Haste
3.30
Agility
2.92
Critical Strike
2.82
Mastery
2.19
Versatility
2.08
#assassination
blissful dove
yea mine is as well.. haste is just yummy 🤷
spring prawn
for aoe tho?
blissful dove
considering garrote, yea prob
spring prawn
whats ur haste at
earnest hedge
so what's the point of garoteing twice after vanish in the opener
spring prawn
im at 838 xd
blissful dove
pandemic effect
zenith oak
it lasts longer
balmy condor
ss still bugged right
frozen karma
civic palm
Will test it tomorrow after reset and see if it was fixed.
torn coyote
hello guys
quick question anout sin in m+
not sure if guide is updated
so for multi target stats crit mastery > haste vers ?
or things changed
tranquil wave
i too have a severe lack of haste
marble hemlock
@torn coyote pretty much
civic palm
@frigid lagoon if it was fixed
marble hemlock
get crit for smoother rotation on trash, mastery scales the majority of your damage best, dont dump haste/vers completely
i just stack crit and aim for fairly balanced haste/vers/mast values
primal violet
just represented assassination nicely on our guilds first g'huun https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/3pZf1jnC7gR2xkAM/#fight=last&type=damage-done
marble hemlock
since its basically haste>vers>mastery on ST and mastery>vers>haste on aoe
tranquil wave
probably running orbs or something whole time
terse pawn
5 people below the blood dk and i assume you don't have 5 different people running orbs
river citrus
!opener
warm brook
torn coyote
thanks for answers
civic palm
SIN BFA GUIDE HERE--> http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/ <-- SIN GUIDE HERE
shy kestrel
guys if you’re below the tank because of orbs, something else is going on
hollow jungle
So what’s the Assassination play on G’huun? Just pump ruptures on tentacles?
tiny vapor
I was 2nd on G'huun yesterday, and I was running orbs
People in my guild are really bad.
torn coyote
thnx
pearl steppe
is darkmoon fathom the best in slot for sin?
hazy sphinx
Bis until you get a 385 to replace it
quick ice
yeah I probably wouldn't use that much of your gold on it tbh
stark garnet
Hey fellas, is it beneficial to pool energy for Elaborate Planning? If so, how big of a deal is it?
Seems like something you always want to pool for
(I check guides on several sites and was surprised to not see it mentioned at all)
vague patrol
would you guys use laser matrix or twist the knife on sin in arena for azerite traits?
strange python
is raidbots updated for nerfs? or it showing current sims?
quick ice
updated
kindred flame
@stark garnet Envenom uptime is what you are aiming for EP comes along the way, if you are going to energy cap you can rupture or anything
strange python
hmm
civic palm
hERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
strange python
i sim 500 more as sub still 👼 @frigid lagoon sin probably better on like vectis at least
wonder how soon theyll nerf that garrote trait
wasnt in the hotfixes now
yeah mines 13350
you have a sick trinket and more haste gear/gems
stark garnet
@kindred flame got it thank you
strange python
i cba to change all the time so i just have crit gems
i dont think the raid drops any garrote traits tho
ruby idol
Fetid chest
zealous lily
yea
strange python
drops 2 good sub ones
inevit and bits pieces
ye but its still bis in st isnt it?
ruby idol
You'll see top rogues swapping between sub and sin depending on the fight and/or their job. They're gonna be close enough that you can play whichever you prefer and be at about the same level tho
zealous lily
sin i think is more flexible on mythrax
maybe zul
i played sub on mythrax last week and outlaw on zul
strange python
outlaw seems best for zek/zul/mythrax/ghuun tbh
zealous lily
but i think dotting up all the mind flay adds will be better
well subtract -5% damage and -20% from deadshot and assassin looks more attractive for those fights
zek i think outlaw will still be super strong
ruby idol
Sin with iron wire is super good on zek
zealous lily
sub is a little better than sin for me pure single target but they are close.
zealous lily
try exsang
strange python
and i think on like taloc the find weakness will be really good
yeah its like 30 dps difference
ruby idol
I see sub being the play on taloc ya
zealous lily
yeah i will prob still play sub on taloc/mother
playing sin on mother would be depressing
you would just sit there in the rooms not even mfd-eviscerating
zealous lily
doubt it
another fight where they had an idea and that idea was a bad idea but they just made it anyway
soft wave
Optimal usage of Galecaller's Boon? Use it on CD? or is it worth trying to wait a few seconds to align with exsanguinate if they're close to eachother
soft wave
1m
strange python
oh
soft wave
on galecaller
limpid willow
hey so i havent tried it yet but wouldnt SS sin in dungeons where you cant just afk aoe zzzz be really good? couldnt i start every mob pull with 3x buffed garrotes?
ruby idol
You want it to line with your 2nd vendetta/exang so on cd is probably the play
soft wave
gotcha, thanks
lilac coral
getting two imminent ruins during hero 
limpid willow
hello there
ruby idol
Sin is incredibly strong in dungeon ya. Most dungeons I think its bis, which I'm surprised by. I expected sub to just be the play always
But sin is so consistent
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
strange python
its just garrote trait really
when its 35 % of your damage
it might be a bit op
sleek iron
High level m+ (I’m talking 10+) aoe fok with deadlypoisons melt trash
strange python
i mean blade flurry replicates all your abilities
limpid willow
yeah i read it last night
still not sure if i should take poison bomb or crimson tempest
sleek iron
You’re basically kiting and aoeing at same time
restive latch
Anyone have a empowered garrote WA they could share?
