Cleaner Balancing

[twilit spire]

Cleaner is too op. If there is like 7 bodys in one room cleaner can clean all 7 bodys in 5 secs why? Because there is no cooldown on cleaning. Cleaner just seems like a op version of scavenger. My idea for balancing is.....

Idea,

Add clean cooldown.

How will it work?,

Below cleaner name there will be a message saying " can clean:false or true ". If its on false then cleaner can't clean bodys. Pressing report on bodys while on false will make cleaner report it instead and if its on true then cleaner can clean bodys. Cleaning a body makes it go from true to false. Being on false means your on cleaning cooldown while on true means your cleaning cooldown is up and your ready to clean. Killcooldown and clean cooldown are different.

Settings

1. Killcooldow:10-60 secs
2. Clean cooldown: 10-60 secs.

[shy stump]

I kind of understand where you're coming from, but I don't think I've ever known for a cleaner to come across that many bodies, plus the fact that if you set the kcd high on a cleaner they're pretty much a little better than average anyway, but that's just imo

[tribal shadow]

Clean limit

[twilit spire]

Cleaner is just a op version of scavenger so it makes sense to nerf it

[shy stump]

I could not disagree more, I'd say scavenger is the OP version of cleaner, cleaner leaves evidence behind, scavenger doesn't

[twilit spire]

Evidence?????? Np it's not like public players are smart enough to use that either

[shy stump]

You do know that a dead body is evidence compared to no dead body at all, right?

And you are also aware that you don't react to your own posts, right?

[twilit spire]

You can cancel reacts?

[twilit spire]

I mean most of us do that anyway 🤷

[shy stump]

Not true, only 3 people I've seen do it so far, I check lol

[twilit spire]

There is definitely more then 3 people

[shy stump]

let me rephrase that, only 3 people that are regulars with coming through the discord and making suggestions a decent amount

[twilit spire]

Scavenger is less op because cleaner can clean any body while Scavenger only remove the bodys they kill

[twilit spire]

Am I one of them

[shy stump]

the fact I've removed your own reaction to your own posts at least 4 times today, yes lol

[twilit spire]

Oh now I get why my reacts were going away

[shy stump]

scavenger is more OP because you don't actually know it's a scavenger until late in the game, if you find a body you can't report then you instantly know it's a cleaner and people get hyper focused on people who stand over bodies not reporting; because either it's the fact they can't report it, or they recently cleaned it.

[twilit spire]

Long story short both of them are op

[primal cairn]

#1104501693967777864

[twilit spire]

Your one is tohtor version

[shy stump]

Just because another mod is using a setting doesn't mean it can't be used anywhere else

[primal cairn]

open source code === they let everyone else use that code

[twilit spire]

Never said it was a problem lol

[primal cairn]

just like how TOHE forked TOH, TOH TOR forked TOH, and then TOH added code from TOHE, etc.

[twilit spire]

All the mods help each other to get ideas

Lol

[primal cairn]

Why #1104501693967777864 is better than a simple clean cooldown, is because the clean cooldown still doesn't prevent you from instantly cleaning a body you just killed. Imo it should work like in TOU-R and TOH TOR

[twilit spire]

Okay what I meant if the clean cooldown is 25 secs then after a meeting is over your cooldown is reset then you can't clean until 25 secs after you clean your clean cooldown will reset again

[primal cairn]

Ok, but the clean cooldown should also reset when you kill

and vice versa

[latent jackal]

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL Okay bud.

[primal cairn]

it's true wdym

[void heron]

No he's right

Cleaner actually is incredibly overpowered

Scav is also overpowered

[latent jackal]

Oh nah,I don't disagree with the fact that it's OP.
I disagree with the fact that it's more op than the scavenger.
Scavenger don't leave bodies. Cleaner however, do
You'll know there is a cleaner way sooner than you'll know that there is a scavenger.
Cleaner you can track down/figure out who it is by getting information of locations while with scavenger you have nothing to go off of.

[void heron]

I'm not saying Cleaner is more OP than Scav, I'm saying they're both OP
I do agree that Scav is more OP than Cleaner, though
I thought you were saying he wasn't

[shy stump]

What was being said is that: "Cleaner is more OP than scavenger, which is why it needs a nerf" I personally think it doesn't need changing because they're both OP but people find scavenger perfectly fine, yet that's MORE OP than the cleaner so I see no reason for a nerf

I will say though, it can have a optional delay between killing and cleaning, but that's about it.

[twilit spire]

@latent jackal @shy stump @void heron okay guys we are in a weird situation
If we nerf scavenger then it will become a worse cleaner
If we nerf cleaner it will become useless when we can have scavenger
What do we even do now

[shy stump]

...just not change it at all because it's fine how it is?

[latent jackal]

It's hard to balance such an OP role, so yeah, I'd either just leave it or maybe do give delays between kills and cleaning.
For Scavenger maybe give it a certain time until it disappears after a kill?
I dunno, I never have either of them on. Pelican is hard enough to track as it is, don't need an Imp in my lobby that can have additional teammates (1-3, depending on gangsters and madmates) clearing them.
A scavenger with even a slightly decent teammate will make sure Scavenger makes it through the game without getting voted out.

[void heron]

I would say this:

Make it so that Cleaner can only clean when their kill cooldown is up

And Scav can just have a really long cd (like 50 seconds)

[latent jackal]

Scav with a 50 second cooldown will just never have the ability to kill in a decent lobby.
I have Virus at 30 and even then its hard to go a round a lot of the times without a meeting being called.
You'd have to have a really passive game for Scavenger to thrive with 50 seconds, but it would push passive crewmates.
That and also if there rolls out little neutral killings that game, Scav will have zero chance as crew will just finish all their tasks.

So yeah, Scav is a hard nut to crack when it comes to balancing.

[void heron]

While this is anecdotal, I'd say that when I use Scav with 50 seconds in my lobbies it works just fine

The thing is, Last Impostor will make it too powerful otherwise

[twilit spire]

We can't disappear a body after it been placed

[primal cairn]

what is all of this unnecessary discussion, jesus christ

just add some options to Cleaner. end of story