off my tooltip 4p Env > TB
#assassination
pseudo finch
twin hatch
what to do in aoe vs 3+ garrote all ct and exang?
pseudo finch
I meant without TB
wise whale
maybe there is something else that makes the sim go vanish tb
vestal abyss
yeah so you should always double env no
The sim does not learn itself right, its manual input
there is no reason to believe the sim is perfect
wise whale
oh rly?
pseudo finch
lul
remote oak
Typically the sims are correct. I just want to know why it’s that way
wise whale
i thought it would be like the sim tryes all the possible rotas within 5min ad takes the best
remote oak
Since it seems like double env would be doing more damage
fierce ingot
Sims are getting too smart. Soon they will take all our raid spots
pseudo finch
Maybe there is a modifier on TB the tooltip doesn't show
small island
whats your guys haste %? i seems haste loses alot of value after 20%, at 20% haste is 2.0 and at 22% its like 1.6 which then is the worst stat for me
wise whale
whys is there no pseudeo "AI" Sim
remote oak
8% 😩
remote oak
Tfw you get a bunch of upgrades and now your haste is uber low
wild gyro
18%
strange python
@wise whale is this your sim or what trait setup?
As it would make sense due to double dose from mutilates
Ok. Thats a Sharpens blades build
barren forge
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/g4BCNzGsfA1HoPJzVTwXsV haste haste haste -.- cant read it anymore lol
vestal abyss
The only downside i can think of is that you delay TB with 1 or 2 globals
strange python
@vestal abyss which may be the case
wise whale
yeah it MA build and i got archive, SB and dager in the back or something
vestal abyss
and that you overlap EP a lot more
wise whale
i know not good but i got nothing else better
strange python
@wise whale try that again on a 4.5 minutr fight
sour trout
So I sim highest with 3 Archieves.. but god the opener feels terrible
Is it worth running 1 SS at all??
vestal abyss
if it keeps you out of depression yes
barren forge
@sour trout take a look at min max dmg in the full html report
sour trout
Is that in pins???
wise whale
@strange python i will when i am home, now i can only do quick sims and i dont know how to change the APL manually
sour trout
Oh ok
sour trout
Kk sounds good, currently swimming
barren forge
if the min dmg is better with SS and you dont lose a lot of avg damage i would go for 1 ss even if you enjoy more
barren forge
swimming would be nice right now 😄
strange python
@sour trout hahahh love it
barren forge
but youre not wrong at all. we are all swimming in tons of azerite traits right now
strange python
@barren forge swimming in feaces
sour trout
True. Feels bad for rogue... it’s like we’re changing somethin every week
sour trout
I’m pretty sure this is 4th??
barren forge
i sim 100-150 dps higher with 1 SB but hell no its so annoying
HasteRating=2.25 😂 holy -.-
onyx wind
any of yall on 16k sim yet?
barren forge
got 385 today from the chest
novel zealot
Azerite controls everything
remote oak
Didn’t blizz make a hidden change with DR from traits a couple days ago too?
novel zealot
I was 6 ilvl above a friends rogue as optimized as I could be with the gear I had
onyx wind
You really run scheming on your helmet @barren forge ?
barren forge
yes 😄
novel zealot
He summed 1.3k above me cause he had high azerite
barren forge
alternative is SB and i hate it
barren forge
its like 100 dps
hollow cloud
@pseudo void I can ask, but he's at work so might take a while to get an answer ^^
onyx wind
Its really nice to have in some dungeons though
Like on shark boss in freehold
or other bosses when you have downtime anyway
but yeah i hate using it on ST
barren forge
yeah but we are on fetid right now. guess i wanna have that haste boost while i have no galecallers
pseudo finch
SB ?
barren forge
sharpened blades
pseudo finch
fml i shud of known that -.-
barren forge
you see 30 stacks and press the button... wtf no energy?! press again
ember mountain
so whats the best trait to stack now?
onyx wind
with nightstalker u could crit for 180k
just whatever u have high ilvl
is the best trait
ember mountain
should we just be going for like dagger in the back
onyx wind
otherwise 1x array and 2x dd
barren forge
@ember mountain double dose
cold escarp
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
cold escarp
yo, does anyone know what the most effective traits are now after the nerfs?
barren forge
we just answered that 😄
ember mountain
yeah but what are the most effective traits? 
ember mountain
I was joking
onyx wind
I dont even know anymore
hybrid thicket
guys do you think I should swap fathoms with this ? I got ´370trink from taloc as my 2nd trinket.
ember mountain
wait
cold escarp
sorry, i was scrolling through chats and guides, didnt see you just bring that up
ember mountain
is your PP plastic love?
onyx wind
YUH
ember mountain
because its literally playing right now for me
barren forge
playing with MA feels a bit strange
ember mountain
those are some nice dice holy
compact venture
I guess for M+ I should still use my 340 SS trait instead of 385 Rezans (or TTK), shouldn't I? Also loosing 15 ilvl on helm and chest when using SS instead of Laser/Archive. (So basically its 75 ilvl lost across 3 slots for 3 SS vs Rezans/Archive/Laser) How do you guys sim it?
