Thats why its incomplete
#assassination
warm parcel
civic palm
๐
jolly heart
Does anyone know the maths for TB before KB for bigger initial hit VS hold TB for when KB is 10secs from finishing to bolster final ticks?
Assuming 100% Env uptime for both
civic palm
If TB is up for the beginning use it there. If it comes up during KB save for the last 8 seconds.
jolly heart
Yeah, easy, that's pretty much how I've been going about it
civic palm
๐
jolly heart
Yeah, in kinda feels uninspired to just press shit when off cd
not thougtful clipping
nope, just press buttons as they come
viscid helm
Well lucky for you, that is 90% of the specs in BFA
strange python
we all frost dk now
jovial kite
we ded
strange python
my bleed sims highest without t20 which i guess means im going back to ToS
steep obsidian
My t20 is 930 and itโs very marginal but I wear the cos 2 set in my best gear rn
It plays so much better though
warm heath
whats bis leggos looking like atm
uneven loom
mantle + bracers is go to
warm parcel
No
uneven loom
๐ฎ
solid nova
Sim your legendary combinations
Depends on stat weights
There's no generic "These two are best"
warm heath
belt ring boots bracets?
shitty stated 26 crit 13 haste 137 mast and 8 vers
913ilvl
warm heath
yeah i figured
warm parcel
What ever combos you want you should sim
warm heath
just looking for a quick answer dont know if i care to go through all the work to sim
solid nova
Lol
warm heath
but yeah i can look into it
warm parcel
Then you can pick fav 2
zealous dew
savage
strange python
Hi
solid nova
Download Simc
Go to raidbots
Equip gear
type /simc in wow
Paste
Wait
Simming is hard.
zealous dew
are you an alpha male ?
solid nova
Alpha Broccoli
gaunt moat
lol idiot alphas.
i've surpassed the pathetic alpha, and i'm now a beta.
midnight latch
well u can more or less simulate it shadow
just leave out kingsbane
and wait one second after cds
solid nova
What does me liking it have to do with it being good or not rofl
strange python
Never asked if it was good either
strange python
Ty zol
turbid harbor
sub and outlaw both feel silky smooth
shrewd night
'how is sin'
solid nova
Doesnt matter if its good
Doesnt matter if its best
shrewd night
solid nova
Just roll a dice and play whatever then
turbid harbor
np boiiii
gaunt moat
it feels the same. except no KB, and it doesn't matter if you clip anything.
strange python
Is it fun tho
midnight latch
subjective question
turbid harbor
even with vigor you barely have enough energy to envenom between ruptures
solid nova
Fun for you is fun for me
strange python
Whats wrong with that
gaunt moat
@turbid harbor have you made the same msitake i did and forgot to apply poisons?
turbid harbor
but that's probably different at 120
shrewd night
outlaw is hella fun with 100% haste
turbid harbor
i did apply poisons ๐
strange python
No
turbid harbor
i did roughly the same dps as all 3 specs with an hour on dummy
strange python
It dosnt matter for me
turbid harbor
all around 2k
strange python
Im asking your experience
shrewd night
My what?
turbid harbor
but i assume gear will help sin feel less like shit
gaunt moat
probably yeah with more haste and crit
shrewd night
My experience being, alpha dont matter one centimeter
gaunt moat
@shrewd night why are you being such a stick in the mud
strange python
Maybe heโs having a bad day
shrewd night
Sticks in the mud is the best kind of toys tho
strange python
Let him be
midnight latch
@gaunt moat I read that sentence somewat different at the end
I need some coffee
also
Its monday in here
apparently
lots of 
solid nova
The levels of ree depend on the question asked before hand
shrewd night
^
midnight latch
How to tilt someone:
- you pick em up
- u flip them
- u put em down
midnight latch
4 u leave em be
solid nova
Oh ๐ฆ
midnight latch
5, report richard to authorities
shrewd night
Richards way of tilting someone is way shorter
Step 1 - Focus on computer rather than individual changing
midnight latch
In all seriousness
If u think the other one is tilting
maybe look at ur actions first
solid nova
My ree levels are currently at 1
strange python
๐
solid nova
When was the last time I tilted ๐ค
solid nova
Oh, when that guy left
strange python
Yesterday
midnight latch
shrewd night
can someone else than richard talk now pls
strange python
@gaunt moat isnt it tho
Nvm bic boi don is here to cleanse the discord
We
Gucci
Fam
solid nova
Bad moderation or people complaining because โ life
prisma gull
This chat is always blowing up
solid nova
Because Outlaw and Sub is dead
prisma gull
Like I blink and there's 30 new messages
solid nova
Only 30
strange python
Only elitists in sin
gaunt moat
@prisma gull monday morning, bored people at work, what do you expect ๐
solid nova
Elitists ๐
strange python
We have to argue
solid nova
Not catering for bad players = Elitist
dire spoke
what is going on here 
solid nova
Got it
strange python
I tilted richard with 1 word
prisma gull
I blink really fast..
