assassination

[keen spruce]

I don't think it's worse

I think it's underwhelming

we'll log it under "room for improvement"

[tough whale]

You could get your shoulders at any point in the game, no matter how rare

[urban storm]

the overall loot system is undoubtedly shittier

[tough whale]

you cannot get azerite except for once a week

[severe niche]

^

[tough whale]

and it is on the same drop table as every dungeon peice

[severe niche]

thats a problem though

[tough whale]

so the chance of even getting azerite is slim

[ocean rain]

how is my haste 1.99

[tough whale]

let alone a bis

[urban storm]

oh absolutely

[keen spruce]

Haste

[urban storm]

people who make the posts saying "why is everyone complaining, dont you remember legion legendary system was horseshit (which it was)" but that doesnt detract from the position we are in

that we have no new abilities

talents

lost artifacts

lost tier sets

[tough whale]

legion legendary was slightly better than bfa tbh

[keen spruce]

Preach Gaming Parrot

[tough whale]

idk how they managed to do worse

Never cease to amaze i guess

[urban storm]

nah like

the beginning of legion was too up or down depending on what legendary you got

and that was terrible

[tough whale]

Yes but here is the difference

[urban storm]

but at least you could gear yourself out

[tough whale]

once you get your shoulders, youre done

[urban storm]

because you could farm traits,et c

[keen spruce]

Yeah legion launch was worse than BfA launch

[tough whale]

once you get your SS trait

[keen spruce]

[tough whale]

next raid you have to Do it again

[urban storm]

yeah

[keen spruce]

and the rest of BfA remains to be seen

What do you mean gear yourself out

340 SS is so overtuned that it's competing with heroic azerite drops

so gearing is pretty easy for assa

[tough whale]

Yup

But look at the damage gain if you get a 385 ss peice

[keen spruce]

unless you wanna jerk off to your ilvl

you're heroic ready without too much work

[stuck shuttle]

lets fucking go boyz

[tough whale]

jooocy

[keen spruce]

and if you're a mythic raider, top guilds were getting 7 characters level capped in legion to farm legendaries

I dont' think that's the same in BfA

I wouldn't think

er not legendaries

the other thing

I don't remember

[tough whale]

it was legendaries.

[urban storm]

yes, it was legendaries

[keen spruce]

yeah Legendaries

I knew that

[urban storm]

because if you didnt get good ones

[keen spruce]

So the gearing up was way worse in Legion on the top end, and it's pretty easy to get heroic ready in BfA

with the current system

but it was in legion too

unless you were a fire mage

[urban storm]

well, the raid is not super difficult

[keen spruce]

neither was EN

[tough whale]

Gearing up is just as bad in BFA with the personal loot bullshit

[urban storm]

because you out geared it

[tough whale]

at least in top end guilds you could funnel split runs

now you cant

[keen spruce]

yeah Personal loot is a dumpster fire

I don't mind it for pugs

but forcing guilds to do it is crazy

[tough whale]

it was never forced lmao. if you wanted to do it you could

it was always an option

guilds always did it

and they still do splits now

[urban storm]

also, my personal opinion is that the relic system of ugprading your weapon is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than relying on random weapon drops

[keen spruce]

I like wep drops better

[urban storm]

yes, the trait bullshit got stupid towards the end with NCL, but until 2 days ago i was literally using a 320 and 310 dagger at ilvl 340

[keen spruce]

I missed it a lot during legion

yeah I didn't get rid of my 310 offhand until the raid came out

at about 340 ilvl

but someone's always gonna get cucked on RNG

a fair game =/= a fun game

people want to spin the wheel

that being said, "room for improvement"

need more azerite traits that do more impactful things besides just damage

like SS is kind of cool because it changes the way you play a little

[tough whale]

Need azerite traits much mroe balanced than "have this or be a nonfactor"

[keen spruce]

but like, they need to add abilities

[tough whale]

much like old leggos

bad traits and good traits have too much of a discrepancy

[keen spruce]

yeah they need to number tuning, but blizzard was super behind on everything leading up to the xpac dropping

raid testing 3 days before launch

not saying that's not it's own problem or anything

but there's lots of room for azerite to be a cool system

[tough whale]

mythic mother still very buggy LUL

[keen spruce]

it's not just "a random world drop will make my spec playable"

[tough whale]

I did the old Arcanocrystal grind on my main last xpac

and this is just about as bad

[keen spruce]

if 2nd and 3rd row traits get some love there will be more interaction between different azerite pieces and all that

The arcanocrystal grind was bad because the item was broken

the azerite grind is bad because SS is broken

the system isn't bad, the balance on that trait is bad

[tough whale]

the system is bad

every class has an op azerite trait

and can only get 1 roll per week on it

[severe niche]

so 11 temple not that bad tbh

[keen spruce]

That's not the system though, that tuning

[tough whale]

Its the system lol

[royal lantern]

well, azerite gear was a intersting idea, but they made some stupid choices

[tough whale]

There's 2 ways to get 385 azerite, trait regardless

mythic raid, or get VERY lucky out of 10 per week

[spice surge]

or pvp

[tough whale]

or pvp sure

[keen spruce]

okay so Mythic + cache, moderate luck

[tough whale]

still, lets talk about the sheer low chance you have to even upgrade azerite on a weekly basis

moderate?

moderate?

[keen spruce]

Total azerite compared to all dungeon loot total

[royal lantern]

if you could chose your own traits or have more options it would be way better, but it makes 0 difference too legiondarys/op trinkets cus you only want the best pieces, wich most of the time only 3-4 sources drop

[keen spruce]

is like what? 25%?

30%?

15%?

[urban storm]

total azerite WITH SS

[wispy apex]

With Galecallers boon, should you delay it to use before each exsang?