cold escarp
thank you nonetheless for helping btw 😃
barren forge
@compact venture do a sim. patchwerk 5-6 bosses with 20 or 40 secs
hybrid thicket
If I want to sim it, should I do the gear compare tab in raidbots?
royal lantern
380 galecallers, i love it
ember mountain
I need to do M+ more
strange python
@hybrid thicket run fathom and loaded dice.
compact venture
alright giving it a go, ty
ember mountain
all I do is raid
twin hatch
is it bad to run with only 1 ss trait if i sim more with other azerite?
strange python
My 390 taloc trinket sims only 30dps above my 355 loaded dice
ember mountain
has anyone tried a fan of knives build in M+?
onyx wind
its prob gonna get buffed
ember mountain
^ implying blizz arent an indie company ^
hybrid thicket
@strange python 😄 lol, ok gonna try it with fathoms then also when you sim, how do you sim it ? through gear compare or top gear ?
shut bone
!sims
prisma monolithBOT
BfA Simulations:
Herodamage: https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/
Bloodmallet: https://bloodmallet.com/index.html
wise whale
Taloc trincet sucks
strange python
@hybrid thicket download simulationcraft addon. Then in game type /simc and then copy ctrl+c and paste it into raidbots websitr
wise whale
does DD gear drop in uldir? if so what boss?
strange python
@wise whale yea 35 item level gave me 30dps lol
ember mountain
DD is so overrated
onyx wind
not overrated
ember mountain
take simcrafts dick out of your mouth for a moment
onyx wind
just boring as hell
ember mountain
most fights arent patchwork
undone hill
hey guys, i see many good sin rogues going for CT + Exsang in m+ with 3x SS, is it worth going CT + EXSANG even though i only have 2x SS ?
ember mountain
and DD does nothing in cleave
onyx wind
@undone hill yes
shut bone
it does for multi dotting though?
onyx wind
more energy -> more muts
dire spoke
mammuts
hybrid thicket
@strange python I coppied the simc and threw it into top gear. I got 300dps boost from that dice
ember mountain
Id say AotT + 2 Dagger in back is probably best
strange python
@hybrid thicket :)
ember mountain
not seen a single piece with dagger in the back yet though
GOD I HATE AZERITE ARMOR
shut bone
I am sure dagger i9n the back is worse on cleave than DD?
ember mountain
DD does nothing for cleave
onyx wind
not true
ember mountain
explain
onyx wind
it scales with more targets
shut bone
does more than dagger in the back surely?
onyx wind
if you have 3 target cleave it does nothing
ember mountain
why would you use mutilate in a cleave scenario
onyx wind
but its fine for 2 target cleav
shut bone
and does require being behiond the packl you are cleaveing?
onyx wind
but its good to be
wheat zealot
When isent it good to be?
strange python
dotting a mob group up is very hectic
ember mountain
DitB only sims slightly behind doubledose
wise whale
there is no azerite piece with DD in Uldir wow
ember mountain
and its leagues ahead in cleave
strange python
is there a macro which lets me target an enemy without my dots ?
wise whale
DITB and blithborne also does not drop in uldir
ember mountain
yeah I get that, but i mean in practical circumstances DitB will come ahead
onyx wind
If you look on overall uldir fights
ember mountain
in 80% maybe
onyx wind
Id say theyre kinda equal
ember mountain
if theyre equal DitB is better because it works better in M+ too
winter gale
I am atm using 1xSS, 1xLaser, 1xArchieve. Is that out of date? 😂
ember mountain
laser damage got nerfed pretty hard
wise whale
thats so last week
ripe leaf
Is there any way to see a log of in what order abilities were used on raidbots when simming?
winter gale
Maybe 2xArchieve and 1x SS. I can do that too
I think atm best would be 2x DD and 1xSS
hollow cloud
@pseudo void its just a custom testing thingy, not gonna be used apparently
wise whale
for ST probably right
ember mountain
I wanna know if Fan of Blades range stacks (probably doesnt)
solid nova
It doesnt
ember mountain
damn 😢
winter gale
@wise whale and for Mythic + still 3xSS?
ember mountain
I use one of them in RBGs
wise whale
yes
ember mountain
with the fan of knives pvp trait
winter gale
Ok, will go for that
solid nova
Ded command, let me check bot.
winter gale
!traits
pseudo void
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2z9QtLtywRFpnXHuhFdXkf
any wise advice at what would e the best course of m+ spam ?
I assume its freeholds for trinket + dagger upgrade and normal for hat/shoulders with SS ?
peak rune
With how manny Stacks of Reorigination Array does raidbots sim? does some one know?
frigid sleet
thats for you to decide
severe osprey
if you use your simc import , the stack you actuallly have so +4 rn
peak rune
where is the option for that?
frigid sleet
scroll down
peak rune
Thanks guys !
tranquil pivot
1x SS, 1x AotT, 1x DD or Dagger in the Black for overall.
severe osprey
Dagger in the Black xD
peak rune
Can i upgrade normal azerite pieces with [Warlord's Trophy] ?
tranquil pivot
Oh.
short wave
after trait stat i see Archive of the titans + 2 DD the best for single target. Or am i wrong?
severe osprey
by normal you mean non-dread glad ?
