if i want a good car i dont have to be able to build it
#assassination
prime quail
what pvp talents you guys are using?
gilded oak
if you want it for free, yes
mental lava
if you are all using those crappy wa's its just sad
wheat zealot
If you want your own custom fit to your liking, make it yourself lol.
Not hard at all
strange python
or just play without a weakaura, its additional anyway
brisk forge
Or pick wa:s from diff creaters go make it work for you
mental lava
thats what you all did right?
made your own thats why youre sharing them right
right
strange python
yea everyone of us did that
mental lava
sure
brisk forge
W/o wa isnt that optimal when you Wang sweet deeps IMO
wheat zealot
mental lava
then why dont you share what you created
strange python
i have my own custom made wa that i spent 300h on but im not going to share it
unkempt gulch
@mental lava the website wago.io has more than what is shared in here, go have a look
wheat zealot
Bc i created it, i dont need to share it your picky ass
unkempt gulch
idk what you're looking for, go look you lazy bum
wheat zealot
^^^
crimson swift
because i did it only for me and dont think that other will find it as useful as i do
brisk forge
Noone can force anyone go share lol
sinful lotus
@opaque grotto Do you use TB or XSang?
opaque grotto
I’ll send you my WAs when I get home if you remind me
wheat zealot
He just wants to be spoon fed guys
opaque grotto
Exsang
crude cradle
Dodger just go look up luxthos in YouTube and he even has another video to help you customize his WA to fit you if you want little changes
mental lava
@crude cradle i will thanks
sinful lotus
@opaque grotto For Raids and Mythic+?
somber wyvern
whats the point of subterfurge?
opaque grotto
For all content yes
sinful lotus
ok thank you!
opaque grotto
@somber wyvern for your garrote to do more dmg?
And you can put it on multiple targets?
mental lava
@somber wyvern it boosts your garrote damage on opener and burst after you vanish
somber wyvern
so its only to use one ability?
opaque grotto
Most talents are just one ability...
somber wyvern
yeye just doublechecking
crimson swift
also it is to use one ability that does 20-30% of your dmg if you have the talent
calm barn
haste keeps going down, RIP
stiff grail
agonizing poison?
wheat zealot
AP made it agonizing to switch targets lul
wooden island
toxic blades or exang?
idle nova
in pvp what poison weapon need to use?
brisk forge
@wooden island sim yourself👌
bright badger
so SS doesn't stack? got 2 ss pieces equipped now still just 3 cp on garrotes
fallen sandal
does garrote cast not from stealth still deal upgraded damages with SS ?
royal lantern
dmg from traits stack, utility effects like more combo points dont
royal lantern
5 combo points with 1 garrote would be op as hell lol
fallen sandal
if i ask it's bc im not english native speaker maybe ?
brisk forge
NO need for caps
bright badger
Oh i see thanks
fallen sandal
idiot
royal lantern
the trait says garrote cast from stealth, ofc it only works in stealth
fallen sandal
i got the game in english for wa etc ?
i mean what am i even talking with you lmao
if you cant just asnwer a simple a question dont talk on that discord
opaque grotto
You seem fluent enough to read the word “stealth”
fallen sandal
ofc im fluent enought where is the problem to have other view ?
daring imp
chill boyz
fallen sandal
to be like "sure" N
soft island
! Ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
delicate root
yeah, what if there's some "alternative facts"?
opaque grotto
LMAO what
crimson swift
i mean, some tooltips actually spew some bs, gotta give him at least that
opaque grotto
Examples?
soft island
Why do you type lmao in caps if ur clearly upset? Don't type at all please @opaque grotto if you are like this. For everything else is mastercard. And 
opaque grotto
I’m not even sure what you’re trying to say there, but okay
soft island
Let someone else answer calmly maybe
opaque grotto
I say saying “lmao” to the alternative facts comment
brisk forge
That you attitude isnt the best atm
delicate root
alternative facts is a meme yo
coarse slate
MY LIFE IS A MEME 
hardy anchor
Anyone here use KUI nameplates and know how to make DOTs have that spiral countdown?
soft island
Sorry. Standart bliz ui ftw
amber arrow
anyone here know the enchant id for pact of haste?
hardy anchor
I always use standard, but it's not as clean for click targetting for multi dot efficiency 💔
soft island
@amber arrow try the wa and look for it in triggers by name.
I would try but at work atm
amber arrow
it gives me a 6 number thing thats the same as wowhead... the problem with that is when i do my /simc i get a 4 number id for my pact of crit
ill just wait for a guildy to come on that has haste enchant
vagrant tapir
Can we just take a moment
as a group
To appreciate how much better the azerite system is than the legendary system
it may have some flaws
but we're miles ahead of lego garbage
cerulean walrus
No
daring imp
hell no i wanna my 20s cd vendettas
cerulean walrus
RIP my 22 second Sprint CD
zealous sable
Rip having anything more interesting than a more dmging Garrote
cerulean walrus
RIP Sub rogues that try to jump from high places
soft island
Don't feed the troll!
torpid sluice
https://gyazo.com/e4ade0eb85415fc19bf1c05b2db270f2
But never actually played with Exsanq, is it same way as Toxic blade? Just use on CD?