[urban storm]

is 3/all items

[tough whale]

15-20% roughly, and even then, the chance of getting a trait you like

[keen spruce]

how many times do I have to say

[tough whale]

is a tenth of that

[keen spruce]

that's just tuning on that one trait

that's not hte system

[quartz dew]

yea but chances of getting azerite [insert one good trait for spec here] is really low

[urban storm]

it doesnt matter

its any trait

[tough whale]

EVERY CLASS has a trait as good as ss

[urban storm]

that just maeans its shitty for eveyrone

doesnt mean the system isnt shit

[keen spruce]

it's like arguing with hard boiled eggs

[quartz dew]

because "it's tuning" doesn't matter, cause if they fix SS another one will be the new hot shit and the cycle repeats until the expansion ends

[tough whale]

^

[spice surge]

The silly thing is that you cant get it from m+, so you cant farm the trait you want

[quartz dew]

unless you're thinking a mythical world where all the traits are the same, in which case why even have them

[tough whale]

Blame tuning, sure, soon as SS gets nerfed we farm a new trait with the same drop chance

[civic saffron]

Either every trait is equal value which means azerite is irrelevant or there's always a best trait which means you're grinding for best trait.

[keen spruce]

They don't have to be identical, it just needs to be brought in line

[tough whale]

Blizzard bringing everything even 4Head

[royal lantern]

azerite gear is just like legion relics/mop glyphs etc....there is a best choice, you take it, its illusion of choice cus there will always be the best piece

[tough whale]

They should just make every class even while theyre at it right

The point im trying to make is that blizzard will never make azerite traits even. There will always be a best option and the system to get your bis azerite trait wont change, making the system the issue.

/end rant

[keen spruce]

fk

it deleted my rant

too long

I'm not retyping it

[peak sapphire]

!chest

[prisma monolith]

Weekly chest position:
Alliance - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKPlCI652Wo
Horde - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLjg2XCTe7U

[harsh totem]

Does Shrouded suffocation stack?

[keen spruce]

damage

yes

[harsh totem]

Is it worth going 3 of them?

[keen spruce]

yes

[harsh totem]

k

[junior condor]

how hard is assassination to play? been messing around with outlaw

[hollow wren]

eASY AS FUCK

[keen spruce]

exceptionally easy

[hollow wren]

And

[royal lantern]

not that hard if you read a bit about pandemic timers with dot's

[hollow wren]

are we stacking 3 ss for pve too?

[keen spruce]

yes

Difficulty is like BM Hunter -> Frost DK -> assa rogue

1-2-3 easiest

[jagged ore]

New to assassination what's the point of double garroting with SS

[keen spruce]

imo

pandemic window

[wispy apex]

Asking again 😄 With Galecallers boon, should you delay it to use before each exsang?

[keen spruce]

adds like 6ish seconds to your buffed garrote and gives 2 CP

[royal lantern]

outlaw is more easy imo, but we

[keen spruce]

2nd exang yes

well you're delaying your exang for galecallers

but same idea

after that use your judgement

inside 10-15 seconds maybe

[junior condor]

actually cant even go ass till i get some daggers.... which are nonexistant for me right now

[keen spruce]

I don't play outlaw, but looking at the rotation it seems much more reactive

so you at least have to use your brain depending on what traits roll

[junior condor]

i have horrible luck with outlaw.... cant seem to get any good rolls

[jagged ore]

go do warfronts until you get two of the 340 daggers

they have crit and haste

I got two in like 5 warfronts

[keen spruce]

You get a guaranteed dagger from PvP last week

got*

[thin ingot]

is there a macro i can create that uses exsang or tb if talented?

[keen spruce]

yes I'll write it for you one sec

[hollow wren]

Outlaw easier? Eh, I don't think so but I think it's closer

[keen spruce]

actually, I can't remembe the syntax off the top of my head

[royal lantern]

idk man, its not really reactive, you just reroll until you get the 2 good buffs or you get a 2x roll

[keen spruce]

i'm at work

[thin ingot]

np

[hollow wren]

It's just cast one

or cast the other

on a macro

[keen spruce]

PM me and I'll send it to you when I get home

[hollow wren]

#showtooltip
/cast Toxic Blade
/cast Exsanguinate

[thin ingot]

thats all?

[keen spruce]

I don't think that works

[hollow wren]

You can't have both talented at the same time anyway

[keen spruce]

if you're talented into exang i think that sequence just dies

but try it

[vocal dock]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[undone cairn]

so im currently new to using exsang, how should i be using it outside of the opener?

[thin ingot]

isnt like something like this?

#showtooltip [talent:6/1]A Murder of Crows; [talent:6/2]Barrage; [talent:6/3] Volley
/cast [talent:6/1]A Murder of Crows; [talent:6/2]Barrage; [talent:6/3] Volley

[jagged ore]

So for all your finishers the damage per second is the same regardless of duration, right?

[thin ingot]

so, the first number is the row i guess

and the second is the column

[hollow wren]

Are we exsang in pvp?

[keen spruce]

Refresh rupture, refresh garrote (or visa versa), exang

yeah it's something like that

I have one written up on my DK

[gentle eagle]

You should be saving your exang, for when you can vanish garrote

[hollow wren]

Are we exsang in pvp?

[gentle eagle]

with the azerite powers

[keen spruce]

I'll send it in a couple minutes

you're on the right track though

@gentle eagle you'll get an exang in between your opener and your next vanish

[gentle eagle]

i think in that case rupture takes priority

[undone cairn]

was that @ me shmoops?

oh nvm

[keen spruce]

you should refresh both before you exang

full pandemic window

ideally

there are some awkward spots

[hollow wren]

btw my macro does work if you switch talnets

Exsang in pvp or not ç-ç

[keen spruce]

gimmy a couple minutes, driving home shortly

[thin ingot]

#showtooltip [talent:6/2]Toxic Blade; [talent:6/3] Exsanguinate
/cast [talent:6/2]Toxic Blade; [talent:6/3] Exsanguinate

this works

[hollow wren]

mine works

its easier..

