beyond the pandemic window i assume
#assassination
tulip wedge
elfin quartz
yeh. you dont wanna refresh an empowered garrote (from stealth/vanish) at all. otherwise do it within the pandemic windoiw
mental nebula
you dont wanna even cast another garrote till the one from stealth fades too it seems
haughty pilot
do i want to use exsang on cd after my opener or sit on it until i refresh bleeds
silver egret
on cd with pandemic refreshed bleeds
i think it ends up lining up with your other cds eventually
cuz youd want it up for your vanish etc
proven pumice
I read in here about something to do with like 2:00-2:15
I assumed that was a time in the fight when all the CDs lined up
silver egret
yeah
haughty pilot
that should be when vanish and vendetta are back up
silver egret
thats the third exsang
haughty pilot
yeah that makes way more sense
vestal zodiac
It was probs asked, but at what point does Archive/Laser Matrix outbeat Shrouded in uldir?
silver egret
prob pretty soon. we get 75 additional stat each week
and laser matrix is already really strong
archive not so much
dapper wraith
so do we think it will become 2x shroud 1x uldir? or 3x uldir?
silver egret
theres no point in 3x uldir
vestal zodiac
It doesn't stack
dapper wraith
ahh
vestal zodiac
so 2x shroud 1xlaser
peak rune
Is ther a very good rogue guide out ?
silver egret
have you checked the pins?
proven pumice
Isn't the SS head hard to get? If there's a laser head I assume that would be ideal
peak rune
Yes i have
silver egret
im going laser head, SS chest cuz those both drop in raid
then praying for shoulders from m+
cold rampart
hi
strange python
got SS chest in weekly bag which is nice
crisp steppe
the guide in the pins misses quite a couple of things
fluid scarab
anyone know more about how much worse the archive is than lazer? reorigination aside
silver egret
have you checked the herodamage sims?
fluid scarab
i havent looked there beside SS and Heed lately 😃 let me go check thanks
peak rune
@crisp steppe thats why i asked .. 😄
silver egret
the guide is still good
elfin quartz
on the 2nd set of vendetta/vanish cds should i vanish grg vend? or save vanish for the end of vend to get up stronger bleeds for when vend is over
crisp steppe
I can't speak to the accuracy of the icy veins guide but it goes into more detail on several topics
things that may not be obvious if u haven't played rogue b4
check out both
lament dove
why would you not use vendetta for the empowered garrote?
hushed turtle
If you are trying to line up vanish with 2nd Vendetta, i assume first vanish isnt held for 2nd Exang
hushed turtle
Right but when do u use vanish after pull
candid phoenix
but that changes with X
strange python
Yes
You vanish after your garrote with sang expires
And garrote twice
Into rupture
hushed turtle
Figured, thanks
unreal wraith
wouldnt it be g-g-r-ve-va-ex ?
lament dove
va = vanish?
unreal wraith
yeah
proven pumice
Why would we vanish after garrote?
strange python
no
candid phoenix
why would u vanish b4 ex?
hushed turtle
u cant double garrote outside of stealth
winter lance
Subterfuge
unreal wraith
ah nvm i fucked up
hushed turtle
U need the stealth buff to garrote 2x in row
candid phoenix
and then Va-g-g-r again
unreal wraith
rup with 3 cp?
hushed turtle
Yea, we are discussing the vanish rotation after opener
strange python
I thought its G-R-G-Vendetta-Muti-Rupture-Exsa
hushed turtle
U rup with 3 and then rupt again with 5 to get full pandemicd rupture
candid phoenix
@strange python i think taht Ven is after M-R, to get the most of its duration for the Va-G-G-R
hard plaza
stupid question alert: How is SS our best trait when it can only be cast from stealth and vanish is what a 2 minute CD?
unreal wraith
might do i run on a dummy
hard plaza
(i havnt played sin yet at all)
unreal wraith
sims still say that tb is better than ex
severe hemlock
Because the damage it does is insane.
candid phoenix
bcs @hard plaza the dmg it does, covers for the 2 minutes wait time 😄
hard plaza
oh lol
strange python
@unreal wraith I sim more with exsa
unreal wraith
@strange python will do
severe hemlock
2 cps are really valuable too.
spice frost
I misunderstood how the bug worked until today and I’ve been garroting 4 targets in m+. I’m excited to get off work and do the real deeps
empty notch
do we wait till bleeds expire after using exsa?
hushed turtle
sure, wouldnt wanna clip buffed dots
candid phoenix
EX sims 300 dps higher for me as wel atm
but i dont rly like EX for progress
cus if u dont use it on CD, it loses its value so fast
unreal wraith
yeah just today ive been making sure i dont clip enpowered bleeds
proven pumice
Can't you say the same thing about TB @candid phoenix
candid phoenix
TB is just a button tho, u can press it to w/e target u are attacking, even if u lose 2 secs from its duration the dps loss is much less than messing up ex
lone junco
yeah. that is true.
TB is missing synergy with the traits, but avg dps is avg.
