changin it to >0 is fine (edit)
#tc-research
regal agate
this would fire every time
but that would make the condition kinda useless
"use it when vendetta is up or if vendetta is on cd"
green wolf
I want to check something with relics and this has a giant impact on it, so I just want it to fire away asap. So thanks ^^
regal agate
you can also make it (debuff.vendetta.up|!debuff.vendetta.up) this would also fire every time
green wolf
so, it would use Kingsbane and Vendetta off CD with that condition?
green wolf
Good shit
green wolf
0 would make it blow off CD then?
regal agate
should
ill test
ye >0 uses it when its on CD but has the condition that evenom buff needs to be up
green wolf
"|(!talent.exsanguinate.enabled&buff.envenom.up&"
if i remove this line, it won't take the envenom thing into the consideration, aye?
regal agate
if u want to remove that you can just use:
actions.maintain+=/kingsbane,if=(debuff.vendetta.up|!debuff.vendetta.up)
green wolf
Thank you
regal agate
that would probably use it on opener also
sry for the wrong information earlyer ^^ missread the line
green wolf
No problem
regal agate
ye^^
strong gorge
Just have it use it without any condition high in the apl and it'll fire asap all the time.
regal agate
or use actions.maintain+=/kingsbane should work also
bc. the condition is basicly not needed
however if he wnats to f.ex. deley it on opener he can add parameter to it
exotic orchid
you have to adjust apl a little to line up
standart apl cant do that with cof and boots
regal agate
when do you want it to use vendetta?
green wolf
I want Kingsbane and Vendetta to be used whenever available
And a code to line them both up as we do currently
merry cloud
@green wolf are you testing AP?
green wolf
Yup with my current gear. 3xMA + CoF + Boots
merry cloud
There are 2 lines for vendetta now, find one with !talent.exsanguinate.enabled and deleted everything past that condition for talent
merry cloud
That would make vendetta to be casted immediately
Same for KB
Just remove every conditions
regal agate
well we did that already^^
merry cloud
And make it just Kingsbane
I don't think current apl syncs vendetta and KB tho
Default one
exotic orchid
yeah its not
regal agate
it does wait up to 10 secounds for vendetta
if the cooldown is higher then 10 secs it just uses KB
merry cloud
To alighn then I add &cooldown.kingsbane.remains<4 for vendetta
merry cloud
It's pain to help from phone...
regal agate
you can also just add: debuff.vendetta.up (for vendetta)
green wolf
I want 2 codes to compare it.
merry cloud
Or you meant for aligning case?
green wolf
One that lines them up and one that blows it off CD:
merry cloud
Basically you wanna test if it's worth aligning KB and vendetta now since impact of KB dropped?
green wolf
that and I want to know the difference as I have 3xMA and boots and CoF.
I have to delay Vendetta for Kingsbane atm
exotic orchid
with 3 ma you delay a lot I guess
regal agate
you can use :
actions.maintain+=/kingsbane
and
actions.cds+=/vendetta,if=!talent.exsanguinate.enabled
to use them on cd
and
actions.maintain+=/kingsbane,if=debuff.vendetta.up|cooldown.vendetta.reminds>=45
to line it up
green wolf
actions.maintain+=/kingsbane,if=(debuff.vendetta.up|cooldown.vendetta>=45) ?
regal agate
typo mistake
cooldown.vendetta.remains
actions.maintain+=/kingsbane,if=(debuff.vendetta.up|cooldown.vendetta.remains>=45)
green wolf
ye, running it now
regal agate
as it looks the cooldown of vendetta is never low enough to not use it together (so you can probably remove that from the argument)
green wolf
I did
merry cloud
Share results with us!
green wolf
regal agate
TR.DL: lining it up is better
regal agate
mhm
actions.cds+=/vendetta,if=!talent.exsanguinate.enabled
you only changed this line for off cd
this means 1st simulation would work more enrgy efficient with vendetta
green wolf
yeh
regal agate
ah okay ^^
your aim was to show that using everything on cd is not a high dps loss
the difrence is +1.7% dps
merry cloud
I can't view html on phone
What is the interval for vendetta when you don't line up?
42?
wise jackal
Does build from 01.02 21.43 include +4% buff that blue post was talking about? Where can I see changes for each build because I can't find it on github :/
green wolf
44 seconds it seems.
green wolf
It does seem strange indeed.
merry cloud
But even if it's 42 you gain extra vendetta only for 9+ min fights
Or some edge cases like 6 mins
green wolf
Indeed
exotic orchid
the damage graph on line up still seems weird
shouldnt be like that
your line up profile only line ups for 4 cds
and it seems if you always line up its a dps loss
raven sage
does kiljaedens trinket sim correctly?
pallid tapir
@split sorrel will you add alacrity profiles to the next sims on your page?
for assa
merry cloud
@exotic orchid can you post pic? I just compare intervals for vendetta and Kingsbane
If they are both close to 45 then code works and they are stacked
split sorrel
@pallid tapir what do u mean ? and I'm away atm
pallid tapir
I was searching on your page with the sims, and didn't find trinkets/legendaries and those calculations for alacrity on assa
I might have not found it tho
exotic orchid
I think this is how line up should look
And without tweak it looks like this
Actually line up still ahead for Stjern, it seems like I used different fight length again because I'm not getting the same results
hollow cobalt
Jesus christ whenever I real all these posts I feel like a giant noob 😄 don't understand a word of what you guys are saying! Don't mind me, I'll get me coat 😄
deft rain
quick question, does todays nightly build already have the 4% hotfix included?
odd sedge
Hmm after getting CoF, boots, and 3 MA, im so unsure what to run as relics, putting one GW in place of a MA sims 1k less (same ilvl), one envenom 15 ilvls higher gains me 3k dps, not sure simcraft is optimized enough for this scenario atm?
gleaming root
there is no nightly build for today so probably not
wanton shell
what is the 4% hotfix?
odd sedge
i just WISH relics wouldn´t be destroyed on swapping... stupid fucking system
maiden cargo
@odd sedge your goal is to sync vendetta with kb always
with 3 MA what is your vendetta cd
odd sedge
Yes but Cof sometimes desynchs it a lot
sometimes more than 10 seconds
its random bullshit (even more)
it can be perfect, or desynch it to hell
maiden cargo
doesn't matter what it does, always sync them
exotic orchid
add &cooldown.kingsbane.remains<4 at the end of vendetta line
it should line up cds better
maiden cargo
so you can wait till vendetta apl is better to see if you should swap rleics, but I suspect it's not much difference either way
odd sedge
what i dont get is how one GW loses me dps...
maiden cargo
just always sync them if you have that combo
exotic orchid
you simmed yourself already I assume, so there is Profile is your result tab
exotic orchid
yeah
odd sedge
from priorities line?
exotic orchid
Find this line actions.cds+=/vendetta,if=!talent.exsanguinate.enabled&(!artifact.urge_to_kill.enabled|(!talent.vigor.enabled&energy.deficit>=85)|
no
this
odd sedge
ok i just imported it from armory
exotic orchid
yeah that works too
odd sedge
ok i paste after that line? what about the rest after it
|(talent.vigor.enabled&energy.deficit>=125))
exotic orchid
actions.cds+=/vendetta,if=!talent.exsanguinate.enabled&(!artifact.urge_to_kill.enabled|(!talent.vigor.enabled&energy.deficit>=85)|(talent.vigor.enabled&energy.deficit>=125))&cooldown.kingsbane.remains<3
line should look like this
odd sedge
thanks for your help, redoing sims now
odd sedge
that lost me 5k dps with normal gear 3 MA
exotic orchid
strange
merry cloud
What do you mean normal gear?
