Sim yourself
#assassination
junior aurora
hollow stone
Theres no "soft caps" for sin that are well known at this time, if that's what youre asking
glass vessel
especially on tyrannical weeks i run more haste
astral sundial
I thought the sim is using TB inside the vandeta :X guess it's not big deal anyway
peak rune
@glass vessel arround 10%?
hollow stone
If we're talking full 385s, you want 1x archive, 2x dd
tranquil lodge
are there any ways to get the HeroDungeon simc profile that herodamage uses for simming in raidbots?
hollow stone
But thats in an ideal world. Sim yo self for your bis
glass vessel
@peak rune probably a good rule to go by, yea. tbh i just throw on crit/mastery rings and a harlans dice and that's fine. rest is just raid gear
sim will always tell you crit/mastery tho
glass vessel
can chang eit depending on your comp tho, if you have a DH and frost mage you might as well just run an ST setup in lower keys where mobs arent alive for 9 years lol
earnest hedge
is there azerite pieces you can get DD on that are 385?
glass vessel
with a lock in the group run more crit/mastery
odd sinew
guys my Sin gear is so crap atm that my Outlaw is siming higher than my Sin... what should i do? 😦
glass vessel
play what you want
hollow stone
Only can get 385 dd from weekly chest. Good luck
earnest hedge
how is that possible? does weekly chest have random traits?
glass vessel
weekly chest can drop azerite gear from dungeons, raid gear doesnt have DD on it
hollow stone
It can drop any az gear. But st 385
earnest hedge
gotcha
hollow stone
So high altitude turban at 385 is sin bis helm, for example
earnest hedge
so glad i've gotten 380 pants three weeks in a row
hollow stone
Its a good system, right?
fossil jewel
sorry, late on this reply but thanks @glass vessel
desert vault
hehe, uhh ok 😃
hollow stone
Tldr it means ilvl is almost always gonna be an upgrade for you
desert vault
prolly not good that i'm sitting on 1% vers
desert vault
right, I just always go for hast/crit since I don't do much m+ and right now I'm just trying to play catch-up
hollow stone
Your has higher value due to low stat and probably high crit/mast
Yea. Keep doin thst
That
desert vault
23 crit and 31 mast
hollow stone
Thats prob why vers is close, your crit n mast are fairly high for st raid situations
Either way, haste + anything is gonna be good for you, which is a really nice spot to be in
hazy sphinx
Is the lion's roar up?
hazy sphinx
when will it be up for horde
desert vault
too high with crit and mast though for raid?
hazy sphinx
when htey retake it?
hollow stone
Yea. Should be up for na horde on sun or mon
No. Your gear is fine, its just not optimal
deft tide
So it's impossible to get high level azerite gear with SS trait for shoulder and head?
worldly orbit
so im currently running 1x laser matrix 2x shrouded suffocation, i have the option to go 1x laser, 1x archive, 1x shrouded but simming with 4 reorigination array stacks still puts 2x shrouded suffocation above 1x archive, any thoughts?
hollow stone
But nobody's gear is hella optimal atm, dont worry
quick fog
You just have to get lucky and get it out of the weekly chest. @deft tide
deft tide
thats so stupid :&
quick fog
Yeah it is
I got the trinket while maining OL. Working on switching to Sin now
Is it worth stacking Laser Matrix and Archive?
glass vessel
azerite pieces are holding my sin spec back feelsbad. simming so much higher as sub even tho ilvls are equivalent
that and no galecallers x)
brisk forge
I was slacking with 10s first 2 weeks of M+ so got head and shoulders with DD regret it now tho that i didnt put in the effort xD
They're 370...
quick fog
How lucky
brisk forge
Could be way more happy if they were 385 😏
deft tide
Are you macroing your galecallers to something? if so what?
hardy anchor
380 legs from the weekly chest, just in time for me to craft my 385s, I called that shit from a mile off.
junior aurora
Exsang
junior aurora
If you got gc should go exsang lol
deft tide
But with exsang it does not seem to pop :/ since exsang triggers a gcd
junior aurora
Use /cast 13 first
hardy anchor
Are people switching from Vigor to Marked for death btw?
whoops, nvm. Was looking at M+ sims, lol
proven ice
mfd with bolstering?
hardy anchor
ooft. Gonna be fun Trash on M+ again this week 💔
proven ice
do the adds before boss 3 in shrine bolster?
hazy sphinx
Havent ran one yet.
junior aurora
No
proven ice
whew
junior aurora
Shrine is cancer with bolstering
proven ice
lol
junior aurora
The oozes bolster, the little shadow dudes after 2nd boss bolster
proven ice
the packs before boss 2..
hardy anchor
I can imagine for the everything inbetween the 1st and 3rd boss.
long hill
Crit mastery with fortified is better right?
hazy sphinx
Ran a freehold 12 right now
proven ice
Time to dust off sub for this week.
hazy sphinx
it was juicy
proven ice
we might do zuul this week anyway
hardy anchor
Imagine M+ raiding.
teal glen
first time in weeks my cache isn't garbage, got a dice from it
hardy anchor
That'd be the sickest and most horrifying shit.
hardy anchor
Yeah man, I gotta get a solid group going for 'em
hazy sphinx
Join the mythic plus friends discord
hardy anchor
Pug'd a group with everyone at 370ilvl on +11 Tol Dagor yesterday
hazy sphinx
raise your IO, and apply to a dedicated group.