I just like the overlap of GC trinket with the exang.
kindred cedar
So how do you Play assa in m+? How do you open on a trash pack? 3x garrote then fok and envenom spam or we put rupture or how we do?
lone junco
ggg ct. /dance.
silver egret
synergy is a dbl edged sword 
candid phoenix
depends what M+ it is @kindred cedar
civic forge
sim says g-m-g in opener
candid phoenix
Rolia that is w/o any SS trait tho
lone junco
that is ST
kindred cedar
Any pointer to how a opener is? If u skip the specific dungeons part
candid phoenix
cus if u have SS that is like 8 CPs
lone junco
g r g anyway
civic forge
nvm i see now
kindred cedar
I have 2x ss traits
mossy hazel
Have we ever had boss specific tips for raids in the guide? I would be genuinely interested to see what comes up as the optimal strategy for some of the current bosses
empty notch
and do we use exsa on cd or when bleed has longest duration left?
silver egret
why not both
unreal wraith
g-r-g-mu-r-ve-ex->dots expire vanish redo g
right?
candid phoenix
yes @unreal wraith that is it
unreal wraith
if i use that then vanish and vendetta are out of alignment for the rest of the fight?
lone junco
then at 220 vendetta vanish gg GC Exang
delicate horizon
GC trinket is?
meager knoll
they're out of alignment by like 10 seconds?
lone junco
like rage.
kindred cedar
So when exsang is coming up from cd we make sure to put a Full bleed rupture for exsang? Even if current one is at High seconds we still refresh it with a Full one?
candid phoenix
for like 20 seconds on the 2nd set
delicate horizon
Ah, got it 380 from cache 👌
lone junco
So i bound gc /exang.
candid phoenix
then they are perfectly aligned
unreal wraith
ah yeah i didnt account for the half times on the bleeds
potent forge
17k overall damage in 10 underrot, assass feels good
delicate horizon
So you delay exs for gale?
lone junco
unbuffed garrote/ruptures dont really do much with a single exang. it is the vendetta vanish gg trinket exang that makes your damage.
lilac spade
Is ct before ex and after pandemic rupt in opener worth it?
lone junco
@delicate horizon yes and no. it is in the apl for Single target. read the sample profile.
whole flame
Anyone seen the 3 target SS garrote overwrite by doing 4th outside of stealth BUG, confessed as a bug and is being worked on? Or have they said something about that is the intended plan of how it will work?
meager knoll
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
strange python
they have said nothing
delicate horizon
Aight, sweet @lone junco
whole flame
Aye, know about it, just wondering if its even confessed as a bug so they're working on it. Or they just say its intended work of the trait
lone junco
It snapshots.
primal gazelle
i wonder if SS bug will be fixed, and then nerfed at the same time
lone junco
so basically you get mongo haste and click the red button
stark token
I have 385 farlans and fathoms
lone junco
fixed and nerfed is my guess.
stark token
Reckon gc better?
floral cradle
nerfed how?
meager knoll
they'll nerf the damage? just like they nerfed deadshot?
primal gazelle
blizz will be like "oh we'll nerf it, but hey at least we fixed the bug!"
hazy sphinx
They wont nerf it.
floral cradle
ok but the actual mechanic will stay the same
lilac spade
@lone junco what snapshots gc + bleeds
silver egret
exsang
potent forge
It's not really THAT strong
primal gazelle
cant tell what blizz might do tbh
strange python
read that wrong
hazy sphinx
Anyone know if there's a minimum haste point for sin atm?
stark token
Does simming use gc perfectly?
potent forge
It's just really good in m+ because you can abuse the constant stealth resets, like the old Lego shoulders
strange python
it's just be a feelycraft answer Zid
hazy sphinx
Man feelycraft would do wonders for me
silver egret
id like 60% haste at all times please
hazy sphinx
cause im at 10% and I feel like cutting my dick off
strange python
I'd say like <15% is too low for above average gear
civic forge
i'm at 17.34%
silver egret
in uldir i have 19% haste and it feels pretty good
golden mulch
so guys elaborate planing uptime is more important than high cp evenoms correct?
hazy sphinx
I need 15% min.
Im gonna farm so many M+ this week
Got a 370 dagger from mother yesterday
strange python
I still have 340 weapons
hazy sphinx
I have a 340 ring
strange python
someone shoot me in my foot
knotty jetty
I read that the reverse bug is true that if you apply un-stealthed garrotes and then apply a stealthed one they all get bonus from SS -- true?
golden mulch
me 2 i do more deeps than people with 370 weapons tho so its fine :^)
strange python
that'd be some real spaghetti
silver egret
moms spaghetti?
meager knoll
spaghetti code
stark token
How many ss traits?
meager knoll
2, the chest doesn't have it
peak rune
Is it worth to let Garrote/Rupture drop In toxic blades to spam Envenom?
strange python
nope
golden mulch
I really wanna know if EP uptime is >> High CP Evenom
meager knoll
you lose your energy regen
magic plaza
2 ss traits
unreal wraith
is it still worth to use ex when you only have 2 ss traits?
strange python
you should never envenom below 4cp
magic plaza
im doing 30k dps
meager knoll
yes ornatus
strange python
does exsang snapshot the haste from Berserking?
golden mulch
prob without lust
craggy helm
It's just so much easier to use toxic blade. Hitting exsang optimally is a bitch because of mechanics keeping you away from bosses at critical times
golden mulch
high people burst like 50k now with lust
verbal pebble
quick question: vendetta applies the damage increase for bleeds/poison already applied to enemies?
proven ice
Yes Val.
verbal pebble
nice.
meager knoll
fake love, is that with PB or CT talent?
proven ice
That's single target so pb
meager knoll
yeah.. I just realised that I could see that in the link 🤦
proven pumice
Do y'all have to switch to adds on bosses, are you ever afforded the luxury of just staying on the raid boss
magic plaza
PB
golden mulch
need to switch unfortunately
lone junco
@strange python i assume yes.
