#[Suggestion] Less punishing spectral cards.

25 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

mortal oriole
#

The spectral cards are all quite powerful but the downsides are often way too harsh. Particularly when it comes to jokers. Adding a special edition to a joker you already own is hardly ever worth destroying all of your other jokers.

I'd really only make these changes:

Hex - Destroy one random joker instead of all
Ouija - reduce downside from permanent to only the current ante
Ectoplasm - reduce downside from permanent to only current ante
Ankh - Destroy one random joker instead of all. Negative enhancement jokers retain negative.

I like that there are downsides to the cards and that does weigh in the factors to use them but permanently crippling your run for a 1.5 mult or a copy of a joker is way too steep a price if you ask me.

Thoughts on how this could be done?

dense junco
#

i don't think ectoplasm is very punishing at all, the others are very situational so i'm not opposed to buffing them but ectoplasm is already probably in the top 3 best spectrals

#

maybe 4th actually since immolate cryptid and deja vu are all insane

tacit belfry
#

ectoplasm non-permanence is not a good idea

#

also ankh negatives were removed for a reason

hushed night
#

For the spectral cards hex and ankh, I'd say they should at least give the sell value of all destroyed jokers instead of just destroying them (if they destroy all but one joker).

delicate needle
# dense junco i don't think ectoplasm is very punishing at all, the others are very situationa...

There is a trade-off with it, but that trade-off grows every time you use one (-1 hand size on first use, -2 hand size on second use, -3 hand size on third use, etc.).
I would say if the downside is permanent, then it should be something small, but can still be significant (-1 hand size no matter how many times it gets used).
However, if the downside is big, then it should be temporary/decays over time. For exanple:
-> -x hand size, but gains +1 hand size every round until hand size returns to normal (x = how many Ectoplasms were used).

dense junco
#

i think its intentional that it gets worse as you use more, not really supposed to be able to get very many negative jokers and especially not a negative of your choice. to put it in perspective the downside can be entirely nullified with 1 voucher, whereas getting +1 joker slot takes 2 vouchers

#

with ecto buying 2 vouchers = +2 joker slots and -1 handsize, and imo handsize doesn't matter much until you hit either extreme

#

usually most of your score is from jokers and ideally none of your jokers rely on the rng of drawing very specific cards

mortal oriole
#

I know this isn't going to be everyone's cuppa tea. I just want to be able to play that whenever I get a spectral pack, I actually want something that's inside of it. No matter what part of the run I am on. Tarot cards are way more comon and it's rare that you don't want to use at least one of them from the pack. But Spectral cards are so rare that it sucks to pay for one only to have options that will destroy your run.

dense junco
#

my bad. thats absolutely fair, sometimes i forget about just having fun when thinking too much about balance

grim pelican
#

I mean regaerdless of how it 'should' be, this is a mod suggestion anyway. It doesn't matter how fair or not it is.

dense junco
#

true

signal mulch
mortal oriole
#

"Supposed to" and "actually do" are two different things lol

dense junco
#

lmao

signal mulch
#

but sure, you don't need to

#

point is, the spectrals giving you the sell value of what they destroy makes no meaningful difference

dense junco
signal mulch
#

you always keep one non-eternal unless all of them suck

dense junco
signal mulch