stacking DD gets dr?
#assassination
daring imp
lone junco
Exsang has always been harder to gear for.
calm grail
Let's give a good example. Taloc has no vulnerable phases but his elevator lets you make more of exsanguinate because of the down time letting things realign.
echo hound
Also AFAIK, exsang is only better with 2+ SS or Rupture traits, after SS Nerf
wide bolt
Stacks of reorigination array @teal bough
daring imp
does stacking DD gets me some dr on its dmg?
pallid bluff
yeah but exsang is way more fun
willow prairie
Exsang helps regen, toxic blade help building combo
echo hound
Is Simcraft updated btw? Last update was 07:30 EU time, so im guessing thats before the tuning hit live at 9am US time right?
hushed turtle
Its weird, feels like LM got nerfed again or sims are odd, last week every sim included at least 1 LM somewhere. This week its telling me that I dont want any at all
daring imp
did you get archive?
mild coral
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
copper hawk
I did a normal taloc last night with dps doing like 5k in a pug I'm 342 with 325 offhand and did 9.3 is that decent?
hushed turtle
No i dont have any archives
And none of my traits are even stacked up
1 DD, 1 SS, 1 TTK
daring imp
are they super high ilvl? do you have full reorigination array stacks?
i mean the ones we can achieve this week
hushed turtle
same thing in outlaw, it seems it wants 2 snekeys now over 1 snek and 1 LM. The gear is all same 370 ilvl, and i have max achievable stacks
daring imp
strange
daring imp
maybe they sim really close
vital haven
can we use raidbots already?
hushed turtle
had LM winning by a ton
daring imp
last week before or after lm nerf?
iron prism
Anyone know what the conquest cap award is this week?
daring imp
not sure then @_@"
echo hound
we will be long over mythic progression before we hit 10 stacks lol. and then, i guess its useless outside of uldir reclears from that point on no?
iron prism
Zzz
copper hawk
Are they currently working on a fix for that SS bug?
hushed turtle
nah
hushed turtle
at least no word about it
hollow stone
LM is not a great trait for st dps not counting array stacks
Its like 10th or something like that for us
iron prism
Still better than any other traits I get lol
solid parrot
woop, finally got rid of dat 340 helmet
echo hound
i like the fact that you have to mix up the traits on the regular to keep on top, but having to play a new setup every god damn week is not fun
solid parrot
almost a 1k increase on dps lol
daring imp
juicy
copper hawk
If I only plan on doing normal/heroic is fathoms still worth picking up?
hasty crater
@copper hawk I do mythic raiding and fathoms still better for me
hollow stone
Til dd is the next on the chopping block. Enjoy your week, that helm is dope
hollow stone
Google it
daring imp
raging / necrotic / tyrannical
iron prism
They should just nerf all traits down to the point that they’re a 1.1-1.4% dps increase, maybe that’ll make them happy. Seems like what we are eventually headed to
hollow stone
Ditb bis trait for all specs; the dream
daring imp
@iron prism thing is there's always some way to enhance them to be better than that
changing talents or something on the rotation
iron prism
We can choose between “removes the gcd from your pick lock skill” and “increases the duration of your stealth ability by 50%”
daring imp
blizz team can't account for all ends, they're not that smart
onyx siren
all this bipolar trait balance bullshit. fuck me. all this wouldn't feel so bad if azerite gear actually just dropped normally in M+.
hollow stone
Lol. 50% on 100% uptime ability. Somebody get this guy a job at blizz, he's got their mentality down
iron prism
I try, I try
pallid bluff
i mean they literally said they want traits to be within range were getting an ilvl upgrade doestn feel like a downgrade because of traits
so ofcourse they are gonna nerf outliers
hollow stone
Outliers, fair. But its getting to be a bit ridiculous now
echo hound
they should buff the bad ones instead honestly. That way you can decide to swap, instead of being forced to it
iron prism
Maybe idk buff useless traits. Or introduce traits that actually change rotation which was the whole point
versed apex
I just got a 20-25 ilvl upgrade ring from my Mythic cache that apparently isn't even a DPS upgrade on a 4 target 40 second sim
strange python
You're literally forced to keep all azerite pieces you get, because you don't know if the ones you use now won't get nerfed by fucking 50%.
pallid bluff
i mean the SS nerf was super well deserved it was way too good. and SB was never that great to begin with. was only useful in super niche scenarios
warped tendon
They’ve had zeros success with this system imo
daring imp
bring SB at the top back pls bliz 🐢
visual token
They should make Azerite traits micro-transactions!
iron prism
@versed apex vers mastery?
warped tendon
It’s straight ass
hollow stone
Ss needed its nerf. Sb needed a SMALL nerf. Streaking stars for boomie needed nerf. But they are heading toward the right direction by buffing unusable traits
versed apex
Haste mastery, my AoE stat weight is very crit
surreal rivet
man today i lucked out got a 385 ring from boralus and a 375 crit/haste ring from pvp chest
hollow stone
Aoe crit and mast are king and you get your energy from multi rupts
rain brook
oh
pallid bluff
and TF too but at only 1600 i get a guarenteed 370 before WF and TF
pulsar goblet
Arenas not that hard
final stone
@copper hawk their fix was nerf ss LUL
pulsar goblet
1800 is pretty easy
pallid bluff
^ just have to grind it a bit
most people haveno idea what they are doing before then and you just have to be half competent
hollow stone
The hardest part about arena is finding people to play with that dont lick nuts
inner pulsar
They can do anything they want with bodyparts if they are winning
hollow stone
Im running double rogue resto druid to over 1900 now. This is not recommended, its just to make a point
pallid bluff
find a decent mage and you can pretty much 2 v 3 to 2k plus
pallid bluff
its the same as it was in legion. ring ilvl doesnt matter as much as secondaries do
lost sentinel
is poisoned wire good now? I don't think raidbots is updated yet but it sims pretty close to what I have atm which is 2x SS
strange python
No
pallid bluff
SS doesnt sim correctly
lost sentinel
oh, ok
iron prism
Is there any good reason to run poisons besides deadly in arena/?
versed apex
I wouldn't care as much if it didn't come out of my mythic cache, but it is what it is I guess
pallid bluff
what do you mean?