hardy anchor
It took us 30 minutes to kill the first boss >_>
velvet geyser
lol?
fading adder
gotta raider IO that shit
hardy anchor
The tank just kept dying.
hazy sphinx
its not even tyrannical though lol
velvet geyser
rough day
hardy anchor
They were all 800+ io too. I think our comp struggled for the AOE cleave on the adds so the tank just kept getting fucked with the enrage+necrotic.
hazy sphinx
necrotic?
you mena last week, oh yeah tol dagor was rough last week without a mobile tank and good aoe
hollow stone
He's got diff affixes than the rest of us this week 🤡
hardy anchor
Yeah man, was just last night. That first boss with Tyrannical is disgusting.
hazy sphinx
why didnt u destroy your kety and get a new one
hazy sphinx
well 30 minutes in first boss wont really net you extra loot bud
hollow stone
People always complain about kr and sots but i HATE td
Td bosses are just the worst
glass vessel
ToS is my least favorite. fuck that shit
hazy sphinx
King's rest is going to be the worse this week.
pale forum
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
hardy anchor
Yeah man. Imagine if it was Necrotic instead of Skittish. That's the true nightmare week.
hollow stone
I have only done fh so far this week and it was cake
hazy sphinx
Just skip everything to the first boss.
hollow stone
As usual
hazy sphinx
Abd everythign else is easy after that.
velvet geyser
I find this week easier than last week
daring imp
thousand times easier
hollow stone
You shroud to first boss in urot? @hazy sphinx
velvet geyser
I did the shroud skippings last night, It was gravy
daring imp
oy this is getting stupid, i get a dagger upgrade ( from 365 to 370 ) and my haste values drop? wth man
tall spruce
How good is the Stand as One trait? Better than SS?
hollow stone
My group seems to think shroud is complete invis and acts like dumbasses. Gonna try it tho. You go from entrance or clear the first berzerker guy, and then go?
hazy sphinx
from entrnace
hollow stone
Thx. Gonna try it out
hazy sphinx
the first zone is very tough with bolstering and all that.
hollow stone
Do you happen to have a mdt for urot you could dm me?
lean anvil
up to first boss is hardest part of that dungeon
hazy sphinx
mdt?
hollow stone
Method dungeon tools
hollow stone
Oh you poor summer child
wanton wagon
Add-on to plan routes in m+
hollow stone
Yea you should check it out
wanton wagon
It's fucking great
hollow stone
Its amazing
desert pelican
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
hazy sphinx
And its still telling me to use fathoms and galecallers
weak pine
I mean galecaller outperforms almost anything below 370 at 340
hazy sphinx
assuming full duration
its just not happening in mythic raids right now
only on opener
weak pine
eh?
hazy sphinx
eh what
weak pine
I don't see what boss does it not happen on
hazy sphinx
taloc, mother zekvoz
im def not gettin 10 seconds of standing still on it every time its up
the sim assumes i do
kindred flame
Even if you wait for winds, fires tank still move the boss on mother
:feelsbadman:
weak pine
You need to get used to the fight, anticipate the mechanics and tank movements
hazy sphinx
i have 90 plus parses on all of em
i know the fights
im not gonna get 10 seconds of standing still with it
every time its up
elevator phase
waste of a trinket slot
storm lily
Can this be? Left is for M+ (Multiple Targets) and right for Raid (mainly Single Target). I still don't feel with so much Hastery and so little Haste.. But the Sims directed me straight to this.
weak pine
you don't have to deal damage in elevator phase 
you should just put dots up and stay out of shit
hazy sphinx
Do you currently have a galecallers?
kindred flame
You need higher prases what do you mean you dont need to do damage
weak pine
yes
hazy sphinx
give me a log, i want to compare your usage to mine if you dont mind
glass vessel
you gotta hop in the shit every once in a while on elevetor otherwise you're useless. healers dont have anything better to do anyways
hazy sphinx
Gotta give em something to do.
weak pine
I got shit logs to compare to
carmine valve
hazy sphinx
I just want to see your usage on it.
glass vessel
taloc can definitely use galecallers
weak pine
Raid leader keeps me benched outside of mother and vectis right now
hazy sphinx
I want to see you stand at least 30 seconds on it.
weak pine
And on mother my only usage is to tricks the adds
hazy sphinx
Any log you have on it.
weak pine
lemme check
hazy sphinx
Helps to be top ST dps.
weak pine
I can't get good mother logs ever
kindred flame
Not if game is holding you back and have 98%+ ilvl prases but 80-87 prases otherwise
royal lantern
parses are based around people on your ilvl or not......?
kindred flame
You are delusional if you think you can prase high on mother if you do adds
glass vessel
guild execution, kill time and other things come in to play when you start pushing 95+
maybe not as sin, but as outlaw your parse is from going early
kindred flame
They are not, there is compare to that, but no 1 look at it
royal lantern
+ye, fights like mother/ghuun can be bad for your parses cus doing mechanics=bad dps there
glass vessel
as sin i'd imagine you stay late as possible since your aoe doesnt have time to build up, as outlaw you wont parse well without going early
on mother
weak pine
Well I found a 30s galecaller on first try https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/zkLhv2rRXwdPYaT3#fight=14&type=auras&source=3
royal lantern
im lucky that my mythic mother parses are decent cus my guildleader let me go last
hazy sphinx
taloc not mother.