vagrant tapir
Think about the begining of legion. Outlaw is good, get nerfed, now you're stuck with those legendaries and have no ability to switch. Yesterday at 2pm i had garbage assa traits, and decided i needed to have some solid assa gear, at 7pm i have triple bis traits
3xSS
Infinitely better system
legos were shit
daring imp
rip legion opener ... ah those were the good ol' days of topping metters w/o even noticing
rich wren
Oh...
cerulean walrus
At least you could you know... swap the leggos based on fights. With Ass-erite traits you're locked in, and as a sin rogue there is 1 trait you go for and that's it
zealous sable
Problem is azerite replaces artifact weapons too and I for one will say I would choose the weapon any day
oblique juniper
how many shrouded suffocation traits should i stack
soft island
@vagrant tapir you are megalucker then and I hope u step on Lego.
cerulean walrus
There is one trait that is good in Sin spec. This is why Sub bois gotta get out
fallow kindle
Legendary effects were pretty fantastic, the only thing bad about them was their aquisition. Very important distinction
tacit crater
Oh yes. I'll love hoping that the next raid manages to put on the "current" bis trait and hope it doesn't get phased out by some hotfix.
cerulean walrus
@fallow kindle Exactly this
vagrant tapir
@fallow kindle Toitally
soft island
@vagrant tapir yes, lucker then.
cerulean walrus
Azerite traits are shit compared to legion leggos
vagrant tapir
The flaw with the system was 100% the acquisition
If they had used a token system
No problem
vagrant tapir
Or atleast a way lower problem
But you need to be able to target them
As long as that was possible
Then yep, all good
Thats what i like about azerite
cerulean walrus
Do you know how good a trait like Sephuz would be right now with all the damn CC you need
I would have taken that as a talent ffs
plucky patio
Sephuz would be great right now, unless you didn't have decent luck with legendary drops. in which case you'd be miles behind everyone else
vagrant tapir
This system feels great. I've got 3xSS for Assa, 2xDS 1xAce for Outlaw, and 3xBiTS for Sub
:^)
cerulean walrus
Like imagine if we had a trait like Sephuz instead of the meme bomb... "Ooooh whoopsie! I dropped my jar of momma's jam on the ground again!"
soft island
Lego is w8 ting 👌
cerulean walrus
talent*
plucky patio
Ya, only bad thing is can't target azerite in m+
soft island
vagrant tapir
although youre right
i probably deserve one
although
340/330 daggers
340/340 1hs
no good weps
getting my conq wep in an hour
but still
soft island
I have 3x snek for pvp and gotta say I was lucky with it too. And it's amazing in arenas. 2200 right now
vagrant tapir
nice
cerulean walrus
🐍 👀
vagrant tapir
i love deadshot and ace in pvp
even post nerf
its still fine
i imagine snek is amazing tho
soft island
Since 🐍 dodged the nerf hammer too
tight ravine
what is snek
wheat zealot
!snek
prisma monolithBOT
Snek Build:
-Use standard mainhand/offhand, and Snake Eye traits.
-Rotation: Reroll RtB when out of Snake Eye buffs, dispatch (bte if RP is up or DS traits) if full combo points and Snake Eye buffs still up. Use other cds as the guide recommends, use pistol proc as usual.
-Note: With 1+ snake eyes traits reroll anything that isn't 2+ buffs once you are out of snake eyes stack and with 3 snake eye traits reroll anything that isn't a five buff. Play standard outlaw rotation for the time you have these.
This is not a substitution for reading the guide, just meant as a quick reference if you have Snake Eye traits.
vagrant tapir
snek is outlaw trait
cerulean walrus
That's one slippery boi right there 🐍
vagrant tapir
!snek
prisma monolithBOT
Snek Build:
-Use standard mainhand/offhand, and Snake Eye traits.
-Rotation: Reroll RtB when out of Snake Eye buffs, dispatch (bte if RP is up or DS traits) if full combo points and Snake Eye buffs still up. Use other cds as the guide recommends, use pistol proc as usual.
-Note: With 1+ snake eyes traits reroll anything that isn't 2+ buffs once you are out of snake eyes stack and with 3 snake eye traits reroll anything that isn't a five buff. Play standard outlaw rotation for the time you have these.
This is not a substitution for reading the guide, just meant as a quick reference if you have Snake Eye traits.
soft island
Snek in live
wheat zealot
Awkward
tight ravine
ohh, outlaw 😦
cerulean walrus
Outlul
vagrant tapir
ahaha
glacial jasper
I wonder how many weeks need to pass for lasers to outclass SS
soft island
I tried assa, don't get me wrong. Had better results with the outlul utility tho. Gouge mainly
cerulean walrus
Never will
wheat zealot
I dont think it will, but 2 xSS x1 lasers will be better ofc at some point
tight ravine
but I liked sub, and I'm trying sin
daring imp
@glacial jasper on m+, likely never @_@" i hope
glacial jasper
I hear lasers are pretty fun, I don’t have one yet
cerulean walrus
Even after DS got hammered?
wheat zealot
Does raidbots account for reorigination array buff when simming with lasers?
glacial jasper
@wheat zealot no
cerulean walrus
I feel bad for paladunks that are stuck with Thunderous Blast
vagrant tapir
IKR?
so shitty
to have all garbage traits
we have sick traits
esp deadshot
deadshot/ace are awesome
soft island
🌈 laser 🌈
cerulean walrus
Like "I am a wielder of the light, I will smite thee with my holy Powwweerrrr" WTF does a thunderous blast have to do with paladins?
wheat zealot
Yeah ret traits are terrible theres like 6 neutral traits that are ahead of every ret specific trait lul
vagrant tapir
its really sad
soft island
good, good
vagrant tapir
gotta get my pally to 120 today
wheat zealot
Going from rogue to ret yikes
cerulean walrus
Paladin pops out of the shadows, good, good
Do it.
