Remove Hand Saw from MP

[charred wyvern]

Hand Saw already forces you to play around it in single player because if the dealer has it or you have it and the dealer has adrenaline, you have to play around the possibility of the dealer getting it once it goes to his turn when there's 4+ shells in the shotgun. MP makes the impact of the hand saw even worse because people play around targeting individuals if they're smart. The hand saw makes eliminating people before they've even had one turn possible, and combined with skips, the hand saw simply takes skill out of the equation in a lot of situations since you have no discretion over how other players are going to use the saw to get someone out as early as possible. By limiting the max possible damage per turn to 1 when there's 2+ people alive, it gets harder to target someone and have it be worthwhile.

[minor viper]

i dont think outright removing it is the play but i do think its probabilities of being grabbed from the box should be reduced

[cerulean moss]

This is better. Making it a more scarce item makes it more able to flip certain scenarios around. Could make it into a fun uncommon clincher item.

At least with 4 players. It should be more common the fewer players there are on the board.

[empty orbit]

To be honest I don't think we should do anything with the saw because if you play 4 players and everyone wants to finish quickly they will only shoot one person with one bullet and not different ones but with the saw because everyone realizes that if you shoot someone you don't like just once he will recover with cigarettes.
So what I'm saying is, if there's 2 damage, they'll shoot everyone, and if there's 1, they'll shoot one at a time.
(pardon my broken English, I don't know it very well).

Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

[sudden portal]

There we go, much better idea

[charred wyvern]

The way it currently acts is not as a clincher item at all though because it works best when you're already at a charge advantage or trying to put yourself at a charge advantage. Because of how many cigarettes are possible all at once now, a lot of adrenaline plays now center around using cigs when it comes to someone's turn to replenish health. The saw exists to make the margin for error much smaller for people who are at 2 charges. But it doesn't end up working that way because the number of ratio of everyone else's turns to your turn ends up being 3:1, so the saw spam becomes perpetual with how many phones and magnifying glasses are also available. That then causes the single person targeting to become even worse. It's either raise the minimum and maximum charge numbers by one each or remove the saw, reducing the drop rate still forces people to play around them significantly in order to avoid the possibility of getting one-shot by a synergy.

Actually come to think of it, I agree with you, push the drop rate to like %10 and I think that’s fair

[cerulean moss]

Yeah that's what I'm saying. And with fewer players it should become more common.

[versed cradle]

I feel like the real problem is that multiplayer needs an item balancing system

You can divide the items up into groups based on how scary they are and make sure each player gets the same number from each group

Maybe just divide them into 2 tiers. Top tier items are Cigarettes, jammer, handsaw, and adtenaline. Second tier is beer, inverter, magnifying glass, phone, remote