proven ice
You mean the luxury of multi-dotting?
golden mulch
but once everyone has more gear im sure they dont care
meager knoll
unfortunately? I kinda like it.. multiple ruptures is nice
craggy helm
Not that unfortunate, adds increase your dps huge cause you can dot all the things
lone junco
and there is probably a condition of +2cp env/rupture to push 100% ep uptime during SS GC Exang.
golden mulch
btw pandemic refresh only works once right?
lone junco
that doesnt make sense.
golden mulch
like i refresh G and R only once
knotty jetty
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
golden mulch
than let it run out completely
meager knoll
always refresh, unless boosted by SS or exsang
knotty jetty
Is reverse SS bug a thing?
meager knoll
please correct me if I'm wrong, noobe 😃
strange python
So .. I basicly want 3x SS trait right? just to be correct 😒
lone junco
there is no bota, so re applying rupture out of pandemic is a loss. but we want max length rupture and garrotes when we exang.
potent forge
Heroedamage and bloodmallet knows
haughty flame
is 3x SS mandatory?
strange python
you still clip elaborate planning right? I see nothing in the apl that even mentions EP
potent forge
In m+ use ss
potent forge
For raid Just SIM it
potent forge
Garrote x3
lone junco
3 garrotes and a crimson tempest.
yes you overcap cps. but each garrote alone is about 100k dmg. the vendetta/exang target not included.
unreal wraith
i presume exang works with ct?
potent forge
Why c.t before rupture though
lone junco
CT is just bulk cleave
lone junco
depends.
haughty flame
so no more toxic blade?
lone junco
just get the 3 g and dont bug it.
potent forge
So you don't lose duration on garrote for the ecsang
lone junco
after that, the rest is up to you.
void raft
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
wheat zealot
If the target is priority yes i would rupture and exsang first
lone junco
In every pack i try to exang something
unreal wraith
doesn exsang only work on one target or are all targets with bleeds affected?
proven pumice
I have a feeling exang won't sim higher for me until I get GC. TB still sims higher for me. Unless it's a secondary stat thing
lone junco
in cleave it is the garrote. period
potent forge
1
potent forge
What's the radius of GC
lone junco
3y?
proven pumice
Lol
lone junco
it sucks. so i bound GC/Exang
to hammer at the same time.
if you drop them with gcd. tank movement might pull mob away from the circle.
proven pumice
Is that just a double /cast macro
lone junco
yeah /use /cast
potent forge
I can't see using GC in m+ ever
cyan stump
GC?
strange python
#showtooltip
lone junco
then you dont know about ggg
coral nexus
What is gc?
lone junco
it is 1min cd. each pack gets a 3garrote possibly a vendetta rupture gc/exang. all 3 garrotes gain the haste, and the exang snapshots.
so if the trash moves, just stand in your circle and fok fok ct.
potent forge
I haven't gotten it yet so I can't really say, but doesn't everything jyst move to much
Especially sanguine
lone junco
it snapshots the boss.
craggy helm
In sanguine it sucked. It's better now
glad ferry
So I've been told Exsang only works on the ennemy being targetted, is this true?
coral nexus
Wait, exang snapshots still? What else snapshots that we have?
glad ferry
my TB sims higher on ST
craggy helm
sorry, what is "snapshot?"
glad ferry
but if exsang is ST only, why not go TB
lament dove
TB is ST as well...
glad ferry
Yes, thats why I'm asking, why exsang over TB in AoE if both are ST
lone junco
ok. here we go.
glad ferry
is it just preference, is it because CT is an extra bleed and that makes exsang ahead?
lone junco
2x garrotes = 23 sec.
GC is 10 sec
Vendetta is 20sec
Rupture is longer.
Exang them all to overlap the GC trinket use. and you have a fully hasted round on the boss. aka like 30k dps for 20sec
if you can do 25k aoe with 3 garrotes and or 30k single with TB, then fine
thin ingot
guuuuuuuuuuuuys guess who just got a 380 galecaller's boon
lone junco
but I hit exang and boss runs off. i still get my 25k garrote ticks.
you stand around with your dick out cause you hit TB. and he moved.
thin ingot
not me, the stupid feral pulling 4.8k dps did
craggy helm
lol
lone junco
oy
wheat zealot
LOL
solid field
Rip
unreal wraith
off
lone junco
@thin ingot one day.
thin ingot
a man has a dream
lone junco
until they change SS, i think GC is my CoF.
candid phoenix
....
coral nexus
Do any of our other bleeds snapshot?
wheat zealot
I probably wouldve shut down my pc then and there tbh
pliant jolt
What t100 talent are y’all using for m+?
glad ferry
what is snapshoting
fresh ginkgo
yay got the dagger from mother with a slot! 
pliant jolt
Ok and exsang?
candid phoenix
this week i run PB
cus trash alrdy dies way too easy
and PB is a useful for bosses
pliant jolt
Yeah.
lone junco
it counts your haste at the time of the Exasng. divides up the number of ticks. rounds up or down. and then ticks that many times.
coral nexus
Pills, snapshotting is when your dots don't retroactively update depending on the buffs you gain /lose
lone junco
so at that point haste up or down doesnt affect the exang tick rate
proven pumice
@lone junco exang sims about 300 dps less than TB for me. Would you say it's worth to go ahead and switch to Exang so i can start going through the growing pains of learning it for the (what I assume to be) the inevitability that it'll pull ahead?
coral meteor
@proven pumice do you have SS??
proven pumice
2x SS
lone junco
remember when you opened with shoulder bombs in M+? and peaked like an idiot?
or sub cloak shoulder dfa round?
