But for the night elves
#beta-ptr-spoilers
uncut vault
newest xpac, newest rules
hollow dock
for this one time
tropic trail
I think that it's inconsistent
hollow dock
it's willing
It is
it 100% is
but
that's facts
For right now, with the night elves, it's a choice
For derek, unclear
doesn't sound like a choice but fuck it
dense plover
maybe their pact with sylvanas allows them to raise anyone using her power, but nathanos doesnt have that
hollow dock
this is what blizz says it does now
Remember
horde doesn't bend to simple things like rules
terse patrol
question
tropic trail
Blizzard need to make up their minds or follow their own set law
terse patrol
if people raised into undeath choose to come back according to sylvanas
why have we never seen the valkyr fail to raise someone
meager zodiac
night elfs at least do
hollow dock
that's the thing arcane
terse patrol
đ¤
hollow dock
horde
doesn't
follow them
they are the love child who gets all the plot
so they get all the breaks
dense plover
sylvanas isnt there in darkshore
just nathanos
maybe they need the power sylvanas has as a result of arthas raising her as a banshee
hollow dock
in the end none of this matters
Horde got the excuses it needed to win
that's the end ofit
tropic trail
I see no reason for the undead night Elves to join Sylvanas
terse patrol
nobody answerin my question ffs
hollow dock
we see people fail to be risen
dense plover
i just tried to honk
hollow dock
in darkshore honk
that's why no one answered you
they updated darkshorein the last build
dense plover
"sylvanas isnt there in darkshore
just nathanos
maybe they need the power sylvanas has as a result of arthas raising her as a banshee(edited)
"
hollow dock
the night elf resurrections do fail
terse patrol
good
terse patrol
then this is the first time
dense plover
maybe thats the only reason they cant be forced
terse patrol
^
terse patrol
"ffs we have to listen to our own rules now" -blizz writers
tropic trail
QA team has to deal with all the shit the story dept thinks of
tropic trail
They can't, would make them look bad
tropic trail
I mean if they were to respond that on the stream would look bad.
hollow dock
they're not on stream tho
they're literally just testing it internally
like you know they do internal testing on everything they push onto the ptr right?
tropic trail
Oh, you mean the devs, I thought you meant Ion and Lore
hollow dock
it's a picture of poop for me
meager zodiac
i wanna turn myself into a banshee
tropic trail
Get impaled by Frostmourne
tropic trail
Are all dark rangers Banshee?
terse patrol
The originals are.
uncut vault
The original high elven ones are, it's dubiously on the no side for kaldorei
terse patrol
Ye, new Dark Rangers aren't.
meager zodiac
oh that is great
tropic trail
New dark rangers are rubbish
meager zodiac
even tho i will probably kinda vomit inside fighting with sira barking orders
the og scourge campaign had keltuzad, now we get a the stupidiest night elf alive
meager zodiac
like this is supposed to reflect wc3 and alliance gets that feel, horde get nathanos and sira and goblin mercenaries to reflect the wc3 fantasy lul
im mostly saying scourge ffaction in wc3 is one of my favs, and this little forsaken with goblin support is a pale comparison
tropic trail
Forsaken are nothing like the scourge
tropic trail
Only the style is similar
hollow dock
his phylactery was never found and destroyed
Forsaken at this point are literally diet scourge
meager zodiac
yeah, the scourge is kinda fun to play along side
tropic trail
I thought they kept it in Violet Hold or something
hollow dock
Nope
meager zodiac
they are bland scourge
hollow dock
It was never found, never destroyed.
meager zodiac
scourge with no flavour, gluten or salt
tropic trail
Naxxramas part 3 confirmed?
hollow dock
that's during Wrath 2: Electric boogaloo
Where they introduce quest queing so you can que to get quests done even faster
thus killing social contact in WoW even more
and in Wrath 3, Queable guilds
tropic trail
Tuskarr allied race
tropic trail
Won't make a difference, a Lich is a lich
terse patrol
Iâm sure when Kelâthuzad returns, itâll be totally not Wrath 2.0 next expansion.