They are sending yo ufirst, so you just standing there on galecallers jerking beef oin the adds
glass vessel
if your guild would wipe more not sending a sin rogue early your setup must be terrible lol
haughty flame
is sharpened blades good anymore?
i just got a 385 head
and have 370 shoulder with SB
glass vessel
@weak pine on your mother parse link you had 33s total uptime on galecallers which is a little over 50% efficiency, that's the point @hazy sphinx Zid is making
cyan frost
why is 375 dread gladiator insignia simming higher than 360 dice but on bloodmallet it says dice is way beter?
weak pine
On mother my uptime is irrelevant since I'm mostly throwing daggers at adds...
glass vessel
exactly
weak pine
He wanted to link a parse with 30s uptime
glass vessel
he's saying other trinkets are more useful since galecallers is hard to keep 90%+ efficient in mythic scenarios
weak pine
It's not gonna beat my 370 g'huun trinket
glass vessel
but in a 5min fight, you can have 5 uses for 50s uptime,
5min10s would net 60s optimal uptime
it's not about what trinket you have, his point is just that galecallers is pretty hard to use really well in mythic atm since there's a lot of movement and it's hard to just cheese bosses quickly with raw dmg
if ghuun is your only other option then yea, obv its gonna be better than that garbage lol
hazy sphinx
the trinket sims so well because it assumes a massive uptime
which in reality is hard to maintain
hazy sphinx
so for example
glass vessel
yea there's no denying it's godtier in a patcdhwerk scenario
hazy sphinx
a patchwerk sim assumes i use it and stand on it on the elevator phase
but on the elevator phase, a proc trinket could help me kill more adds quicker.
a fight where i get a large uptime on it is vectis
hazy sphinx
cause we just stand there and double dot
now im progressing on zekvoz
went outlaw, but i realized im just padding
weak pine
Sin is really good on vectis overall
hazy sphinx
so im back to sin
well hear me out
im thinking of using it during the adds
CT
rupture spread
weak pine
The adds come every 2 mins
glass vessel
true the first set you can get away with it if you have an aoe grip
weak pine
Keep that in mind
hazy sphinx
we do have an aoe grip
glass vessel
might be good then
hazy sphinx
Using the gc on CD will allow me to have it for adds
glass vessel
but second set goodluck wen it stacks with surging
hazy sphinx
but in reality i dont care much for adds
glass vessel
i havent seen 3rd set in my guild so idk xD
hazy sphinx
but when we hiut 40%
and I get that orb
I want to have GC for that insane burst before i meet my lord and savior Yogg Saron
weak pine
Can you catch 2 orbs btw?
glass vessel
and mother if you can find a good time to use it
dusty crow
still no GCB 😦
glass vessel
i feel your pain Brad
hazy sphinx
thats my logs, look at my taloc uptime. im thinking of switching it up this week
glass vessel
only have a 325 version so it's useless against my other trinkets lol
weak pine
those heroic logs 
weak pine
don't have a good emoticon to use
I was expecting more oranges
let's put it like that
tardy yoke
Playing TB with galecallers, do we just press galecallers on CD without lining it up with anything?
weak pine
At least you got good mythic logs
glass vessel
i got 2 oranges on heroic and 3 fucking 94's. fixing that tonight lmao
95's on mythic tho feels good
weak pine
You link it with vendetta, but they should be already linked since 1/2min cooldowns
Can't get logs this early on tho
hazy sphinx
i dont really pay much attention to the heroic logs though
alpine pilot
Is it worth refreshing garrote and/or rupture early so u wont have to during TB window?
hazy sphinx
its just content clear at this point. clear it in 1 hour and go to mythic
glass vessel
even then if you're playing well 90% is a given
alpine pilot
or is that a dps loss
weak pine
1 hour heroic clear sounds quite fast
hazy sphinx
usually where we are at.
alpine pilot
i find myself pooling/prepping for every TB and sometimes, ill hav to refresh garrote or rup during it
glass vessel
its no big deal anime just use it on CD for the most part
hazy sphinx
start at 8, on taloc by 815-830 with break in
glass vessel
dont hold it more than a few seconds max, it's up a lot
hazy sphinx
You know what
alpine pilot
so its not worth refreshing garr and rup early for TB window then right?
hazy sphinx
@weak pine
I'm gonna pre pot and double pot on all fights on heroic this week.
I'm gonna get to orange.
In your honor.
alpine pilot
i want to maximize TB window is all XD
alpine pilot
i find myself never able to parse over 95%tile
im wondering if its cus i dont min max everything lol
hazy sphinx
But I'm gonna play around with the trinkets in certain fights.
glass vessel
you gotta be higher ilvl, play pretty well and have good guild execution to get 95%'s consistently
if you lack 1 of those things it's gonna be harder to do
hazy sphinx
Niko go look at beeftardo in my logs
alpine pilot
wuts guild execution mean?, sorry
glass vessel
quick kills, not losing uptime on DPS
hazy sphinx
We compete in parses, cause in DPS it's not really a good metric.
hazy sphinx
If we killed heroic mother in the last room, i could get a 95 easy
alpine pilot
and im sick of it !
hazy sphinx
But we just burn her down in the first room 😦
glass vessel
yea on mother we just cheese in first room now lol
hazy sphinx
my parseeee
glass vessel
i got my mother parse week 1 so i escaped
alpine pilot
maybe im just bad tho
hazy sphinx
i got it as sub, which is why it hasnt changed.
alpine pilot
i dont understand how assassination works tbh
hazy sphinx
wut
weak pine
put dots up
hazy sphinx
dot and refresh
weak pine
spend energy
hazy sphinx
stab stab stab
alpine pilot
well i wanted to ask
what does the majority of our dmg? is it the deadly poison applications?
or envenom?
hazy sphinx
Um
weak pine
There isn't a set source of "majority damage" for sin
deft tide
Garrote
glass vessel
garrote if you're stacking SS
nova gazelle
Does raidbots sim the extra dmg output u get from vanish?
