#Joker Ranking Results

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

sand escarp
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🧵

undone sapphire
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ok

dark void
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Gros Michel not in S, so sad…

undone sapphire
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loyalty card in b is sacrilege btw

dark void
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Only 4 D-tiers is pretty cool

undone sapphire
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easiest non-blueprint s tier of my life

winged mist
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Hehe… A+ joker’s in A tier.

tulip atlas
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I agree with that list overall

undone sapphire
winged mist
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Shocked hiker’s a D tier

spice flax
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Having any combo of the S rank jokers would probably be a winning run lol, so seems like a reasonable list

tulip atlas
undone sapphire
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and that's x16 with blueprint

tulip atlas
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I mean

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it takes up a slot for 5 turns and then is good

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but then the next blind you cant use it

undone sapphire
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or any glass cards

tulip atlas
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trust me its not s

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consistency is why blueprint is ssssss

undone sapphire
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i will die on this hill

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(supernova is b tier anyway)

tulip atlas
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supernova is c tier

undone sapphire
tulip atlas
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only good for mid game/high card

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I love how people are using the previous thread and not this one

sand escarp
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What I would like to do next is:

  • weight each vote 1-5 (5 for S, 4 for A, etc.), then find the average score for each Joker to create a true ranking from 1 to 45
  • Find the standard deviation of that average score, which should represent the 'range' of how good the community thinks the Joker is
tulip atlas
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yeah

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cant wait to repeat when full release comes out

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imagine the arguing then

misty perch
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I'd love to do this again w the full list

dark void
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I love stats

sand escarp
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I definitely will do it again

dark void
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Hell yeah

undone sapphire
misty perch
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This community tier list is what butter is to a sandwich

broken harness
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Gonna post my descriptions here again

misty perch
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Not required, but by god does it do wonders

broken harness
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The most agreed upon joker of each category:
S: Blueprint with 99% votes for S, only 1 vote going to A and 1 to B and the other 239 to S. Yoikers!
A: Golden Joker with 56% votes for A, barely edging out the 55% both Mystic Summit and Blackboard got
B: 59% people agreed that Droll Joker is B, making it the most widely agreed upon rating in the game. Huh.
C: Regular Joker got a 51%, beign the most agreed upon C tier.
D: Ceremonial Dagger lands at 66% D tier votes, being the most voted D tier. Yikes!

The least agreed upon joker of each category:
S: This honor goes to Supernova with just 37% votes for it being S tier, ahead of 34% votes for A tier.
A: 8-Ball got 36% votes for A tier, just behind it getting 34% votes for B tier and 16% votes for C tier. Very split!
B: Dusk got 33% votes for B tier - a third - and still got put into B. 28% for A, 19% for S and 13% for C. Wow!
C: The To-Do list got with 39% votes for C tier, with 29% on D and 21% for B. Interestingly this card is NOT the closest to drop to D - Marble Joker has 40% votes for D but has 41% for C tier
D: Hiker is the most least agreed upon D tier with 51%. That's a lot and the highest of any tier - it means the cards people think should be D tier A LOT of people think so.

broken harness
misty perch
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Supernova kind of works against itself and stops you from getting the crazy mults bus gives which keeps it out of s for me, but I can understand why people really like it

misty perch
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I mean, it's okay to have things that are worse than other things. It's what creates interesting strategies

undone sapphire
dry niche
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loyalty and dusk surpised me with their ranks

misty perch
spice flax
upper trout
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loyalty in b is crazy lol

spice flax
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would you rather win every round, or every other round?

undone sapphire
misty perch
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They speak facts

spice flax
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Loyalty cannot trigger 2 rounds in a row

undone sapphire
spice flax
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?

torpid nova
spice flax
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oh tru

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Loyalty x Burglar is pretty epic

undone sapphire
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and blueprint

spice flax
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without burglar though, there is no amount of thinking out you can do

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you literally just don't get it every other round

misty perch
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I mean, if a combo really requires a specific synergy to be good then is it a good synergy?

undone sapphire
spice flax
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unless you make Loyalty not win you the round by playing a bad hand, at which point- why have loyalty?

