Summoner

[rigid delta]

[steel python]

There's very little to learn

[solid kestrel]

i see skills to take out though

[steel python]

WB has no def so def hammer does nothing

[solid kestrel]

dng on hornet is grief too

and prickly owo

[steel python]

It's funny I see that KR streamer using dng and briar

I don't agree with it but

[solid kestrel]

wasted dps o:

[steel python]

Maybe they know something I don't

[rigid delta]

I see summoners using cat call

[maiden flint]

doesnt dng get honey

[steel python]

Cat call is kinda goated tho

[rigid delta]

And briar patch still with purple flower

[steel python]

Honey isn't that big for hornets

[solid kestrel]

yes but you lose uptime waiting for it to hit and then the increase is so tiny, it's better to stack another purple hornet

[rigid delta]

Cat call would be worth the spec if they gave iframe back

It is funny being able to call your cat back out of ccs now

[steel python]

But yeah, Niji just barely beat out Thesis yesterday

And they purple hornets

Better stats cuz Lego neck etc

But yeah I don't think Lego hornets is that insane tbh

[rigid delta]

I want Lego hornets for pvp

That's about it

Wb rewards too good to give up. Need the 10g

[solid kestrel]

seems to be but i don't have one to test :)
every time i cast hornet it's sooooooo slow, maybe extra bad with high latency?

[steel python]

Perhaps

[rigid delta]

It was like that on live

[steel python]

Autogcd shouldn't work with hornets

[rigid delta]

Only flower

I think it's still ping friendly

Neo just messed up how quick they come out

[stiff salmon]

we r human for sure

[chrome epoch]

@lament skiff wanna buy?

[steel python]

Wtf

Unupgraded

[chrome epoch]

yup

[steel python]

Insane lol

[chrome epoch]

Ye mine are true already and dont wanna upgrade new ones

[lament skiff]

Depends on the cost, I guess

[ashen monolith]

Wtb daybreak/gimme light NA

[chrome epoch]

well what would you pay

[ruby maple]

aww i just sold my gimme

[lament skiff]

Sorry for the camera shift, I'm no content creator

[maiden flint]

Is that legendary, can u hold down rmb?

[maiden flint]

Can't tell if it's faster but I guess the rose is free cuz no shared gcd

[lament skiff]

Its not

It has a gcd

[serene grotto]

All instant cast i guess its legend hornet

But if u dont weave lmb in u gona run out of focus pronto

[lament skiff]

I don't have a purple HN so I can't compare the two

[ashen monolith]

[steel python]

Rose doesn't share gcd with lmb but it does for a lot of other skills

*hornets

[ashen monolith]

hmmm

i sure do

but im gonna have to bargain

you can have a pic of my old BD

[barren drum]

@steel python carry me

[wet jacinth]

Love how everybody shook me off for trying to buy hornets for 18k and now I just bought 2 for 17k randomly on the market

[sharp wedge]

WTB Purple Sunflower (EU)

[steel python]

17k NA is still a bit much

I know you EU

[wet jacinth]

Yeeee

We saw some for 15-16k weeks ago but it's been a wasteland ever since

occassionaly a 25-30k idiot pops up lol

[steel python]

We had similar, but when purple selector news came out

someone sold for 12k

wish i was able to snipe that

[ashen monolith]

[lean juniper]

WTS EU

[lament skiff]

Is there a neo discord for EU players? Might be useful for organizing for this carry event

[wet jacinth]

This is the discord

[lament skiff]

Yeah but we can't really set up roles to group up people or anything

[sharp wedge]

Isn't #👋︱neo-lfg kinda for that purpose?

[lament skiff]

Yep, but it's a lil inactive

[chrome epoch]

U wanna farm 10 silvers

U can get more if just work

[crisp stag]

WTB Heroic Hornet

PM me

[lament skiff]

The spread on hornet the last 2 days has been weird

Wasnt it at 17? Now's between 19 and 40?

[brittle gust]

bdx bought 3 and that confused the market

[lament skiff]

Aaah

[spiral dagger]

whale

[solid kestrel]

thesis bought like 7 and na market is dry

no sun books either

[cyan oasis]

people use a macro for the earth summoner?

[spiral dagger]

hold T

this is the best macro

[cyan oasis]

even with blue sunflower books

[bold ferry]

not really

[spiral dagger]

With blue sunflower it is harder to hold T but still macro is not needed

[cyan oasis]

How do we do it then because I only do 12K dps with 788 ap

[spiral dagger]

12k on what dungeon, it is matter
Also don’t expect too much from summoner, without purple it suck
Even with purple it is not “the best”

[cyan oasis]

okay, the purple sunflower summoner will be useless, plus this purple book is extremely expensive

[lament skiff]

If you're looking for the biggest numbers, this may not be the right class

[bold ferry]

well you can still deal a lot of dmg but u are not a fm

[minor sun]

New bp next week will have a purple selector tho it will prob take 3-4 weeks to finish it

Just gave to tough it out till then

[sinful cove]

Wonder if the box will be updated when warlock releases

[spiral dagger]

bp is for character so u can't keep that box and mail it or something
cuz all items u got from it, goes to your character inventory

[lean juniper]

WTS EU 5k

[knotty vale]

wtb purple sunflower NA

[dense glacier]

Has anyone tested out the dps of rumblebee build

Is it significantly worse than the other 2 build?

Cause I'm seeing rumblebee build has bleed, which is needed in new contents

[patent briar]

it's very bad

[dense glacier]

We talking about 10-15% dmg decrease bad or unable to sustain dps bad

I have purple doom 'n root and prickly stance

so I want to build something like this

[prime salmon]

anyone selling virtuous soul and mystic badge for hornet?

[patent briar]

#1357802662992675099 message

you honestly might as well run the stun tab instead of trying to stack clawnado and cope that bleed + def down + ccing is enough contribution

[dense glacier]

wow

cat doesn't scale

this is new

[steel python]

with the cheerup buff it will scale a bit

issues is that it will get constantly cc'd

like try hae mujin <50% without using cat q

[prime salmon]

WTB hornet soul + mystic badge - NA

[chrome epoch]

WTB purple Sunflower EU

[quartz mortar]

hey guys is this for group in the future ?

[shadow plank]

Yes it is

[quartz mortar]

m

[amber briar]

WTS one of them ,i keep another EU

[solid kestrel]

what region? o:

[amber briar]

EU

[solid kestrel]

WTB Prickly on NA :3

[brittle gust]

Hm for leg

[amber briar]

u can give me offer

[brittle gust]

7?

Nvm actually

[chrome epoch]

yoo

sell me the legendary one

[river light]

WTB Purple Sunflower - NA PMO!

[chrome epoch]

WTB Purple Sunflower EU

[digital bramble]

WTB Purple Doom 'n' Gloom EU

[ashen monolith]

[vestal sage]

WTS NA, 1.2k on market

[dawn roost]

WTB purple hornet EU

[brittle gust]

emraell is gambling again?