Unliiiimmmmittteedddd poowwwwwweeeerrrr
tight ravine
lord uther the wise
soft island
Only thing We need now is a black guy(maghar orc probably) to get zapped now and get thrown outta window.
wheat zealot
cerulean walrus
Lmao
wheat zealot
Execute order 66
soft island
6⃣ 6⃣
cerulean walrus
Oh, I'm afraid the deflector shield will be quite operational when your friends arrive.
Paladin bubble
in a nutshell
torpid sluice
Is it recommended to pair Exsanq together with Galecaller's Boon for example? And lose out on the 15sec of Exsanq? (And after 2min you can vanish+garotte again etc)
cold meteor
!build
cerulean walrus
Well that's awkward
torpid sluice
indeed
cerulean walrus
Honestly I'm not sure, I actually hate Galecaller's because my tank keeps moving the boss away from the buffed area ffs
cerulean walrus
Its like meme bomb all over again
undone cairn
can't apply my dots 😦
cerulean walrus
M+
mellow pier
Explain to him i have a trinket thats like rune of power
undone cairn
more like crack
cerulean walrus
He'll probably be like
"Lol dude, you just want special treatment like mages did with that Warp lego"
wheat zealot
Premadonna tank
wheat zealot
They dont care about dps
mellow pier
Yeah hes a shit player
torpid sluice
Also figured out the anwser to the question :c Looked at simulationcraft for sin_exsanq and just looked at the table :p
mossy hazel
Are you me? My tank (and friends) just keep calling my stealth a gimmick
wheat zealot
The worst is tanks that dont give you a chance to stealth between pull
mossy hazel
Even though I do 30% of our 5man's dps
cerulean walrus
They just keep saying "you play rogue cause they're overpowered"
But like I play rogue because I like the class fantasy, AND the damage
Also rogues are versatile AF bois
wheat zealot
Literally cussed out my guild tank this weekend because i had to tell him 5 times to stop fucking chain pulling
soft island
@torpid sluice yes boon snapshots exa. So that's why iz da sheeet
mellow pier
I would just kick these scrubs lmao
If hes your main tank for raid and doesnt understand basic things like that hes clearly bad lol
cerulean walrus
Our main tank is a G Druid who never fucking moonfires and half of his talents are garbage
wheat zealot
Yeah hes our offtank, needs to be replaced
cerulean walrus
Our healers complain that he's too squishy, and that's cause he took the damn talent that generates rage based on damage you take
torpid sluice
But the table used in simulationcraft site does exsanq everytime it's up, but not paired with boon 😮
cerulean walrus
Which has NEGATIVE synergy with their defensive Ironfur
torpid sluice
The 0min and 2min?
cerulean walrus
So do you boon on pull as well?
torpid sluice
Thanks ^^
cerulean walrus
I forget what the CD on it is
mellow pier
Ofc
torpid sluice
Ofc
mellow pier
Just bind it to vendetta
torpid sluice
Boon > Vandetta >
cerulean walrus
Oh EZ
torpid sluice
etc
hushed turtle
Should u clip garrote and rupture to fully refresh before exang?
mellow pier
Yes
jaunty lotus
What's a boon? 🤔
mellow pier
Opener for burst is either stealth or vanish
torpid sluice
Never in my life have I played with Exsanq ;_;
cerulean walrus
A scary N
mellow pier
Gar,rup,gar,vend,mut,rup
tiny vapor
Full pandemic before exg
hushed turtle
Yea, I see the guide for opener, i was just curious for general exang. If I should clip regarldess of where they are for exang paring with vanish if i can ofc
mellow pier
Make sure u keep EP up during boon+empowered garrote
torpid sluice
EP = Elaborate Planning right?
cerulean walrus
Yep
mellow pier
Yeah
torpid sluice
Is Exsanq hard to get used to or fairly easy?
mellow pier
No
lofty sand
not as easy as tb but not hard
mellow pier
The only difficult part is determinng fight length/+dmg,mechanics
And when to hold and use cds
cerulean walrus
And awareness of timers
torpid sluice
Yea ok
lofty sand
TB takes no planning and its overrall better if you're not used to the spec
strange python
Is assa the best rogue specc now?
mellow pier
Or ghuun during beam
cerulean walrus
Sub still sims higher but only slightly
strange python
And they killed outlul?
mellow pier
Assassin is best with more gear
soft island
@mellow pier yes according to simucrafting update
soft island
Damn missed. Was ment to @strange python
strange python
I must be tright on the sin/sub breakpoint for gear, both top gear sims are within 100dps
lofty sand
I think all the specs are pretty close now
cerulean walrus
lol bois what? WW at top?
torpid sluice
NERF!
hushed turtle
all specs are close at 340 PR ilvl
torpid sluice
We need to be back on top again >:)
hushed turtle
at max gear, sin and sub scale better
vestal wren
17% diffrence bwteen first and last dps spec
vestal wren
ww damage is actually rly strong ye
torpid sluice
But now, according to that list, our Balance's cry for a nerf/buff to others is finally justified ;_;
cerulean walrus
Clearly the 27% Blackout Kick nerf wasn't enough
vestal wren
issue is iirc the karma thing
mellow pier
@vestal wren that needs to be removed from their rotation
vestal wren
agree
cerulean walrus
Druids: "What do you mean that my DPS is lower than a pure DPS class.... I know I have a Tanking, Healing, Ranged, and Melee option but I need to be top tier!"
