Lethal Quantities

[tough cradle]

the weight is 0

somewhere along the lines its taking the values and spiking them to an absurd number

i checked the regular scrap its normal

[tranquil patrol]

Yeah this isn't an LQ issue at all. The defaults LQ is getting are probably from some placeholder or baseline scrap the corpse mod uses. LQ gets the values for scrap upon loading into a game, and I don't think the corpse mod is setting the scrap values before the game loads

I imagine it wouldn't matter what you change in the LQ config about the corpse scraps unless you wanted them to spawn in at round start

[tough cradle]

im just going to try a different scrap mod

[sharp dagger]

Reclarification: @tough cradle You know defaultly the value for scrap is multiplied by .4 across the board. Putting it to 1 sets the minimum and maximum to be exactly what is seen in the scrap list - however, if you do not check the box - even if it's a parent or not, specific generations can multiply the value further

for example: Scarlet Devil Mansion (SDM) - ups the rate, LethalProgression multiplies the value, as well as many other mods could potentially stack on top of your set values in some way

So if you set a parent to be 1, but don't set the price of the scrap - the scrap value itself could be influenced by something else and then multiplied by the "1"

Although I have 0 idea what could cause your scrap thing without a list of mods o- o... unless the list is up there somewhere

[tough cradle]

im a visual learner lol, my brain is exploding

can we just vc

i can clarify

[sharp dagger]

okey ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[stuck juniper]

okay according to my tests, setting the spawning curve for individual enemies to start in the negatives for the value (meaning it takes that enemy's rarity and multiplies it by a negative number, which I assumed would just prevent the enemy from spawning until the value went into the positives later in the day) is what was causing the broken spawning behavior, with more negative values for individual monster spawn curves exacerbating the issue until it somehow broke early spawning and caught up later in the day.
The reason I didn't think negative values would be an issue is because the vanilla game uses negative values for spawning curves already, particularly for the outdoor enemies master spawn curve, so I just assumed I could also use negative values for individual monster spawn curves as well, but apparently this isn't the case.
What's weirder is that I have used negative values for individual monster spawns through LQ on OTHER custom moons and it works perfectly fine and exactly as the numbers would suggest it would, but for some reason on my 2 Tolian moons PsychSanctum and Argent, negative values for the spawn curves tied to individual monsters breaks early spawning entirely. Perhaps the internal math has some sort of strange negative threshold and I was just happening to hit that threshold where it breaks for the Tolian moon custom monster spawning behavior but didn't reach that threshold on the other custom moons that also use negative values in monster spawning curves, so I am still not certain if it was somehow tied to Tolian moons specifically or perhaps just a quirk with Lethal Company I discovered by altering values in a way the game wasn't expecting from very specific spawning curves even though the vanilla game alters them this exact way for other spawning curves.

Never-the-less, it seems I've figured it out at least.

@tacit thunder if you have a known bugs section anywhere, it may be worth adding that apparently having the spawn curve for individual monsters going into the negatives AT ALL not-always-but-apparently-can-sometimes-have the capacity to break ALL spawning for ALL monsters, (even outdoor daytime ones like manticoils) if any of their >individual< spawn curves dip into the negatives.
I believe the behavior I was seeing where spawns catch back up later in the day was due to the fact the spawn curve for individual monsters dipped back into the positives since the negative value was put in place to guarantee that monster NEVER showed up period, even on eclipsed, until at least a certain portion through the day had passed.

In short, negative values for spawning curves are apparently fine for the master spawn curve of outdoor enemies, daytime enemies, and indoor enemies, BUT a negative value for the spawning curve of individual enemies breaks something internally, possibly just with how Lethal Company was built to manage monster spawning, and as a result the more monsters with negative values for their current spawning curve (at that current time of day), the more borked the spawning becomes by taking off from the max count of enemies that can successfully spawn.
Negative keys and values are fine on master spawning curves, but slowly begin breaking spawning behavior across the board if used on individual monster spawning curves.
What a weird niche specific stupid little thing, but at least I finally nailed it down.

[tacit thunder]

hmmm yeah that's definitely an issue

the range should be capped between 0 and 1

but not sure if i can check for that easily

[stuck juniper]

well if you take a looksy here on March, you can see Zeekerss did this very thing, intentionally dipping the value into the negatives to basically shut down spawning completely past a certain point or before a certain point as the day progresses, this is why I just assumed I could do the same for individual monsters

the key is capped between 0 and 1 in function as near as I can tell, but apparently the value is not necessarily capped in its function the same way since it acts as a multiplier that can go beyond 0 and 1, and somehow putting the value into the negatives breaks things but only for individual monster spawn curves, except it breaks it slowly, not immediately, like negative values done in this very specific way slowly overload Lethal Company spawning systems until they stop working entirely until all those values dip back up to 0 or above

[noble crypt]

is the giant specimens mod not compatible with this mod?

i dont have them allowed to spawn on embrion but they still do

in their config it says they can but i thought got overridden

[tranquil patrol]

Can you use some kind of modulo? It's not really doable to have the input values be clamped between 0 and 1 because with how cubic splines work that doesn't necessarily mean the values will never go below 0 or above 1

Like here, none of the input values are negative, but the curve still dips into negatives

And if I clamp the values to be under 1 as well, there can still be negative dips

Or just hard clamp the values, though idk how the invalid values would play

Or I'm overcomplicating things, and you could literally just go "if negative value, make equal to 0"

[waxen frost]

the spawn curve for individual monsters is different. afaik it just multiplies the rarity with the curve value to get the probability during selection of monsters to spawn within a given wave. You can check how the negative curve values affect this on indoor enemies. The game prints the probabilities of all monsters in unity log. I would have guessed it just ignores the result's sign but if it doesn't it probably messes up the weighted random selection

[tacit thunder]

im not sure, since as you showed the y values can all be positive but it can still be negative, which i can't really control myself

which is the #1 issue that i can't really resolve

it would be best if zeekerrs added in a check themselves

[stuck juniper]

yeah when I read this paragraph again from here https://lethal.miraheze.org/wiki/Mechanics I had a suspicion this was what was happening to me, I just wasn't sure how exactly until I started fiddling with it by starting from zero and working back up to the broken state I had.
I guess negative numbers break or confuse this weighted index selection for eligible entities and renders not just the enemies with negative values as uneligible but other separate enemies in the same spawning pool too.
I guess it does make sense now that I think about it. Technically both master and individual monster spawning curves are animation curves, but one functions with its value as the max count of enemies spawning tries to match, and the other operates totally differently with its value just being a multiplier to the monster's rarity number.

[jovial pelican]

I like how this is an issue i never had until sharktemplar brought it up. now nothing spawns with the same config that worked perfectly fine 3 days ago

[stuck juniper]

based, my nightmare saved someone else from the same nightmare!

You do have a bit of play with it, but the more individual monster spawning curves that have the curve dipping into the negative, the more 'ineligibility leak' takes place for all monster spawning for the entire map inside and out. During my tests, I had instances where I had only 2 monsters with negatives in their spawning curves and the result was that only about half of what I set the master spawning curve to in max monster count was actually spawning in, and adding more negatives for monster curves dropped it to 0, and removing them all made it obey the master spawning curve flawlessly down to the exact number. So, technically it's possible it was broken before but only a little and you assumed it was working fine because the issue wasn't exacerbated enough to be noticeable, but I can confirm it IS moon specific, so I think I was wrong when I said messing with one moon alters the spawning of another. What I had actually done was just make a few tweaks to monster curves without testing it which tipped it over into full-break mode and then moved on to another moon.

[noble crypt]

ok im trying to use LQ with giant specimens and it isnt working

i think the giant specimens config is overriding thw LQ file

but idk how to fix it

[stuck juniper]

could have giant speciments just NOT spawn anything through their configs and then have LQ handle spawning of giant specimens monsters for specific moons exclusively, that way there's no in-fighting perhaps

[noble crypt]

i tried setting "do driftwoods spawn" to false and same with redwood and then had LQ make them spawn a lot but it didnt work

maybe if i do that plus removing their weights in config

but idk

[noble crypt]

ok so i think this is unrelated but i had that thing happen where you can only vist a planet once and then if you try to return you get stuck on waiting for players screen

just wondering if you have any experience with dealing with this

[stuck juniper]

nope, probably something the game is trying to initialize but fails, and if it doesn't happen every time, then it's something that doesn't always initialize by default, so possibly spawns related, either scrap or monsters

[noble crypt]

hmm mk

also, im trying to mess around with embrion spawns

in LQ, it says the old birds are "outside" enemies but they are spawning immediately as statues

so does that mean you just put old birds in outside enemies and then they still spawn during the day and just wake up at night like normal?

[stuck juniper]

yes, in my experience that is how it works. Whether or not an old bird will spawn is decided at the start of the day, and if it is decided yes, a dormant old bird spawns in immediately and simply wakes up at the time it would 'spawn in' like a normal monster spawning in such as an eyeless dog

[placid thistle]

which ones are indoor and which ones are outside?

[tranquil patrol]

Outside and Daytime are effectively the same thing. 0 - 1 for daytime is start of day - end of day, 0 - 1 for outside is start of day - end of day. They're only separated so they can have different power levels

[tranquil patrol]

Fairly sure all of them are outside

[jovial pelican]

the consensus is that daytime enemies are friendly (roaming locus, manticoils) and outside enemies are not. but both spawn outside.

(Interior enemies are inside)

[stuck juniper]

okay so apparently all these tests I did to discover that negative values in spawning curves breaking spawning was true... but only for a specific custom moon called PsychSanctum by Tolian. Using the exact same supposedly broken spawn setup with LQ but placed on Experimentation instead has it behave normally. So... apparently you CAN use negative values and they work as you'd expect across the board... UNLESS it's a specific moon that has wonky spawning behavior somehow attached to it, because even when not using negative values for PsychSanctum, I am now getting too many enemies way too fast to the point it is blatantly violating the master spawn curve that is meant to limit the amount that gets spawned. So just for frame of reference, apparently some custom moons just do not enjoy having their monster spawns tweaked and I have yet to figure out why.
@tacit thunder if you added anything to any FAQ anywhere like I recommended, may wanna adjust it now. The main culprit seems to be specific moons that break in different ways depending on their monster spawn setup, rather than LQ simply breaking everything across the board when using a specific monster spawn setup (such as negative values on individual monster spawn curves, which apparently works fine on vanilla moons)

[tranquil patrol]

Have you let Tolian know?