peak rune
yes
severe osprey
probably not
vestal venture
at what fights are you guys running CT instead of PB in uldir?
royal lantern
deepens on the fight.....
high siren
why do traits have so much more value with MFD on herodamage ?
small island
got this in the chest, https://gyazo.com/b5ada2f044756fc06e17364b3eef5643
wary anchor
what are the sim conditiopns for m+?
small island
im just gonna delete it
strange python
why
hexed tinsel
Its Good for outlaw i think
small island
i dont play outlaw, no reason for me to keep it
naive trellis
Guys assasin and sub are braindead outlaw is the most skilled
gritty yoke
finally, its finally over. still having 340 weapons is a dealbreaker for me now, fuck blizzard
strange python
imagine being stuck at 340 ilvl azerite pieces
oh wait
thats everyone
mega lol
ember mountain
I have 370 with bad traits as a protest piece
naive trellis
Guys assasin and sub are braindead outlaw is the most skilled
strange python
well i do have one 370 piece too
ember mountain
I cant hear you over the sound of you spamming sinister strike
strange python
but it aint great
hexed otter
gritty yoke
i did pvp
gritty yoke
for weeks now
hushed pulsar
How can i sim this
naive trellis
@ember mountain lmfao
hushed pulsar
and still feel like shit
gritty yoke
2089 mmr right now, not a single weapon
naive trellis
Guys assasin and sub are braindead outlaw is the most skilled
ember mountain
wtf
gritty yoke
cancerous rng trashgame
ember mountain
i shit out about 6 350 weapons an arena night
hushed pulsar
outlaw is most skilled agreed SMORc
gritty yoke
strange python
it does suck pretty bad right now
strange python
thought of quitting today
wise whale
you can just buy 355 weopon for gold
gritty yoke
and of course the weekly box also only had trash
ember mountain
come on guys give blizzard a break, theyre just an up and coming indie company
gritty yoke
our realm has the 355 daggers at 800k, not happening
strange python
small indian startup
ember mountain
lmfao same brother
gritty yoke
to you
ember mountain
now im alchemy
unreal bear
/groan
unreal bear
i have so much fucking crit
ember mountain
and im shitting out raid potions
gritty yoke
too lazy
gritty yoke
we are pushing 11 keys daily
strange python
@gritty yoke rng be rng. I sorted mine by running tol dagor. 8-10s
dark token
how to fix azerite gear: combine the 3 azerite pieces into one piece of gear with traits, maybe a weapon since those are hard to get rn as well
unreal bear
weapons aren't that bad if you're doing rated pvp.
gritty yoke
yeah did that reprobate. our priest has like 7 weapons now, while both me and our hunter still have 345 weaps
hazy sphinx
Gina be chaining 10s and 11s this whole week.
royal lantern
weapon where only shit too get on the first 3 weeks
vernal sinew
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/eZirz517HQzTwwyp4P9ubD
With no SS trait, And master assasin talented? Its sim better than subterfuge how is it possible?
royal lantern
after uldir/m+ is out you cant blame anyone except yourself for not getting them cus you can simply grind them
but w/e, complain about it
strange python
@gritty yoke rng is rng. I had no azerite raid pieces since launch. On 3rd boss mythic. And then this morning i get a normal piece because i won a raid roll. 600dps increase in uldir
wise whale
he does 11+ all day
gritty yoke
tryan is a typical "works on my machine" trashposter
strange python
@royal lantern its frustrating for players with limited play time
gritty yoke
10/10 striahgt outta mmochampion
ember mountain
i play 3 days a week
strange python
I use to be abke to log on 6 hours a week and be 97-99 on everything
strange python
Now rng dictates my gear not masterloot giving me gear because i was very good and understood i had limited time
gritty yoke
dont worry blizzard is gonna randomize azerite balance in about a week again, maybe your current traits will be BIS by then
royal lantern
why do you even complain in a spec discord where people do discussions about the class when you stop playing anyway?
wise whale
they are bos this week i think anyway
gritty yoke
tryan, your savespace bfa shill hugbox is this way >>>mmochampion.com
unreal bear
laser matrix and archive. the azerite pieces that i haven't gotten since raid release, while rolling on them.
sounds nice.
naive trellis
Guys assasin and sub are braindead outlaw is the most skilled
unreal bear
good system.
royal lantern
holy is the most skilled rogue spec
naive trellis
xD
hazy sphinx
I have only one laser matrix right now
unreal bear
must be nice.
naive trellis
Arms rogue is impossibruu
ember mountain
Sub is the hardest spec imo
hazy sphinx
A 370. Today, I'll get 2 archives
unreal bear
i'll be over here not getting anything but versatility bracers and non-warforged.
ember mountain
i quit sub because it was too much effort
hazy sphinx
And I'll be a God
unreal bear
tbh you probably won't be.
shy axle
cry more
naive trellis
Suck fub
shy axle
gish damit
hazy sphinx
Salty much
dark token
what do you guys think should i get rid of my fathoms for m+
this is hecticaddcleave
wise whale
just go pug raid look at dpsmeter you will feel better
strange python
@dark token lovely trinkets
dark token
id rather have azerite gear
u see my 355 there
you can farm trinkets you cant farm azerite 😉
unreal bear
rofl those stat weights.