For an example, right now I'm using 1 Matrix and 2 AOTT for raiding but I'm thinking of switching out 1 of the AOTT with either 1 DD or SS, I'm not sure if the sim count the extra dmg u get from empowered Garrote on Vanish?
hazy sphinx
;; see dmg breakdown
alpine pilot
okay let me look
nova gazelle
Archive ot the titans
hazy sphinx
just say archive!
id say
out of the bat
that simming will NEVER truly sim the greatness of SS
weak pine
achieve of the titans
hazy sphinx
one archive, one laser and one SS is imo the best
weak pine
not sure about laser
hazy sphinx
until you get to 10 origination
alpine pilot
thanks fo the logs zid
weak pine
but one archve and 1 ss for sure
hazy sphinx
Np.
frosty gyro
The APL uses vanish right for ST yeah
hazy sphinx
yes
alpine pilot
i see that the dmg breakdown is similar to mine
frosty gyro
Idk how the APL does vanish with multitarget
frosty gyro
Can probably check
alpine pilot
cus legion that wasnt the case
runic maple
is there a good addon that track bleed/posion better on mobs?
weak pine
Melee does tons in BfA
alpine pilot
yea apparently XD
weak pine
Legion it was just wet noodle slappage
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
frosty gyro
Legion had a ton of modifiers to ability damage on artifact
weak pine
It's better this way, higher uptime on melee means more dmg
runic maple
cool
hazy sphinx
Yo im salty as fuck
Jelo insulted me to my core with that old man emoji over my heroic logs
THE NERVE
hazy sphinx
None of them lol. I use the infexious ones.
runic maple
lul
hazy sphinx
To my core!
nova gazelle
So basicly...
if the dmg difference between having double Archive vs 1SS is -1,3% in dmg according to the sim, then SS would still perform better, "I THINK"
tardy yoke
man our rotation just becomes so boring with no SS and no subterfuge rofl
hazy sphinx
I'm gonna orange parse like a motherfucker.
Problem is, it's hard to get to orange with some dudes who had the 3 SS before nerf.
Kind of sad.
frosty gyro
Doesn't it not take into account pre-nerf parses?
Not to mention they would have had lower overall ilv
weak pine
I thought so
glass vessel
nah you can orange parse without it np
weak pine
also this
glass vessel
i dont even play assa that often and get orange parses with shit traits
frosty gyro
I have a couple orange parses
nova gazelle
I mean, this is what I'm working with atm, what do u guys think would be the best combo? I'm super confused lol
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/u5p1AERQdo6T8bRd4Cyg7J
frosty gyro
I also had a few orange parses that turned into purple for some reason which is really annoying
frigid kestrel
Y’all talking orange press by ilvl or orange parses overall?
frosty gyro
I don't get why that happens
gray schooner
SS?
alpine pilot
is SS broken for simc on ST?
wet condor
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/q7KBDMub2kjPrZeaUACsGY what enchantments should i get
hollow stone
Nah. Im crushing my week 1 op ss parses now without ss
glass vessel
by ilvl when you're 370+ is way different tbh. heavily varied by guild execution etc
alpine pilot
exsang is really fun to play over TB lol but simc says its like 4% dps loss
hazy sphinx
Literally gonna ignore mechanics tonight.,
alpine pilot
just wodnering zid, cus u play exsang
frosty gyro
Depends on your traits
hazy sphinx
I just hate TB
alpine pilot
i see
frosty gyro
Exsang is only a 10DPS loss for me so I use exsang
alpine pilot
i hav all the traits
hazy sphinx
doesnt even sim higher
strange python
mmmm 2xSS 1xArchive vs 3xSS in m+?
alpine pilot
ahh
frigid kestrel
@hazy sphinx
hazy sphinx
M=?
keen hound
3xss for m+
hazy sphinx
M+? bro SS
alpine pilot
LOL
hazy sphinx
its that juicy shit
glass vessel
TB sims higher and is less punishing. still run exsang on mother and fetid tho since its OP
hazy sphinx
I'm one pubic hair away from 1000 raider io
glass vessel
for me at least
hazy sphinx
..logs
frosty gyro
Anyone know why parses go down sometimes after you get them?
wet condor
@nova gazelle how can u do over 2k more dps than me when i have higher ilvl
glass vessel
@alpine pilot the exsang burst during the phases where mother and fetid take increased damage is insane
strange python
fetid goes from loot pinata to major pain going from H to M
alpine pilot
i see thanks
glass vessel
well yes
hazy sphinx
honestly though, im happy.
glass vessel
but exsang being busted on fetid is because of the same principal
glass vessel
not saying the fight is a joke by any means lol
hazy sphinx
Then on to Vectis.