[stuck juniper]

yes, but he hasn't said anything yet, he seems busy trying to update his multitude of moons to be of high quality so it makes sense that an issue that only pops up when someone tries to alter monster spawning on one or two of his moons results in their modded behavior not working right would be a low-priority concern for him

[tranquil patrol]

For sure I was just asking cause if you hadn't I was gonna

[stuck juniper]

so far all I can gather is that PsychSanctum REALLY REALLY does not like doing ANY monster spawns early in the day, and telling it to even allow 2 monster spawns immediately instead of 0 causes it to freak out and start spawning like 13 before noon

it's SO weird, there's clearly rogue elements WILDLY, DRASTICALLY altering the math responsible for normal monster spawning behavior

but it's ONLY on his moons PsychSanctum, and it happened on Argent too but I've yet to do rigorous tests there like I have on PsychSanctum so far

and this behavior happened BEFORE he gave it the prettification update

so it must be some internal thing he legit just doesn't realize is even happening

doesn't happen on Celest or Crest or Bozoros or Infernis or Atlas Abyss

but it DOES happen on his moons

[stuck juniper]

interesting, seems using only 3 points for the master monster spawn curve for PsychSanctum gets it to behave the most consistently... but that could just be a weird red herring because if it's this broken then obviously the more variables of control you try to add, the less it will follow them consistently if each one is being altered by something else unseen

[tacit thunder]

hmm ok, so it's because they have a custom spawning algorithm

[stuck juniper]

or something functionally of the sort, yes. I have ABSOLUTELY no clue why else one moon has wonky spawning behavior while LQ works absolutely perfectly fine on vanilla moons using the exact same set-up, negative values included

[tacit thunder]

rip

[stuck juniper]

ripperoni pizza indeed, at least I can get the behavior I want in a general sense since it loosely follows the true values

[noble crypt]

im still having these issues where the second i touch anything in the LQ json file, it makes it so i can only load a moon a single time

i cand land on moons perfectly fine but then the second time i try to return i get stuck on waiting for players

does it have something to do with the live changes from the json file?

[stuck juniper]

to my current knowledge the json file cannot actually enact live changes, each change you make requires that you restart the entire .exe game itself or they don't actually take effect

but the one time I did try to do a live change and just reload the savegame instead of quit and restart the entire game itself, I didn't hang on landing, it's just that the results of the change didn't apply

that's why I suspect it's some other mod you have. I know for a fact HDLethalCompany breaks stuff you would NEVER guess it was touching. After the Black Mesa moon mod updated a night or two ago, suddenly multiple things were broken, and I quickly discovered thanks to a hint from someone that HDLethalCompany was very unstable and carelessly made, so I disabled it out of curiosity and sure enough the issues cleared up, one such issue was just hanging on the "Random Seed" screen while attempting to land on a moon, but that hang was first try not second

best you can do is probably just bite the bullet and start disabling mods you suspect may be the culprit until the second-landing-hang-up stops happening, then wittle it down until you find the true conflict

[jovial pelican]

We need your logs to begin resolving your issue

[noble crypt]

wait what are the logs? how would i send them?

[tranquil patrol]

\AppData\Roaming\r2modmanPlus-local\LethalCompany\profiles\<profile>\BepInEx\LogOutput.log

Or if you're using Thunderstore, replace r2modmanPlus-local with thunderstore

[noble crypt]

after some testing ive noticed that when i disable only hullbreaker then i can load into the moon multiple times

but

no entities spawn besides old birds

(all of my testing has been on embrion btw)

yeah so with hulbbreaker, the game wont let me land on a moon twice

but without it, only old birds spawn

:/

[tranquil patrol]

That would make sense given that Embrion only spawns Old Birds

[noble crypt]

i mean including the inside

so theres nothing inside

and only old birds outside (and i dont think they wake up)

im pretty sure this whole issue is from hullbreaker

i found a fork of it that says its LQ compatible which implies the orignial is not compatible

[noble crypt]

im trying to customize the prices of rend, dine and titan and it wont work

it worked for a custom moon but not those three

not sure as to why

[lament hemlock]

hey guys is LQ compatible with Scaled Loot?

[tranquil patrol]

Haven't heard of that mod, what does it do?

[lament hemlock]

https://thunderstore.io/c/lethal-company/p/Madonox/ScaledLoot/

its supposed to scale loot with the increasing quota. I was thinking i could set the base multiplier with LQ and this could increase them as the game goes on

[tranquil patrol]

Reading the sourcecode it seems to apply value changes as they're being sold, so I imagine it would be compatible yes

Though presumably you wouldn't be able to see any value change UNTIL the items are sold

To test, make the "quota scale" config value something smaller than 130 (or whatever your starting quota is set to) and sell one scrap to see if you get more money than the scrap said it was worth

[lament hemlock]

Interesting… that’s not how I expected it to work lol. But thank you for the input, I’m going to try this!

[noble crypt]

guys what would cause LQ to be unable to customize the moon prices??

[turbid zinc]

I have no idea tbh, never used that feature of it yet

[jovial pelican]

the moon itself reoverrides the price afterwards

[noble crypt]

how would i do it then?

[jovial pelican]

change it in the moons config file.

[noble crypt]

wait what config files? im trying to change asteroid, junic, rend, dine, titan and artifices price

[jovial pelican]

These dont have extra config files (I was talking about for example Ganimedes), but they should work with LQ and not reoverride the price

Which mods do you have installed?

[noble crypt]

ummm

here

[civic arch]

why do roaming locusts keep appearing on rend and dine i did not add them to the daytime table

and no entities appear outside

[tranquil patrol]

Which presets are you changing the prices in

[noble crypt]

the little bottom corner thing

am i doing it wrong D:

[noble crypt]

am i supposed to change it in global?

i tested the price changing thing on a new profile with only LQ so no other mods interfere and it didnt work

so i must be doing something wrong

[tranquil patrol]

Yeah all you're doing here is saying "the cost to travel to Asteroid FROM Asteroid is 2500". You need to set it to 2500 in every planet you want it to cost 2500 in

Unless you want planets to have different travel costs depending on where you are, I'd suggest hitting "Add all" under Prices on every planet, leaving the prices unchecked, and then set the price for each moon in the Global preset

[noble crypt]

ohhh

so it'd be like

for asteroid

i'd put every other planet there and then put the price

but then on asteroid i'd make the price 0 so that you dont need to buy it again?

[tranquil patrol]

Yeah, though there isn't really any need to put a price for Asteroid within Asteroid cause you only need to pay when you're changing moons. You wouldn't need to pay to land on Asteroid twice in a row

[noble crypt]

is it possible to make it where you only have to buy once per quota? the permanent moons mod doesnt work anymore

[tranquil patrol]

Wdym by "once per quota", vanilla behaviour lets you do that? Unless you mean purchasing the planet once and being able to go there forever from anywhere for free, that's not possible no

[noble crypt]

vanilla makes it where you have to repurchase with every change. there was a mod i used in v49 called permanent moons where you could keep the moon until the quota changes

i dont think it works in v50 so i was wondering if i could recreate it with the LQ settings somehow

[tranquil patrol]

Then no LQ can't do that. I usually just go to the same planet for each quota

[noble crypt]

yeah i would too but i have the random sell price mod and the weather multipliers

ill figure it out

[civic arch]

hello, anyone know how to get the time from key when making the nighttime curves? etc i want the time of the 0.6 key

[rapid bolt]

oh god help me i gotta redo everything because recent updates duped my planet entries

its fine i can redo this lol

[noble crypt]

does LQ update the game live with multiple people

[jovial pelican]

18*{key}+6

[tranquil patrol]

LQ applies changes upon landing (might apply when you switch moons, I'm not sure) so yes it does apply semi-live

[tranquil patrol]

Wdym when you say "duped", can't you just remove the extra presets?

[rapid bolt]

The new presets are more updated, the old ones are from a previous version

It's all good, i was able to clean it up

[civic arch]

Ty!!

[placid thistle]

Yo is the rarity / spawn weight for modded enemies true to LQ settings or do some mods interfere?

I have the Jester set to 30 on lethal quantities but I was watching the console and it said the weight was 17

Wonderin if I should be worried about it (is the console right or is LQ true)

[tranquil patrol]

The final value changes depending on the time of the day. Think of the 30 as the default 1x, and throughout the day it can be 0.5x or 1.5x etc

[turbid zinc]

spawn curves, just to throw a wrench into what you think you know 😔

[placid thistle]

Does anyone know a good video for understanding spawn curves and fall off curves better?

I usually prefer written instructions with pictures but the lethal company stuff makes me frazzled for some reason

I guess a better questions:

Can moons affect the spawn curves or is it inherited from the enemy?

[turbid zinc]

funny question cuz I believe the answer is BOTH

but I think if you set a spawn curve for the moon, all enemies use that to determine at which points they spawn most frequent in

but in LQ you can set specific curves per entity

I imagine that if you go and do that, that entity will spawn on intervals seperate from the moon's curves

so say you set like, a bracken to most likely spawn at 9am or smthn

but in the moon's curve, entities only usually spawn at around 4pm

bracken will spawn at 9am, and everyone else, later

[buoyant gyro]

Lethal.wiki's custom enemy guide the unity project section has an explanation on most if not all properties

[tranquil patrol]

I've been trying to get the confidence to make a video on all of LQ tbh but I've not been doing well recently so we'll have to see

[noble crypt]

do you guys know if menstalker works with LQ

[noble crypt]

nvm

it does kind of

but he is too jank anyways :(

[ornate mantle]

Does the key on spawn curves always have to go up to 1 exactly? If i'm using a mod to make the days longer, will x = 1 always be 12AM and x = 0.5 always be half way through the day? or, for example, if the day is twice is long will I instead have to add x = 2?
ive read in places that x is just a percentage of a day so wouldn't go above, but it doesnt always feel totally right, and the outside / daytime x axis are sometimes completely different, particularly in outside enemies when it uses "-7.73696229e-"

[tranquil patrol]

That entirely depends on how the mod you're using to extend the day works, not really any way to know from LQ's perspective alone

The value CAN go above 1 and below 0, it's just that values aren't chosen before the game starts and after the game ends, so it's effectively clamped in most cases, unless you can somehow force spawns to occur before and after the normal timescale. But depending on how the mod you're using works, it could either be 0% - 100% of your available time, or 0% - 200% of the vanilla time. It depends on the mod

Also "-7.73696229e-" is just computer gobbledegook for "really low number", probably due to an exponential

[jovial pelican]

"-7.73696229e-" is most likely just 0 + floating point error

[lament hemlock]

Is it detrimental if I replace those with whole numbers?

[jovial pelican]

no, its completely fine

[severe harness]

There should be a number after the e notation, it's scientific notation, something like "-7.73696229e-7" seems to be the default minimum value for the outdoor enemy curve for many vanilla moons

[tight quartz]

if i create the LQ config files with all my moons, then disable some of them, will LQ just ignore the missing moons or can this create issues ?

[severe harness]

I think it'll just ignore them but if you do have concerns with the absent moons causing problems you can delete the ones that are no longer in the profile, you can do it like so:

In the Web UI, click Presets and you can select the moon(s) you want to remove from the roster manually, image below is how it'll appear

[tranquil patrol]

It'll just ignore them. For example, LQ generates a config for Liquidation despite it not properly existing yet and nothing breaks there. Also TestAllEnemies generates a config despite it being a dev only moon

[noble crypt]

does anyone know what would cause a new modded planet to not show up in the json file as a present?

i joined and hosted a game with the mod and opened the present folder and yet it didnt appear

[noble crypt]

ok nvm i fixed this

i just did the same thing again

and it worked :/

[noble crypt]

im just wondering.. why ever use the scrap amount multiplier instead of changing the amounts yourself?

what difference does it would it make?

[tight quartz]

It's just that some people have 8gb ram so when they play i have to disable some moons otherwise they crash, but if lq just ignore them it should be fine

[tight quartz]

Btw could you explain TestAllEnemies in LQ ? That's the purpose of it ?

[tranquil patrol]

It's just Zeekerss' testing ground for dev stuff, inaccessible without specific mods, you can safely ignore it

[tight quartz]

Yeah i use the "vanilla" feature with lethalDevMode but why IS there a config for this in Lethal quantités ?