distant hill
hi sin rogues, reading through the guide, anything that I shouldn
hazy sphinx
Gonna be spamming boralus for that trinket this week
distant hill
t take for correct on it currently?
strange python
@dark token hahahahahahaha i got my first azerite piece today 355... lets not talk about azerite gear. I hate it
hazy sphinx
What Gin?
gritty yoke
looool just get 370 looool just git gud looool 4HEad
unreal bear
when your looting system is even more luck-based than Outlaw. 🤔
distant hill
@hazy sphinx wondering if anything in the basic guide is not really that correct anymore. A lot of things for outlaw changed.
hazy sphinx
So how many of you are 1800 rating? Enjoying the pvp as sin?
distant hill
so before I read it I wanted to know if there are 1 or two sore spots
ember mountain
A lot of things @distant hill
strange python
@gritty yoke want to compare logs :p then rethink the get good bit ?
ember mountain
SS isnt that good anymore
unreal bear
@hazy sphinx damage is good, some classes need reworked including sin.
candid phoenix
@hazy sphinx i m 1820 on 3s, 2k MMR atm, RMP is fun as sin
ember mountain
archive is above laser now too
hazy sphinx
Reworked? Bro sin is fine.
gritty yoke
nah fuck logs, my rogue is currently benched due to weapons, gonna stick with orange healer logs for the moment
hazy sphinx
Rogue is fine for that matter
unreal bear
sin is too strong.
hazy sphinx
No it's not lol
unreal bear
sub needs buffed, sin toned slightly down
strange python
@gritty yoke lol fair enough
hazy sphinx
Its in a good place. Sin always scales with fear
ember mountain
TFW you get the top dps in raid and only parse a 50
wise whale
you can top dps meter with 340 gear in most heroic pugs and guilds
hazy sphinx
Gear
distant hill
@ember mountain give me the top... 3?
unreal bear
all rogue scale with gear and arena doesnt really matter given scaling...?
unreal bear
sin is too strong, it's a very agreed upon perspective.
strange python
@wise whale thats lile saying you can be the best od the worst in a group and thats fine
unreal bear
lol?
edgy latch
rogue literally trash tier after nerfs
strange python
90% of the playerbase suck
hazy sphinx
Its in a pretty good stop right now
gritty yoke
how is sin too strong in arenas
ember mountain
lots of people like doubledose but i feel like its only good in single target
unreal bear
sin is definitely overperforming.
strange python
@ember mountain it only impacts ST
hazy sphinx
Give me data
To prove this
How did you reach the conclusion. In genuinely interested
ember mountain
I think Sin is fine in pvp, DEMONHUNTERS THOUGH
hazy sphinx
I'm
gritty yoke
inb4 many rogues in arena therefore sin = OP
hazy sphinx
Dh just got tuned, like we did.
ember mountain
DH need some abilities pruning its obsurd
hazy sphinx
Cause they were too strong in both aoe and single with that dash thing
gilded kite
Dash was changed ages ago
quick tapir
Probably someone already asked that but is 1xSS still worth just for the 2 extra combo points even if it sims lower than other traits I got?
gritty yoke
this aint leddit
plush pike
Anyone able to help this shit rogue become less shit with looking over my logs?
hazy sphinx
It was their #1 ability for both single and aoe
ember mountain
same tbh
hazy sphinx
30%nerf, just like our SS
stable oxide
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vXHwCEPtiWGJpHvo1MgnpG I have the feeling I sim really low compaired to people with the same ilvl. do you see any specific reason?
ember mountain
I try my little heart out and i only ever parse 50s
hazy sphinx
Nah Syl, that looks pretty good for your ilvl
wise whale
i met a rpgue who tought you could only use grarot in stealth
hazy sphinx
I'm 369 15k flat
unreal bear
"assassination doesn't overperform" meanwhile sin rogues make up 10% of 2k+ rated players.
l o l
stable oxide
thats 500 more
hazy sphinx
Weapons might be bringing it down
hazy sphinx
Weapons for sure.
gritty yoke
knew hes gonna pull that argument
ember mountain
just because something is FoTM doesnt mean its overperforming
quick tapir
any answers for me?
gritty yoke
rogues have always had an insane representation in arenas
hazy sphinx
Dude he likely sucks
gilded kite
Idk its seems like the most "fun traits" are the class specific ones that mix the rotaton a little. But rather than tuning them blizzard is nerfing them into the ground because its easier
gritty yoke
literally play the game more
unreal bear
mR1s also agreeing that sin damage is too high.
hazy sphinx
And is just bitching
unreal bear
why would i bitch for my own spec to be nerfed?
hazy sphinx
I'm asking you
gritty yoke
you sure can quote them right
hazy sphinx
To give me data
wise whale
@quick tapir if it sims lower it worse
unreal bear
you want me to link you pve logs for arena representation?
gritty yoke
hes just parroting what his favorite random shit streamer said after he got farmed by a tradechat 2s team with a 330 ilvl sin rogue
unreal bear
LOL
ember mountain
they just have a lot of utility in arena
ember mountain
their raw damage isnt too high imo
unreal bear
have you missed the entire conversation, Zid?