This ggg is similar.
dont miss out.
glad ferry
ok so you jsut GC and vandetta before garrote
lone junco
depends.
coral meteor
Idk why exsang sims more for me than tb then, I always assumed it was because I'm 2x SS lol
wheat zealot
Could be you have a lot of haste
coral meteor
But it's not like correct usage of exsang has a massive learning curve
lone junco
vendetta is 2min for bosses first, then prio second. exang and GC should be ready each pack.
ruby girder
is it worth to lose 2 shrouded trait for +100 sim dps ?
coral meteor
I had 9% at one point with galecallers and it still simmed higher @wheat zealot
I thought that too
thin ingot
i woudlnt
lone junco
not for M+ at all. keep the 3ss
coral meteor
@ruby girder the second an additional target comes in, that +100 DPS gets torn to pieces.
wheat zealot
Playing sin without ss traits big yikes
thin ingot
@ruby girder cause at the moment you add any type of cleave SS goes nutz
lone junco
ss requres restealth. it is m+ dream. not so cool in raid.
ruby girder
alright thx
coral meteor
Assuming you have vanish and can spread ss/subter garrotes or its the start of the encounter
lone junco
@proven pumice worth learning exang. but in raid TB/Exang will both do well.
thin ingot
@lone junco i isually delay my vanish a little for any type of cleave phase so i can garrote multiple targets
lone junco
very
buoyant kraken
Has assa been stealth nerfed?? I have lost 1000 dps overnight
fallow estuary
with double/triple SS you just apply 4x garrote on mobs if possible and don't care about CP right?
lone junco
@buoyant kraken did you take off a weapon?
stable mauve
Some general m+ questions. After I get the empowered garrotes out, should I use the CP on Crmison tempest before the ruptures, or rupture then CT?
coral meteor
3 @fallow estuary
potent forge
@buoyant kraken are you using different Talents
wheat zealot
G g g ct
potent forge
Talents
lunar current
When u Exsanguinate do u let your rupture/garrote dot almost run out before reapplying or can u just reapply them at 5-6sec without losing the faster dot ticking?
buoyant kraken
nothing, everything is what i raided with yesterday
coral meteor
Let them run out geeving
lone junco
@stable mauve I do like 20-25kdps on medium packs. over and over. like this.
ggg CT
Fok FOk Rupture (each elite)
Fok fok CT Ham.
refresh garrotes after 18 sec.
when you are down to 1-2 mobs use env over ct.
fallow estuary
Why are the other 3 fucked?
coral meteor
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
coral meteor
That's why
lunar current
okay thank you @coral meteor
wide snow
what is CT ?
fallow estuary
then the other will loose dps?
potent forge
Not until the 3x runs out
coral meteor
lose the rest
stable mauve
@lone junco you spam CT over envenoms even if a CT is running still?
proven ice
Only cast ct with pandemic at 2 seconds.
lone junco
in massive packs yes. each Ct hit lands for like 3k
thin ingot
14k club
candid phoenix
@proven ice no, i actually do it, i got 22% haste and i can do it now, cast 4 garrotes, but its risky cus if my latency goes up by even a little i mess it up
thin ingot
wheres my cake
proven ice
lol
lone junco
CT in fat trash is hamm.
whole flame
@thin ingot eXSA OR tb
proven ice
find 4 target dummys and cast 4 cheap shots and send me the screenshot
wheat zealot
Haste doesnt affect rogues gcd, casting 4 abilities in subterfuge is impossible
No matter how much haste you get
thin ingot
exsang sims higher though
coral meteor
Ye I just attempted it
lone junco
it doesnt land.
coral meteor
Couldn't do it
candid phoenix
well i managed to cast 4 garrotes on some 4m trash packs yday, but a lot of times it failed also
coral meteor
the 4th one was cast inside subterfuge
proven ice
you can cast 4
coral meteor
but landed outside of it
lone junco
the way you get 4 garrotes, is that its not on cd at the end of subterfuge
coral meteor
and procd the cd
somber wyvern
hey guys im using elvui but the text on enemy hp constantly says 100%
proven ice
garrotes, because you can garrote out of stealth
coral meteor
ergo doesnt count
lone junco
and you get bug.
valid pine
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
somber wyvern
anyone can help me out?
candid phoenix
thats what i m saying, the 4th garrote didnt trigger CD 😄
candid phoenix
well i dont have one, cus i didnt rly capture it
thin ingot
wheat zealot
Pics or didnt happen
stable mauve
2 more questions. Exsangunite only affects your target right? And in the opener when do you vanish? Early in vendetta? Or once your original g has worn off @lone junco
candid phoenix
i tried it a lot more times but with 59MS i was failing it
i only managed it like 2-3 times
fallow estuary
Wait Wait Wait Wait
So i may only put up 3 garrotes , then NO garrote recasting whatsoever on no mob
lone junco
This is very close. That vendetta can slide before mut.
fallow estuary
until all 3 run out?
wheat zealot
Correct
empty notch
my deatails keeps restarting after vanish. is it normal?
fallow estuary
X))))))
lone junco
It gets the point across. I think the vanish rupture is probably early as well.