I do wonder if theyâll redo Northrend to show it post-Cataclysm, or itâll be based in the main world.
tropic trail
We got 4 horsemen aswell
zealous basalt
Acherus<Naxxramas
terse patrol
I imagine Icecrown may have melted
tropic trail
New northrend, put zidormi in all the zones
terse patrol
Lame
hollow dock
Icecrown itself is made out of nevermelt Ice
tropic trail
Yeah in the dk campaign
terse patrol
I mean, they could leave certain parts frozen
hollow dock
the glacier will never actually melt
hollow dock
I'm still very sore over Class Quests
because clearly
some got more work than others
tropic trail
But some were legendary
hollow dock
the DK, Druid and Paladin ones were phenomenally great
terse patrol
Even DKs had some cut content apparently, and last minute retcons
But it was still good
tropic trail
Warrior was terrible
terse patrol
play member of the Valarjar
tropic trail
As a shaman I got Thunderfury
terse patrol
dont get their rep???
hollow dock
You dont even start at friendly for them
terse patrol
Also
The fact that they chickened out on not having lore NPCs who died and joined the Valarjar sucked.
We had the chance to meet King Llane ffs
tropic trail
I'm a warrior, I never wanted to go to fucking vrykul heaven.
No legendary warriors for the warrior hall
Nobody we knew
hollow dock
No varian, no Brox, no nothing
terse patrol
Does anyone have a list of the cut Halls of Valor characters?
hollow dock
Hell we don't even see the first human king who was a legendary warrior that brought the human tribes together
tropic trail
No ANDUIN LOTHAR
zealous basalt
King Thoras?
hollow dock
No Lothar either yea
THE LION OF STORMWIND THAT RALLIED A BROKEN NATION TO WAR
HOW IS THAT NOT WORTHY OF ODYN
tropic trail
The warrior class had so much potential
zealous basalt
Odyn can go suck a big one
terse patrol
"Among the NPCs are a non-diamond version of Magni Bronzebeard ([2]), Thura ([3]), Darius Crowley ([4]), Grommash Hellscream ([5]), Nazgrel ([6]), Jarod Shadowsong ([7]), Kur'talos Ravencrest ([8]), Cairne Bloodhoof ([9]), Urukal ([10]), Broxigar ([11]), a non-death knight version of Nazgrim ([12]), Orgrim Doomhammer ([13]), Anduin Lothar ([14]), Daelin Proudmoore ([15]), Llane Wrynn I ([16]), a non-death knight version of Thoras Trollbane ([17]), Varian Wrynn ([18]), Jubei'Thos ([19]), Marcus Jonathan ([20]), Krol the Blade ([21]), Ignaeus Trollbane ([22]), Korda Torros ([23]), Thargas Anvilmar ([24]), Joanna Blueheart ([25]), Modimus Anvilmar ([26]), Mankrik ([27]), High Warlord Cromush ([28]), John J. Keeshan ([29]), Gamon ([30]), Kash'drakor ([31]), Gorgonna ([32]) and Bragor Bloodfist ([33])."
The Magni one is disconcerting.
uncut vault
hes the 7.2 follower lol
terse patrol
I think the plan was
Some NPCs are still alive.
But some are ressurected via the Halls of Valor.
uncut vault
it was, Thura was also datamined
hollow dock
ah ok
tropic trail
Mankrik lol
terse patrol
Daelin Proudmoore could have been. . . very interesting.
tropic trail
Even the warrior artifacts were dissapointing
hollow dock
I'll be honest
terse patrol
Possibly redeemed in death idk.
hollow dock
I'm not disappointed by the Arms one
but the Prot and Fury ones
Ones some new made up dual swords, when literally tens of others exist in Lore to use, and the scale ofa dragon
that did really nothing
tropic trail
Arms there was a few
terse patrol
Meet non-diamond magni in Halls of Valor.
realize diamond magni is just a construct copy of him
tropic trail
Gorehowl for horde players maybe
hollow dock
Clearly that got cut because Magni isn't dead.
hollow dock
Not really
it completely retcons what happened in Cata
Which was "he does a ritual and becomes diamond."
not "he gets replaced with diamond"
He becomes it. With the diamond growing over him and everything
terse patrol
I mean, the ritual actually killed him, and the copy has all his memories.
That woulda been kool
tropic trail
Any class that was worse than warrior?
tropic trail
I don't play monk
terse patrol
Monk is definitely the worst.
terse patrol
I planned to roll a monk for Legion until I saw how bad the Monk missions were.
hollow dock
that's the epitome of being a monk
tropic trail
Lol that's dumb
terse patrol
Ah, look.
tropic trail
How was rogue?
terse patrol
Sylvanas is enslaving dead Horde.
hollow dock
rogue was pretty forgettable too.