gilded kite
2s isn't even balanced
hazy sphinx
You've just been repeating the same shit to yourself
onyx wind
HAHAHAHA
hazy sphinx
Without answering the original question.
hazy sphinx
Give me data
unreal bear
lol
hazy sphinx
I really can't.
gritty yoke
chopsticks is a brainlet who strugles understanding that rogues always had a big % in arena
inland socket
Hello, one rogue assa HL can me explain something, i don't understand i've 366 ilvl+ and i did good rotation but i sim lower than subtely, can u help me?
unreal bear
lol ebic meme mouze
gritty yoke
unreal bear
got me xdxd
hazy sphinx
What's ur haste titou
inland socket
18%
gritty yoke
literally since TBC
wise whale
rogue is best on world pvp
gritty yoke
rogue is good if your opponent is bad, but a semi-decent hunter is miles ahead
hazy sphinx
In world pvp
wise whale
yeah i mean rogue, ret pala team
summer marten
@stable oxide Cant see reorigination array stacks on your sim.
gritty yoke
and of course our 3 hybrids ret, feral and enhancement shamans with their insane heals
unreal bear
rogue is good, that doesn't mean other classes aren't in need of fixes too
hazy sphinx
Which one
Data boy
Pve
Not pvp. Cause we are not too strong in pvp. Maybe in your shit mmr of 1200
unreal bear
relax boy you asked for opinions from 1800 players
you arent in a position to mock mmr
hazy sphinx
But you went off on your too strong tangent
unreal bear
sorry i hurt your feelings saying we're too strong in arena.
hardy mauve
PvP in 2018 OMEGALUL
vivid wharf
hi guys, 2 archive of titans is better then 1 archive and one garrote trait ?
gritty yoke
isnt rating bragging against the discord rules tho
charred oar
hey all if you don't mind me asking what are the best combinations of traits for:
- Udir
- Mythic+
(sub main but i feel like i simply have to swap to assi now :()
wise whale
mythic plus 3xSS, Uldir depends on fights
hazy sphinx
Laser and 2 archive. That's what best everywhere
charred oar
@wise whale I thought they nerfed SS pretty badly?
versed finch
It's still good in mythic +
charred oar
oki
versed finch
And having one is nice for combo points if nothing else
hazy sphinx
They did. And the fact that it's still bugged makes it harder in higher jets as well
Keys
echo hound
When is the optimal time for TB usage? Ravenholdt says to keep it on CD but i find that hard to believe
unreal bear
on CD
versed finch
Yeah but pool energy
gilded kite
Why does the bug matter if you can only use 3 globalstar in subt
hazy sphinx
And try having 2 envenoms ready
echo hound
Seriously? Thought you wanna pool it into double envenoms
hazy sphinx
U do
vestal venture
if you're playing exsang build, 3xSS is best for ST also if you are not thinking about uldir traits
versed finch
U should get 2 envenoms per tb
snow orchid
plan ahead and pool before cd
echo hound
makes sense then. thought they wanted me to use it asap after it came off CD
versed finch
Nah
versed finch
It should like up where everytime u refresh rupture TB should be close to coming off cooldown
warm parcel
They arent exclusive things
fathom echo
if rupture is about to time out do you guys wait until you get 4-5 CP to reapply or do you apply whatever
echo hound
ah i got you. thanks mah dudes
versed finch
At least all the rogue traits more or less suck now so it's not a 1 build to rule them all thing
I still miss 3x SS 20k ticks
little burrow
yup general traits on all my pieces now
unreal bear
i still like 1x SS
versed finch
I run 1 ss 1 lm 1 arch
unreal bear
mostly keeping it for convenience sake
vivid wharf
@hazy sphinx if u have 2 archive an 1 laser u still use sanguinate or change to toxic blade?
versed finch
In pretty much everything
vestal venture
3x SS outperforms 3x DD with exsang though
so SS is still the to-go non-uldir trait for exsang
versed finch
I don't use exsang, I cant get my rotation fluid with it
TB sims higher for me anyways tho
vestal venture
i made the swap from TB to exsang last week and it feels so much better imo
its just preference i guess
versed finch
The first one I'm fine with. Its half way through the fight I feel like I'm fucking it up
halcyon phoenix
i like how exsang makes me use vanish earlier, so it lines up earlier with vendetta again
gritty yoke
exsang has always been cancerous
echo hound
Does exsang favor a more mastery heavy setup? I have more haste by quite a margin and TB sims higher. 1xSS trait 1xLM here
hazy sphinx
Sims still tell me that exsang
Is better. But I don't like TB
Plus exsang is helping loads on mythic fetid
Got the galecallers and a lustrous plumage for that fight. Feels good
hazy sphinx
Your stat weights?
onyx anvil
What tier 1 talent are people preferring
vestal venture
EP
terse shuttle
MP can sim better tho in some cases
vestal venture
yeah but isnt it like that with higher haste EP is better?
versed finch
EP 90% of the time tho
hazy sphinx
I finally hit the crit is higher than haste point
vestal venture
how much haste u at?
versed finch
Nice!