[keen spruce]

oh I thought you said it didn't work

does the tooltip change @hollow wren ?

#showtooltip
/cast [talent:6/2]Toxic Blade; [talent:6/3] Exsanguinate
this works

I think just this will work @thin ingot

[hollow wren]

I don't know tbh

[thin ingot]

mine does too

[hollow wren]

its doesnt show cd

but

yeah everyones should work

Now I wanna ask again, sorry for being anonying

but should we use exsang in pvp?

[spice surge]

Na, get twist the knife traits with tb

[hollow wren]

Wha-, lol ok, I thought I was meant to stack ss XD

[spice surge]

#pvp is the place to go to for that though

[supple hearth]

Tb is stronger on demand burst. Exsang might be okay in a bg or a scenario where you're just rotting

[hollow wren]

Sorry no one answered me there

[keen spruce]

Shiro I have no idea

[spice surge]

TB > 5cp envenom (with system shock) > mfd > 5cp envenom dunks kids

[keen spruce]

I haven't pvp'd since I switched to Exang

but I think with the standard PvP traits being poison focused a bit maybe TB pulls ahead?

[jagged ore]

Is there any reason I can't just put the whole opener on one macro?

I mean any reason why that would be a bad idea

[spare cloud]

Because its not always the same

[jagged ore]

What would change it?

[spare cloud]

whatever happens in a fight, lucky crits, whatever

[jagged ore]

Crits can only give 3 combo points on one mutilate right

[spare cloud]

in the end a castsequence macro just gives you more buttons to press

[jagged ore]

so no matter you're still pressing mutilate exactly twice to get 4+ combo points

[spare cloud]

Mutilate can give 2-4 cp

[spice surge]

Mutilate gives 4 if you crit both

[jagged ore]

ah

okay

if you're opening on two or more targets do you switch mutilate for fan?

[spare cloud]

read the guide

[jagged ore]

didn't say anything about that

[spare cloud]

it's in there

100%

[woven dragon]

pretty sure it's there

[jagged ore]

yes, for building

but in the opener too?

it makes sense I'm just double checking

[delicate gull]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/q5hQ8f4fxDYeTh91HsS6yp

ez reroll to fotm

god bless caches

[wary temple]

should i delay vendetta if vanish is up in 30?

[spare cloud]

depends

most of the time no

[spice surge]

How are your vanish and vendetta not lined up to begin with though

[jagged ore]

What's with the weird blue circles when you use a rupture?

or envenom

Doesn't seem very roguey

[wary temple]

dont know, feels like they dont line up from time to time

[spare cloud]

Thats on you

vanish should be up around 13 seconds after vendetta becomes ready

[rotund raft]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.

[spare cloud]

No self advertising

[jade geyser]

anyone else have melee as their highest dmg ability? I cant figure out why my garrote isnt doing more

[spare cloud]

Do you have shrouded suffocation azerite traits?

[jade geyser]

just 1

[spare cloud]

Your melee still shouldnt be above garotte even with 1

[jade geyser]

I know.....but I cant figure out why. Its never falling off

[spare cloud]

do you use then vanish mechanic properly

subterfuge

[spice surge]

You need to apply it from stealth to get the bonus, and NOT refreshing it outside of stealth afterwards

[jade geyser]

whats the order? i might be doing it wrong

[spare cloud]

read the guide

[spice surge]

Its in the guide

[jade geyser]

well i am doing that i think, just didnt know if it changed

[spare cloud]

You can always post logs

people will tell you

[frigid sleet]

does shadowmelding into garrote correctly apply the azerith buff ?

[spare cloud]

Not in raid combat

[frigid sleet]

dammit

[slow scroll]

Hey anywhere I can see which trinkets to use? ravenholdt doesn't seem to have a say in it

[gilded fossil]

do you bind your galecallers with anything?

[slow scroll]

nvm found it thx

[inner leaf]

fathom is not THAT good for ass

isn t it?

[spice surge]

Look at the trinket sims, but yes it is

[stuck shuttle]

it is

[slow scroll]

its a tiny bit better than a 340 galecallers it says

[spice surge]

Yes, but thats galecallers being OP

[slow scroll]

yeah just saying it's not bad

[spice surge]

I also cant fathom (heuheu) why raid trinkets are not getting buffed, they're so awful

[slow scroll]

ye it's really sad

[true aurora]

It upsets me too!

[jade geyser]

@spare cloud link logs in here or in DM?

[spare cloud]

I don't play rogue

idk

[slow scroll]

What ilvl will be in my cache if I did an +7 and a +8 on another char? lazy ass here 😛

[spare cloud]

google it

[jade geyser]

if I dm someone, will you look at my logs and see why my garrote is lower than it shoul dbe?

[spare cloud]

dm noobe

he's always willing to help

[potent forge]

is kings rest even possible without like mass entangle

for the first boss

[drifting hawk]

does anyone know if raidbots assumes youre in Uldir for the azerite bonus?

[spice surge]

Slow and kite or kill the adds?

[acoustic flame]

What level though?

[spice surge]

Alternativly pot n stuff to be able to burn it down faster

[acoustic flame]

Like, +7 or w.e I did, was a joke

had like 1 add spawn

[spice surge]

Should be tyrannical this week though

[acoustic flame]

Yeah it will

[potent forge]

10 kings rest

[acoustic flame]

with tyrannical?

[potent forge]

yea

[acoustic flame]

Yeah that could be tough, never did it before so I wouldn't know though lul

[spare cloud]

in theory you can kite them forever

You could just kite them around the room forever

[potent forge]

you'd have to predict where the adds would be when you drop yours

by the time the call comes out

so they are grouped

[spare cloud]

Yeah

its not a viable tactic

but you should have no problem killing them

even in a +10

[real night]

Just a question about Exsang - do you pandemic refresh your dots after using it? Or let it fall off completely?

[acoustic flame]

fall off

[tranquil dust]

exsang

or tb

in raids?