[severe harness]

Cause Zeekers prob set the location as a level that can't normally be accessed thru normal means

[tranquil patrol]

Just the way LQ collects the ingame variables. TestAllEnemies is labelled as a moon, so LQ lists it as a moon. Only thing to do to get rid of it would be to hardcode it out, or figure out how to differentiate between moons blocked by a paywall or blocked via dev means

And it's not really necessary to do that, so Banana hasn't done it

[buoyant gyro]

Use devtools not lethaldevmode

[tight quartz]

So test all enemies is useless in LQ ? Like if i want to test ennemies i shouldn't touche it anyway it won't block me to Spawn enemies on testMoon ? Because some of my Monster won't Spawn on testmoon so i was wondering if lq was blocking it

[tranquil patrol]

Easy answer is that they're both variables Zeekerss uses, so they're available to edit. Personally I think it's useful for use with parent presets. You can set the minmax values in each preset then a multiplier in Global etc

[tight quartz]

IS that better ?

[severe harness]

Curious what enemies are you trying to test in this context if you don't mind me asking

[tranquil patrol]

Idk what you're talking about tbh, but anything edited in TestAllEnemies should have literally no effect on any other moon unless there's a parsing error that's preventing LQ from eorking altogether, bit that's true for all moons

[buoyant gyro]

Yes

[tight quartz]

Last one i remember was vile vending machine, no way to spawn it

[severe harness]

Ah ok, haven't played around with that enemy in particular but am familiar that sometimes LethalDevMode doesn't detect certain enemies

[buoyant gyro]

Depends on ur api, LL and LLL all should

Also people generally use imperium now

Rather than those 2

[buoyant gyro]

@gusty vector if ur API isn't currently doing this, it should (patching the dev menu to add enemies appropriately)

[tight quartz]

The thing Is that lethalDevMode detect it, when i click vile vending it show that it's spawning in thé console but i can't see it ingame

Never Saw it on all my games btw

[tight quartz]

Rather than devtools and lethalDevMode u mean ?

[buoyant gyro]

Yes

[tight quartz]

i'm assuming it act the same for enemies btw, it will just ignore the disabled monster mod ?

[noble crypt]

the higher the door speed multiplier the quicker enemies open doors right? what would I need the multiplier to be in order for enemies to instantly open doors

[noble crypt]

what would i change in order to make it where monsters spawn more in the facility

besides the power value

i just mean

i want the inside power to be maxxed out earlier for my late game moons

like you enter the facility and immediately there are a ton of monsters

[noble crypt]

ive been making edits to a json file and suddenly it stopped working.. a previous version works fine and im not sure what is causing it

this could be related

artifice has no present on the right even tho there is one on the left

[jovial pelican]

press add preset, name it Artifice, drag it from the left-left to the right and drop it over No preset.

[noble crypt]

randomly LQ just stops having an impact on anything and im not sure why

[ruby fractal]

68 Artifice, to be precise

[tranquil patrol]

If there's any json errors the entire thing fails. This can happen either because of direct json editing or if an invalid value has been inputted somewhere

Do you read logs when things fail?

[noble crypt]

yeah hold on let me get the logs

[primal oar]

heya, apologies if this has been asked before (please god discord add a search function per post (unless I'm dumb and can't find it)) Has anyone else experienced DunGen desyncs when using the map size multiplier? Seems like dungeon generation becomes increasingly more desynced for clients if the map size multiplier is touched at all. From what I gathered it seems like all clients, or at least some, see the same interior, but it always differs from what the host sees

[turbid zinc]

Oh yeah you don't wanna touch map size

insane desyncs caused by it

[jovial pelican]

since when? never had any problem with it in my 180 mods pack. at the moment i have it at 3 for all moons.

maybe an incompatibility with another mod?

[primal oar]

appeared to happen in isolation too (though used Imperium to verify), but I just found a post a bit further up stating that they seem to work correctly if inherited from a parent? #1213985212686532638 message

which would line up with CreepiMatze's situation too

[ruby fractal]

Uhh, counterpoint, what if all players had the same presets for LQ? Will it still desync?

[noble crypt]

if you make the outside enemy spawn curve high enough, they'll spawn during the morning, right?

i want to make a moon that has absolutely horrifying enemy spawns where its pretty much always an eclipsed moon

si could i ignore the daytime enemies tab if i have the outside enemy spawn curve really high immediately?

[placid thistle]

or you could just set them as daytime enemies

yo so

So i set all my interiors to have the same weight / rarity.
ive been testing Central Config and i've noticed that it seems to be much more truly equally random, whereas with Lethal Quantities it seems like certain interiors never get chosen on certain moons or at all, and facility is much more common

is there something i should be doing in the LLL config in conjunction with LQ to achieve this?

i set this for every interior cfg and the LLL config as well but it doesnt seem to make it happen either:

everylevelname_in_a_comma_separated_string:300 or @300

[primal oar]

to clarify, this was with everyone having the same configs, and it also happened when testing locally on LAN
I ended up making a new profile that touched only on dungeonflows, where I set the multiplier of each dungeonflow individually, then parented the moons where I wanted to scale interior size that way. Was able to get it to work without the desyncing part as far as I'm aware

[ruby fractal]

Oh, I don't actually use those specific factory size multipliers, I use the 'overall' map size multiplier above it. Does that not work?

[primal oar]

Not on the individual moon profiles, haven't checked if it works through a parent though

[jovial pelican]

i use both in the parent preset and they work flawlessly

[ruby fractal]

But what if I just use the overall map size mult for each moon in multiplayer? Would this cause desyncs?

[civic arch]

for the interior sizes, does it override the map size multiplier like if I set facility to 1 and mansion to 0.6? and does the mansion interior size still get divided by /1.5?

sorry wrong ss

[jovial pelican]

no. factory size is a multiplier. the final size of the interior is map_size * factory_size

[civic arch]

alr, so if did map size as 1 and facility as 1.3, the facility would be 1.3?, and if mansion was 1 it would be 1?

[jovial pelican]

yes. just make sure the result is above ~0.7 as low values lead to crashes

[civic arch]

alr ty for help!

[noble crypt]

having a higher door speed multiplier means enemies will open doors that many times faster, right?

[ruby fractal]

That's how it works in the game, but I've never changed those values that via LQ, so mileage may vary.

[shadow wadi]

Does LethalQuantities override levelLoader and the dungeons' individual configs?

[ruby fractal]

Yes, LQ takes precedence

[shadow wadi]

Awesome, so the mods' configs will basically be ignored

Ty!

[noble crypt]

have any of you guys experiences issues with using LQ with the sentinel mod

for me the health, spawn rate and power levels cant be configured and they always spawn on all interiors no matter what

LQ can be used to make them spawn outside tho but nothing else in my experience

[gusty vector]

Yeah, the sentinel mod creator kidna did not follow what other where doing, so there is not much compatibility with anything sadly

They even created their own config system

So accessing the config is a pain

[placid thistle]

yes but not for interior viability

ime

like even if you add every available interior to the global preset of LQ with equal rarity they will not be viable dungeons on moons they are not configured for in their mod config

[shadow wadi]

ohhh, So I can jsut spam the list of moons onto the interior configs

LQ will take care of the weights and what will ACTUALLY load

[placid thistle]

Yes

The weights yes

[shadow wadi]

Sick. And any interiors that don't have configs will just work without anything extra

[placid thistle]

So for the oneshot moons, they don’t have their own config, and even if you use the LLL configuration to dictate which moons they are viable in, they were showing up as unviable interiors on moons aside from the oneshot moons for some reason

So for the most part yes

But apparently there’s exceptions to the rule

[shadow wadi]

OK cool. I'm not using those so hopefully all is well.

We shall see once I get the first tests goin ig

[cobalt aurora]

How does it work? And does it work with profile codes?

[lament hemlock]

so im having an issue with the plague doctor and scp 1507. they both have behavior where they spawn monsters but using lethal quantities seems to break this behavior if other monster spawns are edited in the config. any advice?

[gusty vector]

Hum Aubaniro could tell you best, but in short, they implemented their own equivalent of Lethal Lib, so that it registeres their enemies. As such, Lethal Quantities might not be able to get things as they are

Can't help you more than taht

Really don't know exacly what they did

[lament hemlock]

here are my logs, im getting an error that seems to indicate the monster cant spawn the additional monsters like it is supposed to

[craggy patrol]

anyone know whats going on here ??? 😭 had like a good amount of moons and it was perfectly fine but then i like added literally only like 3 more and now its doing this and wont register any of the modded moons in the terminal (also another thing is selenes choice broke too cus its not showing only 3 moons like it should)

oh wait nvm one of them i added had like lethallevelloaderv50 fixed or whatever it might be that hold on

yea that was it nvm LOL

[placid thistle]

Can you elaborate? Wdym break?

If it’s like using Masked with Mirage, you should add whatever creature type the aforementioned enemies spawn in to the LQ preset but don’t check the rarity , power level, or max quantity box

Like that’s how u make it so the enemy is a viable creature for the moon but the spawn is handled by another mod

You cannot control spawn chances of those creatures with LQ and also have them be spawned by another mod ime

Even if it doesn’t seem broken it doesn’t math

Like for the Haunted Harpist

If you try to set a rarity with LQ it will just spawn like 3 of them every time early in the day

Just gotta add it to the preset and don’t touch anything except health/stun and door stuff

[noble crypt]

what are common causes of the LQ json file not affecting anything anymore?

i heard this can happen when one little thing is input wrong which causes it to stop having the changes to the json file affect the game

[inner light]

yeah serenity's old so it still uses LLLfix

probably shoulda told you that teehee

[severe harness]

Only 3 moons I don't recognize in that list is "Glen", "Barrens", and "Refuge", no clue what mod(s) they originate from either cause Discord search is turning up nothing and all 3 of them don't turn up on individual searches

I'd say yeah avoid Serenity not only cause of the LLLFix part (ie, means if the moon has foggy weather then it might not be configured correctly and could crash game among one of the things) but I also had some, weird af bug where the map spams errors to the point I run out of memory and crash, somehow

No clue what's causing it still to this day

Interesting thing is tho, I don't see Serenity on that list that was posted above

[jovial pelican]

oneshot moons

[severe harness]

Oh

[inner light]

wtf really?

i literally played on serenity for a whole quota like 3 times during an all nighter and like

I didn't encounter any intense logging or anything

I just removed the LLLfix dependency and it worked fine

it also never had any weather for me, except #1241786100201160784's meteor shower cuz it can appear on any moon

[inner light]

peak mod honestly, wish it had a thread here

[jovial pelican]

true

[severe harness]

It might've been caused by me doing goofy stuff

I also threw mental hospital and rehauled the spawns and I'm thinking it's that combo that made my game go kerput

Cause I loved using Serenity as a sorta Tulip Snake tutorial

[tranquil patrol]

The error message you get in the log should tell you exactly where the issue is in the json

[vocal stone]

what is lll

[ruby fractal]

LethalLevelLoader

[fleet bluff]

is it possible to set list of scrap spawn on global for every moons ? (i want all moons to have the same scraps)

[shadow vessel]

is it safe to use lq to modify the interior weights of modded and vanilla moons, or should i use LLL config instead (safe as in error proof)

[severe harness]

Haven't tested it myself but I imagine what you can do is just remove entries for scrap on a per-moon basis and instead have all the scrap entries & weights in the "Global" preset

[fleet bluff]

I have to remove scraps on moons page? Sure?

