assassination

[prisma monolith]

Do my azerite traits stack?
The damage part of azerite Stacks.
Other components can be assumed to stack however with some exceptions and limitations.
You can check https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/azerite-stacks/1t-t22-assassination for estimations.

[cunning dirge]

!azerite

[inland rune]

Is shrouded suffocation fixed yet?

It feels like it's been bugged forever

[civic palm]

Nope and it probably won't ever be fixed.

Low priority.

[inland rune]

Foreeeeeever

That's lame

[tawdry ice]

hmm

[civic palm]

Just don't do it again.

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[tawdry ice]

exsang doesnt seem to be snapshotting it anymore

i just did some testing

it seems the exsanged dots are dynamic as well

[safe matrix]

the only thing that snapshot about it

was tick rate

from the current haste

[tawdry ice]

the tick rate is getting increased as i pop the galecallers trinket tho

[safe matrix]

the rest of the damageis dynamic

is it?

[tawdry ice]

ye

[safe matrix]

hmm

[tawdry ice]

from 1.5 to 1.8

i mean

the opposite

[safe matrix]

tooltip or actual?

[tawdry ice]

tooltip

[civic palm]

The DoT is still dynamic > _>

[cunning needle]

sort of @civic palm except it's the worlds largest island thank you very much

[tawdry ice]

i just did some light testing tho if someone else can test to confirm as well

[cunning needle]

and i think they have acknowledged the ss bug and are like yeah nah not fixing it

[civic palm]

If you EX before GC, GC will still increase the number of ticks you get because Garrote is still dynamic > _>

The only thing EX does is calculate how much it should reduce the remaining time by and factor the number of ticks into that timing.

The more haste you have before hitting EX, then faster the Garrote will be.

ticking*

Do note that EX will always cause your Bleeds to tick 100% faster, that is what it does, your other haste is still increasing the tick rate on its' own.

[cunning needle]

OH

WAIT

WITH MORE HASTE

= MORE TICK RATES

= MORE ENERGY

i get things now

it all makes sense

[shrewd night]

[civic palm]

_>

[dire spoke]

[cunning needle]

i swear i'm a good rouge

professional stabber

[shrewd night]

i swear i'm a good rouge

ok fam, you be a good rouge

[inland rune]

I too am a professional makeup

[cyan galleon]

Are you guys also use exsanguinate in raid ? I simed few times and toxic blade is still ahead

[civic palm]

Use what is best for you and you see the best results from.

[cunning needle]

also do whats more comfortable for you. iirc difference between the two isn't that much anyway

[civic palm]

Yeah playing better will probably lead to better numbers in the end.

and you not dying like a looooooooooooserrrrrrrrrrrrr.

[hushed pulsar]

is marked for death now standard in m+?

[shrewd night]

If you can make use of it, sure

[ripe comet]

rogues don't die , they just shadowstep to bwonsamdi

[shrewd night]

If everything dies within five seconds of eachother, probably not.

[hushed pulsar]

looking at hero damage and everything i listed with subterfuge/MfD

[proud tusk]

How many targets should I be able to keep garrote and rupture on in M+ ? im having trouble sustaining garrote on 3, and rupture on 3-4.

Is it a case of git gud scrub, or is there a limit?

[hushed pulsar]

garrote depends on your vanish

you cant sustain it always

[keen spruce]

Finally got an orange parse in Heroic

[hushed pulsar]

rupture on the other hand should be easy

just hit tab - check for rupture - if no rupture click rupture - if rupture click tab

[vital haven]

also remember

!ss

[prisma monolith]

Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.

[proud tusk]

Ok, i need to create a simple WA for rupture on target 😃 ill try it, thanks dudes.

[cunning needle]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[proud tusk]

Yeah im aware of the SS-bug, and im playing around it

[cunning needle]

use one of them

[vital haven]

its so fucking annoying

not being able to garrote

until they ran out

[cunning needle]

i need some sort of weak aura that tracks garrotes made from stealth

to know when i acn refresh again

[civic palm]

https://giphy.com/gifs/illustration-brain-warcraft-3oEduNyqHoMFP9oVXy

[desert pelican]

triple ss or double ss + laser matrix for mythic +? what if third ss is 40 but matrix is 70?)

[modest zodiac]

how long does exsanguinate last? until all current bleeds wear out ?

[bleak jungle]

Yes

[worldly pelican]

that

i dont see it in any guide

granted that bosses dont die immediately

[hexed tinsel]

Soo stacking double dose works Best for raids (single target)?

[worldly pelican]

do i refresh to max duration before I exsanguinate again?

i mean on the 2nd exsang

[restive elm]

Noob question but does it matter if MH or OH get a specific enchant or not?

[modest zodiac]

I don't think so

In sin

Because they have the same attack speed and when u use mutilate u hit with both weapons so totally it's the same # of hits

[restive elm]

Ok cool, thanks

[unreal socket]

This is probably a dumb question, but why does Fan of Knives sometimes award 1 CP and sometimes 5 CP? Crits?

[safe matrix]

FoK is 1 point + every target crit

It's also why mut does 2-4 combo points

[unreal socket]

I'm a moron

Thanks, of course it's that

[cunning needle]

it's okay we are all morons today

or at least i was also

[restive elm]

Do you guys your Envenom buff fall off or do you clip it <.5 seconds? Also in normal combat where energy is precious, do you ever Envenom with 3+ seconds left or you just wait and pool energy

[cunning needle]

envenom can pandemic i think

but EP cannot

[restive elm]

ahh interesting, didn't think it could

[modest zodiac]

both can

[cunning needle]

wait really?

[modest zodiac]

yes

[cunning needle]

i always thought EP couldnt

[modest zodiac]

when i re envenom i get duration 4 sec

[cunning needle]

or is that only for legion

[modest zodiac]

instead of 3

[cunning needle]

but EP is 4 secs?

[slender hare]

EP doesnt have pandemic, the envenom buff does

[restive elm]

Ok so less pooling energy, more chaining Envenoms inside 4 seconds

[cunning needle]

hmm

when you envenom

does EP apply before or after the envenomd amage

[slender hare]

after

you gain EP after using finishers

[cunning needle]

yeah figured as much

[strange python]

Soooooooo, if you're at 4 combo points never go for the 5th?

[slender hare]

yep finish at 4+

[modest zodiac]

oh wait i thought it was 3 so nvm

but yeah envenom has pandemic. btw does anyone have a tooltip for pandemic?

I remember a long time ago there used to be an in game tooltip for rlocks

[cunning needle]

pandemic is 30%

[slender hare]

wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Pandemic

you can read about the original one for warlocks here

[modest zodiac]

It's no longer in game tho how are new players supposed to know about it 😦

[safe matrix]

I wrote a pin about it

I can't copy paste cause mobile, but it's in the FAQ of this channel

[pastel vault]

anyone on / kill mythic mythrax yet?

how priority is the big mythic add?

would sub ST burst be valuable or total dmg from cleaving matters more?

[acoustic forum]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.

[solid nova]

I gotchu

-Pandemic this term relates to reapplying buffs/debuffs. When a debuff (like garrote) is refreshed, its remaining time (up to a cap of 30% max duration, so 18x0.3=5.4s for garrote) will be added to the new buff. Primarily used to give leeway to reapply bleeds, however can also be used to make bleeds last longer.