I'm also bored at work but occasionally I have to actually work, come back to phone in 3 minutes, scroll for days to catch up lol
turbid harbor
some people are pretty toxic when they give advice for little reason
strange python
Im a sensitive boi
solid nova
I can tell
midnight latch
hnnngh arent tilt levels thou 
prisma gull
The only thing I tilt are seesaws boi
dire spoke
it's warm and I want a Nogger
midnight latch
dire spoke
I haven't had ice cream for AGES
midnight latch
ok richard lets get outside #off-topic
solid nova
Aye
solid nova
Went months ago when Naya left
strange python
All cool people left
midnight latch
I put my gloomblades up on the wall
strange python
Rip speedbleed
midnight latch
removed my rings
strange python
Rip tumna
midnight latch
^ this
solid nova
The end
steep obsidian
midnight latch
sad when someone can sum up ur whole life story in only 8 words 
steep obsidian
off topic discussion best discussion
gaunt moat
people asked for off-topic channel. you have it. so use it
shrewd night
Can we ask for that channel to be removed 
gaunt moat
gaunt moat
i have a good side, and a dark side
wise frigate
I believe selfies belong in #off-topic
solid nova
dire spoke
@final star 
final star
๐ก
safe matrix
If you don't have nitro does that mean you have daytro instead?
jovial kite
๐คฃ
steep obsidian
vapid moth
Hmm
jovial kite
cold spoke
civic palm
=\
civic palm
Yeah but you can't have it.
Nothing new atm.
Too early/late, no sleep, could think of the word constituent yet not the word citizen.
O _O"
spare cloud
Im in for some old stuff
If nothing news out i just listen to red velvet and iu anyways
With some other stuff mixed in
civic palm
I LIED
pseudo river
so sin looks pretty nice, being playing a round a little last night on alpha, good to see we have dispatch Blindside back
civic palm
O _O"
SOME HAWT SHIT
NSFW at all
[MV] ํจ๋ฆฐ(HYOLYN) - ๋ฌ๋ฆฌ(Dally) (Feat.GRAY)
Don't tell #off-topic
midnight latch
wrong chanel
civic palm
Yeah well they are in there being Discord Political, will let them be.
@pseudo river Yeah but I don't know how good Blindside IS.
shrewd night
Why are you racist with your kpop?
civic palm
Compared to the other options in that tier even.
civic palm
Yeah well, reunify that shit and I will post some.
spare cloud
Red velvet actually held a concert in nk recently
civic palm
Yeah but things didn't go swell > _>"
pseudo river
I see MP being nice with TB for the poison build
pseudo river
i admit im pretty new to this Leigon style sin, last mained it in WoD,
seems like the subterfuge with exanguinate might be a nice cleave build
with CT aswell perhaps
pseudo river
indeed, purely speculation but interesting talent changes nevertheless
civic palm
heh
pseudo river
subterfuge making garrote spamable and hit twice as hard for 2 seconds sounds really noice
civic palm
But yeah SIN in Legion is more like SUB from WoD without the Find Weakness uptimes considerations.
Though we've things like Surge of Toxins to consider but it's effectively auto-pilot.
turbid harbor
night stalker empowered crimson tempest will do more with current tuning
civic palm
Garrote being 45NRG in BfA makes it not very spammable at all still.
The Garrote CD is already 6 seconds ๐
pseudo river
ah that is true, didnt think about the cost
turbid harbor
thatโs hilarious
viscid helm
Yup
civic palm
Which is kinda butt while at the same time nice for having an ACTUAL AoE finisher.
glad ferry
How's rogue looking on alpha so far? is sin still the bis spec
civic palm
Good. Who knows.
pseudo river
hard to tell by the looks of it
pseudo river
0 tuning, sub is still missing a 100 talent
civic palm
Yeah things are very much not done.
pseudo river
CDs being on the global feel... interesting
i tried sub out, granted i didnt know much about what i was doing as Im fairly new but having shadow blades and SoD on the GCD was odd
steep obsidian
gcd change is just not fun will get used to itand it not a huge deal for sin
talent options seem ok
steep obsidian
i havent seen anyone who plays at a decent level who thinks its a good change tbh
glad ferry
no clue why they thought it was a good idea
probably because plebs went on the forums complaining about how ''hard it is to have ALL the cds up at the same time REEE''
pseudo river
i recall their mantra for this exp is less emphasis on burst CDs and more on strengthening the rotatoin
civic palm
DPS GCD changes are fine, especially for SIN, we don't really care.
glad ferry
Blizzard only listens to idiots on the forums
civic palm
If that were true.
pseudo river
And by that i heard it a few times
glad ferry
they dont care about their good players cause theyre a minority
steep obsidian
they have said that they dont like burst windows and stacking cds before
then they make specs that work that way
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
steep obsidian
for sure
civic palm
Having 2 of a few of DPS classes be CD focused is fine, having 12 is not great.
pseudo river
nothing stopping them going "na we'll revert that change"
you can sort of see that is the directions they want
Im sure PVPers were complaining about burstiness too
civic palm
120%
steep obsidian
i havent paid attention to pvp for ages
mossy hazel
I've heard the way it's been implemented and how the devs have said "don't just negetively sweep it yet" is pointing to a big rework or the GDC, like they know this isn't the final implimentation
pseudo river
nothing is final with another 4 months of testing
civic palm
They've also put more spells on the .5s GCD recently.
