even if they cut back to 60
#beta-ptr-spoilers
dense plover
we need another row
the rate to level isnt going to increase if they cut the numbers
zealous basalt
Remove talents that no one use at all
dense plover
yes
if it isnt being used or if its only used in high game content, then maybe thats a problem with high game content
a talent shouldnt exist to fix a problem, it should exist as a choice that changes your playstyle
zealous basalt
Well
Tbh there are talent builds for leveling and others for endgame raid
dont know if it can be considered an issue
dense plover
blackout combo doesnt change the playstyle much - it just makes blackout kick actually in the rotation vs filler
eh
i think its more that all talents should have some use at all times
some talents are literally only useful when leveling, thats bad
now, if a talent is only for the end game, it depends
zealous basalt
ret paladin has talents that work for cases
dense plover
things like legsweep? yes
that makes sense
same with the ox statue
or the uh, ox minion?
idk i dont use that
zealous basalt
me either
dense plover
some examples of really good talents exist in the brew tree
zealous basalt
why would a tank like a pet that steals aggro
dense plover
or like, black ox brew
its very difficult to use, but if you can use it, its very strong
zealous basalt
but if we go to ww to the last row
dense plover
Brew has a similar issue
blackout combo is used by a majority of brewmasters
its just too useful
zealous basalt
Serenity has less damage in comparison to WDP
zealous basalt
and let's not talk about the legendary wrist turned into a talent
which should be baseline too
Heck, manny things from legion leggos should be baseline
while others are ok to be as talent
tranquil steeple
for chi spent
tropic trail
Besides c&s cuz I want it but hate pvp
I only do it for Azerite chest at the end of reset lol
night swift
Wow Its like they use an existing race model or something
dense plover
^
round lake
LOL
ancient jasper
Didn't Helmets not work on them?
dense plover
theyve worked for a while
ancient jasper
Ahhh must've missed that
dense plover
they use the goblin skeleton
ancient jasper
Well damn
dense plover
there were no changes made to their skeleton for 8.2.5
ancient jasper
And here I was hoping that meant something. Blah
unborn glacier
@tropic trail You get the ticket yet? š
tropic trail
ofc
zealous basalt
inb4 next week azmongold says "spit on those that bought blizzcon ticket for pets"
tropic trail
he can suc my balls if he wanna judge me for my awsome Gillvanas murloc
zealous basalt
does gillvanas have a custom sound
tropic trail
yes
unborn glacier
Asmon wouldnt do that
zealous basalt
orl
terse patrol
ye
flint meteor
Sadly every single year theres ppl who does
sullen dawn
Here's a question
Where the hell was talanji in 8.2.5
And surely the zandalari are no way in hell gonna stop fighting the alliance even if the war 'ended'
hasty tendon
Conveniently swept under the rug.
Tyrande and her are too useful as tools to keep the conflict at least somewhat going.
zealous basalt
I smell stuff bad happening with Zandalar
They are going to be the Horde's elves and worgen
Because so far those races still want each other dead
ember tundra
you mean horde's undead and worgen ?
zealous basalt
I think undead are going to be quiet without Sylvanas
But the zandalari might want to keep fighting the Alliance no matter if they don't have a war chief
Just like how Night elves keep fighting even if the king says stop, same with worgen
That's what I meant
ember tundra
moreover zandalar and horde are allies, if I remember well talanji refused to receive orders from the horde warchief
Ah ok
indeed
unborn glacier
The Alliance murder the Zandalari king. I highly doubt the Zandalari are gonna be like, "okay, I guess we're all peaceful now,"
zealous basalt
Ye
terse patrol
I do think Talanji will prioritize Nāzoth over that though.
She saw the dangers of Gāhuun, which wasnāt even a true Old God.
dense plover
Just gonna paste this here for later so when someone tries to connect shadowlands and old gods I donāt have to retype it
From the tiny bit of lore we have, i personally conjecture that the shadowlands are just a plane of existence that has always existed. Hell, even titan keepers are scared of death. Itās why I donāt think it has anything to do with the old gods - weāve already seen that shadowlands are connected to everywhere just like the dream, and Nzoth corrupted the dream in order to access more of azeroth and spread his influence - if he could already do that with the shadowlands, creation of the nightmare wouldnāt have been necessary
Not particularly necessary at the moment but it will certainly come up over and over during the next month
sullen dawn
We dont know that he wouldn't need to corrupt the dream if hes encroaching on shadowlands
It makes sense to have access to all plands
*planes
I fundamentally disagree with you on this point, and I think if we do go shadowlands, nzoth is going to be trying to take over it
austere gazelle
The old gods, void lords, void in general feeds on souls
What is present in gigantous quantity in the shadowlands? souls.
They apparently needed sacrifice at some points ( tower of sacrifices of Nya'lotah ) and I guess that Nzoth main goal would be to get back in shape before fighting us full front. Nzoth's goal is apparently using the Azerite to reshape Azeroth in his images ( The master hungers, the heart shall feed his waking dreams ). All of what he wants is at the moment, sleeping ( maybe in his dream ) and he wants to awaken everything ( make his dream reality ) > All that was sunken shall rise, all that was sleeping shall be awaken, all eyes shall be opened
he used azerite to broke free, now he probably needs souls
We are seeing the first step of his " awakening " in the wrathion questline since all of Nzoth agents are called " sleepLess "
dense plover
Where do you get that they feed on souls?