[raven void]

Should I be running 1 laser matrix and 2 shrouded suffication traits or just 3 shrouded suffications

for raiding

[pastel vault]

depends on ilvls of the gear

[raven void]

assuming same ilvl

[pastel vault]

3 SS

[jovial adder]

so hows assassination holding up vs sub?

[true ingot]

Outscaling it after the nerfs.

[hardy stirrup]

Should I snapshot during exg? or wait to fall off

[short thicket]

curious question, does it really matter if your MH is enchanted Deadly and OH Quick Nav? does MH have a better chance to proc more than OH?

[vapid lagoon]

you save second vendetta for second vanish right?

[rich olive]

@vapid lagoon yes

[vapid lagoon]

tyty

[dark sun]

with the ss bug how do you open in AOE?

[jagged ore]

How are you using Exsanguinate outside of the opener? The guide doesn't mention anything about it.

[hollow stone]

All the peer pressure in here and a 79 dps sim increase made me go exsang. Its quite fun 😄

[real night]

Yeah was thinking, do we push garrote and rupture to their max timers before exsang?

[jagged ore]

so double up on them similar to opener for max duration

on exsang CD with vanish?

and vendetta/

[chilly obsidian]

Tox blade til I die 🗡

[timber mauve]

anyone know what T22 represents on hero damage? is it a certain ilvl?

[limpid willow]

hey yo so like
fan of knives applies poisons
but why does it have a blood effect
https://i.imgur.com/ayoL8Q3.jpg

t22 means uldir bis

[timber mauve]

k

[hollow stone]

Little know fact: then knives come outa your body. Thats your blood

[chilly obsidian]

Fact

[undone cairn]

what talent do you guys take on zul

ct or pb?

[night cypress]

ct

personally

[undone cairn]

fuk

no tome gg

[opaque grotto]

LOOOOOOOOOOL

I got the MOTHER dagger on heroic

then bonus rolled and got another one

ez double 370 weapons

[cedar kelp]

has anyone looked at 3x double dose with master poisoner?

[hardy stirrup]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[undone cairn]

big dick

[stuck shuttle]

tfw ur guild kills heroic fetid too fast that u cant pop 2nd rd of CDs

so ur parse isnt 99

[undone cairn]

gg

[acoustic flame]

Can't say it's the issue that I have

[keen hound]

well that was fun

just pulled 17.6k on h fetic

fetid*

actually figuring out this exsang thing instead of TB

[true sail]

So, I just swapped from Sub to Assassination, and I have some questions in regards to Ass. With Shrouded Suffocation, is Garrote snapshotting with the additional damage? Is it important to keep Garrote rolling and not let it drop?

[undone cairn]

am i supposed to pop exsang after i just refreshed

rupture/garrote?

[deft locust]

man..

https://gyazo.com/2ea614c2d48ef44991a595dc6d0c1373

that's overall damage

for +9 freehold

Sin damage is nutty

[acoustic flame]

Yeah sin is very good atm, you can do like 17k-18k if not more probably

overall

[dusky rose]

whats the talent tree for st?

[spare cloud]

check pins

everything is in the guide

[stuck shuttle]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ARhnrX7Q6wTWq3HP#fight=18&view=rankings

lets go boyz

[keen spruce]

I'm now in the dillema

if I should reroll on world boss

for 355 SS helm

..

I only have 1 SS left

[spare cloud]

Why are you heroic ranking when you could be mythic raiding

Don't

[deft locust]

wait a minute

13.7k is a 99 parse on vectix

o_o

vectis*

oh wait

derp

[keen spruce]

lots of downtime

[deft locust]

I didn't read that right

I was thinking 99 parse as in rank 3 in the world

[true ingot]

So how is Limit going to get themselves banned this time around?

[deft locust]

🤦🏽

[keen spruce]

99 parse is top 1%

so top 3 is included in that

[spare cloud]

Parses are always class specific

except if you go to the frontpage of the rankings

[plain spruce]

do you pandemic garote with vanish on pull or let it drop

[spare cloud]

check guide for that info

[keen spruce]

If you refresh in the pandemic window you're not losing any time on the garrote

but if it's exang buffed then let it run down

[vivid umbra]

does raid bots sim for reorig array?

[plain spruce]

thankyou

[spare cloud]

its also not 100% true

[deft locust]

yeah

[spare cloud]

check guide for correct opener

[deft locust]

I'm aware of how the parsing works, I just 100% brain farted

[spare cloud]

You refresh garrote differently depending on your traits

[keen spruce]

close

[deft locust]

ye

it also lists his rank

on the link he linked

😛

[spare cloud]

Yeah class specific rank

[deft locust]

ohhh

is that you

[spare cloud]

notice how the parses are different

[keen spruce]

I just got here

[deft locust]

looks like TB and exsang are both pretty hot

[keen spruce]

i just missed the post

[stuck shuttle]

our myuthic raid is tomorrow night

so we do heroic today

[deft locust]

I hope you get

fetid chest

and mother dagger

[stuck shuttle]

i got mother dagger

not chest

[deft locust]

I meant in mythic

😛

[stuck shuttle]

😛

saving my roll

[deft locust]

ye

I rolled 3 times on H fetid, got it on last roll

[spare cloud]

Heroic rolling is not worth it if you run with a guild and get the opportunity to roll mythic

[deft locust]

I'm pure m+ this xpac

no mythic raiding as it stands for me

so unfort heroic is best I got till I snipe spots in mythic raids who need to fill 1

[spare cloud]

m+ is fun too

[deft locust]

for sure

[tough whale]

bonus on m taloc, nothing 😢

[spare cloud]

I'm praying

for 400 hammer with gem

on my warrior

tomorrow

[acoustic flame]

I'm rolling on mother

BlessRNG

[tough whale]

Im doing both, but mother is fucking us atm

getting used to lots of dmg

[acoustic flame]

i'll probably do like

mother on mythic and heroic

[tough whale]

just m+ for dagger

[acoustic flame]

or zul on heroic, forgot which had better stats

Yeah I will be doing some m+

Guess you're right

might go for taloc instead

I didn't get any dagger this week from m+ and i did like 30 though

[tulip hill]

hey y'all, im new to assassination this expansion, i was wondering, how do you aoe ? like, for m+ and such. I tried following the guide, but i feel like im missing something. Halp 😛

[acoustic flame]

Garrote garrote garrote, crimson tempest

and then spam the fan of knives and apply ruptures I think

!ss

[prisma monolith]

Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.