proven pumice
@lone junco your 20-25k dps in m+ trash packs didn't include galecallers or other CDs?
fading spade
So what kind of burst do you see with that opener?
stable mauve
You you get the double garrote at the end of Ven duration?
fading spade
I haven't tried exang build I still run TB
stable mauve
I assume you always want the vanish to come in before ven ends?
lunar current
if you don't have almost full duration bleeds on when your exsanguinate comes up do u need to make sure u full duration before exsanguinate comes up?
mossy hazel
Man I really need to get better at TB with fewer cp... I'm end up TB at 5 constantly because I was trying to mut at 2/3 and end up at 5 for TB timing...
lone junco
@proven pumice probably gc ggg ct, fok fok ruptures. maybe a exang.
but it was over and over and over. like
me ---------------------------------------
group --------
proven ice
you can gc in stealth?
lone junco
they even out overall for bosses.
you dont need to gc prior to the ggs
its in there somewhere.
stable mauve
But ex only hits your target correct?
proven ice
yes its a ST melee attack
normal flint
do we use fan of knives at 2 or 3 targets?
proven ice
3
stable mauve
And you want to vanish before the end of your ven everytime yes?
lone junco
not in M+. you use vanish with your brain
potent forge
Idk assass overall is really good
lone junco
like big pack of 6+ or on bosses.
proven ice
If you have esanguinate you vanish halfway into vendetta
potent forge
17k overall underrot
stable mauve
If you have TB?
stable mauve
?
lone junco
if you dont have exang, you can vanish gg during pandemic of the open garrote
candid phoenix
i just managed 4 Cheap shots on the dummy, but they had DRs, gonna do it again and ScrSht it @proven ice
lone junco
if you have exang you must wait until garrote is dun.
@candid phoenix try ggg cs
i use prey for now. due to the overlap of exang and that buff
plucky oak
Is there an aura to track exang dots/subterfuged dots?
stable mauve
Thank you
candid phoenix
i will in a bit
lone junco
@plucky oak mizerok WA does a good job
winged stone
So is ass bis now or what?
plain thistle
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
potent forge
I mean on pull can't you get 4 spells off During stealth, 1 from stealth than 3 sec of subterfuge or do gcd and energy not allow
plucky oak
ty
onyx wind
fallow estuary
i'd loose 230 dps singletarget if i get another shrouded trait instead of lazer matrix - worth for M+? 🤔
strange python
Do those weakauras have good documentation explaining the functionality?
strange python
tfw no exsang emote
lone junco
dont need an emote to do Belligerent dps.
potent forge
2 target open is 1x garrote 1 mob 2x garrote another rupture vendetta exsang then rupture other mob right
proven ice
i still do g g g on two mobs
lone junco
if the second is prio. and not just another shiter
lone junco
g tab
gg rupture, vendetta mut mut rupture gc exang. pump env rounds .. . . . vanish gg.
potent forge
Well even if one isn't prio it wouldn't change
strange python
if there are only 2
strange python
longer duration for number 2
lone junco
if one isnt prio. hold the vendettas. use the exang.
strange python
you get 1 more global of garrote tick on number 1
potent forge
Well yea, if you need vendetta within 2 minutes
strange python
Well sure
I do G tab GG a lot of the time too
But optimally G tab G tab G is preferred if you're super anal about it like I am
lone junco
also. manually pick your elites out of packs of shit.
proven pumice
So after the opener, the first time Vanish is up, it's solo with Exang. The second time Vanish is up, it has all it's CD buddies along with Exang again?
strange python
Garroting the bubble assholes in TD 👌
lone junco
never garrote the non elites first.
potent forge
Can you make a nameplate style filter that makes a border around elite mobs nameplate in elvui
prisma pond
Wait...wait...wait.... we use garrote?
lone junco
no
strange python
Huh
lone junco
blade flurry blade rush
candid phoenix
ok i got it now, uploading img
strange python
Garrote is shite
strange python
Blade Flurry Killing Spree is the new breed
prisma pond
I play assassin with axes and use fok to build cp
lone junco
I legit tried 2.6s
g g g ct. fok fok rupture fok fok rupture.
all the same
even tried 2.6s with 4p20
potent forge
Assa in m+ isn't complete brain dead at least which is nice
lone junco
btw., it still buffs garrote through the roof.
strange python
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
round harbor
outlaw in m+ infinately easier for similar dmg thoug
pliant jolt
I don’t know how to approach aoe in m+
lone junco
2ss 4p20. pretty funny
pliant jolt
I was playing outlaw.
round harbor
pres Bf, continue st rotation
royal lantern
garrote 3 targets, spam fok, multi dot/CT
pliant jolt
Okay.
potent forge
Outlaw is not similar damage
candid phoenix
shy axle
do you exang on CD or line it up with Vendetta/vanish? did`nt see it in the ravenholdt-guide
lone junco
@pliant jolt get 3 ss traits and enjoy
candid phoenix
@proven ice @lone junco
lone junco
i did that once last night.
primal gazelle
assassin is bis in m10-15+ according to raiderio
potent forge
Maybe if you pull the whole dungeaon
lone junco
and put the cs on the prio
stable mauve
So I know the SS garrote is bugged and you'll overwrite the empowered garrote if you dont let it run out. In a pack if I regular garrote a 4th target will that effect the other empowered garrote that are out?
round harbor
aka dont do pussy pulls?