limpid willow
@strange python uhh why doesnt it say that in the tooltip? thats kind of important
ruby idol
I was in the poison bomb camp for most of the week but I think ct has won be over
strange python
@limpid willow idk ask blizz
restive latch
same dad, felt pretty nice during keys today
real night
!sin
strange python
idk if its worth to use on 3
ruby idol
Just spamming 5s but had an underrot I ended with 17k overall with ct
strange python
but on 4 it is imo
ruby idol
I think that was when I officially became a fan
restive latch
what was your typical opener on packs dad? I was doing garrote x3 into ct but not sure if thats right
ruby idol
I drop a rupture before fok ct
strange python
depends on size tho
ruby idol
Too starved without the extra energy
But ya, if the pack is like 6+ ct before rup prolly good
Theres no like answer I dont think, it's all pack specific
Always 3 garrote and then from there you kinda adapt
limpid willow
https://i.imgur.com/eTAVRQS.png
i have accepted the path
though imma still totes run outlaw in a few uldir fights
is there a bispecialization role
strange python
imagine how aids its going to be
to maintain 3 specs with 370-385 azerite pieces
because respeccing is actually just not viable to do
ruby idol
Just drop outlaw 4head
ruby idol
Pad dmg btw :) I'll take 6 second silence on add tyvm
limpid willow
so fan of knives and CT both apply poisons at normal rates? 🤔
strange python
yeah pretty sure
limpid willow
yep it does
yeah it seems to be normal rate
first pic was just lucky https://i.imgur.com/hO1cN1L.png
spring prawn
i dont get it. im at 900 haste, and haste is still better then agi for AOE...
only 20% crit, 29% mastery left cuz im putting everything into haste
1k haste*
soft wave
haste shouldnt be better than agi for aoe
tranquil ermine
Toxic > Exsang regardless of what simc is saying?
ancient notch
does the reorigination array uldir buff stack
civic palm
Gets better over time IIRC.
wicked nacelle
does ashine stream?
undone cairn
!wa
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination WA's for BFA:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)
smoky bluff
lol moroes is back
spring prawn
isnt crit/mastery WAY better then haste? i dont get it
tired thistle
Was
quick ice
not anymore
tired thistle
Nto at the current point in Stats
soft wave
try simming 3-4 bosses instead of hectic add cleave
soft wave
4 bosses, i believe hectic add cleave is based off of fights like Horridon in Throne of Thunder
brittle juniper
You aren’t alone silence 🤣
spring prawn
so... would u go haste or crit mastery? xd
in my eyes mastery makes more sense, but idk
soft wave
crit/mastery for m+, haste/crit for single target
night cypress
can exsang be dodged/parried?
spring prawn
ye
icy temple
daring imp
well usually have 2 sets, 1 for raiding mainly st and other for m+ mainly crit/mastery
civic palm
Yeah that there hectic cleave, hmmm
spring prawn
i think raidbots is broke
lel
i have so much hast
and still over agi, that cant be right
daring imp
mfd ...?
spring prawn
im running vigor
daring imp
oh
soft wave
adds in hectic add cleave are not long-lived enough for you to get dots up and ticking for sustained energy returns, so haste has more value in that sim
strange python
does anyone use a garrote / rupture macro?
daring imp
well with 4 adds constantly alive you basically don't need haste because you're always capped energy if you spread stuff correctly
civic palm
MFD is better on the hectic cleave APL due to the add count and time between their spawn.
spring prawn
how long do adds "live" in the hecti add cleave sim
daring imp
40~60s 4 bosses should be better for simming a trash pack pull, maybe?
civic palm
15 seconds or so
spring prawn
ok
civic palm
limpid willow
so ive never played sin before
literally ever
i hit a training dummy and then a +5
im happy with the results
daring imp
it's great
oy how do you activate that graph
i think i deactivated mine
can't find back
limpid willow
idk details is doing it automatically. i never turned it off
spring prawn
gotta install the plugin i think
daring imp
o shit
civic palm
Yep, haha.
coral meteor
I just play meme maghar
To remind me of roll the bones
R.I.P
Should really use dice as well for the full meme experience, don't lose a lot of damage
flint zodiac
Does shadowmeld let you pop another stealth buffed garrote?
coral meteor
No
Shadowmeld in outdoor/pvp environments drops combat so you can stealth and then garrote
flint zodiac
Ah gotcha
coral meteor
but you cannot drop combat mid-fight against a boss if the rest of your group is still in combat
flint zodiac
Yeah makes sense, ty for the explanation
frosty oak
my graph only pops up after the end of the dungeon
drifting elbow
is fan of knifes, little bugged with poisons?
daring imp
bugged how
civic palm
%chance
drifting elbow
oh
civic palm
Like it says on the tooltip.
drifting elbow
i dont see it mentioning a chances
drifting elbow
okay 
fading adder
So is tb the go to right now or is exsang? Or are they close enough that it doesn’t matter what you take, it’s just preference. Or should I just sim and go from there?
safe matrix
fading adder
Thanks will do
slender hare
Mine are within 100 dps of each other, but I prefer exsang so rolling with that
It’s insane on bosses in m+ where you hero
tropic rover
Are you guys thinking sin is going to be the go to M+ spec after tomorrow?