Letās start there
They eat anything
Thereās no specifics given
Azerite wasnāt need to feed him
It was used to activate the locking mechanism
And free him
At no point does any of what you said happen
This sounds parroted from a Pyro video
tropic trail
Question regarding azerite. Are azerite elementals just earth elementals infused with azerite, or are there literal azerite elementals?
tropic trail
you know what I think is weird. How the the fuck did Guldan knew about Sylvanas and the hungering darkness/death, that its coming to Azeroth
I understand that Nzoth knows it or even the void
but how Guldan? even an AU Guldan
Erm... maybe some higher power told him so
yea sure, probably Sargeras . But how did he knew?
sullen dawn
To be fair pryomancer makes a lot of sense (except for him pushing Argus way too hard)
sullen dawn
I agree
tropic trail
like all off his theories are connected to those
and I just dont see it like that
unlikely
sullen dawn
But when he discusses stuff in isolation from them I can get behind his points
But I definitely he agrees hes always finding ways to tie stuff to the titans
tropic trail
yea
sullen dawn
Especially argus/sargeras/eonar
tropic trail
thats one of his mistakes, that he hypes about the titans and specially Sargeras and Argus to much and want to connect everything with them
sullen dawn
But hes isolated points points- about old gods consuming souls in shadowlands, the interconnectivity of the forces of the wow universe etc..hes really good at explaining his views, and they're logical
Then he ends by saying...and it's all due to argus!
And it all goes out the window
dense plover
He doesnāt have any source for all his stuff tho
Itās theories presented as facts based on nothing
dense plover
He says āX shows Yā but it doesnāt
sullen dawn
Hes theorizing
dense plover
Yeah but he doesnāt tho
Hereās whatās happening is not the same as I think
And the titles and cards are way too click bait on top
sullen dawn
But you often say stuff like that
sullen dawn
Like you said 'dragon isles is happening' - not - I think it is
tropic trail
my biggest problem is, that he refuses the Chronicle (or some parts about it) and literally says that some stuff is not true there
dense plover
Yeah I said that in the context of hereās where I think the expansion is going
sullen dawn
And if I'm wrong about that - just goes to show it's easy to misunderstand people
dense plover
Yeah if you analyze my individual sentences, but Iām also not making videos
sullen dawn
But he talks in context of where he thinks the lore is going
Ok that's a fair point
About sentences vs vids
Easier to critique long form video
dense plover
My problem is that people treat his videos as fact and he doesnāt push back
Along with that, his theories are shit
They sound great until you analyze them and realize they donāt even have a lore basis most of the time
Pyro is the one who was going around saying that chronicles isnāt necessarily true
He was the one who went and started the whole thing about it being written in universe when the writers have been very clear that it is told from a lore perspective, not from some character in universe
lone marten
He says that chronicle is made up by the pantheon sigh
dense plover
All his theories go back to making up shit about chronicles based on how certain images look and are bullshit
He is not a good source of lore
His predictions are worse than bellulars
And he does nothing to stop his fan base interpreting his videos as true
The last one imo is the real kicker because it shows that either he is totally disconnected from the community, that he has some sort of superiority complex about the accuracy of his guesses or that he wants people to spread his bullshit
Thatās why I donāt bother with anything he says and why I donāt bother to even consider his ātheoriesā because at a core level he is either an idiot or an asshole
If your fans go around spreading your āloreā as fact it is your job to correct them. If you are encouraging that, then you are the problem
tropic trail
Probably gonna start my YouTube channel soon, but I'll do gameplays, not lore conspiracy
sullen dawn
niiice Honkerton, good find
storm marsh
And I oop-
terse patrol
I know it wonāt happen, but I hope the Shadowlands has non-Azeroth dead races.
Like, things we havenāt seen before.
strange falcon
well,that would only make sense if the shadowlands isnt affixed to azeroth
like a layer ontop of the reality the characters are in
instead of another "world" entirely
terse patrol
why would the āevil death thingā just happen to be in the part of the Shadowlands with Azeroth
We see the Shadowlands touches all of existence
pulsar iris
well if the shadowlands is affixed to azeroth, then every planted has one. as we seen right above, draenor also had one
sullen dawn
If it did Honkerton, i assume we're going to be in the 'Azeroth bit' of the shadowlands
tropic trail
zealous basalt
NANDA
flint meteor
NANI
pulsar iris
KORE WA
mystic heart
Pls no
Stop :D
limber mural
mystic heart
We need intrigue for blizzcon! :D
long blade
pulsar iris
i hope you're right peach
dense plover
literally no other option makes sense
like, are they gonna talk about 9.0 at some other convention?
there arent any in between blizzcon and gamescom
not any major enough for an expac
this blizzcon will focus on 9.0
thats why we got the war campaign conclusion
because 8.3 is focused on the conclusion of bfa
nzoth's already been released and sylvanas has abandoned the horde - if those are the plot points neccesary for 9.0, they wont spoil anything about 8.3 by focusing on 9.0
tropic trail
if its gonna be similiar to patch 8.2, then we will see the first content preview of 8.3 next week
and then 1 week after the stream the first build (most likely encrypted) on the PTR
uncut vault
Hereās hoping itās an actual PTR this time
pulsar iris
why would it be this time?
unborn glacier
They won't want the ending of BFA to be spoiled
pulsar iris
neither will they want new features to be tested?
i mean 8.2.5 didn't have new features. but we expect 8.3 to have something
unborn glacier
I'm basing my opinion on 8.2.5. I highly doubt there won't be heavy encryption of all lore related things in 8.3
pulsar iris
well then they can stop wasting money with a ptr server
junior prairie
8.3 ending leaked: we all gather beer and get n'zoth drunk š
tropic trail
There will test some stuff about 8.,3 like they did with 8.2.5 . all the important things like Raid and such
while probably encrypting the lore
unborn glacier
@junior prairie Finally, the Pandaren will be relevant again
junior prairie
š
pulsar iris
no. it will be dwarven beer and elven wine
pulsar iris
we give them nightborne arcwine
pulsar iris
no panda shall be relevant ever again
junior prairie
@unborn glacier Is your icon a nelf or a helf or belf? š sorry just love the artwork
unborn glacier
Chen saves us all by flooding Nzoths prison with the strongest Stormstout!