strange python
It's pretty annoying when mizerok says "look at the guide" a thousand times, but the guy has some good weak auras
pliant jolt
Do I want to get rupture up on everything after ct?
proven pumice
Not easy to get 3 ss traits though
pliant jolt
Okie.
verbal pebble
dunno if my weakaura addon is fucked up or something, but mizerok's WA isn't showing in combat here 
potent forge
Don't you have 4 globals on pull, 1 from stealth itself which then procs 3 seconds of subterfuge
stable mauve
So dont 4th garrote ANY target until the initial garrotes are done?
hollow wren
pliant jolt
Pls.
verbal pebble
👏
pliant jolt
I just switched.
ripe dock
Is it worth pooling to clip EP as much as possible with envenom or better not to lose SoT uptime?
prime quail
potent forge
@lone junco do you have 4 stealth globals on pull. 1 from stealth itself which gives 3 seconds from subterfuge
pliant jolt
I like sub too tho.
candid phoenix
@potent forge subteruge buff timer starts during GCD so its almsot impossible to get a 4th
lone junco
@potent forge only do 3. dont fuck around with that 4th. it will bug
main blaze
"Assn is trash at m+ Outlaw/Sub is better" is all I heard last week as I played Assn and topped the meters
pliant jolt
Pls no rogue vs rogue.
lone junco
playing scent x3 is gonna suck compared to the 3g
main blaze
haha
fallow kindle
to be fair, if (when) they nerf SS it absolutely will be pretty bad
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
lone junco
2scent 1fok
main blaze
Scent is still good as well
flint fable
🙂
main blaze
eh idk about FoK but maybe. I never looked into that one
lone junco
with scent up, fok whites are big.
stable mauve
So if you go for the 4th and it fails itll turn the other 3 into normal g?
tight ravine
i wonder how far it'll fall when SS gets nerfed
lone junco
I swear to fucking god. I hammer the opener too fast, and jumps right over the vanish.
at least M+ open is easy. g g g ct. cant mess that up.
ripe dock
When I've played assa in the past it was often worth clipping envemon with elaborate planning. Is it worth pooling for this atm or would it be better not to considering that surge of toxins lasts quite a bit longer now, and clipping envenom on EP would therefore drop overall SoT uptime?
Used to do similar in wrath and legion
lone junco
@ripe dock we dont have a lot of crit. and mastery isnt scaling poisons worth a shit. the only thing that matters is EP over the SS open.
ripe dock
So it's probably worth it then?
stable mauve
So basically just isgnore EP?
gentle belfry
How are you guys setting up your raidbots profile to optimize for M+?
4 target patchwerk?
ripe dock
oh, you mean only worth keeping EP up over empowered garrottes?
round harbor
i sim beastlord, 1minute
gentle belfry
O.o
lone junco
yeah. EP is very important during the SS duration whether Exang or not.
round harbor
idk if thats correct or not since it isnt going to include m+
pallid hound
Im a bit dumb but, can someone please explain me why as assa u use "garrote->rupture->garroite in opener? :x
gentle belfry
@pallid hound read up
main blaze
Cause you are doing it wrong
ripe dock
right, cheers
strange python
@gentle belfry Bit useless of an answer, since the guide doesnt even mention pandemic
proven pumice
Wouldn't EP stay up naturally if you follow the Ravenholdt guide
gentle belfry
@strange python I meant read up in this chat, where it was recently discussed.
lone junco
re: EP/ss
strange python
I think best case scenario EP has about 65% up time
lone junco
could speculate that 2cp+ env over the ss may be a gain. but that is also the vendetta time. so 30k env is huge.
so just play 4+cps for now.
imo
strange python
@gentle belfry Okay fair, i rescind my statement and apologize lol
fallow estuary
By the way boys
lone junco
dont want bitch envenoms during your vendetta
strange python
Such a waste
fallow estuary
PvP cap chest is 355 shrouded chest
lone junco
but clipping is ideal.
tight ravine
is shrouded good
strange python
Don't do it with 2 secs left
lone junco
@fallow estuary week 1 wep. week 2 chesst ss?
fallow estuary
yes
ripe dock
My question relates more to downtime when we are low on energy however, between cooldowns
strange python
Don't spam mut-mut-env-mut-mut-env
main blaze
Yeah I was trying to get my pvp cap this week before raid but I didnt. Then I got a 370 SS chest from Fetid and was glad I didnt cap haha
lone junco
With GC trinket your opener is way way too fast for slow clipping
fallow estuary
you can choose between 2 chests - one has SS and one has BitS
gentle belfry
@fallow estuary is it 355 and shrouding for all rogues? O.o
calm barn
370 azerokk trinket 250 dps downgrade 👌
pallid hound
@gentle belfry where? ^^ on ravenholdt its not wrote up
tight ravine
oh shit that's what you meant by shrouded
ripe dock
Like, I can pool and then get 3 envenoms, for example, within the EP buff clip
charred oak
With subterfuge - on your opening rotation do you cast garrote and then garrote again immediately within 3 seconds?
gentle belfry
@pallid hound Scroll up in the chat or search using key words - its been discussed a few times today
strange python
What are the secondary traits on the pvp chest
ripe dock
but would that be a dps loss because i would lose SoT uptime?