exotic orchid
can you upload your result here
merry cloud
That addition works only for boots and cof
exotic orchid
yeah
exotic orchid
DoS is not optimized as well btw
odd sedge
yeah stuff moving too fast for the kind theorycrafters 😄
I will just wait and let it settle before changing anything
thanks for your help
merry cloud
Can't access html
exotic orchid
your report is with 3 ma btw
odd sedge
yes my doubt was wether to change one
odd sedge
I have GW and envenom ones, but i dont think I will change anything right now
exotic orchid
2k more with the change
odd sedge
700k is what I was getting before
exotic orchid
yeah and I got 702 with that change to apl
odd sedge
it´s possible I didnt paste it correctly
actions.cds+=/vendetta,if=!talent.exsanguinate.enabled&(!artifact.urge_to_kill.enabled|(!talent.vigor.enabled&energy.deficit>=85)|(talent.vigor.enabled&energy.deficit>=125))&cooldown.kingsbane.remains<4
seems the same
exotic orchid
I actually just copied your profile
odd sedge
oh
exotic orchid
didnt change anything
exotic orchid
yeah same
odd sedge
added line again lets see
odd sedge
5k loss again lol
exotic orchid
weird
odd sedge
in game im doing like ~750/60
putting a 3 instead of a 4 loses me another 1k haha
in that line
raven sage
So I sim at 666k with dreadlords, just had kiljaeden trinket drop, and now sim at 680k. I simmed the other legendaries, shackles and insignia, and they both simmed lower than the trinket. Does that sound right to you guys? I though shackles and ring were better.
I have boots BTW.
hard kettle
Does anyone know the rough value of 2000agi on dps? what is it worth? im trying to figure out how much one would gain from dropping a mythic Fond for DoS?
lethal wadi
zoldycks and ring are far better than the trinket, unless in aoe situations
round canyon
@hard kettle you can find the exact value
add ,enchant=2000agility to the end of an item
hard kettle
thank you so much
im trying to see if a normal mode DoS would be worth switching out for a mythic fond
holy shit
ok its a lot
how many people have looked at the whole DoS vs Fond numbers? i know there is a lot of rng but it seems like if the descrepancy between fond and dos in raw damage can be something like 10mil on krosus. but the 2000agi would make up for that in raw dmg on everything else
odd sedge
draught is a steady 10% of my damage as assassination, frond is crap compared
round canyon
yeah but frond also has the damage from actually having agi on it
odd sedge
true
steep cedar
hey guys how do i find the nightly simcraft builds?
jagged carbon
hey how the prio for trinket work in simcraft? i get 15k dps diff if i go T1 draught of souls T2 tirathon's betrayal or T1 tirathon betrayal T2 draught.. (option 2 siming the highest )
strong gorge
@steep cedar http://downloads.simulationcraft.org/?C=M;O=D
weary parcel
@jagged carbon i can take a look if you share your profile/report
sullen dagger
Does the latest nightly build include the 4% buffs?
hard kettle
i think the fond might actually be better, u can get those wild swings where it does no damage or 2%. but if it does 5% which happens somewhat frequently, the agi alone should outscale draught
thats pretty anecdotal though and speaking from about 10 years of experience. id love to know the thoughts of the hardcore tc'ers
raven tulip
Is there a reason why DoS sims so low? Live it accounts for about 8% of my damage, but in simcraft it simms way lower than CoF/Urn.
I know Frond sims way higher than it does live, should I just agree with the herd and assume CoF/DoS are just the best combo regardless of sim results?
raven sage
@lethal wadi Idk man the sims are telling me far different, not reeally far but trinket sims 10k higher than the shackles and the ring
odd sedge
simcraft is not perfect, it doesnt value zoldycks very well
I can assure it its amazing
pliant briar
How many iterations are necessary for sim? Should I just stick to 10 or 25k?
obtuse python
did they change something in simc since yesterday?
i did not switch any item and im simming around 50k higher
merry cloud
@pliant briar use target error. I use as Aethys - 0.1% just for DPS and 0.05% for stat weights
pliant briar
Gotcha, and that just runs for certainty as opposed to X iterations?
merry cloud
that runs intill there are enough iterations done to have DPS with set error with decent confidence
pliant briar
Perfect, thats what I meant. Thanks!
sick shell
@odd sedge I noticed that about Zoldyk's, got them last night and simcraft shows only a 9k gain over using an outlaw legendary. Definitely feels like its much bigger than that.
odd sedge
it is
pallid laurel
when simming the legendary trinket, its showing an average hit of 1.2m damage. but in practice im only getting it to hit for 800k. is this a bug with simulationcraft maybe?
wind otter
it's scaling with AP
pallid laurel
thanks
high sandal
how do you use the nightly builds?
odd sedge
you download them, google "simcraft latest"
lapis sorrel
Is the latest nightly build spitting out bad Pawn strings?
drowsy cradle
I tried to sim the trinket from Moores but the garrote from it does sim well. Does our garrote overwrite it?
Moroes
proven dawn
No
drowsy cradle
K thanks. I'll try it again later
mystic jolt
is sub not simming correctly on simc>
urban wasp
? why
mystic jolt
when I sim it for my character, it puts me at ~270k dps, but i pulled around 400k on H Trilliax with it
same gear and talents
sterile jolt
Was the KB bug programmed into simc in the first place?
maiden cargo
yes
sterile jolt
hmm nuts
dim salmon
can someone sim me
either I retarded or
Dark Satyr nech enchant is showing me pulling 100k more
neck*
can someone run me and tell me if thats an accurate number?
Piratebae - US Bleedinghollow
im 879 ilvl whats dps for that?
usually
odd sedge
sim it
wild quartz
exotic orchid
yes
random gorge
Just got mantle and I noticed that with subterfuge and mantle equipped, simcraft uses vanish before opening
rain ice
is there a thing about how SimC has a bias for haste
for rogues at least?
or should i have confidence that simc is right
maiden cargo
talents, gear, energy regen, specc annd fight type affect the outcome of stats weight, i personaly had haste be my best stat as outlaw rogue, while now its by far the worst.
left notch
So I'm thinking that if you didn't have CoF / Boots this recent 4% buff will increase our damage before the Kingsbane fix. Does anyone have some math or logs to prove/disprove this theory?
reef canyon
@manic pulsar made a nice post that looks at how different items affect stat weights, and how mastery is best in certain situations. Both SimC and AMR tests come up with the same results. http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/2163316-Outlaw-Why-does-AMR-always-suggest-it?p=44451160#post44451160
wooden dragon
Is trinkets stiill buggy in the nightly sims? Like NB is suddenly simming a lot higher afther the nightly sim with kingsbane AP fix
lament cargo
@reef canyon is the Rogue simulation updated to reflect the Feb 3rd Hotfix yet?
Already live, some skills got buffed by 4%
reef canyon
we have it on our dev server, just have to push the update. Will have that tonight at the latest.
If you want to use it now, I can show you how, it's pretty quick.