[waxen frost]

if you have any questions about this.. I probably tried everything
basically for now if you want to use map size multiplier just toggle the dungeon flows section as well and 'add all' dungeons. No need to change their rarity or factory size multiplier - just enable the section and you won't get any desyncs.

you can still use LLL to configure your dungeon rarities e.g. to have a functional simulate terminal command. Works perfectly fine.

[waxen frost]

on the moon preset just add all in scrap section. It will inherit the value from from global preset but only if it's in the list.

[civic arch]

lq overrides lll

so use lq

[tranquil patrol]

In the scraps list on each individual moon you can press Add All and then there should be a Disable All button or something of the sort, then Add All to the scraps list in Global and change the weights there.

[fleet bluff]

okay thanks

[fleet bluff]

i have to disable all on each specific moon ?

[tranquil patrol]

Yes, by default each scrap on each moon will have their rarity value set per moon (seen by the tick next to the rarity). This means that the rarity value will be chosen from there rather than the Global preset. The rarity values need to be unticked on each moon for the Global values to take effect

[fleet bluff]

i see

[lament hemlock]

Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately I tried this and am still getting an error. I can't figure out why. Here are the logs if you're feeling generous

Particularly it seems like this is where it tries to spawn one but can't.

[Error : Unity Log] NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
Stack trace:
SCP1507.SCP1507Alpha.Scp1507Alpha.SpawnNewFlamingo () (at ./src/SCP1507Alpha/FlamingoPort.cs:20)
SCP1507.SCP1507Alpha.Scp1507Alpha.DoAIInterval () (at ./src/SCP1507Alpha/Scp1507Alpha.cs:153)
(wrapper dynamic-method) EnemyAI.DMDEnemyAI::Update(EnemyAI)

maybe because it doesnt spawn them through vents? When working normal they just sort of spawn all around

[cloud peak]

Sorry if this has been asked before, but I noticed the json file won't apply any changes anymore, I have an idea on why this happened however I noticed that the .json still has moons even though I uninstalled them already, how can I get a fresh .json?

Edit: well in case anyone stumbles upon my post and has the same issue, for a "fresh start" on the Web UI click "preset" delete everything, save it/replace the .json and boot up the game.

This will provide a fresh start with only current moons/interiors/monsters/scraps on the .json file

[rain kernel]

Question

If in the global preset for all scraps, I don't set a rarity, but I edit other values like weight, conductivity, etc, and on a moon preset I add scraps and just change their rarity, that would keep the other changes from global and just override the rarity of the item, right? It wouldn't set weight and conductivity back to default because I didn't set them for the moon preset?

[placid thistle]

Correct

[civic arch]

changing rarities for other scraps on global you need to disable the rarity on every moon

[noble crypt]

if i give an enemy negative power does that mean it would make more monsters spawn?

wait nvm i just realized i couldnt

but hypothetically is that how it'd work?

cuz i like the idea of an enemy that spawns inside causing more enemies to spawn

[radiant shadow]

if that was allowed, i’d imagine yes you’d get more enemies.. but more than you actually want.
i think spawning caps off once the sum of all spawned monster’s power reaches the moon’s power limit.
negative power could cause infinite spawns because the added sum will never reach the power limit.

that’s just my guess. idk for sure. 🤷‍♂️

[jovial pelican]

its still limited by how many monsters can spawn for each individual cycle. but yes, negative power monster will cause the game to never reach the power limit

[silk stream]

Does lethal quantities overvrite peepers spawnrate?

[ruby fractal]

From what I've observed, I believe it does, but you can just re-add them easily

[verbal cosmos]

does editing the risk level actually translate to a easier moon?

ex. the enemies outsid

[green narwhal]

it's only visual

so no

unless you change the enemies as well

[verbal cosmos]

ok good to know

[jovial pelican]

you have to account for the placebo effect. a risk level of "OMG! WE'RE GONNA DIE!!" may increases the players stress which leads to them making more mistakes.

[tired stream]

Im adding LQ to my groups modpack, are there any major issues I should know about before doing a whole bunch of settings changes? Ive been using LLL for spawnrates of item mods, moons, and interiors, I assume just leave that config default and use LQ instead?

[noble crypt]

the second you put in any invalid numbers, the whole thing stops working

but you only need to worry about that if you fuck up

for me i put a decimal in a scrap spawnrate thing once and it fucked it all up

i just had to undo it once i figured it out but i would say save your progress and test it a lot

i usually like to change the moon's difficulty from B or whatever it is to B test1 and so forth so that i know the changes are actually workin

g

i also save the code of working files a lot just in case i cant figure out why it isnt working

[ruby fractal]

I don't think changing the moon's letter difficulty does anything, unless I'm sorely mistaken. I think it's purely a cosmetic change.

[noble crypt]

yeah its just cosmetic, i just do it to make sure that my other more important changes have worked. if the moon's difficulty is switched from my changes then i know my other changes that cant be observed as easily have worked

[tired stream]

Looks like its working, just need to assign rarities to all the items now since quite a few werent working with LLL and werent spawning. Also looks like the simulate command in terminal doesnt work, not sure if thats terminalformatter or LLL, but LQ does work

[tranquil patrol]

LQ changes aren't taken into account by the simulate command

[tired stream]

Got it, appreciate it.

[tired stream]

If I set prices for moons in global will that be the default price? or am I misunderstanding

[tranquil patrol]

Yeah that's right. If you set prices in the individual moons it only applies to that moon. Eg if you set Experimentation price to 100 in Titan's preset, Experimentation will cost 100 to go to only if you're going there FROM Titan. If you're anywhere but Titan, it will be free

[verbal cosmos]

[10:22:03.2200779] [Info :LethalQuantities] Loading global configuration
[10:22:03.2990330] [Error :LethalQuantities] Encountered an error while trying to load the configuration
[10:22:03.2995358] [Error :LethalQuantities] Please report this error to the LethalQuantities mod developers: System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
at LethalQuantities.Objects.GlobalConfiguration.instantiateEnemyConfigs (LethalQuantities.Objects.GlobalInformation globalInfo, BepInEx.Configuration.ConfigFile fileConfigFile) [0x002a0] in <3d417d56a21746b39758c9436f818602>:IL_02A0
at LethalQuantities.Objects.GlobalConfiguration.instantiateConfigs (LethalQuantities.Objects.GlobalInformation globalInfo) [0x0003a] in <3d417d56a21746b39758c9436f818602>:IL_003A
at LethalQuantities.Objects.GlobalConfiguration..ctor (LethalQuantities.Objects.GlobalInformation globalInfo) [0x0005e] in <3d417d56a21746b39758c9436f818602>:IL_005E
at LethalQuantities.Patches.RoundManagerPatch.onStartPrefix (RoundManager __instance) [0x003c6] in <3d417d56a21746b39758c9436f818602>:IL_03C6

[ruby fractal]

Huh, I can't seem to actually get LQ to load myself either. I thought I wasn't having this issue, but I haven't played in a while, and it's not working for me either

I thought my config was bugged so I deleted it and let the game generate a new one, the only problem is, it's not generating a new one at all.

[verbal cosmos]

i get this error when everything else is working

[ruby fractal]

When you say everything else is working, what isn't working?

[verbal cosmos]

oh thats the same error

idk all the other mods arent having problems im going to roll back

actually i cant

[ruby fractal]

Also, quick question, are you by chance using GiantSpecimens?

[verbal cosmos]

no

[ruby fractal]

Okay, never mind

[verbal cosmos]

I can get it to work on its own sooo

[ruby fractal]

That's odd, why does mine not work then

[verbal cosmos]

i disabled all my mods and im gonna enable half of them to cut down whats erroring

[buoyant gyro]

?

[ruby fractal]

Well, you had a big rework and I remember the internal names of the giants being very weird and I just had a stray thought of maybe you changed the internal names and perhaps LQ didn't like it and it was freaking out over it

Well, not exactly big rework, but notable bug fix update, not sure, like I said, it's been a while. And I normally woulda had the giants spawn via LQ but they aren't now because, as I said, LQ doesn't seem to be working currently

Can't load my config nor make a new one if I delete it

[buoyant gyro]

F

Nah not giant specimens

[verbal cosmos]

It was because brutal company minus updated

[ruby fractal]

Oh, BCM is responsible? What about it is conflicting with LQ?

I guess I can roll back BCM, one of the major things it fixed was the thousand-grabbable turret bonanza, but I that event disabled so I wouldn't encounter it in the first place.

[inner light]

hallo!! I'm here to make a suggestion, no idea if you're still updating this

but would it be possible to add a way to copy paste sheets like the moon prize sheet? I want to have all moons BUT the company have the same prices for other moons

actually... I think I can just set the global to what I want them to be for every moon and change gordion's so globals don't apply to it

nevermind heheh

[sand steeple]

Hello!
I'm planning to use this mod for my modpack settings, is there someone that can help me with some questions?

[tranquil patrol]

I'm here I know all what do you require

[sand steeple]

Thanks, I noticed some good amounts of things that works

and others that not, specially the dungeon set

[tranquil patrol]

I do recall something about the interiors being problematic. I think the map size multiplier breaks things, so if you set that to 1 and use factory size multiplier it should work as expected

[sand steeple]

I've change the dungeon to the CozyOffice made by Rosies, but none of the doors worked, I didn't changed nothing on the size multiplier

[tranquil patrol]

Hm, I don't think that could be directly LQ's fault unless there's a desync or some sort. What does the preset for that part look like?

[sand steeple]

like this

It's not much of a problem, I can change it from LLL

[verbal cosmos]

anyone know the text channel for brutal company minus? v0.13.8 breaks Lethal Quantities

nevermind i found it

[tranquil patrol]

Maybe try adding a factory size multiplier, default is usually 1.5

I'm not sure how the default values work when the option doesn't exist by default

[lusty jay]

Does anybody have a good preset.json they could share? I want to customize the interiors to fit the moons but I figured I’m not the first one to do that

[fleet bluff]

I can but I don't have the same mods as you

[sand steeple]

How does the weight System works?

I tried changing the anvil value to 1000 to 500 and it's not working

[tired stream]

Is this in the General preset or the individual moon? I did all weights in general and unchecked all weights on moons and it seemed to work. Otherwise some other mods can overwrite it, I know lategame upgrades had a bug that was overwriting a few days ago.

[sand steeple]

hmm, I'll check it.
General is Global, right?

[tired stream]

Yes, it is global. Any moon should have the parent set to global, then it will pull from checked values there. Weight seemed to be finnicky, best to leave it checked in global and uncheck any moons.

[tired stream]

Also good thing to note is global/general (I forget which it is) is your default value. I have a system of moons->parent categories->grandparent global for my scrap spawning, added the scrap I want to spawn and the weights in global, set the rarities and values in the different categories, then added everything in each moon but didnt check any values so it went up the chain from child to parent to grandparent to check each item for values, rarities, weights.

It also took like 3 days because I have over 620 pieces of scrap that I got to manually assign values to in my modpack, but I am insane and like spreadsheets so keep that in mind

[sand steeple]

Thanks, I tried doing this but it didn't work yet, maybe I have something wrong

[sand steeple]

maybe it could also works to disable scrap that doesn't work correctly

[tired stream]

Any other mods? Best test would be set anvil weight and rarity in global, set anvil rarity as only item in any moon, experimentation works easiest IMO. Save and load up, run in and see if only anvils spawn and what the weight is. Any tools for spawning in items manuall work around LQ and dont use its values.