terse shuttle
I still have 1200 mastery just cuz gear rolls
hazy sphinx
In raid I think like 21%
strange python
@hazy sphinx and that will probably change when you get 1 crit item lol.
vestal venture
nice
unreal bear
i'm running around with 25% crit lul
hazy sphinx
The higher it goes
ember mountain
I have 30% Yip
ember mountain
I need more mastery
vestal venture
i have 17% haste now + reorigination 225 + food + 370 overcharged construction w/ 40 haste gem
ember mountain
nah i have crit
hazy sphinx
With your daggers chillin?
halcyon kayak
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
hazy sphinx
Oh ok
ember mountain
my haste is like 23%?
hazy sphinx
I was like this dude rocking 3 dagger with that speed
vivid wharf
How long is it better to renew the garrote and rupture?
unreal bear
huh?
vivid wharf
i never played with rogue before bfa
hazy sphinx
Ok
vestal venture
w/ rupture and garrote that get exsnged am i supposed to refresh them after they run out or during pandemic
hazy sphinx
Theres a spot that u can refresh them and it will add to the duration
Always let an empowered one go to full DR
Theres probably a WA set that can help you with that in here
merry elbow
@vestal venture doesnt matter
plush pike
Any log ninja help a scrub out?
wise whale
just post it
wise whale
garrot uptime 44%?
misty nacelle
@ripe comet well sims show that Master Assassin with Double Dose is stronger, that's why I'm wondering what could be the opener
plush pike
wise whale
should be a lot higer even on vectis
astral shadow
don't mutilate after TB
vestal venture
yeah at least 90% is needed
astral shadow
don't mutilate 3 times in a row
hazy sphinx
Overcapped a bunch too
So if u got 4 points
U tb
Then envenom for the extra dmg
And then get another envenom in after 2 mutilates
But garrote is your worst offender
cunning needle
did insignia of ravenholdt work off the dot damage from garrote? or does it only work on actual melee hits
since apparently we can use legendaries for TWing stuff now
plush pike
Ok dont know why my uptimes are so shit might have paniced and didnt pay attention
wheat zealot
44%
hazy sphinx
Get a Weakaura
bright shale
That moment when you realize you are afk in raids
hazy sphinx
That tells you what you got on the target
For you, I'd say get a weak aura that covers 90% of ur screen if u don't have garrote up
You'll never go below 90 again.
plush pike
Lol
bright shale
Hahahah
plush pike
Thanks will work on my uptimes and waste
hazy sphinx
I'm actually serious. U missed your most important dot for half the fight
unreal bear
tbh it works, i do a giant screen effect if i dont have poisons
wheat zealot
Garrote is about 20% of your damage in single target maybe more depending on traits
Very important
gloomy stump
does anyone else miss the filter option from the restoration manager ?
vestal venture
yh my garrote did 16% on 2:25 fetid hc kill with 98% uptime
summer marten
does log not take 2nd phase in account when calculating uptime?
summer marten
vectis
hazy sphinx
Yes u can!
gloomy stump
yeah nothing changed
hazy sphinx
Go to hear compare in raidbots
And sim 3-4 targets for 30-40seconds with the gear sets
Gear
spring prawn
well i cant gear compare without having the gear tho right
hazy sphinx
Yes. U can
unreal bear
you can add the gear manually
hazy sphinx
U can add the gear sets yourself
Like chopstick does with his framed pictures of raid traits in his nightstand
unreal bear
insert wolverine meme here
wary anchor
what are sim settings for m+
modern heath
So I’m a little confused - new rogue here. In HeroDamage it shows the engineering traits as highest damage when stacked for M+. Why is archive/SS better?
royal lantern
you cant stack the engineering trait...?
hazy sphinx
With what other pieces...?
modern heath
Ohhhh herp.
royal lantern
only the googles have it
modern heath
I see, that makes much more sense now.
wise whale
yeah in real live you could wear more then one google but in game not its a little congusing
dark karma
Do you put abilities such as mutilate and rupture etc on your stealthbar to be able to use it faster when running subterfuge?
steel orbit
^ plz be trolling
dark karma
Why would i be 😛 i've hardly never played rogue, and never assa 😛
light kestrel
during subterfuge you shouldn't me mutilating
royal lantern
@steel orbit you dont use garrote 3x on single target, so you better wait 1 gcd too use rupture/envenom?
charred oar
why are people suggesting 3x SS is best when herodamage graphs show a very different story >_<
royal lantern
it is good for m+
wheat zealot
Sims dont always account for real situations
chilly oasis
and for raid you will use archive of titans anyways
gusty needle
or 2xSS plus archive
wheat zealot
First of all, herodamage m+ rankings dont account for restealthing
wise whale
@charred oar you can also just look at herodamage stacked exsg and its the best
strange iris
i dont see the point in simming for 30-40 seconds. while a trash pack might last that long, that is not a good indication of what you'll be able to do throughout the whole dungeon because of your cooldowns being 2 minutes
charred oar
ok
wheat zealot
Then edit the APL to not use Cds??