strange python
so how long before shrouded suffocation gets nerfed
pearl meteor
Yes fiesta, all specs will still be fine tho just depends on what grp needs
arctic agate
You literally answered your question yourself
bleak river
i'm abit confused about when to use exsang in the opener? the guides in the pins don't talk about it
pearl meteor
Garrote rupture garrote vendetta mut rupture exsang
Its in the sin guide on ravenholdt
soft wave
I'm assuming 3x SS trait is required for Exsg to possibly beat out TB in single target, is that correct
fossil jewel
I'm confused as to why we rupture twice in the opener. New to sin btw :/
pearl meteor
First rupture is 3 cp 2nd is 5 so iTs longer duration on exsang
I believe 3x is required yes
soft wave
cool thanks
pearl meteor
For dungeons 3x pulls way ahead of anything
wide gale
Hi Guys I'm a Former Outlaw PLayer, I Want To be Assassination PLayer Now.
daring imp
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
strange python
so mythic plus just spam fok?
strange python
i see the top assassin rogues on raider.io using poison bomb instead of crimson tempest
daring imp
pb consistently does 3%, 4% tops on overall damage through a regular dungeon
assuming no wipes and no mindless pulling/deaths, CT can pull 8~12%
flint zodiac
FOK spreads your poison and generates more combo points than anything else, then you multidot
The combination of the poison applied by your FOK plus your dot bleed energy refund is how you get like a massive energy gen to keep FOK spamming
pearl meteor
Crimson tempest also applies them just depends
daring imp
^
tame cobalt
U dont use ct for in st right?
pearl meteor
Nop
pliant wing
yea spam FoK and rupt everything u can, btw do you think we need to garrot add too ? or just rupt ?
bleak river
when it says garrote-rupture-garrote, I take it you're waiting for the original garrote to fall off or just overwriting?
pearl meteor
Opener on 3+ adds in to triple garrote out of stealth
Try to maintain best u can after that
Over writing
daring imp
@bleak river that's for single target
you apply garrote, rupture, then when subterfuge is almost ending, apply garrote again to extend
pearl meteor
2 targets garrote rupture garrote rupture, 3 targets triple garrote ct
nimble gulch
wait i just watched a video are we the only rogue specc that wont get a nerf
hexed root
really dumb question
is there a reason we use deadly and quick navigation enchants?
and not double quick?
or am i just bad?
daring imp
@nimble gulch yea why
pearl meteor
Cant have double quick buff
hexed root
gotcha thats what i thought, but wasn't seeing anything in the tooltip saying otherwise online
nimble gulch
😅i thought they would nerf ss
pearl meteor
Yea idk it technically can proc more? But still not worth
vital crater
um
daring imp
nah ss mainly decent for m+
balmy cradle
they should fix ss :/
daring imp
better traits for raiding are out there
nimble gulch
😂😂 now probably 60% of sub rogues will play assa
vital crater
crimson tempest and just rupture all mobs?
pearl meteor
3+ targets = garrote x3, crimson tempest, fok rupture all
daring imp
@vital crater if youo got 3x SS you garrote 3x out of subterfuge first, then ct/rupture all mobs
pearl meteor
Maintain garrote as it falls off best as possible
balmy cradle
but only after the empowered fall off right? the bug still exist no?
wicked nacelle
bug still there
pearl meteor
Mhm
vital crater
i only have 2ss sadly lol
daring imp
well it should be the same
vital crater
still need to look for the head
daring imp
just not as stronk as 3x
vital crater
that gives ss
wicked nacelle
if theres a priority mob you can 3x garrote, rupture, exang priority, then fok crimson
pearl meteor
2 ss still 3x garrote
wicked nacelle
thats pretty good too
pearl meteor
I wld still ct first personally
keen cradle
@vital crater the head is from shrine
balmy cradle
3 ss traits with exsang build gives crazy burst
ebon sedge
What’s nameplates you guys use to track your dots? Any specific ones for rogue?
balmy cradle
standard elvui 😄
pearl meteor
Threat plates
ebon sedge
Threat plates > tidy plates?
pearl meteor
Preference
ebon sedge
Cool
balmy cradle
can someone explain me how the trinket dead-eye spyglass works? if i hit 3 mobs and 2 trigger the effect, do i get 2 stacks of 5 or 2x 1 stack of 5?
dont have the trinket so i cant test
edgy latch
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
edgy latch
still no fix? 😦
pearl meteor
Still no fix
obtuse island
Sorry if this is a really stupid question.. but don’t you 3x Garrote the same target with SS? If so, why? I’m looking at switching, and never played Sin, sorry for the noob question
Do you *
pearl meteor
No
In st you garrote rupture garrote for your opener, 3x combo points from them, more dmg less energy
obtuse island
Ah, that makes sense
pearl meteor
Also extends duration of first for more dmg
wide gale
why garrotee again?
obtuse island
And say if it’s AoE.. just Garrote 3 separate mobs?
pearl meteor
Yes on 3+ mobs
obtuse island
Gotcha, thanks!
pearl meteor
Garrote again to refresh duration while still having subterfuge dmg buff
obtuse island
Perfect, cheers
arctic agate
It's not only refreshing duration but extending
obtuse island
One last question... how are you using Exsanguinate outside of your opener? On CD when a fresh Garrote and Rupture have been applied?
