Or does the damage stack but the Combo Point part doesn't ?
#assassination
plain wraith
steep citrus
the second thing you said
plain wraith
Ah fair enough, thanks!
blissful crown
Is it worth buying that 350 dagger for MH only for 300k gold if i wont get any 340 daggers this reset?
I mean if i have 2mil gold
Dno really
😄
copper pine
wait till the raid opened
slow grove
Can someone possibly assist me in properly simming? I'm trying to use the Top Gear option and it's not showing all the Azerite pieces of armor in my bags. Am I doing something wrong? I copied the code from the addon and applied it. It shows the proper equipped gear but it's only showing like 3 of the items from my bags.
urban storm
is your simc addon updated?
lapis sky
how does one use the topgear option
stone pilot
lets just find a way to break fok so blizz will notice us and fix the garrote trait
slow grove
Was the CP aspect actually intended to stack?
stone pilot
i dont think so but it would be nice to get the dmg from it
verbal ingot
how much dps is considered high atm?
zenith oak
its the highest single target trait i think
opaque tree
I have question regarding Shrouded Suffocation. I was under the assumption that the extra damage from it only applied during stealth, is that wrong? Does it always apply the extra damage? I know you only get the 2 extra CPs from stealth.
The damage portion from Shrouded Suff, is it always added to rupture, regardless of stealth?
strange python
it's garrote and only from stealth.
opaque tree
oh that's what i meant sorry
strange python
it's good because of subterfuge.
opaque tree
I meant Garrote
sacred ore
guys does any of these items have shrouded suffocation? Irontide Captain's Hat & mantle of fastidious machinations
opaque tree
pretty sure you can shift click to see if it does
strange python
only way I would know that is by googling, which I think you can too
opaque tree
lol
sacred ore
just checked online
on wowhead
it shows
guys
all of the bis artifacts on icey veins dont have shrouded suffocation
.-.
strange python
Probably cause the damage isn't there
sharp wren
So, before i buy the Fathoms deck. The nerf didn't hit it too hard right?
late goblet
Fathoms worth 144k?
lone junco
Yes.
jaunty lagoon
i could buy the last card for 35k and make it
lone junco
If you were to buy the cards cheap and combine it would be like 8x15. Ish.
But some are 8k. Some are 40k.
jaunty lagoon
i have all of them apart from the 5
and i just sold 2 ace of fathom for 25k each
i think i will buy it tomorrow and make the trinket, it will probs push me up and ilvl and give me a big dps increase over my current trinket
that will make me 342
jaunty ginkgo
which is more important to maintain uptime between EP and Envenom?
surely EP right?
opaque tree
i don't think we're supposed to do the whole 3 Combo Point thing like in legion with EP. I think that was just because of Surge of Toxins, which was tied to the Artifact. I could be wrong
jaunty lagoon
are you talking elaborate planning?
opaque tree
i think you're just supposed to pool a lot of energy before finishers so you can get in those Mutilates with EP up
yeah, he's talking about Elaborate Planning
jaunty lagoon
i haven’t seen many using EP
jaunty lagoon
i’m running master poisoner right now
late goblet
What's EP?
jaunty lagoon
what ilvl you at?
late goblet
ah ok
lone junco
@opaque tree correct. EP ruptures can be low cp.
opaque tree
334 or something around there
lone junco
I messed with the apl for 2cp+ and pretty sure it was a wash.
cant do low env though. due to reasons.
opaque tree
@lone junco so we should try to always keep up EP even with low CPs?
jaunty lagoon
tbh i think EP will be better with more haste, as easier to get the energy pools
lone junco
EP is better with more crit for uptime.
opaque tree
check it out
armory="us,arygos,Gharrett"
name="gharrett"
copy="1212221,gharrett"
talents="1212221"
copy="2212221,gharrett"
talents="2212221"
copy="3212221,gharrett"
talents="3212221"
Simulation Configs
iterations="5000"
target_error="0"
fight_style="Patchwerk"
desired_targets="1"
max_time="300"
calculate_scale_factors="0"
scale_only="strength,intellect,agility,crit,mastery,vers,haste,weapon_dps,weapon_offhand_dps"
override.bloodlust="1"
override.arcane_intellect="1"
override.power_word_fortitude="1"
override.battle_shout="1"
override.mystic_touch="1"
override.chaos_brand="1"
override.bleeding="1"
report_details="0"
single_actor_batch="1"
optimize_expressions="1"
omg sorry that failed, lol
click on it and you can see the talent compare
lone junco
but I havent done enough ST sin at 120 to have many thoughts on it. but you can edit the apl yourself to see if 2+cp rupture is a loss for you. It effectively bumps up your EP uptime by a few decimals.
opaque tree
i didn' t know you could edit that to see... i guess i could try
lone junco
in cleave with the Agi rupture bonus, def want to tab ruptures at 2+
jaunty lagoon
damn i need more haste! im 341 and less dps than that
lone junco
meaning. garrote mut, or mut, or SS Garrote
opaque tree
yes! for trash and even cleave fights
i haven't been trying to get 4+ ruptures
it was just ST
lone junco
if you have agi bonus, then fok does your major damage.
jaunty lagoon
wait so how does this whole 2 point rupture thing work?
opaque tree
you just rupture at 2cps, lol
jaunty lagoon
why?
opaque tree
well we're speculating
lone junco
rupture damage is flat. duration is based on cps.