strange python
or well
t2 traits
@pallid hound read up on pandemic timers, thats the gist of why the opener looks that way
tight ravine
also i def need to get something to track when garrote and rupture will run out
strange python
@pallid hound coupled with shrouded suffocation and subterfuge of course
tight ravine
does anyone else use those
fading spade
Farming for SS gear pieces sucks... I was lucky and got one from my weekly cache
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
charred oak
@strange python Thanks
fading spade
So few bosses drop them
tight ravine
thank you
charred oak
@strange python I must have been doing something wrong on the training dummy. When I used it again the tooltip debuff showed it as a lower damage garrote on the 2nd one.
undone cairn
@fading spade SS trait in weekly conquest
strange python
Garrote-Rupture-Garrote(gains pandemic length)-Vendetta-Mutilate-Rupture(5CP Rupture gains pandemic length from the first 3CP Rupture)-Exsanguinate
undone cairn
chest piece
wide badge
yaw can i ask a question?
strange python
You still dubs garrote on open while rocking poison blade
undone cairn
And it's 355
strange python
Yeah true
stable mauve
So should we try to envenkm before EP rounds out, or let it run out so total EP time is higher?
strange python
Only thing that changes is what happens after vendetta
slender hare
Why do I see a dagger in weekly conq? It’s because I didn’t complete last?
undone cairn
(assuming you're unranked)
strange python
You Envenom as close to EP running out as possible
undone cairn
Yeah I think so
strange python
So the envenom gets the EP boost too
ripe dock
But is it worth pooling for that outside cooldown windows when energy is low?
hushed turtle
Yes, the conq rewards are linear progression, u wont move onto next item until u complete previous
wide badge
hey is archive of the titans a good trait?
hushed turtle
Its mid tier afaik
neon siren
Is it worth playing Sin with only 1 SS trait?
wide badge
i see some people playing one
wide badge
archive but i mean only for raid enviroment
strange python
on m+ it might be less worth it
ripe dock
Also: what if I can use a 3 cp envenom just before vendetta will run out, and also to increase uptime on empowered garrote. I guess it would be worth using this instead of holding to 5?
strange python
ah ok
Yeah Happy I'd say so
What exactly are people running in m+ for sin atm that's launching it so far ahead of every other spec in the game? Trait / talent wise that is. Sin is at a score of 98 and 2nd best is way down at 92
I didn't take it to be god tier / ahead of outlaw in cleave
Shrouded Suffocation
You get crazy cleave with it
Is that with or without exsang because I see a lot of arguing
strange python
You can run either TB or Exsang
lone junco
Just get the SS.
lone junco
People didn't like exang in legion. They still don't like it now. Tb is easier to work with.
lone junco
Just need to understand the bug.
prisma pond
Inb4 70% nerf to SS
strange python
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
lone junco
Don't fucking garrote after the opener.
strange python
Take this into account Grim
It just sims way below my outlaw sims so I'm confused.
normal surge
What talent are you running in M+? Poison bomb / CT?
lilac coral
it's ridiculous AOE even with the bug lol
strange python
CT if you get big pulls
lone junco
@prisma pond my bet is. SS and subterfuge. At the same time.
twin egret
if I have two traits of SS should i still run exsanguinate? I sim less with exsang but im still unsure.
strange python
Yeah they'll probably destroy assassination
stuck shuttle
u just said it yourself
tiny vapor
SS is so kwei yet it needs to be nerfed.
normal surge
how many ruptures do you keep on 3+ add pulls ?
tiny vapor
But I love it so hard
urban storm
They’ll probably nerf ss to one CP
strange python
I'm honestly amazed they didn't touch SS just looking at bloodmallet and it makes me hesitant to hard swap to sin rogue rofl
lol
SS 1 CP wouldn't be that bad
I'd be happy with that
tiny vapor
Nah
lilac coral
i rupture as many as i can since i roll PB lol
urban storm
I think that’s the “likely” nerf, if one happens
tiny vapor
It would nerf our opener but we would keep that sweet deeps
strange python
Yeah we wouldn't be pulling 35K ST burst
kindred cedar
35k st burst?
stuck shuttle
yes
prisma pond
Ez
strange python
I remember exsang being really awkward to use post-opener in legion so I never touched sin. Do you just pop it on CD with SS garrote up?
prisma pond
Exsang burst with 3 SS is wacky
kindred cedar
And im 360 ilvl
strange python
I do 20K on dummy with no buffs
stuck shuttle
gentle belfry
Sure as shit cant hit 35k with TB lol
strange python
Yeah haha
stuck shuttle
i can do 20k on dummy no buffs
strange python
It rides on Exsang
stuck shuttle
almost 25k sometimes
kindred cedar
Oh
prisma pond
Ehhhh I've broken 30k with TB if lusted
twin egret
with lust and other buffs you should definitely hit 30k+
stuck shuttle
I actually crossed over to 40k
kindred cedar
U mean with exsang and bl
strange python
I've done 40K with a good PB proc
Just went to the dummy and tried it
Hit 27K burst
tiny vapor
I've done 100k during MoP
strange python
And you can't even vanish on the dummy
prisma pond
I need to try this room 3 mother burst strat for dem dank rank 1s
true ingot
How do you even get to room 3 outside of mythic
stuck shuttle
for Mythic?
lilac coral
need to disregard all instruction and stay with the tank on mother
gentle belfry
That was in the context of mythic im sure lol
stuck shuttle
Guild downed mother last night, 3rd room is fun
kindred cedar
Do you exsang on cd or wait for a refreshed rupture? Or u refresh rupture even if it has like half of the time remaining?