Oh wait
no
It's not
I'm just mentally retarded
Rogue had the most impactful
but least flashy
of all the order halls
They uncover why the Broken Shore was such an utter flop
hollow dock
Shaw and the SI:7 agents were caught by the Legion
the new demon shaw gave the OK to go launch the full invasion
Which is why the shore was such a surprise
The alliance and horde didn't go in blind, they were tricked
Now I do have a complaint for this: As a hordemember you do the same questline
You go and save the alliance.
granted that the champion is neutral
at the very least they could have done was make a similar one on the hordes side
tropic trail
I don't know, never got that high lvl as a rogue
tropic trail
But there was small changes for factions in some class orders
hollow dock
I wish they had one for the horde equivalent of SI:7
but they didn't
horde go and save SI:7 just like alliance do.
tropic trail
The shattered hand?
hollow dock
that's really my only complaint there.
So I'll tack rogue right under the three I mentioned
zealous basalt
I am
hollow dock
cuz while it wasn't memorable due to the lack of flair and flash
zealous basalt
Disappointed of you all
hollow dock
it was the most impactful
zealous basalt
@uncut vault nice reference
tropic trail
Mages were mostly dealing with internal threats,
hollow dock
The rest were boring and forgettable tbh.
tropic trail
Namely Meryl Felstorm
zealous basalt
Is the monkey named jack?
tropic trail
So the only good ones were DK?
tropic trail
I liked legion, there wasn't much lore breaking, or was there?
uncut vault
DH was decent with meaningful choices
hollow dock
Kayn is the canon choice
tropic trail
Yeah, it was obvious
tropic trail
Most DH mains are Illidan fanboys so none would've picked Altrus
hollow dock
Altrus is the, and this is in my opinon, morally correct choice.
He's everything illidan wasn't and being illidan, while it got results, also destroyed peoples lives.
it's why Altrus rebelled in the first place
tropic trail
Reason why we ended Illidan in tbc
uncut vault
he is the morally correct choice, but if it werent a story that needed the same outcome, he wouldnt have been the more effective outcome against the legion
hollow dock
he wouldn't have. We'd have the normal Akama and junk and certainly would probably take heavier lossesont he assault of erm.
tropic trail
Altrus also existed in game long before legion
hollow dock
Whatever legion planet it was.
If the story was like a normal RPG
but we'd have the moral highground and that feels better.
but yea.
Class halls have me real sore
cuz it really feels like a lot just got left behind
in favor for a few
tropic trail
Some of the halls aesthetic was nice
hollow dock
Oh allof them were great to look at
but if I may be crass in my comparison here
so are strippers
tropic trail
I mean at least some fit with the class
Warrior was an eyesore, and priest was weird
hollow dock
that's something I will say: they all do fit with the class
The wandering turtle is the perfect idea and place for a monk. Monks are nomads.
The priest one was a great thematic as it had the dark and light. Everything a priest is.
The extreme dark, the middle, and the extreme light
tropic trail
I feel like the priest hall only appealed to draenei
hollow dock
Warrior was stretching it, I'll admit.
As that was shoving the legion/Vrykul aesthetic down our throats. But that still does fit what a warrior is.
tropic trail
As a human priest I would've preferred a cathedral.
hollow dock
it's notsupposed to be pleasing to look at.
and Arcane, it was a naaru building
it'll mimic and look like other naaru buildings/ships
tropic trail
True, still would've liked a cathedral
hollow dock
all the cathedrals are on alliance land
or infested with scarlet crusaders
the only neutral one that exists belongs to the paladins
tropic trail
Except lights hope and the one in sw
hollow dock
The one in Stormwind is on alliance land
Stormwind is the alliance capital
and Light's Hope is a single small chapel, not a cathedral, owned by a faction of paladins: The Argent Crusade (Now turned into The Silver Hand)
tropic trail
So the Naaru place was the only logical option?
hollow dock
There were no other places to go
and considering the naaru, so far, exemplify the pinnacle of light.
tropic trail
I don't think we'll be seeing Illidan again. What do you think?
hollow dock
Port just thought you'd love to fanboy over the whole Belmont is canonicallyalive
tulip sun
That's cool
Both
I knew Belmont survived but that dialogue is great
I am so glad Faranell is appearing as well
terse patrol
I find it weird that Tyrande didnât kill Faranell of all people.
Let Belmont run and tell Nathanos.
tulip sun
Faranell arrives later or was elsewhere in darkshore
Velonara is also there which is cool
Some of the older...more significant forsaken
Seeing you play as a dark ranger makes me want to have a forsaken elf race
meager warren
so... san'layn?
not sure that would be a forsaken elf but it is an undead elf
tulip sun
@uncut vault Does Velonara say anything?