[modest zodiac]

Yeah i always use double garrote from stealth

this way i get 5 combos and 23 sec uptime with ss

How can you get +10 origination array stacks since there are only 8 bosses?

does it stack from difficulty to another?

[worldly pelican]

try using Garrote > Rupture > Garrote

so that you get the bonus from EP

[modest zodiac]

if i do garrote garrote rupture i also get bonus from ep no ?

[worldly pelican]

Tjhe origination array stacks, you gain that per 3 boss

[warm sable]

U need to kill 3 bosses that week and you will get +1 on array after reset day

[modest zodiac]

Oh so i have +4 this week means i killed 12 bosses last week makes sense

8 on normal and 4 on hc

[worldly pelican]

AHHHHHHHH

so that's a thing

then it's better to clear normal and HC

does LFR help?

[modest zodiac]

idk but probably not

[worldly pelican]

what traits do you guys use for mythic plus?

I still use 3 SS

I don't how to sim for Mplus

are you able to get Laser Matrix +10 on Mplus?

[modest zodiac]

i use DD and 2x SS

[worldly pelican]

In thinking of maybe getting a fan of knives trait. Since there’s a lot of adds to hit

But im not sure how to sim it.

[slender hare]

Array doesn’t stack like that

You can get +1 per week

So max atm is +4

[nocturne gate]

u gain every week 1 array stack for killing 3 bosses(once per week doesnt matter which difficulty) u can also kill 3x taloc on each difficulty

[slender hare]

Yeah

Should really just see it as a weekly quest: Kill 3 Uldir bosses, gain 1 array stack

[normal ridge]

the combo for vanish is
Vanish+rupture no?

garrote*

[modest zodiac]

i would usually vanish with 0 CBs

double garrote

then rupture

[strange python]

how accurate is simming multiple times without changing gear really?

checked best gear, said that specific gear-combo gives 16.650 dps 3 targets 3 minutes

did normal sim (using /SimC), 16.239 dps same run

0.05% error variable is not several hundreds of dps

[solid nova]

The iterations used will always give a variance too, what was the comparison in that regard?

5k iterations vs 100k iterations for example, would provide a much higher variance

Baring in mind sims is going to provide an average over x amount

[warm parcel]

You had a top gear swap out gems or enchants

[strange python]

10k iterations @solid nova

@warm parcel I swapped to "top gear", then did another sim to confirm - big difference

a difference of like 10-50 dps wouldnt be surprising, but a couple of hundreds?

[warm parcel]

Again, gems and enchants

[summer marten]

i think he meant to say, top gear sim changes gems and enchants on all gear

[solid nova]

Thats what he did say 😄

[strange python]

Aha, then I think I understand more

[warm parcel]

Happens all the time

[strange python]

Thank you all 😃

morning! can anyone explain to me why on ST the prio is haste & crit and on mythic + aoe is mastery + crit?

[worldly pelican]

critting on fan of knives gives more combo points

one extra CP per crit

so it's great for multiple enemies, or mplus

haste make your poisons and bleeds tick faster

great for single target

[strange python]

and mastery is just big dmg on bleeds poisonS?

[worldly pelican]

yes sir 😃

[strange python]

ok nice, for this week tyranical, Im doing some +9s but geared as ST with crimson tempest (haste and crit)

should be an improvement to put my crit+mastery set? even if it is tyranical

[worldly pelican]

I don't think I have the proper credentials to answer that question, but what I would do is look at your party composition. If I'm confident that my party could handle the AOE, then i would focus on ST since sin rogues are great at it. And with Tyrannical, OOOH BOI

[strange python]

@strange python why would you run +9s ?

Do either 8s or 10s

ive done only 2 or 3 not spaming

Also i found my ST spec every week overall out performs my master crit heavy setup.

So this week run PB

For boss damage

[subtle imp]

for high m+, is it more beneficial to CT after you apply all garrotes or lay down a rupture on a prio target

or like most things it changes depending on pull/comp

[slender hare]

CT first

then ruptures out

[subtle imp]

alright cool thanks

[golden juniper]

Is EP doing better than MP now?! I’m afraid to switch lol!

[glacial steppe]

Afaik it depends on how well you can keep EP up

for important spells*

[golden juniper]

Eh I’m sure I can keep it up pretty well if I watch it. If you keep it up, I’m assuming it’s better than MP?

[slender hare]

generally yes, should just sim it

but in most cases EP is better

[lean kite]

how are you supposed to line up vanish and vendetta

since you use vanish after your first opening garrote, how are they ever suppoed to line up?

[halcyon kayak]

they are on the same cd? they will lineup the same way as you use them on pull

[lean kite]

yes

so the vanish will always be ~20 secs behind

[halcyon kayak]

you should be vanishing at the end of the vendetta window to refresh garrote

[lean kite]

correct

[spark oyster]

@lean kite just wait for vanish to come off Cd before using Vendetta

[lean kite]

is it a dps gain to hold it?

[spark oyster]

Yes

[lean kite]

interesting

[spark oyster]

You only have to do this once per fight, all the next ones will be lined up

[worldly pelican]

so Vanish, Garrote, Rupture, Garrote, Mutilate, Rupture, Vendetta, Exsanguinate?

do i have to wait for exsang too?

[spark oyster]

You can hold your 3rd exsang until 2nd vendetta is up

[worldly pelican]

ah

that clarifies it

[spark oyster]

Dunno how it impacts dps tho

[lean kite]

do y'all try to keep uptime on envenom/elaborate planning?

[worldly pelican]

not really

[lean kite]

so is there any benefit to pooling? like pooling before TB?

to get max envenoms off in the window?

or do y'all not pool at all

[tardy spruce]

You should at least try to pool before tb

More envenoms inside tb the better

[strange python]

@spark oyster it impacts alot. And the vanish before vendetta ends is incorrect if you literally mean before it ends

When running ss you open g,r,g, vendetta, mut, rupture, exange (mutilate envenoms to maximise ep uptime) as garrote drops off you can usually land a mutilate, vanish, garrote, envenom, delay a moment and garrote again( sometimes gives an addiction ss tick) then mutilate wait 1-2 seconds for exang rupture to drop then reapply rupture. Ans then standard rotation whilst waiting for the 2nd lot of ss garrote to fall ofd

Additional tick*

370 g'huun trinket is worse than a 325 banana trinket

insane

[golden juniper]

I just got that Ghuun trinket. It sucks

[tribal yacht]

Is there any point in keeping the envenom buff up as much as possible during regular rotation?

[sleek iron]

Your question asks whether or not it’s good to have a buff up

Roflmao

Do you like buffs? Haha

[sour trout]

Silly question - when you guys exsang do you refresh rupture/garrote even if its not in pandemic range?

[small island]

Anyone know why herodamage.com wont load for me? its just a circle rotating

[solid nova]

Works fine for me

[sour trout]

im always torn when my rupture still has like 13 seconds and my esxange is about to come off cd

[sleek iron]

I don’t think something has actually calculated that @sour trout

I’d imagine if they’re within a certain time range of being in pandemic range it’ll be better to refresh before exsang

[sour trout]

yeah i couldnt find anything on it, but what do YOU guys do?