[lament skiff]

No

Someone with a bigger budget has bought out the junk purples

[brittle gust]

just sold 3

[prime salmon]

WTB purple sunflower NA

[ashen monolith]

where should i go if i want to sell my account?

[prime salmon]

weren't u just buying purp books 😭 why u quitting?

[outer hamlet]

bro suddenly got a life o7

[rigid delta]

Buying a summoner neo account gotta be one of the worst financial decisions you can make

[spiral dagger]

He wants to sell
And tbh if he has good gear and some purples it’s not that bad

[brittle gust]

Yeh could be a des account

[steel python]

pre purple selector, it probably would be a good deal to buy an acc with purp sunflower bound

skippng insig/card/level farm is insanely good

[sharp wedge]

Sure, but people often times ask such ridiculous prices for the accounts as if they were able to get their own investments back
Some that I've seen for sale would be just cheaper to spend that money and you'd be better off on a fresh acc

[steel python]

Yeah those people kinda cooked

[chrome epoch]

ppl after they realise they spent too much on f2p mmo

[lament flame]

Wts EU moonwater

[amber briar]

WTS EU PM OFFER

[true stirrup]

What if they enjoy the kind of unique and autistic gameplay of summoner

[rigid delta]

I would agree if this was live summoner

only the cat is autistic instead of you

[patent briar]

lf>a hornet nest player to be buddies with for wb

[steel python]

(for NA)

[solid kestrel]

[wet jacinth]

Only 2

Was looking for 18k for a few weeks, everybody laughed at me and wanted 20-22k

Untill suddenly 3 appeared so I bought 2 of them 🙃

Now I am done buying hornets tho, got 2 purples so now we wait and stack using selectors

[empty portal]

So if we're following things correctly, Summoners become 100% playable after next BP because everyone will get a Sunflower through the BP

[wet jacinth]

If only 1 sunflower did anything

Summoners in 4 man dungeons are rather bad untill the other 3 get insanely geared.

[steel python]

Imo purple sunflower summoners need to be like 20gm to do good damage to the new stuff

And hornet summs need to hit 20k personal and have insane debuff uptime

I don't think we're going to skyrocket to the top of the leaderboards

A good fire/pucture bm will always do more just straight up

[wet jacinth]

Sunflower 100% will drop any utility what so ever to hit the dps check

Hornets need 3 capable teammates to ensure the utility is actually used

[steel python]

Though if you're 20k personal dps as hornets on tree/lab, i'd expect your teammates to be competent as well

[wet jacinth]

This upcoming patch is where all sunflower summs in Korea dropped ALL the utility because they where just getting cucked by uptime.

It's a clear path between budget dragonchar FM or Hornet utility summ.

[steel python]

I mean to be honest, you have to be fighting for top 10 wb

[wet jacinth]

If u wanna do tree you gotta do 35k mujin dmg.
Unless you bring a ton of utility you can probally be fine with 25k ish.

[steel python]

Like maybe not fighting for spot one, but definitely figting to get into top 10

[wet jacinth]

(On Cinderlands nr 7 worldboss is 15k mujin dps)

Worldboss is the worst way to measure dps xd

[steel python]

Or like you should easily solo BBR

[wet jacinth]

Bbr solo is 26k dps, that's peanuts

[steel python]

Yeah, has to be super easy though

gotta get knocked around and not care

I hate tanking in general, i feel pressured to keep it facing the same direction like my kfm/bm tanks in live did

Unmoving, same direction

[wet jacinth]

These 5 would have a chance to do Tree.
Emraell can totally do it if he goes full sunflower bomba (leggy op).
Idk what build the NA ppl have cuz me EU

[chrome epoch]

what this

[steel python]

That's the azura dps meter ranking

[chrome epoch]

i didnt know that a ranking exists

[wet jacinth]

^ atleast for the ppl that care enough to upload the logs

[steel python]

https://beans.azuradara.dev/

[chrome epoch]

oh you have to uploade it urself?

i havent done that if so xD

[wet jacinth]

Yeah somebody off the group has to do it or set up the automatic thing

I never rlly bothered with that 😂

[chrome epoch]

ye but notice that the ppl in top 5 have either crazy gms 30+ or legy skill and only have 3-4k more dps than i have on Mujin with only 12gm is crazy

[wet jacinth]

Everybody can swipe a creditcard

But skill issue can't be solved with that.

[chrome epoch]

29k with legy is kinda uff

and almost 60 gm he on xD

[wet jacinth]

u mean Emraell?

I mean, The gap is lowering every day they do Wb
It used to be a 1% gap, it's now a 0.5%
Nuni has 4 purple hornets, Pummel has 2 purple sunflowers.

[lament flame]

Wts EU 8k in F5
if you want you can negotiable in dm

[wet jacinth]

Yep that's how they do it in Korea

Bring a full sunflower summ and a hornet gamer

[chrome epoch]

i will be a full sunflower gamer

but no one selling me purple sunflower copies

[steel python]

[chrome epoch]

emraell bought all

[steel python]

Everyone a sunflower gamer

I need to start charging to be hornet gamer

[wet jacinth]

Hornet chad

[chrome epoch]

no you should be happy to find a sunflower gamer so u can run new dungeons too 🙂

[steel python]

I get added by so many whales

[wet jacinth]

Just bring KFMs, Bms, Sins and Bds

no need for a sunflower gamer

[steel python]

Literally its wow you have def hammer and you do some dps

add plz

[wet jacinth]

hey, that's hard for most

Mostly cuz they play upside down or something idk 🙃

[steel python]

I do take care to drop cat sleep on classes that need focus

[wet jacinth]

Just drop it in melee, they'll all flock towards it

[steel python]

Oh i chase my melees

Nothing better to do

[wet jacinth]

yikes

Exactly

[steel python]

[wet jacinth]

and u just drop the cat in melee

[steel python]

That's why i run prickly nowadays

[wet jacinth]

They'll happily turn and stand in it, no worries

[steel python]

Its that extra focus regen that lets me bait

also purple tier focus mantras which are gigawhale but dw about that

[wet jacinth]

if u gotta bait as sunflower u just lost

ur a hobbahobba bot

[wet jacinth]

What do you think about this, I want to drop Briar patch for Besties.
And possible drop Smothering Paw for another hornet

[lament flame]

wts EU

[wet jacinth]

Smothering resetting hammer debuff is so annoying

[wet jacinth]

Go into the market thread bru
That ring is like 100dg worth

[steel python]

For grapples, its either purple tier or nothing

(once we get it)

I wouldn't personally drop it if you plan on gamba/buying purple grapple

[wet jacinth]

Kr got their skillpatch on wl release no?