And sanlayn could work. But just undead elves in general
meager warren
ok
uncut vault
She doesnât say much as actual text but sheâs the questgiver
Both in the warfront and the open zone
hardy hedge
It was ultra obvious Belmont was gonna survive
tulip sun
I want to see more to the dark rangers
zealous basalt
To the or of the
fierce crane
Could always use more elves ÂŻ_(ă)_/ÂŻ
tulip sun
Ignore my grammar đ
sudden oak
there are never enough elves tbh
fierce crane
Who need human potential when we got elves?
strange falcon
hollow dock
Why do people think that because baine doesn't like it that the horde is being fractured by Sylvanas?
hollow granite
Baine doesn't even do anything
tropic trail
In mop Vol'jin was the revolutionary like saurfang, and the other horde didn't do anything untill 5.3
hollow dock
He went revolutionary because he was nearly killed. Saurfang let himself get captured by the enemy, refused to go back with the rescue party twice and decided to betray the horde by turning his back on it.
the differences are not similar
tropic trail
Did'nt sylvanas send the dark rangers in 8.1 to assassinate him?
hollow dock
No. That's the plan B if he didn't come back
Why?
he has state secrets essentially.
You need to make sure the enemy can't use him against you. You're in war
tropic trail
Never played the ptr, thx for clearing it up.
terse patrol
I think Garona might try to stop the Derek situation. Theyâre making him do the same thing Guldan made her do.
hollow dock
She already said "It's a grim thing, but it's gotta be done to win a war"
so no go onthat
tropic trail
People change
earnest violet
Des: Not only Baine dislike what Sylvanas do. Saurfang, Talanji, Rexxar, Lillian Voss also do. Those guys who were main parts of the horde war campaign also dislike what she's doing.
steel venture
Valtrios also doesn't like it either.
They literally all have dialogue about how Sylvanas is making them uneasy.
Baine isn't the only one who has disgusted dialogue about Derek either either, Valtrios blatantly states that Sylvanas is reminding her of the tyrant she just broke free from now.
earnest violet
oh yes, she is too
oh and the Garona part: She already stated that she was "conscripted" into the rank of the Horde and she will act and say things she need to survive
"Seems I have been conscripted into service once again, to carry out yet another master's schemes.
I will do what I must--say what I must--to live for another day.
But sooner or later this war will end. We must be ready for what follows."
basically she doesn't want to tell fuck Sylvanas as it might backfire on her.
hollow dock
Again as I keep repeating this
time and time again
Not liking it, or feeling uneasy, or even a lack of trust, is not discourse in the horde.
Rexxar is loyal to the horde as it's champion, as is Talanji. Voss is one assassin and Saurfang is 1 traitor.
earnest violet
lol. They are loyal to the Horde, not Sylvanas...
earnest violet
guess What Des, anyone can challenge the Warchief
earnest violet
no you shouldn't
hollow dock
OK good then you know the oath
earnest violet
Ok good then you know they will challenge her
hollow dock
Except they wont
just like with garrosh
they won't
They'll wait until it's to far, they leave, and THEN they'll grow the balls to rise up and fight.
earnest violet
Except Saurfang already working on it and if you talk with Baine he highly suggest to had enough and the "Horde need changes soon"
hollow dock
Saurfang is a traitor to the horde.
zealous basalt
Saurfang wasnt able to pull the mak'gora on her before
earnest violet
"Champion, I am[sic] will not hide behind false pretenses. I have come to Zuldazar in part to keep an eye on what our Warchief is doing.
The Horde has suffered enough under dishonorable Warchiefs in the past. I would see that our honor be upheld no matter what." Baine
hollow dock
Baine is not the warrior his father was.
zealous basalt
He isnt doing it because he wants to restore his own honor
earnest violet
actually it was there again in the ptr
hollow dock
has it now? Well let's hope it keeps that way on Live.
Maybe the horde isn't as cowardly as I'm shown it is
hollow dock
PTR or live?
junior prairie
I just watched horde side of darkshore... it's worse than I thought D:
earnest violet
ptr as its the new content of 8.1
junior prairie
the actual warfront, banter between the leaders like Maiev and Sira
hollow dock
Great let's hope that dialogue sticks
cuz everyone was fanning over Baine to standing up during the beta
and his dialogue was changed out
junior prairie
"Maiev will not show you mercy." then in next line from maiev "Stand down
sira, I will not hurt you." and then.. "she spreads lies and destruction." ....as forsaken blightcallers are plagueing moonwells and corrupting tree's and then maiev says "Stop this sira, join your sisters again remember why you fought for us, don't let
them win."
junior prairie
it just feels awkward.. the whole warfront does đ
hollow dock
It's supposed to. It's literally a catfight and we're used as the ammunition in it
hollow dock
welcome to every spanish gathering ever where an aunt and your mom are angry at each other
terse patrol
Sira has no free will.
tropic trail
As undead you do, play the starting of the forsaken zone
terse patrol
Iâm pretty sure none of the dark rangers do.
hollow dock
All of them do honk
It's proven canon that yes
they all have free will.