obtuse island
Alright, thanks, think I’ve got all I need to know, just need to put it into practice
pearl meteor
Np gl
pearl meteor
Depends on gear
strange python
i'll have to check mine
pearl meteor
Mine is like 50dps diff
strange python
k
pearl meteor
Not sure exactly on break point.
strange python
kind of dumb that garrote is 35% of overall dmg
if they touch the trait
this spec is done for
pearl meteor
Yup
strange python
which is scary
pearl meteor
Always have a backup spec with rogues lmao
pearl meteor
Yea i have to have all 3 prepared
pastel wasp
It’s kinda frustrating though
One week this nerf
Next week another spec nerf
plain cairn
I only have 340 weap for outlaw compared to 365/355 daggers..... thats my problem haha
pastel wasp
Prob stick to one spec even after nerf now
arctic agate
Not too frustrating if you are prepared to play different specs for different scenarios
pearl meteor
I honestly dont see them touching the specs after mythic starts unless something is bugged
arctic agate
Really the only thing that's is annoying is to remember to adjust loot spec to the boss you are fighting
smoky niche
Sticking to Outlaw and Sin because Sub is confusing as hell to me.
pearl meteor
Fair enough
pearl meteor
Sin you pool alot
smoky niche
I played sin throughout legion, so it's second nature
arctic agate
Sub is the true rogue life, but currently really enjoy assa
pearl meteor
Im a sub main but sin going to b best for alot of prog i think.
edgy latch
i think its hilarious u kids talking shit about sub. u wouldnt say this shit to him at lan, hes jacked. not only that but it wears the freshest clothes, eats at the chillest restaurants and hangs out with the hottest dudes. yall are pathetic lol
pearl meteor
So ive been doing that past few days
pastel wasp
Lol
pearl meteor
Sin is rly fun in certain dungeons.
strange python
i feel like i do more dps as sub in mythic plus
pearl meteor
Dmg in kings rest is dumb
arctic agate
I have the same feeling for now @pearl meteor seems their eyes are all on sub and outlaw, while assa moves below the radar
pearl meteor
I did 17.8k overall in my last kr
Na not the oozes
Most pulls are 3x targets
So op for triple ss
pastel wasp
Sin will be back up on the radar soon
strange python
its annoying how i have to respec my azerith tho
smoky niche
SS = ?
arctic agate
That is annoying? Be happy that is a thing
pastel wasp
Sub is fun though
arctic agate
Imagine you can't reset your traits
strange python
well its better then the legion shit
smoky niche
Ahh. Haven't been lucky enough to get gear with that trait
pearl meteor
🤷 my guild did all leather runs etc first week so we cld get azerite needed
Have all 3 specs in diff azerite pieces
undone cairn
Nice guild
edgy latch
you couldnt trade azerite for the first 2 weeks though
frail gate
how we feeling about the champs of azeroth chest vs 340 deathsnap?
pearl meteor
Sucks
undone cairn
Pls gaben
pearl meteor
😃
frail gate
that ranking site says the coa chest is better but... ss
undone cairn
Let me open a 375 SS trait tomorrow
pearl meteor
Depends i guess
pearl meteor
I have 370 azeritr from heroic and still use 340 ss in dungeons
undone cairn
Have you?
unkempt pond
yea, it's karma for screwing me over this far in bfa
pastel wasp
I thought chest was capped at 370
undone cairn
It's actually so lame I can't even open my weekly chest until 9 pm cause I'm at school all day
Nah it's 385
pearl meteor
380 normal 385 azerite
pastel wasp
Oh
smoky niche
Is there a database for BiS gear for each spec?
undone cairn
If you did a 10
edgy latch
isnt it 3x 385 pieces?
pearl meteor
1-3
edgy latch
oh shi
pearl meteor
U have a chance
undone cairn
Wait it's a chance of 1-3
pearl meteor
Base ilvl is 380
edgy latch
my guild is selling +10 boosts for 2mil
undone cairn
I already know it
edgy latch
its op
smoky niche
2mil!? 💀
pastel wasp
Is that in time ronge? Lol
edgy latch
nah
undone cairn
How do people even set that up
edgy latch
but people are greedy rn
pearl meteor
Grp finder / trade
undone cairn
Ic
edgy latch
"alright then!"
undone cairn
lol
undone cairn
The highest I was able to do was a 7 key
smoky niche
I'll give you all my 50k @ronge 😘
arctic agate
I thought selling through group finder is kinda prohibited now
edgy latch
it is
velvet kernel
Ok so do i always need 4 cp for envenom ?
undone cairn
Ya
undone cairn
4+
mossy olive
Got a 355 Leech Loyalties ring.
smoky niche
Is rupture okay at 4 too?
velvet kernel
so i guess im always going for 4 basically to keep up ep?
pearl meteor
5cp b4 exsang
undone cairn
Ya
unkempt pond
3x ss and exsang is so cute
unkempt pond
meh, we still have toolkit
proven ice
Sin is untouched tho
pearl meteor
Sub is still good and so is outlaw
undone cairn
Yeah but I'm assuming a lot of others are coming in from other specs
pearl meteor
They just brought them down closer to sin
undone cairn
Trying out sin
proven ice
I did because I don't want to pve and pvp in different specs
undone cairn
After nerfs
proven ice
Not because of the 5% nerfs
safe wraith
<- outlaw rogue who is switching to sin because i would need to get another set of azerite traits to keep playing outlaw anyways
coral meteor
anyone know how to sim maghar on raidbots?