iron prism
Eh ran wounding poison for brawl last week and seemed to work well
Just was wondering if there was a good context for changing up poisons
pallid bluff
i personally just use deadly and the minor wound poision telent plus the slow one
not sure why you would take wounding over the pvp talent
hard sonnet
Isnt wounding higher percent than pvp talent
lost sentinel
yeah
pallid bluff
yeah but you lose out on deadly damage
hard sonnet
True
pallid bluff
when you can get a pretty similiar effect anyway
i guess if you plan to go into dampening then the actual wounding poison might be good
but deadly still is probably better
cosmic wren
Does anyone know if RA uses the food buff to determine what stat to buff?
wild stone
eehhh I feel like Poisoned Wire would "feel" nicer compared to SB
hushed turtle
Yes, i believe it changes dynamically too
If you get a crit proc giving u crit and pushes crit to top, itll change over until cbuff goes away
If you eat food that pushes ur second highest about first, RA will change
pastel vault
It's mathematically the opposite, wound poison is more effective with less dampening. It has diminishing returns with dampen, ie if there's 100 % dampen it would have no effect, 99% it would reduce healing half of a percent of their total healing, etc
surreal rivet
i pushed to 2100 in 2 days @pulsar goblet ppl just make it seem harder than it is
real socket
is it worth having 2 archives?
surreal rivet
no
real socket
okok
real socket
true
surreal rivet
how r u hard stuck 1500
pulsar goblet
Find a Healer
surreal rivet
as an assa rogue
real socket
YA YEET
lost coral
which traits did you use cya?
pallid bluff
^ just mongo the healer in 2s EZ GAME
surreal rivet
x1 SS, x1 Scent of blood, x1 dagger in the back
i sim like 15.4 rn
without uldir trait
gilded mirage
I thought archive did stack? Am I just crazy or did they change that so it doesn't?
barren forge
yesterday i had 2 SB and today my best sim is 2 PW with 1 uldir each. same dps. tooltip still shows 943 for PW so i might be doing a bit more than with 2 SB before
hollow stone
Your 2nd archive has extremely diminished value because of that, however
real socket
I want a double dose trait
gilded mirage
makes sense
rain breach
2DD 1PW seems nice too
barren forge
but raidbots isnt updated yet i guess?!
tranquil pivot
This whole System about the Azerite-Traits sucks so ultra-hard.
barren forge
or is it just a tool tip error still showing 943
rain breach
don't think tehy are updated
primal fossil
should be 50%
rain breach
no
primal fossil
Right? after hotfix
rain breach
50% increase
barren forge
actually it should be 1414. tooltip ingame shows 1411 😄 quick math blizzard
primal fossil
Mine shows 1979'
rain breach
time to come home, do wee still get 2 stacks buff from PW?
pallid bluff
i mean would you rather go back to farming for 2 weeks to MAYBE get the legendary that means you can do 10% more dps than without it
hollow stone
I love rng on my rng sprinkled with rng-flakes on top
pallid bluff
azerite traits arent nearly as bad
uncut mango
Azerite is a tier gear replacement not a legendary replacement
wild stone
Simming is telling me to drop SS for Rezan's... IDK how I feel about that...
prisma crescent
Just goofy that mythic raiders are using 340s because the traits are better
tranquil pivot
Yeah, exactly. Just give us Tier-Sets back! Where is the fckn problem, Blizz?
unreal bear
tier isn't good enough anymore. artifact weapons completely changed expectations.
now they have to chase the dragon.
uncut mango
Give us an item that can drop from raid bosses, m+ bosses and whatever else that lets us upgrade Azerite pieces
barren forge
@prisma crescent oh like mythic raiders using a 373 neck that is core this xpac? 😄
prisma crescent
@barren forge LOL
uncut mango
Sim it
tranquil pivot
Its always good to have new ideas, but the Azerite-Trait-System dont work well. They were 100% on cocaine when they dropped this shit, lul.
pallid bluff
@scenic geode haste/crit for ST typically and Crit/mastery for aoe/m+ but sim is the way to go
uncut mango
Azerite system wouldn’t be that bad if it wasn’t for the fact there are so many different traits for each spec and some generic traits too
barren forge
best comment yesterday was: throw sh*t on a wall. see what sticks and nerf it 😂
uncut mango
That and not being able to get upgrades for the pieces easily
rain breach
they should change it to sockets, where every proffession can craft some of them so poison gem by alchy and so on
tranquil pivot
You nailed it, Alixia. Thats my point.
pallid bluff
it would also be fine if everything was more balanced, which is seems like they are working on
scenic geode
i only want to play sin in pvp
pallid bluff
i think in pvp you aim for a pretty good balance of crit/hast/mastery
uncut mango
They also should have made it possible to change azerite traits for free in cities, or made it a fixed price
Especially when they nerf them all the time
pallid bluff
yeah the increaseing price is assinine and the fact that i cant tome and change them
uncut mango
Shit, make a craftable item for each armor class that allows you to reset them
So you can reset anywhere you want like talents can be changed with a tome
unreal bear
i don't do crafting professions, what do i get?
tranquil pivot
They always nerfing the Traits that are on top, next week it will be DD? where is the fckn logic behind that? there will be always a top-trait and they ALWAYS nerf it to ground-zero!
unreal bear
you guys are being overly pessimistic
scenic geode
thanks
tranquil pivot
Im just extremly pissed about what they do.
uncut mango
Why is it pessimistic to say I’m annoyed that they keep nerfing azerite traits every week
vast edge
im using 2 SS and 1 scent of blood still in m+.. and yes the dmg is lower.. but tbh.. its not by much
unreal bear
because all classes are being changed.
wicked comet
just reforge lol
pallid bluff
1.) SS deservered its nerf. it was WAYY overperforming 2.) SB wasnt even that good so the nerf isnt that big of a deal. 3.) the idea is they want to normalize the values of azerite traits, so they probably have a midground that they are buffing/nerfing things to reach
unreal bear
stop acting like a victim.
we're still one of the best classes in the game.
even with all of these "the sky is falling" nerfs
meager knoll
3SS deals less damage now than 2SS used to do
pallid bluff
yeah
meager knoll
so yeah, the nerf is very big
pallid bluff
it was fucking absurd
pallid bluff
^
uncut mango
I never said SS didn’t deserve a nerf
meager knoll
I'm sad tho
tranquil pivot
SUB is broken lul!