[sleek iron]

If it’s close to 50% of the maximum duration I refresh it

[sour trout]

yeah it just feels wasted when my rupture is at liek 14 seconds and m ygarrote is at lets say 8...

[sleek iron]

I don’t know if what I’m doing is correct however

[sour trout]

to blow everything and build up cp to rupture all for esxang

[echo crest]

Hi! i heard everyone is going in the assassination train for raid and mithyc, can you guys tell me the comon talent builds for both and stats priority?

[sleek iron]

If you refresh near 50% you lose 20% of the difference to pandemic time - id imagine that exsang gives more dps than that during that window

[prisma gull]

!pin

!pins

fuck doesn work here..

check the pins

[sleek iron]

It’s not concrete though because one can argue that those globals spent on refreshing can be spent on other things

[solid nova]

!pins @prisma gull

[sour trout]

yeah

[solid nova]

Work?

[prisma gull]

https://i.giphy.com/3o7TKMyfMHjPEQLumI.gif

[sleek iron]

I think exsang is such a valuable global that you should aim to utilize it to its maximum or near max

You get it every 45 seconds after all

[prisma gull]

oh you gotta tag them too? 😛

[sour trout]

tahts true.

[sleek iron]

Sin is just my offspec for m+ so I’m not educated enough in it haha

[queen monolith]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vKwy3LQttn3Vj65eaZYkcW

[echo garnet]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[acoustic lion]

Guys, what do you think is better.. 2x SS and 1 archive of titans that ilvl 370, or replace that 370 with 340 SS?
Speaking purely for m+

[buoyant flicker]

think its 40ilvl~ to replace a SS with an archive

think that is what the rank 1 m+ rogue was saying anyway

[acoustic lion]

Stupid, but thanks

[sudden trench]

repalce

[torn mulch]

sorry for the obviously noobish question, but i cant see why ss is so good? why is the dmg increase that high? even on bosses

[lone junco]

Subterfuge plus SS does a lot of damage.

[torn mulch]

i can see its use on trash, but isnt it quite useless on bosses where i can only use it every 2mins?

[tribal marlin]

damage was so insanly broken that it was bis even on pure ST but with the nerf that's changed

[torn mulch]

just saw the m+ leaderboard and its even played on tyrannical, thats just kinda confusing^^

[lone junco]

It is still my bis. 2ss 1archive

[tribal marlin]

even in tyrannical trashes is the big part on the dunjon

[torn mulch]

well, thats kinda true

[lone junco]

In m+. It's even better o. Tyrannical.

It does really well on 18sec trash.

[torn mulch]

that does make sense, thanks a lot!

[lone junco]

Number wise. Before the nerf. Each garrote was worth about 100k damage.

Just think about the effort required to get 100k out of a single envenom.

[torn mulch]

😄 just returning to rogue, so i sadly missed that

[fallow estuary]

idk boys

i'm unable to do 100 parses as sin

[unborn barn]

You can't before we get better gear

because of the nerfs

[fallow estuary]

maybe i'll just swap back to sub :c

[unborn barn]

I would argue it's impossible to get 95+ parses right now

[fallow estuary]

Nah x)

Not in heroic

[night vale]

that MAY be true if you are still in 360~ gear range

[tribal marlin]

I confirm that, doing 99 parse right now requiert unusual things

[fallow estuary]

did a full heroic clear this week and got 7x 99 and 1x 95 on ghuun because i double ran orbs

[unborn barn]

Well that certainly is impressive

[night vale]

"double ran orbs" still gets 95%... teach me Senpai

[fallow estuary]

blow all cd's on intermission and nuke the fck out of boss + 2x adds

[night vale]

not gonna lie, i run orbs once.... and i cant get above 90%

[tribal marlin]

for example we did the "rush B" strat on mother HC with my guilde, there was remaining 5 deeps in room 3, we did the boss from 80 to 10% with the 100% buff we all did 99 parse

[fallow estuary]

but i can't compare my sin to my sub logs

even tho my sin is better geared and more fun

http://prntscr.com/kzr8fj

[lone junco]

Yeah mother cheese.

[fallow estuary]

Sub is so strong for me im confused

[night vale]

wtf dude i need your help....

[lone junco]

I don't see how people can rank on taloc. The elevator is a mess

Unless Dk grips each add into a stun.

Our ranged kill stuff while I'm throwing knives.

[fallow estuary]

i just cheese it

i beat my own r1 on taloc

http://prntscr.com/kzr95c

just because i cheese adds

during p2

[lone junco]

How

[fallow estuary]

i wishper a healer and tell him to heal me

while i stand in blood

x)

[verbal sorrel]

I do the same

[zealous dew]

lol

[verbal sorrel]

without whispering

lmao

"Nido are you okay?"

my parses bro

[lone junco]

That I'm ok with.

[tribal marlin]

my guild log in private to avoid that kind of things -)

[lone junco]

I have a pocket healer.

He can beacon me

Will pump his numbers as well.

[fallow estuary]

yea thats what im thinking - good for both on a boring fight

[lone junco]

Tbh. It's a shitty phase anyway. He's not healing. I'm not damaging. It's not bad for the fight unless he ooms or I die.

[fallow estuary]

i can't believe that Taloc Mythic and Fetid Mythic are part of the same Raid

Taloc can be cleared by any pug

While Fetid is just pure aids and rng

[lone junco]

Rng meaning how far the egg spawns from melee?

I haven't done it.

[fallow estuary]

Yea - two small egg's on one side and the big on the other = we just call a wipe

[lone junco]

I'm going to try and pug mother. Saw a pug in trade last night. They killed taloc. Mother. And a 3rd one.

[fallow estuary]

a 3rd one?

thats freakin impressive for a pug

[lone junco]

Yeah.

[fallow estuary]

i can see taloc and mother

[lone junco]

Probably fetid tbh.

[fallow estuary]

but zec voz pugging is really good

Nah

Not Fetid

x)

[lone junco]

Zec

It was a longer name.

I just don't remember.

Anyway. We have roster for of 28. Maybe we can squeak together enough dps for taloc and mother.

Would need to rent a dh pug. Ours does like 6k dps.

[fallow estuary]

(^.^) Should be enough for Taloc M

[lone junco]

That easy...

[fallow estuary]

Its insane

[lone junco]

Is there a crossing yellow beam in mythic?

[fallow estuary]

we're a mediocore guild - we downed Vectis as 250 World or something | And we first tried taloc M without seeing the spread ability before

so yea

that easy

You have the same beams like in hc just more of em

[sonic rapids]

I cannot find a definite answer, if rupture is out of pandemic window and exsang is coming of CD, do I delay exsang or do I clip the rupture?

[fallow estuary]

the only new ability is a spread - while ppl who don't get the spread debuff are supposed to go into the tank

but our tank can take it solo 100% of the time

so for us there is only a spread which is super easy to handle

[patent topaz]

mythic taloc is just a lmao

we had 15 mins after our first ghuun heroic kill, went in and one shot taloc

[lone junco]

@sonic rapids anything regarding rupture and exang is the same. You want 4/5cp rupture up at all times. Prior to exang, refresh it a in pandemic with another 4/5.