No telling what else is being put there.
mossy hazel
Like the knew it wouldn't be received well at all as it is right now, but they have something else on the books
pseudo river
yeah the .5 gcd is a weird one, to stop macroing everything into 1 button no doubt
civic palm
Considering the company, there is more-than-likely another option to anything that isnt a core feature and requires a lot of work.
Like legendaries > _>
Hate them all you want, they were not going anywhere.
As much as people want to shit on Blizzard for literally ruining WoW every expansion it's still one of the biggest games on the planet.
steep obsidian
i mean if it goes live i just hope they fix the shit for classes that it makes them play really badly for
for sin rogue its barely noticeable
mossy hazel
I mean I may not agree with the direction they've taken things occasionally, but I've played since vanilla, on and off a few times, but usually pretty consistantly. I've played other MMOs, there is nothing out there better than WoW right now as far as I'm concerned
civic palm
Yeah Warriors are losing some buttons to push in order, but there's still a few you can talent into.
steep obsidian
its like legos it took them like 3 patches to even balance them remotely if the lego system went live like it is now it wouldnt have been that bad
but when you doing mythic and some dude lucked out and got the shoulders before you it sucked
civic palm
I've grown out of getting annoyed by other peoples' luck, even though it did suck shit.
Lot less of that in BFA though, so that's nice.
spare cloud
Idk i havent seen a dude who purely hc raids getting even close to my gear
civic palm
They won't.
and if they do, their parses are not magically better.
Unless they had some PBOMB magic.
spare cloud
The titanforged system is not good but it doesnt have that big of an impact this late in the expansion
civic palm
But then you look at the 22% PBOMB parse and shake your fucking head.
spare cloud
I agree that rng can make a huge difference in early progress though
mossy hazel
What do you guys mean by parses, I'm seeing that a lot lately
spare cloud
Logs
civic palm
Logging.
Combat logging being exported and uploaded into a visual parser like WarcraftLogs.
mossy hazel
So I've got people in my guild saying they're seeing parses during fights? Is that a thing?
Or are they probably just talking about when they go look at it later
civic palm
Sounds like normal Damage Meters.
Though if you are Live Logging you can get the logging exported after the fight finishes.
mossy hazel
Hmm, I'll have to look into that
spare cloud
Also extremely useful to get you kicked when you mess up
mossy hazel
Lol
civic palm
Unless your RL doesn't have a fucking spine.
mossy hazel
Shit half the time lately our RL isn't in the fucking raid...
mossy hazel
Yea... trying to find a new guild..
spare cloud
Without logs thats gonna be difficult
mossy hazel
I mean I have logs, I hit warcraftlogs after every raid night
civic palm
Though with current day logs and a shit raid team, good logs are fucking impossible.
mossy hazel
I just didn't know if there was something else I was missing, based on the way my raid was talking about them
civic palm
Should ask them > _>
mossy hazel
I'm not even in mythic so...
My guild is barely breaking into heroic right now... Another reason I want a new guild
mossy hazel
I'm assuming looking at the ILvl% is better than just the basic Perf%?
hot torrent
yep
hot torrent
and also, not only the dps meter decides a good log. ppl can track your defensive cd usage und target selection, so they can see if u switch on important adds and so on
wise frigate
For a barely heroic guild 70-75 is just fine.
If anything, that's better than most people probably do in that guild, right?
mossy hazel
The top dps for our run this weekend was a Shaman (I think enhance based on the abilities "m seeing). It was her at #1 followed by me, but she only had 32% ilvl on garothi
stark heart
ilvl performance is pretty tricky metric, same ilvl can mean whole lot different gear
mossy hazel
That's a fair point, I can understand that
civic palm
G G
dire spoke
full raid buffed 965 rogue did the same output like me *974 unbuffed - so yeah ilvl doesn't really do much for sin
hot torrent
947 lol
dire spoke
oh
mossy hazel
So how do I know if I suck or not then!!?? Lol
mossy hazel
Oh good, I'm pretty on point then
civic palm
If you are doing less than your simulated DPS if you simmed for light movement, on a fight that has a little movement...
then there is room for improvement.
mossy hazel
I'll need to sim again now that I've got my 4p, but last I simmed out at 1.3m and I was averaging 1.3 at the time, I'm up to 1.5 - 1.6 now with a couple upgrades.
civic palm
Best thing you can do is try to get better week after week.
mossy hazel
I mean I'm trying. I know what I'm SUPPOSED to do, and I know 100% when I make a mistake in the moment, just need to work on reducing those.