@junior prairie Whats the difference? š
junior prairie
oof gotta do me like that š
pulsar iris
is loyalist?
unborn glacier
Yes
junior prairie
Oh very nice š
pulsar iris
yes
terse patrol
"but the announcement will be at blizzcon!!!!!" @dense plover
drifting vessel
any new sub races inc?
drifting vessel
i know, im living in a dream world
dense plover
vendor build is literally just a labeled build with nothing in it
we dont get to download it
we cant see whats in it
terse patrol
It's basically just saying
dense plover
its like seeing the label on a box and then asking the ingredients
terse patrol
"might be out in a week or two."
dense plover
when we only know the name
flint meteor
Damn sweet
flint meteor
Atleast we know its coming soon
drifting vessel
lets hope we get info soon
drifting vessel
Yeah
dense plover
either next week or the week after
flint meteor
Im fine with that
drifting vessel
i can wait
flint meteor
If therrs a live stream that is
flint meteor
Would be boring if they just keep quite like 8.2.5
dense plover
8.2.5 wasnt kept quiet
it was a small patch
they talked about the features
there just werent many
its gonna be a livestream because its a major patch
unborn glacier
I think Fuji is refering to the lvl of encryption
dense plover
that likely wont change
unborn glacier
^
dense plover
maybe slightly? but tbh, its probably just what we should expect. Hopefully they will unencrypt some stuff so datamining doesnt become boring
unborn glacier
It is my opinion that, this is likely to be the future of lore and important moments going forward
dense plover
well, no
they still need to test most quest lines
and music and such has no reason to be encrypted if not in cinematics
unborn glacier
I have a love/hate thing with datamining. But, imho, I think it's a net negative that kills hype.
dense plover
thats ridiculous
imagine 8.2 without datamining
no music until release, no sound bites, no mob models
unborn glacier
IMO, I prefer the surprise
dense plover
then dont look at it?
unborn glacier
Thats where the love/hate thing comes in
lol
I do hope, going into the future, they keep a lid on things a bit more. I think its better we have to explore in-game to find out the depths of a patch, than to have it datamined before hand. Just my opinion. We all have them. And don't get me wrong, I enjoy the glimpses into the future, but thats because Im human and this coincides with the whole "path of least resistance" ordeal that is part of who we are.
something something instant gratification something something
pulsar iris
i don't get too much excited about something if i don't get spoilers about it
uncut vault
8.2.5 just left me with dread and then depression once it came out, I'd rather get my feelings about how good or terrible something is in doses
instead of all at once
green laurel
hey @dense plover can you stop making bad points as to why the leaks are somehow deconfirmed, there is no reason why they would use the new ghost models to represent normal npc/player ghosts
"the naming schemes for stuff dont match how wow does expacs"
would love for you to explain that
also "nyalotha isnt in the shadowlands - that wouldnt make sense. If you have the shadowlands, the emerald nightmare isnt neccesary"
pls explain why it wouldnt be necessary
"The emerald dream can be described in one sentence" but the shadowlands cant? it's literally just the place where you go when you die. You can somehow say thats more complex than a different plane of our world that is actually a blueprint of our world created by titans that represents n unchanged version of it?
zealous basalt
ah shit here we go again
zealous basalt
ironically
green laurel
for some weird reason he presents these statements as though they somehow completely negate the leaks from being possible
and he does this expecting zero pushback. I don't understand why he feels like he has to do this
maybe just because he isnt particularly interested in that side of the story and doesnt want an expansion about it? I have no clue
I honestly dont understand how he doesnt get banned here for just blatantly lying to people speculating about the next expansion
zealous basalt
You didn't get banned back there for your attitude so...make the maths
round lake
I was right about 8.2.5 release, so expect something for 8.3 between oct 14-19th
green laurel
joey I was actually going to say the same exact thing
my reasoning was
the sale for bfa ends on the 20th
so they could like advertize that for the week of release
@zealous basalt you dont get banned for pushing back on misinformation being spread by a blatant liar
zealous basalt
Calling out names is against the rules, TJ
green laurel
?
zealous basalt
Calling peach a liar just for debating against a leak is too far
green laurel
he's blatantly misinforming people talking about the leak
zealous basalt
You are speaking subjetively
green laurel
just read his comments
zealous basalt
If you believe that the leak is true, then it's good, if he believes that the leak is false with points to debunking it, it's good as well
I too, believe it is fake
green laurel
he states multiple times as though the leak has been completely been deconfirmed
zealous basalt
On some parts
green laurel
it's not even the debating or his points thats the biggest problem
zealous basalt
While most of the rest has been deconfirmed by happening and breaking a pacing
And the rest, are things that logically would happen
green laurel
the problem is that he acts as though they had already been deconfirmed in some other setting outside of here
when someone mentions it
he goes
green laurel
"thats already been bunked"
zealous basalt
events*
green laurel
"thats already been confirmed fake"
zealous basalt
Again
green laurel
thats his reaction
zealous basalt
Through events
green laurel
thats misinformation
zealous basalt
Not really
It can't be misinformation because
The leak is just a leak
A "theory" to be correct
Whenever is correct or false is up to speculation
zealous basalt
Because, as I said before
green laurel
when you know it hasnt been
zealous basalt
The pacing of it through the in-game events have been broken
Or happened differently
And most of the people will believe what they believe
Don't get too feed on it or you can get baited
green laurel
if I came in here and asked 2 weeks ago and asked "will saurfang die in the next patch?" and I rolled up and just nonchalantly just replied
"no thats been confirmed fake for awhile"
zealous basalt
"If you"
green laurel
is that not misinformation?