1cp-5cp gives the same damge, and same ep duration
opaque tree
because we're not sure if keeping the Elaborate Planning buff is worth it using 2 CP ruptures, or using them at 4-5
jaunty lagoon
oh so even if you do less combos, you get the same scaling damage just the dot doesn’t last as long
lone junco
I already checked it at one point, and at that time it was fine
ideally you want to finish 4-5cps.
but if you are low crit, you get boned with some 2cp muts.
opaque tree
yeah so the only question is... is it worth having to reapply rupture more often, keeping up EP, and doing less Envenoms, or just pooling for 4-5 CP Ruptures for more envenoms
jaunty lagoon
on multi target that 2cp rupture would be nice
void pecan
rip?
opaque tree
well it's just really low, lol i know vers sucks
jaunty lagoon
i have 30% crit, 9.5 haste, 36 mastery and 7 vers i thinl
lone junco
sec. Ill just do it now.
opaque tree
but still, it's 1% and I have 24% or 25% mastery, i can't remember
lone junco
gimme a min
opaque tree
okay!
jaunty lagoon
right now while we are learning dungeons etc i’m running master poisoner for ease of use
opaque tree
@jaunty lagoon does your rotation feel SUPERRR slow with 9.5% haste?
jaunty lagoon
i had 5% at one point
been getting lucky today on reset and got a dagger with haste and hay crit haste belt from kings rest
opaque tree
EP is always up in dungeons for me, I usually top two in AoE if not top, depends on the group
lone junco
thats the point of ep in 5man
3 subterfuge garrotes, then rupture fok rupture fok rupture fok fok env.
with the bleeds running , and ep up, you do pretty well
opaque tree
yeah, I'm enjoying it... I never really liked EP, I always preferred MP, but there's some skill to it, I suppose 😛 Blindside feels Clunky and unrewarding... which is strange because back in WoD it felt GOOD, really good... not anymore
opaque tree
yup, most of my damage is FoK, you're not wrong about that 😛
lone junco
if you look at your damage profile in cleave, youll see fok over garrote.
zenith oak
what about CT instead of PB ?
opaque tree
depends on trash pulls
void pecan
^^^
jaunty lagoon
wait i have a question, if you apply a rupture, then buff EP, does the rupture benefit from it or does it only benefit if you apply with EP
opaque tree
some dungeons i've done well with CT, but Poison Bomb happens often
every trash pull i get 1-2 sometimes more than that
while EP is buffing you
it just increases the damage you're doing
with EVERYTHING
opaque tree
it's not an after effect, like you don't apply something after you get that buff and it THEN buffs it, just while you have the buff, from a finisher, ALL your damage is increased by 10%
lone junco
all the damage you have. the 3x garrotes, the tab ruptures, the deadly poison ticks, the poison bomb if you have it. the white dmg from the fok. all get buffed.
lone junco
both
opaque tree
finishers proc EP
jaunty lagoon
and does the finisher that procs EP benefit from EP?
opaque tree
damage following it immediately after
jaunty lagoon
okay lemme use another skill
lone junco
thats why we "clip" ep
tracking EP lets you finish right at the end.
ok. here is 2cp ruptures in 1T.
jaunty lagoon
if you garrote without EP, then use rupture to get EP, does the garrote gain the dmg increase?
opaque tree
so, depending on crits and procs, it's almost even....
lol because it's almost equal
lone junco
(unless i blew the apl code)
opaque tree
i mean I've done the clipping before and it felt good, but maybe because i had lower crit at the time it seemed like less damage, i'm going to try it out
jaunty lagoon
so basically using EP, keep it up all the time and keep as many ruptures up on targets as you can
what is clipping
opaque tree
yeah, well you always want to keep rupture on as many as you can, even without EP
the whole point of EP is... whenever you use a finisher, whether it's 1 combo point, or 5.... you get a 10% buff for 4 seconds? I think it is...
so using 3 combo point finishers for RUPTURE is just as much a gain as 4-5
just use 4-5 combo point finishers for Envenom
i believe
jaunty lagoon
and the only difference is that you have to reapply rupture more often
since it will be a short duration
opaque tree
yes because a 2 or 3 combo point rupture is not going to last as long
that's pretty much it
yup
jaunty lagoon
the same on ST?
opaque tree
yes, well... this is for single target we're talking about
jaunty lagoon
oh i thought this was multi XP
lone junco
3t was a little more loss. but these are very long fights. and it is using FOk for cps.
opaque tree
because for trash... you NEVER need to have 4-5 combo point ruptures..stuff doesn't live that long
so just tab target and apply ruptures at 1-5 combo points
lone junco
anyway. aim for 4-5.
opaque tree
and just keep applying them
lone junco
dont bother with 1.
if you garrote for 1, them mut, that is 3 or 5
aim for 4-5. 2,3 isnt the end of the world.
dont go fishing with 2's as a habit
jaunty lagoon
so even on single target use 2-3 combo ruptures to keep up EP
opaque tree
for trash? or you mean for ST?
lone junco
for all cases.
jaunty lagoon
sorry for q’s im relatively new to sin
opaque tree
on trash I didn't think it really mattered, but there aren't many cases I do use two
lone junco
this is my shitty sin gear
opaque tree
yeah, haste feels good
lone junco
ilvl helps.
jaunty lagoon
@lone junco i’m 341 equip atm ilvl is fine
lone junco
then just work on stat weights for st or cleave. whichever you are targeting
opaque tree
and you say you're simming lower than me in damage?
jaunty lagoon
by about 100dps
opaque tree
yeah i'm sure it's your haste... you have a ton of crit.. 30%.. that's huge
jaunty lagoon
i know that’s what i’m aiming for lol
opaque tree
thanks, you too Noobe
jaunty lagoon
i got a couple pieces
EU horde got a haste crit dagger the other day from emissary
gilded seal
Has the SS bug been taken into account in the nigtly sims APL or is the weekly safer to use?
I didnt see anything in pins
jaunty lagoon
haste is just OP in this XPAC
void pecan
For every single class too, it's nuts
jaunty lagoon
shame i only have 9.5%
i’ve been fishing for those haste main rings
with 200+ haste oh my lord
royal lantern
can somone tell me why mastery suddenly got such a huge boost in my stat weights? (19%crit 15%haste 22%mastery)
i thought crit will be higher when you reach high haste %
opaque tree
its because of crimson Temp i think
royal lantern
sec
opaque tree
try with PB
opaque tree
lol more damage.. but still weird
how much mastery do you have? maybe you just have so much that's a relevant stat for you
royal lantern
maybe because if blightborn infusion?
onyx falcon
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/oTs5W4znzbwhkXYpHv79kA my SIM 18/16/27/6 and less geared than you im pretty sure
also heading to work check whats up later 😛
opaque tree
@royal lantern Humor me and compare talents for both Master Poisoner and EP, I want to see the difference in comparison for you and your stat weights
For me, Master Poisoner is only a 1% loss
royal lantern
allright, my current shoulders have the blightborn infusion trait, wich is a huge crit% boost on a proc
without them the crit rating gets higher again https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kefyjvYLGei1eZzFN9G3iM
royal lantern
ye, the proc boost me from 19% too 32%
opaque tree
wow!
