which isn't simmed
#assassination
icy ember
daring imp
finally almost 0 vers
eager cobalt
I've given up on not having shitty stats
frank wyvern
array is like 70 of 2ndary stat only atm
icy ember
it goes to 150
safe tusk
yeah it's 150
wind berry
depends on how many bosses you killed
frank wyvern
really?
frank wyvern
yeah thought so also
wind berry
clear lynx
Before using Exsang, is there an optimal / minimum amount of time remaining on the debuffs?
dusky rose
both trash and high hp
dreamy wagon
For single target whats better? Overwhelming power or heed my call? Ravenholdt shows heed my call, but bloodmallet shows overwhelming power by quite a bit
dreamy wagon
I imagine the extra haste will be better until we get higher base haste
west frost
You especially want overwhelm > heed without tb too, right?
obtuse island
I’ve never used Warcraft logs, and someone in my guild was ‘logging’ the raid lastnight, how can I use this to see where I go wrong? So I can improve my AVG score
I can link, if it makes it easier
safe tusk
btw do u guys go with crit/mastery (2 target) or go haste/crit (1 tar)? It's not easy to have high ilvl of both
dreamy wagon
The way poisons amd bleeds scale with haste, i would think prioritizing that over mastery
daring imp
@obtuse island https://wowanalyzer.com can help a bit i guess
safe tusk
anyone willing to share their Premium raidbots? 😅
free version doesn't have enough iterations limit 😛
wheat flame
guess you should learn how to use the desktop software
obtuse island
@daring imp that’s actually helped a lot! Cheers
safe tusk
I know how to simpermut but it takes insanely long
grizzled harness
Wowanalyzer isn't an exact science tho
It will tell you if you're using your CDs, not if you're using them wrong
cunning pebble
I'm simming that currently and all 3 are close to each other on ST and mastery crit pulling ahead the more targets you add
strange python
how do u sim m+?
cunning pebble
HecticAddCleave / 4 target 40 sec etc
cunning pebble
I got a lot of haste on gear, most likely why 😄
dusky rose
whats ur mastery
safe tusk
patch 3 targets puts crit mast way over haste for me
dusky rose
oh thats why mayne
short oak
is assassination the strongest spec rn
unreal sundial
yes atomic I'd say so
obtuse island
I’d agree with it being the strongest, and probably the simplest concept
ruby idol
I'd say its clearly bis in m+. Uldir has a few very good sub fights where it's not so clear
dusky rose
does anyone no the opener on a 3+ add pull
undone sandal
^
obtuse island
I played all three and find Sin the easiest to play
arctic agate
@dusky rose garrote as much as you can, CT, and focus mt
tawny shell
is there a reason the tool tip for SS is 65 dmg and not 511?
ruby idol
I originally thought sub would outperform sin in m+ cause of infested but the way all the dungeons are mapped out and how packs are handled at 10+ sin really shines
tawny shell
on raidbots
undone sandal
Even though that means wasting combo points?
west frost
Yes, the damage is worth the cp
safe tusk
outlaw is easier :D
you don't have to manage anything or watch dot durations for re applying. 5 points roll > 5 points bte (deadshot) > deadshot on proc > dispatch > ss
quick ice
@tawny shell weird thing about how tooltips are displayed
takes it for base0ilvl item
not for the ilvl of the actual item
undone sandal
Okay, when is it better to use CT over Poison Bomb?
ruby idol
That's kind of my point
tawny shell
word
ruby idol
Uh, next week sqyla
lilac fern
It was better last week too, no ? Necrotic and sangua with so much kiting. One would think CT > PB in that situation.
arctic agate
@undone sandal I'd say in m+ always
ruby idol
Well fort vs tyrannical is really the difference
unreal sundial
outlaw is clearly better than sin in m+
ruby idol
Trash just flops this week
undone sandal
Right on, how many targets does it need to be before it's actually benefitial to maintain CT?
ruby idol
Spending cps on ct is less ruptures which is less energy, which is less fok, which is less poison dmg
Which is less ep uptime as well
somber wyvern
any addon to make rupture more visible on targets?
round wadi
Should I use the haste troll spell on ex?
bleak river
So rupture on 3 tar is prio befote CT? In m+
ruby idol
If I'm running ct I drop 1 rupture before ct usually. But it's all pack specific and how energy starved you're going to be
cunning pebble
What's the target area you start using fok as combo builder instead of mut?
ruby idol
Like were a dot/resource class, so time to death of mobs is just as important as target# when you're making decisions
dim frigate
are we supposed to be clipping Elaborate planning buff? or just keep maximum uptime of it?
strange python
man, I love an hate galecallera
civic palm
That a new pokemon?
strange python
sure is
west gate
Can any one tell me how you how open one trash in mythic+ with ss x 3
fresh robin
garotte everything
ruby idol
3 garrote, afk
mortal warren
g g g rupture
strange python
avoid the 4th garorte out of stealth if the bug is still present
cyan stump
are you guys running tb or exg for dungeons and single target?
mortal warren
you want to take advantage of the 3 sec subterfuge window for garrot
fresh robin
did anyone know the answer to twintoe's question
What's the target area you start using fok as combo builder instead of mut?