oblique pendant
U N D E A D P R I D E
pearl meteor
B a blood elf 😃
coral meteor
??
pearl meteor
Yikes
hazy dune
dumb question but can someone give me a quick rundown on sin talents?
unkempt pond
wowsers
coral meteor
I'm asking because I'm already Maghar
but keep simming as Orc because I can't get maghar to work
the simc input doesnt work
oblique pendant
simming races in 2k18 x(D)
arctic agate
You probably have better luck using actual simc rather than raidbots
oblique pendant
relative difference between races is so small you'd rather not see that on meters
coral meteor
Well yeah considering Maghar shits out secondaries, but Orc shits out AP
I'm interested to know if it makes any weights difference
jovial kite
@oblique pendant get with the times swigga
theres actually around 2% variance between best and worst race
🤷
velvet kernel
is there a big diff between say 11% and 16% haste?
oblique pendant
changing races doesn't make u skilled and topping the meters tho
jovial kite
changing races from goblin to troll gives you 2% more dps
wide gale
Really?
pearl meteor
Mhm
oblique pendant
like you would notice that xD
safe wraith
16% is about a 45% difference from 11% i think
oblique pendant
bruh srsly
hazy dune
@pearl meteor you run iron wire?
jovial kite
you definitely notice it
jovial kite
its not like haste isnt the bis stat for sin
pearl meteor
Raid is w.e
jovial kite
its not like it works really well with exsang
pearl meteor
Its mostly for the tank tho @hazy dune
safe wraith
Right now toxic blade is simming slightly higher than exsang for me, but I'm at 2 ss traits. Would the 3rd trait push it over?
hazy dune
@pearl meteor what about tb or exsan
pearl meteor
Depends on ur haste
hazy dune
only 14 rn
pearl meteor
Exsang has a much higher value of haste even tho its bis for both
Exsang better for dungeons but raid its pref
hazy dune
thanks for the help bro appreciate it
pearl meteor
Np
tacit wing
!talents
unkempt pond
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
arctic agate
Kind of depends on your opponents. But creeping venom and deadly brew feel good.
proven ice
1233121
deadly brew, system shock, creeping venom
sinful parcel
Anyone know of an addon/WA to track Sharpned Blade easier?
arctic agate
Make a WA for it
pliant wing
sinful parcel
Thankyou man
strange python
guys after the initial 3 garrotes on trash
do we apply rupture with the 5 combo
or ct
pearl meteor
Ct
stiff leaf
Whats ct?
unkempt pond
crimson tempest
vestal wren
ashine is streaming, you could just watch him 😉 (not atm)
pearl meteor
Ct loses value the higher u go
edgy latch
whats his twitch?
pearl meteor
10 or lower go ct
unkempt pond
/ashinee
limpid willow
do you mean like m+ or amount of targets?
limpid willow
because it seems like poison bomb could still be handy if your group lacks boss damage
is that a good assumption?
gleaming kelp
Ashine was specced into CT for freehold 16 i think
tiny vapor
Ashine was using CT on Freehold +16, how does it loses value ?
proven ice
Isn't CT better than envenom on 2 target?
pearl meteor
Depends on ur st for bosses in ur gro grou
Any fort week i wld run ct
100% of the time
Dont think so mercer
Doesnt do much
gleaming kelp
True that in Tyrannical you may want the extra dps in ST from Poison Bomb
pearl meteor
Just depends on grp rly
proven ice
63% ap vs 80% ap?
limpid willow
is that adding in the bonus chance to reapply poisons?
because im pretty sure the envenom buff applies to CT and shuriken toss poison application right
proven ice
no
mortal warren
"grab poison bomb for single target on tyranical weeks" is that what you imply? I mean poison bomb is such a rng clownfiesta
tiny vapor
Depends on what your group needs anyway
gleaming kelp
Well if my comp have enough cleave / burst aoe I won't be speccing CT
mortal warren
hmm tbh even if you're playing in a heave cleave group its worth to compare direct runs with ct and poison bomb to know what deals more overall dmg.
pearl meteor
Overall ct will be more most of the time no matter grp comp.
proven ice
Yeah, I think you're right about 2 target skipping ct.
pearl meteor
On dungeons with little trash or trash with 1 main guy and smaller ho adds
mortal warren
I mean even in a tyranical week it can happen that poison bomb deals little to no dmg cus of rng to bosses and you would be better off killing trash faster
mortal warren
on dungeons with little trash and one main guy you'll want play sub tbh
proven ice
poison bomb is what, 1.75%AP damage per combo point spent?
proven ice
44 * .04
daring imp
[5:19 AM] Mousha: True that in Tyrannical you may want the extra dps in ST from Poison Bomb
"extra"
seriously think not worth it with how pb is now
barely a difference at all
with 1 main guy and smaller adds per pack your tank should be pulling more
fallow sky
PB is not worth it with Sang/Necrotic because tanks have to kite a lot
daring imp
the only reason to pick pb over ct is if you really don't like the ct gameplay because even with a slow tank it's much easier to do more damage with ct than pb
soft wave
is there any way to track exsanguinate empowered rupture/garrotes in weakauras so i dont accidentally overwrite?
daring imp
@soft wave i saw some weakaura about it a few days ago dunno which one tho
@frigid lagoon also there's many runs that aren't being recorded on raider io. leaderboard on blizz side is kinda fucked up or something
vestal wren
you can just look at the vod's https://www.twitch.tv/ashinee/videos/all
arctic agate
Isn't it exsanguinate a debuff on the target that accelerates the bleed ticks on the target, or is that just bad wording and it actually changes the bleeds?