[sand steeple]

quite a lot (166 mods)

[civic arch]

can someone send a fresh preset i want to see the new data of moons and entities for v55 and i cant access lc for a while

like v55 preset

[tranquil patrol]

This should work, what's not working about it?

[sand steeple]

Well, It only spawns anvil (I know why) but the weight it's not set right, it says 1

[tranquil patrol]

1 what? lb?

[sand steeple]

ah, yeah

1 lb

sorry, I'm also with the new v55

[tranquil patrol]

A couple things to look at maybe.. Is the weight value the same on every moon (or unticked everywhere but Global), are the moons Parent presets set to Global, are there two scrap items called "Anvil"

If none of that turns up anything, maybe a bug. Does the anvil weigh more when you're not using LQ?

[civic arch]

?

[severe harness]

Oya just to give a heads up regarding v55 (it'll be under spoilers for those that want to avoid the details below and discover it themselves)
||There's 2 new enemies in this update, 1 outside, 1 inside||

||The inside enemy "Barber" seems to appear on the enemy list just fine||

||The outside enemy "Kidnapper Fox" seems to have its own unique condition to spawn, which seems to be tied to RoundManager.WeedEnemies according to 1A3. It seems to be available in the dropdown just fine and can be added like any enemy, however in the initial list of outdoor enemies that's read in, it doesn't appear, even on moons (such as Assurance) where players have encountered it||

@tacit thunder Posted some details regarding v55 above if you wanna take a look

[silent whale]

||The "Bush Wolf" does actually appear when you want to add it to other lists under the name "Kidnapper Fox". It's just that the WeedEnemies list itself doesn't for obvious reasons. I have not tested how they work yet however so I can't vouch for any stability if you make the fox an interior enemy for some reason||

[severe harness]

||Thanks for the heads up, I edited the response to more accurately reflect what's going on||

[tacit thunder]

oh darn is it out already

thanks

[severe harness]

Yeah it's in beta branch as of a few hours ago, figured to ping you about it since there's something relevant between LQ and v55

[tacit thunder]

hmm yeah

ok ive been needing to catch up with my minecraft stuff but after that i'll start updating lq

[severe harness]

👍

[ruby fractal]

I know right now Brutal Company Minus 0.13.8 isn't compatible with LQ, but not sure if that's on your end or theirs. Just something to note.

[tacit thunder]

alright, ill look into that when im updating

[ruby fractal]

Aside from that and the continuing issues with inconsistent entity names, I'm not seeing any new issues crop up in my end

LQ seems to still be functioning soundly

(At least how I use it anyway)

[sand steeple]

I'm happy to know that this mod is getting updated, I'm doing something cool with it :]

Today I had the fear that this mod would be abandoned and this effort would be in vain

[tacit thunder]

oooh nice

yeah i dont like to abandon projects, but as a result i rarely start new ones

[crisp stone]

@tacit thunder what minecraft stuff you doing?

glad to see your still hanging about 😄

[tacit thunder]

just some minecraft plugins i need to update to 1.20.5/6 and 1.21

[sand steeple]

Hello

I've seen that "Disable" means unchecked on the "rarity" section, If I disable one, does that item stops from spawning on a Moon?

I figured it out, anyway thank you

[waxen frost]

adding an item but disabling it will allow inheriting rarity (and other values) form parent preset. If there's nothing to inherit it's like you said.

[tulip wharf]

quick question about this, i kinda wanna get lazy :P
would there be any problem if i reuse the same config from v45 to v50?

[severe harness]

For LQ? Probably not, the only things you'll need to account for is these changes:

1. New entities, there's 3 in v50 ||(Tulip Snake for daytime, Old Bird outside, and Butler inside)||
2. You'll have 3 new moons to configure, Adamance, ||Embrion, and Artifice||
3. Some slight balance changes such as the lowering of power levels for these:
   Spider 3 -> 2
   Baboon Hawks 1 -> 0.5
4. There's a third trap that can appear in interiors

Most I would do is make a copy of it then do this:

1. Keep the copy safe somewhere and have the original load into a v50 save
2. Check to see if your preset from v45 populates with the new stuff and doesn't crash/hang loading your game

If something goes wrong when trying to populate it, you can do this

1. For the v50 profile, generate a completely new preset on one web tab for LQ
2. Have your copy populate a second web tab with your old preset and copy over any changes and just fudge in anything for what's added in v50

Fallback scenario is going to be tedious if you're someone who goes ham in let's say, installing every one of Wesley, Tolian, and/or Generic's moons (to name but a few), lots of scrap addon mods, and configuring everything to your hearts content

iirc you'll likely have to sacrifice any LE moons too unless they got ported to LLL (Wesley, Generic, and sfDesat's all have so no worries on that if you use any of theirs')

[waxen frost]

keep in mind that moons that got converted like wesley's now have a different name so it will regenerate in LQ. Same with ex LE items.

you should be able to reassign the presets i think

[cloud peak]

Can someone guide me? to my understanding this curve has a value of
X = Probability from 1 to 0 which translate to 8am to 11:59pm
Y = Probability from 1 to 0 which translate to rarity weight of 100% to 0%
but how does LQ use this and also where is Spawn Count fall off?

as to why? im using LQ to make special challenge moons
for example March will have no enemies, but a bunch of landmines, spikes and turrets
so i want to make the moon spawn roughly 7 turrets...but i dont know how

[buoyant gyro]

For something like turrets

Which are generated on startup

There isn't gonna be an axis for time passed

I believe it just picks a random x value and checks the y value corresponding to that x value

So if u did smthn like.
0, 6
0.5 8
1 10

It'd be roughly 8

[tranquil patrol]

Yeah 😔

If you want it to always spawn 7 turrets, you can set it to

0 , 7
1 , 7

At least I hope, curves are weird

[buoyant gyro]

Yes

Lol

[cloud peak]

ah thank you both for answering! yeah curves are not as "easy to get" as the monsters
but with what you both given me it will help a lot, thank you X3!

[sand steeple]

small question...
What can I do on the Presets section

[waxen frost]

You can create a copy of your presets. Useful when you want to get updated defaults for a moon. Copy the preset. Delete the original preset and start the game once to regenerate it from the current default values.

Also you can click and drag presets from the navigation bar (very left) to the boxes for each moon on the right. Useful when a moon changes name and you want to reassign your existing preset instead of the newly generated one.

[sand steeple]

oh, I see

Thanks!

[waxen frost]

of course you can also rename your presets and create entirely new ones.

For example if you want to use multiple levels of inheritance. Like Global -> Forest -> Vow

I think you are doing something with prices per moon. I used to use extra presets for each 'Tier' of moons which allowed me to set it up so travel inbetween moons of a certain tier was much cheaper than normal costs without having to do it on every single preset.

[sand steeple]

Regarding the price of the moons, I have decided to make my job a little easier but still feel a feeling of having unlocked something.

You must pay to go to a constellation, but all the moons in that constellation will be free when you are inside (with some exceptions)

[sand steeple]

But I think I know where to use this

[waxen frost]

Yes, that's very close to how I had it. So you can use presets for that. Just make one for each of your constellations. Set the prices for all the moons in that constellation in there and in the moons presets select the constellation preset as parent.
edit: you don't need to set all prices in the constellation presets. Just the ones you want to make free.
Just make sure you 'add all' to the prices section in the constellation preset and set its parent to the global preset where you have set all your default prices.

[bleak comet]

Do you guys know how to copy particular maps settings to another map?

[waxen frost]

You can use an online json editor to manually copy entire sections (or whatever) between presets. I've used this one in the past: https://jsoneditoronline.org/
Be careful to not rip the formatting tho. Make backups!

[bleak comet]

I see thanks a lot!

[waxen frost]

With LQ web editor you can only copy entire preset and assign it to a different moon or copy things manually entry by entry.

[dapper wren]

Does this function with the V55 beta?

Asking before I spend 20 hours working on something

[sand steeple]

idk if that is 100% working rn, but I've seen that my custom prices from LQ are working on v55

[dapper wren]

[severe harness]

Seems to work for the most part aside from 2 things I notice:

1. ||No way to configure stuff regarding Vain Shrouds so no way to completely eliminate the Fox unless mod dev does something about it themselves||
2. I don't see any Old Birds on modded moons where I increase their chances for them (e.g. Transmission should have the most chances for them yet that's the only thing I've yet to see as of v55)

[fleet bluff]

Hi how to set kidnapper fox and claysurgeon, it doensent appear in my preset

[civic arch]

@fleet bluff @severe harness ||its the beta still, so dont expect stuff to work and wait for a LQ update that will add comp for v55+, just use v50 for now||

[fleet bluff]

Okok

[severe harness]

||Claysurgeon appears internally as "Barber", should be able to find and set Barber just fine on modded moons with this info. LQ doesn't quite work with foxes due to the unique mechanic with the bushes tied to it||
||Subject to change cause y'know, beta, but does work out pretty well (aside from fox) if you wanna jump in v55||

[fleet bluff]

Can't find barber on lethal quantities enemy selection

[severe harness]

Interesting, I wonder what that's all about cause it shows up just fine on the interior list as shown here on a modded moon nonetheless

[severe harness]

🤔

Dumb question for me to ask but you've booted up a run at least once in v55/56 yes?

[fleet bluff]

Yes 3/4 shifts

[severe harness]

Interesting, not sure why it's refusing to crop up

[bleak comet]

Does this mod sync with clients? Does clients need the same presets.json file that host has?

[civic arch]

Clients need same file and mod

[bleak comet]

thanks

[noble crypt]

how would i make it where an entity can only spawn from between 10:00am to 12:00pm

something to do with spawn curves but idk the specifics

(this is an outside enemy btw)

[silent whale]

Spawn chance curves use normalized time values (basically a value between 0 and 1) as their "keys" which correspond to a day's entire length
0 is 6am (beginning of a day)
1 is 12am (end of a day)

this means each hour is 1/18 or 0.0(5)
0 to 1/18 is between 6am and 7am
1/18 to 2/18 is between 7am and 8am etc

in your case you should put a value of 1 for keys 4/18 and 6/18 and 0 for everything else.
in other words try something like this for your enemy's spawn chance curve

these values would create a flat "curve" which almost instantly jumps to 1 and flattens between 10:00am and 12:00pm and then drops down back to 0

if you'd want a gradual change then you could bring the second "key" closer to 0 and second last "key" closer to 1

or you could remove them altogether

keep in mind this doesn't mean your enemy will spawn

all the other enemies will still have their rarities set normally so they will be in the spawn pool when the spawn cycle commences

you could also set the opposite for all the other enemies to "guarantee" that only your desired enemy will spawn

or you could bump up these 1 values to something insane like 99999

reuploaded the image because I made a mistake in the last one

[placid thistle]

So do I need to check “Outside enemies” for it to inherit the Outside enemies configuration from the Global parent?

[oak zinc]

If i edit an interior to appear on certain moon and i delete the mod that adds it, does nothing actually happen or does the game crash/conflict?