cunning pebble
I found it mate, 3+ targets
fresh robin
i find fok clunky af with low crit unless theres lik4 + adds
sleek iron
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
ruby idol
Just stack crit 
west gate
ahh that what happend last night in raid lol
sleek iron
It might be low apm but coming from sub - sin has some more complexity to min/maxing rotation imo
lavish furnace
do you use an addon to keep track of the dots in aoe situations ? I have some problems there and get confused 😄
daring imp
probably just gotta get used ot it @sleek iron
if you play tb it's just another cp generator, exsang has a bit more depth* tho
sleek iron
Yeah I’m going exsang
The first opening is easy - it’s how to use the second exsang efficiently so it’s syncs with the third with vendetta/vanish
cunning pebble
Garrote > 5 cp rupture > exsang is hardly much depth 😄
sleek iron
Depending on your haste stats you might not have optimal timing to do that for the second exsang
daring imp
depends on the fight too
daring imp
definitely more depth than "hit tb on cd" @cunning pebble
cunning pebble
Haha, yea okay 😄
daring imp
that reminds me
sleek iron
What if I had 10sec left on garrote and 6 second on rupture and my exsang cd comes up?
daring imp
sleek iron
Do I wait till I can refresh
cyan stump
are you guys running exsg in m+ too?
sleek iron
Or do I just cast exsang to sync
cunning pebble
You need to plan better then
daring imp
hit 2~3cp beforehand to ensure full pandemic when refreshing rupture
sleek iron
If you get 2 5cp ruptures it’ll be different than 2x 4cp rupture
short oak
whats better. TB or Exsang
knotty dew
I dare to FoK at that point, not sure its beneficial though
sleek iron
Care to explain ongbak?
sleek iron
That’ll extend the rupture to full duration in time for exsang?
thin ingot
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
daring imp
i am not sure if doing fok for those extra 4s on rupture is good tho
i mean, it's not a garrote
gotta check the sim apl to be sure how it does, that or check top parsing logs
signal summit
Can some1 Tell me How much uptime u try to have on EB?:)
daring imp
just did a +9 atal dazar, had 73% on last boss
around 70
should be fine
@signal summit you mean elaborate planning?
signal summit
Yee mate
daring imp
yea, that one
daring imp
not all the time, was it?
knotty dew
The FoK for me at 3-4 cp is more a legion leftover for me, but it still feels good specially if it crits to go from 3 to 5 cp
daring imp
well if you got 3x SS you should definitely have EP up for 100% of its duration
when empowering garrote
signal summit
Well it was a long time Ago But their was a general rule
I only have 1 sadly
But all azerite is 370 so sims higher than 340
daring imp
yea for st that should happen
signal summit
Is there a general rule atm
daring imp
m+ tho no way, SS is definitely ahead of anything in m+
daring imp
@signal summit not quite sure, try to pool/chain envenoms back and forth
signal summit
Ye gotta give assa a try today
daring imp
trying to have it up before casting that 2nd envenom
atleast will boost envenom dmg while at it
signal summit
Been sub player until now
daring imp
but make sure to cast at the very end tho
daring imp
no worries 😛
zealous sable
is there a definitive answer to what is better, casting Envenom during EP or maxing the Envenom buff uptime? Prob EP right?
cunning needle
what is the max m+ gear you can get from finishing (not the weekly chest)
is it still 5?
cunning needle
oh cool
daring imp
given how low our crit/resource regen is compared to legion, chaining so many envenoms that you actually overcap on its own buff pandemic is very unlikely
zealous sable
Fair enough, thanks
main blaze
EP is 10% damage to all sources, while envenom is increased poison application. At the moment with our mastery levels and desire for haste/crit EP should be the better one
WIth more mastery it shifts to wanting envenom uptime which means that you would want to go master poisoner at that point.
long sandal
Why is the Taloc trinket so bad. I got a 395 last night and it sims worse than my fathoms which isnt even that strong for assassination
dapper moat
Question about EB uptime, so with 3xSS you should have it on 100% fight im bit confused because i am often quite energy dry so i just cant cast finishers with 4-5 CP or should i just cast 1 point finishers just to keep EB going?
strange python
@dapper moat 100 during empowered garrotes
You will loose ep and envenom uptime naturally
daring imp
i assume you're sync'ing vendetta with vanish?
strange python
But you learn when this takes place and pool to repeat cycles
strange python
@dapper moat always sync with vanish. To play safe i recommend the following
The opener is pre pot, garrote, rupture, garrote, vendetta, mutilate, rupture exang, mutilate mutilate envenom, mutilate mutilate envenom, (garrote is about to expire- when it does) vanish garrote envenom garrote
Rupture will have 3-4 seconds and should allow a 4-5 point rupture once that expires
Then keep ep up for the remainder of the empowered garrote duration
And as its coming off CD and all aligning
Do the exact same even if there is a rupture up already etc
dapper moat
ah ty guys alot here
tough warren
For the inner ring traits, should i stack them as well or just choose one of each mentioned in the guide?
strange python
Will give you very smooth and reliable burst untik you learb how to play dynamically
daring imp
i'd get those mini prydaz 😛
strange python
@tough warren check herodamage website as it changes on item level and stacking
tough warren
thanks, will do :)
strange python
Ideally you want at higher levels ss and overwhelming power
At 340, aslong as you havr 3 x ss the damage is so small its not overly game changing.
gleaming geyser
If you have one ss trait, you wait for garrote to fall off and vanish garrote x2
tough warren
i sadly only have 1 SS right now
just switched from sub
and the drop gods werent generous with me yet :P
cunning pebble
Cant for the life of me get shoulders to drop with SS 😦
Cleared everything since week 1
strange python
@gleaming geyser if you can fit a finisher in to start ep you do
dusky rose
so from what im getting for aoe one three targets: g g g ct g g g ruptures all and then env main targert?