If your timing is off. And you refresh at like 10sec. Then fine.

It's just not best.

[sonic rapids]

so that means you delay exsang by more than 10-12sec in worst cases?

[lone junco]

But your GC. Exang. Vend. Vanish timing is way more important than a few cps worth of rupture.

[tribal marlin]

I have 2 SS and 1 SoB for m+ should I play with PB ?

[lone junco]

Never delay the exang based on rupture values.

Delay exang if you are tying it to GC.

[sonic rapids]

but if I should never clip rupture in purpose and I should never delay exsang, how does that work out, sometimes rupture is at 15sec and exsang come off cd

[patent topaz]

If your timing is off. And you refresh at like 10sec. Then fine.

do you even read

[fathom lynx]

I would refresh a 15s rup with a 5cp rup. But the dmg from rupture is not that impressive, compared to the dmg of garrote and will matter less. But you've already made the mistake really, because you should probably just have used a lower cp rup earlier to plan for the exsang, so that you don't clip 8 seconds of it. So ideally you would look at the CD for exsang and plan a rupture so that it has around 6-8 seconds longer duration than the remaining CD of exsang.

And then refresh just before exsang urinate is up

Exsanguinate *

[sonic rapids]

that is conflicting information again, 4-5CP and low CP rupture beforehand

but I will give it a shot at a dummy for a few minutes

[sharp flower]

how does one envenom 2 times in a row

[queen monolith]

MFD

[sharp flower]

im watching streams like musclebrahtv and he has the little rotation down at the bottom that shows what buttons he presses and his envenoms are always paired

[strange python]

Because he’s pushing fast his button the add on show the bind you push not the spell launched?

[patent topaz]

multistrike

[summer marten]

i also think thats not rotation but addon that shows buttons he presses for stream to see

[warm parcel]

Envenom registers two events in combat log

So does dance

And afaik frostbolt

Etc

And the addon only hooks combat log and displays what happens

[candid phoenix]

guys, any1 has a macro/addon that announces ToTT in raid / party chat (depending on what u are doing), even through mouseover macro usage of ToTT?

[lone junco]

Not a horrible idea.

Was just thinking back to the legion exang with CD-R on vendetta. 1min to sync with GC would be like 5/7. Leave room for 2mut relics. That would have been pretty fantastic.

[desert pelican]

/offtop someone know wtf doing guys who killed ghuun in 57 seconds?

meh, logs alrdy deleted ;D

[lone junco]

Neat.

I've seen edited logs with a jump in boss health or something weird. It pumps their dps.

[desert pelican]

but moonkin with 500k crits from starsurge alrdy here -_-

[lone junco]

If it's legit. Maybe It's a few solo orbs and the didn't kill the big guy. Overlapped the purple buff with the vuln phase.

[high siren]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/xfaFdEgrqfXkMwig4tt8zW

this fuckin canonball sims so high, yet it's unusable

[desert pelican]

95 -_-

[storm skiff]

been messing around on my rogue, the ilvl is okay but i sim like i'm wearing a foam sword. would anyone mind having a quick look at see if i've missed anything other than the raid trait?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/cJsUdsKreBDSrTUg3hh5NS

could it just be the combo of 2 bad pieces + lack of raid trait?

man this is so much easier on a tank >.> just equip the higher ilvl

cheers for looking man 😃

[gusty spire]

your neck ilvl is really bad 😃

champions rep?

[storm skiff]

i only just got to honored right this minute :p

[hardy anchor]

Is there a specific timing for using the Lion's Guile trinket to maximise it's effectiveness or do you just use it on CD pretty much?

Do bleeds gain the benefit of the increasing agility after they've already been applied btw?

Awesome, something hella important that I wasn't too sure about, haha

Cheers 😃

[grizzled harness]

I do think Bleeds take all buffs dynamicaly

Even EP ye?

Well Fantastik did answer that I guess

[past harbor]

Galecaller's Boon Bis trinket for dungeons?

[grizzled harness]

Depends on the affix

This week with Tyrannical, probably yeah

Last week it may not have been

[calm grail]

It's p good regardless of week. Slap that bad boy with a Harlans dice and pop it on CD pretty much

[grizzled harness]

Well if mob-packs are the focus, you'll overcap energy, especially if you only have raid-oriented gear

But it's never a Bad trinket ye. But maybe not BiS tho

[hot flume]

You think galecaller + Construct overcharger is better than galecaller + fathoms on m+ ?

[grizzled harness]

Gotta sim yourself I guess

[hot flume]

Gotta learn how to mess with patchwerk I guess

Never got into it so basically simming ST fights

[grizzled harness]

40sec 4-5Boss

To sim trash packs

[hot flume]

Thank you for the tip mate

[high ingot]

So, I'm kinda confused now with the whole exsang-GC thing: Do you actually delay each exsang to line it up with GC now because of the synergy?!

[hardy anchor]

Are people fully dropping shrouded suffocation after the nerf?

gonna feel weird playing with that 1 CP Garotte again if so, haha

[grizzled harness]

Never delay Exsang

[gentle rapids]

you should delay it if you use the on use haste trinket(Galecaller) right?

[high ingot]

thats my question

[hardy anchor]

In a perfect world your exsang is usually ready just as you pandemic your garrotte/rupture

[grizzled harness]

Yeah Veddis, I'll always use one SS

[hardy anchor]

https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/azerite-levels/1t-t22-assassination

This kinda made me yikes

[grizzled harness]

The dps loss isn't worth the lost of gameplay comfort

[quick chasm]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[high ingot]

So with 1min haste trinket and 45s exsang you're just taking care to pop the trinket first on pull and then not worry about that synergy until they line up again?

[grizzled harness]

I don't even know how to open without SS aha

[calm grail]

Triple SS still beats out my raid gear by a good chunk for m+

[grizzled harness]

Adding 15sec on a 45sec CD everytime is surely a loss

[high ingot]

that's what I thought. currently playing it like this but read something on here about it's great synergy or something so I just wanted to confirm

[valid meadow]

Hey guys

Is it just me, or is the new poisoned wire super strong?

[calm grail]

Haven't touch it yet.

[valid meadow]

I'm getting 1700 crit on my next 2 mutilates

i'm throwing out envenoms faster than ever

Somehow i gradually switched out all my haste gear for crit gear, so i'm at like 14% haste and 32% crit, it works tho

[hardy anchor]

I think missing out on that pandemic bleed damage every time is rough. But if you're sitting with exsang up for a while, like with a movement heavy fight or something, it's not terrible to just use non-pandemic'd

[cedar meteor]

with sss traits ,im always waste cp ,I do triple g that is making more than 5 cp always and then rupture,or with more haste is time put two garotes one rupture and again garote in one supterfuge window ?

[ripe comet]

ss cp don't stack

[grizzled harness]

On trashs ?

[ripe comet]

even with 3 you only get 2 extra

[thin ingot]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/h423GWBx82V4YmLmAZMHD3

[hardy anchor]

Wasting the CP for the 3 garrotes is worth it.

[thin ingot]

master assasin bis

[ripe comet]

oh you mean that way , yeah just do the 3 garrotes

[grizzled harness]

371ilvl

Damn

[hardy anchor]

I haven't hit the point where I can get 2 garrote rupture garotte before Subterfuge ends yet

But my haste has been kinda low

[grizzled harness]

Can you?

