who's excited??
hazy sphinx
Which one?
inner pulsar
Haha
hazy sphinx
This needs to be posted in the research.
hollow stone
Tb van arg
elder gulch
but is DD 385 better than 340 SS for M+
hazy sphinx
It's a great victory for us TB before Vanish players.
novel island
385 heavy haste/mastery waist today from chest. I'll take it.
hazy sphinx
We didn't need no sims to tell us what our hearts knew.
glass vessel
rekt @exotic glen
exotic glen
im up to 4 toes now
solid nova
Room for improvement
hushed maple
Do I still use Fan on Knives at 2+ Targets?
glass vessel
coffee time. i earned it
solid nova
Let my people contact your people
inner pulsar
solid nova
And i'll see what we can do
inner pulsar
Not a cloak this time
exotic glen
big
inner pulsar
Wish I had nutted up and done a 10
hushed maple
Traits suck, tho
fresh coyote
does master assassin work decently for M+? or is subterfuge still the way to go?
hazy sphinx
The agi alone will be an upgrade.
inner pulsar
And since Zul is being an ASS about his shoulders
tropic rover
How many item levels is the third stack of SS worth in M+?
tropic rover
I got 385 DD shoulders from my cache this week, womdering if it's worth it to drop the 3rd stack of SS with a 45 ilvl upgrade
ocean robin
I need help.. I have a 355 azerite chest with SS(my only SS trait), and I just got a new 370 chest with DD and Battlefield precision... No clue which one to use. Is it worth to use the 370 chest?
hazy sphinx
before good man
go with this knowledge and spread it to all who would listen.
We beat the APL today. We beat Skynet.
strange python
@vocal wave use however u like it rofl
elder gulch
how many itm lvl is SS worth in m=?
frozen karma
it's barely anything
elder gulch
m+?
inner pulsar
Wow, 1.8% increase, even with the shit trait
glass vessel
@elder gulch my 340 SS beats out 385 meticulous in m+ by a small margin. but meticulous is one of the absolute worst traits
elder gulch
is DD a bad trait for m+?
strange python
Nah
inner pulsar
Lets attack it this way, what traits do you actually have?
vocal wave
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/58MVSrn7Q7cK2tZh7rN4i8
All I got man. It's fun for m+ but a bit eh for raids.
elder gulch
kk so i imagine it'll be much better. ima sim. thank you for the response!
exotic glen
cargo the skynet perpetrator has been defeated
vocal wave
My biggest issue is my trinkets. I swear to god, KT Cannon feels so much weaker than Glad Badge. Like not the 0.2% it's saying or anything
glass vessel
im gonna come take a shit on your pillow to celebrate my victory @exotic glen
hazy sphinx
Damn
vocal wave
But having that extra big CD to pop during trash packs is pretty nice
exotic glen
fucker
elder gulch
when you sim for m+ what's a good number of bosses? 6?
glass vessel
whoa thats kinky
strange python
@elder gulch depends on week
hazy sphinx
Make sure you TB him before doing it though
glass vessel
@elder gulch 5-6 bosses for 40sec
inner pulsar
No no, you shit between the mattress and the box spring. They will never find it
solid nova
@inner pulsar Reform
glass vessel
whoa that's brilliant
inner pulsar
Sigh
arctic walrus
Is it normal for Lazer matrix to sim higher than archive for me?
hushed maple
I feel your struggle Liquid......
I am not at home
And I have 3x DD OR 2x DD and either 1x Archive or SS but all items are 340 except for Archive Shoulders, which are 355
inner pulsar
I suggested a more optimal approach to shitting on someone's bed, which apparently is offtopic
elder gulch
@hushed maple you should have 1 ss trait for m+ and go 2x DD
hollow stone
I mean, it depends on your goal of the bed shitting; do you want them to know you did it? Or do you want it to smell like shit as long as possible?
Sorry richard. This is just too captivating
solid nova
@hollow stone Enough OT talk
inner pulsar
Alright, so....... SS is still good for M+?
strange python
nope
solid nova
You've used up your free warnings, be good and carry on your wisdom within rogue stuff
strange python
😄
elder gulch
holy shit.... i got 385 shoulders. I sim and it comes out worse thn 340 SS. how tf
inner pulsar
Or how about...... is Archive better than SS in raid?
hazy sphinx
I mean, im officially at the point
elder gulch
arichive is better than raid
hazy sphinx
That archive is better
hollow cloud
I expect an answer will be found
inner pulsar
Or......, ok I got it, is Fathoms any good
elder gulch
than ss in raid*
hazy sphinx
Too good.
