#Shop Rerolls

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

zealous kayak
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🧵

rotund ore
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sometimes, when i have $15+

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but i usually don't go out of my way to reroll

torn vine
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an average run, rarely

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i only ever really use rerolls if i have really good econ

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there was a discussion about reroll price somewhere

twin lagoon
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I only use rerolls when I have more than $25

torn vine
amber crater
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I only really reroll when I reach the shop before verdant just to spend all my money to try for one last good joker or arcana. Maybe I’ll reroll occasionally for planets if I have constellation, but that’s about it.

quiet compass
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On an average run, I can't afford it.

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When I can afford it, I don't reroll just to meme tho

amber crater
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Always gotta dunk on the shop by flaunting your cash and never rerolling

hallow oak
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If I have more than $25+cost of reroll I'll reroll.

If I have to reroll to try to get a joker to save myself, it's very unlikely that the reroll will save me.

oak igloo
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...yeah, I average 14 rerolls per run LMAO (not if i'm doing some stupid abandoned deck shenanigans though)

amber crater
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Man, we got moneybags over here

thick geyser
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Maybe I reroll too much lol

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But I don’t know how often I do it because I need to have at least $30, probably more, and that’s after buying a pack (if that seemed relevant)

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So maybe on my average run I die without rerolling

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But on an average run I win I roll a lot

dapper zinc
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i reroll when im over intrest limit and or am early game and want another option

river swift
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I only re-roll a lot on strong econ games, otherwise it's just a few times

neat furnace
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i dont reroll often until i have massively good gold generation, i often buy every pack offered.

pliant wing
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The bulk of my rerolls comes from right before the final boss, otherwise I'd say only 1-2 times

cobalt lynx
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I reroll if I need a joker or I have money to spend to hunt for tarots and planets

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or right before the final boss to find a joker to sell

cerulean dawn
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i almost only reroll if i have enough money before Verdant

cobalt lynx
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I like rerolling if I have a good amount of cash to spend and i'm hunting for glass tarot

thick flare
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On average, less than 1. It's too expensive.

thick geyser
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Interestingly the lack of $10+ votes suggests the Reroll value has negative EV

rose crescent
oak igloo
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yeah the reroll voucher's hilariously useless rn

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you need to already have a lot of money to go for it

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cause otherwise there won't be many opportunities to use it properly

cerulean monolith
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I tend not to reroll enough to even consider the voucher

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If I am rerolling 7+ times in a game I'm already stacked

hidden snow
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i reroll any time i have like $50+

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on average, i dont tend to hit $50

thin hinge
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on average if I go through the whole game and win its D or E but there are things like jokerless runs that scew that closer to A

warm sluice
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I only reroll in the last few shops because there is no reason to spend my gold before then. Either i have a combo that is already good enough to get to the final boss blind so that i dont need another joker or not and then i wont spend my gold on rerolls but whatever joker there already is in the shop.

golden pulsar
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I usually reroll if i get a good hermit or temperance

ornate pulsar
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If I have enough money to reroll and still have $25 left over (after buying anything else in the shop I want like packs and vouchers) I will reroll

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Basically just maintain the interest after buying what I need, but saving more than that doesn't seem necessary and I like the opportunities to roll better jokers, plant cards, tarot cards

red lagoon
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The reroll mechanic feels fine, though i'm really mostly using it towards the end of the demo to spend leftover money and earlier only if i have a strong economy early and have $30+ after buying packs to retain full interest value.

I think this calls into question the value of the reroll cost reduction voucher though. Assuming you might double your average uses in the full game we're still talking about 6-10 uses most of the time, which means the $10 for the voucher is going to serve you far better sitting in your cash pool and earning $2 a round in interest.

I think buffing the voucher is needed to make it a worthwhile purchase sometimes because right now i can never justify it. Lowering reroll cost by 2 instead seems like it might hit the sweet spot of "good but not too good"

thick geyser
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I had thought about making the first Reroll free

dapper zinc
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i mean theres a joker that does that in the full game

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he seems pretty good

gloomy edge
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On the topic of reroll voucher, I think it helps to compare it to overstock, which does a similar thing (lets you see additional shop options), but does it in a much better way than reroll voucher.

(1) Let's say you want to reroll the shop.
Normally, that costs $5 for 2 options = $2.5/opt
With Reroll voucher, it's $4 for 2 = $2/opt
With Overstock, it's $5 for 3 = $1.67/opt
So Overstock gives a better rate of money per option seen than Reroll voucher does, just counting rolls.

(2) Let's say you roll a whole bunch of times. The price of rerolls increases each time, but the discount from Reroll voucher is always $1. This means that as a percentage, the discount from reroll voucher falls off as you roll more times in a single round. It starts out as a 20% discount to rolls, but after you've rolled 5 times, now it's only a 10% discount.
Overstock on the other hand, always gives you 50% more options seen, and that percentage does not fall off as you roll more times.

(3) Overstock gives you an additional option in your starting shop (before rerolls) each round. Thus, even if you never reroll, Overstock effectively gives you half a reroll per round for free.

(4) Overstock refreshes missing options in the shop on purchase, so often you get extra value upon buying it

red lagoon
thick geyser
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You’re not going to buy one over the other because you have other options, you won’t buy it because it’s not worth its price

red lagoon
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That's not my point. If reroll value is changed to be a better version of a different voucher then we have missed the mark on rebalance

thick geyser
gloomy edge
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I think an interesting way to balance it would be something like "rerolls cost 4", which gets rid of the scaling cost of rerolls. This would give it an actual use case in money builds where you can reroll a lot more now, without making it too broken otherwise (still worse than overstock for non-money builds)

mint wedge
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These daily-ish polls are getting less and less daily

quiet compass
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would rather Thunk be coding than writing Polls and reading the discussions lol

mint wedge
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Yeah ig

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There is roughly a poll every 0.804 days or about 1.243 days per poll

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(46 days, 37 polls)

quiet compass
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Nearly all of the polls so far have been about collecting data to aid with game design decisions. I'm glad/surprised we've gotten as many productive polls as we have