[acoustic flame]

there's important bug to know about ss trait

[tough whale]

^^^^

dont fuck this up or your damage is 0

[acoustic flame]

Yeah, 3 garrotes out of subterfuge

and don't reapply until they all fall off

then garrote all

you can do like garrote garrote garrote,crimson tempest, vanish, garrote, garrote ,garrote though i think

[tulip hill]

i dont have the azerite trait

[acoustic flame]

Try to get it then

it's insane

But you just want to keep dots on mobs

[tulip hill]

i was running 2212221 in my talents

[acoustic flame]

garrote, rupture, crimson tempest

[tulip hill]

should i trade poison bomb for Crimson tempest ?

[acoustic flame]

It's either crimson tempest or the hidden blades or w.e it was called

crimson is better for higher keys since u got sustained aoe

[tulip hill]

okai 😃

[acoustic flame]

You can watch seliathan on twitch to see how he plays

he's not bad

/incarnated on twitch

[tulip hill]

if i do not have the azerite trait for garotte , which ones should i use ?

i currently have 2 scent of blood

[acoustic flame]

Either sim them

or check herodamage.com

[worldly mantle]

Check herodamage or bloodmallet for traits etc.

And ive Bern running 10s With bomb and its fine

[indigo shale]

Icy Veins says Overwhelming Power is by far the best second ring azerite trait but it seems to never proc. Is it really worth it?

[tulip hill]

thanks for the help everyone ;p

[rough agate]

Should i use galecallers on cd or line it up with something

[tough whale]

Ideally with exang

1300 haste for exang > 1300 haste for nothing

[rough agate]

aight

[worldly mantle]

Dont delay it in u lose a use on IT in the long run

If*

[rough agate]

but then its like should i hold exsang for it

[vapid lagoon]

what does our rotation look like on 5+ targets?

[rough agate]

i can get 2 in vendetta cd

[jolly notch]

ok so im losing my mind. i still have yet to get an ss helmet

why did blizz have to make it where you cant get azerite gear from mythic+ end of dungeon chests. it makes no sense

[sullen robin]

Ugh I sim higher with 1x ss with two uldir azerite

[solar minnow]

blizzard make no sense 100% of the time this expac

[somber hill]

is ex sang the go to build?

[tough whale]

tb is close

just loses to ex by a decent margin in burn phases

[stuck shuttle]

ive been wrecking with exsang in this heroic run

[floral loom]

where are the wa sets?

[tough whale]

My taloc was screamingly poop with exang

mother is great

[floral loom]

i can't seem to find them

[arctic agate]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[weak oak]

is there an updated guide to rogue talents etc

[cedar kelp]

so the opening for exsang with SS on the ravenholdt guide is wrong if i read this correct?

its 3x garrotes at open

instead of garrote-rup-garrote

[severe niche]

looks like 21~% haste is the break point for exsang build https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wpgj7PZ6ktYNsH5CNQMsAm

where crit and mastery start to take over

[arctic agate]

Did you look at the multi target rota? @cedar kelp

[cedar kelp]

i only see 4 different openings on the link

[jolly notch]

Where did yall get your helm for ss and where did you get it?

[cedar kelp]

with/without SS - TB

[late niche]

So I've raided as assassination tonight and holy moly this spec has shit mobility

At least the damage was good

[tough whale]

mythic mother room 2 bugged and didnt spawn beams lmao

[severe niche]

wut

step is legit god mobility

just gota be smart with ur sprints

[late niche]

I mean compared to sub or outlaw

[severe niche]

only on zul atm

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/kiljaeden/foxynights

the spec pumps hard

heroic reclear so

[arctic agate]

No idea where you've been looking @cedar kelp says garrote, rup, garrote for me

[tough whale]

holding vanish on mythic mother for the first tank add in each room

3 garrotes isntead of 2

[fast nacelle]

is garrote fixed btw?

[tough whale]

no

[fast nacelle]

...

[mint osprey]

Lol

Pbnjustice

I once donated $5 to your stream

Like 2 years ago

[tough whale]

I remember the name LOL

[mint osprey]

We were plugging some raid

ToV

Good times pal

[tough whale]

I REMEMBER THAT

how you been?

[mint osprey]

Good good took a long time off

Now I'm back

[tough whale]

welcome back bb

[mint osprey]

Tyty

You.playing rogue main?

[tough whale]

You know it

Spriest main wasnt for me xd

[mint osprey]

Nice

[surreal lodge]

just getting back to assassin rogue, is exsanguinate really pulling ahead of toxic blades now? i dont wanna learn to use that talent now after ignoring it all of legion x.x

[vital haven]

shrouded

oops

mt

[surreal lodge]

x3 ss traits

[deft locust]

https://warcraftlogs.com

tomato

I would suggest

browsing assassin parses

both TB and exsang are doing well

[surreal lodge]

i was i see half and half mostly just wanted to ask what people think of it

[mint osprey]

Both are viable and nearly equal

[deft locust]

exsang is slightly better

for short fights

so if you are gonna smash a boss

exsang will prolly be on top

exsang will also be on top

if your ven/vanish/exsang cd's end

when the fight ends

since exsang build is more frontloaded

[tough whale]

exang = better burst, so if you manage it better during like, mother room 3 or fetid or ghuun

[deft locust]

just depends on your dps, your groups dps, the fight itself

lots of factors

[tough whale]

it will pull ahead more than just patchwerk

[deft locust]

Yep, right now I see about 35k burst on exsang

TB gets to around 27-28k

so if you can abuse a damage bonus on a boss

exsang is also better there

[tough whale]

our p3 attempt with exang had me at 60k

on mother room 3

[deft locust]

yeah, sounds about right

that damage bonus

😮

[tough whale]

juuuiiicccyyy

[deft locust]

shame we can't just run through the first two rooms

[tough whale]

our room 2 had 0 lasers

lmao

[deft locust]

o_o

just ran right through?