glass vessel
fathoms is amazing
hollow stone
I am def gonna be giving my higher ilvl more st dps set up for at least 1 m+ over ss set at lower ilvl for this week, see how it goes
inner pulsar
Haha
glass vessel
@hollow stone no SS you're gonna cry on AoE
hazy sphinx
I'm not running SS anymore and it feels clunky, but fun.
hollow stone
I think w tyrannical and no poopy trash affixes it MIGHT be faster given my comp
hollow stone
Eh, the ma fok ct fok opener is OKAY. Its no ggg but
strange python
tb before vanish and use fok on 1 target
inner pulsar
Pew pew
hollow stone
Shh dont tell them my dirty outlaw secret
inner pulsar
@strange python Wait, is TB before Vanish better?!
sturdy python
Outlaw is love.
inner pulsar
hollow stone
My sin and outlaw st sim within 50 dps w outlaw higher
strange python
😄
hollow stone
It makes me sad
inner pulsar
Wait, but do you FEEL like TB before vanish is better?
inner pulsar
Haha
novel island
MP and EP has simmed within 100 DPS since I came back a few weeks ago. Is that about the same with most of you?
inner pulsar
EP for life dude
strange python
Ghuun is open in LFR
novel island
Yea, currently using EP, but was curious as if that will continue as I get more gear. Currently around 370 atm. I literally do no raiding so it is a slow go.
inner pulsar
@strange python Yeah, let me rush to do that.....
exotic glen
are you kidding
strange python
I mean
errant mauve
whats the most accurate sim website? i get different results by a good margin from ask mr robot and raid bot
strange python
Theres no debuff for pickin the orb
exotic glen
i do no raiding
currently 370
strange python
So same 2-3 people can run it
supple hearth
@errant mauve raidbots/simc
exotic glen
😢 tfw 373 and i've been raiding everything possible in bfa so far
inner pulsar
@strange python Same two people can fail at running it
novel island
I see lots of people way up there in IL.
inner pulsar
Or they get rid of the cysts
strange python
oh yeah rofl
Or reduce the amount
I havent done any lfr
Taloc once but tahts it
glass vessel
a lot of our guild does LFR before mythic to get a new stack of the buff
novel island
I hit 27 yesterday on my neck, was pretty happy with that. Still 4 more to go to use all the bonuses
stuck shuttle
yep LFR for stacks only
glass vessel
nah i want that LFR dagger. its purple. looks awesome
final stone
bois RNjesus was good to me last night!
stuck shuttle
I do LFR if its before raid time
inner pulsar
Herpes test came back negative?!
novel island
Lfr is what I raid :)
glass vessel
if RNG gives me a galecallers from chest ill give @exotic glen a nice footrub
final stone
375 plumage and 370 lions guile!! we rocking them cds bois
i got a shit ring from cache soo riiip
exotic glen
ill fucking stub all of them so they can be as deformed as possible for my footrub @glass vessel
glass vessel
used a reroll for lion's guile I want it so bad
inner pulsar
WHat is the NA world boss this week?
strange python
some fucker in nazmir i thiunk
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/sFiAbdWo27k4SX2ekMPMdU without any buffs 40sec / 6boss /patchwerk this good?
wooden giant
hollow stone
Heh. Bis for st not bad not bad
mint oar
i'm getting scammed
strange python
not bad
strange python
dont worry i got boots 3 weeks in a row
mint oar
i'm gonna get benched 4 life
unreal coyote
i cant get a gale above 360 to save my life
mint oar
every other rogue be like yo i get bis 385 pieces
glass vessel
i cant veen get one at all. feels bad
hollow stone
Az pieces 3 weeks in a row. Gettin' a crystal this week and im ok w that
mint oar
meanwhile i get fucking rings i dont need
digital kindle
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
final stone
@unreal coyote nt bad... haha more like so HUUUge
jolly trout
Would Archieve + 2 SS be better for m+ than 3 SS if you could maintain the Archieve STacks from Pack to Pack?
strange python
nvm
inner pulsar
World boss azerite piece is going to be 355 max huh?
strange python
Depends on how high the key is
lilac lily
Got 370 chest yesterday with DD, and 385 shoulder with DD today 🤔
strange python
Im running 9+s and I use 370 archive + 340SS and 370SS
final stone
so plumage/ionsguile think swapping out plumage out for harlans on non st boss fights
i have fathoms too
strange python
dice is very good in m+
mint oar
yeah
strange python
thats not cheesing rofl
keen briar
Currently equiped chest 355 Archive of the titans vs 385 Rezan's Fury... although, which trait is better for m+?