strange python
If you vanish and garrote oncr and have 4 cps envenom or rupture(depending on current duration)
It gives a gcd between the reapplication
And extends the garrote once used by an additional tick
@dusky rose only if there is a vanish before the 2nd set of ggg
Else you would drop thr empowered garrotes from the original 3
Also
You want to weave FOK
After the CT
Else you may not have venomous wounds active
Especiallt if using a mouse over macro for garrote
cunning pebble
Depending on how long the adds live, you might want to hold the second round of garrotes from vanish back a little
dusky rose
ohhh i seee
strange python
@cunning pebble agreed
On ghuun for example
3 tenticles on the right and the big add
tropic hull
night elfs can restealth on trash too
strange python
Garrote 3 cyclopeans rupture the big add. Pool a moment vanish garrote big add garrotr cyclopean garrotr big add then rupture cyclopean
quasi flower
Is it correct to hold off on using Exsanguinate until after bleed reapplications? If so, do you refresh bleeds regardless of time left when exsanguinate is off of CD?
cunning pebble
If they live long enough to finish an entire rupture. Yes 😃
strange python
Fok and re rupture big add vendetta exang
I am able to transition on ghuun on 22k+
@quasi flower outside of the vanish vendetta combo. You want to have max pandemics on both garrote and rupture before exange
quasi flower
But do you refresh to max pandemic regardless of the remaining duration, or hold off until the standard refresh times into the exsang
strange python
Even if you reapply garrote and rupture on high duration as the exange will half the duration and increase your dps those combo points become less significant. And delaying exange for them to decrease would be an overall encounter dps loss
quasi flower
Alright, thanks mate
rapid prawn
in M+s , do i CT bosses or no?
vestal wren
no
quasi flower
I don't think the guide specifies the number of targets for CT, but I'm assuming its 3 like FoK
potent raft
is there a m+ rotation guide for Sin? In theory it should be good but whenever i try it i do like.. 50-60% of what i can do in outlaw (almost same level of gear)
azure bear
do you have 3xSS?
cyan stump
pb or CT for m+?
potent raft
@azure bear no, only 1
unique axle
Pb on tyrannical
azure bear
if not, outlaw will beat you in m+ trash, because the cleave is pretty hard
potent raft
ok so I should aim for 3x SS before giving it another go, thanks
daring imp
it gets really good with 3x SS, 2x should be decent, but really good only with 3
potent raft
(and in the subterfuge window, do you mass garrote or do you garrote -> rupture -> {switch target} ? )
cunning pebble
Only got 2 
cyan stump
i have 2x SS and 1x Blightborne
daring imp
garrote>tab garrote> tab garrote
strange python
laser matrix is best at ST , and meh on cleave aoe imho
potent raft
mass garrote, thanks, i'll give it another go soon
verbal sorrel
actually
I've seen a different opener on ghuun mentioned here
what I've been doing is 6x garrote
5x on cyclopeans
1x on dark terror
and I keep the burst up to transition phase
ending on 25k
daring imp
don't touch the big guy 🐢
verbal sorrel
what I also do
is Cloak first dark bargain
and get 2nd one instantluy
so I get 2x dark bargains during vendetta
dapper moat
That ss bug has usually kept me adding another garrotes. But i will now on just garrotte all mobs. Ty 😊
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
daring imp
i've seen a progressbar tracking for empowered garrotes on some guy's screenshot but couldn't find that shit anywhere
uneven summit
so weird they haven´t fixed that one yet
daring imp
like, all the empowered garrotes ( if you have 3 there's 3 bars )
verbal sorrel
bois I'm simming higher without Shrouded Suffocation trait on single target
feels bad man
2x laser matrix
1x double dose
stuck shuttle
same
only have 1xSS
simming higher still
i feel like the 2 CP off 1 trait should be worth it alone
verbal sorrel
well yeah
zealous latch
hey guys are you running ex & posion bomb for uldir ? I've only played pvp sin so I'm looking for pve tlanets 😃
verbal sorrel
Poison bomb on every encounter
stuck shuttle
im running exsang
verbal sorrel
and im running tb since no shrouded traits
knotty dew
I’m using TB but i have a hard time to sync vendetta with vanish because the ss empowered garrotes tick for like 22 secs of vendetta time so the vanish garrote garrote to have a new set of ss empowered garrotes wont be during vendetta, and at that point vendetta and vanish have cd with like 22 sec difference. Any recommendation on this? Should i wait with 2nd vendetta to lign up with vanish?
zealous latch
so without the shrouded traits I should go for toxin blades ?
strange python
@verbal sorrel on ghuun why woukd you 6 x garrote with no finish in between ?
verbal sorrel
just use vanish as its up same as vendeta
@strange python because the garrotes tick for insane damage
more than using a finisher
strange python
In essence without a little weaving your cutting your pandemic window
verbal sorrel
you cant fit in a finisher there
6x garrotes is just enough time to get to position to dark bargain
strange python
Or they die before the end of the duration
cyan stump
but dont you loose the empowered garrotes
chilly obsidian
No
cyan stump
if you go for more than 3 garrotes
verbal sorrel
I vanish
strange python
Im at work so struggle to view it on my phone
chilly obsidian
You lose if you dont cast more empowered
cyan stump
got it, thanks
chilly obsidian
So you vanish to make the next 3 empowered
strange python
@verbal sorrel on ghuun i transition on around 23k
verbal sorrel
its a 50k dps burst
yeah thats pretty much the same as me
I can do a bit higher
on this attempt I transitioned 25k
strange python
Are you vanishing garroting 3 or 6 targets?