meager knoll
I didn't get 3SS until after nerf
uncut mango
I would agree it was broken in m+
sinful badger
Vel can you stop defending this piece of shit azerite system
real socket
🤔
tranquil pivot
SUB was THE! Spec at the beginning and now?
unreal bear
almost like it's a living game and things get changed.
uncut mango
Yea but not 1-2 times per week on gear slots that directly impact the performance and in some cases rotation for your spec/class
pallid bluff
the azerite system is fine TBH people are just being babies about it. im way more annoyed about inconsistencies in M+ and the lack of patchnotes for alot of stuff
like stop patching shit and not saying anything
sinful badger
The azerite system is NOT fine. You are 100 percent wrong
unreal bear
azerite is a lackluster system, but it's a problem with the game. not your class or your spec specifically.
wicked comet
stop defending the system that i dont like because i dont like it
zenith cedar
Azerite is pretty bad compared to reforging lol
tranquil pivot
Its not only about our class, there are soooooo many Specs right now, that are unplayable or cant keep up.
slender peak
So poison wire is still trash? I was hoping the 385 chest in my bag might actually be useful one day
pallid bluff
100% is alot of percent to be wrong about something thats pretty subjective
sinful badger
It’s flawed and a seriously terrible replacement for tier sets / artifact weapons / legendaries
meager knoll
Vel, what's your ilvl?
meager knoll
and your azerite pieces?
tranquil pivot
What ever you say, its still a poor and bad replacement for tier-sets.
pallid bluff
340 340 355 in M+ gear
wild stone
Are we supposed to trust simming a trait over SS? i read it doesnt account for vanishing??
sinful badger
blizzard doesn’t have a clue what they are doing if you haven’t noticed. They are making serious buffs / nerfs each week and then going back to the drawing board and attempting to figure it out again
wild stone
Rezan's is simming higher
gleaming stratus
how good will Poison Wire be with the 50% buff?
meager knoll
probably still dog shit
wicked comet
damn sifi got any more insider info
sinful badger
Yes
unkempt karma
Would 3x of double dose work on ST? 😛
wild stone
well poison wire was only 60 dmg below SB for me.
gleaming stratus
i see
calm grail
Any special way to use double dose or just use abilities normally?
meager knoll
DD is nice if you have enough mastery
fickle tide
wild stone
Are we supposed to trust simming a trait over SS? i read it doesnt account for vanishing?? Rezan's is a little higher in my sim.
vital haven
go ass
pallid bluff
SS doesnt sim correctly on aoe
gleaming stratus
Anyone played around with Rezan's Fury seems really consistent proc wise not a bad little bleed
zenith cedar
Poisoned Wire is doo doo
vital haven
does anyone know if we can use raidbots now?
zenith cedar
Non interactive, passive traits are exactly what blizzard doesn’t want but here we are
pallid bluff
it only puts out 2 instead of 3 garrotes
vital haven
dagger in the back....so exciting
tulip falcon
which dungeons should i use crimson tempest on?
wicked comet
all
wild stone
all
pallid bluff
almost all of them
simple meteor
i can't wait to see how dogshit the new traits will be
gleaming stratus
all
pallid bluff
kings rest is debatable
gleaming stratus
so strong
meager knoll
how about the "highest" azerite trait of all
wicked comet
unless you're doing the smallest pulls known to man
pallid bluff
the +5 ilvl is not really something you aim for
zenith cedar
They should bring back SND/RTB on kill refresh as a trait
pallid bluff
its blizzards catchup of "hey you should have gotten an upgrade by now but you havent
wild stone
Are we supposed to trust non-uldir traits simming higher than SS? i read it doesnt account for vanishing, and I actually like it.. Trying to hang on to it if I can...
edgy wharf
which enchants for daggers?
wild stone
i like it, but its simming lower
pallid bluff
sims are not perfect
wicked comet
it will sim lower
zenith cedar
There are probably better ST options now
wild stone
okay thanks
zenith cedar
But SS is still very strong
wild stone
i REALLY want to keep my SS...
gleaming stratus
makes sense
meager knoll
it's not as good in raids anymore
wicked comet
for st there are many better options
unkempt karma
where do you see in warcraft logs class per spec rankings?
meager knoll
still toptier in m+
edgy wharf
Which enchants for daggers in assa?
pallid bluff
@edgy wharf your two highest stats. probably haste/crit
edgy wharf
Thanks mate ❤
pallid bluff
highest weighted stats*
fresh ginkgo
Anyone know if that time walking event gives heroic uldir?
severe egret
showed up as normal uldir for me today Gyu
wicked comet
all classes
simple meteor
meanwhile in sub channel back to sin 😂😂
wicked comet
has a drop down
fresh ginkgo
Ewwww
royal lantern
found a use for detection in bfa!
gleaming stratus
does gutripper stack as in below 30% with x2 does that stay at 30% or now does that work at 60%
edgy wharf
@pallid bluff They stacks? Like 2x Quick naviagtions?
unkempt karma
@wicked comet thanks
vital haven
sub channel is prbo like when SS got nerfed
royal lantern
you can use it too see the ferret's in stormsong valley!
vital haven
in this channel
dense quest
simple meteor
back and fourth
pallid bluff
@edgy wharf they have diminishing returns so unless 1 is WAYYYYY higher than the other you want to do two different ones
edgy wharf
ok thanks mate
vital haven
idk guys
oak osprey
is the weekly timewalking cache 355 uldir or 370?
vital haven
i know a lot of traits sim higher than ss in single target
graceful rivet
anyone help me out to see if I am doing anything wrong if I post my sim?
vital haven
it still feels wrong imo
daring imp
mate, this week's all good
daring imp
no lust, motherlode 9, tank being really braindead, still got +2
calm grail
It seems that a single SS trait is better than a double weaker one for single Target.
zenith cedar
No shit lol
meager knoll
two 385 azerite pieces... and I got belt and bracers........
calm grail
But TB pulls way ahead 🤔
zenith cedar
TB is great
zenith cedar
Much more versatile than Exsang
calm grail
Double 385 pieces
gleaming stratus
rip
wheat zealot
Better than having no 385 azerite
meager knoll
teach me how you open the chest to get that
simple meteor
@@calm grail can you post your stats as well mate?