Darkshore's update changed the horde quest of raising night elves, half of them become whisps when you try to raise them.
the val'kyr refuses to raise them after as they "Made their choice"
tropic trail
It's only Derek who doesn't right?
hollow dock
In theory as it doesn't sound like he was given the choice to come back
If ya listen to him first coming awake
he's confused, and screaming
tropic trail
All the forsaken in the starting zone are like that
tropic trail
Maybe only night elves have a choice?
zealous basalt
Derek seems to be a special case
hollow dock
zealous basalt
He doesnt seem to know what is happening
hollow dock
Just listen Arcane
hollow dock
As in the forsaken starting zone, it's similar to this
If you'll remember
they're just brought back
they're not given a choice in coming back prior to being risen
Thenight elves, for some reaosn, are
reason*
tropic trail
Probably because they're supposed to become wisps or something?
hollow dock
Which begs the question
terse patrol
âI was a maiden, pure and true. A young ranger in service of Silvermoon, betrothed to the nobleman of my dreams.
Then Arthas came.
I fell in battle as the mad prince cut a black scar through the land I loved. But at least I was at peace, I suppose. For a time. Until the Banshee Queen pulled me back from beyond and damned my soul into her service.â
hollow dock
why didn't they all become whisps immediately?
hollow dock
Yes. She's not a night elf.
If you will follow the convo Honk, none of the forsaken from the starting zone are given the choice when they're being risen. Only afterwards.
tropic trail
Helvs and humans had no choice
hollow dock
but for some reason the night elves are.
terse patrol
Itâs bad writing.
zealous basalt
Probably something about the rage of feeling forsaken of Elune?
tropic trail
Elune did'nt forsake them
terse patrol
Except why would she bitch about Maievâs apparently harm of her own people, yet she wants to genocide her own people now?
tropic trail
Why blame elune for your own despair?
steel venture
"BUH DAH FREE WILL.."
Derek.
hollow dock
but won't go full with it
hollow dock
Arcane did you listen to the video I posted?
steel venture
tbh
tropic trail
Yup
hollow dock
OK. Does it at all sound like he was given any choice in coming back?
terse patrol
They wonât got full with it because they know Sylvanasâ fanboys will scream if they found out Sylvanas enslaves souls.
tropic trail
Reminded me of Lilian Voss when she was first risen.
steel venture
which lillian hated the forsaken
terse patrol
And that maybe those night elves who didnt come back were intervened by Elune.
hollow dock
They weren't. They chose to become whisps
steel venture
and that was several years ago when she was first risen
hollow dock
Which again makes no sense
because why didn't all oof them become whisps when they died
like right from the getgo
steel venture
because blizz cant decide on if night elves become wisps or regular ghosts
apparently.
hollow dock
Like I can accept them beocming normal ghosts and stayign in our world
steel venture
there is a lot of conflicting evidence
hollow dock
cuz of the whole haunting thing
that happens a lot
but
if they're not haunting
why aren't they just whisps
tropic trail
They go harvest wood and gold for us
hollow dock
IMO the best way to solve it is outright say, Sira and Delaryn were forced into it
like Velonara
terse patrol
I actually WANTED Delaryn to become a banshee, due to her trauma, like night elves can become naturally. Not get enslaved by the Foreskins.
hollow dock
and then remove all the night elf dark rangers
the horde failed
they can't raise them
daring to say I know
but that's the best course of action
tropic trail
Forced to be risen or forced to follow sylvanas?
hollow dock
yes
terse patrol
Both
steel venture
cause elune either protects them / or night elven spirits are too strong.
also both.
it would make the most sense for it to be both.
no free will
like derek.
hollow dock
Exactly
hollow dock
Have all of the dark rangers they try to raise fail, have the horde fail.
tropic trail
The light that protected Tirion is stronger then elune?
jade basalt
Mind control or something would make more sense than willingly joining the person who literally just killed you and everyone you loved. Sylvanas didn't join Arthas when he did the same thing to her and Quel'Thalas, she was forced.
terse patrol
Sylvanas getting a taste of her own medicine would have been cool. Night Elf banshees who possess their own bodies, and begin a guerilla war against her.
That would have been fine
hollow dock
Exactly, Quiet.