verbal sorrel
6
Garrote left sie
vanish shadowstep right side
garrote all
and move with dark young
strange python
Ah i have to do the big add
verbal sorrel
to get 2nd dark bargain with cloak
strange python
Mines on 3 cyclops and the big add
verbal sorrel
you can hold off on 2nd dark bargain
if you want to bargain the cyclops
but Ive noticed higher dps when I get 2nd dark bargain
zealous latch
do you guys use toxin blades on cd ? and after how many SS traits should I change to EXsa
verbal sorrel
but I mean, this is all useless numbers mostly since 1st phase doesnt matter as much
@zealous latch I try to use it before pooling some cp's/energy
but mostly its best to use it on cd
@zealous latch you should sim
strange python
@verbal sorrel can you send me a link to your log pag(front page)
strange python
Yea
severe niche
solar summit
I have a small dilemma, i have 3 Ss pieces 340 and got shoulders from heroic that don't give Ss but they are 370
solar summit
340 ia simming higher
solar summit
But then, where do we get 370+ Ss pieces
severe niche
i use 2ss 1x lazer
stuck shuttle
or heroic uldir
zealous latch
@verbal sorrel sry for asking again but do you run deep stratagem or vigor ?
verbal sorrel
Vigor
solar summit
There is only 1 item that gives Ss in heroic uldir
stuck shuttle
yup
zealous latch
@verbal sorrel thx ❤
solar summit
So we are stuck untill...
ruby girder
guys how do i sim myself for m+? 5 targets 40sec ?
gray shuttle
TB or Exsang? Opinions
verbal sorrel
@ruby girder ye thats fine
ruby girder
ok ty
verbal sorrel
both TB and exsang are fine, sim your self
thin radish
Dumb question - how does haste affect our bleeds/poisons?
gray shuttle
For Raids?
verbal sorrel
exsang has been simming higher
ruby girder
exsang is best for m+ right ?
thin radish
So more ticks within the duration = more DMG?
severe niche
best for everything depending on your gear
strange python
@verbal sorrel @severe niche like your logs mine are not as good yet due to my very casual guild. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/draenor/undérrated
gray shuttle
TB for Uldir, Exsang for M+?
stuck shuttle
it's really up to you
severe niche
whers tehe ghuun kill bro
strange python
Dont ask mate
severe niche
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/MLv7zymchd243HKJ#fight=last also this is a +2,. 11 atal for m+
if anyone wants to look at it
we have 13 atal we pushing tommarrow
strange python
@severe niche we are very casual. We have had like 15 pulls on ghuun
ruby girder
crimson or poison bomb for m+ ?
severe niche
poison bomb
stuck shuttle
i like it better
severe niche
dont ct
strange python
Pb
verbal sorrel
yeah no need for ct this week
kind stump
Yeah trash just dies so fast this week
severe niche
rank 5 out of 5k on that atal key xd
verbal sorrel
Im scared of spiders now
nah
I tried cloaking and soaking all the spiders
but they just reapper
reappear8
strange python
Atals easy :) some of the easiesr mechanics in the m+world right now
cunning pebble
Everything is easy on a +2 guys.. 😄 😄
muted pelican
atal'dazar and freehold
prime stirrup
freehold is so easy if you cheese the last 4 packs
stuck shuttle
Taloc easiest mythic boss
prime stirrup
you can group the last 4 packs of freehold and they will AOE themselves
strange python
@cunning pebble he did a +2 on a +11 atal
severe niche
@cunning pebble cant tell if trolling xddd
cunning pebble
Yea I was kidding.. 😄
severe niche
basically if we get some shit dungeon for teh 14 key
its an insta brick so rip
im so glad i am part of the assassination god race now
we have all ascended with our pinks names 😄
verbal sorrel
haha
severe niche
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/pRCyeF4NRcX1dbaLsgVp1U im so close to 15k i can taste it
plz giff me double mother daggers blizzard
i feel like your gear is more optimized than mine ^
just low azerite pieces
wait
385 shoulder
W DF
nvm
fuck that
id rather have 20 more agi pots
i can also try swapping my weapon enchants
cuz
haste is bad now
but
let see if swapping some enchants around could bump me up
i just feel like if i lose any haste
then crit and mastery fall back down
and haste jumps back up
like im in the exact sweet spot
where haste is loosing value atm
if i get a higher ilvl galecallers
frail widget
Haste prolly better than it sims. You won’t always be in galecaller proc
severe niche
that could also push crit and mastery
frail widget
I actually hate the trinket lol
severe niche
i mean
when i pop it i am
big brain
plan ahead
like on mother
you can use it on cd
to help run against winds
and hit boss
worldly orbit
is there an opener i should be using when pulling aoe packs? is it better to spread garrote with subterfuge and then rupture or crimson tempest etc?
tropic pike
Yo so I've decided I'd like to be maining sin rogue and I’m not the top 3 dps (I am in top 5) of my raid group (I’ve been told rogue should always be at the top). I am trying to compare my raid log to a 99 percentile sin rogue. I’ve noticed he does not use toxic blade as much why is this? And in general how can I improve. It is my first time trying to play WoW more competitively and I’m looking to raid mythic at some point in the season.
99 percentile log: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/yaAHZ2CbKnpY9TRq#boss=-2&difficulty=0&wipes=2&type=damage-done&source=20&target=44
vast edge
im having ALOT of mixed results multi dotting garrote on 3-4 mobs in m+ some times my dps is 20k sometimes its 8k.. i get the feeling that the trait is still bugged using subterfuge.. is this a known bug that iv just missed?