strange python
not really
hollow stone
Multi target sim
inner pulsar
Archive is better, but I'd be willing to bet that jump in ilvl is worth it
ripe nimbus
nice got 385 SS azerite shoulders in chest. now i have 2 385 SS trait azerite pieces
ez life
glass vessel
jeeez
hazy sphinx
Damn
honest iris
Damn it I got a 385 double dose 😦
hazy sphinx
I got a 385 sharpned blades now, gotta get used to throwing it.
honest iris
i wanted ss haha
spice surge
"damn i got a bis piece"
ripe nimbus
monkaS
dapper moat
How come dooms wake is so high suddently?
gray shuttle
Weapon Enchants???
spice surge
Yes
honest iris
would you go master assassin talent with double dose?
ripe nimbus
actually thats with TB let me sim with exsang lol
gray shuttle
PINNED MESSAGE IS VAGUE
spice surge
Its not
unkempt gulch
check pin
strange python
asking for m+ when do you refresh crimson tempest?
hazy sphinx
Pandemic
strange python
and do you use crimson on 1 or 2 targets?
final stone
no
frosty gyro
Does CT pandemic?
hollow stone
Weap chants: your two highest simming traits.
Use ma when using dd (sim to confirm) but it should be better
hazy sphinx
Yes it does.
ripe nimbus
even more MonkaS
opaque grotto
Why don’t you just sim the enchants instead of crying about not wanting to read pins?
spice surge
MonkaS
hazy sphinx
I still don't know what that monkas shit means
supple hearth
@gray shuttle my opinion is to check the pin
hollow stone
Red orcs arent from round these parts
ripe nimbus
frosty gyro
It's a twitch emote
spice surge
@hazy sphinx https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/monkas
frosty gyro
That
hollow cloud
@hazy sphinx monkaS is just the best emoji around
It represents us as a people
in shape of a frog
🙏
supple hearth
Off topic btw
hazy sphinx
A website to learn your memes. We've literally gone full circle.
hollow cloud
Felt like I had to answer his question 
strange python
asking for m+ when do you refresh crimson tempest? and do you use crimson on 1 or 2 targets?
hollow stone
Refresh it within pand window, and if it will last til they die. 3+ targets
ornate gazelle
With a Twist the Knife trait, do we want to be trying to Envenom at max combo points or still 4+?
strange python
pand window?
hollow stone
Google "wow pandemic". It will explain way better than i will
stuck shuttle
Bleeds and dots add 30% of the remaining time to your newly refreshed bleed
hollow stone
You prob still env at 4-5 cp. i doubt the wasted cps make up for the dmg of twist
lilac lily
Use Garrote to get the fifth combo point, unless it's empowered
if you cant, envenom at 4~5
hollow stone
But idk for sure
lilac lily
unless you would override an empowered garrote with a regular one is what i meant
strange python
Fixed a bug causing the bonus damage from Shrouded Suffocation to fall off if the rogue used Garrote on another target.
fixed 5th october
hollow stone
Yea. Definitely. When the stars align and garr is within pandemic and you have 4cp, g into 5cp env
onyx edge
Hey guys, what would be your opener on a 2 bosses encounter, like council in Freehold or SotS ?
strange python
4th*
lilac lily
You can garrote for the 5th cp even outside of pandemic I'm pretty sure
hollow stone
Traits/talents needed to help @onyx edge
rough garnet
new rogue here guys, any guide with m+ bis items??
hollow stone
You can, i just dont know if its worth it dps-wise so i didnt mention that
onyx edge
@hollow stone 2×SS 1×LM and exsanguinate
sturdy python
No bis guide really . You can look at the guide in pins for the traits you should look for then find the gear with those traits. @rough garnet
rough garnet
k @sturdy python , tyvm
hazy sphinx
Laser matrix sucks for SS
hollow stone
G t1, g t2, g t1, m, r t1, vend t1, sxsang, m m r t2 and then just maintain dots/reapply ss emp garr to both
Is what i do
Oops
Forget that m before r t1
It dont belong
shy escarp
2x double dose + archive, back to MA I go
hollow stone
Gen for the t2 rup on t1 since it has vend up on it
severe tree
hello guys, galecallers boon in sync with exsg or on cd?
hollow stone
Ill brb in 2 hrs to see the result of zoraki's question, good luck all of you that stay active during it
onyx edge
Thank you @hollow stone
hollow stone
Im on the "save xsang for gcb/xsang" side, @ me when michee fudges the apls
hazy sphinx
30k crits on the dagger throw is juicy as fuck lol
final stone
i think in raids i could prob just use lionsguile/plumage on most bosses
maybe swap to harlans for like zul maybe
desert vault
Haste/mastery daggers in weekly, better than nothing! 😃
hazy sphinx
Construct sucks?
desert vault
Isn't Lions Guile like really strong?