tiny vapor
I'm usually the first one to cross feelsbadman
strange python
you could pad mother heroic so bad if everyone was in on it
untold laurel
What are you guys going for zul opener? More worth to drop normal single target rotation on zul since adds die so fast or still garrote 3?
stuck shuttle
we 1 room Mother on Heroic
strange python
Yeah
lilac coral
lol i crossed early the other night and i was like "what exactly are y'all doing in here"
lunar current
anyone know how u can turn off exsang gcd in a WA? the trigger gcd option is turned off
hardy jewel
You can reset MOTHER and as ur doing that have everyone run to room 3. When MOTER respawns have a single tank bring here back to room 3.
true ingot
Is that a real thing you can do
devout moth
Is MotD viable on fights with adds?
strange python
HAHA holy fuck
Is SS and and exsang intended to be dynamic (aka you can refresh on pandemic and retain the damage bonuses)? Or are they intended to be snapshot like feral?
strange python
plz @ me if you respond ❤
ripe dock
Not sure if it's worth holding Gale Callers just a little bit til feeling a bit energy starved 🤔
gentle belfry
HOLY SHIT
strange python
100 parses on everyone except a tank and 2 healers
ripe dock
might be overkill on open?
stuck shuttle
no wonder
strange python
Mother just became the easiest Mythic boss this tier?
stuck shuttle
i pulled 18k on mother
rustic onyx
Do you play CT over PB this week in m+ ?
hardy jewel
They still wiped 21 times trying to do that
strange python
I actually run PB over Ct this week
rustic onyx
I play with PB and exsang and do g g g ( with last g on prio target ) rupture that prio target gale exsang
is that correct
strange python
I'd say that looks good
woeful moth
Is ss still a good azerite trait?
stuck shuttle
no its trash
strange python
Yeah shush
stuck shuttle
it needs a buff
woeful moth
Rip
strange python
it's bugged too
woeful moth
Lol
strange python
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
unique depot
So about to switch from sub to assassin I want to try this ex sang thing is there a guide for it? Didn’t see anything in pins
thin ingot
guys do you CT on 2 targets?
woeful moth
Damage matters
strange python
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
strange python
Yes Staba
stuck shuttle
FotM we are here
thin ingot
thanks ma man
strange python
But rupture on both targets is prio
is this implying that garrote SHOULD be dynamic?
lone junco
@thin ingot apl is >=2. For uptime.
quasi swan
why exacltly is ss soo good is it just soo much dmg with the few casts every 2 minutes or is there a way to go invis more often?
strange python
It's crazy damage
woeful moth
Garrote only in subterfuge unless there is not previous garrote on the target
crisp steppe
@strange python idk what is implied just read the bottom line for advise on hwo it will affect ur playstyle
lone junco
SS is nothing.
strange python
on ST Garrote will be doing 30-40% of your dmg
stuck shuttle
ss is shit
strange python
oh sorry
woeful moth
It’s 500 more dps over the next best trait
lone junco
SS. Is bad. Play sub.
stuck shuttle
Sub good
lone junco
👀
stuck shuttle
they have dances
lone junco
👮
strange python
Dude
indigo verge
what's the optimal way to combine ur cooldowns, mainly vendetta, vanish and toxic blade
stuck shuttle
SS trash
strange python
You can stun an entire pack
@crisp steppe I've been allowing empowered bleeds to run full duration before refreshing, just wondering what the intended behavior is.
That is beast
stuck shuttle
@indigo verge there's a guide up there pinned
brazen cliff
when do we pool on single target? and is there a general amount?
crisp steppe
@strange python I don't imagine thats intended behaviour
stable mauve
In m+ when should I pop exsanguinate?
strange python
That's intended behaviour
@indigo verge The guide gives good info, just doesn't explain the info too in depth. Read that, then chill here to gain a deeper understanding!
dim raptor
void elf + sub = many poofs
stable mauve
And does CT benefit from it?
strange python
NEVER overwrite a buffed Garrote
NEVER garrote outside Subterfurge if you have an empowered garrote up
@strange python That wasn't the question
What was the question
sorry
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
strange python
"empowered bleeds"
huh
What do you mean
Exsang bleeds or subterfuge garrotes?
@strange python since ss is bugged, whether its intended to be dynamic or snapshotted
is all
ohhhh
Yeah doubt that's intended
since the subterfuge buff stays
stable mauve
Is CT bleed effected by exsanguniate?
strange python
It's only the SS buff that goes away
delicate gull
Outlaw was the problem xD
stuck shuttle
yes @stable mauve
dim raptor
"It's a feature" - Blizz
strange python
when you use your 4th garrote
stuck shuttle
but only ST
strange python
Makes a dramatic difference, working with dynamic vs snapshot bleeds, ya feel
delicate gull
They gonna hit sin soon I feel it
hard plaza
nah
strange python
Why? Sin is t r a s h
hard plaza
they hit there specs
stuck shuttle
Sin is becoming FotM . always the worst
runic kernel
So basically dont cast any non subterfuged garrotes until your sub ones run out?
dim raptor
who do I gotta talk to so i can redesign the Raventholdt website?
strange python
Yeah
But m+
Blizz's new baby
"new"
You don't want to be top in pvp either or they do that BitS stealth nerf
crisp steppe
what do you mean new baby
glad peak
Double dagger for assassination correct ?
crisp steppe
they can't even bother to add rewards for m+ season