royal lantern
@opaque tree talent compare , its 0,5% only https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/eZyEHfuVD69NpN1UG81ra3
opaque tree
that's with the crit procing shoudlers?
that's really close
my stats are like RIGHT on top of eachother
both my crit and haste are at 20% ingame
I really really really need some better weapons
D:
also... i have 6 socketed pieces
lol... so freakin' many
royal lantern
head piece, not shoulders, sorry
but make's sense, a proc that gives a huge boost too crit% takes some value out of stacking crit in gear
well, thx for the help guys
kindred cedar
anyone heard anything if blizz is aware of the shrouded suffucation not working properly?
opaque tree
i have no idea... I've been wondering the same thing
is it that the damage isn't stacking if you have 2+ talents?
err abilities
strange python
SS ist bugged and u wont get the garrote dmg
latent cape
abstract crescent
pvp talents for sin rogue?
\
royal lantern
there is a pvp channel
opaque tree
@tir What do you mean you won't get the garrote damage? The ability says you get damage + 2 combo points, You're not being very clear
Oh, maybe you made a grammar error and you meant to say "is" bugged?
night cypress
stat variation
nimble tartan
its just gear man high ilvl doesnt mean good gear like on wowprog im like 100th on the server in ilvl but #1 in simdps
we out here
hot snow
I'm absolutely simming every piece but I guess I've just had shitty luck
strange python
if u read the tooltip from ss "generates additional 2 cbs + additional xxx dmg"
slow grove
Which channel is the appropriate channel for general comparisons between the different specs?
tight meteor
Which rogue spec is the best?
-If you have to ask this you're probably not doing the type of content where this matters, all are more than viable and very competitive.
slow grove
No.
tight meteor
okay
slow grove
I don't want a general hey this spec is the best in everything ever answer. My rogue isn't max level yet. So I don't have the personal experience of max level gameplay or simming. I'm trying to plan ahead. I love Sub gameplay but for some reason I'm just not good at it. Sin is easier for me because it is easy. I know that Outlaw kinda big dicks the other two in aoe generally but I don't how it competes with them in single target. I like to prioritize single target over aoe but there's still those moments where it sucks to see your numbers be pure garbage on a trash mob pull.
chilly obsidian
whats your question exactly? like no offense but if you like sub then get good and practice it until youre good
slow grove
I'm not necessarily trying to compete with the entire population of WoW but it is a game and there is some competitiveness between my close friend and I.
tight meteor
so you want to play sub but scared it sucks?
lost horizon
the specs are close enough that your skill/effort will factor in more than any inherent difference in spec output
tight meteor
all 3 specs are competitive
slow grove
I guess that's what I was looking for.
If they are close enough to compete in most aspects with one another.
lost horizon
i recommend playing what you enjoy
tight meteor
^
chilly obsidian
go practice on a target dummy or in normals until your rotation is muscle memory or something, better than sitting in a major city just waiting for queue
tight meteor
sub is definitely takes a while to get used to though
but once you do its pretty braindead
same with all 3 tbh
slow grove
Single seems ok so far. I'm trying to level with it and as soon as I switched to it from assass, the first mob I pulled smacked me til I died. I guess my real problem with sub is trying to get aoe and cleave down.
I'm not sure 100% what I'm looking for anybody to say tbh. Maybe just some experiened do's and donts?
chilly obsidian
slow grove
That's my other issue. I'm not real experienced with discord tbh. Youtube video linked the discord so I hopped over and started reading the chat. Half the questions you ask though someone just says "sim it or read a pin" and I'm like wtf.
I'm tryin to get this stuff down. Sorry if it comes off annoying or anything.
supple hearth
like 90% of a new rogue's questions can be answered there
as most FAQ are answered there
slow grove
Oooh. Thanks.
ionic hemlock
Having a brain fart, striking attack speed, is not the same as haste?
shy wolf
we were all new at some point :p
i'm pretty sure haste and attack speed are not the same...but i might be wrong
ionic hemlock
yeah, I don't think so either, trying to figure out what weapon enchants.
shy wolf
Attack speed is a secondary attribute that describes the delay between auto-attacks, measured in seconds. It is the reciprocal of the actual rate of attack; a higher attack speed means that you will attack less frequently, not more frequently. Essentially, it can be considered the "cooldown" between auto-attacks by the given weapon. It is a function of weapon speed and haste. -source wowpedia so it might be wrong xD
best answer i could find shrugs
ionic hemlock
yeah i just dunno if thats better then mastery or crit atm i need to do some more googling because my sim doesn't seem to help
shy wolf
^^
ionic hemlock
just don't know if i want to blow 5k on basic weapons lol
ebon bramble
hey all, are poisons considered magic damage or physical damage in respect to the debuff raid utility monks/dh brings?
ebon bramble
what about bleeds?
ebon bramble
i see
so the physical damage debuff from monks, benefit our bleeds and autos
while everything else like envenom, poisons etc are
magic related so benefit from dh debuff?
fleet whale
yes
bright axle
So does that mean you can benefit from both at the same time?
fleet whale
yes
bright axle
Sweet thanks mate
violet sonnet
What's a good amount of haste to have right now?
kindred flame
8 is better than 4, but worse than 12
fiery bear
is it good to have same enchant on both weapon or should get different ones
ionic hemlock
^ trying to figure that out
It
has been so long since I had to worry about it. I don't even know. But if you want to play it safe, get two different ones
ionic hemlock
yeah probably haste / crit or mastery whatever you need more
prisma gull
Iirc they have diminishing returns on each other, so using 2 different ones is best
ionic hemlock
yeah im kind assuming that
it's been a long time since we used dual enchants, even when i toyed around with frost dk's
urban storm
wish i had weapons to put enchants on 😦
ionic hemlock
Me too lol
slender hare
Same, im ilvl 341 with 2 310 daggers...
sweet needle
I have ilvl 330 with 290/300 daggers. Can't get a drop to save my life xD
shy wolf
we should start a club :p
fiery bear
having 2 heed my call traits stack right?