[hardy anchor]

Maybe with galecallers that works?

I think I can do it with BL/Hero

[grizzled harness]

I'll try, I'm hitting 1700Haste on Uldir

[cedar meteor]

yes but almost alwys making in the opener some cp Seal Fate is well

[hardy anchor]

I'm like 850 haste atm. It's painful. 💔

Outside of Uldir

[grizzled harness]

We're talking MT, so Zul?

[dawn dragon]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/rtrbVtS2gzwP5rjg4p8DJN

[grizzled harness]

Or M+?

[thin ingot]

i hover between 20-30% haste outside of uldir

considering frenetic trinket and weapon encant

enchant*

[opaque grotto]

I’m just gonna let you know

Haste doesn’t change rogue GCD

It’s always 1 second

[dawn dragon]

with master assassin, I just want to vanish with Vendetta and evenom/estro as much as possible during the buff ?

with TB up i guess

[hardy anchor]

Use Subterfuge, it's OP

[cedar meteor]

ok so wat is about ss cp and Seal Fate cp,that almost always hapen .Its wasting cp for me every opener

[opaque grotto]

I’m pretty sure you only take subterfuge with SS

[dawn dragon]

talking pure single target here, for m+ or multi i go subterfuge obv

[fast nacelle]

got only 1 SS trait - tb still 100 dps behind exsang
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vfJQhzihoHeaJ42uKtrYJL

[hardy anchor]

80% garotte damage is OP, unless something changes I was pretty sure Master Assassin was trash in comparison.

[dawn dragon]

that's some big boi deeps

[hardy anchor]

379 oooft

[dawn dragon]

Master assassin sims higher for me

[grizzled harness]

Yeah 379 wth

[opaque grotto]

Yeah MA sims higher for me to unless I have SS traits

Veddis I think you need to brush up on rogue lol

[fast nacelle]

ah sec i can test MA and TB

[hardy anchor]

Maybe so!

[dawn dragon]

If you don't have any Double Dose / Twist the knife, i don't think it's worth it Tyra

[fast nacelle]

MA even worse

yeah

[dawn dragon]

Toxic Blade with Master Assa is good with double dose and twist the knife, you get some juicy evenoms :>

[fast nacelle]

https://i.imgur.com/d7KHIot.png

385 without SS but the other trait is highest i can get

to 100dps difference

[cedar meteor]

do you alwyas siming without raid bufs ?

[dawn dragon]

what's nice too is that with the double dose/twist pieces, second trait is overwelming power

[fast nacelle]

without raid buffs?

[quartz depot]

remove some mastery if you want tb to sim more

[fast nacelle]

i got low haste now

was at 23% now im at 13% or so

[quartz depot]

i got shitloads of crit & haste, and tb is like 300 dps more

[hardy anchor]

Yeah I dropped to 13%

had a phat 340 haste ring that I had to replace.

[cedar meteor]

@fast nacelle yes if you have in raidbot raid buffs or not

[hardy anchor]

but i've got double overwhelming power so hopefully it makes up for it.

[magic zenith]

In Sims it will lol

I avoid that shit like the plague

[hardy anchor]

I just got a 355 Construct Overcharger last night and then replaced it with a 375 Lion's Guile 30 mins ago

so my brain is all over the place right now gear wise.

[cedar meteor]

I thing like some people show us sim with and some without raid buffs

[quartz dew]

Exsang is a minor loss for me, but I only have one SS and assorted shit gear

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/aVYTYRaHrvuDBr3EViikz1

[dawn dragon]

default settings are with buff no ?

[cobalt bobcat]

hey guys, how much value is there in 3 stacking SS in m+? (cant rly sim that, as sims dont count for restealths between packs). I have 2x SS on head/chest (355 & 370) and the third SS is on a 340 shoulder, but I also have a 355 shoulder with AotT... so do you think the 3rd SS on the 340 is worth the 15ilvls with AotT?

[grizzled harness]

You can sim trash packs

[cobalt bobcat]

well you can sim add cleave or multiple bosses on short duraiton, but neither uses restealths

either way, SS sims very low

[crisp hollow]

what do you prioritize to parse on vectis? our add kill times are really solid so i don't get that great of dot uptimes, should i be tunnelling and just using rupture for energy gain? (this is on farm of course)

[valid gull]

crimson tempest or poison bomb for m+?

[grizzled harness]

CT

For Vectis, I guess yeah just a rupture? With a garrote if it doesn't fuck your refresh on Vectis?

[opaque grotto]

I usually get to 5 CP just before add spawns

And double bleed the add right when it spawns and get back on boss

[grizzled harness]

Depends on how fast the add goes I guess

Yeah

But 5CP may be too much ?

[opaque grotto]

Or 4 CP, doesn’t really matter

[grizzled harness]

Yeah

[opaque grotto]

I sit at 4-5 and pool just before it spawns

[grizzled harness]

Do you FoK?

Or Mutilate

[crisp hollow]

on progression it was a hard swap to ensure it died and it broke my heart to waste 3s of toxic blade or let something drop off the boss

[opaque grotto]

Mutilate

[crisp hollow]

out warr will be back next kill though so let's see how the tunnel works out 😄

[opaque grotto]

Yeah warriors are nutty on certain bosses

[supple ridge]

is there a specific stat weight for cleave, and if so - where can I find it? 😃

[pine jetty]

So i am using raidbots to sim and get my pawn string. it is saying that haste>crit>mastery>vers. however when i look at top rogues i am seeing Crit>mastery> vers=haste (like on the multi stats that are pinned) is there a reason why Raid bots is making me favor those other stats?

[grizzled harness]

Depends on the encounter

[pine jetty]

i run Mythic + osrry forgot to add that

[lone junco]

@cobalt bobcat m+ sim for SS could be. 6T 40s. Patchwerk. No buffs.

[grizzled harness]

M+ is MT favorite

[lone junco]

Hecticaddcleave has weird waves.

[valid meadow]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dYWxseS4TD62CuUk7uYEnG

Thoughts?

[pine jetty]

should i be using Heticaddcleave to weight for M+?

[grizzled harness]

Isn't it a little low for 364?

Why only 2RA stack?

[lone junco]

Gdi. I deleted the wrong message.

@pine jetty m+ sim for SS could be. 6T 40s. Patchwerk. No buffs.

[pine jetty]

sorry im brand new to rogue and simming. lol Is there a soft cap for haste i should shoot for then @lone junco

[lone junco]

No. Just use top gear and keep an eye on your weights.

[pine jetty]

ok thanks a bunch guys

[honest iris]

When should I replace my darkmoon card deck?

[lone junco]

The paid version of raidbots would let you select like 15 azerite combos. And exang and tb.

[honest iris]

I have 370 dice and gale

[lone junco]

Use dice and GC m+.

[valid meadow]

@grizzled harness I got max stacks now

[lone junco]

Sim that 6t40 to see the diff.

Fathoms GC is probably best in st.

@pine jetty and aside from gear. Crit is king In aoe. Due to cp gen on FOK.

[grizzled harness]

Ye

[lone junco]

Crit mastery for m+. Haste crit for st until your weights tell you otherwise.