They've removed entire quests beforehand why can't they do that now
why can't they have the horde fail once
steel venture
because they like sylvanas's tits
terse patrol
Sheâs basically Arthas. Delaryn could have been the Allianceâs Sylvanas lmao.
steel venture
her gross. dead. rotten tits.
terse patrol
Except not stupid
tropic trail
Believe me, as a horde player I want to fail. This writing is disgusting.
Iâd prefer the night elf banshee idea
hollow dock
Just anything BUT what we have right now
terse patrol
I legit thought Blizzard was going the banshee route when I finished reading the Delaryn arch in the book.
But nope
Gave them too much credit
tropic trail
BfA's overall writing is bad
steel venture
Even when they do lose they lose with 'dignity'.
hollow dock
"Oh but guys you kill rastakhann!!!!!!!!111111!!!1!1!1111!!!!- Kham"
tropic trail
It affects the nelfs and the horde
terse patrol
Blizzard goes out of their way to make the Horde unable to truly lose.
tropic trail
I don't want to kill rastakhan.
steel venture
EX: Rastakhan's death having a big honorable funeral where everyone is like "Okay, we need to get our shit together, for vengeance."
hollow dock
AND A VAL'KYR WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT YOU WIN SO MUCH!!!111 HORDE LOSES SO MUCH!
tropic trail
That's nothing
terse patrol
Wanna know what would have made that scene better?
steel venture
"WE LOST UNDERCITY REEEE"
sylvanas blew up undercity herself to prevent the alliance from using it
hollow dock
I know I'm just mockingKham for being such a horde apologist
tropic trail
In place of a Valkyr you guys loose Mekatorqe.
terse patrol
If we killed Nathanos, and the Valâkyr sacrificed itself to bring him back.
steel venture
I would've preferred that.
tropic trail
Rastakhan isn't exactly the racial leader for the zt, everyone knew it would be Talanji
hollow dock
"But you guys kill the loa council!!!!11! we lose loa avatars! clearly the horde islosing so much"
terse patrol
Except loa fucking
steel venture
ressurect.
terse patrol
Reincarnate
steel venture
yeah.
terse patrol
Even Shadra isnt dead
hollow dock
actually
tropic trail
Avatars are nothing
steel venture
the fact we're getting zandalari paladins probably proves my theory on the recruitment quest
tropic trail
Not really
hollow dock
cuz what was the point of us stopping the drakkari from eating their loa?
terse patrol
@hollow dock idfk
hollow dock
they'd come back and shit stomp the Drakkari for eating them
terse patrol
That was the one way of killing loa before
tropic trail
Didn't we kill that one loa in wrath?
zealous basalt
"But night elves undead are so cool why delete them"
terse patrol
But apparently Shadra isnt dead when she was eaten
steel venture
i was saying since rezan died
that probably, the horde will help resurrect rezan to prove to them the horde is worthy of joining
and also make sense on why zanda prelates will still be around
its so obvious that'll probably be the route
zealous basalt
"But you guys are winning all warfronts"
hollow dock
And they didn't
steel venture
because bwonsamdi's fucking up
tropic trail
Rezan became undead...how tf?
hollow dock
the community wanted em too
that was Zul's peoples doing
they resurrected Rezan's corpse
but not Rezan himself
steel venture
its like how ursoc was a zombie in grizzly hills
tropic trail
Oh wait, there was an undead loa in the one wrath dung
steel venture
its his body, not actually him
hollow dock
yea as Nile said
steel venture
Rezan's probably in his realm, licking his wounds.
terse patrol
Well
tropic trail
Zan priests still folow him, probably
terse patrol
If Rezan returns, heâd be a baby devilsaur
hollow dock
so do their prelates
tropic trail
Like torga
zealous basalt
Like torga?
terse patrol
Yes
tropic trail
The turtle loa
hollow dock
Torga's being reincarnated in an egg
steel venture
He might be a baby.
He doesn't have to be a baby though.
hollow dock
the massive turtle
terse patrol
Loa inhabit an actual animal.
zealous basalt
Watch the void elves void possessing him
terse patrol
Or person*
steel venture
Torga became a baby because he used an ancient reincarnation spell to speed up the whole process.
tropic trail
Torga is that small turtle on top of one of the tortolans head
terse patrol
Bwonsambdi likely had a troll âmotherâ and âfather.â
steel venture
Bwonsamdi is older than the trolls.
terse patrol
When he last reincarnated
steel venture
He just looks like a troll.
terse patrol
If
tropic trail
How do you kill Bwonsamdi?
terse patrol
He ever did
terse patrol
Bwonsambdi isnât the Loa of Death, heâs the Loa of Graves.
steel venture
And the Dead.