zealous basalt
And it never happened
green laurel
would that not be misinformation
zealous basalt
It would, but your example is badly performed
Everyone here had bets of Saurfang dying this patch
green laurel
lol please tell me the differences between my sitation and what hes doing
okay and tons of people have bets of shadowlands being real
tons of people dont
tons of people had bets he didnt die
tons of people had bets sylvanas dies
your not describing
the difference
between my sitation
and the reality of what hes doing
zealous basalt
The difference is how much you put attention to the game
green laurel
????
zealous basalt
I will be frank here
If you believed that Sylvanas was going to die soon, you either don't play or don't put attention
zealous basalt
If you believed that Blizzard did cut 8.3 to make 9.0, you either don't play or don't put attention
green laurel
my situation
green laurel
please tell me
how it would mean
you arent paying attention
to know if the leak
is CONFIRMED fake or not
zealous basalt
You are going to make me read that leak again, don't you
green laurel
no
its just logic
he's misinforming people by saying something has been CONFIRMED to be fake without ever witnessing evidence to support it
if I flipped a coin and told you ITS CONFIRMED that it will land heads
without me actually knowing
if its heads
thats me lying to you
green laurel
but the way he words it
its as though
hes heard other people
confirm it to be fake
so like if I flipped a coin
and told you
hey some other guys told me
that coin is rigged
and always lands heads
zealous basalt
Irrelevant
zealous basalt
Also please, don't split text
green laurel
then that is lying
please tell me how its irrelevant
hes acting as though he has heard second hand knowledge from others that it has been confirmed fake, when the reality is that the only basis he has for his conclusion that its fake is from his own theories and interpretations, then hes lying
please read this
before replying
thats why ive been splitting text
to make it small for you to read before splitting hairs on a previous point
zealous basalt
And where is your reasons to believe it is not fake? Like really, post them
green laurel
jesus
you dont even understand what we're talking about here, it's as though you have completely ignored every word ive written
I even made them in short bursts to help you read along with the logic
green laurel
the thing you're asking me to defend isnt the thing im defending
are you fucking joking
zealous basalt
Then don't make a fit about it, shesh
green laurel
!?!?!? are you fucking trolling?
you're intentionally not even reading the words im typing
fuck off if you're going to intentionally sound like a fucking complete idiot
zealous basalt
I am not trying to
green laurel
fucking bad faith trolls in this chat i swear
oh so you're just blatantly ignoring what i'm writing so that you can completely miss every point im making
and you're not trying to troll
yeah
it's like im talking to a 5 year old when you completely miss the point intentionally and reply with "Then don't make a fit about it, shesh" when that doesnt even logically follow the conversation preceding it
green laurel
lol says the dude who goes out of his way to lie to others cause he just doesnt like the way a story is going in a video game
dense plover
Tbh, donāt bother pinging me, I have you muted. I donāt give a fuck what you say
zealous basalt
I am reading what you write but can't really get how your logic works, you are blaming on peach for "misinformation" on a leak that have some points debunked by playing in the game and other points that are true already. And there are other points that apparently will happen in the other expac or not. The theory sounds really bad on some parts, and has people have said before, some theories that are more closer to the real idea of every expac aren't...that logic or close to the expac.------Really, some points are just copy paste from 8.2.5 notes that wowhead posted and wroten in a way that it'd tie in the story...Which are what are true atm.
Now on your part, you aren't being clear whenever you come up and antagonize peach...to be honest thought it feels like you both antagonize eachother...but that's another thing. You don't really come up with a good defense of the theory rather than "explay why it doesn't make sense" that's not how debates work man.
dense plover
Iām going back to watching the dark crystal now
green laurel
you're not going to explain why you lied and told people the leak is confirmed to be fake multiple times?
zealous basalt
When you are in defense, you are expected to come up with a good evidence against whatever the other party sets up, and not just "it doesnt make sense" "don't be a liar" and such
green laurel
My defense isnt that the leaks are real
zealous basalt
I give up
green laurel
my defense is that the leaks are not 100% confirmed fake as peach tries to lie about
frigid crater
insults can't foster healthy discussion
zealous basalt
I tried Uchur
zealous basalt
I am not the one calling out names against the other people here, Tj
green laurel
sorry should I have not had such a fit about that
maybe i should just ignore everything you say
intentionally
zealous basalt
And now that is acting passively agressive
green laurel
dont have such a fit about it, shesh
green laurel
I'm not defending the leak as real, I'm saying peach is lying when he tries to tell people that it has somehow been confirmed fake by unnamed sources
zealous basalt
Then post something that say that it's not confirmed fake
terse patrol
As someone who knows Pyro
Thatās BS lmao
š
Iām friends of his ex-mod team.