meager knoll
but there's only been two weeks?
daring imp
i'd murder a few puppies for that
calm grail
3
meager knoll
oh, USA
calm grail
I'm just wondering if my 385 shoulders will be better than my 340 SS shoulders now
I will still have a single 385 SS for dungeons
vital haven
ofc it its
calm grail
That's not true actually, I used to 340 SS Helm too instead of the Uldir one.
calm grail
Yeah but DD doesn't really clear packs faster.
vital haven
oh you mean in m+
calm grail
Yeab
daring imp
for m+ you want SS
pallid bluff
you also dont mut on m+ hardly ever
calm grail
That's why I'm thinking I should still run my triple SS even though two of the pieces are 340 for Mythic+
pallid bluff
you FoK on 2 targets
meager knoll
probably yeah
pallid bluff
6 tar 40 sec patchwerk
daring imp
3~6 targets, 40s~1min no buffs ( maybe flask/food only )
vital haven
ye
simple meteor
the rng on fok with crit makes me wanna use multilate more on packs
vital haven
though i really dont think the 340 shoulders will do better
fresh ginkgo
Dunno how to feel about this
pallid bluff
you dont want to use mut on aoe at all
safe matrix
If you sim ss for AoE, the apl is scuffed and doesn't use it properly
simple meteor
yeap doesn't count restealths
safe matrix
It only uses 2x garrote instead of 3x
meager knoll
and probably only on 1 target instead of 3
simple meteor
that too
simple meteor
double gale new meta
haughty flame
i just got the uldir helm with laser matrix, but when i sim with my old helm im at 14.8k - with the uldir helm im 14.5k
can any1 explain why
meager knoll
and the old helm is?
pallid bluff
whats your other helms traits and ilvl and your new ones ilvl
haughty flame
385 with traidewinds + heed my call
wary anchor
Fukin fuck sb nerf
meager knoll
and uldir helm is 355?
haughty flame
uldir is 370 laser matrix and elemental whirl
hushed turtle
So simc has a new add-on update. I redownloaded simc add-on and my dps went up like 400
Same gear
pallid bluff
sims have a margin of error and variance
hushed turtle
Something was funky with RA
It was telling me LM was bad for me even at 3 stacks
Vs 3 random traits
I redownloaded update and it fixed
pallid bluff
are you saying that sims could possibly be inaccurate????? say it isnt so
hushed turtle
Simulation craft lol
vital haven
wait
hushed turtle
To export your character profile for topgear
vital haven
WUT?!?!?!?
haughty flame
ok gna delete and reinstall
pallid bluff
ive never understood the wow communities idea that sims are literally the bible and cant be wrong or that the people who create the apls cant make a mistake
calm grail
Did some sims and that 385 actually sucks in M+
hushed turtle
It's a somewhat peer reviewed process
calm grail
Triple SS still
hushed turtle
Not just one person behind curtain
pallid bluff
and thats with SS being bad at simming
oak quail
pallid bluff
i mean own judgement is pretty strong if you are a semi decent player. you should be able to feel and notice what is likely better for most stuff. like after the ss nerf you could just go into a couple M+ with 3 ss and then some other stuff and you would see that SS was still great
but people for the entire week and still now are like. BUT MUH SIMS SAY ITS BAD
maiden edge
@pallid bluff I mean, it's easy to see what the sim is doing if you know how to code. So it's easy for lots of eyes to be checking over the sims to see if the rotation sucks or something like that. Other than errors in what it's programmed to do, sims are pretty objective. It uses the law of large numbers to minimize variance and give a good baseline for judging things that are super hard to judge in game (like what equals out to the most damage in a boss fight)
meager knoll
I'm just salty that I never got to try 3x deadshot or 3x SS before they nerfed it... got the gonk shoulders yesterday
pallid bluff
yeah but proc rates and values of trinkets and traits are notoriously wrong in sims
devout steppe
I'm 336ilvl sin rogue, but doing around 5k dps. I don't know what I'm doing wrong. Mr robot says that I should do around 8,7k dps so I'm bit worried for that
maiden edge
@devout steppe Is that on a boss fight? That doesn't seem too far off for an extended fight with light-medium movement
devout steppe
It was MOTHER
maiden edge
@devout steppe Sims default to showing you maximum DPS (as in you never make a mistake and have 100% uptime on the boss)
maiden edge
Oh, well Mother DPS charts are 100% dependent on what group you are in. If you move early, your DPS is going to look bad on a chart. If you stay til the end, your DPS looks a lot better
lone junco
Poison wire stacks to 2. Buffs next 2 Mut.
devout steppe
Well question is is that normal for me to do around 5k
lone junco
I didn't know that.
vital haven
just ignore the other rooms
winged veldt
do fetid then check back lol
lone junco
But really wish it consumed on blindside.
vital haven
and just lust on pull
winged veldt
or stick on boss
meager knoll
but it's still shit, right?
winged veldt
then judge
vital haven
and zerg her
meager knoll
feels like even if it was a guaranteed crit on the next mutilate it wouldn't be top tier anyway?
maiden edge
@devout steppe That's what I am saying - it's impossible to say if 5k is "good" or "bad" on Mother without knowing what group you were in. If you were one of the last groups to transition, then it is a bit low because you had a lot of uptime on the boss. But if you get moved over to the second room early, you lost the ability to DPS mother and the adds start dying pretty instantly so nobody in the second room can pad the DPS meter
barren forge
welcome to beta for arzeroth 😂
meager knoll
297 WF, waow
haughty lily
maiden edge
@devout steppe But general tips - learn a good opener. It varies based on whether or not you have exsang or toxic blade talented. My exsang opener is to Garrote from stealth>Rupture>Garrote>Mutilate>Rupture>Vendetta>Exsang>Mut x2>Envenom>Mut x2>Envenom>Mut x1>Vanish>Garrote>Rupture (I think, it's more muscle memory so it feels weird to type it out like this)
haughty lily
if only it was another shiv
lost sentinel
I thought weapons cannot titanforge
haughty lily
i mean idk i got it from cahce
meager knoll
and your opener depends on your traits
wicked comet
didnt know weapons could drop tbh
hollow stone
Nice dag! Good cache for ya, gratz
maiden edge
Weapons can't titanforge
barren forge
mythic 10 is titanforged. its basically a WF because the "base" dagger would be 385. not that rocketscience @lost sentinel
mortal basalt
Does anyone know the formula for how haste affects bleed duration?