I want to delete some interiors that could cause bugs on v56, thats why

[severe harness]

Only thing I can think of that might be a problem is the instances where the removed interior was the only interior present for the moon. iirc from testing with MANTIF it does a fallback to Facility if it detects no interiors, but unsure

[oak zinc]

Alr thanks

[waxen frost]

what violet wrote + LQ will remove the interior from the presets file when it's not registered in the game. So you have to readd it if you decide to reintroduce it to your profile.

[silent whale]

honestly in general if you want to assign interiors you should use LLL config instead
if you want to modify facility size for specific interiors then use the global LQ config, add all interiors to the list, and modify their facility size while making sure their rarity option is disabled

default size is 1.5 so just set everything to that and then test and change the size accordingly

[cobalt aurora]

does this work in v56?

[civic arch]

Yes

[cobalt aurora]

niiiiice

[civic arch]

Just cant edit kidnapper fox because you know it uses a different spawn system

But barber can be edited

[severe harness]

Yeah Fox is directly correlated to the Vain Shrouds and LQ has no way (currently) of tweaking the bushes

[mighty marsh]

@tacit thunder

[tacit thunder]

hmmm yeah probably cant

id have to take a look at it in the future though

been sick this weekend so i couldnt get any work done on anything unfortunately

[civic arch]

Get good soon!!

[tacit thunder]

thanks, i think ive been hit with double colds or something, since i got better but got sick again. im hoping to start updating tomorrow/wednesday-ish

[fleet bluff]

since i've added interiors and moons to my lethal quantities preset my firned keep getting desync interiors on the base interior only

i can't figure out what mod cause this

0190994b-c352-b331-119a-7eb5e836ba5b

[silent whale]

don't use LQ for interior weights
Only use it for interior size

[fleet bluff]

why ?

[silent whale]

it's a bit buggy

just use your LLL config for that

[fleet bluff]

it always worked for me before

ah why all interior work but not the base interior

[silent whale]

no idea why them specifically but I had these desync issues myself back when i tried setting interiors in LQ

using LLL for weights and LQ for interior sizes only helped

Specifically using the global config for interior sizes

just add all interiors and set their sizes without setting their rarities

[fleet bluff]

on some moons it stopped working overnight for me

[silent whale]

• if you use LLL then the simulate command actually functions correctly

[fleet bluff]

its not about wrong type of interior generated

its about same interior but different placement

[silent whale]

yeah, these are the issues I had myself before

[waxen frost]

it happens when you use map size multiplier in LQ without setting dungeon flows. I played around with that. Let me find it

#1213985212686532638 message

[fleet bluff]

Okay I'm gonna look into it later

[fleet bluff]

Thanks a lot it was that

[silent whale]

Alright I am so confused rn. These are my turret configs for Assurance.
However for some odd reason when I do go there, the entire moon is riddled with turrets. this only happens on assurance and I have no idea why

[waxen frost]

does it change the decimal point by region? In my region it would actually be a ',' but I see and use '.' in LQ web editor.. immediately though it looked weird in ur ss.
Otherwise these are nearly default values. Any other mods? event mods?
I can test this in my environment if you want.

[ruby fractal]

Only happens on Assurance? Do your other moons have similar curves?

[waxen frost]

can confirm. Definitely more turrets than it should be if we go by the keyframe values.

[waxen frost]

ig it might be something funky with curves. Try setting the key of the last pair to 0.5996..

[silent whale]

I think i figured it out??
I set proper 1.0 keys and their values at the end of both curves

does anyone know a way to visualize an animation curve?
Like with a website?

[civic arch]

Use google sheets and create a chart

Do what you did with lq such as:
Key Value
1 1
(Example)
Select that and the text, then press chart button

Sorry i am bad at explaining things

[waxen frost]

https://www.desmos.com/calculator/s5dmajojxa
https://tools.timodenk.com/cubic-spline-interpolation
These have been brought up in this thread before but I think we are still not entirely sure if they are 100% representative of what happens in Unity. Like you mentioned these tools only give you the entire curve when adding start and end points but vanilla curves don't seem to have those..

[austere nova]

is this mod still the most viable

[cobalt aurora]

Imo ye

[austere nova]

alright bet

better than central config?

[placid thistle]

They aren’t mutually exclusive but I use LQ and Loadstone instead

(Loadstone mentioned for the interior generation improvements in comparison to those offered by Central Config)

[cobalt aurora]

What gen benifits does it have

[austere nova]

i already use loadstone

would central config clash with that?

[placid thistle]

Both Loadstone and Central Config generate interiors differently than default LLL which is supposed to improve larger dungeons loading correctly for all players in multiplayer and scrap distribution

I don’t really know the technicalities

[placid thistle]

Only if you turn on Dungeon Generation Overhaul

I believe

I’ll be completely honest I tried using Central Config for weeks and kept getting anomalies and errors

[austere nova]

i havent booted the game yhet so hopefully i dont encounter that

[ruby fractal]

It might be my glitchy modpack, but for whatever reason, when I was trying the v55 beta, I found that only Old Birds and Barbers were spawning with LQ enabled. Again, trying to use a large modpack and bug hunting for why entity spawns were not working, so take that for what you will.

Probably not due to LQ, but could be, not sure

[placid thistle]

I have a huge modpack too and seemed like only a few entities were spawning even tho I have all interior enemies enabled with varying rarity

But haven’t been able to play enough to be sure

Saw demogorgan every single time tho even tho it has less rarity than a bracken or loot bug

Some modded entities are just quirky with the spawn rates and don’t work well with LQ. The haunted harpist spawns way too much when added to LQ

[ruby fractal]

I noticed the harpist as well, and I have him toned way down

Nonetheless, all entities, modded or otherwise, were pretty much not spawning, just mechs and barbers

[placid thistle]

When I landed on Artifice there was like 30 old birds

[ruby fractal]

I only got a tenth of that

[placid thistle]

I think LQ isn’t working with spawn curves effectively or something on the new update

[ruby fractal]

LQ could most definitely do with another update, at least to work out some kinks

[placid thistle]

I want to switch to Central Config but I got tired of being one of the few bug testers , I just want to play the game atp tbh

Need more people testing Central Config to dig up all the bugs, cuz the dev is very on top of patching and updating when bugs are reported

[austere nova]

im using it and i havent encountered any issues so far

[placid thistle]

Online co-op?

[tranquil patrol]

The dev (unfortunately for us) does mostly Minecraft stuff, so when they're not busy they're usually doing that, they also don't know much, if any, Unity so hard to really say when/if there'd be any changes

[austere nova]

not yet

still testing my pack alone atr the moment

[placid thistle]

co-op is a whole other beast

[placid thistle]

that’s unfortunate, I actually really like the web editor

[tranquil patrol]

Well ynever know

[placid thistle]

There’s a few quirks rn

Interiors also show as Unviable on certain moons even if they’re added to LQ and assigned a rarity

Have to do it thru LLL config which feels wrong if the dungeon has its own separate config like LC_Office

[cobalt aurora]

Ive had unviable interiors spawn XD

[placid thistle]

wait now that u mention it

Yea

Same

Idk it overall feels clunky

rn

Why’s it show unviable but still can be chosen

with Central Config the viable dungeons reflect accurately

[ruby fractal]

The web editor is the reason why I came back to LQ

[cobalt aurora]

Its jank but I prefer it over LLL and CC

[placid thistle]

for the web editor or because of reliability ?

[cobalt aurora]

Both kinda

[placid thistle]

I like the web editor, but im really just biding time to switch to Central Config once it seems like everything is ironed out. It looks promising now, im gonna do extensive testing on Friday

the interior enemy spawns with LQ aren’t satisfactory for me atm

[cobalt aurora]

Just dont like how CC is formatted so I just deal with a lil jank

[placid thistle]

LQ seems to try and separate its config values to its own system which I think is causing inconsistency with the new game updates

Since it was compiled for v50

[cobalt aurora]

Def needs a v56 compile for better functionality

[silent whale]

that would uh... explain the abnormal turret count

(it's my animation curve for turrets)

[tranquil patrol]

Yeah upon testing, it does seem like the curves made in the desmos are accurate to Unity, which explains the weirdness of seemingly simple coordinates. Just try to build a curve you like rather than get bogged down with specific values, cause chances are the curve's gonna be all out of whack if you try to be normal

Cause cubic splines aren't normal ig

[silent whale]

honestly serves me right for just tweaking values instead of properly learning how the curves work

Now all that is left is to... remake every single curve in my config

[fleet bluff]

How do you show animation curves?

[civic arch]

@fleet bluff

[fleet bluff]

Nice

[silent whale]

Do you guys have any suggested interior sizes for various modded interiors to bring them closer in size to the vanilla facility?

[cobalt aurora]

usually I go for 0.6-0.8

[silent whale]

for which interiors specifically?

[cobalt aurora]

pool rooms, mental hospital, castle and school

[waxen frost]

• i used to use 0.6 for poolrooms but for a while now (I think since they added the new big entrance hall..?) it generated way too small for 1.4 moon size mult.
  • Like every single time I found my self walking across 3-4 rooms before I reached the (actual) pool room with 2 fire exits and the apparatus room. That kind of small.
• Mental I also have 0.6
• CozyOffice 0.8. Can't go too small or it will have trouble generating (blocked entrances)
• Skkarj 0.8
• Oobl Lab 0.5
• SCP 2
• Office 2.3 (might be outdated again. way back office was huge, then it was tiny when it had 3 floors, now idk)

[silk stream]

Guys do i have to set the spawn for kidnapper fox on LQ or not?

[silent whale]

currently the fox is uneditable

it will spawn normally regardless of your config

[silk stream]

because for now i have never see her with LQ

dunno why

[placid thistle]

Which mod is Skkarj from?

[cobalt aurora]

unreal

[silent whale]

zeekers nerfed the foxes with the last v56 patch and they no longer instantly cover the entire map in shrouds. I assure you that they do in fact spawn

[silk stream]

Oh ok thanks

[silk stream]

Does It works also with modded moons?

[silent whale]

technically?? LLL is currently a bit bugged with foxes. they don't treat various planets as different ones for tracking vein shroud spawns. basically this means that the swarm of shrouds will follow you wherever you go

[placid thistle]

I haven’t seen shrouds at all

The fox doesn’t even show up in devmode or LQ

[severe harness]

Debug Panel DOES have fox, it's just named "Bush Wolf"

Similarly Barber is on there, named as "Clay Surgeon"

[inner light]

bush wolf is such a better name lmao

same with clay surgeon

[covert frost]

I like barber more

and fox

I mean it is a fox not a wolf

[severe harness]

I think Kidnapper Fox fits more than Bush Wolf, esp with how the monster acts more like a Fox than a Wolf, minus the weird stretchy tongue it has for whatever reason

[radiant shadow]

middle ground

BUSH FOX

✅

[carmine crater]

Hey

uhm

where is Barber?

Im trying to configure barber spawns but I can't find him nor it's code name "Clay Surgeon"

Never...

Mind...?

Yeah nevermind

[ruby fractal]

It should be 'Barber'. I can see it just fine

[inner light]

other than being orange it aint too much of a fox

like it can be both

it's a stylized canine

[carmine crater]

Does making Kidnapper Foxes spawn make Vain Shrouds spawn?

So like

When you edit Kidnapper Fox's settings your technically editing Vain Shroud Settings?

or like

mgjnrsbsr

you know what I mean right?

[cobalt aurora]

nope that would just spawn the fox with no bush

[placid thistle]

Which is pointless because the AI relies on the bush right?