Go to the assination rogue 'spell' on this page http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/theory/mechanic/spell/assassinationrogue?spec=RogueAssassination&version=live
Then edit the dmg multiplier to the new one, so change it from 0.7 to 0.11. Save it, and you're all set. You do have to be logged in to edit it (so it can be saved to your account). Or if you aren't in a rush, we'll have it updated soon 😃
tender ibex
i ran that edit zooper, and it took my DPS from 583 to 585K, shouldnt it have boosted to 606K? (4% add to 583)
multiplier went from .07 to .11
pastel sundial
you dont get flat 4% dmg
tender ibex
ya i know, but to most abilities under that multipler, DeathFromAbove, Hemorrhage, FanOfKnives, PoisonedKnife, Envenom, DeadlyPoison, DeadlyPoisonApplication, KingsbaneMainHand, KingsbaneOffHand, Kingsbane, MutilateMainHand, MutilateOffHand, Rupture, Garrote
was expecting more than a 2K dps add
from a 4% buff to most abilities
maiden cargo
agreed
pastel sundial
should be about 3.3% buff or so
i think it affects about 85% of our dmg?..idk the numbers of PB on average
yeah sounds about right..should be 4% *0.85 on average
unless i missed something..but i think beside melee pb and from the shadows all should be buffed by 4%
tender ibex
nm i fucked up, i wasnt comparing like for like talents in sims
changing from nightstalker to subter took my dps from 583 to 597k
with the 4% mod
pastel sundial
which comes close to the 3.3%
well not exactly but it depends on how much PB you do
lament cargo
@reef canyon thanks. 😄
reef canyon
@tender ibex So now you are getting the dps you'd expect, right? (sorry, catching up)
reef canyon
Mr. Robot has informed me that he will be shining your armor tonight when you aren't using it. He loves getting <3s
alpine gyro
you really dont ahve to scroll that far to see the answer lol
random gorge
@split sorrel sorry should have been more clear, simcraft uses vanish before opening with mantle equipped as assassination.
with subterfuge
gleaming root
is the nightly sim updated with hotifx
lilac vine
@random gorge subterfuge sim is broken. it is unusable. damage calc is incorrect and yeah the opener is another thing
hushed quiver
Are stat weights fluid on rogues like other classes?
lime thunder
I'm having 4 piece improperly sim with the latest build.
alpine gyro
@viscid sonnet we have it on our dev server, just have to push the update. Will have that tonight at the latest.
said around 2pm pst
viscid sonnet
cheers buddy sorry to be a nag
@alpine gyro is this for AMR perhaps? i looked at the simcraft commits from the last day and cant see anything, also the talk about a dev server
alpine gyro
i'm not sure if its amr or simc, but yes it sounds like only the dev server has the update, and will go live later tonight
viscid sonnet
thought you were a dev 😛
alpine gyro
nah
reef canyon
@viscid sonnet On AMR, we have it on our dev server and it will be updated tonight. However, I can show you a quick way to enter it now so you can use it.
Log in to AMR (sorry, have to do that so you can save your change). Go to this page: http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/theory/mechanic/spell/assassinationrogue?spec=RogueAssassination&version=live
Click the edit button at the top. Change the damage multiplier from 0.07 to 0.11. Save it.
Go back to the simulator, select YOUR version (you will name it when you create it), and you're good to go 😃
quartz halo
is the 4% ability buff implemented in nightly yet?
maiden cargo
no
wet peak
Greetings, i assume this has been reported already. But just incase.. i noticed the there is no condition in the Outlaw Simcraft APL differentiating the usage of BTE in a single target vs multi target scenario.
hard hull
is the hotfix for rogues in the latest nightly?
wet peak
nope
runic flame
last ferry
to update simc do i just need to download the new patch and run it?
regal agate
just download the latest nightly version and unpack/install it
wet peak
@runic flame yes you can override spell data
fallen valley
probably the millionth time someone asked you that today
none of dh discussing it right now'
dark obsidian
hey guys, is the 4% buff for assa in the nightly build of simcraft?
gleaming briar
Hi. I just got 3x vandetta relics. This will make my weapon to 883 itl since the relics are quite low. I also got duskwalkers boots. Is it worth trading my weapon down with 3x vandetta relics for my current 903 weapon with only one vandetta relic?
gleaming root
probably asked question is the 4 % updated with newest sims:D
that went up for 3 min ago
rapid plaza
Tribbz, when I made the swap I got a 10k dps increase from a 25? ilvl downgrade so it was worth when I did it a few months ago, before I had boots. My gut says yes, but I'll be that ass that says you should really sim it.
left notch
So are people simming higher now than pre kingsbane fix?
vocal timber
so is 4% dmg buff for assa live then?
late willow
The buff is live but the 4% was just implemented as a commit like 2 hrs ago. The most recent build should have it
vernal plover
how strong is nightbloom atm for Assa. My guilt say its now very bad But i do very good dps with?
late willow
Seems like around 2.4% dps increase
kindred epoch
Are frond simming accurate ? i gain close to 20k dps on simc as soon as i equp the frond instead of 890 Urn
plush shard
Iam simming nightbloom with 3-5% around 898 itmelvl overall
iron obsidian
Simmed my char last night at 887 w/ 2pc at ~563k. Simmed with the newest commit at ~585k. About a ~3.8% dps increase.
Can't say if it's an improvement from pre kingsbane because I didn't have 2pc back then.
maiden cargo
k im simming 5 k less with the new nightly :<
rare trail
why am i simming 60k dps higher when i take alacrity instead of aganizing poison when i see most taking this for bleed build
maiden cargo
how much mastery do u have?
maiden cargo
go full mastery with shoulders i guess ull see a difference at 135%+
rotund oak
@mellow kite whats the channel called?
mellow kite
@rotund oak i simmmed myself 3 times different every time
rotund oak
different by what amount
mellow kite
4k difference between the 3
rotund oak
then you did something wrong, maybe low iterations
maiden cargo
!trinket
vivid siren
Is the 4% in the nightly yet?
late willow
yes
vivid siren
thanks
raw raft
Anyone here know if lego belt works with drought of souls?
maiden cargo
yes cindaria works with everything
dusty mortar
Hi. Does subterfuge extend shoulder leggo buff by 3 seconds?
errant idol
maiden cargo
Why is it that I can sim gear in simcraft and get one result, then 10 minutes later with same exact gear/spec do it again nad have almost 40k variance?
woven sandal
I just started into SimC, that's not what I wanna hear, lol....
languid zealot
!trinkets
desert oxide
stiff forum
so just got master assasin mantle
and it with sprint draught opener seems legit af
got 1mil+ openers
south coral
!trinkets
feral warren
are sims holding second vanish till 5 seconds into kingsbane ?
with mantle of course
ocean basin
does simc still have issues with trinkets when using the addon import?
cosmic orbit
Is there a way to remove food buff, combat potions, and flasks from simulations? I've only found where to remove Blood Lust.
merry cloud
remove lines like
actions.precombat+=/food,name=seedbattered_fish_plate
and
actions.cds=potion,name=old_war,if=buff.bloodlust.react|target.time_to_die<=25|debuff.vendetta.up&cooldown.vanish.remains<5
and
actions.precombat=flask,name=flask_of_the_seventh_demon
bleak cobalt
I cant see it in pinned, a friend told me frond now sims correctly, is that true?
merry cloud
it was fixed in simc long ago
bleak cobalt
Alright, thanks
sleek moss
quick question... is simcraft currently not working properly for sub? imported my rogue via several methods and end up on 497k..