[steel python]

No clue

[wet jacinth]

it resets hammer debuff

10s > grab > 3s left

[steel python]

Yeah i had that before

[wet jacinth]

Thats why I wanna drop it

it's so bad

[steel python]

I don't think its a big deal personally, i've gotten more ok with letting def buff drop for that few seconds

as opposed to not having it for the original 4s duration

[wet jacinth]

Could go this

[steel python]

But i'd rather have another book in place

[wet jacinth]

U still pin

U just hammer to get the debuff

[steel python]

If you drop briar, i'd consider whether you need your DNR as well

I have my F locked

[wet jacinth]

Dnr is giga good tho

Like seriously

[steel python]

I don't doubt it

I can just hold down macro and everything will be fine

[chrome epoch]

WTB purple Sunflower EU

[wet jacinth]

I am not swapping to blue pettels tho, skillpatch not to far away atm and hive OP

[chrome epoch]

👀

[steel python]

tiffy is NA

[chrome epoch]

bruh

[steel python]

Yeah petal toss is probably going to be WB only soon

[wet jacinth]

bruh

[steel python]

[chrome epoch]

[steel python]

Look at this person, she only gets 1 stack when she clicks rmb

point at her and laugh

[gusty kiln]

tiffy what's your ign?

might wanna buy something if youre selling

ty

[wet jacinth]

Wts purpel hornet 80k

Be the hornet gamer you always wanted to be

special discord gamer price

[steel python]

This is what I run

A lot more utility than most summs

[chrome epoch]

what a nice summ

[wet jacinth]

Where do I even put my last 7 points lol

[chrome epoch]

what server are u on

[wet jacinth]

Wdym, that looks like a regular hornet build? xD

[steel python]

I'm NA

Yeah its pretty standard

I don't think the points matter at all

70% dmg should be from hornets, 25% should be from rosethorn

or some breakdown like that

[wet jacinth]

Dnr and drain do like 3-4%

[steel python]

I'll stand by this opinion, Purple Def Reduction book is worth it

The base stats are nice

I could cast dnr/drain or i could hold more macro

Some def i believe

I'm too lazy to log in to check

I think debuff resist too?

[wet jacinth]

Idk but it does some additional dmg on 5 poison stacks

So it's prety nice

[solid kestrel]

WTB Purple Hornet Nest (NA)

[chrome epoch]

[solid kestrel]

[brittle gust]

I do wonder when u guys gonna fix ur accuracy

[wet jacinth]

detect set op

[brittle gust]

Never seen a summoner above 1300

I need 50 more for 2k

The average summoner has like 900 accuracy don’t u miss

[lament flame]

WTS eu

[wet jacinth]

Brother, go into the right channel

Jezus christ

[steel python]

I use detect set, I want to miss

[ashen monolith]

Idk man, i got a lot of mix info about sunflower and hornet

Not sure which to go for

Some stand by sunflower js cabaple with dps and can modify to keep def shred up time

[brittle gust]

sf is stronger but lack of poison and support makes it worse

i had 70% upkeep with sf with hammer

[wet jacinth]

You go full selffish dps sunflower

Or you go hornet utility with def redec

[ashen monolith]

Nowhere in between?

[wet jacinth]

As hornet you will confidently be bottom dps but boost your teammates, as Sunflower ego dps you will be... a little bit bottom dps

[brittle gust]

but the average sf player probably has 10% upkeep

[wet jacinth]

[brittle gust]

some sf player dont even have a hammer

[wet jacinth]

Don't take hammer

Take more sf

[brittle gust]

might aswell just play fm at that point

[ashen monolith]

Cuz what I'm trying to do is mixing between util and still get dps output

[wet jacinth]

Well every summ has to carry its weight

Just let the hornet gamer do both.

[brittle gust]

gl getting into parties without doing nothing

[brittle gust]

piercing req is 3k at next dungs

most classes struggle to reach that so if u dont hammer

same ppl pulled me into hae at lvl 48

[steel python]

If a party looks at my stuff and turns me down, chances are they're trap af and have no clue how to play their class

Easy filter

I make my clan peoples come and carry if we get trapped

[leaden lance]

idk what youre talking about.

[steel python]

Ono I've been spotted

I'm the rat of the clan

Pugging to see what pugs are like

[ashen monolith]

oh, does anybody selling petal storm toss?

[gusty kiln]

Dodo carries the pug

[solid kestrel]

the more i share here the more people are fighting my market :/

but hornet is better than sunflower in dungeons

[wet jacinth]

Always was :d

[solid kestrel]

the dps difference isn't that big at all but hornet can keep def down the whole time

[wet jacinth]

• doesn't miss when boss jumps and/or doing mechs.

[solid kestrel]

just look at the logs (sure, not many were uploaded) but i'm right up there between all the sunflowers because i know how to play hornet :)
and that is with def down

even at wb i'm contesting sunflower players (GM 18, 24 and 30) but comparison at wb isn't really a good one because of orbs etc

i do plan on getting all the necessary stuff to actually test sunflower dps myself but that'll take a bit longer

[chrome epoch]

[solid kestrel]

you think the other suns up there aren't whales? o:

[chrome epoch]

did i say that? 👀

[wet jacinth]

Top 5 cinderlands all have 4 pp hornets or atleast 2pp sunflowers

[solid kestrel]

in my clan i'm around center with dps, against the big hitters of course i'm like 10k below which i make up with def down
in pugs i'm always top :)

[chrome epoch]

all whales except me, i dropped my purple sunflower myself and farmed tons to now have gems to buy another 😛

iam dolphin

[chrome epoch]

your gear is pretty good

[solid kestrel]

so is the gear of people in my clan owo

[chrome epoch]

and u got tons of stacks of hornet already

[solid kestrel]

still only the same value as 2 sun books o:

and i'm competing against people with 3 purple suns at wb

just because the majority of people are bad on hornet doesn't mean that hornet is low dps

[wet jacinth]

2 sunflowers is 4 hornets in price, think about that.

[brittle gust]

u can stack more hornets too cuz u dont need prickly

[solid kestrel]

5 hornets uwu

[wet jacinth]

Oh idk murican prices but here is 18k vs 35k

:d

[steel python]

15k vs 50k roughly

[wet jacinth]

Don't even need daybreak/solidarity as hornet

eventho its nice too have

[steel python]

Though 15k is a bit low

[brittle gust]

yeh i have a dragon char fm in my pt

[solid kestrel]

35k is so cheap

on na suns sell for 45+

[brittle gust]

daybreak is nice for the pt

sold 2 sf for 35k to emraell

[wet jacinth]

NA prices in general are odd

Xept hornet for some reason xd

[lament skiff]

Huehuehue

[steel python]

NA prices just higher

It's hornets that's weird

[wet jacinth]

How many more u need for full sf em? :d

[brittle gust]

are u regretting removing the skills or u good em?