-it
soft wave
it alters the bleed, i dont see an exsanguinate debuff
arctic agate
So it's shitty wording again
next summit
Here is a question for you: Is stacking SS more important than simming? I keep seeing top logs and others stacking SS, but my gear sims higher with other pieces, even with equal ilvl. Just wondering if sims take into account this?
daring imp
@next summit m+ or raiding?
woven bane
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
woven bane
Ffs how long do they need to fix this
exotic frigate
They'll nerf the trait before they fix it lol
woven bane
Probably
soft wave
careful what you wish for, odds are they'll "accidentally" nerf SS during the fix
cold meteor
The bug is on multi target right ?
dapper moat
Question about the rotation. Why it says that when u open from stealth with garrotte, you then cast right after rupture, and then your second garrotte. I am not undestanding why that rupture between the garrottes, as u should be low on combo point at that point if not specced with mark of death talent? Might have misunderstood something there. Why not go with garrotte,garrotte,mutilate,rupture? The gyide i am refering is the ravenholt one wit at least one ss talent and single mob. Ty all 😊
daring imp
shrouded suffocation makes garrote give 3 cp
so on singlet arget you garrote (3cp) > rupture (0cp) > garrote (3cp) to extend the already empowered garrote to its maximum duration
no cp overcap
nimble gulch
isnt garrot 2 cp
dapper moat
Aah nice ofc
nimble gulch
😄 ok nvm then
but wouldnt that be bad cause rup would have less time then with 5cp
i mean overcaping one cp is barly noticeable
daring imp
the point is having the garrote up for as long as possible
rigid pewter
i just switched to sin for the first time after outlaw and have no daggers whats a quick way to get some
daring imp
@rigid pewter pvp reward maybe?
rigid pewter
hmm
crimson basin
Mythic dungeons?
nimble gulch
well with garrote garrot rup it will be as long as garote rup garrote
crimson basin
Mother have a nice dagger also
daring imp
garrote garrote rup lasts less, specially if you try to minmax and cast garrote on the very last second of subterfuge
rigid pewter
ahh ok
daring imp
tho the difference shouldn't be noticeable
daring imp
garrote (18s) > garrote ( 17s+pandemic = 23.4s) > rupture ( garrote 22.4s)
vs.
garrote (18s) >rupture (garrote 17s) > garrote (23.4s)
no clue if that extra sec gives an extra tick or not tho
safe root
3x is sexy
nimble gulch
yeah but then u have less time on rup since u only used 3 cp
safe root
finished the first freehold+5 boss with 25k on meters
worn mango
does the garrote bug happen when you put up and 4th garrote or when you put up a garrote outside of Subterfuge when you have empowered garrotes already up?
severe hemlock
Fwiw the 2 gcds after the 2nd garrote are muti rupture
So you get full rupture full garrote then hit exsanf
crimson basin
Outside or subterfuge
severe hemlock
Exsang*
worn mango
ty @crimson basin, thats what i thought
daring imp
you need to check sim's apl to see exactly why, but i can only assume it's because the extra overcapped cp and the lack of a rupture casted 1s early would hurt the vendetta window burst somehow?
that's too minmax to be an issue
crimson basin
3cp rupture helps to have 100% uptime on EP I guess
daring imp
if you play DS tho you might have a point, or not, not sure
^^^that too
ep 100% up during empowered garrotes is likely a must
i do that atleast
nimble gulch
XD hm confusing
i guess ill stay with the garrote garote rup since for some reason i get like 5k more dps
daring imp
5k?
nimble gulch
yeah since i dont have to refresh rupture so early and have cp and energie for envenom to fill in
delicate root
Garrote, rup, garrote sets up for pandemic rupture for exsang tho
kind stump
But arent you supposed to mutilate and rupture after the second garrote to get pandemic rupture anyways
daring imp
a quick way to solve this would be to check the top performers on wlogs too
nimble gulch
well dont matter cause more cp just makes the dot long not higher dmg
delicate root
Btw you should try exsang, it's great 😅
safe root
@nimble gulch thats exacly what you awnt
nimble gulch
hmm ill try it later
safe root
longer dot damage for a longer exsang
the opener is all about setting up a max timed exsang
delicate root
He just said he's not playing exsang
nimble gulch
yeah but why waste cp and energie on a early refrsh of rupture if u can have a line up dot with garrote so u have place to fit in envenoms
safe root
you want exsang off cd asap also
stuck oyster
should exsang sim more dps on 5min flickwerk or is it only for m+ trash ?
nimble gulch
XD i dont play exsang i playTB
severe hemlock
Fits more rupture ticks into vendetta.
nimble gulch
@safe root
daring imp
heck if i know, ep uptime/no cp overcap/energy from rupture ticking early perhaps, or not
hot flume
But do we use exsang on CD like toxic blades on a pure ST fight ?
nimble gulch
u use exsang after ur bleed dots
fallow sky
Anyone tried exsang in m+?
delicate root
Yes. It's good
hot flume
So whenever it's up, refresh bleeds and exsang ?