hollow stone
Fathoms is better than my 390 socketed construct, youre not alone in feeling that way. Contruct proc is low low low
severe tree
thx for the anwers gonna test stuff out now
final stone
@desert vault is bissola
strange python
So for m+ when do you refresh toxic blades do u have number of seconds of expiration like rupture or u just let it tick off?
hazy sphinx
I have a 385 socketed trinket
severe tree
toxic blade on cd
hazy sphinx
That's still isn't better than fathoms
severe tree
spam crimson tempest because they do direct dmg
desert vault
I thought Lion's was BiS. Decent trinket I saw Int versions of from World Boss
severe tree
if there are many adds
hollow stone
Unless your tank is a mad man, you shouldnt be spamming ct in m+. You should use it to refresh the dot if the new cast will last til the mobs die
severe tree
yes watch out because skittish
desert vault
ugh my mastery is out of control ... 34%
desert vault
Don't we all?
errant mauve
Anyone good with simming? I feel like I’m doing something wrong and I should be simming higher with 369 worn ilvl but I’m sitting at 11,704 according to raidbot
vestal abyss
1 boss patchwerk 5 min all buffs on
novel island
I have been lucky so far, but have only been back for 3 weeks.
Dagger, head, waist all good.
Head was second best.
desert vault
I got 380 haste/mast daggers today which are good. Last week something I just scrapped, don't even remember
errant mauve
Why with all buffs on?
spice surge
I have gotten 3 bracers 😄
novel island
Ouch
vestal abyss
why not?
final stone
@desert vault it is bis
desert vault
I need a good week from heroic clear, I have one piece of raid gear equipped, no two, sorry 😃
errant mauve
It’s not giving you your raw dps... it’s giving your buffed dps which is obviously going to spike stupid high
vestal abyss
well then what kind of number are you looking for?
novel island
Raiding is over rated
spice surge
Youre always going to be buffed in raids?
stuck shuttle
thats how you sim ST dps
spice surge
So why sim without it
vestal abyss
If you want a high number you sim with all buffs on
if you dont want to sim with all buffs on why want a high number?
what are you trying to achieve here
errant mauve
Hmmm
vestal abyss
why are you simming
errant mauve
Typically I sim to figure out what build trait talent or gear gives me best dps
vestal abyss
best dps for what
errant mauve
I already know my dps is going to peak hard buffed
stuck shuttle
and you won't get accurate measurements there either without buffs on
errant mauve
Mythic+ PvP and raid
spice surge
Raid and m+ you are always buffed
vestal abyss
those are three different things
so you need to run three different sims
which one is the 11,704 for
old quartz
bruh, how further can they explain this. sim yourself
it determines min/max dmg
not complicated
errant mauve
Im@just simming for highest dps as possible right now
vestal abyss
What in the fuck
errant mauve
Lol
vestal abyss
What is your question
valid pine
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
slender spade
Does anyone know the required ilvl for getting the 370 Azerite armor from emmisaries?
warm geode
ppl r saying 368.5
slender spade
wtff feelsbadman
frosty gyro
That's not how it works Blizzard tweeted about it
It has something to do with the average ilv you have equipped of azerite gear or something
spice surge
Blizzard tweet said basicly nothing though
Except: get higher ilvl to get 370 pieces
frosty gyro
Yeah it's just some people are over 370 ilv and not getting 370 pieces
It's not tyied to overall ilv it's some stupid more copmplex thing
spark pike
i have 374 i get 340
frosty gyro
Yeah exactly
warm geode
374->370 shoulder
languid ore
Average ilvl has to be 370
So the system isn't there for you to receive an uograde
warm geode
377 for me then
spice surge
Its there for you to get 370 pieces if youre stuck with 340/355 but have good gear elsewhere
You dont need 370 azerite pieces to get 370 average
warm geode
is there for u to farm SS gear for m+ 😃
strange python
So when you do m+ opener stealth>3garrotes> do you use first rupture + exsanguinate on 4th target that is not affected by any dot? or lasta garrote target. And when you put 2nd rupture later do u put it rather on mob that is not affected by any dot or one that has garrote and crimson tempest on them from start ? please answer me this correctly 😄
spice surge
No
Average
Or maybe you need to have 1 370 azerite piece, but i got 370 shoulders despite only having 355 ones before
spice surge
No
languid ore
And tossed them out
spice surge
Read that again
languid ore
Because they werent good probably
spice surge
It doesnt say you need 370 in all slots
It says it counts your best aquired items
It literally says nothing except it scales of bag ilvl (for most players that didnt toss high ilvl pieces)
valid pine
it doesnt have to be kept in bags
strange python
So when you do m+ opener stealth>3garrotes> do you use first rupture + exsanguinate on 4th target that is not affected by any dot? or lasta garrote target. And when you put 2nd rupture later do u put it rather on mob that is not affected by any dot or one that has garrote and crimson tempest on them from start ? please answer me this correctly 😄 does anyone know this? and do u use mutilate for cp's for nxt rupture on what target dot affected or clean one?