had no time to check discord the last few days, that's why I am asking
regal agate
sub should work properly
however you may come up with some apl changes that improve your dps slighly
sleek moss
gotta check again, ty for the answer^^
regal agate
if you found a mistake feel free to explain it
sleek moss
okay, dunno what changed tbh, imported it again and now the numbers are as expected
If this happens again and I can replicate it, I will come back 😄
sleek moss
ye I saw that, checked the pins before I asked >.< really don't know why this happend. gonna check if I can replicate it later
maiden cargo
hey guys, im new to this so if im asking in the wrong channel just say:P
so anyway my question is about my dps
ive just simulated assassination and outlaw(my main spec) and wanted to choose a spec that does more dps
my assassin spec does 355k dps
and my oulaw 414k dps
regal agate
outlaw will show you a better result on simulations
assasination will give you better result ingame
maiden cargo
yeah
regal agate
thats due to the design of outlaw, assasination is more consistant
maiden cargo
yeah, thats what i noticed
but when ive been testing both specs
ive noticed that assassin is more wobbly with the dps
and outlaw is going up with dps, and then it goes all the way down
regal agate
btw. as you pointed out earlyer this is the wrong channel for this discussion.
that comes from cd's assasination has shorter cd's that makes it more "wobby" in the graphic
regal agate
simple question or general
maiden cargo
alright , thanks
autumn bramble
shall i change my "target" in sims or should i just leave it custom
hasty wagon
Bot commands don't work in this channel
lusty spire
Okay, thanks :/
I am a Bit clueless right now. Assuming equal item levels- which trinkets are best for assassination. I get different results on different simming pages / guides and don't know what i should believe
Or which simming Page gives the most realistic results for trinkets
gaunt pelican
sim it yourself gives the most realistic result
Does API save Kiljadens for Vendetta also Gnawed Thumb ring?
storm spoke
Is there any "premade" trinket sims for assa rogue?
humble tendon
Is Nightblooming Frond still simming higher than it should be in the latest simulationcraft build?
regal agate
'!bot' - commants dont work in this channel, commends using them will be delete immedeatly.
maiden cargo
Hey yall, just dropped a 880 DoS (replacing my 860 EoC), but it sims 10k lower ? It does show 1 mil per execute, however shouldn't it be like 2-3 mil ?
regal agate
the apl doesent line it up well if i remember right, this could mean you get more benefit from a good use ingame then in the simulation (unless you change the apl to do it right).
regal agate
if you changed it and there is still a huge gap report back with a reference log
ember cape
Replace old_war by prolonged_power
regal agate
import through armory or copy the profile string from the result of a simulation
then replace the name for the pot in the string
odd sedge
how accurate is the target error function on simcraft? its so. much. faster.
late willow
Its as accurate as you set it.
If you chose 1% then thats the target it looks for in the error. If you choose 0.03% thats the target it looks for in the dps error.
regal agate
depends on boss, cloak is better with adds
but you can just sim it with the legendary combinations 😉
strong zinc
Do any of you guys know how the Master Alchemist trait actually works with AP ? The +3% to AP is 3% of what ?
I sim higher with relics for that trait than Vendetta / GW or even Envenom (I have 4p) and I'd like to understand how it actually works :/
maiden cargo
What is the best one..Boots+3MA+CoF?
Or Boots+2MA+1GW+CoF?
flat flare
A question: Is opener used in simulation the most optimal/the best?
strong gorge
It's hard to prove anything is 'best' especially in all situations. It's the one we've found best under the constraints we have. Feel free to try and improve it and experiment though :)
regal agate
you can play around with the apl for opener, this will provide you difrent results.
if you find something better feel free to share 😃
solemn plaza
Just wondering, have you managed to sim the shoulder bug yet? If it's worth doing other than during opener?
wanton grove
I've noticed that SimC is trying to ambush from Shadowmeld, and you can't do that. I removed that condition from the APL and gained a bit more DPS. I'm Outlaw btw.
crimson hinge
you can ambush from meld
wanton grove
Yeah, was just testing it. Stealth bar doesn't come up but I dragged the button and yes, you can. Nonetheless, not ambushing still nets more dps to me. Probably that's just me tho.
broken pelican
Is the nightly build updated for the sin hotfixes lately? When I sim it still shows Kingsbane as #1 dmg
broken pelican
ohhhhhhhh alright, i have been mis-reading that part of simc for a long time then rofl
mystic jacinth
haha
rotund oak
not sure if someone already did it, but i tested a bit with DoS APL, and this line gained me 3% / 17k DPS
actions.cds+=/use_item,name=draught_of_souls,if=equipped.140808&energy.deficit>=80&(talent.agonizing_poison.enabled&debuff.agonizing_poison.stack=5&debuff.surge_of_toxins.remains>3|!talent.agonizing_poison.enabled)
For Assa AP
odd sedge
Yeah was thinking of something like that, since you should always use draught with surge, if APL doesnt do that then it needs to
primal slate
are the Zoldyck family training shackles valued appropriate in simc? only getting 1k dps increase over symbiote
merry cloud
Simc assumes uniform Hp distribution so no
primal slate
thanks thats what I was hoping to hear
lunar trout
How do I switch from Potion of the Old War to Potion of Prolonged Power within SimulationCraft?
mellow elbow
There's a string named Potion_of_old_War I believe
Just change it to prolonged_power
ashen crater
@merry cloud Can you elaborate on why Zoldyck family training shackles are undervalued in simc. I would think a uniform health distribution would be what you want. 30% of the time the target is below 30% health.
rain ice
More dmg earlier on
naive birch
it's not that they're undervalued as much as the belt is way overvalued
rain ice
So cinidaria is inflated
merry cloud
@ashen crater people said it above also Zoldyck is great for certain encounters while belt is most of the time worthless
mellow elbow
If I want to test ST, I just import my char and hit "sim" button?
regal agate
yes that should do it
cyan hill
So, anyone around who's willing to help a newbie with simulations? Guildies are telling me it's a good way to get more dps out of my character, but I'm very confused. I've already run the simulation through simc and simulationcraft, but I'm confused on what I'm looking at....
umbral roost
Hey I know the sim version currently out over vaules Kingsbane, is the nightly buiilds safe to use?
merry cloud
if you are talkinga about KB AP bug that was hotfixed - it is fixed in simc as well
fervent willow
Man even with these sim guides I don't get it. I got a 900 ring with vers and mastery. It would replace an 865 ring with crit and mastery (higher mastery than 900 ring). On pure stat weights simming myself the 900 ring has more stats. However, I simmed myself after equipping the new ring, and my dps went down
nocturne niche
Does anyone know how I could implement the mantle opener into my APL?
http://i.imgur.com/UTlmhVq.png
vivid siren
vanish -> mut isnt helping either
nocturne niche
With subterfuge, what does it matter? As long as you garrote within the 3 second window it snapshots 125%
tribal stream
it matters because you should vanish rupture
bleak sky
Not if you have mantle
keen lodge
sorry if i am not in the right chat
but someone is saying slice and dice is way better
because they nerfed it
patent moat
anyone know if Nightblooming Frond still siming higher then live?
gaunt pelican
hey guys im trying to save stat weights for both assasin and Outlaw, but whenever i import my values into a profile called Outlaw it will create a profile called "myname" instead of going into "outlaw" which is where i pasted it'
like do i need to manually change my import string manually each time?