Lul
If you want to see what you should do without them
charred oar
@wise whale can you link me the stacked exsg graph? I cant seem to find ass+exsg sims
royal lantern
vendetta is ussules for aoe anyway lol
wise whale
archive+2ss is best with exsang in everything is uldir i would guess
because the uldir buff ist getting substantial now
vestal venture
what is the opener when using master assassin? just going regular?
strange iris
i had SS available on 2/3 of my pieces and simc told me not to take either of them. archive/laser/blight
strange iris
exsg-no, sub-yes
wise whale
ss is stronger with exsg
wise whale
i dont know if ss+ exsg would be better than another combo without exsg though
strange iris
i assume simc takes into account the extra combo points, so why should i take it if simc says it isn't better?
wise whale
you could also just sim yourselfe with exsg and ss and compare to your current setup
modest zodiac
If I upgrade my 325 azerite helm to 370 using the warlord's trophy, do I get an additional line of talents?
I only got 3 on my 325. And for a 370 it's usually 4
knotty cedar
guys whats ur sim settings for m+
strange python
4-6 targets 40sec-1min patchwerk
hazy sphinx
I don't get the necessity to sim yourself for m+
strange python
Why not lol
knotty cedar
would u care to elaborate as to why
strange python
3 minutes is too long
2 minutes is optimal
oh well its tyrannical now
so 3 minutes
my bad
golden mulch
so pb over CT? not really right?
knotty cedar
do u use ct on 3+ targets
shrewd tinsel
need a timewalking channel ! >.<
young meteor
I ran CT in a 7 last night and felt energy starved. I don't know how that makes sense, but I was.
strange python
Did u spread rupture
wheat zealot
Just rupture more 
young meteor
Usually on roughly 3 targets. More depending on pack size.
Do you Ct on single target bosses?
wheat zealot
No
young meteor
I ran 3 SS
strange python
You don't need much haste for m+
Garrote and rupture is your energy generator
in m+
young meteor
My groups aoe is ok. Dh and frost mage. We'd probably benefit if I went more focused on st
young meteor
For tyran
strange python
sure
languid plover
Is that with exsg or tb?
midnight ledge
Aoe build its with exsang i think
tulip wedge
Elaborate Planning. To maximize this uptime do I just hold envenoms until planning debuff almost off to make sure I get the full 4sec per finisher?
tulip wedge
im also assuming never finish under 4cp and don't delay rupture
strange python
Well on ST you never finish under 4
on m+, to spread rupture, you can even use it with 2
strange python
Feelscraft tells me how my rota works
tulip wedge
looking specifically at vectis right now
unreal coyote
thatd be the first ive seen
tulip wedge
dagger was my outlaw offhand, havent bother reenchanting
long portal
Mastery is good for outlaw? 🤔
tulip wedge
oh sry no, thought that was vers. yes mastery is my 2nd highest prio
long portal
Odd
unreal bear
at least it wasnt trinket?
bronze topaz
do i use galecallers with exsanguinate in the opener?
hollow jolt
hey there, with us not using 3x SS trait in raids anymore how does the perfect opener looks like? cause I played all the time full SS traits and opener was: garrote>rupture>garrote>trinket+Vendetta>toxic blade> envenom> mutilate> mutilate>rupture>mutilate>vanish> garrote>envenom>garrote> basic rota ...
daring imp
@bronze topaz most people are saving every exs to use while you have the trinket up
strange python
@hollow jolt Ravenholdt has the opener written
Or you can sim urself and look in the apl
midnight ledge
What traits u guys using for st raid?
astral hill
Hi
strange python
1 archive, 2 SS
hollow jolt
🤦 sry mate
royal lantern
1ss 1 blightborn 1 archive
astral hill
Whats the best traits now when shurikens are nerfed
royal lantern
dont have a dd piece :/
long portal
Archive/matrix for meee
strange python
@astral hill Depends
daring imp
laser, double dose & 340 ss 😦
midnight ledge
@strange python did u tryed 1 laser 2 Ss?
strange python
Nah mate I don't have laser
midnight ledge
Ah ok
strange python
Though I guess it'd be good as well
astral hill
Ty guys
strange python
Uldir traits are good inside the raid since you get the array buff
placid elbow
god damn it lol
strange python
Try Ctrl+Shift+R
ruby notch
you think a 355 laser piece is better than a 370 achive piece even when sims says different ?
strange python
Of course not
placid elbow
wow Ctrl Shift R worked
strange python
If sim says its better, its better
midnight ledge
Everything lower is worst i think
strange python
@placid elbow np mate
midnight ledge
Prio is ilvl
ruby notch
k 😃
long portal
Laser and archive sim very closely for me so I would assume the higher ilvl one would win
midnight ledge
Yeah
summer marsh
Did SS get nerfed again?
midnight ledge
They just nerfed sharpened blades
placid elbow
Debating if i should even run 1x SS or switch it for Archive
unreal coyote
ss is not worth it for me at all
placid elbow
it could just be me afraid of using a different opener lol
strange iris
i did get screwed up a few times on opener last night without it
slender hare
Im swimming highest with master Assassin now 😦 that’s without SS
strange iris
kept rupturing after garrote
long portal
MA was only 12 dps more for me sadly :(
placid elbow
@unreal coyote it truly is lol. I think maybe because the garrote>rupture>garrote felt nice lol
unreal coyote
yeah i suppose it did feel nice
lost wharf
Hey there. Is there a more in depth guide to assa than the one at the top of the channel? I'm quite unsure about proper Exsang useage and it's only covered in the opening part of the guide
unreal coyote
the guide is about as in depth as the spec
you wanna use exsang on a full rupt
i think thats about the only condition
unless im much mistaken
lost wharf
Yea, but do you line it up with vanish+vendetta or just spam it like toxic blade?
