#Bosses like the Psychic and hand bonuses

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

lean fractal
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I know that there are benefits and drawbacks to having the uncounted Psychic hand trigger 'play' effects, but should they count or not? Which is more intuitive?

Some examples of things I'll need to standardize: Ride the Bus, ice cream, DNA, Runner, To Do list, probably more

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I want to make it consistent and choose the more intuitive route before fixing these bugs

broken python
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I guess it depends on how you interpret "Must play 5 cards", I personally assume it means "Must play 5 cards, otherwise you discard what you played"

uneven ridge
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To answer this question the first thing I did was double check the exact wording of The Psychic, which is "Must play 5 cards". I think the basis of the problem is that The Psychic's wording doesnt actually tell you what would happen if you dont play 5 cards, it implies that you can't play the hand at all which makes it inconsistent with current gameplay even ignoring joker effects. Imo The Psychic (and similar boss blinds, like the arm) need to be changed to something like "Must play 5 cards to score", which implies you will earn no score if you play less than 5, but the hand still plays (same as current behavior)

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Yeah we had a similar issue mcpower

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If you go with mcpowers updated text, you wouldnt trigger any effects, if you go with mine, you would trigger all of them

broken python
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"Must play 5 cards to score" is a more reasonable way of interpreting it, and aligns more with other boss blinds for debuffing cards (those cards don't score)

uneven ridge
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My point is that neither is intuitive at the moment because the intuitive interpretation is that you cant play less than 5 cards at all, but you can

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yeah thats probably why my head jumped to it at first

lean fractal
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The bigger issue is the inconsistency, not the wording, because if you experiment one time you should know from them on how it works

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All of the bug reports/complaints have been about the inconsistency

uneven ridge
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Id rather everything trigger honestly

broken python
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hm, would it be an issue if it became "All cards are debuffed unless 5 cards are played"? that'd make the boss blind slightly easier and make it very consistent

uneven ridge
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I think it would be unintuitive if they didnt trigger, since you are playing a hand, its just been "disallowed"

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Its not really the same as discarding, because you arent discarding

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so it should be treated the same as the button you hit, which is play

broken python
lean fractal
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Wording/effect will be the same, triggering/not triggering bonuses is all I would change

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I was leaning towards nothing triggers

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But sounds like you both would assume everything triggers?

uneven ridge
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Nothing triggering is like a discard, but you didnt discard, you played

broken python
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that was my initial assumption - nothing triggers and the hand is effectively discarded

lean fractal
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Duality of chat

uneven ridge
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in my mind its just a hand that was played but not scored

lean fractal
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I guess I intended it to be a pseudo discard

uneven ridge
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since thats whats happening on screen, you hit "play" to play cards, and then they dont score because it wasnt allowed

lean fractal
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Because you messed up

uneven ridge
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thats unintuitive imo because i didnt discard and it didnt use a discard

broken python
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-1 hand, played cards aren't treated as discarded for some jokers, no jokers trigger (for example, DNA), and would count as a hand for jokers that depend on "first hand" like DNA

lean fractal
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That honestly would have been my assumption too

uneven ridge
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part of the reason I want things to trigger is because there is strategy in playing cards outside of scoring, and I like that strategy being maintained

lean fractal
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The strategy will emerge once I have a solution

uneven ridge
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fair yeah

lean fractal
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I know it's definitely 'better' for the hand to count

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But it makes all the bosses easier and less of a challenge too

uneven ridge
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Oh I wasnt thinking 'better', moreso just more interesting

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you have to sacrifice hands for 0 score to continue leaning into your strategy

broken python
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I think it's more intuitive that hands don't count at all if disallowed by the blind

uneven ridge
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vs just not being able to utilize whatever you have going on

lean fractal
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If I do that, then those bosses might be a good way to farm scaling too though

uneven ridge
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i think if its treated like a psuedo discard, the text needs to change, because nothing implies that playing cards in this context is actually a discard instead

lean fractal
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I'd rather they were ruthless

uneven ridge
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like im fine that plays with less than 5 cards are actually discards, but i wouldnt know that

broken python
lean fractal
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I thought 'not allowed' does that pretty well, but that's something I need data on

broken python
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I view debuff bosses as a "lighter punishment" than no-hand-allowed bosses

lean fractal
uneven ridge
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debuffed cards are explicit ahead of time though, there is no way to actually know what will happen on a boss like the psychic the first time you try it

lean fractal
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'not allowed' to me implies that it's not allowed to trigger anything either

broken python
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very silly idea: when a hand is not allowed, the blind icon moves from the left sidebar to the centre of the screen and visibly eats the cards instead

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(this is a joke)

lean fractal
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Hey that's related to the poll I was going to have today 🙂

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It's about boss blinds

uneven ridge
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👀 excited for that

muted turtle
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i think it should trigger the abillity's

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the description talks about activating when played

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you played the hand

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it might not have counted, but you still played it

echo sierra
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i can see both sides , but my assumption when reading it is "Score 0 points when playing less than 5 cards," but that a hand has still been played. So my assumption would have been that things like DNA, Ice Cream, Loyalty Card, Ride the Bus, etc would all count it as a hand being played but no points are scored.

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Having said that, I would have no issue with either final decision by the dev/community so really it's just pick one or the other imo

muted turtle
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Dna, Bus, Supernova profit from triggering, Loyalty card is situational and Ice cream just loses chips

cursive dawn
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when i saw “must play 5 cards” i assume the hand is burned (discarded) and nothing triggers nor scored

longer wording may be
“Must play 5 cards or the hand is discarded instead”

we could have a daily vote on this. i am ok with one way or the other as long as it is consistent