gaunt gale
gaunt pelican
yeh but that means when you import the string that got exported as ur character name originally then yeah
iron elk
uhm, im the only that have more dps with 3MA-cof-boots and kingsbane on CD
instead to 2MA/1GW-cof-boots and kingsbane on vendetta?
torn dome
The apls arent even working properly so the comparison is pointless
iron elk
? what you mean?
torn dome
The apls are simply not working as you claim and are suboptimal to begin with
split sorrel
y
maybe I'll spent some hours updating it
but I guess blizzard will nerf/buff it the next day
so I'm not very motivated, last time they killed my motivation about CDR things
torn dome
I specifically ment the changes made by this guy. Kb from stealth, syncing not actually working
So the comparison was incorrect to begin with
iron elk
kingsbane,if=(talent.exsanguinate.enabled&dot.rupture.exsanguinated)|(!talent.exsanguinate.enabled&buff.envenom.up&(debuff.vendetta.up|cooldown.vendetta.remains>10))
torn dome
In your sync apl intervals are different
iron elk
dont mean that at least the simulator try to wait vendetta if the CD is less than 10sec?
for the other i simply wroted
actions.maintain+=/kingsbane
so im pretty sure that it is on CD
torn dome
And the other apl kb usage is fucked alltogether
Ye so it opens up with it first
Which is far from optimal
iron elk
uhm, true
torn dome
In addition whenever you modify apl with dos equipped you will break it unless you know exactly what to do. Its not quite simple
regal agate
@torn dome mind sharing your apl changes so ppl are able to compare shoulders more accurately?
torn dome
I threw it out weeks ago but it didng get put into simc
And it only works with a fixed setup, offers no dos support etc
regal agate
thanks
iron elk
dos damage appear to be the same for 3MA and 2MA/1GW
torn dome
Ye but it is using dos in very much a plsce you dont want to be using it in
iron elk
plsce?
torn dome
Place. Phone typo
iron elk
you mean in the vendetta uptime?
torn dome
Not really discussion for here. And dont actually have access to simc rn so cant explain/fix
calm dust
I have one question to sim Myth+ Dungeons. What should I configure to simulate Myth+ (> 9) ? Patchwerk with 3 Targets an 2 min battlelength?
onyx monolith
does anyone know if trinket sims are operating correctly atm? DoS seems to only be giving ~300dps increase from an 885 tirathons betrayal
delicate cipher
I have question, is it possible to simulate entire raid team at once?
halcyon falcon
Can someone write me the action line for gnawed thumb ring? im not that good in things like that...
delicate cipher
Is it possible to mass extract certain people?
wanton shell
@split sorrel hello wanted to ask. is frond simming correctly in the latest nightly, there hasnt been an update from blizz side. is it just that unreliable? and does the apl take that unreliability under consideration?
modern aurora
how can an apl take a procc into consideration?
APL = Action Priority List ... Simulating a player doing actions so it can't "use" proccs
merry cloud
What exactly do you want to do?
modern aurora
i was trying to answer sangreals question if you are asking me
merry cloud
How should apl take frond unpredictability into consideration? I am not sure
delicate cipher
Is it possible to extract full raid team at once to create profile for simulation?
merry cloud
Frond is just passive damage that is not affected really by any special attack you do( iirc )
modern aurora
yes Lorentz that is correct
merry cloud
@delicate cipher I don't think so
Your armory doesn't really know "this is raid team"
modern aurora
@delicate cipher https://code.google.com/archive/p/simulationcraft/wikis/Output.wiki#Massive_profiles_exportation this is a way to do it but I think you have to sim them seperately
could be deprecated aswell dk
merry cloud
So then I don't get the question at all about frond
mellow elbow
According to a guide evoked by a "!simc" command, all I need to do is just a paste a /simc string and I'm good to go?
merry cloud
It will use default apl iirc, yes
mellow elbow
Can I look into that default apl iirc?
Is there a more detailed guide how to make your own?
wanton shell
guess im asking a dumb question in a wrong way
lets just oversimplify
is frond simming how much its supposed to. and if it is does it represent correct damage?
or is it too rng to sim properly?
pallid tapir
if it is too rng, you would be able to see in the dps bars for each one of iterations I believe
stark sentinel
wonder why nighstalker + mantle (744k) sims higher than subterfuge + mantle (731k), shouldnt subterfuge be higher ?
mellow elbow
Probably sim doesn't take mantle into consideration etc
torn dome
You want to scroll up for the mantle apl if you want any remotely close results
stark sentinel
http://pastebin.com/3ZstJgjD this ?
torn dome
Yes
If you have dos you will have to add it yourself to apl. Also only works with mpap with subterfuge
modern aurora
@wanton shell we can't know for sure if frond is simming correctly we can just compare the sim results to live results... that is hard because of the major rng this item brings
the rng of this item is represented in the dps variance in simc
stark sentinel
ok, thank u weak, tried it with ur apl got 34k more, seems legit xD
torn dome
Mantle is pretty sweet
late willow
Yeah it's pretty strong
hard kettle
I am showing a near 30k dps loss going from a 905 Fond to 895 DoS
does that seem reasonable or is that a sim APL issue?
novel lava
where do i paste that to add it to the apl? never edited apl before
eternal patio
@torn dome Hey weak, Stjern told me u might have some APL for subterfuge opener/rotation?
torn dome
Literalli 5 posts above
eternal patio
Oh thanks
torn dome
The example from sim also shows ooener
torn dome
Jup
eternal patio
Aight ty
So when i got the crit buff from the shoulders, should i still clip envenom with SoT? Or just spam envenom to make use of the critbuff?
torn dome
Not the channel for said question but you want to spend maximum amount of your energy during mantle
eternal patio
Alright thanks
bleak sky
What is the part I add to the APL for DoS
steady jolt
Hi, some one can help me with simCraft? i want to change relic for simulate dps
regal agate
if you have the relics in your inventory use the addon simbuilder.
if you dont own the relics go to wowhead, find your relic and replace it in your input string (id's are in the url)
steady jolt
Ok thx ihave relic in my bag 😃
regal agate
simbuilder offers a seperat window (acessable through your char window).
you can replace the relic then in these seperat window and copy the simc string.
this means you dont need to replace them in your weapon
steady jolt
Ok, thx for help, but where do you copy the simc string?
regal agate
you copy it from the window and paste it in simc
regal agate
you go to wowhead and copy the id/bonusid from the url
cunning pebble
kindred epoch
Hello guys sorry to bother you with the same question but is frond simming correctly ?
regal agate
yes
inland flicker
I've made an MMO-C thread to discuss mantle and subterfuge since it seems the vast majority of rogues are still under the impression nightstalker is king, trying to compile info like Weak's APL and ideal opener.. hopefully it doesn't get nuked by mmo-c retards insisting on the feelycraft but feel free to add any of ya'ls findings or APL improvements etc. to the thread so we dont' have to try to sort through these discord channels to find nice information http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/2166163-Theorycrafting-Subterfuge-gt-Nightstalker-With-Mantle-(AMR-SIMC)?p=44514088#post44514088
naive birch
so amr sims subterfuge higher than nightstalker for me even without mantle. is amr just flat wrong?
inland flicker
Phup check out the post I made, my feelycraft is telling me that subterfuge might just be flat better than night stalker now even w/o mantle because the nightstalker preference is pretty firmly rooted from when we were running deeper stratagem... if nothing else it may make us more flexible in how we spend our energy during our CD's to maximize kingsbane damage
but i don't know enough to back it up with math yet
regal agate
subterfuge isnt that interesting without mantle
regal agate
can you post the results simc gave you?