I got a lot of good info from you guys here last week too that I've been working on.
dire spoke
with 1.5m you're likely still low on crit and struggling on clipping stuff
so don't worry
mossy hazel
Someone named Richard took some time to go over my logs with me last week and pointed out some good stuff I could work on. Fixed an issue with my opener I didn't know I had, confirmed I was doing the majority of things right. Was a good chat
lone junco
But that being said. My ilvl parses at poison would prob be 88-92. but exang is 98-99
nothing like 75s
Pretty sure the pks are gone
mossy hazel
I'm only 948, what is old PK playstyle?
forest acorn
PK playstyle was when the artifact trait poison knives was strong enough that we fokked on single target. no longer viable
lone junco
at 948 1.3m is reasonable.
dire spoke
good thing I was sub back then 
cba
spare cloud
Good thing i didnt play back then
hoary copper
Im 950 and 1.7, so its not bad Prototype
spare cloud
Im pretty sure a 940 rogue with better items could easily get over that
So take ilvl parses with a grain of salz
steep obsidian
i could equip random ilvl pieces and sim 1.5 at 975
spare cloud
No im talking like normal gear with perfect stats
steep obsidian
prolly less
spare cloud
I mean if i just drop 4pc im going down like 400k
With same ilvl
I think i tried that recently when simming ring boots
Forgot 4pc and was at like 1,85m
dire spoke
fishing pole
hoary copper
Anything below probably like 960 or 965 is going to be a bit more rng based on getting decent pieces
That's quite a difference with the 4p
mossy hazel
Yea, I still need to replace my head piece, just been absolutely shit luck on drops... Still have a 910... Just got my 4p early last week, too
Based on how my guild has been doing, I'm just going to start pugging heroic in hopes of making some actual progress and getting some upgrades
hoary copper
Pugging heroic is fun (said no one ever)
dire spoke
it's fun until vari
mossy hazel
Haha, can't be worse than actually trying to run with my guild... We got stuck on high command for like 2 hours this weekend
dire spoke
and then you need an other group
wise frigate
Dodging the big purple bois is even harder.
dire spoke
gotta proc memento trinkets with lightning pewpewpew
hoary copper
This week even normal has been a struggle, idk whats going on this week
solid nova
My hc clear this week, 1 shot everything with a pug
I was in shock
No one left, nothing
dire spoke
you been dreaming richard
mossy hazel
That's the dream
dire spoke
ID still up
hoary copper
I mean if you have aotc getting an ok pug is prob a little easier.
solid nova
Did it last night Zempai my boy
mossy hazel
I do not have it... That's one of my few remaining goals before bfa for this character
Then I just go nuts with alts
hoary copper
Pugs could not get even kin down last night on normal, was painful. Was on my mage doing 2nd in dps at 900K
mossy hazel
Eep
worthy moon
Is it worth it to refresh Rupture at 4 CP in pandemic range or mutilate on 4 and potentially have Rupture fall off for a couple seconds before refresh but you get a 6 cp Rupture.
Same question but factoring in Exsang. Should I 4 CP rupture into Exsang or mut for 6 cp rupture (delayed) into Exsang (also delayed meaning less value I'd guess)
hoary copper
I dont have it either. Ive gotten to Coven but havent gotten coven down, also havent had a group get HC down
mossy hazel
I've been in normal pugs with my mistweaver, punching things and doing more dps than actual dps classes. It's a little scary
hoary copper
Rupture at 4 cp, you should be trying to use finishers at 4 @worthy moon
solid nova
@worthy moon So yes, you should be refreshing at 4 or more CPs within pandemic
But if you're at 4, you dont need to go any higher
hoary copper
Exsang I'm not as sure about, I thought exsang you refresh at like .7 seconds or something like that
solid nova
Where's @lone junco when you need him
hoary copper
Or Slagg
solid nova
Its a bleedy boy question
wise frigate
Busy talking about TF in #off-topic
solid nova
๐ญ
lone junco
Get 10 mins a day.
hoary copper
You're the reason for it probably ๐
solid nova
@worthy moon I think regardless, at 4CPs its not worth muting as the potential for wasted CPs is too high, especially as a bleed with crits.
Refresh during pandemic at 4+
hoary copper
Also Vigor is prob a better talent...though idk for bleed
lone junco
Bleed. Typ don't mut on 4. But prior to exang always a 6cp rupture.
I do 5/6cp into 6cp.
Jack is more precise.
But the 32s vs 24 is important.
Then during maintenance between 4cp is ideal
With 75+ Mut crit that is very easy to do.
worthy moon
Sounds good to me, tyvm
lone junco
And it is absolutely ep/ns/DS...exsang/vv
hoary copper
Need more crit to drop....preferably without haste. 955 Crit/haste cloak from weekly mythics
lone junco
2p4p bracer boot. Crit comes from rings and neck.
But at this point bleed is just a struggle
hoary copper
Yea I keep getting verse/mastery. I made a list of where upgrades would fall and bonus rolled, got AP. rng is rng
worthy moon
I'm pretty new back so bleed is just what parses higher for me atm. I have neither tier sets haha
worthy moon
Sims, my bad
hoary copper
That's surprising
shrewd night
Vers heavy gear or bad stats in general I guess
hoary copper
high crit gear maybe
worthy moon
I have way too much haste + mastery for a bleed build imo but it's what raidbots told me. Didn't believe it, simc'ed myself, still true. It's a fairly minute difference however. That being said, at my ilvl, I'll take any edge I can get.
worthy moon
I have only boots at.
lone junco
not the Exang.
worthy moon
Atm
lone junco
if you have 3v and boots, it makes sens
grand sigil
Is a 880 Convergence of Fates worth replacing a 965 Singed fangs when using the boots with 3 Vendetta traits?