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
vast edge
omfg
strange python
@severe niche you sim 1.3k above me. You need to work on your logs pal :p
severe niche
thats is it
severe niche
yes not until your stealth garrotes fall off
tender walrus
Yea ofc
vast edge
so many times on two targets i reapply garrote twice on each target to extend the duration.. and i guess iv just been fucking myself
vast edge
all 4 garrotes is from subterfuge but why the fuck would 4 applications be bugged and 3 not? makes no sense
frail widget
Cause the fourth one is out of subterfuge
vast edge
but yea thanks for the heads up... atleast i know why my dmg isnt consistent
ruby girder
whats the best time to exstanguinate ?
severe niche
subterfuge only last 3 sec
3 globals
3 garrotes
twitch clip me it then bro
.....
you realise
thats what were talking about
you dont use a 4th
tropic pike
@frigid lagoon he did in tha particular fight?
stark token
If pack of 4 and you subterfuge garrote 3 and then normal garrote a 4th the first 3 love the damage?
tropic pike
?
ruby girder
whats the best time to exstanguinate ? pls
vast edge
well i have garrote in stealth on a different key and then garrote out of stealth.. and i click the garrote stealth button 4 times for 4 garrotes before im "out of stealth"
severe niche
on cd @ruby girder
tropic pike
How come he's used it 6 times
severe niche
with pandemic refresh
tropic pike
wait wut
severe niche
@vast edge thats because after you cast the 3rd it doesnt go on cd
so you CAN cast a 4th time
but shouldnt
tropic pike
What was I looking at then?
scenic saffron
why is the opener says garrote>rupture>garrote, what is the point of casting two garrotes back to back ?
vast edge
@severe niche oso its yet another bug then? 
strange python
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
severe niche
dots/bleeds maintain 30% duration if refreshed
lilac fern
You do the rupture to proc EP @scenic saffron
severe niche
with enough time ofc
vast edge
iv been fucking my dmg for so long LOL
severe niche
@vast edge no subterfuge just makes garrote have no cd when cast
severe niche
you just dont want ot cast a 4th cuz you no longer have the buff but the 3rd was cast so it doesnt go on cd
3
or
6
magic numbers
you only have enough globals for that many
trust me
lilac fern
And then you got enough time to get another SS garrote off, to maximize DPS
severe niche
you should be tracking subterfuge buff with a wa
if you dont see it
dont cast garrote
vast edge
@severe niche the confused has been that while in subterfuge i use my stealth abilites and in stealth my garrote is on 2 but out of stealth its 1 and i spam 2 4 times which means i was in stealth for the 4 casts but while im saying this.. every time iv cast 4 "in stealth" garrote has been on cd.. so yea i totally understand what ur saying now
hard plaza
whats Assa like in M+?
vast edge
and thx for explaining it to me so i no longer have garbage dmg
severe niche
god spec in m+
np trying to help the monkey pack 1 nanner at a time 😄
i mean assassination rogue community :p
memes btw
vast edge
memes
severe niche
hard plaza
debating between switching loot spec from outlaw to assa 🤔
severe niche
debating?
stark token
For daggers only?
stark token
I switch every boss
hard plaza
yeah but theres a few where u can get both!
stark token
Only mother drops both I think
hard plaza
and m+
severe niche
always assassiantion loot spec dont want to dirty up your inventory with those filth things outlaw rogues call weapons
high siren
why you talking about weps, when the real boost come from azerite traits
tender walrus
How come i have 2x ss and exsg sims lower than tb?
vast edge
yesterday loot day i got a 370 dagger with a socket from the pvp weekly and then the first match of the reset i got a 360 dagger.. both with bis stats.. nice upgrade up from 340 daggers
severe niche
now what you do want is a nice prestine bleed flesh carving machine that an assassination rogues uses
high siren
that's all that matter
vast edge
dunno how MUCH daggers count for the overall dmg tho
severe niche
they are big
frank wyvern
offhand not much
hard plaza
whats the learning curve like?
frank wyvern
mh like 500 dps per 30 ilvl
frail widget
@tender walrus u not running ep?
vast edge
sims only went up like 400 dps
high siren
not as big as swapping not-SS for yes-SS azerite
frail widget
You’re supposed to run ep period right now
vast edge
isnt offhand more important for assa since muti is both daggers?
frank wyvern
i tried it
severe niche
can i?
frail widget
Mp won’t be better for a while
tender walrus
@frail widget ok tyvm!
frail widget
Np
hard plaza
the big question though, is Darkmoon fathoms alright for assa :S
frank wyvern
there, i default to 2x355 daggers (with enchants)... simmed vs 2x385 daggers with enchants (same daggers)
frail widget
A lot still run toxic blade. They sim close. I wouldn’t worry
frank wyvern
not even 1k dps with both 385
empty notch
so the "bis" dagger drops in tol dagor?
frank wyvern
like probably 500 dps per mainhand and 100 dps offhand
vast edge
btw.. atm im playing elaborate planning instead of master poisoner.. have any of you experimented with it? outside of sims
severe niche
technically that is bis if you hit the haste 'break' point
vast edge
whats the haste break point?
empty notch
how much haste is the "break point"?