undone sapphire
spice flax
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are you able to consistently get loyalty to hit every round?

misty perch
undone sapphire
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dopamine = good

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thank you for coming to my ted talk

misty perch
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Yeah, but we're not ranking them on how much dopamine they give us

undone sapphire
misty perch
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We're ranking them on how much we would want them to appear in any given run

hollow steppe
undone sapphire
spice flax
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ye

hollow steppe
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if you want to rank by some other metric, go ahead, but don't make it sound like other people are just being dumb

misty perch
undone sapphire
spice flax
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you can absolutely vote based on how much you like the card

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but we're just as valid for voting on how much we don't like the card lol

undone sapphire
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anyway, this argument is kinda pointless
i will keep liking loyalty but i will now shut up about it lol

spice flax
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I don't want just big number, I want big number that equals win

misty perch
upper trout
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I guess the structure of this demo (where the final boss follows another boss) doesn't help the card, but i think 'throwing' to get it to line up with the boss can make it very potent

spice flax
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Burglar + Loyalty is a really interesting combo that I will be looking out for though

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because it suddenly turns from super inconsistent to guaranteed every round

paper tiger
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To that one person who put blueprint in B, you made history.

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The one singular person to not vote it on S

spice flax
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B for Blueprint

misty perch
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Son of a cussing cuss word

pine flax
misty perch
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It really isn't though. Fishing for a foak to allow for a near guaranteed win is a decent trade

spice flax
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Dusk can trigger every round, loyalty can't

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(unless you have burglar)

pine flax
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but dusk trigger doesn't get you much, loyalty is guaranteed 4x mult

spice flax
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yes, but you need to win every round

pine flax
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it's dope for high score builds when you have glass cards

spice flax
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if you're winning the rounds you don't get loyalty to trigger on, you don't need loyalty

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if you don't win those rounds, well then you lose and the run is over

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if you're coming from the perspective of "I want to get the highest score possible, even if I lose several runs trying to get it", loyalty is probably one of the best cards

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most of the people here are probably on the perspective of "I want to win as many runs as possible" though, which is very different

pine flax
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I'm coming from the perspective of "I want to win as many runs as possible", which loyalty is better at

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huge winstreak guy

spice flax
wary burrow
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the voices

pine flax
spice flax
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what does that have to do with my point?

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Dusk is guaranteed to go off every round. If you can win without it, it would still have made an impact if you needed it.
There will be rounds where Loyalty just went off to make you win the previous round, and thus you will not have it even if you need it next round.

pine flax
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It's not guaranteed to go off every round

spice flax
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it's guaranteed to be possible to go off every round

misty perch
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It literally is

spice flax
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you could always have a last hand

pine flax
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ah okay that's what you mean

spice flax
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also, the difference between x4 mult and triggering every card an additional time is huge.
Dusk is a decent bonus that can give your last hand a sizeable boost when synergized with card enhancements or other jokers, but having those card enhancements or other jokers means that your deck is in a decent position without Dusk, so you might not need it every hand. It is basically there as insurance to make your last hand huge if you get down to it. (I am not personally a fan of Dusk as I would rather have Jokers that prevent me from needing to play down to my last hand every time, but in any case-)
With x4 mult, if you are in a position where you are needing that in order to win the rounds, you are probably going to lose on one of the rounds where Loyalty just triggered and you don't get it until next round.

pine flax
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it's not about using it as a consistent point of mult to win a round, I agree if you need it you're in a losing position

spice flax
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well, if you don't need it and it is inconsistent in that it doesn't trigger every round, why have it? especially instead of a different Joker that could be guaranteed to trigger every round and give you value?

pine flax
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oh I'd much rather have another joker, just not dusk

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Because if I need either of them, I'd rather have loyalty

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but if my deck is strong enough, I likely don't need either of them

spice flax
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🤔

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I personally don't agree with picking loyalty over dusk if I needed one of them, but I do agree I would much rather have another joker for consistency besides either of them lol

faint gate
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IMO loyalty and dusk are around the same - loyalty has the benefit of early-one-shotting blinds to get economy from extra hands, dusk has the benefit of being consistent