[lament skiff]

Just the bound selector

Nope

[wet jacinth]

oh shiii

[chrome epoch]

stop buying all sunflowers!

[lament skiff]

I’m noooot

[chrome epoch]

leave one to me!

[lament skiff]

Anymore

[chrome epoch]

RUDE

[wet jacinth]

What's the dps diff

[lament skiff]

Idk

[steel python]

Bring some to NA!!!

[chrome epoch]

u now 60 GM+ legy?

[lament skiff]

I don’t hold the button down in hae

I like the way my face is arranged

[wet jacinth]

Lel

[lament skiff]

No 54

Hae has some kind of kick that makes the screen flash red threateningly

[chrome epoch]

[brittle gust]

isnt that a besties bug?

[steel python]

Yes but also Hae Mujin hurts

[chrome epoch]

depends if u stay in hive its oki

[lament skiff]

Lyns are very good punching bags, I guess. Even the thrasher is taking bites

[chrome epoch]

ye most ppl in top 5 bc they p2w pp copy

[chrome epoch]

my opinion will still be that sunflower has more dps with same GMs. But Sunflower is harder to play, and can be a pain if they add some mechanics and stuff and u cant just chill in cat / hive focus recovery all time and have to move lots. Also there is a huge skill gap i my opinion. As SF player u can sometimes put def down without huge DPS losses but obv. not as often as a hornet player. So it will come down to how well you play it in the end. so some SF go full ego no def down and have few more DPS but if u are SF with def down the overall party dmg is higher

[solid kestrel]

can you play and provide some logs?
i sadly only have what people uploaded so far and looking at that sun is just so bad :)

[chrome epoch]

check ur dms, i showed u some worldboss dps

notice that iam only at 12 GM

[solid kestrel]

i sadly dont remember what i have at wb

you could send dummy logs though but even those are skewed

also do you have another sum at wb for poison

[chrome epoch]

isnt there always one

i can tell, there was no other in my group at least

you can also check my streams, i will try to stream more when update is out :3

[solid kestrel]

so as sun sum you should get even more dps at wb than you would in a dungeon o:

because there's always someone stacking poison for you

[chrome epoch]

that was my mujin dps with a hornet in team 😮

[solid kestrel]

i'm at 26k now with full def down uptime

[chrome epoch]

now add the % GM iam missing with my only 12 GM

[wet jacinth]

[chrome epoch]

[wet jacinth]

[chrome epoch]

how much % is 36 gm

[solid kestrel]

i'm 34, it's 57%

[chrome epoch]

yast not working on my phone

[solid kestrel]

59.6% for gm36

[chrome epoch]

12 is 22.8?

[solid kestrel]

yea

but why only gm36 is that the max for your build? owo

i could get gm54 hornet

[chrome epoch]

no thought ur on 36 sorry

if iam not doing maths wrong i could reach that dps with 34 gm ->

[solid kestrel]

just adding gm is not flat dps owo

[chrome epoch]

well ofc its not flat but close no?

[solid kestrel]

no because you already have multipliers on your damage right now

you'd have to add the damage from your base damage

not multiply

and then account for reductions too

[lament skiff]

Isnt there a calc? I saw one somewhere from the sin thread

[chrome epoch]

can u share that? 😮

[chrome epoch]

i dont get what you mean

[wet jacinth]

It's it just 0-16 1.9%
17-25 1.5%
25-38 1.2% or something like that

[solid kestrel]

your 22831 dps already is with a 22.8% multiplier on mastery
your base damage would be closer to 18592 dps

so you multiply 18592 with 1.596

[chrome epoch]

when iam at 22.8% with 12 GM and ur at 57% with 34GM i miss 34,2% soo i just added that

[solid kestrel]

which is 29672 dps at gm36

but you still didn't account for crit multipliers and so on

so it might be more or less, i don't know

[chrome epoch]

but still lots more no?

[lament skiff]

https://ci3t.github.io/calc-skill-neo-basic/

[solid kestrel]

i also have 10 slots for hornet books, 9x6 = gm54 is my goal

how much can you stack?

[chrome epoch]

depends if i wanna go ego or not

[solid kestrel]

and then also would you do 29.6k with or without def down

since that's only a 3-4k dps difference to what i do owo

[chrome epoch]

i did no def down just apply pois

[solid kestrel]

so at 36 gm you'd still deal like 6k damage less on mujin than me

due to at least 5x2k being added from def down

[chrome epoch]

its 1k less dps if i also use some def downs

[wet jacinth]

If u drop dnr/dng u can get 11 right

[solid kestrel]

i don't use dng on hornet uwu

[wet jacinth]

Thats 10, Minus doom is 11

[solid kestrel]

but i do have seed shroud, which i could possibly remove too, just really like the party stealth if there is no sin

[wet jacinth]

Aa

True

I forgot to add that mb

What else do u not have then

Besties?

[solid kestrel]

seems about right? o:

besties is a must, if you remove it you're griefing >:C

[wet jacinth]

So this you

and then just hornets

[chrome epoch]

wait u add 5x 2k for def down? xd

[solid kestrel]

yeah, i use petal toss instead of hive though

[solid kestrel]

yes it is at least 2k dps per player owo

if you have full def down uptime

[chrome epoch]

i think 1-2k also depends on their piercing no?

[wet jacinth]

SoonTM u'll want to swap anyway, honey buff op

[chrome epoch]

supaaaaa sunflowaaaaa

[wet jacinth]

Did u do a comparisson between blue petal or no?

[solid kestrel]

yea that's what we'll see and don't know yet o:

what is blue petal? owo

[wet jacinth]

blue petal storm

The poison dps one

[steel python]

It's about 10% difference between hive swarm and petal storm toss

[wet jacinth]

shiii thats alot

[steel python]

That's assuming you don't mess up your focus ofc

[wet jacinth]

true, hive is giga op for focus

[solid kestrel]

ah you meant petal storm vs hive, yeah it's like 2-2.5k dps?

[wet jacinth]

I never stand in Cat so I can use the focus xd

[spiral dagger]

kaboom gives 2 focus on crit

so this purple blue petal strom is nice anyway, just 4you not 4party
but dps is higher

[solid kestrel]

no one likes my hive anyway so i just petal storm for dps

[spiral dagger]

i used hive when i graple boss

to make fire kfm dps harder

[steel python]

Yeah too many specs want focus

[lament skiff]

Does the clan veil also hide you from non-clan members?

[chrome epoch]

btw. do we know what else comes in patch?

Honey buff in it or HP/Acc scaling?