severe niche
gota sim yo self
vast edge
im at 20% haste atm
hard plaza
hmm just looking at bloodmallet think i have 3x shrouded suffocation in my bank 😮
frail widget
For me 18
high siren
getting the bis trait vs. getting a +25 ilvl dagger upgrade
severe niche
and those will scale better
i say break point very veyr loosly dont take my word as law just from my own simming and messing with stats
just aim for 18-22% then go for crit mastery
like i said 
also in raid you have to take into account reorg array if you have 2 stacks of that atm
frail widget
Sim you’re stat weights. Gear accordingly. Sim again
tender walrus
@frail widget i like min maxing, its fun sort of :D
severe niche
in raid i get 150 haste atm but then my other ring becomes more dps
empty notch
sad, but i'm not going anywhere cause daggers are a myth
severe niche
if you dont have galecallers boon then you prob want as much haste as possible always
frail widget
Same. I’m 365 ilvl right now with shit tier weapons
And only one ss trait
Feels fucking bad
severe niche
one ss trait isnt bad
if you have good others
plenty of people with 1 still doing well
frail widget
Lasted matrix and other one is shit
severe niche
i dont see the trait getting nerfed like people said
frail widget
Laser
vast edge
i thought SS trait was godlike.. so atm i have 2 traits but if i change out my 340 helmet with a 325 helmet that has a SS trait i go down in dps
on the sims
frail widget
How do you not see it getting nerf. It’s literally the exact thing every other spec has already had nerfed
severe niche
i mean
i can swap both ss traits out for titan raid traits
and i lose 2-3% dps
its not that op
just in m+
cuz you can abuse restleath so often
vast edge
makes sense
frail widget
One trait shitting on all other traits. U want that to be good so you have to sit there and hope your cache has it
Legendaries all over again
severe niche
i mean thats all calsses atm
with all azerite gear
if azerite gear doesnt drop from m+ or cahnged so you get a guarnetted one from chest each week, i see that happening in the next month 100%
severe niche
i mean they said azerite will 100% not be tradable all xpac
frail widget
I’m not even 5 percent sure why they did that
severe niche
and look what happened to that
amber temple
yes they are fucked, shit out of luck
stuck oyster
385 shoulder worse than my 340 ss shoulder. gj blizz
vast edge
cant they just make it so that from a +10 you can get 370 azerite +7 355 and +4 340? like it cant be that hard?
hard plaza
they did it so u have to use thr raid azerite gear
or thats the only thing i can think of anyway
lo
as i presume Sims dont account for the buff u get only in uldir right?
severe niche
they do not
frail widget
There’s 2 options. They nerf the fuck out of vastly stronger azurite traits til everything is boring across the board or they let you get azurite gear from mythic plus. They’ve chosen to do the first with a lot of classes so I think that’s the way it’s gonna go
Dumb af but it is what it is
vast edge
fuck the raid gear.. i only play m+ with my mates this expansion.. i sometimes do pug raids in normal/heroic.. but mostly my time is spent in arena and m+.. waiting a week to maybe get an azerite piece is so fucking stupid
stuck oyster
they want us to play bfa longer but the azerite shit is demotivating as fuck
vast edge
iv just stopped all together leveling the neck cus its boring as fuck
frail widget
No one does expeditions lol
severe niche
something with change 100%, that change to be determined i guess
frail widget
Fuck that shit
stuck oyster
i mean getting higher ilvl azerite pieces. i dont have a problem with the neck
frail widget
U do your weekly and then gtfo
vast edge
oh.. i need to keep my neck lvl high so when i finally get a bis 370 azerite item i can actually use the traits on it.. derpyderp
nice one blizz
stuck oyster
time to play 5 rogues and hope one gets a ss piece. yeah
jaunty dagger
deadshot wasn't that op either and look what happened
thorn crater
btw boys
sims put my 1 355 matrix and 2 340 SS above 3 340 SS
is that right?
or just for ST?
frail widget
Sim it with exg
thorn crater
i did
frail widget
Check your stat weights
jaunty dagger
don't forget the 150 secondary from laser that doesn't show in the sims
gleaming geyser
LM isnt bad, archive is
main blaze
We will eventually want 1 laser matrix for Uldir with leveling of Reorigination array. Also laser matrix does a good bit of damage by itself.
vast edge
the array thingy is raids only right?
main blaze
yeah
gleaming geyser
Yes and sims dont take the buff into account
thorn crater
yes i know which is why it seemed weird to me
that it simmed higher
also i have the crappy 370 head from uldir
that sims for 2 dmg higher than x2 SS and puts me down on 1
gleaming geyser
You get 15 ilvls and you already have 2 ss traits doesnt seem weird to me
thorn crater
but fck that i aint doin it
gleaming geyser
LM isnt that far from ss
thorn crater
im just wondering whether i should drop to 2 stacks cause of the chest matrix thing
frail widget
I want triple twist the knife and the raid 30k melee dmg trinket just for pvp. So I can double envenom with mfd and then trinket
cyan stump
can i apply 3 empowered garrotes to just 1 target?
gleaming geyser
What
main blaze
no just 1 garrote per target
frail widget
U can use it twice to get a longer duration out of it
Or garrote rupture garrote if st
cyan stump
okay
undone sandal
So in a pack of 3-4 mobs (m+) I want to garrote 3 targets and also keep them ruptured
frail widget
Garrote rupture garrote vendetta toxic blade envenom is your opener if playing toxic blade. On st
jovial plume
why the double garrote?
main blaze
pandemic
grizzled harness
It's still gar gar rupt with ex right?
main blaze
makes the garrote last longer on the target
frail widget
Extra duration and ep buff
cyan stump
is there an optimal window to use CT in m+ ?
cyan stump
so after i apply garrote and rupture,, and before envenom?
cyan stump
thanks
vast edge
whats CT?
dawn merlin
Crimson tempest
vast edge
aaa
frail widget
I rather enjoy crimson tempest
frail widget
Yeah
dawn merlin
It is quite good, especially noticeable in high keys and certain add heavy dngeons
dense fern
i was actually about to ask
should i be using crimson tempest in 10s this weke
figured not cause tyran but poison bomb seems meh so i was gonna ask
cunning pebble
Feel like all that really matters is ST dps and then its PB
warm geode
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
warm geode
T_T
frail widget
Look at what percentage of your dps poison bomb is
Crimson tempest def worry it
Worth
vast edge
i need to test out crisom tempest today
dense fern
wait so what does this bug mean?
vast edge
crimson*
dense fern
one i cast 3 garrotes i need to wait till they run out before applying another one?