zealous basalt
Just like how people thought BfA would end in 8.2.5
terse patrol
hE wOuLDnT LiE
zealous basalt
Mass mentality is dangerous
tropic trail
Lol
green laurel
its not possible for me to say that it is not confirmed fake, for similar reasons that peach can't claim it is confirmed fake
thats the fucking point
zealous basalt
Calm down, no one is insulting
green laurel
like if you dont get this now after what I just said
its unbelievable
and if you dont get it after all ive said before that
its still unbelievable
zealous basalt
Peach, in the past, along other multitude of people have...been very clear about the discussions they had about the theory
That is...the claim in this case, as the people here have proven to be...very wise in WoW, lorewise at least
And thing is that
The theory has been talked about so many times, that the people in this channel get really bored whenever someone touches the point, which is why some can be really dism---dismissing
zealous basalt
das not a gif
zealous basalt
I have multitude of problems with gifs
it is not funny
We are in 2019 and the chrome browser can't distinguish about copy and paste a gif with an image
zealous basalt
no bruh
dense plover
Have a good day
tropic trail
So 8.3 vendor
zealous basalt
If that happens pls
tropic trail
It's the most likely tbh
zealous basalt
I just hope in next xpac they focus about what monk players say
tropic trail
It'll be a location for sure
dense plover
Itās gonna be one location - itās a patch
And people hated the no flying on argus - so probably flying after beating the story or a few weeks or something
Seriously tho Iām gonna sleep now
zealous basalt
Don't
green laurel
black empire would be neat but I think that would be like the patch after next patch
zealous basalt
Sleep is for the week
That's what you get for playing Destiny 2 all night and day
green laurel
black empire could also come next patch idk
green laurel
junker gnomes rather
zealous basalt
And what it's the parity?
tropic trail
Vulpera probably
green laurel
mechagnomes lack emotion, junker gnomes are so much more plausible to me
zealous basalt
Aren't mechagnomes and junker the same
zealous basalt
I think Dukk meant those
tropic trail
Blizz calls the junker ones Mechagnomes
green laurel
really?
oh well before mechagon was released for years people wanted mechagnomes which before mechagon meant the early ancestors of gnomes
tropic trail
Ye
green laurel
so i always thought of mechagnomes as being the fully robot ones
tropic trail
I want my Adeptus Mechanicus gnomes and Deep One Samurai
zealous basalt
weabo
tropic trail
We might get four ARs in 8.3
green laurel
so that would be vulpera, mechagnomes, the tall fish dudes and the short fish dudes
zealous basalt
Wait, we had the same amount as 7.3
green laurel
maybe not the tall fish dudes actually
tropic trail
More than likely Vulpera, Mechagnomes, Ankoan and something else Forsaken-related
zealous basalt
we don't really have short ars
tropic trail
Yeah, I don't think Gilbins are that likely
tropic trail
Ankoan are more likely than Saberon or Sethrak
green laurel
I dont see anyone out there like WISHING we had the two fish pun races in the game
green laurel
jk ankoan are cool i take that back
but no goblin players are like
GEE i wish i could be the same exact thing but with fins for no reason
green laurel
vulpera and ankoans confirmed here first
folks its done
then later they will release ogres as the pandaren-esque neutral....allied...race...
neutral...allied...
that makes sense sure
green laurel
oh no i was just joking
cause like i was basically trying to decide for myself which ones i would be happy with
tropic trail
They didn't?
I think gilbins aren't gonna be playable. Too similar to goblins
i want Ankoan to be a playable race so bad..
The fins might look awkward though
Clipping through a lot of armor
i dont care how they look we need a race like that on Alliance :p
FOR THE ALLIANCE!
round lake
I see a Loyalist faction and a Night Warrior faction springing up
When you want to PvP youll be fighting for the Loyalist/NW Factions becuse I see PVE being something you can do with Ally/Horde
tropic trail
It can't be worse than Elf ears and eyebrows
ancient jasper
Night Elf ears have enough strength to pretty much literally poke holes in any known substance. š
hasty elbow
imo if Lightbounded Undead did showed up in 8.3 as a new faction(similar to Lightforged Draenei in 7.3) the 4 ARs might be Mechagnome/Vulpera & Lightbounded Undead/???(idk may be San'layn? )
and I hope they will added more classes combo in the next expac like Nelf pally.
sullen dawn
Mechgnomes/vulpera/redeemed/darkfallen is my guess too
And potentially tortollans for panderan even though I didn't think they'd get one before, my mind is slowly changing
strange falcon
as of right now
tortollans have the least chance of getting in
simply because of the shell
it's baked into their model and cant be removed
so every single gearpiece would clip through
round lake
Well maybe they can add some good AR and opening quest content for em. However I am hoping that 8.3 adds some good content overall because I dunno if they are gonna do another WF since well the "war" is over
and it just seems/feels it was abandoned
storm marsh
I think they will add darkfallen at some point. That would make them A LOT of money
strange falcon
MORE ELVES
strange falcon
too many clashing classes
they had to butcher warlocks to make dhs already
they would have to butcher warlocks even more,and DK too
to make necromancer
really unlikely atm
round lake
Just improve class design
vernal juniper
if the leak will be real, this make sense with the cinematic
round lake
they def could add more but I think they should improvew on what they have first
strange falcon
i mean,i dont think "just improve class design" will cut it for a necromancer class
especially since unholy DK is literally about resurrecting
and having an army of skeletons/ghouls
round lake
When I say improve class design I mean worry about the current ones
we dont need necros right now
or any new ones
fix what we have first
strange falcon
and demonology warlock is about having an army of demons,which you could argue,is things necromancers do
vernal juniper
usually we have a new class every 2 exp, so is pretty normal if they add a new class on 9.0 DK 3.0 PANDA 5.0 DH 7.0 NECROMANCER? 9.0
strange falcon
tinker is the class that's most probable as the next one
round lake
If it s a new class itll be Tinker
strange falcon
i already showed you more than enough reasons
vernal juniper
this time can be a ranged dps since we have no ranged dps from vanilla
vernal juniper
necromancer fits as ranged dps
round lake
Tinker could fit ranged/heal/tank
strange falcon
we already have tinker gameplay examples from the opposing AI teams in Island expeditions too
strange falcon
mechagon is all about tinkers
yes,tinkers can be ranged dps
with guns and turrets
round lake
Wandering ranged bots yup. However I dont know if they will add a new class, yes every other we have however it doesnt mean its guaranteed
vernal juniper
I know mechagon is about tinkers, but nzoth is about void/necro so, need to w8 next week for the 8.3 patch
strange falcon
i gave you SOME(not even all) evidence leading to how making necromancers right now
is not in blizz's best interest
vernal juniper
or 1 month for preorder and early access
strange falcon
from a resources standpoint
if you will continue to ignore my points and hamfist your theory
this conversation ends now
vernal juniper
thats you assumption, you can think what you want it dosen't make them the truth.
strange falcon
evidence is not "thinking"
round lake
We dont even know what we are dealing with next also just because Nzoth is void means nothing.