mellow pier
They should have been nerfed
torpid sluice
Also: I use ST traits, how come my AoE is bad, gimme buffs
strange python
bring back the hybrid tax!
vestal wren
blizz balancing was never fair or good
vestal wren
we have utility
mellow pier
No we dont lmao
vestal wren
surviviability
mellow pier
Not anymore than a pally
strange python
i want smokebomb!
mellow pier
Not anymore than a dh
cerulean walrus
We CC, we Stun, we soak damage, we are fast AF boi, we deal a ton of damage
vestal wren
feint
vestal wren
only short cd
mellow pier
Cloak doesnt work the same way it used to
cerulean walrus
Cloak has been nerfed every xpac dude
royal lantern
and the feint change did almost nothing
cerulean walrus
Its a broken AF abillity
strange python
also where is Shiv, if druids get soothe back in pve, i want my lilttle knife back
cerulean walrus
The feint change only made it so you couldn't cheese literally all inc damage
royal lantern
hell, rogue is 1 of the better classes for fights like fetid devourer cus you can take elusivness and feint on the strong dot
cerulean walrus
so you have to think before using it
mellow pier
@royal lantern u would never take elusiveness
royal lantern
did you feint on cd on vari? where the fuck did you get all that energy lol
vestal wren
ppl did feint kind of on cd on avatar mythic
strange python
Cheat death opOP
vestal wren
without utility cost cs of mt energy income from sin
mellow pier
Avatar was more fight was bugged
cerulean walrus
Dude rogues have utility... just look at Mythic Kil'Jaeden
mellow pier
@cerulean walrus u cant do that anymore
cerulean walrus
Ehem... 5 rogues
royal lantern
rogues are one of the best classes BECAUSE they have good utility lul
cerulean walrus
Well no shit
strange python
feint multi stacking its DR on M Avatar was legit
vestal wren
KJ was not possible without rogue
mellow pier
Yes but
cerulean walrus
^^^
vestal wren
it was more of a design issue
cerulean walrus
Dude, so what if cloak can't drop EVERY boss debuff
mellow pier
Instead of rogues u will see 3rd tank,soak bitches now
cerulean walrus
we can still soak dude
mellow pier
@cerulean walrus it cant drop any anymore
royal lantern
doesnt matter, blind/kidney/hard slows/cheath death/cloak will always be good
vestal wren
you will see rogue played
cerulean walrus
Rogue has utility, end of story lmfao
vestal wren
assassination is probably the strongest melee dps spec in the game atm for progression
hushed turtle
What's the best way to utilize vanish with SS, 3x garrote?
mellow pier
@vestal wren id argue ur gonna see class stacking on dh more
mellow pier
Dude i cant argue with u
royal lantern
and about ´´you never take elusivness´´ dude, fetid devourer, the 2dot hits fking strong on hc and will be even more nasty on mythic, you can take elusviness and feint too reduce the dmg by 30%wich is a huge deal
vestal wren
not sure, sin just has 0 costs for downtimes compared
vestal wren
it will come down to mythic mechanics but i doubt you will see to much melees overall and sin seems like one you could always take
mellow pier
Like watch on zul
We wont be able to cloak circles like we used to
Instead ur gonna use a 3rd or 4th tank
cerulean walrus
Then change with the times
cerulean walrus
So roll up a tank then lmfao
lime valve
I cloaked zul circles last night 🧐
mellow pier
ya but it doesnt remove the debuff
soft island
Stack versatility rogue ninja assassin tank inc
cerulean walrus
Its gotta be b8
mortal warren
it removes the debuff and insta triggers the explosion
cerulean walrus
JFC
daring imp
avoidance 🐢
hollow stone
Bubble > cloak. Doesnt mean cloak isnt still amazing
keen cradle
no ones saying that?
hollow stone
Yea. An on demand aoe stun and karma have 0 utility. Especially in m+
agile bane
dark ranger op
hollow stone
Oh and 2 rolls. Oh and flying kick
wheat zealot
Dampen harm, karma, aoe stun isent utility?
Lul
And 5% physical damage boost (all i care about)
hollow stone
Sims are sims tho. I havent been beaten by a ww monk all xpac
In any content
Sin master race
mellow pier
That means
royal lantern
tbf, blizz hates monks, if they do good dmg they get guted again
wheat zealot
Just bring a warrior and monk to make you do more damage lul
mellow pier
Have some shit ww in ur guild
soft island
Does rogue have any party utility except looking fly as fck?
mellow pier
@royal lantern what?
rich wren
Ww stinks
wheat zealot
Shroud duh lol
wheat zealot
Blizz must be full of weebs bc they definetely dont hate monks
soft island
Bring 10 percent smoke bomb dmg reduction back as base tho
royal lantern
ww monk was good in antorus cus they gave them tons of %dmg buffs and the set effect was good
hushed turtle
But whose got the better cleave between ww and rogue
mellow pier
Cleave or aoe?
vestal wren
ww with karma
wheat zealot
Ww did in legion, until it got fixed lol
mellow pier
WW has better aoe burst
soft island
Rogue has multi dot so monk, kek
wheat zealot
Was legit broken
mellow pier
Rogue has better cleave
tiny vapor
Ww was killed when Draenor started, at least in st because their cleave was too strong kek
lofty sand
WW was really good on legion
cerulean walrus
So who's ready for Method to stream their mythic run?