zealous dew
lol no
solid nova
Sim would answer that but also it wont even come close @grand sigil
viscid helm
never coming back
urban blaze
Sat on a 970 eoc my trinkets are locked
spare cloud
Eoc on cleave fights
solid nova
EoC with 2 targets is fine ๐คท๐ผ
dusty shoal
Hi, sry to bother you but I really enjoy my rogue alt...currently using shoulders and fok legendary for low m+...any advice on better legendaries?
solid nova
Daily emissary quests
Capping wakening essence each week
Raids including LFR
PVP
A lot of content can unlock legendaries
dusty shoal
u got me wrong, im asking which legendaries to use for m+....sry ๐
mellow pasture
If i am trying bleed build
When do I Kingsbane now? As soon as it's up or save for vendetta exsang combo
solid nova
Oh - what are your options? @dusty shoal
hoary copper
Shoulder/Bracer I think are still technically strongest.
But it also may depend on level of it too and of course off pieces
dusty shoal
@solid nova i got all of them ^^
solid nova
Oh ๐
Cloak is literally shit for Assassination mate
You'll do swimmingly with Shoulders/Bracers
Wouldnt recommend the FoK cloak for anything assasination wise mate
dusty shoal
ok, felt good in a quick daily hc though ^^
lean hill
Daily HC you can just run ahead and solo bosses lol
dusty shoal
well my rogue is a reeeeeally shitty alt around 940, not running high m+ atm ^^
dusty shoal
already dumped it in the bank ๐
lean hill
Any dungeon where you can split is nice. Lower kara, go kill maiden while group clears trash to attumen lol
dusty shoal
well, on my main I got kicked twice this week for soloing stuff :/
ppl are angry about everything these days
hoary copper
People seem extra special this week
Took 2 or 3 groups for normal Kin on my mage -.-
solid nova
Half the reason why i rolled tank myself for the most part of legion
Shit tanking or slow tanks are the worst
dusty shoal
yeah, overgeared people in hc pulling mobs solo triggers me instantly ๐
single mobs i meant
solid nova
Just pull the whole dungeon and get finished asap
lean hill
People tend not to say much because you can stealth ahead as rogue
And when the first boss dies while they are killing the first trash pack they get on board
dusty shoal
thx for the quick advice guys, gonna go get to work....take care ๐
solid nova
Later mate
lean hill
Had the worst PB luck I've ever seen the other day
Was running a quick upper 16, PB finished 13th damage. 0 procs on shade, 0 on worm and 0 on viz
solid nova
Jesus
hoary copper
I had like 3 the entire eonar the other day, then PK and it was like nonstop
Yea that's pretty bad
lean hill
This run it was about 2%
The giant pull after the worm boss, 0 on that as well. Didnt help that I was carrying alts either Haha
normal cedar
Hey guys, I'm looking for some help in maximizing my dps. I have my logs all available but they're not nearly as high as I'd like. Is it just poison bomb proc rng or is my rotation off? https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/id/31104905
civic palm
PBomb average for single target is 7%.
The later Kingsbanes have some ENV uptime gaps.
Very good.
mellow pasture
In bleedspec when should you kingsbane?
civic palm
This last Vendetta sub 30%?
mellow pasture
Kingsbane on CD or do I save for exsang combo?
hoary copper
Not sure with bleed specifically, but I dont believe you want to hold kb. Not sure how they align tho
@jovial kite or @lone junco are the expert bleedy bois
supple hearth
Send him a dm he's probably not on atm
jovial kite
@mellow pasture cd
you can pretty easily line it up with vendettas though
but kingsbane isnt as impactful in exsang as it is in tb
mellow pasture
Thanks slaggy.
Any more tips for optimizing bleed?
Rotation wise? I try to keep pandemic up and combo vendetta and exsang. Envenoming on 4 cp
normal cedar
ty @civic palm I haven't been Sin for super long so still a WIP. I know I could use some better Mastery Crit gear
civic palm
Just make sure to save that last Vanish for under 30%, line up what you can, don't hold things for over 5 seconds, 2-3 ENV inside TB, maximize NRG while keeping ENV up during KB, don't be afraid to refresh Rupture @ 3CP before going into a DPS cycle.
dapper wraith
I'm trying to catch up after taking a break since NH. During normal rotation, should I be spamming my envenom asap? Or build CP, then hold my finisher for a brief second to pool, and not clip the envenom buff so much?
civic palm
Read the guide, there have been updates.
dapper wraith
I did multiple times, that specific point isn't clear to me.
unless I've missed a section
simple jackal
is there any interaction betwenn cloak and the diabolic bomb on kin garoth? I triggerd one with cloak on in mythic and every player received like 1m dmg and the boss had at least one 25% more dmg buff...
anyone noticed something similar?
civic palm
Yeah Cloak of Shadows doesn't stop the raid damage
The triggered explosion still goes off.
simple jackal
i noticed that but the dmg was low as fuck
civic palm
@dapper wraith Clip ENV, only spamming is during TB or Mantle window.
Could have been your positioning/their positioning?
hoary copper
Use finishers at 4+ combo points.ย When both bleeds are up useย Envenomย at . Try to use Envenom right before your Envenom buff falls off'@dapper wraith
2nd bullet point
civic palm
Could be cloak interacting in a stupid way and not triggering positional conditions on the bomb.