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both are "only good if you're behind" type of jokers

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(or going for a high score run)

dark void
dim dirge
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supernova in S tier is crazy

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scary joker above to do list is worse

spice flax
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Are you an abandoned enjoyer

dim dirge
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perhaps

spice flax
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think of it like this:Supernova is a mini bus

faint gate
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but it's retroactive!

spice flax
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but it works even if you pick it up late yeah

faint gate
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still, I agree that supernova isn't as good as bus

spice flax
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If you've been playing Bus and see supernova, supernova is probably very good

dim dirge
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in demo its probably like b tier but in full game it might be different

spice flax
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I like bus a lot because I am an abandoned enjoyer, and when I ride the bus Supernova is basically Blueprint lol

faint gate
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the benefit that Bus has over Supernova is that high cards feed Bus but not Supernova

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(unless you have a high card run)

misty perch
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You can easily get 40x mult with bus, but rarely get above 30 with supernova

spice flax
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30 is still like
a lot 😅

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it is higher than any joker that has a liner + Mult value on it lol

hollow steppe
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you can also use bus's stacked mult on anything that isn't face cards

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meaning you can stack up with high cards and such until using your main big hand last

misty perch
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That's why I would put it at the top of A tier

spice flax
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I think that's fair

boreal shadow
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can I say that everything manage to fit nicely on a normal bell curve that slightly askew towards S tier?
pretty nice

broken harness
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Really good design

spice flax
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yee

misty perch
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100%

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If everything had the same effectiveness to use, then it wouldn't be fun

dark void
sand escarp
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Sorry for the incredibly dense data - some interesting things here though

image.png
misty perch
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As an informatics student, sheets are my passion

dark void
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Droll Joker being 2nd place for most agreed in B tier is really funny to me

torpid nova
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Cartomancer put up a good showing all around

misty perch
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Banana 😢

solar onyx
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Superposition at second worst joker is a crime

sand escarp
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One of the more interesting things I see is that Supernova finished below 2 A tier jokers in terms of average tier and still finished S

misty perch
dark void
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Man, I live for this kinda data, thanks for sharing local

sand escarp
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NP, so do I!

misty perch
solar onyx
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And dagger

misty perch
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I know I know, I wasn't being 100% serious

solar onyx
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I can't read sarcasm through a screen, I ain't quite that skilled enough yet

misty perch
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clue's in the caps, man

dark void
misty perch
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I'd honestly still prefer hiker over superposition tho

sand escarp
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FYI that middle table is what I would consider to be the official community ranking for all the Demo Jokers

misty perch
torpid nova
solar onyx
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Smeared don't deserve S lol

misty perch
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It really doesn't

undone sapphire
sand escarp
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I mean according to the data... it does 🤓

solar onyx
misty perch
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I can't argue with the fax man

undone sapphire
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smeared is a solid a tier, and supernova is b maybe c

solar onyx
misty perch
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Still can't believe 8 ball is so high

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I used it once and it was good, but it needed serious setup

sand escarp
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I trust the cohort more than my own opinion here (I personally disagree with some rankings but I hold more value in data sets than anecdata), in addition to this being an incredibly interesting dataset for me to just look at it's also informative of how a fairly large sample of players feel about every card

solar onyx
boreal shadow
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also Blueprint has 0.02 spread and everything else is just explodes
so I think we can make the joke about Balatro player has no free will when Blueprint shows up in shop

dark void
misty perch
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Must... use... blueprint...

steep cove
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really cool to see the weighted average data, its like a ranked list

solar onyx
sand escarp
dark void
misty perch
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Maybe some unique sound effects for the worse cards?