[grizzled harness]

^

[honest iris]

is triple ss still the way to go in m+?

[lone junco]

I use GC. And have like 24% haste with raid buffs. It's not my top stat anymore.

Yes.

So far.

[honest iris]

even if those azerite pieces are all 340?

[grizzled harness]

Yeah probably

[lone junco]

My 340 SS beats a 370 archive.

[grizzled harness]

Cuz they don't have secondary stats

[lone junco]

A 370 scent might beat a 300 SS.

They still have agi.

Sim top gear sets st 6t40

[grizzled harness]

Yeah obviously

6 may be too much

4 should be more accurate

accurater

[meager knoll]

accuratest

[supple ridge]

never sim'ed anything but Patchwerk and standard raid setup. Any tips for m+ cleave?

[meager knoll]

what they just said, 4 or 6 patchwerks, 40 seconds

unbuffed probably

[supple ridge]

aki ty

[meager knoll]

definitely unbuffed, since you don't get lust or most buffs in a m+

[supple ridge]

so num enemies = 4 and Target level = raid boss ?

[meager knoll]

uhh... target level?

[supple ridge]

It's under "Target and tanking options" ?

[meager knoll]

I'm just using raidbots, I don't see that option there

[supple ridge]

ah, I used the simcraft client

[mint snow]

!ss

[prisma monolith]

Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.

[honest iris]

how many ilvl is a socket worth?

[strange python]

It wont be fixed

@honest iris its worth 37 of your bis stat

Sim it and convert it to the stat youre considering

[meager knoll]

37?

[wheat zealot]

40

37 is enchant

[strange python]

Ah

My bad

[wheat zealot]

For rings

[wintry parcel]

Question regarding the SS bug, when you apply the fourth SS say in an AoE scenario, you lose the multiplier you have on 3 other targets?

[hollow bridge]

@valid meadow seems like your issues are your azsrite traits. They are all really bad :(

[meager knoll]

the expensive ass enchant

compared to the 27 ring enchant...

does anyone even buy that 37 enchant?

[wheat zealot]

I got a 395 ring w socket off mother that i put the expensive one on haha

[meager knoll]

well, fair enough

[wheat zealot]

Dont think ill replace that one too soon

Lmao

[honest iris]

All my gear is enchanted with crit because I play sub 😢

[strange python]

3k enchants arent expensive tho?

[true thistle]

@honest iris crit is good

it is my 2nd stat atm

[wheat zealot]

On my server they are like 8 to 10k @strange python

[strange python]

Wtf

3k here

[honest iris]

i mainly play sin for m+

[strange python]

Its like 1 anchor weed node for 1 gem. Lol

[true thistle]

Shanothy, what region do you play on

[strange python]

Eu

[true thistle]

realm?

[strange python]

Ravencrest

[true thistle]

i play on burning legion

most fucked up economy in europe

[strange python]

[true thistle]

when on other servers fathoms were 210k+ on mine it was 90

[strange python]

Lul

Its still like 90 here

[true thistle]

on my server it is constant actualy, about 80k+-

[slow hemlock]

Hey guys what do you think about my Azerite Traits?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/cMqt1ZcVo3354YViUiVJnc

[high siren]

very hipster

much originality

[slow hemlock]

should i change something?

DD to SS?

[high siren]

in which context

[slow hemlock]

i use this for every boss fight in Uldi but at every boss you have somethimes more target´s so is it better to run with SS ?

[lone junco]

@wintry parcel yes. 4th garrote kills all 3prior.

[glass vessel]

none of my upgrades azerite pieces have SS on it so im running TB/MA and it actually plays nicely

[slow hemlock]

okay thanks

[hollow stone]

It was nowhere near the exsang w ss burst but i had a really sweet opener w tb/ma. Bursted at 34k raid buffed. It can still be good (on pull)

Had the best mut procs of life tho

[glass vessel]

yea you need the muts to double crit to get crazy opener dmg

[meager knoll]

is that rare?

[glass vessel]

not really with MA,

[hollow stone]

Its not THAT rare

[ebon gulch]

do you guys run CT or PB in mythic+ 9-11++ keys? feels better for me to just tab-rupture fok spam, unless we pull really big

[hollow stone]

With ma, yeah

[glass vessel]

always run CT in m+

[hollow stone]

Ct all day baby

[glass vessel]

PB is like ~2% ST dmg that's it

SS/sub/exang is definitely better if I had the gear but blizzard says no. nice change of pace from playing sub 24/7 tho 😛 so ill take it

[hollow stone]

Yea. The ss subt xsang opener is so sexy. Still

[glass vessel]

specially on mother and fetid where you really want that huge burst

[hollow stone]

But. We do what we gots

[glass vessel]

indeed

TB/MA is about as easy as it gets for specs imo

really straight forward

[hollow stone]

Sure is. Its legion with 1 less button lol

[lone junco]

New top gear is nice now. You can select tb and exang. And run like 12 azerite combos at the same time.

[meager knoll]

MA?

[glass vessel]

master assassin

[lone junco]

2ss + archive still my bis by a bit.

Surprised to see haste tank below crit mastery for st tho.

[glass vessel]

i have like ~15% and it did that for me as well

[hollow stone]

I got 1 sb 1 archive 1 tailwinds for raiding. Kinda lame but it works

[meager knoll]

I'm using AotT / DD / SS for raiding, 3x SS for m+

[glass vessel]

my 1 395 piece is fucking meticulous so im kinda boned. it does sim better tho. also having to use the 355 coa chest

385*

definitely not optimal lol

[hollow stone]

I hear ya

At least we have 385 az pieces

[glass vessel]

psh

[hollow stone]

Lots still dont

[glass vessel]

if i wasnt so perfectly setup for Sub i wouldnt be using the 385 i'd be using my 370 zul shoulders

[wheat zealot]

Yeah i havent gotten one yet, boots gloves and cloak

[meager knoll]

and I've gotten a belt, bracers... and something even shittier that I forgot about

[wheat zealot]

Lul

[summer cape]

Guys, is there no dagger from m+?

[wheat zealot]

Lol wut

[meager knoll]

6 out of 10 mythics drop dagger

[summer cape]

woop

[torpid jackal]

there is not

[wheat zealot]

Theres plenty of daggers from m+

[sharp wigeon]

I'm looking to switch from combat to assassination. where can I find a updated guide for assassination?

[summer cape]

haha my bad, I was acctually looking from an outlaw perspective, fml

[meager knoll]

all but siege of boralus, temple of sethraliss, motherlode and waycrest manor drop a dagger

so avoid those if you want a dagger

[torpid jackal]

3 weeks of m+ and raids with no daggers

[wheat zealot]

I avoid motherlode and temple like the plague

[sweet flame]

Siege has a sweet trinket tho

[torpid jackal]

daggers don't exist

[meager knoll]

mother+zul drop good daggers. but the best ones are from either Tol'dagor and mother

[sweet flame]

I didn't have daggers until last week

Was like 370 with 340 daggers

[torpid jackal]

still rocking a Xing and a 345 Honorbound at 365

[sweet flame]

Now I've got 4 360+ daggers this lockout lol

[sonic spindle]

I did get a 380 dagger off heroic mother Tuesday so I shouldn’t complain, but that was like my first drop since the pvp ones.