and by stacking i mean their dmg gets doubled or proc chance gets doubled?
fiery bear
ok thanks 😃
surreal rivet
anyone know if the freezies bubble popper boe is good at all?
charred moat
Int daggers do half the damage of agi ones im pretty sure
surreal rivet
oh that ones int? no wonder why the dmg is so low lol
silk jolt
Fan of knives feels so lacklustre compared to shuriken storm
quartz ginkgo
At first it feels like farming weapons is a drainer but are we actually better off with having to farm weapons (2 slots) as compared to legion where we didn’t have a weapon to farm but had 3 relic slots to farm?
loud niche
so, bloodmallet says that commodore calhoun's tricorne is bis at 340+
can azerite tf?
drops as a 300 ilvl
river quarry
lol i just spawned 40 horde into 40 alli killing a world quest mob and we wiped the shit out of them
get rekt frostmourne alliance
server shat itself
keen spruce
Anyone else noticed that daggers / weapons in general are extremely low drop chance? i have full 340+ armor but still rocking 325/310 daggers. haven't seen a single one drop in all of the mythics I've run. no weapon WQs
not trying to spend 350k on a BoE
safe matrix
Depends on RNG
Daggers/weapons are just a single piece and compete against armor
of which there are quite a few more options
last whale
i did yesterday 3 mythics without single drop so..
wise frigate
RNG is RNG. I'm at 49 boss kills in mythic with 5 drops.
waxen arch
I got a 340 dagger from emissary chest lol
lament dove
I got the emissary in 345 plus another 340 dagger and I'm still in 334^^
lament sandal
same
hybrid cobalt
Hit 338 tonight. 325/305 daggers are still anchoring my ilvl. The struggle is real.
steady wharf
I ended up buying a 350 dagger, got sick of waiting
15 mythic dungeons so far without a dagger dropping
safe matrix
!warn @last whale "-Telling someone to "KYS" and/or encouraging self-harm" is against the rules.
last whale
Warned for saying kys as a joke..
safe matrix
Yep, its banned for a reason
civic palm
#off-topic O _O"
safe matrix
you know whats also banned?
civic palm
Nice!!
safe matrix
"-Harassing moderators/staff"
tight meteor
yikes
solid nova
Friendly reminder: This is not your personal discord, your guild's discord, or any other discord out there. Behaviour that is "just bants" may violate the rules here.
Adapt your language for the environment you're in, or simply dont contribute at all.
lofty junco
SS fixed or still bugged?
warm parcel
Try it out. Wasnt fixed last night
lofty junco
was then thinking eventualy goes with ruzpture trait, cause dagger in the back isn't that good for trash IIRC
or thunderoues blast
tidal sluice
Hi all. Could anyone tell me if I can have Shrouded suffocation trait on 2 different Azerite armours and if it adds up of course?
wise frigate
There just so happens to be a pin answering that question. You should check it out!
lofty junco
its bugged atm
tidal sluice
Sorry I'm a bit new on discord channel, how do I find the pins 😃
lofty junco
normaly its stacked but SS bugged atm so ya get everytime only 2 additional CP's and NO dmg, 1 or 3 traits all the same
wise frigate
📌 in the top right.
tidal sluice
Thanks!!
wise frigate
Ah so that one doesn't actually stack Blake?
lofty junco
so SS is atm jsut good to ahve 2 additional CP's for aoe etc
wise frigate
I knew the CP gen wouldn't. Figured damage would at least.
lofty junco
yes
tidal sluice
They'll fix it before the raids and MM+I suppose
warm parcel
lofty junco
garrote ticks for the same dmg with 0 SS, 1, 2 or 3 SS traits. no dmg from it
warm parcel
Sweet summer child
wise frigate
Rule 1: Never trust Blizz to do their job in a timely manner.
lofty junco
ya don't played wow that long i suppose @tidal sluice xD
tidal sluice
lofty junco
i think i will going outlaw for pure aoe and sin for tyrannic weaks for comeing m+....doesn't enjoy the sub aoe
vestal dune
Do the sims using the default weekly thing use the buged ss?
lofty junco
SS is bugged since release so i would said yes^^
vestal dune
If it's like that, I might actually sim higher with assa than sub with my current gear once they fix it
lofty junco
yeah i think to go with dagger in the back is still a better option atm, cause its worked for all 3 speccs
WTF what a price.....5k gold only for reforging my azerit piece?
vestal dune
I currently only have 2 middle of the pack traits and the bises of assa and sub for the chest
And it went up each reforging I believe
vestal dune
Does it grow much?
lament dove
I don't really get the point of reforging though...
vestal dune
If you are playing multiple specs for mythics and raid for example, could be useful
lofty junco
it doubble everytime
lament dove
true, but I would rather get 2 (or 3) sets rather than reforge every time, since I like to play more specs (this was one of my main problems with Legion's artifact weapon)
currently I cannot decide if I like assa or sub better, so I'm changing specs all the time,:) because of that I'm also happy with my epics with thunderous and dagger in the back
lofty junco
i think i would play sub only for ST raidbosses
lament dove
also so far I only got pieces with one good and one bad trait, up to the point that I got 340 pieces which were worse than my 325s with a good trait, so why would I reforge to a bad trait? even if I have one piece with an assa specific trait, it's usually better to get another piece with a sub specific one, rather than reforge to a bad trait
vestal dune
It is still rng, you might only get 1 chest piece from the raid for 1 or 2 weeks
iron chasm
Anyone else got problems with energy regeneration? I seem to be always out of energy when a fight is longer then 10 seconds. I never had energy problems in Legion but since bfa I had to switch to outlaw since assa with low energy is zero fun :/
odd tundra
you HAVE to pool
iron chasm
Hmm Okay guess I'll give it a try again and practice my pooling haha. Thank you guys
winter dagger
In AoE situation u have to spread poisons and tab targets for rupture and garrotes for more energy from passive, also when target dies with rupture u get lots of energy back, so in AoE assa is most fluent spec rogue have. In single target however i agree with energy starvation but it happens after a longer fight. You have vendetta for a reason. Save thistle tea for boss fights so you can squeeze out more dmg in burst phase.