[wet jacinth]

No thats long far

Next patch is just dungeons

Warlock patch is skills (maybe)

[chrome epoch]

ewwwwwwwwwww

[wet jacinth]

And then a month after that KR got extra skillpatch

And a month after that they got shadowmoor

[spiral dagger]

no1 know untill patch appear tbh

cuz we are getting everything faster than kr

[wet jacinth]

It's prety safe to assume we get the same patch as Japan and Taiwan gets next week

The rest we need to wait

[spiral dagger]

but about skillpatch they didnt say anything, like never (?)
i remember when they changed blue buff or stacks GM, at first - no1 knows about changes, or i didnt noticed any info about that in patch notes at first

[wet jacinth]

Yep

[chrome epoch]

They changed stacks GM?

[spiral dagger]

they added it without letting us know, same with blue buff changes

it was for party before, then after patch they changed it and didnt say anything

for like few weeks it still has 'title' under the skill "party boost" or something like that

now they changed it for 'self buff'

but some skills change for sure, i mean for fm or bd - we should got "first skill changes" with dungs

[chrome epoch]

But wasnt it like that from the get go

[spiral dagger]

Blade Master (검사) – Heroic Tier Skill Expansion,
#### New or Enhanced Skills:
Full Moon Slash: Follow-up (만월베기:연계) – Allows chaining into another attack after Full Moon Slash.,
Phantom Sword (비연검) – Summons a flying sword to attack the enemy.,
Ambush: Movement Speed Boost (습격:이동속도 증가) – Increases movement speed after using Ambush.,

#### Skill Buffs & Adjustments:
Blade Dispersal (어검발산) – Enhances the Sword Aura burst effect.,
Heavenly Sever (천지가르기) – Increased overall damage output.,
Riposte: Maximum Acceleration (역습 시 최대가속) – Grants a movement speed buff upon successful counter.,
Increased Focus Recovery (내력 회복량 증가) – Boosts the amount of Focus restored from specific actions.,
Dragon Sword Effect Added (검룡 효과 추가) – Applies the Dragon Sword buff to affected skills.,

#### Skill-Specific Buffs:
Dragon Sword Combo (검룡연격) – Increased damage and now benefits from the Dragon Sword effect.,
Scorching Slash (초열베기) – Gains the "Heat" effect and deals additional damage.,
Meteor Slash (유성격) –
Increased base damage.,
Airborne effect removed.,
Gains the "Heat" effect.```

we should got this in this patch i guess

#### New or Enhanced Skills:
Smash Fist: Additional Cast (붕권:추가 시전) – Allows an extra cast of Smash Fist.,
Rising Dragon Kick (연천각) – A powerful upward kick.,

#### Skill Buffs & Adjustments:
Tiger Blast (맹호광파산) – Now restores Focus upon use.,
On Hit: Continuous Focus Recovery (명중 시 내력 지속 회복) – Focus is continuously restored when the attack lands.```

#### New or Enhanced Skills:
Exploding Palm (파음지) – Deals additional damage.,
Glacier Palm (빙하장) – Deals additional damage.,
Frost Lotus (빙화지) – Restores Focus on use.,
Spiritual Barrier (강신장막) – Enhances defensive capabilities.,
Inferno Avatar (폭염신장) – A powerful fire-based ability.,
Scorching Strike: Knockdown (작염: 다운) – Now applies Knockdown on hit.,

#### Skill Buffs & Adjustments:
Ember Spread (불씨확산) – Now applies the Burn status effect.,
Burn Effect Enhancement (화상 효과 추가) – Burn effect added to certain attacks.,
Ember Stacks Increased (불씨 5중첩) – Ember can now stack up to 5 times.```

#### New or Enhanced Skills:
Ambush (습격) – A quick strike to initiate combat.,

#### Skill Buffs & Adjustments:
Thunder Slash (뇌운베기) – Now has added effects.,
Whirlwind Slash (와류베기) – Now applies a new effect.,
Thunderbolt Effect Added (뇌반 효과 추가) – Adds the Thunderbolt effect to the skills.,
Critical Hit: Thunder Stack (치명타 시 뇌전 1중첩) – On critical hits, applies 1 stack of Thunder.,

#### Wind Effect Skills:
Wind Spirit: 3 Stacks (풍연 효과 중 사용 시 풍혼 3중첩) – When Wind Spirit is active, gains 3 stacks of Wind Soul.,
Wind Slash: Wind Spirit (바람베기:풍연) – Applies the Wind Spirit effect.,
Gale (샛바람) – Activates Wind Soul effect.,
Wind Slash: Additional Wind Effect (풍연 효과 추가) – Gains additional Wind effects from certain attacks.,
Cutting: Maximum Acceleration (가르기 최대 가속) – Increases the speed of your attack.,
Wind Effect on Successful Knockback (튕기기 성공 시 풍연 효과) – Applies Wind Spirit effect on knockback success.```

[chrome epoch]

👀

[spiral dagger]

i really dont know why we didnt get it yet tbh

so we should get it like now i believe

[chrome epoch]

all i want is summ buff

[wet jacinth]

Not happening

[spiral dagger]

play live then

[wet jacinth]

Imagine when Summ would do good dmg and have a deff reduc

[solid kestrel]

but we already do owo

[chrome epoch]

do you play live? xD

[solid kestrel]

like even compared to my clan members i'm doing ok o:

and they have similar gear and stats as i do

[spiral dagger]

i'm playing live when i have nothing to do on neo, just did soulboost and waiting for new one (and doing daily/weekly for gold)

[chrome epoch]

i never played live so idk anyway xD

*will never do

[spiral dagger]

many ppl doing the same cuz when u dont have nothing to farm its suck

[solid kestrel]

my baby alt with 799 ap 2883 cr 1562 cd, 929 acc and gm11 blue hornet does about 10k at mujin

[chrome epoch]

u do daily stuff on 3 chars?

[solid kestrel]

i really don't see any issues owo

[chrome epoch]

i have barely enough time for 1 char tho

how can u play live too and do all there xD

[spiral dagger]

i do everything on my main and mushin only on my alt

[chrome epoch]

thats sounds chill

[spiral dagger]

everything means: 'mushin tower + purple train + burn energy on oldman > quit game'

[chrome epoch]

so no 5 chests pvx

[spiral dagger]

i dont do faction quests when i hit 55

[chrome epoch]

or 10 gold chests pvx

i dont wanna swipe so kept grinding

[solid kestrel]

skewed numbers because too few logs

[steel python]

Dont think this is right

[solid kestrel]

but unless you compare with sin or bm it's not that huge of a diff

[spiral dagger]

i have like 500g atm and many mats to insta upgrade weapon when i get it, so i really dont pay attention to do all the stuff we can do on neo

[steel python]

I think its BM > Sin = KFM > BD > FM > SUMM = DES

[spiral dagger]

for me sin = trap

[steel python]

Gotta find the good ones

[spiral dagger]

i know maybe 3 sins who can play on EU

really

[wet jacinth]

Nuhu

[steel python]

Like blue EP with like 10 GM does like 28k hae mujin

[solid kestrel]

yes but it's not like we're doing trash dps compared to all other classes

[wet jacinth]