[sweet flame]

Using 380 and 370 atm

Hoping for that sweet mythic mother dagger

[wheat zealot]

I had two 350 xings til last week i got a 375 one off heroic mother and 370 one from td

Feelsgoodman

[sweet flame]

I got the haste/mast one from my box on tuesday

[wheat zealot]

The tw box?

[sweet flame]

The m+ box

[wheat zealot]

Oh eu

Lol

[torpid jackal]

the lotto box only gives me trinkets

[sweet flame]

I don't think I did the tw quest yet on my rogue

Would need 20+ TF to get an upgrade anyways

[wheat zealot]

So fun using leggos again

Even if its only for 5 tw dungeons lol

Makes me reminisce

[sweet flame]

Can't get back kingsbane tho 😦

[strange python]

fuck i spammed like 30 tw dungeons for gear but forgot the quest

[sweet flame]

F

I leveled a paladin to 120 yesterday, but it takes so little to get gear atm

Already up to like 340 with no mythics, LFR, etc

[strange python]

yeah i mean tw dungeon gear is basically m0

[sweet flame]

I only did the 5

[wheat zealot]

Its only 325

[strange python]

335 for me

[sweet flame]

335

[wheat zealot]

Still easier to get your guildies to run you thru m0 and get azerite as well

If you have a guild that is

[sweet flame]

The vendor sells 320s tho, so very easy to go from fresh 120 to LFR requirement

[strange python]

well.. i suppose

spamming tw is still pretty viable at first though

[wheat zealot]

Its not bad

[sweet flame]

I'll just bring my pally to alt raid or something

Doubt my guild wants to run m0 lol

[wheat zealot]

Thats what i do lul, get carried thru normal

On alt night

[strange python]

could probably do that too now since were on mythic now

[wheat zealot]

Warlock is already almost 360

Yeah m0 sucks, as long as your 340ish running with decent dps better off to just run some low keys for gear

[strange python]

i did some +2's with my former 300 ilvl, wasnt too bad

kinda squishy but thats about it

[solid parrot]

hmmm

It was below 300dps on every fight

[scarlet sequoia]

can you get 4 combo points from mutilate if both mainhand and offhand crit?

[frigid sleet]

yes

[solid parrot]

even though charts/sims are showing it as 800+ dps

[meager knoll]

it's poop

[wheat zealot]

Im not a huge fan of that trink haha

[young swan]

So low proc rate

[solid parrot]

yeah it's trash

gonna go back to a 350 dice

[winter fox]

ive seen some big crits out of that trinket but i doubt it is really worth it

[solid parrot]

I even blew a coin on a shrine 11

[winter fox]

id use dice trinket before that

[solid parrot]

yeah going back to the dice, which is simulated higher on aoe anyways

and obviously in practice the corpsicule isnt doing me good

[strange python]

i saw someone get a 380 with a socket some day

galecaller that is

sad days

[solid parrot]

Dont want to hear stories like that

Then again I got a 385 turban this week so I cant complain

[drifting merlin]

guilde hunter got a 395 dice last week ...

[strange python]

jeez

[winter fox]

i cant seem to get dice or gale personally so i ahvent been able to use them but since dice has a chance to roll all 3 stats and those stats not being bad for ass i feel like it should be used more than most trinkets

[drifting merlin]

might even been in the first reset from m+

[lone junco]

Dice can double proc.

And carry through packs.

[strange python]

yup

[lone junco]

(Or so I've heard. I have no dice)

[winter fox]

as far as azarite traits go is it really worth stacking ss or would it be better just go 1 ss and 2 twist?

[sweet flame]

Still using 340 dice. Only m+ trinket I've got so far is cannonball zzz

[strange python]

i know right

got 3 of those

[wheat zealot]

Yeah feels so good when you get multiple stacks of the dice buffs

[primal gazelle]

sim yourself, 5 boss 1 minute

[winter fox]

yeah ive been farming for it awhile

[sweet flame]

Twist hasn't simmed that good for me

Tbh

[lone junco]

I do 6t 40s. Relatively same.

Just turn off raid buffs.

[drifting merlin]

fader depends on what u play :p for mythics it might be better for raids mabye not 😃 simming is the answer

[inner pulsar]

Hey guys, is SS still best for M+?

[lone junco]

Cannonball sounds like poop.

[primal gazelle]

sim yourself

[lone junco]

Stand still for 10s? Lol

@inner pulsar Yes

[winter fox]

i've ran sims on my current setup and was doing 12.2k

with 1 DD 1 twist 1 SS

[primal gazelle]

its best but you still need to sim if youre losing alot of ilvls over it

[winter fox]

at 354 ilvl

[lone junco]

I'm 356. I think 14.3

[inner pulsar]

@primal gazelle What does "sim yourself" mean....?

[lone junco]

🍿

[primal gazelle]

you should listen to your own name

[winter fox]

run a dps sim on your gear to see what it does

[inner pulsar]

.....

[primal gazelle]

sacrificing 85 combined ilvls for me across 3 pieces to use 3 SS is a 50 dps increase for me on a 5 boss, 1 minute sim with no raid buffs - at those numbers... i rather take the hp gain on higher ilvl and just use 1 SS

[lone junco]

The sim doesn't account for the 3rd garrote.

[inner pulsar]

Sorry guys, it was a joke, guess it missed the mark this time

[lone junco]

Real values will be higher than sim apl.

And 1min is too long. (For me)

Depending on your groups pull rate.

[primal gazelle]

1 minute is fair, considering you wont have 5 mobs up for the whole minute at a time . The first add will die 20 secs in, 2nd mob 30 secs in, 3rd mob, 40 etc

[winter fox]

roughly

[lone junco]

Sim does g g r. We should do
g g g Ct Or. G g g r. Depending

[primal gazelle]

i did 1 min/2/3/4/5 min sims, results were the same

[solid parrot]

Sim trying to keep from capping CP or something?

[lone junco]

Most of my group packs are cleared at the 20-30sec mark. SS has more value in the shorter runs.

[primal gazelle]

depends how high your keys are

[lone junco]

Totally.

[verbal nimbus]

with no lust dps should be fairly consistent for anything inside 1 minute

[balmy cradle]

Well i think the 6 garrote on big pulls with vanish is insane also with ss trait

[primal gazelle]

in my current gear (375 ilvl), losing 85 ilvls on 3 items was an .01% increase to use 3 SS on a minute sim

[winter fox]

are you running ex or tb?

[lone junco]

Seli pulls m15+ and the packs are massive. Totally pushes crit.

[primal gazelle]

at those numbers i rather take the HP gain on higher ilvl

[lone junco]

Sure. Just get 370 SS 😉

[primal gazelle]

i still use 1 SS tho cos it feels weird not to

[lone junco]

Dd is garbage in FOK condition tho

[hollow stone]

@inner pulsar what's best rogue spec for sarcasm?

[lone junco]

Fury

[inner pulsar]

Apparently not assassination

[lone junco]

Better nerd rage gen

Negative.

[primal gazelle]

dropping from 375 ilvl to 368 to use 3 SS just feels like shit lol

i lose like 10k hp

[lone junco]

Ok. Dd is just junk if you never mut on a never env.