hollow stone
Parses go down after because theres 10,000+ people playing sin and most groups raid at similar hours. Its the constant updating the changes your parse rank. If thats what you mean
glass vessel
^
frosty gyro
Like why is it a 95 here https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/XgMr98WKZfY3VJp2#fight=4&type=damage-done but a 94 here https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/id/2250262
hazy sphinx
It was just explained sir.
hazy sphinx
I had more oranges in heroic, then everyone else got gud.
glass vessel
cut him some slack he posted it 2secs after apple posted that lol
hazy sphinx
I know, i was kidding.
nova gazelle
@wet condor ilvl doesn't say shit like it never ever has, it's just a score number of BS if u ask me, if u combine ur gear correctly with the right stats, ur gonna do more dps than most ppl higher ilvl than urself
glass vessel
SRS BSNS
hazy sphinx
^^
tardy yoke
woop simming over 17k now pogchamp
hazy sphinx
Nah but real talk, I'd like to point you guys to my nemesis.
hollow stone
If i dont orange parse i just stop raiding for the night
keen hound
Man, last night I was worried i done messed up on fetid heroic. He dies so fast I didn't use my burst opener and held onto everything til 50% hero. I was middle of the pack on our dps chart and i didn't think i was going to make it back up. Soon as we hit 50% though, threw out hero and i did my burst w/ empowered garrotes + exsang... Shot way ahead of everyone w/ an 80k dps spike lol
hazy sphinx
frosty gyro
My mythrax parse dropped from a 78 to a 73 which took me under 90 avg
hazy sphinx
Look at my main man soyboy
frosty gyro
RIP
hazy sphinx
Representing them grays with pride.
hollow stone
Oh zid, just delete rogue bro
wet condor
what does tha parse depend on?
nova gazelle
@hazy sphinx help xD
2 archives or replace the 355 archive for a 340 SS?🍑 🍆
wet condor
damage done?
glass vessel
DPS
hazy sphinx
id say sim yourself, but for me right now
frosty gyro
Meanwhile I have 2 94s in mythic might as well kill myself
hazy sphinx
i have a chest with archive and SS at 5 stacks
and SS still sims betteer
And feels betters
glass vessel
i feel your pain kirvin i have 3 94's and a 93 in heroic to fix tonight lol
nova gazelle
I did sim myself but the double archibe sims 1,3% more than the SS
hazy sphinx
Nothing worse than coming out of stealth with garrote and feel like u hit em with the ol mosquito bite
nova gazelle
Archive*
hazy sphinx
Double archive strong though.
frosty gyro
my 94 on mother was a 95 when it was uploaded but dropped like an hour later
hollow stone
Mention me in your note, @frosty gyro, im one of the ones beating you 😘
nova gazelle
But I still feel like the SS would do more dmg on vanish redot, but idk..
hazy sphinx
a 94 is still something you should be proud of.
frosty gyro
Also no one was logging my taloc this week which felt like a 97 or so
hazy sphinx
You could also say you were orange for an hour.
wet condor
why do more people go exgang than TB in raid?
keen hound
b/c it's better 😃
hazy sphinx
He cleaned up his act.
wet condor
no longer a crip or blood what u mean
hazy sphinx
Nothing. The joke was lost.
strange python
People go with exsang because maybe it sims highest for them
hollow stone
Lol
strange python
🤷
hazy sphinx
You said exgang, so I mentioned some gangs.
glass vessel
@wet condor its mostly preference, TB/exsang sim very closely for almot everyone. but on some bosses exsang is really good for burst windows
like mother and fetid
main bobcat
master assassin over subterfuge if you have 0 ss traits?
strange python
sim yourself
hollow stone
Siiiiiiiminy crickets
glass vessel
with no SS traits subterfuge just feels wrong
main bobcat
simming ss is not accurate
frosty gyro
Why
glass vessel
even if it sims close MA feels better without SS
frigid kestrel
The bug
hazy sphinx
on one target it is
frosty gyro
The bug only affects you on 4+ targets
hazy sphinx
even on 3 it still is
frosty gyro
Why are you trying to sim 4+ target cleave
hollow stone
For the council boss, obviously 💩
frosty gyro
Also pretty sure Subterfuge would be better than MA on 4+ targets with 0 SS because you can just gar>gar>gar>gar
subterfuge isn't bugged just SS
main bobcat
yea i agree
glass vessel
yep
main bobcat
but im thinking ST, my sims are dead equal on st
but it kinda feels like mt works better
glass vessel
any peeps around 370 mind telling me what theys im? im at 371 and only sim 15.5k with a 385 dagger and it's kind of infuriating
hollow stone
Haha
nova gazelle
lol
strange python
Please dont bash me
nova gazelle
I as about to haha
hollow stone
Was waiting for you to realize that michee
main bobcat
im 375 and sim 16.8
gloomy jasper
Can you link your sim @main bobcat
frosty gyro
Lots of sockets?
frosty gyro
good mh?
glass vessel
has to be azerite traits
glass vessel
im not, 15.5k seems low af at 370
hazy sphinx
Cause I STILL have a shit 355 on my offhand
frosty gyro
385 MH and 3 sockets yeah that'll do it
glass vessel
no galecallers but that cant be the only reason
gloomy jasper
I'm 15.5k at 373
glass vessel
3 sockets total ya goof
hazy sphinx
Hold up
frosty gyro
I feel like galecallers is overestimated by sims still
glass vessel
385 ditb.. jeez
hazy sphinx
Got like 10, might as well play around.
main bobcat
i do too krivin
hazy sphinx
We had a big indepth discussions baout this earlier.
tiny vapor
Hi, switched to Master Assassin, is there a special opener or nah ?
hazy sphinx
About optimal GC usage.
glass vessel
yea seems like my azerite and no galecallers is holding my sin spec back
clear blaze
why do most people bind galecallers boon to vendetta, wouldnt it be better to use it right before exsan while vendetta is already up for 2 globals?
hazy sphinx
Well its opinionated.