[tough whale]

no

they never spawned

[deft locust]

oh

wtf

[tough whale]

yeah LOL

[deft locust]

can't complain I guess

haha

[tough whale]

sad we didnt kill it that pull

[deft locust]

ah rip

[tough whale]

https://gyazo.com/f10815b181c6672df3cf367f746a7ed8

lmaooo

[indigo cradle]

Whats the approach for exanguinate on m+? Garrote 3 targets , 5cp rupture one and exanguinate ?

[tough whale]

p much

[strange python]

That feeling when you play monk the first three weeks of the xpac so you’re garbage at rogue now

[cedar kelp]

what are yalls secondary's at atm, im switching from outlaw since it got fucked hard and im not going to play brain dead snake eyes

[tough whale]

haste > agi > Crit for me

[cedar kelp]

b/c im having an issue with damage and not sure where im going wrong honestly

[surreal lodge]

thats me but i been playing outlaw for 3 weeks

[tough whale]

make sure youre not doing the ss bug

[surreal lodge]

whats the bug?

[tough whale]

whats the command again?

[strange python]

As bug?

[tough whale]

!ss

[prisma monolith]

Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.

[tough whale]

^^^^

do not do this

[cedar kelp]

ive been trying to, so its 3x garrotes and not applying another

[surreal lodge]

so that mostly applies in cases where youre cleaving right

so if i open get 3x and refresh the other 2 are gonna fall off damage?

[cedar kelp]

yeah, basically the unbuffed garrotes over write the buffed ones

[strange python]

Yes

[cedar kelp]

so let those fall

[surreal lodge]

will keep that in mind, thx

[strange python]

It’s just like dot snapshotting back in the day

[surreal lodge]

for the opener we vanish to refresh the first garrote right? i read somewhere to refresh the first ss garrote outside of vanish but that seems wrong

[cedar kelp]

so the garrotes stack though right, hence the 3x on open

[tough whale]

not even that

[strange python]

Let the empowered dot fall off

[tough whale]

if you garrote at any point on any target outside of your SS window

you remove ss

[cedar kelp]

^

[tough whale]

even if its a 4th target

[strange python]

Yep

[cedar kelp]

the original SS garrotes must fall

[strange python]

But also don’t garrote a 4th

[surreal lodge]

on single target opener we vanish to refresh the first garrote at 5-6seconds left correct?

[tough whale]

no

let first garrotes fall off

then vanish and reapply

[surreal lodge]

for single target also?

[tough whale]

yes

[arctic agate]

Reading this made me question how exsang works. Does it alter existing bleeds on target, all existing bleeds on all targets or all bleeds on target after exsang?

[surreal lodge]

dang i been doin it wrong then

[tough whale]

when you vanish you double garrote so you pandemic again

[surreal lodge]

and you double garrote on opener as well?

[strange python]

Yes

[surreal lodge]

huh i never knew that but that makes sense

to get the extra time

thx

i guess when i get less lazy itl be time to learn how to use exsang x.x

[severe niche]

hate how vendetta and vanish dont reset on boss wipe , didnt notice and screwed out of zul parse

still got 92 doe

[cedar kelp]

what secondary percents are yall at atm

[severe niche]

https://gyazo.com/5e34daa2bf7741e0c6a156c0e683f02e

like i said earlier 21% haste crit nd master over take exsang on st

so prob good to aim around 19-20

[cedar kelp]

cool, thank you

[lone junco]

weak open, but this peak was funny

[severe niche]

nice mc yo

[lone junco]

cought a ball and got a bingo

[severe niche]

this is my 100% taloc on heroic

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/bwh7gtJ6kK3TfqnW#fight=2&type=damage-done&source=4

dat burst doe

[lone junco]

yeah.

I messed up my alignment a few times tonight.

like garrote vanish. fuuuck

[severe niche]

ye

[late niche]

same lul ^

[severe niche]

all about mastering the timing of cd's

[strange python]

how do you use the exs after the opener one? on cd or do you apply double garrote when you about to use second exs?

[severe niche]

on cd like 80% of the time

with all the bosses ive done so far

which is 6/8 H atm

[late niche]

do you exsang on cd and wait the extra 15sec for vendetta and vanish?

[severe niche]

we on mithrax atm

its almost never worth saving exsang unless your last vanish garrote's wont fully tick

[strange python]

i think i might try sin today on taloc and mother and fetid at least

mainly outlaw for others

[cedar kelp]

its roughly 15-20 seconds right to get full exsang

[severe niche]

optimally 16

[tough whale]

CDs align again at around 220

thats when you should vanish vendetta exang

[severe niche]

its still not worth aligning them

if the fight is gona last the full duration of the cd'd bleeds

[tough whale]

well obviously

[strange python]

Does archive of the titans stack?

[severe niche]

yes

but reorgination array

doesnt

you only get one of those

and it 'stacks' weekly

after 3 boss kills

[strange python]

Just wondering about the agil buff

[severe niche]

ye

that one does

you can have 2

and get 400 agi

[strange python]

Nice

[severe niche]

when it ramps fully

still a shit trait for us

if you can take a lazer matrix

and 2x ss

[strange python]

Well it's only uldir pieces I got atm

Both with archive

Been unlucky with ss pieces except for a chest

[icy temple]

So opener with exs is garrote rupture garrote vendetta exs?