hollow stone
Youre not alone, cornholius
haughty lily
ive grinded tol dagor 25 times on 9 and 10 and ive only gotten a dagger drop once
hollow stone
Dw
lost sentinel
they said weapons cannot titanforge, so I asked 🤷
barren forge
people with hunter avatars dont deserve higher dagger 
barren forge
toxic!
ember fable
Guys, i droped a [Kul Tiran Cannonball Runner] 360 with socket, does anybody knows how good is this trinket? For M+, raids or even pvp?
barren forge
poisoned dude
maiden edge
It's a bug because yes, weapons cannot titanforge. Only warforge. Like the other guy said, Mythic 10 base ilvl is 385, so a 390 is a warforged upgrade, not titanforged
hollow stone
Where's an admin? 6hr mute for that vicious verbal assault
maiden edge
@ember fable It's pretty good, not best in slot but sockets are valued really highly (especially if its your only socket)
ember fable
@maiden edge I have the haste one 380 from Taloc and the darkmoon card, idk what to use
meager knoll
I'm playing both sides
maiden edge
@ember fable Perfect question to answer with a quick sim.
barren forge
@maiden edge its not a bug. they just force the m+10 item to titanforge at least to 385
royal lantern
wrong channel pal
barren forge
i mean 380. 385 is azerite
ember fable
@maiden edge I dont think the sims are calculating the cannon trinket good enough, but i'll try
hollow stone
My 390 taloc trinket w a socket sims like 5dps higher than fathom. But sims will answer your question better than our guesses would
So is it currently impossible to get a 400ilvl weapon then?
385 from cache or mythic +10ilvl from wf?
meager knoll
395 should be cap
stray fox
ember ermine
vital haven
they added a wing
devout steppe
Yo guys Should I envenom with 4cb or I need to multilate one more time or use Poisoned knife ?
vital haven
envenom
strange python
If you've 5 cp do u TB into envenom? And waste the TB cp?
surreal rivet
got some new toys https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/g1EDSiT5RXh4bPTqVNK2iy
rain brook
good question do i tb with 5cp?
lilac coral
wheat zealot
Wasting cp is never good, unless you are opening with 3 garrptes on a trash pack with ss
rain brook
so i use envenom then lets say my mut generates 4cp again
wheat zealot
Then its wprth the waste. Otherwise no
vital haven
ah SS
rain brook
worth using tb on 0cp?
strange python
What about in pvp? Does TB at 5cp add much to envenom dmg?
wheat zealot
Yup
vital haven
Frequently Asked Questions
TB on cool down, really?
Yes, on cool down
Use tb on cd as long as bleeds will last the full duration and you wont overcap
Yes its that easy
daring imp
spice surge
@strange python Its worth if you have mfd ready and think you can get the kill (in pvp)
daring imp
oy
spice surge
If not, then tb after envenom
meager knoll
you shouldn't really be in that position.. try to plan better when you see TB coming off cd
wheat zealot
^
strange python
Didn't we used to pool for mutilate spam after envenom? Has that changed?
wheat zealot
Lol wut
meager knoll
nah, pooling is good
wheat zealot
You mean pooling for envenom spam after tb?
spice surge
Not really, just less focus on it
daring imp
if you use any DD, try to only cast muts when inside envenom buff
wheat zealot
Surge of toxins is gone, so doesnt matter as much
daring imp
double dose
vital haven
jokes on you im using the extremely interactive dagger in the back
brittle lantern
it's so thematic
strange python
Ah yes @wheat zealot surge of toxins... That was it
brittle lantern
if you stab them in the back it does more dammage 
meager knoll
well, atleast it has some extra effect if you're behind the enemy
deft locust
See blizz just made a mistake on the trait
it was supposed to be Assassin only
but they accidently made it generic
accidentally
strange python
Mages throwing daggers and ferals spamming moonfire. Great game design
daring imp
"it's not an accident, it's a feature" scenario all over again lul
meager knoll
yeah kinda weird how dagger in the back is one of the best traits for a mage...
daring imp
^
deft locust
I mean in bdo witches have the meme shank in the back
for the execute
it's apparently running rampant in multiple games
taking over our class design
strange python
"let me just turn u into a sheep and get my trusty daggers out a sec..."
meager knoll
bdo.. the only game with more RNG that you could ever imagine
pure sparrow
at least one SS is needed for best M+ performance yeah?
deft locust
I loved bdo
daring imp
combat in bdo feels so good tho, a shame the entire game is bad outside of the commbat 😦
deft locust
Way more than this game
Alas, this game has my friends D:
and ye, the rng is uh
a clusternut
daring imp
@pure sparrow i recommend full SS's
strange python
What's this friends thing u speak of? Are they like in game bugs?
young meteor
@daring imp fukl SS for m+ still?
wheat zealot
muted jacinth
I'm using 1 dd 2 ss for tyrannical
gentle belfry
What are the talents to go for on a TB build? just starting to make one. Is it mastery > crit?
strange python
@gentle belfry haste > mastery
wheat zealot
We need something that counts how many times its been asked "is ss okay guys"?
gentle belfry
loool
red plaza
hectic add cleave?
mortal basalt
How does haste affect bleeds?
sinful badger
Might just reroll healer where i don’t have to worry about rebuilding my character every fucking week
lyric glen
^
eager cobalt
Yeah it's getting old at this point
daring imp
your haste affects bleed tick timer, not the bleed duration itself, just how often they tick @mortal basalt
burnt lagoon
Guys, there is something i dont understand. I have seens alot of people spam Crimson Tempest on big packs, but if you already have the 12skunders dot on the adds, why use it again?
hexed root
they're bad
sinful badger
I personally think 1 trait of SS will always be good until they nerf the combo points it generates. Pretty sure that will happen next week
daring imp
'cuz the initial hit will hit way more on 4~5 mobs than a single envenom
burnt lagoon
does it do some kind of initial dmg that arent in the tooltip?
