As title. It will simply show "Debuffed" and not give the x1.5 mult. A debuffed King is still a King. The Joker isn't debuffed. Since it's the Joker's ability that applies the multiplier, it should still trigger.
#Baron doesn't trigger correctly on Debuffed kings
serene vessel
swift ravine
Intended interaction between cards and jokers, if either one is debuffed the effect doesn't get to activate
serene vessel
That makes no sense. If it counts as a King for use in straights (but doesn't get scored), then it should count as a king held in hand for Baron.
swift ravine
debuffed has no effect on poker hand determination
only on enhancements, editions, and jokers iirc
serene vessel
The joker isn't debuffed. The card is. Which does not change the fact it is a king held in hand.
swift ravine
correct, but no ability is allowed to activate on that king
serene vessel
Which is correct. The Joker's ability activates. Not the debuffed card's ability.
swift ravine
but the Joker's ability activates on the king
(which also means that they can be retriggered)
serene vessel
Not quite. The Baron gives 1.5x mult "for every king held in hand". Whether it's gold, wild, glass, spades, steel, red seal, blue seal--
And a debuffed King is still a King, or it couldn't be used to make a straight or a pair. If you make a straight with a debuffed king, you still get a straight, and scored accordingly, which means the rank isn't taken away. Therefore, it is "a King held in hand". Whether it's debuffed or not should not matter.
Red seal for instance retriggers the card. But it does not retrigger the Baron on a King with a red seal.
keen meteor
But the card cant be scored on
Like if you play a 2 with even steven you dont get 4 multi
serene vessel
It's not scored. It's held in hand. And the rank doesn't change, as is evident by it being perfectly usable as a King.
keen meteor
Then why doesnt wven steven work? That also had a rank that is even, is that also a bug?
Same with odd todd and a few other jokers?
serene vessel
Well, those jokers specifically say "When scored", which you can't on a debuffed card
keen meteor
What about Shoot the Moon then?
serene vessel
I don't know that card yet
keen meteor
Its baron but queens and gives 13 + multi instead of 1.5x multo
serene vessel
"For every Queen held in hand" ? Or when scored?
keen meteor
Held in hand
serene vessel
Then yes, it would be the same and should trigger in my opinion
keen meteor
Alright I understand your logic
Do we know what debuffed cards specifically say? Do they just say they arent scored? If so then you might have a right opinion
serene vessel
The card cannot be scored, and its abilities are disabled. But that's the thing, it's not that card's ability that is triggered on, it's its rank. And that doesn't change even when debuffed.
Because with a Stone card, it specifically states it removes rank
keen meteor
Im sorry for asking so many questions but what are the exact words of baron?
Actually I think it just says says “Kings held in hand give 1.5x multi”
But from that wording that says the kings themselves are the ones giving the 1.5x multi
serene vessel
"Gives 1.5x mult for every King held in hand"
keen meteor
Hmmm ok
Then yes I think you are technically rifht because its saying the joker itself is the one giving the multi, not the kings
serene vessel
Yes exactly. Otherwise Red Seal would also double the 1.5x, which it doesn't.
keen meteor
Though that also means red seals shouldnt work, I think the best solution is changing it so that it says “kings held in hand give 1.5x multi”
keen meteor
Yes exactly. Otherwise Red Seal would also double the 1.5x, which it doesn't.
It does
serene vessel
I guess I missed that then, there was a lot going on and it went fast. I thought I recorded it, but Windows Gamebar apparently can't record Baltaro.
keen meteor
Yeah recording can be difficult
Ill try and remember to inform localthunk about this slight wording change if I can in the future, or if smithbodie sees this maybe they can inform everybody since they are a mod
They check a decent amount of bug reports so they might
serene vessel
I know. It went fast because I had Smiley, ballot, Photograph and the one that triggers face cards twice.
That'd be cool. Like, I don't mind if it's intended it's fine, but the wording and interaction don't add up.
keen meteor
Yeah I think once the wirding is changed so the king itself is the one doing it then it will all work out as it is intended rn
Also the one to at retriggers face cards is Sock and Buskin
serene vessel
Or simply add "(not debuffed)" somewhere in the current text, so it's clear on both jokers. Though it's still weird.
Yes that one
It went nuts when I added Lucky Cat and started making cards lucky.
But that's off-topic XD
keen meteor
Yeah face cards being retriggered is a pretty good build
True 😂 its hard not to to get sucked in
Anyways gn
serene vessel
I know. 14 hours, I have the game 2 days XD Oops.
gn, thanks for hearing me out
keen meteor
Its nice to do civil talking, just slightly tedious because you have to go through every part to find the problem
serene vessel
Yeah. I think it would be best to alter the text of "Debuffed" to "This card can't be scored or used by Jokers and Abilities". It's a very niche case, running into disabled faces with those specific jokers.
elfin shore
Flowerpot was changed so that it's ability still activates when playing debuffed cards. Idk, the choice of which jokers can still work on debuffed cards is inconsistent
keen meteor
Yeah…
dapper falcon
wasn't that an actual bug though, where it would count debuffed wild cards as no rank when it should still count as its original rank?
i.e. it's now consistent with disabling abilities of cards
swift ravine
well flowerpot is still bugged right now, so...
dapper falcon
why wouldn't it smh