BD > KFM > Sin > BM=FM > Des > Summ

[steel python]

maybe 25k

[wet jacinth]

There just are alot of whale bm and fm's atm

[solid kestrel]

maybe our definitions are just different

[steel python]

No blue book summ is doing over 15k

No way BD is that insane idk

[wet jacinth]

One pp puncture bm (me) does 24k mujin.
One pp hornet (also me) with near same statts does 11k mujin

[wet jacinth]

Bd is giga insane

It's legit ultra broken

[steel python]

A realistic hae mujin BD is like 40k

[wet jacinth]

It's just super expensive

[chrome epoch]

We trash dps

[solid kestrel]

huh? even the highest bd log is only 35k

[steel python]

And I see BMs do roughly that much all the time

Not everyone posts their logs lol

[solid kestrel]

the parsers do

[wet jacinth]

Ceni (30k bd) is nr 2/3 wb on Cinderlands

[chrome epoch]

Probably the logs suck

[wet jacinth]

So yeah, the logs are just bad

[solid kestrel]

like why would you upload logs if you aren't doing good

[chrome epoch]

Or most high dps ppl dont even share them?

[solid kestrel]

only you yourself can upload

[steel python]

Yeah i dont see any of the HR bds here

[chrome epoch]

They probably dont care or dont know

[steel python]

Like I'm looking at Cavok and he's good but he's not at the level of the insane bds

(hes f2p i believe)

[wet jacinth]

Kz littarly does 23-25k on mujin with 784ap and lvl 50

Bd is giga broken 😂

[solid kestrel]

better use that def down hammer

[steel python]

This is BD ranking in HR

I think its missing a few

[chrome epoch]

your right...xd

[steel python]

BD is good but its like FM tier

[chrome epoch]

well dont wanna leak but some ppl just dont share dps

[steel python]

but better

[wet jacinth]

Bd is more broken then kfm

[spiral dagger]

one of the trap sins i meet

[steel python]

No way BD is more broken than KFM

[wet jacinth]

But just like most kfm's ppl just suck

[chrome epoch]

why trap

[steel python]

Caera pulls 45k

on hae mujin

[wet jacinth]

Bro look at his gear

[spiral dagger]

18k dps with 20 stacks?

[wet jacinth]

If u do less then 40k with that gear u just uninstall

Lmao

[spiral dagger]

and this cr+cd

[steel python]

She's less geared than quite a few of the BDs

[wet jacinth]

Mah man caera got leggy wep and leggy skill

Aint no bd got that

[steel python]

We had at least one BD who had it

Then they quit

[chrome epoch]

this 82k dps is BD btw

[wet jacinth]

All I know is Kz is nr 10 bd at lvl 50, that says enough

They just bad

[steel python]

30s fight idk

[wet jacinth]

Thats just fatal/storm nonsense

Like destro execute xd

[steel python]

Like I agree BD is broken

but like not at the tier of the other broken ones

[wet jacinth]

Bm is strong atm cuz purple scales good

Leggy skills on bm suck bad

[chrome epoch]

well i took that after WB

[wet jacinth]

So as soon as ppl start whaling enough it's joever

[chrome epoch]

idk why it shows 30sec

[steel python]

thats cuz you're puncture

[wet jacinth]

Look at nanaya with dt xd

54gm leggy dt does same dmg as 30 puncture

Criminal

[chrome epoch]

Check HELP Dps

dude can almost solo mujin

[wet jacinth]

Does he have a leggy ice rain yet?

[steel python]

don't talke about help

[spiral dagger]

help is dragonchar, not ice rain

[steel python]

Their parse isn't legit

[spiral dagger]

noush was ice rain whale, but he quit

[chrome epoch]

[steel python]

0%

[solid kestrel]

FM, Sin, BM, Summoner for last night's WB on Viridian

[wet jacinth]

I know but leg dchar is a dps loss while ice rain is giga broken

[chrome epoch]

is he the fraud guy?

[wet jacinth]

huh

no?

[steel python]

they must have other fms funding embers and probably at least a summ giving focus

[solid kestrel]

except for sin the damage % diff isn't that big

[steel python]

its not realistic

I've seen Viridian population

[chrome epoch]

how you know

[wet jacinth]

He does play with a pocket summoner (Shivita) and another fm

[steel python]

its not representitive of the top geared stuff though

[spiral dagger]

emraell killed noush

and makes him quit

[steel python]

I bet it was probably Tank + HELP + FM + FM + SUMM + SUMM/FM

[wet jacinth]

Nah

[steel python]

and all FM's just spamming LMB

[chrome epoch]

why even swipe for 5%

[solid kestrel]

this has nothing to do with population if you look at the top people only o:

we share the same market and gear up at the same pace as HR

[wet jacinth]

They do Pizza (kfm) + Bd (grabber) + Fm + Help + Summ (shivita) + Another KFM I forgot the name off

[spiral dagger]

25x13 (books) = 325 books
325 x 1500 (sometimes less)
487k divine gems (if 1.5k for 1 book)
X D

[steel python]

You guys geniunely have shittier gear, i'm not kidding

[lament skiff]

I have a spreadsheet

It's a lot

[wet jacinth]

It actually does.
If you compare Eu1 to Eu2 its also world apart.

[steel python]

Like best summ would be middle of the pack in HR

[solid kestrel]

we just have less gigawhales than you do

what rank is chibi?

[steel python]

Depends on rng usually

[solid kestrel]

or icecream

[steel python]

Icecream can beat

[chrome epoch]

you have lots Whales but we have some giga whales

[wet jacinth]

(When are we going to notice Worldboss sucks wiener)

[steel python]

Thesis has beaten once i think

Lego hornets btw

[solid kestrel]

you also need to know how to play owo

i mean if i look at a hornet player with dng... i already am questioning what they're doing

[chrome epoch]

like @lament skiff who gamba some purple books instead of getting a car or something else kekw

[steel python]

I've seen plenty of like 18gm purple sunflowers in pugs that don't appear at all in wb rankings

[lament skiff]

WFH privileges

[wet jacinth]

Fusel u on cinder?

[chrome epoch]

Moon

[steel python]

I think we can assume all of HR top 10 are decent

[wet jacinth]

Ngl alot of ppl dont bother with wb either

[chrome epoch]

you?