The balls they have to do that lmao
Maybe they need money
quiet spruce
Very excited!
wheat zealot
Yeah theyre gonna make big bucks
cerulean walrus
Wouldn't doubt it
mossy hazel
I work all day tuesdays, so I don't actually know what time the servers come back online. Lol...
hollow flicker
outlaw rogue here but enjoy all 3 specs, how are my sin cousins fairing, especially in m+ (higher keys moreso than lower)
cerulean walrus
G'huun is gonna remember the day... 9/11
E D G Y
D
G
Y
@hollow flicker Sin's in a good spot right now, M+ is nice if you can utilize 3x SS
But once you get past 3 target cleave we sort of fall off a bit
lofty sand
There are logs around, you can see where each spec stands.
edgy solar
AAAAAA
dark shoal
Hey.
Shouldn't they work about rupture mechanics? Since, it need 25energy + energy from mutilate, and the base dmg at 5CP is around the garrote one
devout jolt
Do we know if all Method are streaming? Like Yailo (however you spell that name)
strange python
You misses the j :)
opaque grotto
Vala what
strange python
Vala are you saying it feels bad because it doesn’t do significantly more damage than garrote?
sullen robin
Ylijao
sullen robin
Yliajo mb
dark shoal
Imo, it should. Not way more dmg, but at least, a bit.
strange python
I don’t know that rupture needs to do a ton more damage than garrote
opaque grotto
If subterfuge and SS weren’t so strong then rupture would be doing more dmg
Base garrote vs base rupture, I’m sure rupture would do more dmg
strange python
It doubles your bleed damage
dark shoal
Hum. Is the tooltip from garrote dmg take Subterfuge into consideration?
round sail
anyone know if we can get SS traits from warfront 340 items?
opaque grotto
I mean it doesn’t really matter
Even if rupture did like no dmg you would put it up
opaque grotto
Because of energy regen
dark shoal
Yes, at the end, it doesn't change much
round sail
@strange python okay, thank you
dark shoal
But I think about it in mechanics. Like, as a spender, I feel a bit bad
strange python
It loses a little of the finishing move rogue class fantasy
opaque grotto
Sure but you have to think about the fact it gives you energy back over its duration
opaque grotto
It’s stronger than it appears on details
strange python
Jingle this is more of a feely moment not really a concrete thing
He wants his finishers to do strong man damage
opaque grotto
Well if you want feely
Don’t put rupture up
And FEEL how shit your rotation feels
dark shoal
Haha
strange python
Lmao
delicate gull
TB is 30 sec or 45 sec CD? Anyone know? Sorry on mobile and wowhead doesn’t show CD
opaque grotto
25
vapid oracle
25
opaque grotto
Wrong and wrong
delicate gull
oh 25? Thanks
lofty sand
Yes its probably not intended design that Garrote does more damage than our main ability, SS will probably get nerfed eventually
reef ginkgo
i mean technically its only from stealth
lofty sand
Yes but its probably a miscalculation on their part I doubt they wanted us to prioritize it so much. And make one trait so much better than others, as it stands everything else is utter garbage
reef ginkgo
you mean like deadshot 😂
opaque grotto
I agree it shouldn’t be the best in every scenario
autumn bloom
noobe
opaque grotto
But they knew what they were doing when designing the trait
lofty sand
You give them too much credit, but none of us has a way of knowing that for sure
lone junco
@opaque grotto nice logs btw.
tawdry swan
so do we need 2x shrouded for assa to compete?
lone junco
@devout jolt ylaijo was streaming the other day.
lofty sand
Somewhere along the lines with the nerfs to Assassination on the pre-patch fucked the balance of the spec, I think they might let SS live through this patch but I'm betting it will be nerfed in 8.1. And probably we will be seeing a shift of power in sin, probably some buffs to rupture and traits related to it
autumn bloom
idk they definitely were aware of the way they were pushing garrote to be the star of the kit
with several talents mainly affecting it and many az traits
which i think is good because garrote is the unique sin opener now that they've pruned it from other specs
devout jolt
cheers @lone junco just curious if all Method streamers will be streaming, guess we'll all just find out.
lofty sand
I think they wanted to make a build around Garrote I don't think they meant to make it the only viable build
fading spade
The AZ traits only boost its damage from stealth though. Realistically we only see its benefit 3 to 4 times an encounter
spice frost
It’s just like the t20 set which focused on garrote. It’s not a bad thing
lofty sand
plus SS build requires no effort and little to no planning on us, anyone that gets triple traits will most likely jump on dps meters almost automatically. Its too much reward for literally no effort
lone junco
SS is far less flexible than sub. Regarding swaps and CDs.
devout jolt
And the fact that SS has been bugged since release..
lone junco
Therefore. I believe that SS should stay strong for its stupidly ST niche in raid.