wheat zealot
Ct spam comes ahead 5+
sinful badger
And then they’ll nerf the amount of bleeds rogues can have on one target.
mortal basalt
How much does it do that by? Can I calculate how often my bleed will tick if I have X amount of haste?
hexed root
SS x3 still seems strong as hell to me
daring imp
plus there's the time building cps back up again, by then ct will already have ticked 1~3 more times
eager cobalt
I think rogues are safe from nerfs for awhile
lone junco
sephuz + gc + juju got me to 75 % haste.
sinful badger
And then they’ll nerf + damage from stealth since it’s since it’s unfair
eager cobalt
you can't nerf your only melee pure dps class too much
wheat zealot
I dont
hard sonnet
should i got 2ss 1pw for raid, or just stick to 3ss?
wheat zealot
Dd nerf is next
sinful badger
You’re gonna want an archive in raid
hard sonnet
unlucky to even get one for the past 3 weeks
eager cobalt
how the fuck can you nerf azerite traits even more?
hard sonnet
our whole raid group has only had like 2 pieces drop
wheat zealot
They can, and will
eager cobalt
That just makes it more obvious that they are forcing players to raid
haughty lily
is there a way i can check my most optimal azerite gear traits?
lone junco
easy. 12% dr per stack
vestal plank
Is it a definite that dd is getting nerfed?
sinful badger
Poison wire sucks at 1 stack
daring imp
@mortal basalt sec i'll see if i can find the formula
wheat zealot
Obviously i dont KNOW its getting nerfed @vestal plank
eager cobalt
@vestal plank I think it's just a meme
strange python
Guys, just feel really weak after la' this nerf on my rogue compare to other, playing rogue and only rogue since bc, first time i feel So "low"... it's only me or even by playing 100% weel we can't beat other?
wheat zealot
But prob will
sick monolith
what does the +10 or +5 mean on the azerite traits? Is that just the stack of it? Such as Archive of the titans +10
vestal plank
Thank god, i cant be bothered farming more traita
First SS nerf, the next time i might just end myself
eager cobalt
@strange python I don't feel week. I consistently get 1st on ST meters for M+ and do well on trash
I'd say Sin hits spots in the rotation that feel slow, but never weak imo
lilac lily
Is raidbots updated with the azerite traits changes?
sudden ravine
lol, why doesn't this world boss drop her trinket anymore?
every other world boss still drops their trinket, but the primary/haste one doesnt exist anymore?
daring imp
2s / 1+(haste/100) i guess @mortal basalt
arctic crow
Not using SS now. For opener, why not use garrote twice for longer duration?
strange python
I was 20k overall on m+ 10 and more, i m now at 12-14 😩, or i really fuckup since nerf or my stat was perfect for 3ss king and now Si shitty or i don't know What go fucking do vs monk-wl-etc...
wheat zealot
We arent overtuned anymore lol
tranquil pivot
arctic crow
I'm not using SS
wheat zealot
Ss was a problem, as much as we all loved it. It needed to be nerfed
arctic crow
Have DDx2
eager cobalt
Unfortunately Indicaz is speaking the truth
wheat zealot
Yeah i still use it, but its not stupidly strong now
lyric glen
yea but what does sativaz say har har
lyric glen
😃
daring imp
5ilvl being more than 1k diff in sim how the fuck
hallow glen
what are the best trinkets to have for mythic plus?
wheat zealot
Dice/galecallers is ideal imo
daring imp
30~40$%ish decent
hallow glen
Galecallers for m+ really?
wheat zealot
Yup
daring imp
i do like it for the single target part with exsang
assuming you'll have crit/mastery gear
wheat zealot
Im not a fan of fathoms in m+
daring imp
having some st burst will definitely help for bosses
wheat zealot
And great for priority mobs w/ exsan
languid plover
my sims has been showing golden plumage as really strong for ST
iron prism
Yeah idk, just went into the brawl with the intent of poisoning their tank then disrupting their healer
Felt like it work but I could have just been telling myself that
lone junco
Sephuz. 4p20 and 2ss.
lone junco
The snapshot on sephuz GC. Juju.
iron prism
Oh timewalking haha
royal lantern
can we use the old legendary daggers again?
iron prism
Thought you were just being “that guy” in lv 101 pvp or something
lone junco
It wasn't as smooth as I want d.
royal lantern
or are normal bfa daggers better for tw?
lone junco
Ilvl is flat.
royal lantern
but.......dragonwings>enchants
iron prism
Ilvl is a flat circle
lone junco
Warsong enchant in my bags
Should use on the orange glaives.
For lols.
Gonna get a SS of 120% haste I think.
Maybe higher.
I like lols.
drowsy crag
Does archive of the titans stack?
lone junco
Will be funny to see a boss melt in like 7sec flat.
hasty crater
So wait sharpened blades didnt get the 30% damage reduction as assasination and its only for sub ?
Atleast that is kind of what the new bluepost on mmo champion is reflecting to me
inner pulsar
@hasty crater That looks like how it is
Which..is....hilarious
For those interested
hasty crater
Guess they did that bcs as sub you dance symbols into sharpened blades
arctic lodge
the dr on the stacking is huge though
hasty crater
I mean ''huge'' we dont know by how much they nerfed the stacking
arctic lodge
i dont have raw values atm but on sub the net nerf feels >50%. they were hitting for 50k and now they're hitting for ~20k 😦
hasty crater
That seems very unlikely, even only 1 copy hit for 18k
inner pulsar
We have some anecdotal evidence, my boy @daring imp posted some numbers earlier, but I don't know if they were the result of time on a dummy or a sim
@arctic lodge Also, thats feelcraft, we don't deal in that in here
lone junco
I do.
arctic lodge
that is true.
inner pulsar
@lone junco Nope
arctic lodge
i also realize now im looking at the wrong channel
lone junco
This worked !
inner pulsar
@lone junco Get your feelings out of here!
lone junco
Btw. My poison wire build sucked.
arctic lodge
so my feely anecdotal bs is applied to the wrong spec
hasty crater
maybe just running 1 poison wire could be good with like DD and archive
lone junco
I wanted it to crit blindside as well.
I ran poison wire and a few other options.