Logically Tinkers make more sense
strange falcon
it's like saying blizzard will make nagas playable with 9.0
the amount of work that would entail
already tells you,it is a very unlikely idea
round lake
AI has already been used for Healing Bots especially in the Goblin Crew during Island Expeditions
vernal juniper
since cata
strange falcon
the model doesnt work
upper remnant
Tbh necromancer would fit as a demo skin
vernal juniper
well also the part of "model is already on island expedition" to me means nothing. for example
strange falcon
like shadow hunter,necromancer doesnt have enough ground to stand on as it's own class(that is without completely annihilating 2 specs on 2 different classes)
vernal juniper
On legion jumgle we had felmages, with all their spell book. we haven't a playable felmage spec now so.
vernal juniper
that was mop
upper remnant
Which makes them warlocks by definition
vernal juniper
I never seen a warlok casting a fel flamestrike
upper remnant
You are being purposefully obtuse
Have you never seen a warlock using felfire ?
vernal juniper
round lake
I said nothing about model I said AI Healing Bots, is already working and tested, Mechagnomes already implemented, with different types of aesthetics. The resources are already there so logically putting that evidence together it makes more sense at this time than Necromancers
upper remnant
Mages all use arcane
While Warlocks all use fel
round lake
Im not saying its going to happen it just makes more sense at this time
vernal juniper
used by
upper remnant
Yeah that's their name
vernal juniper
clearly not warlocks
upper remnant
You know it's just a name right
They can be called fel priests for all I care
They are still warlocks
ember tundra
warlock is a "fel mage"
upper remnant
By definition it is yes
ember tundra
so by definition they all are warlocks
upper remnant
They are just called "mages" become they were mages prior to learning fel magic
So it's not comparable in anyway with Tinkers who are completly new, have three distinct specs already, working new mechanics, a lot more spells, story focus and all that in one expac
strange falcon
also,some group of people has wanted tinkers for a long time
like another group has wanted bards for a long time
ember tundra
I just don't understand the point of tinkers
vernal juniper
Anyway next week we probably have a 8.3 build with more info.
sullen dawn
im guessing 15th
vernal juniper
what do you except to be on 8.3 build IF we are going with thinker class
upper remnant
Nothing
strange falcon
tinkers wouldnt come on a 8.3 patch
sullen dawn
well tinker wouldnt be until 9.0
strange falcon
^
upper remnant
^
sullen dawn
and they're probably gonna hide the story stuff again
vernal juniper
well, on the end of wod he had a "legion" raid for DH
don't you think we will have any clue at all?
round lake
"WoD had a Legion raid for DH" huh
sullen dawn
the tinker team on islands, mechagnomes, the gallywix fight
upper remnant
The tinkers clues, if they are to be a new class, already happened
strange falcon
wod was a trainwreck e.e
hellfire citadel was supposed to be an orc raid
with shattrath as the fel raid
but yeah
vernal juniper
@round lake "hellfire citadel" got a lot of demons etc...
sullen dawn
regardless, that's just tying into the legion expansion as a whole, not specially demon hunters
round lake
and youre connecting that to Demon Hunters?
upper remnant
8.2 got a lot of machines
vernal juniper
why not?
upper remnant
That's enough
round lake
I guess what ever you gotta use whatever you can so you can try to make your point of view makes sense so have at it
sullen dawn
there may well be tinker hints in 8.3 but I don't expect them to be front and centre. if the leak is true we'll get a cinematic at blizzcon showing gallywix unfreeze mechatorgue and then theyll introduce tinkers with the expansion
vernal juniper
@round lake this is called internet, everyone is doing it. Never seen how they are tring to explain every "leak" ? š
sullen dawn
hopefully we'll get a blizz stream for 8.3 in next 2 weeks but It'll go over the features, zone and raid, not something that would just be a hint for 9.0
upper remnant
Mechagon is just as much a "build up" as Hellfire if not more
sullen dawn
slock, I think joey was talking about you š
vernal juniper
could be
upper remnant
Monks didn't got a lot of build up prior too
sullen dawn
agreed Marchelune
vernal juniper
@sullen dawn to be honest is the same thing other are doing to explain on how thinker will be next class
round lake
Yea however theres using the evidence you have and making and educated guess then theres just making things up to fit your narrative
strange falcon
this really sounds like that one flatearther comedy sketch,where the evidence against his theory is like a whole massive archive,and then the evidence for it,is one small piece of paper
and he goes "i knew it!!"
was pretty funny
sullen dawn
haha
upper remnant
There could be no new class too
It's just that Tinkers are the more probable from what we have
vernal juniper
we have a turrent on island -> next class will ne thinker. Ok.