Might as well run an archive buff

[hollow stone]

I like to pop stam flasks and make low ilvl tanks feel bad for having less ho

Hp

Its kinda my thing

[lone junco]

Pass. I ran 4p20 for a bit. I lvl 306 doing 28k dps.

Make everyone feel bad.

[fervent hearth]

Question: CT or PB for Zul?

[primal gazelle]

neither

[hollow stone]

Sub

[primal gazelle]

go sub

[hollow stone]

Lol

[lone junco]

Heroic can be Ct.

[winter fox]

sub is so sad now

exact on aoe fights

[hollow stone]

If you have to play sin for it, for whatever reason, ct is prob your best bet

Sub is fine you big baby

[fervent hearth]

i've never played sub before. I am reluctant to change specs just to increase my performance on zul.

[hollow stone]

Our group has 3 rogues all running diff specs and we are all competitive with each other

[primal gazelle]

damn ive never heard someone say that before

refusing to change something in order to do more dps lol

[lone junco]

If the adds are getting gibbed by warriors, then I'm not sure how useful sub would be for non mythic.

[winter fox]

im the only rogue in my group and i try to compete with everyone haha

[lone junco]

It's not more dps. If you suck at playing it.

[fervent hearth]

there is a learning curve for new specs

[lone junco]

Sim is not a log.

[fervent hearth]

if i suck at sub, i deal less dps

[lone junco]

And not everyone has 80% mastery sitting in their bags.

[vernal mauve]

I've seen some people running existingate, is there certain stats that need to go along with that?

[hollow stone]

Np. So run ct. sin isnt terrible on zul, its just that for zerg strat sub is super strong

[lone junco]

Haste. And SS traits.

[fervent hearth]

ok

[lone junco]

Zerg strat?

7 subs. Don't kill Craig's?

[hollow stone]

Burn strat, whatever

[winter fox]

all ssub is on zul is keep NB up and spam FoK for CBs

spam evis

[hollow stone]

Push zul to 40 in 1.5 min or w/e the timers n percentage are

[winter fox]

yeah it is dumb. watched a few guild streams do that

[meager knoll]

but what if you have a bunch of arms warriors that bladestorm all the crawgs to death? 😦

[winter fox]

then dont play sub lol

doesnt seem worth if they get burned too quick

[vernal mauve]

So existingate requires alot of haste?

[hollow stone]

Sim

Yo

Self

[winter fox]

i ran sims from MP/EP with TB to see what was better, found EP to be better, then ran sims with EP to see if ex/TB was better. TB was better

[zealous niche]

Also it’s exsanguinate

[winter fox]

but thats with my gear

[meager knoll]

https://www.reddit.com/r/excgarated/

[winter fox]

i feel like it is personal preference at this point

[meager knoll]

was my only thought to the slaughter of that spelling

[winter fox]

i actually lost 1.4% dps running EX>TB

[vernal mauve]

Okay, I do sim myself often but wondered if theres something else that I can do to help increase my damage.

[delicate root]

push the buttons in the correct order

[nocturne mulch]

why do I still see people talk about running 3x SS if it's been dumpstered?

[meager knoll]

it's still good in m+

with frequent restealths

it's not toptier on single target anymore, which it never should've been imo

[plain thistle]

and its pretty good for single target too

[meager knoll]

but it's not dumpster tier

[tranquil pivot]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/3wucqw1gcYKb3WrtyQWZ3x

[daring imp]

@winter fox depends on traits/gear too

[winter fox]

so what are we thinking as far as trinkets for BiS?

[tranquil pivot]

ilvl 350, is 13k DPS normal?

[winter fox]

its higher than my sim @tranquil pivot

[daring imp]

with DD, MA and mastery my mastery is now haste>agi>mastery>vers>crit

[hollow stone]

Dice and gcb as bis trinkets if everything is same ilvl

And they sim better than fathoms

Imo

[tranquil pivot]

fathom can only proc on one target, right?

so its crap for aoe.

[winter fox]

gcb?

[meager knoll]

galecaller's boon

[winter fox]

ahhh

i hate the thought for running shrine so i dont wanna think about that trinket

[desert vault]

I have a gcb and dice, just 340 though. So lazy with gcb, I hate use trinkets. Requires thinking.

[winter fox]

not sure why, it is up literally every vendetta

just macro it in

[opaque grotto]

Legit just make a WA that glows when it comes off CD if it requires too much thinking

[hollow stone]

Just bind it to everything. Optimal timing? Pffff

[winter fox]

LMFAO

[desert vault]

Hehe yeah bind it to mut :)

[winter fox]

im sure some ppl would sadly

[hollow stone]

I bound prolonged power to mut while leveling. Was pretty swag lol

[winter fox]

id bind it to vendetta but it has a 1m CD so it can be used alot

and thats ALOT of haste

[opaque grotto]

I bound prolonged to garrote so I would use it every time I opened

[desert vault]

I guess putting it with Vend makes sense. Never really thought about that.

[hasty lily]

boys

[opaque grotto]

It was ez lvls

[hollow stone]

It sure was

[hasty lily]

toxic blade - exsanquinite

Toxic if u stack crit? and exsan with mastery I geuss?

[hollow stone]

Siminy cricket

[opaque grotto]

I’ve never read something to incorrect

So*

[winter fox]

i was looking at noxxic/icy and they are saying haste>crit>mast

[opaque grotto]

NOXXIC

Okay I need to leave

[winter fox]

lmfao

i just joined this discord today to do more research to see what i can do better

[opaque grotto]

Go to the pins

There’s a guide in there

And sim yourself for stat weights

[hollow stone]

"This guide was written by knivesfodays, a mythic raider from <im a douche>, everything he says is right"

All joking aside, wowhead guide and ravenholdt guide should be your go to; cross reference them for the best outcome imo

[opaque grotto]

My guild is 3/8 M can I write guides

[winter fox]

heard

[opaque grotto]

I’m a mythic raider

[winter fox]

im a mythic radar

[dapper marten]

I'm an LFR hero

AMA

[opaque grotto]

I got 385 MOTHER dagger yesterday, creamed myself

[winter fox]

lucky...

i have PvP daggers lmfao

360 ilvl

[hollow stone]

You can leave now, @opaque grotto as you promised

[dapper marten]

Niceu, I got the M Mother dagger on our first kill. Took a victory lap

[opaque grotto]

Umad

[desert vault]

My DPS is so rough cause daggers are so awful, 310 and 340 😐

[opaque grotto]

It’s okay, I have two 340 azerite pieces on still

I sim at like 14.8k dps, I want to kms

[hollow stone]

GOOD

😃

[dapper marten]

lmao

[opaque grotto]

Y u do dis

I thought we were friends

[cerulean walrus]

The cycle of life can be cruel

[hollow stone]

Thats why i do this

Lol

[opaque grotto]

😦

[hollow stone]

I dont make fun of non-friends, thats just mean

[opaque grotto]

People in my guild keep ninja’ing loot because of personal loot

Honestly they’re all assholes

[hollow stone]

Yeaaaaa. Its pretty bad

[opaque grotto]

They either just keep it and don’t give a fuck

Or trade it to their butt buddy without rolling