iron chasm
@winter dagger thank you :)
strange python
@iron chasm you might be using envenom too much, only cast when you don’t have the buff otherwise you are wasting energy
charred moat
well youd get 3x the damage not the cp, if the damage actually worked
iron chasm
@strange python What do I do then if I got 4-5 CP, Rupture is not about to fall off and the envenom buff lasts for another 4 seconds? Should I just do auto attacks?
strange python
@iron chasm just chill, sin is a low apm spec for a reason, all you do is maintain your 2 debuffs and 1 buff on yourself permanently
slender sandal
Any eta on ss fix?
shy mica
Do you guys run poison bomb or CT for hcs/M0
Or depending on group setup
I feel like CT is so shit when doing anything other than trash tho
but i guess most time is spend on trash
steady wharf
Been doing poison bomb but switching to elaborate planning. M0 has things dying so fast now that no special cleave talents are needed
Depends on your group obviously. Helps that I run with a combat rogue in my party too
shy mica
Wouldn't u always run elaborate planning?
steady wharf
Nah, others were simming higher for me
only at 341 gear level did elaborate planning come out higher
so when I go with that, I dunno what will sim better for the AOE tier
solid nova
!azerite
prisma monolithBOT
Do my azerite traits stack?
The damage part of azerite Stacks.
Other components can be assumed to stack however with some exceptions and limitations.
You can check https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/azeritestacks/1t-t22-assassination for estimations.
solid nova
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat wights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
rain breach
is there a blindside/multilate macro thatn i can use it on one button?
spring lantern
Playing Sin in island expeditions while browsing reddit 
spring lantern
20% dmg is pretty busted
vestal wren
you dont rly need it to beat the ai
spring lantern
But the numbers on the screen are bigger 🤷
vestal wren
good argument
jaunty lagoon
where does the 20% come from?
lone junco
20% is the same as 20/100 or 1/5
jaunty lagoon
yes but where is the 20% boost from?
mossy hazel
Where do you think assassination will settle once the first raid pieces are available? Think our ST damage will improve or are we doomed to aoe spammers this expansion
royal lantern
i think it will be good st, decent aoe
knotty dew
Assassination Stat wights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Is this the stat weights when using Elaborate planning or Blindside instead of Master Poisoner?
urban storm
Best to just sim it
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Stat wights:
Single target: haste > crit > mastery > vers
Multi target: crit > mastery > vers >= haste
Note: Simming will always result in more accurate results.
sweet pecan
the icy veins bis list for ass rogue is off at least for the azarite shoulders, me thinks
kindred cedar
Herodamage is what i would recommended for AZT
spare cloud
!darkmoon
prisma monolithBOT
Darkmoon Deck: Fathoms is still a top tier trinket,even after the recent nerf. Herodamage has updated sims for this trinket for all specs.
dry trail
which pvp talents are you running for WQs? gonna be playing assa for 3 weeks cos I'M going to canada and gonna have like 300 MS there, and kinda want to prepare myself 😛
urban storm
Five minutes until more disappointment about not getting any weapons from wq/emissaries
dry trail
we had a 340 mace from a dungeon WQ in eu horde today
barren tree
strange python
^
urban storm
Yea none of that for NA
elfin mantle
there was a wq for fist weap today 😮
urban storm
I’ve run 16 mythics and not gotten a daggee
15 rather, 3 more tonight to finish them off. 320/310 at the moment
dry trail
I got 1 dagger from the 20 mythics, but I already bought a 350 one so I gave it to our other rogue
zenith oak
i saw 5 weapon drops in 2 heroics yesterday and all of them were caster weapons 😦
candid phoenix
i know u guys will hate me but my very 1st mythic drop last week was the dagger in Atal'Dazar
and it was my 1st mythic also xD
zenith oak
I am glad to know, they do exist! 😄
urban storm
Done 7 mythics this week with same group and only two items drop for me total
Hopefully my luck improves, I can’t really complain as I’m 334/338 bag
Nothing 😦 wait begins again
dark isle
I've done 2 this week and got 1 loot from each, so I'm prob not getting anything from the next 8 😂
mystic elbow
opinions?
lofty sand
The UI? seems clean enough
zenith oak
Ya, i like it. I just came back to the game. havent setup my UI yet but i am gonna do something kinda like that. minimalist ftw
mystic elbow
ya im huge fan of minimal ui
verbal cedar
Is assassination performing a lot worse than Outlaw in dungeons?
lofty sand
we lose aoe if thats what you wanna know
plucky thistle
In M+ what woud be more visable? I playing assa 1 year i can pull decent dps, but now learning sub and strugling. Do you think shoud i stay with assa and i dont loss so mutch in M+ or keep learning? 😄
spring lantern
Tbh if you don't wanna learn don't do it, if you do wanna learn keep trying
plucky thistle
I want but im terible, so basicaly i only loss on AoE as Assa
arctic frigate
Self-Rotating Dagger of Xing it is a good dagger for rogue?
solid nova
Is it a good dagger? Yes
How good of a dagger is it? You'll need to sim yourself for the most accurate result
Most likely it'll be a decent upgrade 😄
clever cipher
we mutilate from Vanish now? not Envenom?
clever cipher
the opener in the guide can't be right then
zenith oak
why not? looks right to me
clever cipher
maybe im missing something, i'd think you would get 5cp, then vendetta, vanish and finisher
zenith oak
well, if you land at 5 great, but if you land at 4 its not worth using a mut to get to 5 and then rupture
lofty sand
I think getting garrote up is pretty important isnt it?
zenith oak
garrote with trait is insanely strong and should be your opener from stealth
lofty sand
with the extra CP it also lines perfectly to get 5 cp
strange python
I can not find any weapons I did all the mythic but nothing to do
lofty junco
only a 340 fist weapon from wq -.-
storm delta
Hey guys, do you have problem with energy sometimes? At long fights, my energy really sucks and can't do much. I dont know if i doing something wrong like rotation or it depends from gear
lofty sand
Yes, we're all energy starved.
storm delta
Yay, great i am not the only one
fast fog
I noticed once I hit about 12-15% haste I stopped having energy issues. I've been playing Sub mostly because of being energy starved.
supple compass
are any of the other sin specfic traits remotely close to ss?
storm delta
I have 12% at my assa and still sometimes i have energy problems
strange python
Are you spam clicking your skills?