terse patrol
The Loa of Death is Muehzala
tropic trail
We killed the lich king...not really, but we killed his..."vessel", is that the right word?
hollow dock
Bwonsamdi ferries the dead
steel venture
His "boss" is probably Mueh'zala. That's the only Loa that was in Traveler that hasn't reappeared in BFA yet.
tropic trail
Did'nt we kill the avatar of hakkar?
steel venture
Kimbul and Sharda both became story-relevant again thanks to Traveler, and then later show up in BFA.
hollow dock
We killed his avatar yea.
he's been rocking it out in the uh
Shadowlands
ever since
steel venture
ngl
i kind of wish it was just hakkar again with the whole blood trolls thing
g'huun is
kind of lame
not going to lie.
tropic trail
G'huun the "old god"
hollow dock
then again, name an end boss of raid #1 of an expansion
steel venture
yeah, i feel like they could've easily made it so hakkar was one of the first loa corrupted by g'huun
terse patrol
I was hoping Gâhuun would birth Hakkars final reincarnation and we perma-kill him.
steel venture
to explain the whole blood thing
terse patrol
But nah
steel venture
and the whole pestilence, etc etc.
hollow dock
Well the blood thing is explained Nile
They used blood and flesh of Y'shaarj to make G'huun
steel venture
nonono i mean hakkar's blood thing
where like he's got this old-god level of bullshit but its just never explained or given a proper source
he's just "Like Thatâ˘"
hollow dock
Uh
yes?
I just told you
They took the bits and bops from Y'shaarj
that fell back to Azeroth
experiemented with it. Gave it life.
to what ends are unclear, but that's how G'huun was made. When it gained sentience it went rampant and sealed
steel venture
I MEAN HAKKAR.
Making Hakkar, the first corrupted loa due to G'huun's influence would've explained all of the weird issues about HAKKAR
hollow dock
Oh ok.
tropic trail
In conclusion: Titan constructs and experiments are useless
tropic trail
I think Sargeras was the only titan thinking clearly.
hollow dock
No?
All of the titans thought clearly.
What ended up happening is none of the titans saw what Sargeras saw.
steel venture
Sargeras - Good ideas, bad execution.
zealous basalt
Sargeras = Blizzard
steel venture
"The Void is going to consume the universe!"
"How do we stop it?!"
"Kill everything."
"WHAT NO. SARGERAS WTF."
"lol too bad //shank"
hollow dock
More like "WE HAVE TO GO BACK TO AZEROTH. THE VOID HAS TAINTED THE TITAN WE CAN'T LET IT WAKE!"
"WAIT BROTHER, HOW DO YOU KNOW THIS? WHY DO YOU FEEL THIS WAY? WE'VE N-"
"YOU AREN'T LISTENING THIS IS THE END OF THE UNIVERSE!" storms off
tropic trail
I think the light corrupting azeroth would be just as bad
hollow dock
Yea
any extreme is bad
shadow, light, fel, arcane, life, death.
doesn't matter what wins
whoever is at the top is wrong
tropic trail
Titans are beings of order right?
tropic trail
Arcane is their thing right?
steel venture
ye and we know that arcane is actually usually corrupting in the hands of mortals
yknow
"PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWWWERRR"
gets to your head
tropic trail
also attracts the legion
zealous basalt
"Itty bitty space"
tropic trail
But that does'nt apply anymore
zealous basalt
What attracted it was the raw power tho
steel venture
doesn't mean you can still just use it willy-nilly
demons still will come after you, just not the legion as a whole
tropic trail
Sargeras took in too much fel and turned to the shit we see him today.
steel venture
lets not forget how malygos literally nearly destroyed azeroth
i think people forget that
a lot
tropic trail
How is too much life bad though?
tropic trail
The botani?
steel venture
yep
tropic trail
Too much fel = argus, mardum, etc
steel venture
there would be nothing alive but the sporemounds if aggamar didn't intervene.
tropic trail
Does draenor have a world soul?
steel venture
think like uh
kudzu vines
and no it doesnt. so it had an excessive amount of spirit, which fuels life.
hollow dock
To much life strangles out life, ironically.
As the plants remove all the water, the atmosphere, even the very air. And eventually, it all dies into pure death.
steel venture
this is essentially what the sporemounds do
hollow dock
Yup
steel venture
all those bumps are what were trees.
but they've been overtaken by kudzu vines
tropic trail
Does draenor have a world soul?
hollow dock
No
We answered tha tone O.o
Not every planet has a world soul. In fact, it's very rare for a world soul to exist in a planet
tropic trail
Oh sry didn't see
pulsar iris
Is like Malfurion says. Nature will rise against you. đ
tropic trail
Nature exacting it's vengence on mankind
hollow dock
Like I said, I believe yesterday or Wednesday.