anyone? 😄
fervent fox
dude just get your bleeds out on 3-4 targets then, CT...you're over thinking this
try to exsang on a full rupture/garrote
elder gulch
raiding with out SS, should i change subterfuge talent?
hollow stone
Dot things that will live for the entire dot or as close to that as possible. It doesnt matter what you dot if you follow this logic
strange python
subter vs MA rofl https://gyazo.com/1a395050497a7f2470b41f7141eee0b7
hollow stone
Probably @elder gulch but sim it
inner pulsar
@strange python Yeah, but make sure you TB before Vanish
wheat zealot
Thats about the difference in sub vs ma for me. I just use subter tho mostly bc almost every fight has add spawns at some point that make subter come ahead imo
strange python
@inner pulsar already trained it for 3 hours on the dummy
Guys how do you get 100% logs on taloc or 95+ what do i need to change to get that orange 😄 i got like 87
inner pulsar
................
strange python
idk but I got 95 parse on heroic
inner pulsar
Are you TBing before you Vanish?
strange python
and im pretty shit
hollow stone
100 parses are all luck. Prove me wrong
inner pulsar
@strange python Me too
strange python
95 on mother too
i have fetid 95
do you toss daggers when u run to lets say fetid if hes away for ur mele range?
just shadowstep
rofl
inner pulsar
I.....a...
inner pulsar
At this point, I think this guy is Richard baiting me
hollow stone
If youre not over capping energy or cps, youre not losing dps
strange python
because dps loss
whos trolling dude im asking serious questions ..
isnt rogue discord made for asking questions that u dont know and geting better at ur class by asking people that are better than me?
dont answer if u dont want to lol..
just go and play game why bother with my "silly questions"?
inner pulsar
Alright, serious answer then, if you have used both Shadowstep and Sprint, and have nothing to get back to the boss with after stomp, then you need to fix that and not worry about whether you should be throwing a dagger
hollow stone
The easy answer is to never use dagger toss
strange python
dude..
inner pulsar
Because your poor play is making more of a difference than anything
What? That is the answer
prime stirrup
addikt, typically you use daggers when you are out of range and about to energy cap
PK*
hollow stone
Its super super situational
strange python
SO WHEN YOU ARE ON M+ SHARK BOSS IN FREEHOLD U DONT USE DAGGERS WHILE HES SPINNING?
prime stirrup
if you are energy capping you should be
wheat zealot
If you are going to cap, yes
strange python
then dont fucking answer "never use daggers"
spice surge
But you shouldnt be in that place to begin with
past harbor
whoa whoa whoa lets all simmer down
wheat zealot
You shouldnt, ideally lmfao
spice surge
As you should use your energy before that
safe matrix
How about y'all calm down
hollow stone
If sprint and sstep are on cd, and you are capping energy, and you have less than 5cps, then in that very specific situation, you would dagger throw
strange python
i mean whole day people are trolling me here
i dont know what is funny abou trolling people in class discord that dont know some stuff.
hollow stone
I gave you two, now 3 real answers, ignore the trolls
strange python
ok thanks respect that
inner pulsar
My answer was not a troll answer
I 100% promise you that better use of of Shadowstep and Sprint on Fetid is going to make a bigger difference than using dagger toss
prime stirrup
shadowstep is up almost every knockback
hollow stone
And sim yo self gave good advice too. Hes hust an asshole 😘
proud schooner
Quick question, should I take CT or PB for M+
And same question for TB and Exsanguinate?
I am always reading 'what you prefere' but yeah, something has to be better
safe matrix
It depends on your gear
prime stirrup
enforcer it comes down to the dungeon and how your group is pulling also
wheat zealot
Exsan will be better for aoe generally, because it gives regen to feed your fok spam. And exsan will come ahead on 3 minute boss fights generally
proud schooner
Alright, when should I use CT? At how many targets?
wheat zealot
But always sim yo self
hollow stone
General rule is fok and ct at 3+ targets
fervent fox
hey guys, do you have to re download the simulationcraft app every time if you want to use nightly builds?
spice surge
fervent fox
no thanks, i like doing it myself for free
glass vessel
raidbots is free
spice surge
? It is free?