naive birch
one sec
simc had nightstalker at 634 and subterfuge at 625
that amr sim has my weapon at 54 when it's actually at 46 which is why simc is significantly lower
main is outlaw
but still, i am curious how it gets subterfuge higher
odd sedge
amr is wrong in a whole lot of shit
naive birch
such as?
naive birch
i know it's gearing recommendations are often wacky
odd sedge
they still insist on that
naive birch
but its actual simulations have alwasy seemed decent
they were saying ap was better than exsang way before simc was
odd sedge
a simulation that says mastery is bis for outlaw, sorry not a fan
odd sedge
it does they made a post justifying it even
naive birch
if I raise my mastery and lower something else in amr, my simmed dps in there goes down
regal agate
guys every tool has it uses and upsides/downsides
we dont want a arm vs simcraft discussion
odd sedge
its normal its not very good, they are only 2 or 3 ppl working on all classes
regal agate
you need to adjust simcraft also to your task
it doesent give you the best result by default for every szenario
naive birch
i've looked closely at the log of actions the sim took when running rogue parses and it doesn't do anything wrong
regal agate
it does what you tell him to do, and thats decidet by the apl
naive birch
that's with mantle, right?
bleak sky
yup
naive birch
i'm saying AMR has subtefuge ahead with no specific legendary
regal agate
ye mantle is f.ex. a special case, weak invested time to optimize the apl for mantle and got a good result.
if its the optimal one isnt clear however its alot better then the default one
bleak sky
I will say that if you have mantle you should ALWAYS hold KB so it lines up with Vendetta. This is with CoF only.
Came out a 14k dps loss to just use KB on CD
Even if you lose KB uses
regal agate
yes the optimization is for CoF
whole zinc
does anyone know if nbf still sim higher as it should?
compact shell
Is the nightblooming frond trinket simming way to much as of right now for sin rogues?
naive birch
so when i run the default assassination apl with subterfuge, the first action it takes is vanish
prepot in stealth and then vanish
i'm guessing it's not optimized
sly yoke
i was just about to say that
torn dome
yes, the reason you wanna use my apl for mantle testing
sly yoke
i dont think it has "always garrote" logic for subterfuge
so it wouldnt be surprising simc would show it as a dps loss
inland flicker
wEak in theorycrafting i saw you were posting some sims with an APL showing ring / mantle was substantially outperfomring mantle/boots any chance youve got that APL or did i misunderstand thatw
naive birch
this is not with mantle though
i'm still wondering if subterfuge is closer or better than NS even without mantle
regal agate
the apl is posted here several times
torn dome
Without mantle I have no idea
APL for mantle:
http://pastebin.com/3ZstJgjD
Am I allowed to pin this
strong rune
yes, at this point you might as well
compact shell
Is the nightblooming frond trinket simming way to much as of right now for sin rogues?
strong rune
seen an inordinately large number of requests for it
regal agate
ye would be nice to add a text to explain it
strong rune
it's clearly an improvement, actually, so I'm just going to merge it into SIMC
inland flicker
Thanks wEak. Even with that APL i'm showing about 5% more dmg from mantle/boots/cof over mantle/ring but i'm guessing it was a mastery thing cuz i lose so much swapping out my rings
compact shell
wEak can you please reply if you know? :) Thanks in advance
torn dome
And abou the everlasting frond.
The damage numbers currently match in game numbers exactly. I just think in game it has lower ppm than simc has it right now. So I believe it oversims
compact shell
So you can't trust it at all, is what you're saying...
I'm simming 20k difference from Draught of souls 895 to Nightblooming frond 895, not sure what to do here...
torn dome
With my few hundred pulls of data frond is about 3% of my damage with the hc version. Where sim shows it at 5+%
whole zinc
@torn dome thanks 😃
regal agate
weak just trys to explain that his apl modification is for a specefic case and isnt ment for everyone
torn dome
I would have to do quite some work to get it to work with cof and boots
And it doesnt support any other talent setups outside the usual mp ap
naive birch
in simc is there a way in the apl to force the first x actions
like i want the first 4 things i do to be this, regardless of what procs or how many cp i get
then once that's done, use normal logic
torn dome
Like amr has?
Afaik no
naive birch
is there a time thing then? I thought there was. equivalent to "ignore this rule if we are in the first 10 seconds of the fight"
bleak sky
@torn dome It seems to work fine out of the box for COF. It was a dps loss to not save KB until Vendetta came off
Since boots reduce vendetta even more you won't need to bank KB really anymore
torn dome
Ye well Ill get a chance to look at it when I get back home
bleak sky
I'm playing around with seeing if I should bank DoS for vanish right now
torn dome
Shieet this apl gonna be the length of a short novel
strong rune
It's not done much around the codebase these days.
There's also a "time thing" - the variable "time" is time-since-start-of-combat
bleak sky
The answer appears to be no. You should not bank DoS for Vanish
strong rune
so you can condition something only on the first ten seconds of the fight by blocking it with if=time<10
torn dome
I really should learn to use simc for real
naive birch
@strong rune once a sequence is done it never gets run again unless i have a restart rule?
ami reading that right
strong rune
see the documentttion, i dont remember off the top of my head
that control flow block is rarely used these days
precisely because it's hard to reason about
torn dome
I think this is perfect for something like mantle vanish
Making it pool and then forcing a rotation
lavish yoke
got two 880 vendetta relics and legendary boots is it orth to switch for 895 toxic blades and 895 rupture crit?
bleak sky
I think I might see why. For some reason after vanishing it is using envenom waiting .3 seconds. Mutilating and then using envenom and then finally using DoS
actions.cds+=/use_item,name=draught_of_souls,if=equipped.140808&energy.deficit>=80&buff.master_assassins_initiative.up&(talent.agonizing_poison.enabled&debuff.agonizing_poison.stack=5&debuff.surge_of_toxins.remains>3|!talent.agonizing_poison.enabled)
was forcing it to wait for the mantle buff.
torn dome
Mantle has 2 buffs
bleak sky
That might be it ahaha
naive birch
all i did was get rid of the initial bad vanish, and with opener sequence and now subterfuge is simming at 632 for me vs 634 for NS
without mantle
no other changes to the apl
the default apl
torn dome
Nice. This also proves my feelcraft of ns rupture being weak nowadays for sin
But people have it so deep in their mindset
Also would point towards subter 100% in m+ and such
naive birch
it's all i use. i haven't been taking it off even on single target
sly yoke
@bleak sky you need a conditional to see if it would be up again before vanish is up
meaning cd remaining of vanish > 85 seconds
&(buff.master_assassins_initiative.up|cooldown.vanish.remains>85)&
i think it would be
strong forge
What changed regarding NS rupture @torn dome ?