nimble gulch
@safe root all good but ill give it a try later
signal summit
Is exsang better than TB atm? Sry havnt incestens time into assa yet
fallow sky
I prefer TB due to shorter CD and mobs won’t live long enough even on 7-9 keys
delicate root
Think of TB as a rotation skill, exsang as a dps cooldown
nimble gulch
i mean burst wise is exsang the top one
delicate root
@fallow sky they certainly do live long enough, esp with fortified
nimble gulch
but TB is a good fitment into rotation
fallow sky
@delicate root with outlul and arms not so much 😂
Also if u play with exsang do you still garrote 3 targets? Or just 2 bc of pandemic
daring imp
i miss old blade flurry
safe root
i burst quite high on exsang, my logs aren't the best and i fucked up a fair bit but this is what my mother looked like https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/A7GDzTmcBMkvjPFK#fight=5&type=damage-done&source=24
as compraed to TB
delicate root
Well obviously on the packs where outlaw and arms shine, exsang isn't going to. ie low hp large packs
pine torrent
I use sharpened blades
strange python
for fights like zekvoz / zul where there is high aoe but things die fast, what is my go-to rotation
magic plaza
what Exsang means guy ?
pine torrent
Its a trait
halcyon jolt
but how do you enter that in the rotation xD
pine torrent
45sec cooldown
delicate root
It's a talent in your talent tree
pine torrent
And all bleeds go away double speed
tropic hull
exsang gives amazing burst
magic plaza
ok
tropic hull
if you have 3 SS
pine torrent
Does SS deal the damage per tick or total?
tropic hull
per tick
safe root
i was wondering about that also @strange python i personally switch to outlaw for zul, but im wondering if its worth opening with 3x garrote on 3 adds, vanishing and then applying around 3 garrotes then continue normal rotation once adds cleared
pine torrent
Wtf
safe root
but i'm not sure if the adds will live long enough on the initial pull
pine torrent
You can use garrote 4 times
safe root
to make the garrotes worht while
pine torrent
1 without stealth buff
delicate root
SS is bugged tho
pine torrent
But 3 with
delicate root
So don't do that
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
tropic hull
SS bugged yes
safe root
but yes, in an ideal world without that bug you're right 4 would be better before vanish
pine torrent
I see
strange python
hmm ok, i might try get some weapons that arnt daggers for those fights if outlaw will be better off
pine torrent
I dont use SS due to not getting any
safe root
but doubt the adds on hc live long enough, maye mythic ?
strange python
i was considering just bursting the bigger targets and using the small stuff for FoK only
wide gale
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
tropic hull
i sim exang build and my stats weight is haste>agility>crit>etc
wide gale
Wtf
safe root
in hc that might be the approach i take if i decide to try assas instead of outlaw again Hex, full bleeds on the crusher, hexdrinker and zul while fok the crawgs
pine torrent
How much haste dp you have
tropic hull
17%
pine torrent
And what ilvl is your weapon
strange python
yea ash i will give that a shot next time, cheers
pine torrent
Hmm not sure why haste is worth that much
arctic agate
Bleed ticks
safe root
but higher than agi ?
magic plaza
so bassicaly , is Assa best rogue spec overall atm ?
waxen tide
is the headpiece with SS only from Shrine lol?
safe root
can't remember where i got my headfrom, but i got lucky in hc this week and got the 370 SS chest
wide gale
I have x3 Fan Of Knifes Traits , Is it Any good Guys ?
pine torrent
For aoe maybe
worldly seal
The legendary Benz
coral meteor
God bless
worldly seal
You guys are going to be enlightened
Benz is ace up your sleeve the best
@wide gale
safe root
ah yeah i remember him from outlaw chan
wide gale
I Want To Play Assasination now
tiny vapor
Ss chest is Fetid
wide gale
OutLaw Feels Weak
safe root
wait till tomorrow for deadeye nerfs then it'llf feel even weaker :P
worldly seal
Benz I think you’d make a great assassin
coral meteor
stack benz up your sleeve traits
merry orbit
you are plaing dungeons with exa and poison bomb or crimson tempest ?
wide gale
Lottie You Are Cute
worldly seal
Damn he’s flirting with you
safe root
i normally play with another outlaw rogue or havoc dh, so most of time i just stick with exa and PB instead of CT on majority of dungeons
as they blow trash up
jaunty arrow
Dunno but ct is goodh
safe root
but ya depends, i switch between em quite often for m+
jaunty arrow
Still with necro u need kite ads atc so ct is better, but its my opinion
safe root
cool, oh yeah if you run assas on mythrax try not to use crippling posion, your raid will get angry at you when getting them out of cc balls :P
safe root
yeah i sim better with vigor, plus it feels nicer to play for me personally
jaunty arrow
We use Hunter and dk grip for myhtrax
safe root
nice, yeah we normally are priest heavy and only 1 dk 1 hunter so leap of faith is great there
ashen lagoon
After the nerf what spec is now taking the lead you guys think?
tropic hull
engr enchant can work too
jaunty arrow
Sub i guess
safe root
has the US guys got the class tuning yet?
ashen lagoon
@jaunty arrow sub i see. Should farm for that spec and try it out. But in M+ I Cant do aoe whit it
hot flume
Does Crimson tempest work with exsang ?
delicate root
Yes
hot flume
Ok
tropic hull
for me crimson tempest feels so bad
somber wyvern
hot flume
SIn high m + is it worth applying your bleed on bunch of adds and exsang or just CT and exsang directly ?