fervent fox
and not waiting 5 minutes
spice surge
But then yes
wheat zealot
More like 1 to 2
hollow stone
Use simc to get your string, then put into raidbots and select nightly
proud schooner
Thank you for the advice guys, I am new to rogue but I am loving them so far! ❤
glass vessel
not even clsoe to 5 mins and raidbots doesn't use your processor 😃
fervent fox
i PREFER to sim myself and NOT use raidbots
strange python
so what does increase parse on logs? lets say i go on taloc hc ? do i reapply dots while hes in lift phase and step into red just to reapply dots ? does that increase parse 😄 im noob with this so please dont laugh 😄
hollow stone
Then you do you. Most of us use raidbots for sims
glass vessel
then you jsut update every night if possible, that's your only solution
fervent fox
ok, thanks
spice surge
@strange python He takes 99% reduced damage
hushed maple
How do you sim yourself?? Do you stand there calculating every possible stat constelation x10??
spice surge
During elevator phase, so it doesnt matter
glass vessel
if you get venomous wounds ticks it can help
hollow stone
The biggest thing for high parses are fast kills
glass vessel
i dont know if you do tho
spice surge
@hollow stone Good kill times***
hollow stone
The closer you are to the opener (assuming lust opener) when the boss dies, the better
spice surge
Which often correlates to fast kils, but not always
hollow stone
Yea
glass vessel
my guild still lusts in phase 3 feelsbad
hollow stone
Not always, very true
spice surge
For example. 2.40 is a better kill time than 2.00 for assa
As you get a second use of vendetta
Or even 2.20 with tb
strange python
so how someone from my guild has 99 on ghun and i have lower and we killed it on same time
hushed maple
2.25 is masterrace I guess 😅
wheat zealot
Yeah the monks always beat me on fetid bc they get a second touch of death and i dont get my second vendetta off lol
inner pulsar
UH....
hollow stone
The other thing that you CAN control for high parses is to utilize boss vulnerability phases to their highest potential (like ghuun)
hushed maple
@strange python well then he did more dmg
daring imp
@strange python he's a pad god
strange python
Addikt must be trolling
hollow stone
Also. Most of the top parses cheese mechanics in one way or the other
daring imp
he mastered the skills of padding so much you can no longer think of catching up
inner pulsar
@strange python Seriously, I'm telling you it is Richard
wheat zealot
Complains about trolls, starts trolling
strange python
@solid nova https://gyazo.com/b7a3ffefb891353565ab431f5ca33671 help
daring imp
lul
inner pulsar
Hahaha
strange python
You've been given an answer rofl
hollow stone
Moment of truth incoming
strange python
There shouldn't be time where you don't have sprint OR shadowstep on fetid
inner pulsar
He's going to come in here and blame me
strange python
hold on let me rephrase
truth? il just not ask u nothing cuz ur all trolling tards and if im not a nolifer like u its frolling kk..
keen inlet
Hi.
inner pulsar
I don't actually know what that meant
vestal wren
hi
keen inlet
Stop being idiots. JFC. Thank you.
strange python
no 
hollow stone
Member when i said ignore the trolls? Youre getting answers. Just leave the rest be
vestal wren
move to #off-topic if you want to make babyrage fights.
chrome crow
I have only been following and not saying anything but i find it pure trolling when you literally come in here and ask "Why does he have higher parses but we have same kill times" But you don't post logs, you don't post ANYTHING to let people help you. You just talk about getting lower parses. You must not truly understand how parses work. As people have said before, most top parses are either pure luck because of procs etc or padding/cheesing mechanics
wheat zealot
nocturne mulch
@chrome crow that was a 10/10 rant
chrome crow
❤
vestal plank
Hey guys should i be holding tb or just using on cd?
strange python
fossil agate
Tldr why do i nit hit my buttons good
hollow stone
Oh luke, my poor summer child
leaden niche
on cd unless vd has like only a few secs left
opaque grotto
All my top parses were from having 3x SS week 1 uldir :^)
keen inlet
Keep it on spec, keep it on topic, keep the memeing and trolling to #off-topic. Thanks.
inner pulsar
tulip falcon
does anyone have a sharpened blades weakaura?
hollow stone
Id say scroll up but the conv on that was like 8 years ago in discord time :/
keen inlet
@strange python Watching you, in particular
safe matrix
And if you don't want to answer something, you are not obligated to
strange python
@tulip falcon Can you use google?
hollow stone
For the most part, use tb on cd
leaden niche
nocturne mulch
wago.io solves everything, I was getting greenb/blue parses before, now I get a ton of oranges
inner pulsar
@nocturne mulch haha
strange python
Like literally https://wago.io/r14XptS_7
hollow stone
Theres some pre planning that can make your tb usage better, but in general, tb on cd is good
strange python
Typed in "sharpened blades weakaura" in google and its the first popup
inner pulsar
@hollow stone Only before Vanish bro!