The prob is the 3sec ma.
arctic lodge
@hasty crater what is your ilvl so that 1 sharpened blades trait hits for 18k?
spice surge
Yeah but if it worked on blindside it would probably be reduced by like 30% for that talent. Because otherwise its not confusing enough 😉
arctic lodge
and is that crit or baseline?
spice surge
Properly?
lone junco
Blindside + poison wire is closed to the outlaw bracer action.
hasty crater
I am 370, ran 2xSB 1x archive yesterday
spice surge
Well yes, SS isnt very good for ST
calm grail
I just thought exsanguinate would make it a little more forgiving
tacit plaza
Yo I was gone for like two weeks and I come back to SS being trasho
lone junco
So now 1archive 2ss
tacit plaza
What's this nonsense
calm grail
So if you have no SS, exsango is still good for Vuln phases right?
spice surge
Its not trash, its just not OP
inner pulsar
What is this obsession with Exsang?
spice surge
Just because something isnt bis doesnt mean its trash
tacit plaza
When did this even happen? Not seeing it on latest patch notes
calm grail
Because my TB setup Sims a good deal ahead of everything.
spice surge
2 weeks ago? 1 week? Dont remember
lone junco
You have to assume that the apl is optimized by someone that plays the spec. Ayyy
unreal coyote
the obsession with exsang is people want to feel like this spec has depth
wheat zealot
Exsan isent braindead and is actually kind of fun, thats the obsession
unreal coyote
^ see
final stone
385 dagger coming out of my cache today bois!
pallid bluff
what do you mean obsession with exsang? are people obsessed with it
visual token
Gl
unreal coyote
its the neckbearded hipster assa talent
tacit plaza
Hold up does crit strike rating increase crit chance or crit damage
unreal coyote
for only the edgiest assa rogues
half timber
i got a 385 cowl of fluid. and whats up with poisoned wire now?
inner pulsar
Ok, just yesterday, I asked the same question, and the answer I got was "I only have to press Exsang once every 45 seconds, its easier"
torpid jackal
exsang is like the skinny hipster jeans
unreal coyote
just do whatever sims higher
inner pulsar
Exactly!
balmy cradle
why is no one running venom rush? hello? big? any1?... no?...
tacit plaza
I feel like sim isn't the end all. I'm not gonna follow sim if it's ten times harder to pull off
calm grail
Nah, it's just that for certain bosses there are some phases where burst can be more fun padding.
cursive cloak
Boi's in terms of traits whats poppin after the SB nerf? I believe the SIMC sims aren't picking up the 30% nerf just the reduced stack so cant even sim it
calm grail
I really am just trying to go for the highest numbers
pallid bluff
and in m+ exsang is better
round harbor
two weeks in a row azerite piece from chest YEET
inner pulsar
@cursive cloak That is because the 30% nerf doesnt apply to Sin
tacit plaza
I just go straight down the line and pick up some noice passive traits
Venom rush aok
inner pulsar
There is so much ridiculousness being said right now, I don't know where to turn
surreal lodge
week 4 no azerite from the cache FeelsBadMan
scenic geode
if my chest is at 9 can i get 385 azerite
unreal coyote
i got no keystone from my chest
having to ticket
my beta experience is going poorly
storm siren
Has Herodamage/bloodmallet been updated?
tacit plaza
@inner pulsar idk for certain classes (DH) you can pick like all passive talents and be within 5% of optimal spec that brings in like 3 more things to the rotation
strange python
i got a Tiny Electromental in a Jar in my Cache, can someone kill me pls
tiny vapor
So who's rerolling 
unkempt karma
Hero has, no bloodmallet
cursive cloak
@inner pulsar I'm actually an idiot. I can;t believe it!! cheers my guy
torpid crag
@strange python got the same cum jar in 385 
strange python
i got a 375 one
inner pulsar
@cursive cloak Thats ok, it just got updated 30 min ago
torpid crag
a 355 spyglass sims almost same has the jar
unkempt karma
jar itemlvl?
torpid crag
385
strange python
i De'd that shit the moment i got it and relogged to my DK
inner pulsar
@solid nova Anyway you can update the pin to reflect that the hotfix descriptions were changed to remove the part about 30% nerf to SB for Sin?
torpid crag
i guess I have to play outlaw if I dont get a good item tmr
lone junco
@balmy cradle I was trying vr with the poison wire trait. Post buff. Seemed very mediocre. Like 1k dps loss.
tacit plaza
I don't get this game sometimes. For all the talk about dps rankings and stuff, sometimes you just get that one fukboi balance druid absolutely topping charts
It's like bro are you moonfiring harder than the rest of em
lone junco
You talking about the mother pull where they mass rezzes in the 3rd room.
Good log nerds.
Watch the replay. It's pretty funny.
tacit plaza
I play rogue to be a unit in pvp. Not this crap I'm dealing with right now
lone junco
Ok. Grats. This was never a pvp only game.
tacit plaza
Bust my opener on a homie and then he does his dumbass turtle shell things and skedadles away
lone junco
Pvp is like battle pets.
inner pulsar
@lone junco I think he is just saying things now
balmy cradle
@torpid crag dont cry about jar, this piece of shit barely sims over 370 dice #feelsbadman
lone junco
Yes. When they dump a cd and you blind. Weeeee
strange python
id fucking rather that 395 over a jar anyday
lone junco
Those kind of things are strong at the open. At least.
prisma perch
hey i will need help because my dps just sucks
lone junco
20sec over vendetta exang.
torpid crag
@balmy cradle Im sorry for you
iron prism
idk why people get worked up over getting small upgrades, i havent had anything that wasn't useless from a cache in this entire xpac lol
daring imp
@inner pulsar sharpened blades doesl ess damage when stacked
balmy cradle
if this was on use trinket tho... hmmmm
spice surge
I mean, people get upset about not getting upgrades
inner pulsar
@daring imp Ok, what are you responding to
torpid crag
im still having 3 340 azerite pieces depsite having HC clear twice
iron prism
game needs to drop me more vers/mastery gear and pvp azerite with sylvanas and scent of blood traits lol
unkempt karma
Love the meme
strange python
So im confused
tacit plaza
@daring imp I think they added a diminishing return to SB, but they didn't do a damage reduction like to sub
iron prism
@torpid crag yeah sadly 340 gear gonna be better in a lot of situations, though bummer to not have at least one origination array
strange python
I simmed myself with a new dagger last night (one from the direbrew dungeon)
inner pulsar
@tacit plaza That is correct, they fixed the hotfix description
strange python
And the stats are better but the crit
torpid crag
@iron prism makes no fucking sense
hollow stone
What? No, sb had dmg reduced for sub or sin. Its right in the hotfix notes..