Dunno how they would nerf the subterfuge cleave but keep st strong. Would have to dump subterfuge and buff Ns
vapid oracle
if you want to utilize SS for prio target you have to hold vanish which feels like a good enough downside too it
lone junco
But then we would vanish sharp kife.
white seal
Is there any reason to use Crippling poison in PvE or should I just use Deadly?
lone junco
Both.
vapid oracle
both
lofty sand
yeah usually when a bug persists like that just means they don't care enough to change. I mean they went out of their way to fix the damage part of it on a hotfix why did they leave that one bug up? I think they just going to change the trait anyways so why bother
opaque grotto
@lone junco thanks 😃 my guild is letting me sit boss for MOTHER this week so I can get a good parse on that one LOL
lone junco
I will do better. My 220 was a fucking joke.
Literally vanish didn't go off.
Vendetta. Derp. Garrote rupture exsang.
........... vanish g g. /cry.
vapid oracle
rip
main blaze
gar vanish ... wait FUUUUCK
lone junco
My vendetta vanish key press is way too muscle mem.
opaque grotto
If I ever garrote > vanish
lone junco
And bork. It never goes off.
opaque grotto
I legit afk for 6 seconds
lone junco
Garrote vanish. Wipe the raid.
hushed turtle
So what is the inteded vanish rotation?
opaque grotto
Until I can garrote again
lone junco
Ahhhhhhh
opaque grotto
Vanish > garrote garrote
lone junco
Just chill. Thanks.
opaque grotto
Unless you already have a garrote up and can pandemic it
lone junco
G v. . . ...... g g.
main blaze
cause you might not need to refresh rupture
lone junco
You should.
mellow pier
yes u will
lone junco
Some times you fuck it up.
lilac coral
oh my is that a dagger WQ i see?
opaque grotto
Well it depends if you can pandemic rupture or not
opaque grotto
You can garrote > mut > rupture
mellow pier
no
opaque grotto
It legit just depends on your current duration on dots
main blaze
You dont need to do that on the first vanish
opaque grotto
And your CP
lone junco
I def did g v. And /cry
lone junco
Sure.
opaque grotto
Sure, you can
lone junco
Logs are going to be timing precision. No rng.
hushed turtle
So try and be at 2+ combos then vanish garrote rupture garrote exang?
lone junco
So you are good or bad. No shoulder bombs.
lofty sand
just ignore mechanics bros 😉
opaque grotto
Most of the time I just press garrote > rupture
Because I have 2 CP when I vanish
Like a god
devout jolt
@lilac coral EU or US?
lilac coral
US
devout jolt
😦
lilac coral
just 325 on mine, nothing to write home about
strange python
what settings on raidbots should I use to sim for my best M+ gear combination?
spice surge
M+ isnt really simable
spice surge
Because it varies on the dungeon, your group, your gear, your key, affixes etc
hollow stone
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat weights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
spice surge
Use SS traits, im pretty sure they trump almost anything in m+
hollow stone
Thats about as good as we get for m+ "sims" lol
strange python
gotcha... I know herodamage has a "dungeon" setting to see what they say your best dungeon traits are
but Idk how they're determining that
pulsar goblet
Item level seems to almost always win outside of rings anyways
lofty sand
as far as traits go, assassination only has one choice
hollow stone
Yea. The other choices are way below in sims
lofty sand
you will do well even with just one SS
hollow stone
Its possible they are doing that because they dont have 3ss
lofty sand
thats how powerful the trait is, but triple SS is just insane damage
hollow stone
Im running double dose on helm because shrine is an asshole
spice surge
Tbf, the dungeon tab on herodamage tries to simulate having lots of different combinations of numbers of targets
But it doesnt really factor in that you can stealth and get 3x SS every pack
strange python
Yeah ran a few M+ as sin
Holy cow it's easy to just crush the meters
All you need it 3x SS and you're good
lofty sand
yeah, its effortless
mellow pier
if ur running +5s u could sim hectic add cleave/ST for like 40s to 1m
to atleast see what trinkets work better
strange python
mainly doing 7-9's today
strange python
.io score
I feel like I'm doing way less than what I'm doing as sub or outlaw but the numbers are roughly the same or better depending on the encounter
spice surge
Why not just wait till next week and do 10's
mellow pier
this week
spice surge
For loot
undone cairn
sanguine is lame
strange python
Tried a +8 King's rest : ///
lofty sand
maybe his group thinks its fun to do it?
autumn bloom
sanguine requires a very good tank
strange python
It was not fun
mellow pier
@lofty sand no one thinks this week is fun
autumn bloom
actually this is probably
mellow pier
if they do they're lying
undone cairn
and im sitting here using fok on one mob
strange python
took us 30 minutes over time to finish +10 siege yesterday. miserable.
lofty sand
🤷
hollow stone
Sanguine necrotic is full on aids
undone cairn
why are you doing king's rest smh
strange python
And we had a bear tank as well so no magic mitigation, he just got crushed by the caster adds
HAHA I had to try
lofty sand
some people take m+ serious enough that they don't care about the weekly loot, they want to practice and get good at it
spice surge
No tank has magic mitigation
mellow pier
pple who take it serious
autumn bloom
DH does
hollow stone
We did 10ad in about 40mins... with many deaths lol
opaque grotto
I did +10 tol dagor
strange python
tfw the skeletons shadow step more than me
mellow pier
dont push on shit weeks
opaque grotto
It was aids
mellow pier
tho
opaque grotto
Also did +10 underrot, that wasn’t too bad
autumn bloom
prot pallies have magic mitigation as well
strange python
underrot is even easier than atal imo
sand canyon
fh is easiest key
hollow stone
Urot wasnt bad on a 9
mellow pier
yeah
strange python
FH is great
sand canyon
also for highest
hollow stone
I think ad is easiest if you have enough boss dmg to make the totem boss a joke
versed finch
Anyone have a good route for AD?