But in mythic raiding, I'm not getting full usage of GC
Hardly get 50%.
glass vessel
galecallers is insane in a patchwerk scenario but in mythic atm it's hard to use it well enought o make it worth equipping
glass vessel
not only stay put for 10sec but being able to stand still every 1min, on the dot, so you can use it on CD
main bobcat
fits good for zek vec, mother and taloc doesnt it?
dusty crow
guys, why do people still use subterfuge over master assassin when using tb?
tiny vapor
Depends if you have SS or not @dusty crow
hazy sphinx
Might be different for heroic.
dusty crow
so if you have 1 SS you would take subter right?
main bobcat
feelsrogueman
tiny vapor
I would yeah
hazy sphinx
Rogues are insane in that fight.
main bobcat
and a rotating dps spot
hazy sphinx
We can really burn shit down.
gloomy jasper
Ah crap we have like 7 melees with nothing really in backup
gloomy jasper
Gonna be a long few weeks
main bobcat
u gotta basically hope for good add rng
gloomy jasper
We're only top 500 though so not expecting miracles
hazy sphinx
@glass vessel
Now since I know mother will rewrad my efforts tonight, here's whats going to happen.
exotic glen
@strange python i'd honestly pick dice, because if you fuck up the usage of galecallers, ur fucked
glass vessel
nice shoulders tho. i feel your pain with 385 garbage traits lol
exotic glen
unless you need burst dps on adds or something
strange python
Yeah was thinking the same
exotic glen
in which case galecallers
hazy sphinx
They hurt to wear lol
exotic glen
i was about to complain how people only play assa these days and im the only one simming as sub
then i remembered what channel im in
hazy sphinx
wait i can just post the logs why am i posting pictures
tiny vapor
Yeah but its still better than my 340 SS
exotic glen
fuk ur 385 weapon btw zid
hazy sphinx
i dont have it!
hazy sphinx
thats a sim assuming i get it tonight
gloomy jasper
Are we running 340 SS over 370/385 lesser traits in M+ still?
strange python
yus
exotic glen
probably
hazy sphinx
Niko has one and I'm still outsimmin him, but he wont post his logs to see what all the fuss is about 😃
at this pace, ill get 385 daggers from pvp instead
glass vessel
i cant atm im logged out in sub spec lol
at work
im at like 15.6 w/ a 385 dagger
and 371 ilvl
hazy sphinx
Logs
cursive cloak
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4x2RDmxzzgCRa74LL5Jswe
why tf do I sim so low ?! I thought my traits were fuckin bis
hazy sphinx
Not sims. Sims mean nothing to me!
frosty gyro
If I got a 385 dagger it'd put me at 16.4k
hazy sphinx
Only patchwerk fight is heroic fetid.
glass vessel
dont have much for heroic sin logs atm but i do have a 90 m taloc from last week
frosty gyro
logs for ghuun only count damage on ghuun
glass vessel
i was logging for sub in heroic last week
wheat zealot
Only damage not counted is cyst damage
glass vessel
they also dont count damage done to ghuun during first beam if you're trying to cheese that way too x)
dusty crow
guys, if i'm using master assassin and TB, do i even have an opener?
frosty gyro
yeah
dusty crow
is it just garotte, mulitate, rupture
hazy sphinx
You get 2 beams on ghuun?
frosty gyro
iirc it's like gar>mut>rup>mut>vanish>tb>mut>envenom or something
glass vessel
not really
but first beam you can hit ghuun while he's int he wall
he jsut stays at 100% tho
hazy sphinx
Really?
glass vessel
yep
hazy sphinx
Gonna pad that shit tonight!
frosty gyro
It won't count that part
glass vessel
it doesnt show up on logs but you can meme your guild if theyd ont know about it
frosty gyro
But what you want to do
hazy sphinx
Still gonna throw a dagger at it
frosty gyro
Put garrote+rupture on him at like 6 sec
Then Vanish>Cloak and immune the last tick of beam
Gets your vanish on CD like 10-15 secs earlier so its up for 2nd beam
hazy sphinx
Then vanish wont be up for 2nd beam though
hazy sphinx
We go fast.
glass vessel
not if your guild does the orbs quickly
dusty crow
so i vanish for TB and not for garotte?
frosty gyro
yep
dusty crow
where in that do you vandetta? lol
glass vessel
talking about opener?
strange python
Yeah I have a question about MA opener actually
cursive cloak
ma opener is the "non ss opener" on rh. It is g m r m vend tb van env m env
glass vessel
you TB before vanisha dn vanish on the envenom instead
glass vessel
G>Mut(4-5cp)>R>M>TB>Ven>Van>Env and spam away
cursive cloak
ma opener is the "non ss opener" on rh. It is g m r m vend tb van env m env
its that my dudes
you ven before toxic blade
ionic charm
Niko’s opener is the “wrong” one, but the “right” one assumes you have 3 double dose traits
strange python
Yeah but I got 0DD traits
frosty gyro
Gives that opener
strange python
Im 2 archive /dagger
frosty gyro
idk what 0x DD gives idk why it would be different
rough sable
Is the sim for SS still not accurate on hero damage? Currently running 1x DD 2x SS in m+ and I feel like my dps is solid. Hero damage shows DD being way better tho.