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
simple jackal
maybe, should have wiped us no doubt ๐
dapper wraith
@civic palm @hoary copper ty both. I saw that but for some reason my brain didn't make the connection. cheers.
mellow pasture
@hoary copper bruenbut why did the sentence stop.
hoary copper
Because that's all thats in the bullet point?
mellow pasture
We must uncover the secrets lol
hoary copper
New Nickname
manic vigil
strange python
yo guys just returned after like 1-2 months, anything new on the sin front?
gaunt moat
nope
warm parcel
get pb
strange python
coolio
strange python
How's DS vs Vigor atm?
warm parcel
bleed vs poison
strange python
no ds in poison?
warm parcel
na
strange python
fair game
midnight latch
@strange python welcome back
patent yarrow
i dont know if this has been noticed yet on the alpha. but bleeds are being effected by haste the same way hots are on resto druids.
mossy hazel
I saw Infexious did a video about that. What do you guys think about that change?
hoary copper
It's intended as far as we know. At least it wont make haste useless
patent yarrow
i havent checked yet but is dp ticking the same rate?
mossy hazel
I think Infexious' video showed poison was being effected the same as bleeds. I could be wrong though
I'm like 90% sure he tested that in the video though
patent yarrow
or better yet ill just test it and let ya'll know lol
mossy hazel
Lol
Would you guys say sin is going in a good direction on alpha right now? Bad direction? Not really movig?
strange python
I'd say it's not really going in a direction
Losing some abilities and apm, and that's that
hoary copper
How to make a low apm spec even lower
gaunt moat
no... if anything apm will go down
also adding more buttons != APM when they are locked by GCD
hoary copper
sin, the one handed spec of champions
gaunt moat
b-but GCD
fervent beacon
I'm not a huge fan of gcd change
spark pond
Guys, a help please. I started getting more serious into M+ runs. I know that people tend to use Sub for high keys but I like playing as Assa and I'm doing well so far in 19-20+ keys. Are there any guides for Rogues M+ (assa prefereably)? I wanna know what kind of gear/talents/tips should I use.
keen inlet
I mean if you're doing well in 19-20+ keys
idk what a guide is going to tell you
๐
(That you don't already know)
gaunt moat
i dunno of any m+ specific guides. what would that guide contain even
plain thistle
mossy hazel
Geeze, you're looking for a guide for 20+? Could you write a guide for us peasants still doing 10s?
keen inlet
I'm being sincere
gaunt moat
@keen inlet
plain thistle
more precisely, don emotes
gaunt moat
pliz
keen inlet
hold up
I feel like
that emoji doesn't work without it's companion
which is the universe-expanded brain at the end of the meme
spark pond
nah, I mean...I'm doing well 20+, but I'm using the same talents/gear I use in raids, wanna know if there are any better comps for M+ to improve my gameplay
strange python
doing well in m+ is mostly player skill and reaction timing
keen inlet
@spark pond For that it's going to depend on the affixes, the dungeon, a lot of specific stuff
gaunt moat
well do you have better emotes?
I'm all ears.
https://scontent.fsdv2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/29178461_1921698404794861_8179387163620671488_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=72d607db3ecf9c870735577bb1b6fa6d&oe=5B5481F8
keen inlet
:outofenergy:
plain thistle
I don know, im not a creative guy ๐
warm parcel
nice #off-topic
gaunt moat
poisons are hasted as well? is that even intended? lol
patent yarrow
strange python
I remember seeing a headline in like February that said "new update, bleeds and poisons boosted by haste"
patent yarrow
is confirmed. those were cut from srceen shots like 5 mins ago
keen inlet
mfw haste skyrockets for sin
mossy hazel
I don't have any idea how that's going to effect our numbers, but if it's a solid increase I have to assume a different we're going to get the nerf bat in a different stat
keen inlet
Nah.
They want secondaries to be close in value
and scale well.
They'll end up tuning down direct ability damage (or poison/bleed dmg) to compensate, or something
stark heart
hasted bleeds make all our energy income scale with it which obviously helps
lone junco
Crit + haste build inc.
hoary copper
Still need to get through beta >.>
lone junco
45/119/35
Mmm
Reminds me. I should reclaim all the vendored haste trinkets. Procs etc.
Dust off the 945 BTI
nimble tartan
i know there's a sub rogue who's writing mythic + guides but based on high 20s
mossy hazel
I would seriously love a crit + haste build honestly. I just have a soft spot for haste. Was bummed it tanked
lone junco
I look forward to bloodlust mattering. But ep uptime and 4cp mut will be king of my heart.
marble hemlock
945 BTI oO
lone junco
BTI scaled during bracer window anyway. Might be nice synergy
lone junco
Haste tick rates during lust on alpha raid. Went from like 1.8sec to 1.4sec
strange python
wait, do auto attacks proc deadly poison?
lone junco
Maybe better.
terse rune
anyone else hates the fact that we have 3 aoe talents in the lvl 100 row and are forced to play poison bomb on st?
well to do competetive dps u are
lone junco
Alpha?
terse rune
yeah
mossy hazel
How accurate is the current spell list for assassination??
lone junco
Ticks as hard as rupture and has a hit component.
mossy hazel
The list on the talent calculator shows Cut to the Chase, Sinister Strike and Eviscerate
turbid harbor
pb is awful on alpha atm, ct is so broken right now that it's probably a gain on single target
but i get what you mean with the design intent
terse rune
thx u got it
lone junco
I like the hit component of CT. Else it's pretty boring.
strange python
hit component?
lone junco
As it should prob. Needs crit to work.
lone junco
Rtb will carry low 2ndary for some time.
