#Mime doesn't retrigger Blackboard

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

misty ravine
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I'm not entirely sure if this is a bug, but I've tested Blackboard with Mime, and it doesn't retrigger.
As the description of Blackboard says: "X3 Mult if all cards held in hand are Spades or Clubs."
It absolutely should retrigger any held in hand ability, including that of jokers. (e.g. Baron and Raised Fist)

bold walrus
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Mime cards about cards held within the hand, blackboard is not held in hand so mime never sees blackboard

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enhancements like steel and gold are a 'held in hand ability' blackboard's trigger condition isn't, since you don't hold blackboard in hand

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Here's another discussion about it from a year ago if you want to see other perspectives about it. Regardless, the way it works now is as intended

misty ravine
bold walrus
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because mime is retriggering the kings that are held in hand and the lowest ranked card that is held in hand

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mime isn't retriggering baron and raised fist directly, mime retriggers the card that's in hand to do what it's told a second time

misty ravine
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technically though, it still counts as a held in hand ability regardless if the cards are held in hand or not
it's either missing blackboard or poorly worded

bold walrus
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other people have agreed that blackboard is somewhat poorly worded, I personally don't have an issue with it

misty ravine
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i feel like every ability with "held in hand" in the description should be retriggered by mime

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they're all held in hand abilities

bold walrus
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something I just noticed about mime is that is specifies "card held in hand"

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that wording is somewhat vague but does imply that the card needs to actively be held in hand for it to be retriggered

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and as BB isn't actually held in hand, just triggered base on the held hand's condition, it shouldn't be triggered

misty ravine
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that makes sense

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i feel like blackboard should have something to say it doesn't get affected by mime, because i imagine ALOT of other people made that same mistake

bold walrus
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yeah, that's a discussion that was brought up quite a bit closer to the game's launch

misty ravine
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because on the surface, there's no reason for it not to

bold walrus
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so many people asked about it

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also many people asked why BB didn't work with stone cards, due to them misinterpreting the wording

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and how an empty hand satisfies BB's condition

misty ravine
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wait does blackboard work if there's only stone cards in hand? ive never checked that

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technically it should if it works with no cards at all

bold walrus
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Stone cards are not black suited

and empty hand vacuously fulfills the requirement

misty ravine
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that doesn't make sense

bold walrus
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Look up vacuous truth

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it explains it, but it can be somewhat confusing

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as for why a stone hand invalidates BB, Blackboard requires that all cards that are in hand to have a black suit, stones do not have a black suit

misty ravine
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that is kinda confusing

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and then technically 0 cards makes all cards have a black suit

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but the 0 cards could be light suits too

bold walrus
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being a red suit doesn't invalidate BB, as evidenced by wild cards working

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and by the exact wording of BB

misty ravine
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i mean wilds trigger every suit ability

bold walrus
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it doesn't remotely care about the red suits, just that a card has the attributes of a black suit

bold walrus
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they count as all suits simultaneously, but only once for any given joker (really only matters when considering Flower Pot)

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A wild card will trigger both Gluttonous and Lusty at the same time, but will not count as both the Club and Heart in a hand to trigger Flower Pot

misty ravine
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so flower pot only counts each card one time?

bold walrus
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yes, you always need 4 cards for flower pot

misty ravine
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that makes more sense

high oracle
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Honestly I joined this discord just because of this interaction. I felt it was a bug myself. They absolutely need to reword one of the cards (probably blackboard) maybe something like "If your hand contains only spades and clubs x3mult"

bold walrus
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I agree that BB should be reworded to not cause confusion with mime, it would need to be reworded to be something that it actually does.

Only spades or clubs would mean that you can't have either red suit in hand which isn't true, wild cards are valid. The word only here implies an exclusivity meaning no other suits can be present.

high oracle
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heres a better reword "if your hand contains only cards that are spades or clubs x3mult"

brittle pawn
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Ultimately blackboard isn't a held in hand ability, as blackboard provides xmult from the joker slots, not from the hand. Raised fist and baron make it so the playing card held in hand provides the score, which is why mime works with them.

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And tbf, before this bug report, I've never seen anyone get confused by the wording on blackboard and how they think it would work with mime

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Technically, the held in hand effect from blackboard is just checking the cards, since blackboard itself provides the X3 from the joker slots. As is, I would interpret it as that Mime would just copy the suit check

high oracle
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if it did not specifically say the "words" mime looks for I would assume it wouldnt interact. I literally got the game in the last 2 weeks. I have not been apart of the community from the beginning. As a new player the wording seems like it should interact. I feel like I've understood almost every other mechanic so far. that was absolutely the most confusing nonbo that I tried to set up for like 4 runs in a row. I literally just got my first legendary joker today.