[solid kestrel]

what rank is ice at wb? do you ahve some screens

[wet jacinth]

I am constant nr 6-7 bm unless I get giga lucky so I don't care to much about wb

[wet jacinth]

ye

[steel python]

Rank 2 or Rank 1, very close

[solid kestrel]

because compared to me ice only does 2k more at mujin...

so it's not that huge of a diff

[steel python]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1367177799961542838/1375671484474724432/0pnMrmj.webp?ex=68352c68&is=6833dae8&hm=ccf47009792897bf02e8023ce58bf7d6f0097c534c9259321a8a00c1789080a3&

that's 3 days ago

[chrome epoch]

this is like 3 weeks old

[steel python]

Chibi won yesterday

[solid kestrel]

then this isn't right at all owo

[steel python]

Also i'm not comparing to you, I'm comparing the two populations

HR is so muc closer

[solid kestrel]

you said best summ, i'm top 2

[steel python]

Because gear is so much better

[solid kestrel]

best viridian sum would still be top 5 on heaven

[steel python]

Yeah

I agree

I'm saying the bottom 5

wouldn't be there

[solid kestrel]

i don't really get what you're trying to say

[chrome epoch]

1 month old HELP dps

[spiral dagger]

i remember time when i was top1 for weeks ;[ i miss sunflower

[steel python]

Meanwhile the bottom 5 HR could fight for top 5 if they get lucky with orbs

[spiral dagger]

[solid kestrel]

top 5 heaven and top 5 viridian would mix rankings, but top 5 hr would not stay top 5 in a merged server

what do you mean they could fight us

[steel python]

I'm saying, you have a lower sample size in your population

[solid kestrel]

your #6 is at 0.439% #1 at 0.597%
you #1 does 28.4k at mujin, our #2 does 26.4k at mujin

[steel python]

so its skewed by more outliers

Chibi does way more at Hae Mujin

[solid kestrel]

so how would your #6 beat our #1

[steel python]

30k is like an off day

[solid kestrel]

log from 5 days ago is 23k....

[spiral dagger]

[steel python]

From chibi?

[solid kestrel]

yes

from chibi

[spiral dagger]

now im just top5

[steel python]

This was like a month ago

[solid kestrel]

oh yeah with a pocket sum

niji is hornet

[steel python]

Got a lot of upgrades a while ago

[solid kestrel]

and you too

[chrome epoch]

i catched up

[wet jacinth]

Pumper 💪

[steel python]

That's like 10% damage missing

[solid kestrel]

@steel python https://beans.azuradara.dev/players?name=Icecream&region=NA

[wet jacinth]

This is Cinderlands (No thats not me)

[solid kestrel]

last mujin log was may 22 with 28k

[steel python]

And it should be factored in because sunflower doesnt run without hornets anyways

[chrome epoch]

until this happened

[wet jacinth]

Only 0.4 huh

How old are those xd

[chrome epoch]

that one?

[solid kestrel]

yea true, at wb you have stacks anyway

[spiral dagger]

i skip so many wb cuz of work

[chrome epoch]

15.05 was that

[wet jacinth]

aha

[solid kestrel]

but how about, partying up with them and knowing the real dps instead of only boss %?

[chrome epoch]

who works at 10 tho

[spiral dagger]

i have 3 shifts

[chrome epoch]

rip

[spiral dagger]

when i have late/night shift i can't be on WB

[wet jacinth]

15.05

Look at that gap lmao

[chrome epoch]

wait u guys got a separate worldboss

[wet jacinth]

Wdym

U also got that

[steel python]

this was like 9h ago

[chrome epoch]

how long is yours allive?

usually

[wet jacinth]

Idk like 8 minutes in Eu2

2-3 mins in eu1 lol

[chrome epoch]

yee

[wet jacinth]

It's the same for Na

[solid kestrel]

i looked up the names and besides like 3 people i don't see more whale than on viridian

[chrome epoch]

i thought we fight the same one

[spiral dagger]

that's why cinderlands always get auction

[chrome epoch]

bc we get shared auction

[spiral dagger]

we are killing it too fast

[wet jacinth]

More gamers more auction

[spiral dagger]

[chrome epoch]

auction gets me gems

haha

last time got like 650 gems cause whale bought it for 135k gems xD

[wet jacinth]

Well not you cuz its always Cinder auctions

[spiral dagger]

u are getting gems only when item drop on your server

[wet jacinth]

[steel python]

Then why is there such a big discrepency between Waffereborn and the bottom 5 of Virdian dps

[prime salmon]

I have 1.6k accuracy 🙊

[chrome epoch]

its 80% dropped on cinders

[spiral dagger]

yes

[chrome epoch]

sucks tbh.

[wet jacinth]

More players = More dropchance innit

[chrome epoch]

should just share all server?

[wet jacinth]

Moonwater being the elitist server doesn't help

[chrome epoch]

or more on moon

[solid kestrel]

look up the names and compare gear o: you have a few with 1000+ ap but that's about it, your bottom few are much more undergeared than our top 4

[steel python]

Yeah

I know the top 4 would do well in HR

I've been saying that

???

[chrome epoch]

doesnt it just die quicker so u can build up less gap?

[solid kestrel]

you've said your top 5-10 on HR could fight our top 5

but that's not the case at all

[steel python]

Yeah our 6-10 are pretty close

[solid kestrel]

big gap

compared to our top 5

[steel python]

My point was that, your best summs would be middle of the pack

[chrome epoch]

Their top 10 seem very close no?

Like they all whales

[steel python]

which is good

because our top 5 are insane whales

[chrome epoch]

When on yours @solid kestrel it looks like some giga whales

[solid kestrel]

owo i don't know what you all are talking about, one is saying viridian doesnt have enough big whales, another says we have giga whales

i compare gear in game and it looks about the same

but then i get told HR top 6-10 could beat our top 5?

doesn't make sense

[chrome epoch]

I had 1550 but went down to 1450 or so xd

[solid kestrel]

if we merged servers your top 5 would compete with our top 5 to keep the place

[steel python]

That's count vs magnitude

[chrome epoch]

From the looks, doesnt look so. Yours look stronger but might be bc it takes much longer to kill?

[spiral dagger]

more% = longer fight, u can't compare only because of % or gear, on WB there is so many things.. like orbs, getting cc, boss jump
why are u even compare worldbosses xd

[steel python]

I'm not arguing with you on the fact that your top 4 would be able to compare to the top 3-8 on HR

I agree with that

We're not in disagreement

[solid kestrel]

i'm not just comparing wb but the state of gear
since the market is shared between servers we have the same opportunity to gear up

just that HR definitely has more whales buying timestream for example

[steel python]

Yeah ofc

higher pop

[solid kestrel]

but when it comes to competing, personal skill and latency also matters
like how is thesis so far behind chibi and icream owo with a leg hornet

i'd just say they haven't played hornet long enough, especially looking at a build with dng

[steel python]

What point are you trying to make with that?