Shark. Or snd.
4p 21 with high crit is super smooth. Will suck to go back to green gear.
turbid harbor
obviously gear is a factor
but it feels REALLY bad
like barely enough energy for an envenom between ruptures bad
outlaw and sub feel good
lone junco
I won't feel bad going rdruid/moonkin then
terse rune
i hope that outlaw wont be the spec to go
lone junco
It will likely bounce. Not as strong As it did in legion. No tier but availability of 2ndary matters.
Stupid phone.
turbid harbor
telling people what to hope is pretty yikes
lone junco
Among the 3, something will be fine.
Mythic islands will be questionable as rogue though.
I didn't hate rtb.
Just wanted BtE to hit like 2x harder non crit.
NH was outlaw prime time.
6buff with Ld.
I do. Too many resources into outlaw.
terse rune
outlaw with slice and dice is okay but i hate the casino buff roll bs
lone junco
I love the dice.
Esp with mark.
But the dmg is lacking. They flattened it too much. Blame shoulders.
lone junco
Then don't play it.
terse rune
but just my opinion tho
lone junco
Rng flex specs are mediocre or gods. Some times, gods will push a boss over the edge.
terse rune
tru dat
lone junco
It's frustrating to some. Others get that greed rage and roll to get 6b (5) as a reward. And get a hulk Meta for it.
I had 3x 6b in one fight.
Was a good day.
Had another pull with 99% Tb uptime.
When it still did dps, that was a good time.
Low avg. insane max.
They did. Penalized rolling due to LD.
Without ar reset around 45sec however. It will be a cooldown. And people will fish Tb between.
tough lantern
Hello
strange python
Hi
vapid moth
!relics
chrome tuskBOT
List of relics for each spec: http://tc.ravenholdt.net/
gray_hounds relic sheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1vmVwWWnNhrbzi0S_qK6emjFquyUexbTmOEov7vkRjjg/edit#gid=0
nocturne gate
hi can someone explain me why some people with higher gear(970+) simming/parsing better with shoulder+boots ?
viscid helm
why wouldnt they?
stark heart
what is the problem with that?
plain thistle
because its better for then?
stark heart
your best legendaries are not set in stone
they vary depending on your tier/stats/talents
supple hearth
lapis crane
Hey guys when doing AOE in dungeons as assassination do I want to put my ruptures on as many targets as possible?
supple hearth
Depends on how many and how long they are going to live for
zealous dew
rupture does way more damage than envenom so yeah but you need 100% uptime on env
wide bolt
You'd only rupture for its dmg if the target will live a long time
Otherwise just put rupture on one enemy for energy regen and FoK > Envenom inbetween
plain thistle
even if they live forever, its not good to rupture everyone, because our poison does a lot of AoE damage
thats why you want to envenom to keep the buff up
warm parcel
aoe is simple
fok
keep tier up
spread rup on targets that will live thru it
lapis crane
Okie dokie. In new to rogues and learning the ropes.
sick cradle
Can you use Feint on Varimathras Marked Prey?
strange python
I doubt it because it's not aoe
viscid helm
not unless you spec for it
fervent beacon
@nocturne gate you should also account for 100% uptime on bosses which isn't going to be the case majority of the time and running bracers is just better overall than boots. Having said that, running boots/bracers are excellent for progression.
lunar berry
Howdy..is FoK sometimes used to generate CPs even if its single target?
my addon keeps suggesting that now and then
civic palm
_>
lunar berry
well its aethys addon so i figured id ask here
plain thistle
yes, with 5/7 PK traits or more
its used to get the 4th combo point
3cp->4cp instead of mutilating to get 5 and possibly wasting 2
@lunar berry
echo estuary
what filthy piece of shit did you do now xaethron?
plucky raft
950 assassination rog with 150 mastery damage less the 1 mill need help to improve my damage
Toon name shocruz if you want to look and help me out
fiery nest
Have you read the guide in the pins
spare cloud
@vapid moth Yes
vapid moth
hehe. ironic. always thought i would be first
strange python
good night good fight
quiet junco
What are you're mythic builds, I've been running raid build an IRS been doing me good. But I'm getting into higher mythics an was wondering if there were any go to builds.
turbid pecan
dude i see so many assassination rogues on the dps meters doing like 1.6m-2m damage at item level 960ish
seems like sin is really good lol
vapid moth
When the raid forms and half of them still have their flask from last raid night :/
hazy iron
Yikes
icy trout
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oq3gEr699WCk-RT6KqpqKNBeyQDqxUppi1K3NA3yito/edit?usp=sharing Optimized speed leveling spreadsheet for anyone interested.