inner pulsar
Nope
strange python
By like 4 and simming shows it has a worse dps then my other dagger
iron prism
wait guys i have an idea to fix it. what if blizzard took all azerite traits off the armor itself, and put it into a table or tree where we could select or unlock them progressively. has anyone implemented a system like that before?
inner pulsar
Thats why I said "fixed the hotfix notes"
iron prism
yeah! or maybe like a list of "talents" that we could assign points to
strange python
Lol
balmy cradle
@iron prism you mean like you unlock every trait once and keep it forever? and can freely swap between them for your needs?! thats insane
sonic spindle
I thought the neck would be like that, but it’s just a number tbh
inner pulsar
Hahaha
lone junco
zing.
unreal coyote
LOL
strange python
It's all blizzards fauly
balmy perch
lone junco
So. In perspective. SS vs poison wire vs cancer. I'll take the SS Cause it's still good in m+
I do. S&p 500
strange python
Then when you get older move the money into a safer less volitile one
inner pulsar
Yeah, can't believe they nerfed SB stacking, and I am still below average in the sack.
hollow stone
@inner pulsar yea.. sb reduced 30%
lone junco
51%
hollow stone
And further for stacking
lyric glen
it's ok guys, ion said theyre putting in more complex traits so that's good, they should do a great job balancing those
inner pulsar
@hollow stone Try again, bottom post
lone junco
Was a joke. I'm doing fine enough.
strange python
:+1:
hollow stone
Am i just that bad at reading comprehension?
inner pulsar
Yes
balmy perch
They are goong to put in more rings, making even harder to find a good azerite piece
inner pulsar
Rogue
(Assassination) Sharpened Blades: The benefit of having multiple copies of this trait active is reduced.
(Subtlety) Sharpened Blades: damage reduced by 30% (unchanged in PvP). The benefit of having multiple copies of this trait active is reduced.
lone junco
@lyric glen did you see the sub one that spreads nightblade?
hasty crater
Some1 has to pin this for real, Assasination did NOT receive the 30% nerf to SB, only stacking nerf.
inner pulsar
@hollow stone BETTER COME CORRECT SON!
lilac lily
SB is cancer for assa anyway
inner pulsar
😘
iron prism
lol blizzard can't get complicated traits like "increases crit rating" right to a magnitude of like 50-100% on some traits, but thinks they can "implement more complex traits" correctly
lone junco
@hasty crater it will be addressed when the nightly is live.
hollow stone
Haha. Well that makes more sense seeing as sb was simming ridic high for sub and only "pretty high" for sin
spice surge
Or if blindside procced on mut crits
lone junco
Just do all cp gen.
hollow stone
Dw. Blindside traits inc in 8.1 so we can all bitch about "having to take blindside"
lone junco
Garrote fok. Etc.
strange python
Is blindsided even.good
lyric glen
they removed reforging so that we wouldn't have to micro-optimize for every new piece of gear guys
lone junco
Guaranteed Blindside proc on a Mut crit would be iterating.
strange python
It seems like a waste of energy
lone junco
Interesting.
balmy cradle
@lyric glen well reforging was way too difficult man, so complex and stuff...
lone junco
And if VR applied to blindside.
lyric glen
😃
hollow stone
Dmg per energy spent, blindside is amazing. But its not good, no
lone junco
I don't hate the system. Just rather they hurry up with the balancing.
iron prism
why not both?
balmy cradle
id like to see 50% of the traits removed and balance the remaining ones
iron prism
yes
strange python
Also I was looking at some raiders pve gear and saw they took master poisoner first
hollow stone
Too bad theyre adding more traits in 8.1 instead lululul
inner pulsar
...............
strange python
Soon™
spice surge
I have faith that the system will be good in 8.1.5ish. Same as legendaries, rough at the start and much better later
hollow stone
8.1 is after 8.0
iron prism
the best patch notes i could read would be that the azerite system has been deleted. or that the hoardric cube has been added
prime pasture
you need to understand
tropic crypt
Master Poisoner only sims .2% lower than elaborate planning so I run it since it's easier to keep up with
inner pulsar
@strange python No, thats....no
ashen ermine
Wtb azerite raid pieces pst 😂
balmy cradle
funny they didnt implement any cdr on vendetta trait for example, would have been a dead sentence to any other trait i guess, maybe it will come later
tropic crypt
That's just for me, not everyone
inner pulsar
It sims .2% lower for him
strange python
I'll look at my thing
inner pulsar
You need to #myname
hot flume
Are the changes live on BloodMallet/herodamage/raidbots ?
spice surge
Cool effects such as CDR are never in the first tier
torpid crag
wtb artifacts traits back
spice surge
Nighthold wasnt really the first tier, and it was a fairly big mistake putting it there, as it was competetive for far longer than that tier
lone junco
Kb was lame
iron prism
shit that needs to be deleted that absolutely zero people would miss: unstable catalyst, sylvanas' resolve, filthy transfusion, secrets of the deep, tradewinds, incite the pack, liberator's might, blood rite, meticulous scheming, ruinous bolt, scent of blood, poisoned wire, retaliatory fury, collective will, combined might, barrage of many bombs, azerite empowered
lone junco
Ooo
hollow stone
I like the idea of that. Helm shoulders n chest all roll diff traits, and you can cube one of each
iron prism
and that's like... a mild threshold for deletion
spice surge
Scent of blood isnt bad
lone junco
Scent is good. Ill keep that one thanks.
strange python
imagine getting a 385 SS chest and its a downgrade
hollow stone
Too late and difficult to implement. But would be neat
iron prism
eh that's fair scent is ok aoe
calm grail
Does DD procc pretty often?
safe canopy
is there such a thing as too much haste for assas right nw?
iron prism
i mean it's not ideal in aoe
hollow stone
Lol, chris breezy
haughty flame
xD