glass vessel
yea i guess you should TB after ven actually my b
cursive cloak
yeah still wrong
ionic charm
Because mut during TB gives poison damage
glass vessel
small dif but still better technically
cursive cloak
it accounts for not wasting CP
lone junco
@rough sable m+ stacks are using ma talent. Make sure you change to exang to see SS at the top.
ionic charm
@lone junco did the 6 target 40s sim without buffs, even with vanish, my 385 blightborne beats out 340 ss
glass vessel
that's assuming it procs every pull perfectly tho
ionic charm
It’s got pretty good uptime, been using it in raid and having 50% garrote crit over the 5 min fights
glass vessel
ignore that
lone junco
2ss blight with a massive ilvl jump. Vs 3ss Makes sense.
glass vessel
im dumb
lone junco
I really wanted scent to be a bit stronger. I like tabbed rupture aoe.
But it just doesn't beat the small pack ggg
ruby idol
Meaning to try ma in keys this week. How are yall opening on trash packs usually? Fok ct fok and then go about your business?
ionic charm
I don’t play MA but I can’t imagine what else you’d do
fallow estuary
ionic charm
Doesn’t outlul win zek?
vital haven
yes
vocal wave
So guys, question quickly. MY second Vanish and Vendetaa, Vendetta comes off CD like 20 secs before the next Vanish. do I hold or pop anyways?
amber arrow
ionic charm
If MA had another global it would be op but seems underwhelming atm. But that might just be because I have so much crit already
wheat zealot
I cant see ma or ns even coming close to subt for m+
wheat zealot
Wouldnt even consider it
shy escarp
for M+ subterfuge is king with SS
vital haven
too op
ruby idol
I'm just bored of ss
ruby idol
And it's an annoying week
ionic charm
Ma needs to swap with blindside, then both talents could actually be viable
wheat zealot
If you pull way bigger tho just go outlaw or sub imo
ruby idol
So I'm running MA for at least today
vital haven
ss is the most exciting in this expansion
shy escarp
I wish blindside was baseline
lone junco
Try the scent stacking with HB.
vital haven
what you talking about
vital haven
they should remove ss
ruby idol
I'm not saying ss is boring. I'm saying I specifically am bored with it at this moment in my life
ruby idol
I was running sub for 15+ at the end of last week as is cause sin got monotonous for me
ruby idol
Not swapping traits around. I'm just running 2 archive 1 filthy transmute this week cause of ilvl
I wanna play all 3 specs without going broke
lone junco
That's the best part about SS. Raid and m+.
I'm back down to like 80g respec
I could do 1ss 2scent without spending anything I think.
vital haven
blizz went full circle back to vanilla where respecs were 50g a piece
lone junco
That broke me on priest.
shy escarp
i had a guildmate of mine not pay attention and reach 20k on his azurite reforging
calm grail
Trying a single DD for m+ with SS.and Arhcive.
lone junco
Prob shop.
calm grail
Can't decide if I like it or not
shy escarp
I just ran holy all the time and made all my gold herbing
and just told my guilds DPS to go kill things for me
lone junco
@calm grail mut on 5t lol
calm grail
Ehh nahhh
modest zodiac
TFw they buffed doom's wake but i scrapped it before buff
lone junco
Dd seems neat. But doesn't have the fok synergy.
calm grail
It's more for baby packs and boss damage. It's either 340 SS shoulders or 385 DD shoulders.
calm grail
This week though probably will use the 340 SS
ruby idol
Bring back gear swapping in m+
slim olive
^
shy escarp
gonna try 1x SS and 2x Scent this week now that I got the gear to support ir
lone junco
That would just make it worse.
ruby idol
Itd be much more rewarding
lone junco
Need a lot of crit to tab out the ruptures.
gilded oak
What's your ultimate Uldir azerite setup..?
ruby idol
Ss for small packs, dd on bosses, sob or archives on big boy pulls
shy escarp
at least according to my sims its telling me to go scent over SS
ruby idol
I'd be happy dad
lone junco
Then you get wife aggro and have to go clean up dog vomit.
ionic charm
Shouldn’t 1 archive/2dd be best for Uldir?
gilded oak
more than 1 archive?
ruby idol
Uldir is p much just 1 archive and then ilvl determines other pieces
vital haven
pretty much
ionic charm
Meanwhile I’m still farming shrine 0 for the 340 ss helm for m+
calm grail
But if you stack DD you're probably going to need another set for Mythic Plus.
vital haven
you pretty much have to be lucky to get an azerite with dd that goes that high
devout moth
guys is 2 SS and 1 scent good for mythic plus?
vital haven
yes
calm grail
385 tentacle spaulders brother
tidal sedge
wait they buffed dooms wake?
exotic glen
is that the great cornholio
vital haven
tp
wheat zealot
You just have to wait til the 10th
exotic glen
whats on cd until then
exotic glen
yeah you cant have that reduced i think
was hoping he would say "trinket" "vendetta"
"exsang"
would have been pretty funny
vital haven
when does azerite reforging reset?