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That'd add some oomf to them

solar onyx
misty perch
sand escarp
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I have used this example a ton before, but when you hang a picture on a wall it is more important to line it up with the floor, the walls, the ceiling line, etc. than to use a level to make sure the picture is exactly even. Even if it's technically worse it feels better, and that is the goalpost

misty perch
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I like your funny ideas, magic man

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but srsly tho that would make sense

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I'm no game dev; I trust you know what's best for the game

spice flax
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Dusk has the biggest spread, very interesting

misty perch
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If the debates I've had with people in chats are anything to go by, I can see why

sand escarp
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My guess there is that it's at a cross section of difficult to use/understand and incredibly powerful for high score runs

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I actually would have thought the votes would be an inverted bell for it

spice flax
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well I personally don't like it too much because I want to win in as few hands as possible because money

dark void
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It isn’t particularly useful unless you have a decent amount of enhanced cards or card-specific jokers

spice flax
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but I can see how it would be cool, especially in a bus run where that isn't the case

misty perch
spice flax
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A2345 + Fib + Dusk 😩 👌🏻

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actually that's worse than all evens with steven lol but it feels more satisfying for some reason

dark void
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Throw an Odd Todd in there too 😳

sand escarp
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If anyone wants to farm free Karma on https://www.reddit.com/r/balatro, feel free to post those snips of the final tier list and the larger data table, they might like it there

misty perch
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Ah, reddit. May their API rest in shambles

faint gate
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oops, misread this

prime gate
hoary tendon
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Super interesting poll, ty for running this localthunk! I feel like it's the closest a tier list has gotten to matching my thinking lol, stuff like dusk or loyalty card jump higher for high score runs but aren't always game winners on normal runs

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I think having everyone rate based on their own metric made everything even out in the end lol

vernal portal
vernal portal
vernal portal
vernal portal
vernal portal
faint gate
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can we do a voucher tier list next?

paper tiger
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And Spectral tier list!

faint gate
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ooh, spectrals will be very divisive

vernal portal
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I think it could just be cards

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Like Tarots, Planets, and Spectrals

silver sable
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they did my boy gros michel dirty

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💪🍌

last slate
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I so hope dagger gets mire synergy in the full game

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Rn its a garbage money sink without very good rewards

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You would have to have the most rediculous money build know to man to afford to get to to cracked levels

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Or an egg

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One requires extreme luck

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The other requires extreme waiting

dim dirge
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new buff: dagger gains mult equal the the sum of all jokers in hand sell values every hand

misty perch
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That would be OP. Imagine getting +10 mult every blind without needing to get rid of anything

last slate
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I feel like ceremonial dagger should, at the start of the blind, destroy all cards to its right

misty perch
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Agreed, but that doesn't fix the massive money sink it still is

last slate
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I mean its def a card that would need a super money focused build

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Golden Joker and Delayed Gratification at the least

misty perch
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It could make for an interesting build, agreed

last slate
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Rn it simply does not synergise with money cards

misty perch
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It's in a spot where you either don't have the money for it or don't get the mult you need

last slate
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You can buy a ton of jokers but it has a hard speed cap

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It def could make purely money focused builds more viable

misty perch
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It'd be interesting and unique, that's for sure

faint gate
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what about "When Blind is selected, destroy card to the right and gain its sell value. +1 Mult per $1 sell value"

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(+2 mult if you want it to be overpowered)

dark void
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Isn't that what it already is?

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oh no i see

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thats pretty interesting

misty perch
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So it gives an instant small mult boost and is easier to ditch?

pine flax
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same mult boost but also sells for more

dark void
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im particular to making it a scaling xMult (like somewhere between x0.1 and x0.05 per sell value), but id be alright with something like that too

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it makes it only temporarily cost a lot money instead of permanently sacrificing your income for mult

dim dirge
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i think it gaining its buy value makes much more sense

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but also like egg dagger doesnt exist then so maybe not

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ok how about buy value + its sell value

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destroying my negative legendary joker for a smooth 50 mult

faint gate
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it also gets debuffed by Clearance Sale 🤔

hollow steppe
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eh, current dagger does too

misty perch
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One of my most hated things about the game is that clearance sale affects sell prices

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I guess it kind of makes sense, but it nerfs tarot and planet cards by a lot

vernal portal
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I think Dagger would benefit from Jokers that have buy/sell synergies. Super Auto Pets had animals that grew stronger as you bought or sold other animals, so that could make you gain more value for each $ spent in Dagger