wheat zealot
Yeah not looking up at the right corner of your screen for buffs tend to improve performance lul
inner pulsar
33 extra dps!
spice iron
whats the best boss to coin in Uldir? first time doing heroic with guild.
strange python
@spice iron rofl
inner pulsar
@spice iron Zul and Mother
nocturne mulch
mother 100%
inner pulsar
Let them eat all your coins
strange python
Fetid has a 3xx SS if u want
tulip falcon
@strange python thanks man 😃
spice iron
346 ilvl so everything is upgrade X)
wheat zealot
Oh, than mother and fetid imo, or zul
strange python
You can coin mother for dagger, Fetid for SS chest, zul for dagger
wheat zealot
Get the weapon and 370 ss chest, and you will be off to decent start for m+
inner pulsar
Now, be aware that none of them are actually going to drop anything
acoustic latch
Hey guys, on Vectis heroic, when the small adds spawn, do I still wanna keep dots up them? I am new to rogue as it is my alt, so trying to master the class
wheat zealot
^^
hollow stone
Zul also drops the only leather az shoulders from raid
visual token
I’ve been coining mom and zul
strange python
@acoustic latch Yes
inner pulsar
Zul has the shoulders too
short arch
For M+ would you guys choose 2x 340 SS over 2x 370 AoT? :p
wheat zealot
I would regardless
short arch
Examples?
inner pulsar
I would favor the AoT pieces in most cases
short arch
Because of bigger mobs that live longer? :p
strange python
Depends on the level of the key
Like after 9+ you'd rather get stat traits
Like archive
Mobs live longer, bosses live longer
Having sustained dps is better than burst by then
inner pulsar
60 ilvls and Archive? Its got to be superior right?
wheat zealot
SoB is really good for high keys imo
inner pulsar
Didn't he say 2 x 340 vs 2 x 370?
strange python
for m+
short arch
yes
fierce knoll
had to drop my only SS for SB 😦 feelsbadman
short arch
I mean I got 1x 370 SS :p
strange python
Unless u decide to run toxic blade with MA
People think that SS is really that mandatory, but its really not
wheat zealot
In m+? Big yikes
I would never run ma over subter for m+
Subter + iron wire alone is just too good for silence and damage reduction on mobs
strange python
Yeah the silence is very good
chrome crow
I think Nightstalker is far superior cause it makes me move faster!!!! 
shy escarp
you'll pry sub + iron wire away from me from my cold undead hands
solid nova
@strange python Seems you got your answer(s).
@inner pulsar You too, I wont tell you again, you'll be muted next time.
stray patrol
is it PB or CT week in m+ when 10+ keys?
wheat zealot
Only use pb in kr @stray patrol
strange python
what answers homie
wheat zealot
Personally
inner pulsar
In all seriousness, in what way was I trolling there?
All of my answers were 100% legitimate
wheat zealot
If you are running with two mongo aoe dps tho like a mage or dh you might want to run pb elsewhere @stray patrol
keen inlet
@inner pulsar It's not a debate, you were warned, just keep it on-topic, ignore ppl you think are trolling or ping a shadowblade
stray patrol
Thx man!
molten reef
is shrouded suffocation a "must" have for assassination?
vast mulch
No
fading spade
Used to be
wheat zealot
Np
strange python
Good for m+
golden mulch
wtf apparently now the daily cache gives 370 items...my mate got 370 azerite while i only got 340 bc i did it like an hour before
chrome crow
It's ilvl based
chrome crow
if you don't have like 368.5 ilvl (or soem weird scaling like that) you wont get 370
It got hotfixed in last night
golden mulch
what ilvl do i need for that?
hidden yoke
Yeah so you wouldve gotten it yesterday if you were high enough but its notjust ilvl
golden mulch
370?
hidden yoke
Yesterday no one knew, some people who had a lower ilvl were getting it while a higher character was not
chrome crow
There's conflicting reports, my mate only has 369 and he got the 370 ilvl cache, others have 370+ ilvl and still only got 355
pulsar coral
ummm jesus christ https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/u6B7fTUwToXgUTN5De1E4W is this Blightborne Infusion realy this powerful?
wheat zealot
You had to have a 370 in that slot at some point in time is what i heard
strange python
Its 385
hidden yoke
in what slot would it be though because the cache doesnt already have your item picked out when it says the ilvl
pulsar coral
it's 385, but it's not an upgrade for my outlaw cuz the traits are crap for outlaw
hidden yoke
so I dont think it is that
inner pulsar
@wheat zealot I think that was just poorly worded. I believe it meant "We aggregate the ilvl for the highest soulbound item in each slot, even if you don't have it anymore"
lost sentinel
does wound poison work on fetid? I've been using it but not actually sure
craggy notch
Guys what do you guys think is better for high m+ pushing: One helm that has ss+heedmycall at 340 OR a helm that has Dagger in the back+
Overwhelming power at 385
hollow stone
Nobody knows specific breakpoints for the scaling from caches. Its all speculation atm
inner pulsar
I can confirm that you don't have to have had a 370 in the slot, as I received a 370 for a slot I only had a 355 previously
grim mason
What cache is everyone talking about, the daily?