Cause I've noticed it felt better if I wasnt constantly throwing envenom out and waited till the buff almost ran out
Well this doesn't make shrouded look better
zenith oak
looks like a tooltip bug
thin kernel
Do the dmg part of SS trait stack?
wise frigate
Apparently it's bugged currently so no. It's supposed to.
strange python
It's on the moblie app thought it was funny since it's currently bugged
storm delta
Yea, that's a good tip. I was spell spamming
hardy pewter
there´s your issue, rogues dont use spells
zenith oak
lul
there are times you can spam though, when have 2-3 ruptures/garrotes running at once you can go pretty hard
but single target yea. def need to slow down
storm delta
Okey. Thank you very much guys
versed finch
Anyone know if blizzard has said anything about SS? I check about every day to see if it's even mentioned but find nothing
chrome stag
ok just got killed by level 114 blood dk, guess I need to learn alot about this class
main rain
Yes, first rule don't attack players with legendaries
warm parcel
unlikely to beat a bdk anyway
zenith oak
you lost because of scaling, not because you did something wrong
at least thats most likely the case
chrome stag
ye but still, i'm 120 ilvl 300 I think, needed for some pvp quest to kill someone anyway but failed miserably. won't be login on that rogue tonight surely, afraid of him /w me
:d
zenith oak
so i havent pvp'd at all, but everything i hear is that its very common for 112-115's to stomp 120's. probably some class variance tho
and i might be wrong 😄
strange python
It's fun being weaker than people lower level than yiu
zenith oak
ya, super fun
supple hearth
@zenith oak it's the legendaries. Take them off and you won't do as well
lofty sand
Live QnA happening btw
zenith oak
link?
strange python
zenith oak
ty
molten pike
They hotfixed that btw
the lower levels aren't as strong anymore relative to 120
So uh
when did garrote stop requiring stealth
zenith oak
legion? idk, i hadnt played in a long time and its a thing
molten pike
Yea I hadn't been a rogue since wotlk basically
and I had no idea
I just assumed it was like it had been since classic for me
So I tried assassination yesterday and lamented at the energy regen
while not having half of it
lament dove
I don't get it, how is shrouded suffocation best...? 2 CPs and a few hundred damage every 2 minutes...? what am I missing?
molten pike
I was wondering that too after looking at it
zenith oak
Combo point generation is very good
molten pike
1 cp a minute?
lament dove
I get it for cleave/aoe, but for single target...?
lone junco
@molten pike subterfuge garrotes.
molten pike
It's still only every couple minutes
I know the damage is increased 80%
I guess that couple hundred damage goes through more multipliers making it really significant
in addition to the extra 2 cp
steep citrus
yeah, i think the damge bonus from the trait goes into it before subterfuge doubles it
i THINK
mossy hazel
Garrote is consistently my top damage ability
lone junco
That's normal. FOK should be close in cleave with ep.
fluid burrow
why is my world quest reward 340+ fist when my specialization is assassination?\
lone junco
Wq doesn't change by lootspec.
fluid burrow
feelsbadman
gleaming geyser
SS doesnt even work on live tho
gleaming geyser
gleaming geyser
Would you consider the 2 CP worth taking over some other trait for dungeon packs
warm parcel
2cp alone no
late goblet
Wait so SS doesn't even work atm?
warm parcel
yup
stark token
only just got 11244 simmed dps as asssass 12400 as outlaw 😢
late goblet
And the 2CP isn't worth it to just have 1 SS?
warm parcel
cp alone isnt
late goblet
How do we know it's broken? I couldn't find anything on it
late goblet
How did blizzard manage this
lone junco
I have 2ss ready to roll. Just need it to work.
late goblet
I have 3 atm
barren lotus
they just forgot to add the damage, and added the CP only
my guess
maybe an old build didn't have the damage and they forgot to update
lone junco
"Forgot". Dev voodoo
late goblet
Also is Overwhelming power still best considering the amount of damage taken in dungeons atm?
or is it better to take Heed my call?
zenith oak
https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/azeritelevels/1t-pr-assassination
pretty much rates overwhelming power pretty low across the board. but i dont really know. just what it says.
warm parcel
heed my call is always solid
late goblet
Heed my call stacks? I have 2 of them i could take
warm parcel
every trait in game stacks
late goblet
Aight cool, thank you for your help
zenith oak
except SS 😄
warm parcel
ye well for now
prisma monolithBOT
Do my azerite traits stack?
The damage part of azerite Stacks.
Other components can be assumed to stack however with some exceptions and limitations.
You can check https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/azeritestacks/1t-t22-assassination for estimations.
warm parcel
o
civic palm
mmm
chilly marsh
is there a guide where drops the best azerite pieces ?
royal lantern
check your adventurer guide
zenith oak
if you click on the trait on herodamage it takes you to wowhead which shows all the items that have that trait
chilly marsh
asking because i dont wante to check piece by piece from eveyr dg ?
if someone alredy determined what dg to go for each piece
civic palm
royal lantern
its..........always 2 items from the endboss, nothing more, thats not really hard work lol
chilly marsh
lol do it for me
coral meteor
is it even a dps increase to pool before envenom so you can put mutilates into it or did that die out the same time dp stacks did?
tropic osprey
SS fixed? 😃
warm parcel
no
drifting orbit
is ravenholdt website down? cant load the guides
warm parcel
cant load myself either
zenith oak
worked for me
supple hearth
@drifting orbit yes it's having issues. We have reported it
rocky agate
hows assassination doing rn in regards to pvp? feels like outlaw/sub is all I ever see anymore ):
shell crater
What's the best tier 1 talent for boss fights? I'm using blindside atm but I really don't know xD
zenith oak
i was using blindside but i didnt like it. happen to have really high mastery cause of rng gear and used MP
but gear is balancing out now so i have EP, i like EP the most
but ya sim is best
lofty sand
I was using EP until I got 20+ ilvls upgrades that lowered my haste and shoot up my Mastery. Now i'm using MP
shell crater
I mean my stats are basically just a big mishmash atm xD
sturdy pond
Is there a downside to equip a fistweapon instead of a dagger?