vapid moth
why are the fucking hound hit boxes so weird
yall we using vantus runes on dogs
cause you know. gear specialization doesnt matter
hot snow
I've got a derpy question here - I've noticed a lot of high parses (mythic) are running helm shoulders. is that just simming better or is there another reason?
rocky ginkgo
check the kill time probably
drifting cloud
they dont?
supple hearth
hot snow
must have been a specific boss. I noticed it a few weeks ago and didn't ask
void pecan
Looks like helm shoulders to me
supple hearth
literally 0 helms on the front page anywhere :p
void pecan
๐
hot snow
or maybe I need new glasses ๐ฎ
supple hearth
If someone is actually using it they might just not have bracers, or they actually for some weird reason sim better with helm idk - it doesnt look like its a popular thing thoughj
vapid moth
why is it that whenever i fucking use shroud. i get blamed when it runs out as if it doesnt have a fucking time limit
hot snow
Also I'd like to share that the stars aligned and a I got 17% dmg of pb procs on mythic vari kill last week
vapid moth
damn bruh
prime void
high parses see all types of legendary combinations, because our legendary sims are very close and dependent on off pieces.
But, Top 10 parses are nearly almost always going to be "Gamble build" playing bracers mantle because the ceiling on this build is typically way higher than that of the more consistent builds.
Vanish poison bombs in execute are just too stronk
manic vigil
Mizu 
prime void
y'know
just responding to the same shit I've responded to 9000 times over the past 6 months kek
manic vigil
someone's gotta do it 
prime void
while writing this unbearable term paper
void pecan
๐ฅ
quiet junco
Any builds for high mythics other than the raid build?
quiet junco
I didn't see lol
steep obsidian
Scroll up
quiet junco
Lol I did
vapid moth
there are no specific builds. youve got your leggos. and regular gear. its more about reaction timing and actual skill than wahat gear you have
steep obsidian
The alternative and superior build is sub
vapid moth
that too
vapid moth
lol cool then
prime void
no mute for calling people retarded?
Lol if that was Tom it would have been insta- what bias
prime void
That's some fucked up shit lmfao
wise frigate
Well he's not insulting people here I guess?
prime void
hell if itwas me, it'd be instant
void pecan
We had a discussion about that
here or not
they are almost
zero tolerance
but.. against certain people?
๐ค
supple hearth
!mute @vapid moth
ily take a time out
also you guys expect me to be here and insta mute it every time or what
void pecan
I mean you're not the only mod โค
void pecan
The mod life
supple hearth
@quiet junco :p no need to bounce people just get frustrated when the same things get asked repeatedly ๐
prime void
who you ?
gaunt moat
hey it's 6am here, i'm not even supposed to be awake โน
void pecan
You just went to bed like 20 minutes ago right?
gaunt moat
went to bed at 23:00 woke up 2:30
now i'm scrwed
void pecan
That's what they make coffee for!
prime void
lol
void pecan
silly rabbit
steep obsidian
I swear itโs the guy who plays panda and has a bigger model
hazy iron
I think hunterpets will often fuck shit up
manic vigil
yeah huntards still are experts in adding mobs 
steep obsidian
Was talking about brh we should probably just practice it a few times I guess
manic vigil
easy skip ye
steep obsidian
Should be
manic vigil
even our ret ... stupid... BM can get past those mobs
can also chug a invis potion tho, they can't possibly fuck that up right?
steep obsidian
Iโll watch a few streams of it or sonethin maybe Iโm distracting the wrong mob
Also Druid stealth is a lot worse then rogue stealth eh
Hmmm
manic vigil
I actually have no clue about stealth "strength" anymore
void pecan
invis pot ++
manic vigil
ye it's way easier
manic vigil
we had some nice keys today 
lower into 3 times upper. No EoC to be seen of course
void pecan
As it is written.
manic vigil
yeah
supple hearth
@steep obsidian literally just muted xaethron for using retarded. Don't do that.
hazy iron
@steep obsidian sabodjust use a skaggldrynk potion
You dont need to do any special shenanigans to get through that skip
Whats your group composition?
steep obsidian
I was not even aware I said it hmm ok
supple hearth
looks at uni
steep obsidian
I canโt see where I did but Iโve been guilty of it in the past for sure
supple hearth
maybe i misread the name. either way dont do that you guys lol
vapid moth
hmmm
they snapped at me cause i said "look at the map" when a person asked which direction it was to get off the eonar ship
hazy iron
Like, the group i run with has 2 druids and my self, who have no issue stealthing past, the other 2 death run and we res at the top of the stairs
manic vigil
I didn't do it 
vapid moth
sent them this screenshot. still waiting on an apology. they all ignored it. cant wait for xpac to end lol
@hazy iron use distract. practically idiot proof
hazy iron
Ah thats what im saying, you dont even need to do that
Sabod is having issues with the skip
Nah***
steep obsidian
I like giffing replays of Warcraftlogs when someone try to blame me for somethin not my fault and linking it to everyone
Is that toxic?
hazy iron
Haha
steep obsidian
It backfire when you do something dumb though sometimes
hazy iron
For eonar, im amazed how many people still dunno how to leave the final doom ship.. its noooorth bois
steep obsidian
I only ever did that fight once and I figured it out