sullen dawn
no ones saying we're getting tinker slock
just that it's most likely if we do get one
upper remnant
^
bold granite
I know there is zero hope for it. Bit tide sage would be dope
strange falcon
tidesage are already kultiran shamans
upper remnant
Obviously they wouldn't do a mono-race class
upper remnant
They are a mix of shamans, mages and priest tbf but it's just like nelf priestress of the moon or trolls shadow hunters
It's a mix
sullen dawn
yeh those kinda 'classes' won't happen, they're way too specific
upper remnant
^
sullen dawn
the only way I see a shadow hunter for example is a 'class skin, it's just a rogue available to trools, with some sort of equivelant for alliance'
but they'd need like 15-20 class skins to make it fair across the board, seems like an allied race type system
or the class version of 'allied races'
upper remnant
^
Necromancer could also easily become one
sullen dawn
but in terms of 'normal' classes remaining, the only ones I can think of are Tinker and Warden
strange falcon
inb4 bard
sullen dawn
yep! necro works for locks too
bold granite
You think tide sages are shamans? I always pictured them as a frost mage and shadow priest.
round lake
or a new spec to current classes
upper remnant
They use water and storm too @bold granite
strange falcon
laughs in druid 4 specs
round lake
lol
upper remnant
But also shadow and arcane
bold granite
@strange falcon booking is SOOOO hard for me to play for some reason lol
Any talk on allied races before next xpac
bold granite
@strange falcon always the bottom dps when i play ot lol 410 and only pull in 10k dps
strange falcon
unless something changed in 8.2
balance was a pretty high up dps
do you have 0 haste?
or terrible azerite traits?
uncut vault
If they were going to add a death related class again at this point, it would probably be dark rangers anyways. Mail is in the most dire need of a class, and 8.2.5 sets up the dark rangers staying loyal to Sylvanas and going off to do death stuff with her
sullen dawn
again dark ranger would probably just be a hunter 'class skin'
uncut vault
Only as much as shadow priests are mages that deal shadow damage
sullen dawn
failing that it could be a hero class, but I feel having all three hero classes be 'dark' is weird
tropic trail
if dark rangers are just marksmanship hunters , then priests and warlocks are just mages
same for rogues and warr and pala
uncut vault
The whole spec idea behind old survival Hunter is fully open for dark ranger to use, especially since it was the spec with black arrow
sullen dawn
nah
strange falcon
i mean,at the end of the day,blizzard can do whatever they want
sullen dawn
you have to look at it from a gameplay/systems perspective, not just lore
strange falcon
if they want to figure out a way to make dark rangers distinct enough from hunters
they'll do it
tropic trail
I am talking about gameplay perspective
sullen dawn
dark ranger is too specific to make an entire class around, unless as i suggested, they make it a hero class ala demon hunter
tropic trail
Its not
uncut vault
All classes from here on out will likely be hero classes
tropic trail
you say its too specific because you think only a hunter can use a bow?
sullen dawn
but then our hero classes would be death knight, demo hunter, dark ranger....starting to see a theme š
uncut vault
Because of legion class halls and artifacts
sullen dawn
no
tropic trail
while all the other meele classes uses always same weapons
uncut vault
Blizz isnāt going to make those for new classes
uncut vault
And we conveniently have nelf dark rangers now
Led by a woman who is no longer explicitly horde
sullen dawn
we have nelf 'dark wardens'
tropic trail
right. Im not saying that Dark Rangers are going to become the next class, I think TInker is more likely, but you can 10000% make a Dark Rangers their own class
tropic trail
if you dont agree on it, you lack probably on creativity
uncut vault
People said the same thing about DH
sullen dawn
no need to insult me
tropic trail
its not an insult
sullen dawn
also, i run a tech company, plenty creative š
uncut vault
Too similar to rogue and warlock, would fit better as spell effects for rogue
strange falcon
DH was on the vanilla boxart though
uncut vault
Not enough gameplay design to make a whole new class out of DH
strange falcon
blizzard wanted to make them ever since tbc
tropic trail
Dark Rangers were there since WC3
sullen dawn
i think warden is much more likely than dark ranger
tropic trail
Again, Im pretty sure Dark Rangers wont be a thing as a class, but it can be 100% their own class
sullen dawn
i mean lots of things could tilted, im not saying it 'can't' be it's own class
just that it won't
strange falcon
i will state it again, if blizzard wants to do it,they WILL do it,but as for me,i do not think it's happening any time soon as a full class
tropic trail
I think (dark)warden could be a part of the dark ranger spec, but then we would go with a "elven only" class
which is super unlikely
since we have such thing already
sullen dawn
warden is easier to make available to other classes i think
strange falcon
well,we got so many elves now,a elven only class wouldnt be that much of a constriction
sullen dawn
and likely 'ranger' would be part of the warden class, not the other way around
uncut vault
Warden has more of its abilities stolen by other classes than Dark Ranger š
sullen dawn
dark ranger is never gonna happen imo
tropic trail
say never never
sullen dawn
if it does it'll probably be a 'class skin'
dense plover
Turrets, alchemical healing, electricity stuff
sullen dawn
unless wow is around for 15 more years
sullen dawn
tinker is highest probability imo
round lake
Healer and ranged
sullen dawn
followed by warden, followed by something dragony
tropic trail
what need more then a healer, is another mail wearing range DD
dense plover
We have an island, we have a starting zone, if we get mechagnomes that would help too
sullen dawn
well tinker would be both titled
tropic trail
I know
sullen dawn
mail healer, ranged DD, tank
tropic trail
thats why I think TInker is the most likely class
uncut vault
Tinker and Dark Ranger are the primary two with story hints right now, mainly tinker
dense plover
Donāt know if we need another tank, but it could definitely be done via a mech
sullen dawn
yeh it could be two dps specs instead
tropic trail
its gonna be Tinker or a (un)Death Class.