[cobalt aurora]

like maybe id do it for shits on a gimmick moon if he worked without the ai

[noble crypt]

does the kidnapper fox work with LQ?

i have ooblterra and LQ and in the file thing i think the fox's internal name is switched to Ghost Oobl

the Oobl Ghost is separate

but when i look up bush wolf Ghost Oobl comes up instead

[noble crypt]

so do they just not spawn at all with LQ? or are the shrouds a separate system

[carmine crater]

The hell?

Wait but wouldn't it kill it right away?

or make it disappear?

with Imperium you can't spawn it in, it just instantly displays a message saying it died

[errant iron]

Do me have to set all global to true? or me can set specific moon to make the preset config work? Because it keep reset back to default. (´・ω・｀)

[placid thistle]

The fox need the bush

[placid thistle]

the ai relies on the bush

someone would need to make a patch for the AI

[placid thistle]

What keeps resetting back to default?

[carmine crater]

Yeah which is why im confused why there isn't a Vain Shroud setting on LQ

[placid thistle]

Cuz it hasn’t been updated since long time

[carmine crater]

Ah

[placid thistle]

It’s not an enemy object it’s a map object also

[carmine crater]

Oooooh okay okay

Thank you

I'll stick to KidnapperFoxSettings for now

[placid thistle]

IF this mod ever gets updated i wouldn’t be surprised it he doesn’t bother trying to include fox things

[placid thistle]

Yea

[placid thistle]

How are you feeling?

[tacit thunder]

my coughs are gone, im busy with work this week but i finished my other projects so i can start next week

is my plan

[placid thistle]

U have no idea how happy this makes me😂😂

well for when you get to it, something I’ve noticed is that LQ just ADDS to the rarity of modded enemies as given by the .dll and .cfg of the respective mods

I’m not sure if it’s always been like this and I didn’t notice before or if it changed with the new game update

So if the cfg for Demogorgon has a rarity of 20 and you set the rarity to 40 in LQ it will actually end up 60

[tacit thunder]

it should definitely just set it

[severe harness]

Oh God that explains why Shockwave Drone is like, everywhere in my runs lol

So any place I have it normally set to like 35 weight is actually 70 since I have it as default on some places at weight 35

[placid thistle]

Yes afaik

[tacit thunder]

it could be that the other mods have changed how they added weights, or some other thing might have changed, but ill need to take a look at it

[placid thistle]

Maybe it’s because LQ is not using the enemyName property?

Idk

[cobalt aurora]

Would make sense since l lib has been updated a few times

[tacit thunder]

lethallib has probably changed how/when they add custom enemies to levels, and the same enemy entry may be there more than once, especially if they add it after lq

[placid thistle]

Once LQ is updated i think im gonna make an FAQ video

[tacit thunder]

it will probably take a bit though, since im going to try and implement all the missing features in the web gui and whatnot

[placid thistle]

all good. The fox will be a tricky one

[cobalt aurora]

I think thats true because when v50 dropped the old spawn weight method broke spawns

So they changed it

[tacit thunder]

that makes a lot of sense

yeah ill have to take a look at how the foxes and baboon hawks are implemented now, but i think there should be some options available

[cobalt aurora]

Other options?

[tacit thunder]

more options i mean

in the webgui

[cobalt aurora]

Ohhhhh

[placid thistle]

Oh also another thing to look at is that the moon pricing works MOST of the time when set in the Global section but randomly will stop and the terminal will display the default prices until you travel to another moon then it fixes itself

this is when not using LLL or CC to configure moon pricing

Or any other config mod like CustomMoonPrices

[tacit thunder]

hmm ok

ill have to see how those mods do it

[errant iron]

The presets file, me was editing through file directly just to test out and when start the game, the settings seem to revert back to default.

[placid thistle]

Use the web editor

[errant iron]

Right now, me following the webui thingy and see if this will change anything.

The global settings in configuation need to be set to true as well? Preset parent settings are all in Global in web ui.

Some moons are not having anything set, would them using the vanilla setting by default?

[errant iron]

Do me have to disable settings in Lethal Level Loader?

[civic arch]

yes

[errant iron]

Will give it a go (´・ω・｀)

[placid thistle]

I’d be happy to test any new updates for this mod if needed

[errant iron]

So far it work fine.

[placid thistle]

There’s some updates needed he said he will possibly start on it next week

[civic arch]

yay

[carmine crater]

wait huh?

[errant iron]

Me got a weird spawn in Dine where a red giant speciment spawn inside the mansion, if the enemies are not set int the settings, do they still have chance to spawn in?

[placid thistle]

No, that’s pretty weird. Are you sure you didn’t add it to the “enemies” section? You only want to add the Redwood Giant to the “Night” section

[errant iron]

Night section? There're just Interior, Outside and Daytime for me in the Web UI

[placid thistle]

Outside is night

Couldn’t remember the exact name

[errant iron]

Just Forest Keepers and Eyeless Dogs on Dine setting for me, that's strange.

Might be some other settings from other mods, maybe?

[placid thistle]

Also just so you know as a friendly tip, you should use “I” instead of “me” for this grammar situation. I’m only telling you because I’ve seen you use “me” several times and thought you may want to know, haha

[errant iron]

Just an old habit, can't quite fix that, unfortunately.

[placid thistle]

Wow

That’s my bad that’s funny though

I had thought I was being helpful

If English wasn’t your first language

All good

[placid thistle]

What about “Global”?

[errant iron]

There's nothing set in global

||https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2202287059||

It's me vod, the giant spawn around at 00:25:58

Or should me put the presets to let ye see the file itself?

[placid thistle]

That is so weird… I’ve never had that happen

Double check your Giant Specimens cfg

[errant iron]

Should the giant setting turn off or set to 0?

[placid thistle]

Send a screenshot of the config

[errant iron]

It's quite long, just a moment..

Oh wait, me could just do this..

[noble crypt]

does the roller enemy not work with LQ? i cant seem to find it in the file

[indigo pewter]

it worked for me

[severe harness]

Try loading up any run, whether it be existing or new then check your LQ preset

[waxen frost]

I have arrived. LQ Endgame

[21:26:52.2887251] [Info   :LethalQuantities] Importing data
[21:26:53.9560767] [Info   :LethalQuantities] Generating level presets
[21:26:54.7973578] [Error  :LethalQuantities] Encountered an error while trying to load the configuration
Couldn't extract exception string from exception of type OutOfMemoryException (another exception of class 'OutOfMemoryException' was thrown while processing the stack trace)

[placid thistle]

Lmao

Never seen that

[waxen frost]

btw It's not a LQ problem. Just my large pack kinda pushing it. the game commits over 30gb memory on startup and I'm running out of disk space for pagefile occasionally xD

[placid thistle]

Are you using BepInEx_Faster_Load_AssetBundles_Patcher?

[waxen frost]

yea

[placid thistle]

How are you using so much memory?

I have every interior and 73 moons and almost every enemy n im at 10.5gb peak

[waxen frost]

hmm.. 81 moons, 33 interiors, lots of enemies too

LR, CelestialTint are also contributors ig

[placid thistle]

Still seems insanely high I feel like 1 of the mods might be in a crazy error loop

Idek

But 3x as much

Seems like sum ain’t right

[waxen frost]

Haven't observed anything unusual. Some stuff is just not very optimized ig. Do you have Mantif too? moon and dungeon is over 1gb alone.
ram usage also drops down to 50% ish after the game is up for a while. (if it doesn't crash :D)

[winter flint]

Can you drop that interior list, didnt realize there were that many

[waxen frost]

sure

[winter flint]

Thank you thank you

[jade token]

is my dungeon really the only one whose name doesn't end with Flow

[placid thistle]

Yep

Hipster

[placid thistle]

In my opinion TranquilityManor is a cool idea but very poor execution

Also for some users MentalHospital causes a lot of Unity crashes on launching modded

[placid thistle]

Only the interior

I know MentalHospital is going kinda haywire rn, not sure if it would cause a spike in ram usage though

[winter flint]

Yeah i gave it a whirl last week & i’m keeping it on the watch list for the moment. Huge potential.

No issues with hospital atm tho.

[waxen frost]

interesting I'll give it a try without hostpital once I have my presets file set up and see if it changes anything.

[waxen frost]

i've yet to actually play it in a game. Is it actually only the main hall that's different from mansion? I thought there was more like back and forth between the two vanilla interiors but when I tested it briefly most tiles were just mansion.

[placid thistle]

It works fine once the game is loaded it just made my game crash on launch with like a 70% chance

Hella annoying tbf

[placid thistle]

When I tested it in Imperium it generated to massive proportions haha

Basically HauntedMansion and Level1ExtraLarge smushed together

With not much intermix

More like mansion with facility on the outside edges

[waxen frost]

ah, that makes sense. and that's even tho the size multi on tranquility is 1 by default. have you tried fiddling with the factory size mutliplier for the dungeon flow?

btw how big is your LQ presets.json? I just noticed it's actually committing quite a sum of memory when lq is processing it. mine is 30mb

[placid thistle]

Nah I didn’t realize that’s all it was when I added it, once I realized I was like, meh deletes

[placid thistle]

I’ll check in 1 sec

[carmine crater]

Hey

so lets say that I configure a locker for example to spawn on ooblterra

But I don't check off the rarity

will the mod it came from or the game in general take care of the rarity for me?

[placid thistle]

Yes

It just means LQ won’t touch the rarity but you can still configure other attributes and add it to the spawn pool

But if the mod config doesn’t have a rarity for that moon or tag it still won’t spawn

[carmine crater]

Ah good

[carmine crater]

Can somebody explain this to me?

Something tells me this is correct

Ooooh wait

wait

im confused

Wait so

is the Spawn chance multiplier X

and the Time of day Is Y?

Wait its the opposite

wtf??

okay okay

so Time of Day is X

and spawn chance multiplier is Y

got it

Think I got a better understanding now

[sand steeple]

yeah it's not easy to understand it at 1st
I'm here with other numbers lol

[tranquil patrol]

Exactly, though the curve doesn't always come out as you might expect it to, so always worth checking it on one of the cubic spline calculator tools

[carmine crater]

cubic spline calculator

sounds like a smart person thing

[tranquil patrol]

Cubic spline is just the maths term for the curve itself

[silent whale]

Key is time of day
0 is 6 am
1 is 12 am

Value is just a spawn rarity multiplier. it can go above 1 if you want to make certain thing spawn more at a set time of day

[tranquil patrol]

So this is what these values make

[carmine crater]

Okay

so whats X and whats Y

Key is X and Value is Y?

[silent whale]

yup

[carmine crater]

Alright

and so that means spawn chance is X and time of day is Y

[silent whale]

no

X is time of day

[carmine crater]

What

wait how

isn't Y top and bottom?

[silent whale]

key is the time of day

[carmine crater]

What the fuck?

[carmine crater]

so that means these have to be opposites?

[tranquil patrol]

Depends what you want tbh

[silent whale]

X is left to right
Y is bottom to top
X is time of day and Y is the multiplier

[silent whale]

usually you want the first key to be 0 and last one to be 1 so that the curve goes over the entire day's duration

[carmine crater]

Ah I see

[silent whale]

also I use this to visualize my curves when I modify them
https://tools.timodenk.com/cubic-spline-interpolation

I learned the hard way that just tweaking some values can severely break how things spawn

[carmine crater]

Oh wait

[waxen frost]

I think what hasn't been said to DarkFedora is that Y is the amount of enemies

[carmine crater]

so I don't have to put
0
0.25
0.5
0.75
1

[waxen frost]

but maybe it was. I just marked server read by accident :x

[carmine crater]

if I just do
0
1
the spawning will go on through the entire day?