valid junco
Harlans Loaded Dice seems to be bugged , procced 1 time in last run of mythic +
hollow stone
Yes. And for those interested in setting routes, download "method dungeon tools". It take some work but is an amazing tool for pushing or even just effectively clearing m+
versed finch
U have to set your own route with that or are there defaults?
hollow stone
You can set your own or import from other peoples' exports
My group all took 2 dungeons, set the route and shared
untold basin
question people - can rogues solo ghuun basketball ? if so how to do it
hollow stone
Warr, mage, dh. All better
versed finch
And druids can go into elk
untold basin
if u have a portal - is it possible
hollow stone
Prob ww monk too
versed finch
And someone else can ride them with the orb, at least you can in temple of seth
hollow stone
I didnt get a chance to test it, @untold basin
untold basin
dam well we have 2 dh 4 warriors and 2 rogues i want to have 6 solo groups
hollow stone
You can cloak the slow from the aoe zones on the way to ghuun so you can probably cloak it in the fight too
So you should be able to cloak, portal, sprint
But make your warrs, dh, mage, ww monk do it
untold basin
cloak portal sprint shadowstep or something?
(not a rogue here btw) so just curious
hollow stone
Cloak portal sprint "should" be enough. But again, no testing for me. This is speculation
untold basin
now do all rogues specs have all of those tools ?
hollow stone
Yes
molten scroll
I've already tried cloak portal sprint double shadow step then disp and shadow strike and it wasnt enough, you cant solo it as rogue or its rly hard (or nerf ? i did it on wednesday)
safe matrix
Goblin racial would work too
hollow stone
Better responses
calm grail
Best SS hood for now the one from Shrine?
untold basin
so only sub rogues can blast it alright great tips
autumn bloom
hook wouldnt work as outlaw?
hollow stone
We had groups of 2 w a mw monk floating. Mw monk never touched the orb unless absolutely necessary
mellow pier
on heroic u really dont need pple to solo
hollow stone
And yes. Thats bis helm slot for us
mellow pier
u will be fine without it
molten scroll
No its not possible even as sub, or im rly shit but with gate double shadowstep and shadowstrike port it wasnt enough
molten scroll
Yeah but as I was Blood elf ;p
untold basin
thank you bois
but how does a mage solo it ? i cant see 2 blinks + portal being enough
wild lily
you can solo as outlaw, maybe sub if you are on very first one you can prepot with the 150% speed, though i never tried it yet, i got very close without gate/bladerush/grapple
well not without those, but without the potion
but why go through hassle if other classes are a bit better and 2 people makes it ez
and certain
wild lily
we doomed
haughty lily
do we put higher dmg dagger in main hand or does it not matter
strange python
subterfuge talent will get nerf for sure
Hye question, the shrouded sffucation stands highest on bloodmallet.. so should I stack this trait for pve dmg?
wild lily
-5% damage, -20% shrouded suffocation
quartz relic
Assassins, outlac or sub? to uldir, which is better now?
crimson swift
or
dawn merlin
@strange python yes, 3 shrouded suffocations is optimal for raid and m+
strange python
so u just reapply with vanish than?
dawn merlin
at least until subterfuge gets a big, fat nerf
strange python
I had a garote up on a dummy with triple trait.. just the garrote was showing 15k dmg 😊
spice surge
Idk, just making SS not stacking with subterfuge
storm epoch
@strange python no way
spice surge
Is good enough to gut it
strange python
ticks of 6k each 😊
strange python
Dunno how it worked but ye it showed 6k but meanwhile dmg meters showed 15k dmg
languid ore
Garrote is going to get nerfed.
storm epoch
g2g pm me if you hit 15k ticks
dawn merlin
@spice surge true, it's an oppressive azerite trait as it stands.. curious to see how they'll approach the issue
storm epoch
and send a screenshot
gray shuttle
What is 3 SS?
patent jetty
I’ve got 3 SS traits. The opener in the pins says to garrote rupture garrote. Are you garroting again that quickly to extend the initial garrote?
safe matrix
Yep
tight ravine
what's the bug again
serene nacelle
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
tight ravine
also why do you garrote -> rupture -> garrote again
serene nacelle
To increase the duration of empowered garrote to 24 sec
plain thistle
I wouldnt say thats the reason, because we never did x2 garrote on legion, what changed how we play is the new trait Shrouded Suffocation, basically the extra damage and 2 extra combo point
tidal gorge
I agree with Eleem, I doubt the multiplier between the trait damage and subterfuge is intended. They probably just haven't figured out a way to fix it yet.