sullen dawn
i feel the mech thing suits tanking though
tropic trail
one of the 2
dense plover
Might just be two specs like DH
strange falcon
the island expedition teams for goblins and gnomes have a tinker team,constituting of a mech-suited tank,a healer with bots,and a ranged dps with turrets
tulip sun
Oh my
dense plover
And it would probably start at level 107 and finish itās starting experience by 110
sullen dawn
ill finally roll a goblin if we get tinkers
strange falcon
we have the goblin ones,gnome ones,the lightforged ones
already being used in the game
etc
tulip sun
They'd likely have to be edited a lot and newly models made
I could see a generic horde and alliance ok ne
One
dense plover
Might not need too many edits. All mechs use the same skeleton and share animations
And they have a lot of animations
upper remnant
I would prefer if tinkers were quite restricted race wise but a lot diverse in their skins a bit like druids
upper remnant
I would be fine with even just gnomes and goblins
But I could easily see Dwarfs and Mag'har/orcs
And then maybe Draenei and Forsaken
But only if they each are unique
strange falcon
I dont think dwarves
Maybe dark iron
Since they have golems
Dont see orcs either
Draenei lightforged could be since they have many "engineer" npcs
upper remnant
I think Maghar are more probable yes
strange falcon
Dont see forsaken
upper remnant
Dwarf have a lot of meca stuff though
Even regular ones
Forsaken are more a foil to Draenei in that scenario
Because they could fit if their skin is unique enough
strange falcon
Not likely imo
upper remnant
Draenei with magitech and Forsaken with Alchemy
strange falcon
If you let in forsaken,you could even make the argument for belfs
upper remnant
No
upper remnant
They are magic
strange falcon
Yeah,if alchemy works,and magitech works
Why cant magic work
You either make it very restrictive in what goes,or everything goes
upper remnant
Alchemy is the healing spec of tinkers so it's that far
And magitech isn't just magic
Magitech is basically circuits powered by arcane cristal instead of electricity
Whereas straight up magic is just enchanting a golem
And again I said I would be fine with just goblins and gnomes
strange falcon
I am quite sure belfs also have Crystal powered golems,and a bunch of starting zone quests involve collecting them
upper remnant
It's not really the same though
terse patrol
Belf golems are straight up enchanted.
strange falcon
Its blizzards decision e.e
terse patrol
Same with dark iron golems.
strange falcon
If they want to make dark iron tinkers,theyll find a retcon around it
upper remnant
DI have mole machines but I think dwarves fit it more/equally
With their tanks
And being close to gnomes
strange falcon
Also,IF mechagnomes DO make it in
AND get tinkers
Youd need someone on the horde side thats an allied race
To get it too
Blizzards very stingy about its faction balance
sullen dawn
vulpera?
upper remnant
Well the balance is a bit looser on allied races
sullen dawn
they're not that 'mechy' but they do have a lot of inqinuity so i could see them being tinkers
upper remnant
There are still more horde druid races for example
sullen dawn
i imagine a lot of races will get tinker
strange falcon
I mean,wasteland mechs
Is the entire concept of Mad Max
So vulpera tinkers wouldnt really be that out there
sullen dawn
gnomes, mechagnomes, human, dranei, lightforged draenei,, worgen, goblins, vulpera, undead, orcs, mag'har,
agreed
maybe not worgen
upper remnant
I fear that if a lot of races get it they would just bother doing a horde / alliance theme
sullen dawn
true
maybe cut out human and undead
4 on each side
gnomes, mecha, draenei, lightforged
goblins, vulera, orcs, mag'har
upper remnant
As of right now I don't see vuleperas>forsaken
Their most advance tech is the wheel 
strange falcon
Have you seen mad max films
sullen dawn
vulpera tinker is such a cool theme tho
upper remnant
Yes
sullen dawn
even though i hate vulperas
upper remnant
But there is nothing showing that
strange falcon
Set in the desert,using scraps found in the dunes, vulperas have already been established as very crafty
strange falcon
Im not saying its going to happen
sullen dawn
think star wars sand peole
upper remnant
The "scraps" aren't mechanincal at all as of now
sullen dawn
*people
upper remnant
I personally think a blight theme would be just as cool :)
sullen dawn
agreed
but then as you said lots of races getting it and it might just go generic A/H
instead of goblins getting their own mech theme etc..
upper remnant
Yeah that's why it was my wild third choice
Gnome/Goblin 100%
Dwarf/Maghar 75%
Draenei/Forsaken 30%
If I had to guess probabilities
storm marsh
I just want to say, if Belves get Tinkers (if that's the next class) then it would be logical for void elves too
And btw. Since there is a vendor 8.3 ptr build, i suppose we might get a livestream before this month ends
dense plover
^ next week with ptr the week after, maybe announcement of stream sometime today or tomorrow
Aka āTune in next week to see what the future holds for BfAā
upper remnant
They shouldn't take a longer schedule than 8.2's considering they wouldn't want to make it too close to Blizzcon so it has to be soon enough
dense plover
Yeah thatās why stream next week, ptr the week after
That way they have a build for the floor
Maybe a new dungeon?
We really need a new dungeon
upper remnant
There should be a new raid but yeah it won't be ready that fast
tropic trail
Did someone say new dungeon? With new transmog gear?
dense plover
There will be a new raid, but thatās useless for a floor demo
upper remnant
True
dense plover
You canāt run a raid demo
And we have only gotten a megadungeon
Legion got 2 additional dungeons - the to@b of Sargeras one and the Argus one
tropic trail
Do you think Nathanos will be killed in the next raid?
storm marsh
So Dragon isles 8.3 ?
I mean what else could be
With dragon aspects and their essences
tropic trail
I honestly really wanted to see a duel cutscene between Mathias Shaw and Nathanos