exotic glen
never i think
daring imp
every 3 days, halves the cost
exotic glen
i think its reduced in half every reset
daring imp
something like that
exotic glen
or every 3 days
vital haven
wait it doesnt reset???!?!?!?!?!?!?
lone junco
On a roll.
vital haven
qikowjdbqiwjdbqiowdjwqbnudiqhvbdqidj
calm grail
Ooof
exotic glen
cornholio is broken guys
cerulean walrus
Hey hey, keep the hunter rotation out of sin chat
exotic glen
wouldnt that be 12121212121212121
cerulean walrus
I heard you have to play BM hunter with your nose, lest you risk actually pressing more than 2 buttons and netting a dps loss
calm grail
(don't get me wrong, I find the specc fun)
cerulean walrus
Just smash your nose on the keyboard until you look like voldemort
calm grail
BM Hunter is apparently more involved this expansion.
lone junco
🐍 is like. 111141111411114.
calm grail
I think all of the immobile range classes are just jealous
cerulean walrus
Shhhhhh don't let Blizz see that
We would want the meme dream to die
wouldn't*
lone junco
I played a sample toon of BM and klolled pretty hard. "You can just run around and jump Willy nilly"
vital haven
sin channel shittalking BM hunter rotations 🤔
calm grail
I was defending it!
calm grail
Controversial statement here, but every specialization is pretty easy once you get used to it.
calm grail
People who brag about their specialization being difficult just want you to look at them and admire what they are doing when you perceive it's difficult.
It's pretty weird.
vital haven
whats the hardest spec
ionic charm
People always say feral but I know that’s not it
calm grail
But yeah, detailed assassination multi dotting can get more involved.
Uhh
Maybe survival?
cerulean walrus
Lul
cedar kelp
honest question, roughly how much energy should we pool for TB window
cerulean walrus
Hardest specs are always the clunkiest specs to be honest
cerulean walrus
Because they suck to play and yet masochists play them
calm grail
I have been playing Rogue since wrath and I find every other class to feel kind of weird.
cerulean walrus
Rogues play differently than other classes so it makes sense that everything else feels strange
At least in my experience
calm grail
Like I understand damage cooldowns having a cool down but having basic abilities with cooldowns feels weird.
ionic charm
Feral is pretty similar to sin
vital haven
gz @strange python
strange python
TY 😄
cerulean walrus
@calm grail Lul paladunks
calm grail
I'm sure that combo points and energy being a limiting factor just gives me the illusion of having choice and more complex gameplay depending on the situation, but just hitting stuff as it lights up doesn't feel as fun for me
ionic charm
I mained ret at the start of legion and assuming you opened correctly you could basically just spam 4 buttons at the same time as Ret and the spec would play itself because of spell CDs
calm grail
I guess I like the flow
ionic charm
So it’s def not like it
cerulean walrus
I mean, you do have choices and it makes it more complex
Choosing whether to refresh something because of a mechanic or just blowing it on a hard hitting finisher IS a choice
calm grail
That's something I noticed I wasn't doing as efficiently as I could on m+ lately
Sometimes I would have liked a seven-second rupture left
jovial swallow
Hey gusy, kinda need little help over here. First of all regarding trinkets, I got 370 spyglass and 370 pvp 1.5 agi on use with socket
calm grail
And I would occasionally be tempted to refresh it even if the mob was at like 50% health and would probably die
jovial swallow
wich trinkets should I go for as assa for m+?
lucid bolt
hey guys as someone who has never played a different class are Rogues one of the hardest if not the hardest class to play?
calm grail
Instead of just hitting it with an envenom
lone junco
Rogue is the easiest class I've played.
cerulean walrus
Like on MOTHER sometimes my tank is stupid and will pull the boss all the way to the other side of the room during the wind tunnel. so I'll refresh Rupture over Env because I know that its gonna fall off otherwise
Because its all you play @lone junco ?
lone junco
But that's from a survivability stand point.
calm grail
That is one thing I miss about our set bonus from last expansion at the end was Envenom being more useful for AoE
lucid bolt
what about from the rotations and dps stand point in raids
lone junco
Nah. I played mutiple healers and enhance /ele
lucid bolt
like not that we're ranked at teh top but as in doing our stuff properly and not dying
ionic charm
Rogues aren’t particularly difficult or easy. Some specs are easier, but not too many specs stand out as being particularly difficult. There’s mindless specs, and semi-mindless specs, and that’s about it
cerulean walrus
#BringBackKingsbane #RemoveMemeBomb
lucid bolt
@ionic charm what would you consider mindless?
lone junco
But it's pretty easy when you don't die from a beam. And dh /enh/warrior does.
Kb talent would be cool. Solid mastery choice.
jovial swallow
370 spyglass and 370 pvp 1.5 agi on use trinkets, is there any trinkets that beats them and if so wich one?
lone junco
Herodamage.
weak pine
?
wheat zealot
cerulean walrus
I would have LOVED KB over "Whoopsie, oh dear I dropped mama's jam again, darn!" The talent...
ionic charm
@lucid bolt the aforementioned ret, frost and fire mage are pretty bad. Arms is basically ret and is easy as well. Those are just the ones that stand out off the top of my head. BM hunter is pretty easy as well
lone junco
Too much babysitting with that q
lucid bolt
thanks @ionic charm i want to have the easiest game play possible so i may make a new character eventually
calm grail
I've never played a match, but for some reason I always think of it like calculus because it scares me
lucid bolt
If they could have a rotation where I would hit 1 button I'd pick that