[tough whale]

no

garrote rupture garrote vendetta mutilate rupture exs

pandemic that shit

[icy temple]

Oh ok obv

[tough whale]

Its in the ravenholdt if you need to remind

[icy temple]

And when fhey fall off u vanish?

[tough whale]

when garrote fully falls off

vanish garrote garrote

[icy temple]

Okwill check there, ty

[tough whale]

not when its at 4s

[void raft]

whats 2nd best trait? only got 2 garrote anda bout to switch from outlaw

[civic palm]

[opaque grotto]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/9P2DyvFyWRcb9zw2vinJ81

Finally made it to that 14k

[sacred seal]

359 ilvl? wow, gz 😃

[opaque grotto]

I got the 370 MOTHER dagger

bonus rolled

got another one

[sacred seal]

yea me too, I got it yesterday, but still on 350 ilvl

I also hoped for bonus roll and get second, but no luck ... gratz to you man

[night cypress]

mama mia thats some spice

[grim wolf]

Had a r1 heroic fetid parse for all of 15 mins tonight 😂

[rough flax]

how do u guys sim yourselfs for dungeons? i did 3 targets and its telling me haste is last priority not sure i should be trusting that

i pretty much only do m+ no raiding anymore

[daring imp]

crits will make you generate more cp per fok

mastery makes garrote/ct/rupture/overall poisons go ham

[clear blaze]

guess in sims u dot all 3 targets and get enough energy reg plus crits will help build cp with fok

[safe matrix]

haste loses a lot of value in AoE

[daring imp]

and if you bleed everything you don't need energy regen since you have bleeds ticking

[safe matrix]

because you're getting a lot of energy back from your bleeds

[rough flax]

ok so the crit>mastery>vers>haste i got from my sims at 3 targets was fine then

thank you

[daring imp]

just gotta find a decent balance between dgs, 3 packs per pull seems slow*, 5~6 seems more realistic if your tank isn't a wuss

[deft patio]

Guys is the weekly chest out ?

[daring imp]

yep

on the room beside the bank on dazaralor

[deft patio]

Idk Where that is xD

Can you screenshot haha

[daring imp]

great seal

you know where it is?

[safe matrix]

!chest

[prisma monolith]

Weekly chest position:
Alliance - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKPlCI652Wo
Horde - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLjg2XCTe7U

[daring imp]

oh well ^

didn't change anything?

smart sim / quick sim?

[queen monolith]

is FoK supposed to be rng combo points?

[daring imp]

depending on crit, yea lul

@split dock not sure i'd be able to fully read those @_@"

[candid mica]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/c1u1UvFMp51GjSu6m4ErNX

14k club

[daring imp]

i consider the difference too small to be an issue

what's the margin of error people use these days for sims? 5%+/-?

less? dunno

well

rule of thumb: m+ is 3x SS no matter wut

[signal summit]

So Im a sub player who is currently Looking to play exsang , some advice ? Generally about opener and cd management, i know the rest 😃

[daring imp]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xac5HPe_-CgXJo4yUiv_LJldqLu5WjPjUq9d0wRqmIg/edit#gid=0

i don't think hectic add cleave is a good way to measure SS potential on m+, is it?

i mean, there's no resets with them

oh no you simmed patchwerk

[signal summit]

So basiclly that opener then Sync ur vendetta vanish around 2.20 and just play normally inbetween

Seems logic

[daring imp]

yea

[signal summit]

So basiclly between that just get full cp rup and Garrote up before every exsang

[nimble tartan]

ok am i rigth in thinking since if u click through this sim and seeing 2 ss 1 laser matrix simming neutral to 3ss WITHOUT the sim taking reorigination to account that i should just insta pop that in right

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/q9qkTyd7breojNyJGKDb9y

[daring imp]

@signal summit that i don't know exactly for sure, checking decent logs should be better to see which performs better*

[safe matrix]

sim error% is really low

[signal summit]

Ye Will do thanks

Omr with the god gear as always 😃

[nimble tartan]

cause the sim doesnt know that ill get another 150 haste

which is hot

ye i got lucky with some mythic+ drops

[signal summit]

👌🏻

[late niche]

does reorigination stack at all?

[nimble tartan]

i dont believe it does

but ye i was thinking of just removing 1 ss for the laser matrix probably best for st

since its already dps neutral without the haste buff

[keen meteor]

what ilv from weekly chest this week? if I done mythic 10+ last week

[signal summit]

How to properly use EP as exsang ? Always try to have 100% uptime ? Or only during exsang

380 or 385 azerite

[zenith cedar]

Struggling on trash dpps

[keen meteor]

thx!

[signal summit]

Np

[dusky fulcrum]

how the fuck do u have 366 ilvl

i've done atleast 15 m+ over 5 or higher and i lost ilvls cuz i rerolled sin lol

[signal summit]

Its just rng as always

[dusky fulcrum]

is that gear from AFTER reset or smth?

[signal summit]

Think he is us

[dusky fulcrum]

m10 ring doenst say warforged

[signal summit]

So he Had whole day yesterday to play

[dusky fulcrum]

looks like he ran a bunch of m+ after reset, there's no way he got that otherwise

then again, i cleared uldir twice and all i got was 3 cloaks 👀

[frosty oak]

is crimson tempest best for zul?

[daring imp]

@zenith cedar 2x/3x SS solves that

@frosty oak if your group lacks aoe/cleave for p1, sure but usually you aren't the one that should worry about that unless you're outlul

[surreal rivet]

somehow i just hit 20% haste

do i keep going

[void raft]

any key binding suggestions for garrote / mutilate? let me know waht you do 😃

[surreal rivet]

my garrote is bound to 5

and my mutilate is 1

[void raft]

opener on multi-target isnt awkward with 5?

[surreal rivet]

not really

i have big hands

tbh

[void raft]

big gloves then too 😉

[surreal rivet]

xD

i might get an orb weaver

[upper island]

3

[bleak river]

On a m+ trash pull of lets say 4 mobs, do you garrote three of them then CT and then exsang or wait to put rupture on all 3 first?