once
blissful dove
Yes
main blaze
yes
blissful dove
Only matters when you've got empowered garrotes rolling
vast edge
dafuq
cunning pebble
2 min fight (M+) First with CT second with PB
frail widget
2 minutes lol
tiny vapor
Lel
cunning pebble
Why the hell would you sim 5 minutes for M+? Thats just stupid
cunning pebble
That the diffrence really isnt that much and CT is better on thrash 😃
frail widget
Why the hell would you care about 300 dps on a boss vs clearing it faster
dawn merlin
ahh
cunning pebble
Exactly, just take CT
dawn merlin
fair enough, true
frail widget
Also it’s more like 3 mins on high keys cause tyrannical
cunning pebble
Dont think it will change much, but I can make it 3
ruby girder
how do you play with CT you replace envenom ?
cunning pebble
288 dps difference on 3 min fights
frail widget
Garrote x3 ct. ruptures if they live long enough envenom
That’s prio
Fok as builder
On aoe packs
ruby girder
never use CT on single targt ?
ruby girder
alright ty
dawn merlin
ye don't
paper root
Anybody know how accurate the sim dps is now?
im simming 11,8k but i have no chance at maitiaining that at a dummy
arctic vine
anyone play with exanguinate?
young swan
how would u guys use on use trinkets as sin? if u use it in a window with vanish, garrote rapture exg, do u use it before the vanish or after the dots are up?
arctic vine
exsanguinate*
paper root
bursting abit above but i fall to like 9k or abit higher after allitle white
Am i fucking something important up or is it the sim/dummy?
sage cosmos
You're bursting "a bit" above 11.8k?
vast edge
@young swan i always use trinkets with vendetta
paper root
Burst is about 14.5 with vendetta then going to around 11 during the 2nd toxic blade, then slowly towards 8,5-9
strange python
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
sage cosmos
What's your ilvl, and how many SS traits?
paper root
even when i get vendetta back up i cant get to 9,5k even for a 300 sec dummy fight with 2 vendetta
arctic vine
does anyone know of a place i can look for exsanguinate build? and rotation
paper root
348, 2 ss
cunning pebble
Are you simming yourself with all buffs?
sage cosmos
You should burst 20k+ Gulrotmongo
paper root
that might be
sage cosmos
With lust atleast
paper root
hmm but from invis : Gar, Rupt, Gar, vendetta, toxic blade
then 2 x mutilate and envennom except for when i reapply poisons?
lilac fern
What
sage cosmos
not sure for toxic blade, but revise the guide for sure if you cant burst 20k in that gear imo
tardy yoke
When you vanish for 2nd vendetta, do you use vanish and do your opener as you did at the start?
cunning pebble
After, they update constantly and don't snapshot
vast edge
i wish you could snapshot
paper root
yeah i vanish then do the same opener
hard plaza
Fathoms ok? in Assa i bought it for Outlaw
cunning pebble
I miss aff lock in MoP 😦
paper root
i dont have onuse trinks
vast edge
i always play with my dots like im snapshotting.. i wish..
peak sapphire
fathoms is amazing for all 3 rogue specs
paper root
and my trinks are pretty bad
cunning pebble
Shit gear, but if you had good trinkets you could snapshot for an entire fight 😄
paper root
gonna buy a fathoms i think
paper root
and my heart is lvl 18 so i dont have 2 traits on shoulders, but i have ss and overwhelming on both head and chest
paper root
ss and heed*
shut crest
hm quick question, why do the sims with exsangunate not refresh garotte earlier in the opener? there seems to be 5 seconds of downtime as if they wouldnt take into consideration that the dot drops off faster
peak sapphire
better than some* 385 trinkets
tame cobalt
Am i doing something wrong or does vanish comes up around 20s into second vendeta?
paper root
ah wait
vast edge
reapplying empowered garrote with 2 s left on vendetta to get that juicey placebo effect for maximum deeps
hot snow
So I'm sure this is a dumb q. but the guide says g - r -g but surely the second garrote over writes the subterfuge one ?
vast edge
@tame cobalt should only be a couple of seconds
paper root
the second garrote is also within subterfuge window
peak sapphire
u have 3 globals in subterfuge so the 3rd global wont overwrite it, just extends it
hot snow
oh to extend the buff right
gleaming geyser
@tame cobalt you're fine, just delay 2nd vendetta for ur vanish so you get full duration on ur SS empowered garrote
strange python
ich hav 370 chest with out ss should i go for that?
and 370 head.. from.uldir with the trait..fml.
blissful dove
German?
strange python
yee
blissful dove
lol
strange python
what ?😂
blissful dove
Sim it and see which is better my dude
vast edge
did the "ich" give the tell? 😃
tame cobalt
@vast edge dont u use vanish after garotes runout first time? That would mean around 20-24s after pull no?
blissful dove
lol
strange python
rip
vast edge
@tame cobalt yea i totally thought wrong! you are right.. just hold the vendetta til vanish is up again
mb
sage cosmos
Can you explain how you got it wrong? You made me doubt myself..
gleaming geyser
If you believe everything that is being said in here, you need to reevaluate stuff
vast edge
cus the third vendetta/vanish combo is a few seconds betwen each other cus you already lined it up the second time @sage cosmos
blissful dove
It's mostly the same, but no one is vanish rupturing these days
sage cosmos
Ahh makes sense, i havent raided much as assa yet so I hardly ever see the 3rd combo - Good to know tho.
blissful dove
rip nightstalker
gleaming geyser
rip ns pk
true thistle
Rip sub
vast edge
any high level pvpers here that know if the SS bug is also in arena? and if the SS trait does tons of dmg aswell
frail widget
It is. Not worth using tho
Twist the knife is better
As a rogue right now u do not want vanish as a dps cooldown
Rogues flop
true thistle
Subtleforge and garrotte is nyeh?