That seems shockingly close even without mantle
torn dome
The change in our damage break down. RUpture is less and less of our total damage
So buffing it every now and then is also less impactful
wanton shell
well then
how is subter then better
since the only thing is that u basically vanish for a stronger garrote?
if u dont have mantle i really dont see the value lol
unless i am missing something
btw gonna ask here quick as well @torn dome tirathon 900 dos 910. use together yes or no?
the shared on use cd is 15 seconds
torn dome
as always sim it
wanton shell
im asking if it will be clanky
torn dome
and subter garrote actually hits like a truck
inland flicker
I'm very much with wEak on the feelcraft and the logs are showing it too- on average the few players running subterfuge on every fight are substantially outperforming nightstalker. I'd guess its because it makes our big damage less reliant on trying to tie all our cd's onto a vanish timer that doesn't match anything
torn dome
Then it should be higher
sly yoke
its actually really easy to napkin math which is better
inland flicker
i did the napkin math earlier, NS rupture does about 20-25% more damage, but i'd be willing to bet the flexibility you get from not having to vanish ruptrure more than makes up for it
torn dome
Wanna share an example html
sly yoke
average rupture cast * .5 vs average garrote cast *1.25
whichever is higher is the better talent
inland flicker
Garrote: 373,401 over 18 seconds.
373,401/18=20,744.5 DPS
373,401*1.25=466,751.25 (125% bonus to garrote damage)
466,751.25+373,401=840,152.25 (total damage from 18 second garrote)
840,152.25/18=46,675.125 (DPS from garrote)
Rupture: 912,720 over 24 seconds.
912,720/24=38,030 DPS.
912,720*.5=456,360 (additional damage from nightstalker)
912,720+456,360=1,369,080
1,369,080/24=57,045 (DPS from Rupture)
Potential maximum empowered bonus for garrote: 18*.75=13.5
13.5 seconds before initial refresh, refresh = 18-13.5=4.5
18+4.5=22.5
First garrote + second garrote = 13.5+22.5=36
36 seconds of empowered garrote
57,045*36=2,053,620
46,675*24=1,120,200 *.5=
1,120,200 *.5=560,100
1,120,200+560,100=1,680,300
theres your napkin match all the way done mouse
inland flicker
yeah BOTA has a much higher ceiling
sly yoke
i mean if youre just using log numbers
average cast is still average cast
all other factors are in there
either way its suuuch a small difference
inland flicker
but thats all assuming single target and almost every fight in NH is gonna give you another target to garrote and two empowered garrotes are gonna do more dmg than the rupture, not to mention energy gain
torn dome
Ye any cleave sub will blow ns
inland flicker
yup. i'd say we should start seeing a subterfuge meta emergre pretty soon here
torn dome
Ill get to it on friday.
Relax bois'
sly yoke
lulz
sly yoke
yeah
inland flicker
ur the man weak
sly yoke
to immediately pandemic
i think garrote, other ablility, garotte
is actually what you want
sly yoke
yes
the only addition would be multidot
if theres more than one target
because you have 3 seconds of no garrote cd
sly yoke
it can be annoying to get used to
i have vanished many times with garrote still on cooldown
rotund oak
This is the current line for Vanish Subterfuge
actions.cds+=/vanish,if=talent.subterfuge.enabled&dot.garrote.refreshable&((spell_targets.fan_of_knives<=3&combo_points.deficit>=1+spell_targets.fan_of_knives)|(spell_targets.fan_of_knives>=4&combo_points.deficit>=4))
What is Fan of knives doing there?
naive birch
it seems to be trying to avoid using vanish if you have multiple targets and fan of knives is likely to get you to max cp
i think. seems to be missing the point of throwing empowered garrote on multiple targets
or maybe i'm misunderstanding the logic
strong rune
wait, am I super dumb?
i really don't play assassination because i have to ask this, but doesn't FoK only give one CP?
it's not sub, where shuriken storm gives CP = # targets, right?
rotund oak
one CP + Crit
strong rune
roger.
rotund oak
But that line shouldn't say anything about Fok, either it's ST in which case you just garrote 2 times, or on MT cycle garrote
naive birch
in st why do you garrote 2 times?
rotund oak
to get a longer enhanced Garrote with pandemic
mellow elbow
Pandemic
naive birch
but if it's a vanish, isn't garotte already running. couldn't you just pandemic the existing one?
and not have to spend 35 energy for those extra 5 seconds or whatever
rotund oak
hm yeah obviously, didn't think of that
naive birch
and i always want to spell garrote with 2 t's for some reason
sly yoke
same
mellow elbow
omelette du garotte
rotund oak
@naive birch How did you get the sequence to work? "actions=sequence=garrote:mutilate:garrote" doesn't work
reef canyon
@odd sedge Hey pinging you again. Looks like you might have some things I can explain about AMR's simulations?
naive birch
i don't have it up anymore. i think it's a colon after sequence though
maiden cargo
Hey Zoopercat
reef canyon
Hey iso!
maiden cargo
I just posted you a few questions on the forum about the simulator, same thread as the Wunju comment ^^
reef canyon
he posted in a couple threads, let me try to find the right one. One sec!
maiden cargo
Nighthold trinkets, page 11
maiden cargo
Well the long and short of it is, I have been getting "no solution to the regression could be found" when trying to simulate myself for a gearing strategy, I think I may have broken it :p
reef canyon
ok, first - when you setup the simulation, do you have 'live' selected as the version?
reef canyon
I can try to run it here - using your most up to date armory? And did you want ursoc or mythic+?
maiden cargo
I have always just used ursoc I guess
reef canyon
Did you change any of the numeric values in the 'more options'? Like number of stat points or anything?
maiden cargo
Honestly I sim myself every time I get new loot with simcraft and I update the pawn values and that's great and everything, but to actually filter loot and see what's good for me I use the robot, it would be great if the numbers both things used were the same
reef canyon
a couple of things to note:
- you can use simc weights. To do that, on the gear page click the green 'view/edit' button above the stat priority list.
maiden cargo
So I can just enter into "use stat weights" the things from simcraft and it will work just fine?
reef canyon
- AMR does stat weights differently than SimC, for a tradeoff in speed. TLDR: AMR looks at 1000s of data points (simC looks at 2). AMR looks at stat interactions (simC's scaling function does not, however, the reforge plots DO, so check those out). AMR sims every item with a proc when you run stat weights - since those items don't rank well (or at all) with stat weights, this information is actually quite importat to have when looking at ranked gear lists.
inland flicker
@naive birch isn't the double garrote off the start a waste of energy? It'll be empowered still after your vanish and to get max empowered up time with least energy spent / combos wasted... i would suggest opening Garrote-mut-rupture-kingsbane-mut-envenom-mut-envenom until oom, vendetta and pop the vanish and another garrote right around 5 seconds left to maximize empowered garrote
reef canyon
So regarding using simc weights, if you want to do that, first run a custom gearing strat on AMR (or I can give you this one when it finishes). THEN use that report and adjust it to simc weights. That way, you'll have the trinket ranking info as well. Make sense?
maiden cargo
That would be fantastic
Do you have any idea why it was telling me it had no solution to the regression?
reef canyon
Here's the link to your report when it finishes: http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/simulator/report/6b4ed37f994d4115b13e9759b4f5b056
nope, only one more quesiton that I can think of - show me a screenshot of the gearing strat options (just above the more options section)
maiden cargo
should be able to see it in the first screenshot above
I had messed with the min and max ilvls, so maybe this
is 850-900 bad?
reef canyon
hmm ok those settings look fine. Try setting it to 870 - 920
otherwise, i'll send this over to our dev.