[severe niche]

welp the heroic full clear is done

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/kiljaeden/foxynights

ez Clap

[terse pawn]

grats on the perfs

[sullen robin]

@severe niche mines lookin the same

[severe niche]

link yo

gota compair

bigger e peen

[plain cairn]

hey guy, when lookin at wowanalyser i see my envenom buff uptime and EP uptime

how much should i aim for ?

sitting around 60-65% right now

[severe niche]

im 70%~ ep uptime atm

60$ on envenom

60%

[plain cairn]

ok ok

so i aint too bad x)

[chilly obsidian]

Is exsang recommended for m+?

[severe niche]

i exsang everything atm

just superior talent imo

everyone seems torn on it

but exsang pulls ahead at higher gear lvls

[sullen robin]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/id/35292379

[safe matrix]

it depends on your gear

[sullen robin]

havent gotten as many bosses down cause of guild being newly formed but we chillin

yeah my rogue guildie got 370 dagger

yeah no mine got it on mother

:x

😦

i got a pvp 365 but

[late niche]

man I wish blindside was baseline

[sullen robin]

i can still complain

[tough whale]

LOL

look at the very end of this graph

https://gyazo.com/379353de7f623497a010a47d26391c92

[dusky fulcrum]

Why does the ravenholdt guide say to garrote twice but here in disc i hear three garrote? D; what am i missing

[tough whale]

i went to infinity and beyond

[sullen robin]

you garrote 3 in m+

or aoe

[tawdry canyon]

are most of yall playing exsang or toxic blade for m+ and for raid? are there certain situations where u prefer one over the other?

[sullen robin]

playing exsang for both

[dusky fulcrum]

Ah ok, there was no distinction like that in the guide, thanks

[sullen robin]

because it just seems better in general

[tough whale]

exang for both

[sullen robin]

like

the burst for it is way better

and tb just doesnt seem as useful

[tawdry canyon]

i thought the same, i just saw a few rogues streaming using tb and wasnt sure if there was a situational reason

[safe matrix]

exsang is usually better on shorter fights

but it heavily depends on your gear

[dusky fulcrum]

Toxic blade cannot be better than exg without kingsbane :(

[trail otter]

is there rotation fixed in the sims so I can sim exsang vs TB?

the*

[strange python]

RIP kingsbane never forget

[dusky fulcrum]

Sim talents?

i accidently removed my kingsbane ability from my hidden actionbar

i had saved it for almost a Month

[strange python]

A nice reminder of what sin could be

[late niche]

do I wait for the second exsanguinate before using vanish

[dusky fulcrum]

🤔

Garrote
Rupture
Garrote
Vendetta
Mutilate
Rupture
Exsanguinate when talented
Mutilate till 4+ combo points
Envenom
Mutilate till 4+ combo points
Envenom
Vanish when Garrote runs out
Garrote twice

That'd be a no

[limber dew]

anyone know much about reorigination array?

[jagged ore]

How do you use Exsanguination when vanish/vendetta are not up?

[severe niche]

yup @strange python

what you need to know?

[limber dew]

does it basically make those azerite pieces bis, I am told that each week depending on bosses killed it increased the stats

[severe niche]

3 boss kill

[terse pawn]

you exsanguinate once in between vendettas i think

[limber dew]

per week?

[jagged ore]

but like

how

what does it look like

do I garrote twice even without SS up?

[limber dew]

pandemic rupture pandemic garrote = exang

[jagged ore]

which first

how am I building the combo points

[limber dew]

no given you dont. you need at least 1 ss

[jagged ore]

I mean

you won't be in stealth for it

cause vanish is down

so SS won't go off

[limber dew]

or the other way around, i pandemic garrote ( then pandemic rupture ) then exang

[jagged ore]

so only 1 combo point for garrote

[terse pawn]

opener vendetta exsang

[jagged ore]

I got that

[terse pawn]

then when exsang is back up do vanish exsang

then vendetta exsang after that

[limber dew]

during the downtime of vend vanish you just have a very stable rotation ( buff/debuff uptime )

maintain ruptures maintain garrotes, envenom uptime

[jagged ore]

vendetta without vanish = no Shroud Suffocation Grarote

[limber dew]

with elobarote planning uptime

[jagged ore]

but what am I doing with exsang

[limber dew]

your using it on CD i told you how

[terse pawn]

you can use it without SS

just make sure you have it for when you do a SS garrote though

[jagged ore]

so for example

[limber dew]

then you align the next lot of CDS of vanish/vendetta with an exang

[jagged ore]

Exsang comes up

[terse pawn]

use it unless your vendetta/vanish will be up soon

[limber dew]

befere it comes up pandemic timer your garrote, and rupture then exang

that simple

[jagged ore]

okay

[terse pawn]

what is it, 6 seconds on garrote for max pandemic?

[jagged ore]

I can kinda see why people like toxic blade more

but Exsang must be sick for like G'huun burn phase

[arctic crow]

does it work if you pandemic a SS garrot on a non SS garrot

[terse pawn]

toxic blade is more active but you get fucked if you use it at the wrong time

[soft island]

It's sick for more things but yeah

[jagged ore]

if you use non ss garrote doesn't it override the SS garrote

[arctic crow]

yes

[terse pawn]

yes

never overwrite it

[limber dew]

@jagged ore its sick on the pull

right 3 tenticles and the big add

[jagged ore]

I haven't tried it yet

I'm still practicing on dummies

I understand the opener and rotation mostly

[frosty oak]

is it worth using 4 cp on envenom or overcap with mut for 5 points?

[jagged ore]

exsang was just kind confusing me I think I got it now

[limber dew]

garrote 3 tenticles, rupture the big add, vanish double garrote the big add, garrote the small add, rupture the big add (pandemic rupture ) vendetta exang, etc

35-40k opener