[waxen frost]

There spawn waves at fixed times throughout the day

[silent whale]

depends on which curve we're talking about
a moon's spawn curve uses Value as the amount of enemies to spawn while an individual enemy's spawn chance curve is a multiplier to their rarity

[carmine crater]

the only reason I need to know is because for no reason at all without Quantities my monster spawns are busted

[waxen frost]

for every wave it will evaluate the curve and get the enemy amount to spawn

[silent whale]

you want at least 2 points for a working curve

[waxen frost]

the other ones are called spawn chance curve tho. Not Enemy spawn chance curve. I agree it can be confusing lol

[silent whale]

think of it like: at this point in time how many enemies do I want spawning?

[carmine crater]

Ooooh okay

[silent whale]

and USE a cubic spline visualizer of sorts like desmos or the website I sent

if you don't you risk screwing up your curve in a way you wouldn't expect

[carmine crater]

Wait but I can just leave it unchecked and it'll do the curve for me?

[silent whale]

it will use the default curve

[tranquil patrol]

Eg this, where it dips into negative despite none of the values being negative

[carmine crater]

yeah

[silent whale]

so whatever a moon's dev put on it

[waxen frost]

also keep in mind that the Enemy spawn amount range will be aplied on top of your Y value from curve to randomize the spawn wave size. Higer range -> more random, simply put

[silent whale]

yeah and remember the range goes in both directions

ig if Enemy spawn amount range is set to 2 then you'll get between -2 to +2 enemies

[tranquil patrol]

Zeekers make a simple enemy spawning system challenge, impossible

[carmine crater]

https://tenor.com/view/there-is-so-much-information-tracy-kiss-theres-a-lot-of-information-we-have-so-much-information-theres-so-much-about-it-gif-23929525

[atomic geyser]

am i misunderstanding this feature? i was trying to use it to tweak the values of specific scrap under 'global' so i don't have to update each moon manually, but it doesn't seem to actually take effect (even when those values aren't selected on the moon itself) unless i select those values on the moon itself and change them there

if i am misunderstanding it, then is there a way to tweak the values globally without having to update them per-moon?

[placid thistle]

There are issues with the global section on the current version

Some parts work some don’t

[atomic geyser]

oh that'd explain it

do we know what parts work or is it inconsistent

[placid thistle]

uhhhhhh factory size multiplier doesn’t work, enemy rarity, and apparently whatever you’re tryna do with scrap

I just use it to change enemy power level and spawn amount

And double down on the rarity I want for the interiors

[atomic geyser]

good to know it works for this still

i thought maybe i was just doing something wrong, ty

[tranquil patrol]

Assuming LQ is working as intended (idk how well it's working rn, haven't played LC in a lil while) then this should work fine so long as all the values you have ticked in Global are unticked in the moon presets, which it sounds like they are. So you're not doing anything wrong, mod's just been collecting some dust

[severe harness]

Uh I wanted to inquire about something, so I recall messing with map size has some sort of desync problem but I also have a second dilemma where an interior I wanna use (in this case, CozyOffice) has a problem where sometimes entrances (Main and any Fire Exits) would get the "x appears blocked" and prevent the player from entering the interior

Is there any sort of workaround to adjusting sizes that's friendly towards clients either on an interior's size (via LLL's parameters as Rosie's interiors do not generate their own unique config file) or via LQ's end?

[waxen frost]

yes there is. wait a sec

[waxen frost]

I'm using all of these. They should be working. Like you said @atomic geyser you probably don't have a list with everything but unticked in the presets that inherit from global. That being said it might not be possible to change the Meteorite since it doesn't spawn naturally but idk. maybe it works. I know it works for casino chips that I add to the scrap list with a rarity. Since they spawn naturally in those levels they respect the values I set. The chips in the casino at the company obviously don't respect the values I set.

[waxen frost]

#1213985212686532638 message
so basically if you only change your factory size multipliers for dungeons (in the global preset) there shouldn't be any desyncs.
but if instead you only change the map size multiplier for a moon preset it will cause desyncs.
You can avoid that by also ticking the dungeon flows box (either in the moon preset or in global) and Add all dungeon flows to it. No need to change or tick anything. Just add them and you should be able to change the map size multipliers with LQ just fine.

Regarding the cozy office problem. From what I've heard and seen myself it happens when the dungeon generates too small for the amount of fire exits on the moon or sth. Try to keep that in mind when choosing the sizes or dungeon rarities.

[atomic geyser]

i wasn't testing it with meteorite specifically, i just screenshot something random

i couldn't even get it to work with vanilla scrap, even when all of the options were un-ticked

maybe it's a mod conflict then

[inner light]

has the enemy spawn weight config issue been fixed or nah?

[severe harness]

Oh heyo, I was actually looking at your notes regarding the desync issue last night before heading to bed. I'll put my method into text format rq and I was wondering if this might be a safe option:

1. Go to Global, enable "Dungeon Flows" and add all to the listing
   (Image provided of this step is on left)

2. Go to the desired moon (in this case, Experimentation & Assurance) and set the "Map Size Multiplier" above 1.0 to avoid the exit generation issue present with CozyOffice (I set it to 1.1 for context, Image provided below of step is on right)

I basically never touch the "Factory Size Multiplier", just Map Size Multiplier

[waxen frost]

Yea, I think that should work. Whether it resolves the CozyOffice issue with those values idk.

[waxen frost]

You can use the factory size mult if you want btw. Well, I should rather say: You don't have to not use those. I use them for all dungeons (in global preset) instead of the LLL size scalar thing.

[severe harness]

It seems to work for Experimentation so far, I'm doing a run where I'm going for like several days on JUST Experimentation & Assurance to see if it crops up

[placid thistle]

No

[inner light]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1003561100190679093/1147732884715737138/GRAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH.gif

bananapuncher save me...

[placid thistle]

CentralConfig works™️

[buoyant gyro]

https://tenor.com/view/bleach-tybw-thousand-year-blood-war-bleach-trailer2-bleach-pv-gif-26116525

[inner light]

not configing everything again

also i've heard it breaks stuff and or is kind of unstable

so i'd rather wait

[placid thistle]

Lethal Quantities (v89) gonna go crazy

CC works fine just don’t touch interiors with it

[atomic geyser]

i tested it more and it seems that the price works fine globally, but the weight will convert to 1lb unless you set it on the moon itself

[sand steeple]

I'll be using LQ because it is the tool that I understand the most on my modpack.
I am aware that some configurations might not work as expected, but in some future update of this mod it is expected to be fixed.

[placid thistle]

afaik all these settings will work fine

but i havent done extensive testing with every setting

besides moon price, definitely bugs out atm

[frozen magnet]

Would it be possible to get variable intro messages for moons, i.e. varying temperature or wind speeds relating to conditionals like weather? Or is that kinda, too advanced for the game to handle?

Like, imagine if you were able to control different sets of the same moon, sometimes it's more risky, sometimes it isn't. May not necessarily random but one would imagine different weather conditions would affect different spawn rates for certain enemies, even if it's the same enemies. I dunno, I think that'd be a unique idea.

I guess the way I could imagine it realistically would be that different weather conditions would register as sub-class of a main preset of the moon so that you don't have to re-do all the stuff you've already done but can still tweak aspects of the moon to better fit the context of a weather event.

[atomic geyser]

is there a way you can get lethalquantities' routing prices to be prioritized over a mods own config's? i'm trying to give ganimedes conditional routing prices, but it seems to ignore them

[severe harness]

What do you mean by conditional routing prices exactly?

As in if you're in an "adjacent" moon already (e.g. Artifice) the cost to route to the moon is 0 or smth?

[atomic geyser]

exactly that yeah

lq's feature that allows you to set moon prices per moon

it doesnt seem to get along with ganimedes, which has its own config for price without the option of per moon pricing

[heady cliff]

Does LQ's enemy weights take priority over LLL's?

[placid thistle]

No

[sand steeple]

What happens if I disable completely the spawn system in LLL?

[severe harness]

How I usually have my things set up between LQ & LLL is this:
LQ:
Enemy weight,
scrap weight,
map size,
route cost,
curves for enemy spawns & traps,
Risk rating & description (e.g. Changing Ganimedes from SS to something like S++ or S+++)

LLL:
Interior weight
Whether or not a moon shows up in the terminal*

• (Moons that are edited in such a way have 0 edits from LQ's end)

[upper sable]

is editing interior spawns with LQ working?

[carmine crater]

I just edit it with their respective mods

[upper sable]

a few mods don't have configs for their spawn rates outside of the LLL config, and i believe the LLL config requires you to turn on config configuration to edit the interior spawn weights which i don't really want to mess with

[carmine crater]

Yeah

What interiors don't have configuration?

[upper sable]

wesley's interiors, unreal interiors, lc_office, etc

lc_office technically does have a config but it's an outdated rarity config that doesn't work

[carmine crater]

A h

[carmine crater]

Wesley's interiors

[upper sable]

grand armory my beloved

[carmine crater]

more like

fucking nuclear explosion in grand armory

that fun house one better frfr

[upper sable]

you're a hater

[carmine crater]

Well i mean

of the grand armory yea-

[heady cliff]

Is there a way I can make LQ have priority over LLL for this type of stuff?

[sand steeple]

I'm disabling this manually per moon

[heady cliff]

So I just delete wherever I don't want LLL to affect?

[sand steeple]

I'm not sure if it's 100% working

[frozen magnet]

I'm pretty sure LLL only affects things if you change the config to true

[placid thistle]

It won’t those settings aren’t actively handled by LLL they just show up in the config for display

LLL just does interior stuff

[heady cliff]

Wait, so none of those settings in @sand steeple's screenshot work??

[sand steeple]

Oww

Welp

[woeful cliff]

I know you can set the cost of travelling from specific moons using this mod but how do you just set the overall price?

To go to a moon

[woeful cliff]

I figured it out

[lost finch]

Hello!
I have a weird bug with LQ.
I have 25 interiors installed and I want all of them to have equal chances to spawn on all moons and i've tried everything, dungeon injection in LLL (content config = true) , i've tried using a preset on every single planet that puts all interiors at equal chances using LQ, I have CC but i don't really understand how it works because when i set dungeon override to true and start the game it doesn't give me an config options. and even after leaving every mod on it's own with the others it still doesn't work and I don't really know what to do now. (to test if the mods works i set one of the interiors at the weight of 9998 on Experimentation [Experimentation:9998]) but LLL doesn't seem to work even without LQ and CC, LQ doesn't work and if i delete CC my friend have void fog and can't join me. I did try all:9998 and All:9998 and Vanilla:9998

weirdly enough LQ works with mob spawning weights and animation curve , moon price but not with the interior weights and i did test this because i set one of them as 10000 and it didn't spawn.
they told me i should ask in this channel.

[covert frost]

have you tried making a new profile with ONLY Lethal Quantities installed, and changing the interior values?

Because configuring interiors works fine for me using Lethal quantities

[lost finch]

Yes

[covert frost]

can you send me a screenshot of how you configured it in the web editor?

[lost finch]

k