Does it work for any other characters?
maiden cargo
I'm not sure, it takes about 45mins on my system to finish but I can sure try it with my hunter, it's been fine in the past, just stopped working after I fiddled with some stuff I guess, mostly the ilvl stuff
naive birch
@inland flicker so garrote -> mut -> garotte = approx 25 or 26 seconds of empowered garrote out of opener instead of just 18
not sure if it's a gain or not.
since you waste some energy overwriting a garrote with like 16 seconds left on it
inland flicker
Right so what I'm suggesting is you dont use the second garrote until you've vanished
naive birch
you would still do that
inland flicker
because by the time you vanish, you don't waste as much time
but your pandemic gains no extra time doing it your way
naive birch
the end result is still 7 or 8 more seconds of empowered garrote at the cost of 35 energy
reef canyon
@maiden cargo to do a test run, set the number of data points to 500 (instead of 1000)
naive birch
probably a wash eithe rway
rotund oak
I'm trying to test this, but i can't get it to garrote 2 times in the opener
maiden cargo
How do I change the number of data points?
inland flicker
I"m sayin, garote-mut-garote (12 seconds later) vanish-garote means that second garrote is still limited to 24 seconds when you cast it, but your clipping over like a 12 second one rather than a 5 second one when you cast the second garrote
reef canyon
In that options section (Above more options), you'll see stat points listed at 1000. Edit that to 500.
you could probably go down to 250 and not cause problems (bugs)
naive birch
doing it your way the total amount of buffed garrote time is 36 seconds.
doing it mine, it's 43 to 44 ish
maiden cargo
Ok I started it on my alt rogue ill let you know if it finishes, thank you very much for taking the time to respond to my questions Zoppercat
naive birch
depending on how close you cut that extra garrote during the first subterfuge
inland flicker
ohh i see what your syaing phup
Yeah w/o mantle thats definitely strongest opener
naive birch
i don't know. you spend 45 energy to get 3 or 4 more ticks of buffed garrote
not sure if it's worth it
either way is probably fine
inland flicker
I'm assuming mantle where you definitely want to vanish right around 12 seconds in to catch the last 6 seconds of kingsbane
naive birch
oh yeah
i'm doing it for us plebs with crappy legendaries
really, if the 45 energy is worth the extra ticks, seems like you'd let the first garrote go completely before repeating the process on your first vanish
50ish seconds of buffed garrote to open
but after that just one since you could pandemic an already running weak garrote
rotund oak
anyone know if there is a simc command like "exsanguinated" for subterfuge garrote? when i try to customize the APL, it overwrites the subterfuge garrote with a normal one
inland flicker
i guess downside to that is by the time your second vanish comes up a lot of time is gonebut
naive birch
yeah, you have to hold your first vanish for 20-25 seconds
but on a 2 min cooldown, it won't hurt you except at very specific fight lengths
tardy walrus
What's the opener with shoulders and DoS
rotund oak
tardy walrus
I've tried there
tardy walrus
Copy of that post probably would have been more helpful. But thanks. I'll go look for it
maiden cargo
The sim on my alt seemed to work just fine
dire rapids
rotund oak
use target error, 0.1% for dps and 0.05 for stat weights
reef canyon
@maiden cargo I can reset your character settings to see if something is 'stuck' on your account for that character.
bleak sky
seems overkill Zyrius
reef canyon
but you might lose filter settings and stuff
maiden cargo
I'm going to try again with my main just like I did on my alt now and see if that works before I go to that option I think
so far it seems fine
now I have the sim you made I can sort out the gear atleast
One thing I did wonder tho about trinkets, why does the robot dislike convergence of fate so much?
reef canyon
I have to ask @manic pulsar for details on that one.
manic pulsar
I don't think the robot dislikes convergence... it just isn't amazing unless you have some certain other items, is my understanding, @maiden cargo
bleak sky
It's basically always amazing
So if robot puts it low it's not simming it right
or you aren't running MA relics perhaps
Yeah. AMR puts it WAY too low
just from gear optimizer perspective
inland flicker
yeah when you actually sim it it provides accurate-ish results for what the convergence actaully does
i'd guess gear optimizer doesn't assume you have boots/ma relics etc
but the gear optimizer menu (which admittedly zooper has said before is not meant to be terribly accurate) definitely mishandles it
delicate dagger
any idea how up to date is the simc profile for sub ?
reef canyon
@odd sedge hitting you up again - seems like on mmo-c you haven't seen my guide on how to run a custom gearing strat. Of course, if you don't get a custom one, you won't get custom weights. When you have time, I can walk you through that, or run it for you on your character.
@bleak sky Were you looking at a trinket list after running a custom gear strat? If not, I can run that for you and we can see how COF ranks then. And debug from there if it still doesn't look right. Just need your character name and realm.
@inland flicker Hmm, I don't think I said the gear optimizer isn't accurate 😉 You just need custom gear strategy that is tailored to you (that's maybe what you meant). Once you run a custom gearing strat, all trinkets, relics and items with procs are ranked from those simulations. If you don't have a setup custom to your character, it will be based on defaults (which is meant as a place to start for casuals).
pliant briar
If I want to use a SimC nightly build, jsut DL and extract the 7z file at the top of the list? Didn't know if I needed that plus a setup EXE from that list as well
round canyon
you just need the 7z file
extract it somewhere and run the simulationcraft.exe that you can find inside the folder
round canyon
np always happy to help others sim things
pliant briar
Also, is there a way in SimC to change the potion you would use, so I could see the difference?
round canyon
there is a line for it if you import from the armory
granite gust
Is there a way to see what was casted when in simcraft ? Curios to see the mantle opener with subterfuge. Saying its a 2k dps loss to run sub over NS
cinder iron
where in simc can i change my relics to sim other relics?
torpid skiff
!simulation
round canyon
commands dont work in the simulation channel. the command your looking for is !aethys or !simc most likely
inland flicker
@Sneekyone#0008 simC doesn't seem to have a mantle or subterfuge Opener built in yet. If you scroll up in this channel about 5 hours there are a few links to alternative APL's to force it to use mantle/sub Opener, as well as a few suggestions on how to open with it. It's a #WIP still from the author though so it's not perfect.
past token
@granite gust scroll down to "Action Priority List" in your results tab, then expand "Sample Sequence Table"
granite gust
Okay thanks heaps both of yous 😃
regal agate
apl changes for opener are pinned (keep in mind those are situational and dont fit every gear/relic/trinket setup)
round canyon
@night tinsel i found another error in simulationcraft and your the only theorycrafter online
it appears that cinidaria is not being applied by bladeflurry even though it applies in game
night tinsel
You can open up an issue here https://github.com/simulationcraft/simc/issues
round canyon
good to know
rotund oak
@night tinsel is that just for bugs, or APL optimization too?
night tinsel
Both, although with apl optimisation I think aethys would prefer that you've at least tested it to be a dps increase yourself with a default profile rather than just suggesting random ideas you think might be good
split sorrel
If you open an issue about the APL, ideally I would like to have the line you want to change with modifications. Testing it on a bunch of profiles isn't an issue.
rotund oak
How do i set the APL to only use an item if it's equipped, if=equipped.draught_of_souls and if=equipped.140808 don't work
merry cloud
You don't have to. Write line that uses draught and it will just give you a warning if there is not such item
rotund oak
Yeah, but i don't want the warning to show up :D
If my line gets into basic simc, everyone that doesn't have DoS gets this warning
merry cloud
Your line into basic simc? You have to change C code for that 😃
rotund oak
not me, but i would submit that line to github and let someone else to it :D
merry cloud
Simc won't generate line to use item if there is nothing to use
rotund oak
So i dont have to worry about the warning and just submit my line?
merry cloud
Yes