inner pulsar
Emissary
grim mason
even tho it says 355?
wheat zealot
@inner pulsar thats what i heard too, my wording was just fucked up
wheat zealot
If it says 355 irs probably 355 lol
lost sentinel
anyone know if wound poison works on fetid devourer in uldir? just making sure I am not sacrificing dps for nothing
hollow stone
Emissary cache gear scales from 340-370 but nobody knows how it scales atm
inner pulsar
I was 368 at the time
grim mason
so what was the big deal i don't get it
hollow stone
Some say its bag ilvl, some say it is not retroactive, some say its slot ilvl, etc
sturdy python
It's possible there's some obscure requirement for it other than ilvl and azerite pieces but no one knows. Could just be a mistake on implementation too
hollow stone
The big deal is we want 370, not lower :p
inner pulsar
Well there was a blue post confirming it is not bag lvl
sturdy python
If I had to guess I'd say it has something to do with neck level too
lost sentinel
it's retroactive, they said it is, prob just need 370 average tho
craggy notch
Maybe it scales to how many hc bosses you killed
sturdy python
There are people getting them at 365 though
Possibly but I got 370 and guikdies didn't. I've only killed ghuun unlike them but other guikdies got 370s without him too
lost sentinel
equipped or overall? also weapon/trinket slots counts 1 afaik
grim mason
I mean I understand wanting 370 i just dont understand the commotion around it now, mine I am sure has always said 355
inner pulsar
Twitter
sturdy python
Possibly a point system like the weekly used to use
inner pulsar
No
sturdy python
O intersting
hollow stone
Yea but that doesnt explain breakpoints
craggy notch
Guys what do you guys think is better for high m+ pushing: One helm that has ss+heedmycall at 340 OR a helm that has Dagger in the back+Overwhelming power at 385
lost sentinel
are they 365 equipped or higher overall?
inner pulsar
And that clears up that it is not based on the slot
Because obviously rings would have no effect on that
hollow stone
@craggy notch prob the 385 ditb
inner pulsar
So no, we don't know what the tipping point is
ionic charm
@craggy notch according to herodamage charts, the DitB is better, only slightly
hollow stone
My alt is 368 and is showing 355 reward. Going to try to push over 370 before turn in and see if that flips it
craggy notch
Ty guys, will run the 85 then 😃
inner pulsar
@ionic charm That is probably because he has, at some point or another, had items soulbound that put him higher than you
slim jetty
i want to try assa for the next weak after a long time. what stats should i prio for m+ bzw. hoe do i sim m+ dungeons. i know crit and mastery is king in fortified weaks but whats about tyrannical weeks?
hollow stone
It "could" be based on when you complete the quest (not turn in, but complete). Like, it snapshots your ilvl. Disclaimer: THIS IS UNCONFIRMED
ionic charm
@inner pulsar wouldn’t he not be able to trade those items then?
So would still have?
hollow stone
Nah. Coulda de'd
hollow stone
Or sold
inner pulsar
Correct
jolly trout
They should just clarify it this vage shit is just idiotic
hollow stone
Im sure they will when enough people complain
inner pulsar
It is also possible there is a bug
ionic charm
They haven’t for tooltips so don’t hold your breath
hollow stone
Open dem tickets, get on twitter. Lets go
inner pulsar
I know that last night, I received a 370 chest, and I was positvely under 370 at the time
hollow stone
Btw, guildie who turned in the emissary before the hotfix was told "tough shit" by the gm when he ticketed, so dont ticket that
inner pulsar
Of course, my evidence is anecdotal, and one is not a sufficient sample size
ionic charm
@hollow stone yeah there’s a reddit post about it lol
hollow stone
Anecdotal? Sufficient? Get outa here mr linguist
Oh. Thats probably him
He was salt boi
ionic charm
I would be too that’s dumb af. Me being apathetic about my emissaries on the other hand turned out to be a good choice 😏
inner pulsar
@hollow stone Hey, don't you go insulting me, I'll go complain
novel island
I received a 370 head piece yesterday when I was 368. Had a 385 
ionic charm
I at least got a first dance piece for when I play sub on Zul. So there’s that
Small victories
inner pulsar
Don't care if I get muted this time, this is too perfect not to use here