sturdy pond
oh ok, thanks
fluid falcon
I finally learned how to aoe properly. You all should be so proud ❤️😂
zenith oak
share your story
fluid falcon
Well.. i switched to crimson tempest for one. I stealth then garrote 3-4 mobs using subterfuge. Then use crimson tempest, then fan of knives a couple times.. by then you can dps them down 1 by 1. Was doing 11-14k dps on groups of trash in heroics 👍
zenith oak
i assume using EP over MP as well since no poison bomb
ebon bramble
so our poisons benefit from DH 5% magic damage and bleeds from monk 5% physical damage debuff right?
strange python
yes
ebon bramble
so we're split haha
interesting
man wish assassination was more competitive this tier. seems like we have to scale off to next tier before being as competitive as outlaw or sub XD
zenith oak
wait, our poisons benefit from a monk 5% physical damage debuff?
solid nova
!darkmoon
prisma monolithBOT
Darkmoon Deck: Fathoms is still a top tier trinket, even after the recent nerf. Herodamage has updated sims for this trinket, for all specs.
solid nova
Its still very good, yes - you'll need something spicy to replace it thats for sure.
fluid falcon
@zenith oak yes i use ep over mp 😉
supple compass
are people taking poison bomb in dungeons also, or ct
i know the pins say ct, but saw some people saying pb is still better
civic palm
PBOMB will never be better for AoE.
supple compass
ok, and for ct, do you spam it, or only refresh it when neccesary
unborn barn
but CT will be useless in single target, poison bomb not. Make your choice knowing that
royal lantern
well, the PB dmg in st is really low too
fluid falcon
I rather do well in both aoe dmg and st damage vs only really be good in st
royal lantern
ofc its the better st talent, but CT is way better for aoe
fluid falcon
Ya.. and I hate depending on pb procs
lofty junco
PB for comeing tyrannic weak and CT of ya need aoe AND can keep CT and Rupture on the targets
royal lantern
isnt pb dmg something like 3% right now?
foggy briar
Hey guys, anyone else having troubles with energy regen? assassination just feels so slow... i often have downtimes, where I am waiting for energy, so I can build up combo points etc
zenith oak
ST yes, aoe not really
foggy briar
yeah, aoe isnt the problem for me aswell
but st and bossfights are like: autoattack, autoattack.. waiting.. waiting... oh mutilate.. rupture.. waiting.. waiting.. xD
any tips?
zenith oak
maximise envenom uptime, be patient
foggy briar
kk anything else I could try? it just feels so slow
zenith oak
not that i know of. gear reset. game slows down
foggy briar
kk thanks
royal lantern
sin rogue is no spamm class
its good too pool energy for important windows with toxicblade and stuff, you dont always spamm skills anyway
quiet junco
So I checked the pins, where are there weap enchants. They all say apply to anything lower than ilvl 136 on ah....
quiet junco
Thanks
abstract crescent
anyone playing sin in pvp
rain breach
Sin best pvp rogue spec ;)
abstract crescent
😄
rain breach
Since we have a longer ttk
rain breach
What is trash?
rain breach
Sin is best pvp spec
rain breach
Nope
Only outlaw sux a bit in pvp, but still viable
This addon rogue spec's are pretty balanced
Play what you like most
ember violet
outlaw and sub will be best for 3s, assa not so much
royal lantern
sin has good st dmg and constant preassure with dots, sub has really good utility and is simply a asshole in 1v1 fights, outlaw has good ranged cc with bettwen the eye's and is also quite strong in 1v1 situations
rain breach
Thats what i say all 3 are good
And since the time to kill is higher this addon, dots are stronger than before
cinder palm
Outlaw has great control with gouge/BTE. I think it’s quite strong in 3s
lethal heart
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
Assassination Guide: http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
opaque tree
Shrouded Suff is frustrating, why aren't they fixing it... lol they've done so many hotfixes already
😦
rain breach
But btw have someone a blindside/multi macro?
idle radish
what lvl 100 talent for lvling?
zenith oak
probably PB
idle radish
ty m8, was thinking i dont use tempest enough
idle radish
exsan or tb
urban storm
guess ill try again nextw eek to get daggers 😦
valid junco
its hilarious to see 4 x swords in wq rewards .... as an assassination rogue 😄
like giving retripaladins a shield
urban storm
i have had 1 quest reward dagger the entire expansion
it was 320
id consider switching to outlaw if i got a 340 sword
valid junco
no way outlaw is for no brainers
abstract crescent
Pvp talents for sin?
valid junco
do we need to recast our bleeds after using trinkets that give us stats ? or do the bleeds get buffed while they last ?
example trinket galecallers boon , giving us 1k haste
woeful wraith
Cleave sims me vs outlaw friend best in bag:
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/crviMCP9DJ1vu2GfisWW8q
vs
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/rC4TXfRdWVnfamk1MmDsb3
sad
still pewter
sacred ore
guys is this website better than icey veins/wowhead for trinket and azerite traits comparison?
honest needle
what u guys think is better for mythics sub or sin ?
honest needle
sin gonna be better for raiding
strange python
maybe
spiral pebble
why do i feel so starved for energy? im just following the rotation on ravenholdt. Is it possible to do the rotation to fast? or is that just where the spec is at right now
honest needle
u using deadly and masterful weapon enchants for sub or is it better to use haste
@spiral pebble I feel starved for energy as well playing sub
strange python
use navigation enchants for your top 2 stats
honest needle
@strange python I kno to use whats best for top 2 stats, but i cant decide cause mastery better for aoe and haste better for bosses
so i cant choose between those 2
i got deadly alrdy
sacred ore
guys which trait blood rite or scent of blood? because they're approx the same
sacred ore
what would u choose
lone junco
the one that is higher in aoe
woeful wraith
@still pewter mfd doesn't work in that sim it'll show lower dps
strange python
good point if they are the same in single target than the top aoe one wins
lofty sand
I just got a ring that is 15 ilvls upgrade for me. But when I sim it, its worse than mine. Because it has no haste in it.