delicate root
Exsang just CT on its own? That seems like a bad idea 😅
When garrote is so insane
safe root
depending on numbre of adds, i bleed them all for that dope energy regen and envenom spam, but odn't like CT can't say, but ya i wouldn't exsang on its own i would do it on a fully bled target which won't die before the exsang'd bleeds fall off
delicate root
Also I get the impression you think exsang is aoe
hot flume
It doesn't buff ALL your bleeds ? Just the current target ?
delicate root
It says so directly in the tooltip
magic plaza
so can anyone explain bassicaly , when do i use Exsang ?
safe root
^
delicate root
Also it's not a buff to bleeds. It just makes them tick faster
jaunty arrow
Better with garotte from stealth
safe root
the idea is to make exsang'd bleeds to last as long as possible, that is why you get max duration on your garrote/rupture
jaunty arrow
Its like bleed burst 
hot flume
Yeah yeah got that point
safe root
yeah max duration garrote when buffed via subterfuge alongside max duration rupture is crazy damage
hot flume
Thought it would work on all applied bleeds, I was wrong
dim sentinel
Hello anyonw has a good addon to track BiS dor assassiantion?
tropic hull
wa
jagged elk
hey guys!
i got a quick question:
how important is it still to cast at least 2 envenom spells during toxic blade duration? i usually got to reapply my rupture inside that windows and can only use 1 envenom.
greetings
jaunty arrow
Just use tb on cd
jagged elk
@jaunty arrow i do mate, but thats not my actual question
jaunty arrow
Ofc u can hold cd but its not that worth
fair hill
@ @hot flume it does work on all applied bleeds, for instance KS bleed if talented
jaunty arrow
Cd is low so w/e ofc more envenom into tb is better
safe root
i would think re-applying your rupture will trump an envenom in the TB window, but i don't play TB so take with pinch of salt
(assuming your rupture has dropped)
pliant roost
Is there a way to know what mobs can/can't be stunned in raids/m+?
fair hill
Priority is not letting rupt expire so ofc > rupt 》 env if rupt is almost gone in any situation ( unless the target is almost dead then by all means go for Env )
jagged elk
@safe root i have two options:
#1: applying two casts of envenom, but rupture runs out and i apply it later on
#2: applying only one cast of enveom and refresh rupture too while TB
safe root
i'd personalyl go #2, you want your ruptue up close to 100% uptime, the dmg plus energy regen is great
lilac fern
Hey guys, In big aoe pulls should I just after the 3 empowered garrotes start spamming fok and rupture on any mob that I can or should I just spam Fok /TB / Envenom for example after 3 ruptures applied to mobs?
safe root
darkstalker explained it best above
@jagged elk
if the adds will live long enough you could do 3x garrotes vanish another 3x garrotes for 6x empowered garrotes
jaunty arrow
Bleed all than envenom 
jagged elk
ok ty very much guys!!
lilac fern
Allright, thanks.
jaunty arrow
3x garotte coz insane dmg + ct + fok for cp on rup atc
And enjoy your insane garotte dmg
lilac fern
Is Poison Bomb not worth, because I see for example Fragnance running it?
lilac fern
I have not tried CT, but I honestly should try that aswell..
untold current
Hi all, cant seem to find the logic to garrote with shrouded suff beyond the opener. Why do we cast multiple garrotes beyond refreshing debuff and when do we do this?
jaunty arrow
I like ct more coz necro kite for example and sanguin
low nymph
I don't understand why you do Garrote -> Rupture -> Garrote. I thought the point of Garrote is that it applies a DoT? Why would I reapply the DoT when I just applied it in the opener?
nimble hazel
For the exsang opener? You want the highest duration garrote before you cast exsang
nimble hazel
And sitting on exsang too long is worse than clipping
nimble gulch
whats best enchant ments and gems for assa
nimble tartan
so my laser matrix only sims 40 dps lower than my 3rd shrouded suffocation with exsang, the sims dont take into account reorgination array right? so id get 75 haste on top of that thinking its actually better than the 3rd 🤔
radiant shoal
you need to garrot multiple time for pandemic
chilly socket
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
jaunty arrow
@nimble tartan u need atleast 1 ss
nimble tartan
ye
strange python
@low nymph so the opener breakdown. Empowered garrote, rupture(triggers 2nd blees effect and elaborate planning damage buff) 2nd garrote still inside subterfuge window gives thr pandemic effect (a longer than baseline empowered garrote duration plus thr additional tick between the rupture and reapplication) you then vendetta to give the next damage buff mutilate and 5 cp rupture for maximum panemdic timer and hit exang
strange python
Garrote will fall off and you vanish garrote twice for max empoweres garrote duration again. And then when rupture falls off you re apply rupture
rough knoll
What I was curious about
strange python
You dont ever overlap the empoweres garrotea wait for the last tick to fall off
rough knoll
You know when vanish and vendetta are coming off cd
Do you want to get a pandemic'd rupture too?
So rupture before vanish, then vanish g g r vendetta exsang
Or?
What does the apl do
strange python
@rough knoll i always ensure i have both at pandemic. Its easy with ss you vanish when rupture is on 9-10 seconds, garrore garrote rupture due to global cds will drop to close to 6 seconds. Thr garrote duration prior to vanish is irrelevant unless on multi targets
rough knoll
Okay so try to cast a rupture when?
To make it around 9-10 seconds left
How long left on vendetta roughly
strange python
Garrotes should be used at 9-10. As it takes almost 3 seconds to use the subetrfuge window up