arctic crow
It's going to be a "bug fix"
arctic crow
Aka nerf
jovial kite
i do def believe its intended
jovial kite
they just couldnt code it on top of subterfuge without a 4th non subterfuged garrote breaking it
hollow stone
Try a m+ without restealthing. Look at your dmg
It is dog shit compared to everyone without ss
rough knoll
Tru
gray shuttle
they should remove the ability to stack
vagrant tapir
-aq\\
hollow stone
But thats just because it does much more than our 2nd best trait
vagrant tapir
1
arctic crow
How is assassin simming compared to your other specs. I have 3 trait for assassin but still Sims low
hollow stone
Yea lol
rough knoll
They just nerfed the trait individually
Sin seems borked because we do a lot of burst
rough knoll
But it evens out on a long flight
Like in m+ you can get 6 garrotes running every 2 min if the packs big enough
Omegalul
hollow stone
Exactly. It seems broken because in a sense, it is. Most other classes cant take adv of their trait to the extent we can WHEN WE CAN GET RESTEALTHS (outside of vanish)
hollow stone
Without restealth it is literally a dead and useless trait
jovial kite
i dont see the issue
hollow stone
Me neither
weary verge
Its so frustrating with a tank who insists on chain pulling
jovial kite
get a better tank
hybrid thicket
With 3 SS its straight op
weary verge
Yeah I'll just pull one out of my arse
hollow stone
Just talk to your tank
weary verge
😉
jovial kite
eww
pulsar goblet
I constantly gotta ask for restealths lol
hybrid thicket
😄
rough knoll
Cause I didn't have exsang
One time I just sat in stealth for 10s
😂😂😂
"trust me it's a dps increase"
crisp igloo
/r
hollow stone
Lol, been there
strange python
or adapt to the situation.. wtf is wrong with a tank chainpulling 😊
rough knoll
What's wrong with a tank chain pulling?
strange python
thats what Im saying
exotic abyss
Hey guys for m+ trash, do i Gx3 a single target then CT then Ex? not sure how to aoe
rough knoll
What do you mean
rough knoll
Aye
safe matrix
If you can't restealth you can't use shrouded suffocation without vanish
rough knoll
@exotic abyss how many targets
strange python
I dont think he clears faster that way 😊
strange python
imagine 1 sec delay is 1 sec no dps from 15ish people
safe matrix
Which is a pretty big dps loss, which means you kill targets slower
rough knoll
Then g, g g r exsant
weary verge
Who said anything about 15 people?
hollow stone
Yeah. I love running m+ with 15 people
strange python
I say
weary verge
I dgaf about trash in raids
severe hemlock
Tbh i found m+ a lot easier once you brought more than 8 people.
weary verge
Thats what the plebs are for 😄
exotic abyss
Oh ok so, if there's 3+ g up to 3 then ct - ex? then rupture up to 3 if they live long enough?
jovial kite
if the adds dont die fast
3x garrote
rupture
exsang
then weave in ct with ruptures and envenoms
severe hemlock
then you begin the mad dance of trying to keep rupture and garrote on 3 things while not letting CT drop
it's a ride.
but let your subterfuge garrotes fall off themselves
don't refresh them
exotic abyss
@jovial kite 3x garrote in a single target in a pack of 3 or more?
severe hemlock
and don't put any new garrotes out
weary verge
have they fixed that bug yet?
severe hemlock
no, in a pack of 3 garrote 3 things
jovial kite
ppl were talking about aoe
severe hemlock
have not
jovial kite
i replied to aoe
safe matrix
Nope
exotic abyss
Kk
weary verge
where the 4th one removes the damage bonus?
severe hemlock
right
safe matrix
!ss
prisma monolithBOT
Shrouded Suffocation
Currently still bugged. Applying 1-3 Garrotes in Subterfuge, and then applying another Garrote outside of Subterfuge, all of your Subterfuge-empowered Garrotes lose the Shrouded Suffocation multiplier, However the Subterfuge multiplier still remains.
Advised to not cast unbuffed Garrotes to avoid losing SS trait damage bonuses until this has been fixed.
exotic abyss
thx alot
weary verge
ty
lone junco
@storm epoch crit ticks of 20k on vendetta aren't unreasonable.
glacial jasper
Think I’m going to go sin once I get the last SS trait and roll with ex
mint osprey
Yea I only have one SS trait and it feels a bit weak
lone junco
2ss is fine to start with.
gray shuttle
!rotation
glacial jasper
That opening burst on m+ bosses just feels so good
And I don’t mind having to work harder for aoe
calm grail
Outside of subterfuge just apply garrotes as usual? This is once you wait for the first 3 empowered ones to wear off?
jaunty lotus
Oh, so you need 3x SS to see the burst with exsang? I only have 1 and thought the burst was quite underwhelming
hollow stone
Yes
hollow stone
And yes, exsang doesnt shine til 3ss
jaunty lotus
I see, will stop trying to use it for now then
calm grail
Ooof I won't be able to use exsang then
cinder palm
I have 3 SS and 18% haste and now sim higher with exsang
hollow stone
It's usable w 2 but more work than tb so unless you just want to get used it it, tb is better
calm grail
Got a laser matrix hood.
unreal coyote
same
jaunty lotus
With 1x SS TB just seems better overall
cold token
CT or PB for m+ ?
lone junco
@calm grail tbh. Outside of subterfuge. Garrote is shit damage anyway. With 6sec cd. But yeah. Use as normal.
CT for m+
2k ticks. Instead of like 12k
calm grail
For AoE I see it says Garrote 3 times, does that put you over CP cap or are you dumping after the second one?
calm grail
Ok
serene glacier
cold token
do you use CT on bosses too ?
lone junco
Fucckrt.
unreal coyote
wew
lone junco
No Ct in single. Envenom hits hard.
unreal coyote
that dag
calm grail
Ooof
undone cairn
god dam
hollow stone
No