unique trellis
its still good to have 3xss in m+?
lost wharf
Do you use Crimson Talent on a single target if you have speced into it?
unreal coyote
never
primal sigil
have a question do u guys use CDs on the elevator in heroic taloc
placid elbow
I've never used Exsang, simply because it never felt... "right" to me lol
primal sigil
i seem to be holding vanish ven want to know if its worth blowing
placid elbow
if your group is struggling on elevator
smoky heath
Funny, thats why i never used toxic blade
placid elbow
pop it
remote oak
Unless you’re trying to parse, no
strange iris
our guild does hero when elevator lands, so i save for that
placid elbow
otherwise, hang onto it till phase3 when lust
remote oak
Hold it
primal sigil
no we do fine, just wow analyzer is like USE VENDETTA !!! .. so i just want to know if i shud use it on CD or hold it for p3 lust
long portal
Tell your group to not dps the add so you get full vendetta :)
long portal
Oh we've just been lusting on pull so no real reason to save it I guess
lone junco
@primal sigil hold it on elevator
primal sigil
roger
daring imp
using exsang on elevator is ok 'cuz it's what, 1min30s, 2min to get down?
placid elbow
how much haste is everyone at? outside uldir and inside.
placid elbow
i feel like my itemization is amazing... but simming supperr low for my ilvl haha
long portal
Wep ilvl could be holding you back
placid elbow
my Heart of the Azeroth going from 348 or whatever to 365 just now upped my DPS by 300-400?
wtf?
lone junco
so i should jump to 14k soon
placid elbow
@long portal that's a possibility, i'm 370/360 on weapons
getting into mythics is a struggle lol
Those are the ideal rings IMO noobe.
Rot scour and the Seal of Questtionable
lone junco
I use my RC bid for that rot ring
quaint sequoia
So what trait is best now? Double dose?
long portal
I was using 360/340 until Monday night so I feel your pain
lone junco
did pvp last night got 2 daggers.
modern kindle
please I'm still using 340/340
lone junco
made me lol
placid elbow
wut ilvl daggers?
lone junco
340 socket and 345
placid elbow
maybe i need to start pvping lol
long portal
It's all relevant to content level that you're doing though right? Raiding mythic and spamming 10s with 340 would be pretty feelsbad
modern kindle
Is this sim alright for my ilvl? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6TZmEFNh1KiWpgPD8vNUm2
unreal coyote
ilvl and simdps are not quite as in tandem as usual
long portal
There is a free 345 from pvp cap and drops of 360+ from 1800+ :)
unreal coyote
thanks to triats
lone junco
@modern kindle its ok. i was there a few days ago
placid elbow
yeaaa that heart of the azeroth, i didn't realize was worth so much DPS
i legit just became revered like 10 minutes ago and re-simmed lol
lone junco
how much did it go up?
placid elbow
it went up by 400
urban storm
Shouldn’t really be all that much
placid elbow
lol
lone junco
ill make sure to do a few q tonight then. will def hit 14k
placid elbow
really? mine went up by 400
urban storm
You only get a couple of points per ilvl
placid elbow
BUT, it also could be because i lvl'd to lvl 21 as well
and i added gutripper
lmao
this was all at the same time when i got revered haha
urban storm
Well if you unlocked a trait then yes
urban storm
But the stats on 15 ilvls alone wouldn’t be anywhere near 400 dps
stoic pelican
Noob question: when should I pull energy?
placid elbow
@stoic pelican they say to pool energy before you use TB.
unreal coyote
pretty sure the gain
placid elbow
i naturally pool energy between every skill if it's not on an opener or on vendetta.
unreal coyote
is minescule
lone junco
can you even hit 3 env in tb these days?
unreal coyote
i seem to recall discussing that with fuu
placid elbow
nope
placid elbow
i feel like you can't hit 3 envs
vapid oracle
I’ve only been getting 2
vapid oracle
Maybe in vendetta lust you get 3
placid elbow
^yes definitely
stoic pelican
So always going with full rupture to TB?
lone junco
I played tb/knife/ma. for a day and the vanish tb env knife. was weird tbh
vapid oracle
Idk I play exsang mostly
placid elbow
i'm bad at exsang
lone junco
exang is my bb
signal summit
what makes assa a better specc than sub on fetid ?
placid elbow
the fact that sub got nerfed
lone junco
signal summit
well i sim 16.3k as sub
unreal coyote
the same thing that makes it better on every fight but zul
stoic pelican
so if I dont get TB, there is no point pooling energy?
unreal coyote
lol
lone junco
middle peak sucked. but I love these vuln phases
signal summit
and 15,3ish as assa
daring imp
@signal summit target switching?
signal summit
sub has great target switching aswell