[chrome epoch]

Nia just too good with 100+ms outclassing the NA ppl

[steel python]

He's got lego hornet playing to the best of his ability

[chrome epoch]

[steel python]

I'm not going to comment on it

I'm not privy to the details

[chrome epoch]

👀

wdym dodo

[solid kestrel]

that people complain about summoner too low dps, that people say viridian would have too low dps compared to your top players and so on
at the end of the day it's a combination of gear and player skill and latency owo
and if you were a good summoner player you would have no issue doing comparable dps to other classes, considering def down

if i started playing sun right now i'd be trash at it, i can't even keep focus up on a dummy xd

[chrome epoch]

i kind of dont wanna put def down as part of dps calculations

[solid kestrel]

i could have any gear i want and would not deal as much damage as hornet until i practice and know what i'm doing

[solid kestrel]

you outdps other classes if you apply def down

if you don't then it's 20% below?

which to me at least is very reasonable with all the utility we get

[steel python]

"summoner too low dps" This is true... take your gear and GM and give it to a good hybrid BM or Puncture BM or low ping BD/SIN, there's no way they don't do more damage

And yeah i dont think def debuff is enough of a reason to justify our low dps

[chrome epoch]

but we dont know exactly how much dps def down provides to others you know? like if someone got tons piercing they dont really get much from the def down or do they?

[steel python]

Correct yeah, its mainly an estimate

[solid kestrel]

that is what i'm saying, my clan members are equally geared and of course do a good bunch more than me but are not miles ahead o:

[chrome epoch]

you can get 2-3k more dps but u can get only 100-500 too

[steel python]

They all have lego neck? and 34 GM? I think you're very well geared lol

Only Niji in our clan has lego neck

[solid kestrel]

our bm is 1011 ap, 4076 cr, 3711 cd and gm20 dt, 10 es (i have no clue what skill matters on them)

that is even more than i have in stats

[steel python]

And how much do they pull

[brittle gust]

Gz u only missing 400

[steel python]

Honestly i can't compare to hybrid bm because all the ones i know are puncture

[solid kestrel]

31.3k at mujin
i did 26.5 that run
that was including def down

[brittle gust]

1955 + lvl up so 1970 I could ev some acc still

[solid kestrel]

20% dps diff but i provide utility, sounds worth to me

[brittle gust]

Do u drive ?

[solid kestrel]

another run he did 33.4k, i don't remember his max dps

but should be around that

[steel python]

Yeah that sounds fine

but that's still an insane amount of difference

5k dps

[solid kestrel]

for low lvl dungeons yes but for high lvl def down does so much

[steel python]

Again, def down skews your dps heavily, you just need 1 in a party

I dont think its fair to compare what you bring to the party from def down to someone's hae mujin dps

Back in live, Summs used to be top dps and they brought insane utility

as an example

[solid kestrel]

that just sounds broken owo

why would you want broken classes in neo again

[steel python]

Yeah they were broken tbh but still, you needed the other classes because they were also broken but had party buffs

I'm saying that we shouldn't be relegated to either doing below avg dps (sunflower) or doing meh dps and being the only damage amp in the game (hornets)

[solid kestrel]

i don't know what your definition of meh dps is but i guess it'd be ~26k compared to ~32k at similar gear then

[steel python]

Your BM isn't playing the "meta" build

Since puncture is current meta it seems

(though hyrbid is insane still)

my friend estimates 30% higher

which tbf he hasn't played both

[solid kestrel]

uh, again idk how to compare world bosses

but he's #1

[steel python]

Don't compare BMs

its a futile effort

Look up Anthem and Sulli

[solid kestrel]

skill issue :)

we also have a super big whale that just can't rank high

[steel python]

wallet issue

[solid kestrel]

well, high is relative

still below non-whales

[chrome epoch]

they just gotta swipe more

[solid kestrel]

i just dislike people making statements about something they think how it is but not taking into account actual numbers you see

i'm providing logs, screenshots, you can also look up stats in game and compare everything to get actual numbers owo
and all i get countered by is how someone still thinks summoners are too low dps etc

he's making points without facts though

where's the data to support?

i'm trying to listen but you have to provide evidence

just assuming something isn't good enough

[chrome epoch]

we can go private call and i show you my trash dps

[solid kestrel]

what does cute have to do with talking about numbers?

[steel python]

the evidence is that you're being outdps'd by a BM by 5k, and he's playing a build that does 30% less than the "meta" bm build

[prime salmon]

Ty ;w; I don't think I can find another 400 tho

[solid kestrel]

it just so happens that this is the best bm on the server so if you can provide higher numbers, feel free to show
just because you're saying "it could be 30% higher" doesn't mean that there has to be one with that

[steel python]

[solid kestrel]

who's better than who? no one said anything the likes

you're trying to make a totally different point to what dodo and i are trying to say

[chrome epoch]

eww you both chill pls

[snow coyote]

sunflower or hornet build for summoner? im total noob 🙂

[steel python]

ballpark math:

Hybrid BM is 7.5AP/s

Puncture BM is 11AP/s

Puncture gets free crit as well, only thing hybrid has for it is a minor def shred which does NOT make up the difference

[solid kestrel]

logs & numbers pls, not just theory

[steel python]

It's literally AP/s

[solid kestrel]

then show just one screenshot or one log and all is good

[steel python]

If you want an example, wait for Sulli to put his pve gear on and compare his stats/books to Anthem

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1374946761918906498/1376395827689422968/6d8b99d2006b6a7e4d34c066fa9fdcf5.png?ex=68352c01&is=6833da81&hm=4db9817e1a3ec9c04aefc8b7d2b538b45b79fa3ae0ae879778eca8d0070545f0&

[solid kestrel]

still doesn't tell me their dps..

that shows me their gear, and?

[steel python]

Sulli was probably 50k dps pre hae mujin patch (dummy)

He was 40k tanking WB when i played BM

[solid kestrel]

can you get your hands on current logs

like dps a month ago doesnt really help

[steel python]

No i dont run with Sulli, Homra does their own runs I believe

I can't believe its a question of whether summ does more dps than BM

Or whether Puncutre is better than Hybrid

[solid kestrel]

it's not a question if summoner does MORE dps than bm but a question how much more a similarly geared bm would do

[wet jacinth]

Lmao

I looked away for an hr and we talking bm again

[steel python]

You play BM

[solid kestrel]

of course they do more damage than a summ player but is it a reasonable difference for how much utility we bring?

[steel python]

tell us

[wet jacinth]

I got a similar geared bm and summ

Bm puncture 28k mujin.
Summ hornet 12k mujin.

[steel python]

The utility is besides the point

[wet jacinth]

Does that help?

[solid kestrel]

how do you only do 12k at mujin

[wet jacinth]

Cuz its only 1 purple hornet

and i'm not using kabloom cuz i got hive

[solid kestrel]

how can you compare that

[wet jacinth]

Its equal gear.

1 purple vs 1 purple

both 18gm.

[steel python]

I mean double the summ dps and its still not matching that BM

[solid kestrel]

you should do more than 12k with that on sum

my baby i've said before does 10k with 11 gm blue book no storm either :/

alt that i don't gear...

[wet jacinth]

[solid kestrel]

latency?

[wet jacinth]

20

[solid kestrel]