gleaming geyser
I dont see mp pulling ahead of EP since mastery and ep both double dip to bleeds and poisons
blissful dove
I just don't feel like deadly and envenom do enough for mp to be better than ep
frail widget
Ss is cheese garbage in arena that works to 1800 then kinda useless
blissful dove
Yeah what Pexa said
zinc sleet
!trinkets
frail widget
Go twist the knife. Run mfd get the burst trinket from raid. And time your double envenom with the trinket
For pvp that is
vast edge
im struggling to hit 1800.. (first time doing arena games) getting shit on by arms and bm.. maybe changing out my SS with twist the knife can give me abit more output for the close games @frail widget
im around 1750-1770 feelsbadman
frail widget
Find a Druid
Right now they’re a better option for us that disc
As I said bro. We just flop.
vast edge
its a druid i play with 😛 that used to be 2.1k rating 😛
zinc sleet
Is there a up to date sim chart for trinkets?
vast edge
i guess its just me :;(
gleaming geyser
Herodamage or bloodmallet @joey
frail widget
Run mfd. don’t run smoke bomb as sin. U need the dmg
torpid sluice
Hey, is there a WA to show how many enemies are around you, so you know when to do Mut or FoK (in for example dungeons)? Or is this not possible?
blissful dove
I think fuu had something like that
vast edge
system shock creeping poison and the wound poison in the pvp talents? @frail widget
viscid rover
nameplates and FoK 3+ works for me
frail widget
System creeping and deadly brew
zinc sleet
Thank you @gleaming geyser
frail widget
Run mp and toxic blade
gleaming geyser
Better off fok at 2+ tho
vast edge
mp?
torpid sluice
Believe FoK was >3?
frail widget
Master poisoner for pvp
viscid rover
yeah i do 3+ and just muti 2 target, works for me
daring imp
dot
solar summit
Bis daggers are from mother in uldir?
barren wharf
thx
daring imp
halves dot duration, makes it tick faster
gleaming geyser
I fok 2+ but I feel its probably close to dead even
torpid sluice
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
gleaming geyser
Fok 3+ is a given
blissful dove
I also fan at 2
frail widget
I don’t know if there are bis daggers. It depends what your weights are lol
solar summit
Hehe ok
blissful dove
CPs are worth more
sage cosmos
Tbf out of the two daggers dropping in uldir, the mother ones are more likely to be your best for stat weights than the one from zul
frail widget
Haste isnt even my best stat anymore as sin
barren wharf
Are the Uldir trinkets planned to be buffed does anyone know?
viscid rover
video guides get outdated faste imo
sage cosmos
Myth check the text guide on ravenholdt website
solar summit
Saw infexious gaming but he's not using exsang
frail widget
Not that I’ve seen. Infexious prolly has one. Dalaran is some self masturbatory clickbait so I’d avoid that like the plague
solar summit
You could be right fl0w
sage cosmos
99% of youtube guides are made by people who shouldnt make guides
daring imp
@frail widget how?
viscid rover
@solar summit some of the ones ive seen i can tell is clearly outdated already
solar summit
Aha
frail widget
They’re all 5 through 10 minute videos where u can tell he ran out of shit to talk about so he just clips himself doing meme shit
@daring imp
daring imp
no i meant about haste not being best stat anymore haha
frail widget
Oh. I have 20 percent haste
daring imp
that's what, 1400? 1500?
frail widget
300 on a ring
torpid sluice
https://gyazo.com/1872655f942a774ecce3c2e9bee07994?token=35a7609a3e71021b36612bf120acf390 slowly getting there ;_;
frail widget
Something like that ya
gleaming geyser
I have 20%, use galecallers and haste still king 🤔
daring imp
simming myself with gc boon haste dropped from 2.02 to 1.80 o_o
frail widget
I also have gc boon
daring imp
wth
green ruin
Sin is top dpe on the latest day 1 heroic charts, who's scared
daring imp
i'm not, nothing bad will happen with us, chill bois 
blissful dove
Rogue absolutely does not need nerfs
green ruin
pine panther
so i think im gonna switch from sub to sin ..
sly bloom
SS nerf inc 
gleaming geyser
Most people do
torpid sluice
TB sims 100 DPS lower for me
frail widget
Sin is way better. You can watch Netflix while raiding
daring imp
we ought to drop some other high ilvl azerites so we stop using SS's for raiding and mask it a bit ... lul
timber owl
@vague kernel I do
frail widget
I hope they nerf ss ooo
blissful dove
Those bottom specs are literally unfinished
gleaming geyser
Nerf sin so people have something to complain about and reroll to their other FOTM
viscid rover
bois i cant figure out the opener with subterfuge without ss, single target that is
blissful dove
Why Nerf ones that are?
daring imp
dun touch mah ss's pls
blissful dove
Make azerite shit drop from m+!
daring imp
some day i'll be full 385 with 3x 340 EZerite pieces
frail widget
No moth. That makes too much sense for a small indie company like blizzard
tropic hull
i have 355 SS 😃
gleaming geyser
@vague kernel after vendetta in opener, on CD and pool a bit on rotation
daring imp
oh you silly lucky bastard
torpid sluice
Got 370 head from my 4mythic cache and it simmed better than my 340 SS head ;_;
tame owl
bois, do i delay vendetta and vanish a bit for exsang?
daring imp
y
blissful dove
It's not like we'd get to use the traits since they're locked anyway 😂
torpid sluice
:>
gleaming geyser
Give garrote 3 cp baseline 👷
daring imp
give us not-shitty-traits