Boy I love this haste hungry patch.
vapid moth
What's the actual ring ilvl @lofty sand
idle radish
does the garrote az trait stack? making it generate 5 points?
strange python
the damage stacks but right now it doesn't because bugged.
sacred ore
i sim by using stat weights in raidbots?
royal lantern
thats....simming your stath weigts
onyx falcon
just gonna... put this in here...
warm parcel
Not too shabby
violet sonnet
Did Shrouded Suffocation get fixed yet?
warm parcel
No
dark token
whats bugged about it?
zenith oak
the damage doesnt work
slender sandal
Are they " looking into it " 
onyx falcon
has anyone gotten it to proc off Vanish?
cause i dont get the bonus 2 CP off vanish garrotes
also @ weak makes sense
slender sandal
Works for me :s
warm parcel
Hopedully fixt soon tm
onyx falcon
do you use a vanish/garrote macro?
warm parcel
No
slender sandal
Nope
onyx falcon
maybe thats wuts fking w/ it
warm parcel
Ss doesnt work for you on vanish?
warm parcel
Prolly need delay inbetween
tough lantern
SS fixed yet?
latent obsidian
thinking about switching to assassin how does it compare to the other specs?
blazing hinge
All 3 specs are in a good place. I'd recommend playing all 3 specs honestly.
trail otter
Does it matter if I refresh the 5 CP rupture RIGHT when it hits 7.2 or is it still efficient even at lets say 2 seconds left?
Is there a downside to this or is it all the same between the window of 1-7.2 ?
lament dove
if I'm correct the remaining duration is added to the next one but maximum 33%, that's why the refresh window
in the end it doesn't really matter, because if you refresh it later, it will last just as long (up to the same point in time)
odd tundra
i just have a weak aura that glows meeehhh
lament dove
yes, if refreshing it at 1 or 7.2 would be better, you would see that in the guides:)
the point is if you refresh it in the 7.2-1 window, you don't lose any uptime
trail otter
okay sweet, thjank you for the quick response 😄
yeah I realize that was just wondering if the pandemic mechanic had any weird interactions or some shiet
ebon bramble
i assume shrouded suffocation is still bugged?
@blazing hinge are all three specs competitive? i've heard its sub > outlaw > assassination right now
trail otter
That is the correct strength order currently. But that doesnt mean they arent competitive. Assa always scales so I think at end of Uldir it is a top spec
ebon bramble
unless blizzard nerfs it prior to that lol
odd tundra
play assa
ebon bramble
i enjoy assa the most
trail otter
Then play assa
odd tundra
when/if you beat one of the other specs it feels better
ebon bramble
it just sucks it doesnt feel as competitive when im playing with a DH, monk or arms warrior in mythic righ tnow
warm parcel
As long as youre below the treshold of 30%, you lose nothing
lament dove
use sub/outlaw with aoe spec for aoe and assa with ST spec for bosses:)
the more hectic a fight, the more you can screw up shadowdances, assa is more consistent
ebon bramble
i suppose
and i bguess
plus tuning is not finished yet, maybe the aoe kings will get nerfed
lament dove
btw, do you guys use CT...? I don't see the magic, it just keep me energy starved, so in the end I'm doing the same aoe dmg with PB and rupturing left and right
nimble hazel
Ct doesn't count as a bleed for the energy reg
So you still need to get a few ruptures or garrotes up to sustain your energy
odd tundra
well poison bomb is rng but ct makes us even worse for st i reckon
if ct gave energy regen it would be op
silk jolt
Guys I had a cataract operation yesterday. How soon can I play world of Warcraft.
I feel like I'm missing out on stuff
odd tundra
i'm feeling like i get really predictable sustained dmg atm and when poison bomb procs it spikes ALOT
frank aspen
Is everyone getting the same trinket in todays emissarry? It seems crazy.
wise frigate
No. 
wise frigate
Thank you for rubbing salt in the wound.
dusk jacinth
i got emblem too
frank aspen
Oh.. i forgot blizzard forgot theyre dicks. Sorry Birb..
dusk jacinth
But First mate's spyglass is better
frank aspen
well atleast i hope your alliance so you got your rep and can rub that back
dusk jacinth
Even at a 15 ilvl difference
wise frigate
It's EU only again. I'll just dry my tears with these war resources.
frank aspen
Sparq i got fathoms, galecaller and emblem
dusk jacinth
oh i see
frank aspen
should i do fathoms and gale or emb?
guess emb will have the highest output in the long run
depending on the procs
slender sandal
350 emblem for me whooo
wise frigate
Can always sim yourself. I guess I'm not too too salty since I have a 335 Emblem already.
tough lantern
i've done every mythic that drops dagger and heroic still no daggers
so mad rn
has blizzard adressed SS bug at all?
warm parcel
Fix soon tm
tough lantern
🙏
frank aspen
@wise frigate @dusk jacinth So Birb, if it makes you feel any better - The emblem loses me 150 dps...
frank aspen
Its better?
frank aspen
i lose 50 dps from galecaller
i mean from taking spyglass > galecaller
Master poisoner or elaborate planning sims highest?
I guess if you did spyglass EP it would be stronger.
warm parcel
You can ask raidbots numbers questions
valid junco
do u open with galecaller activated first or do u push it after the bleed application ?
cause it seems that subterfuge and shrouded suffocation doesnt work if u use trinket in stealth and garrote after it
valid junco
with subterfuge it should stay in stealth though , as we are able to use other stealth stuff after trinket usage
but with opener garrote and stuff the galecaller seems a bit shitty if u can only 10 second mutilate or apply one rupture with it
valid junco
in raid bosses , galecaller still seems to be ok but in mythic plus content its not the bis to go on it seems atleast like this
grizzled harness
Hey! Small question : Do we need to wait the end of the buffed garrotes from stealth (with SS) before puting it again?
Or did I misunderstood the azerite trait
warm parcel
Would if the trait even worked rn
grizzled harness
So eventually yeah
lament dove
even if it doesn't work, the garrote is buffed by subterfuge, so you wait, no?
lament dove
but I usually don't wait because I suck and forget lol
zealous dew
mmm I forgot, azerite armor can only WF +10 tops right ?