When a planet is shaping, 5 elements exist.
Fire, Water, Earth, Air and Spirit.
pulsar iris
6
hollow dock
Only four grow elementals.
tropic trail
The chronicle magic chart thing mentioned all the cosmic forces, elements, etc
hollow dock
Oh you're right
so 6 elements.
Indeed. each planet has all six in equal balance and life flourishes.
but when a planet is made out of a world soul, the soul devours the element of Spirit
so it can live
and thus the elements are thrown out of balance
Que the Elemental War that happened on Azeroth between the four Elemental Lords
pulsar iris
The more spirit a world has, the more elementals wandering around it has. Wasn't it?
hollow dock
Yup. While the less they have, the more destructive they become
pulsar iris
Like Draenor doesn't have a world soul, so it is full of spirit, and the elements are all around
tropic trail
Are elements related to cosmic forces?
hollow dock
yes and no.
They help shape the universe on a planet-by-planet basis
but don't participate or are seemingly affected by the overall eternal conflicts
I would personally say no they aren't but it can be said either way.
tropic trail
Who do you guys think will be the final boss of the expac?
hollow dock
Personally I think it will be N'zoth
pulsar iris
Has to be N'zoth in some form
tropic trail
But that closes him off for later expacs
pulsar iris
They are so much more than what we understand
hollow dock
the only one we end up killing is because his heart was exposed and destroyed
tropic trail
Yogg-saron?
tropic trail
Did'nt we attack his center in ulduar?
hollow dock
Nope
we attacked the physical manifestation that broke the surface and was contained by the keepers.
he's still alive.
As is C'thuun.
pulsar iris
We actually attacked his brain, which is weird
tropic trail
This feels like a big lovecraft ripoff
tropic trail
Say it, I'm curious
pulsar iris
Your call, Des
hollow dock
The Old Gods are, OBVIOUSLY, based off of Lovecraft's Outer Gods.
Yogg-sothoth anyone?
Yogg-saron?
tropic trail
Azertoth?
pulsar iris
There are things there are just rip off from Lovecraft
hollow dock
The black goat with seven eyes
tropic trail
So Nya'toha is basicly R'lyeh?
zealous basalt
Final expac we go to the void dimension and get rekt
hollow dock
shub niggurath
Y'shaarj
the same role
the black goat of the dark forest
Ny'alotha might be R'lyeh
we don't know yet
pulsar iris
I would love to see a xpac where we fight all the 3 remaining old gods in some way
tropic trail
But C'thuun is nothing like Cthulu
hollow dock
I sincerely do not want to visit Ny'alotha in game
C'thuun is the sleeping dreamer. As is C'thulu.
Controlling anthropomorphic people.
one being bugs one being fish
tropic trail
Appearance is way off though
pulsar iris
Well, they had to do something on their own
tropic trail
And he's supposed to be in R'lyeh
hollow dock
Again
Names/roles are similar
in what they play for the story
that's the inspiration
they're not direct ripoffs
zealous basalt
Final raid in game where we re-fight all 4 old gods
tropic trail
Do you think it would be better if old gods never existed?
zealous basalt
For the game or for the planet?
zealous basalt
Well
pulsar iris
Blizzard could always find a new enemy tho
zealous basalt
Take in check that
The second war would have never happen
And probably the Horde would have been killed in spot
tropic trail
When we defeat the void lords i think they're going to create a new more dangerous threat out of nowhere. Just to make more expacs.
zealous basalt
Money money
zealous basalt
I dont get why people think Blizzard does stuff for love
hollow dock
Void Lords represent in the story what every new expac is for us players
the carrot on the stick
something we can't attain
tropic trail
Remember when voidwalkers were just regular demons who worked for sargeras
pulsar iris
There wasn't a thing like some old god created a alternative timeline in some war?
hollow dock
voidwalkers are, and always have been, enslaved beings of void energy from various realms
Now the Voidlord variant shares a name with the Void Lords
which is confusing admitidly
pulsar iris
Well Arcane, warlocks used demons to fight the legion
I think the same applies
The same goes for the titans experimenting on old gods, and creating G'hunn
zealous basalt
Money money
hollow dock
and no Johann.
What happened was that during Yoggs fight
we saw his influence everywhere.
At the creation of the dragon soul, at King Llane's assassination, at Bolvar's breaking
or attempted breaking
And yea as Johann points out fight fire with fire.
tropic trail
What would be the ideal way for warcraft to end?
hollow dock
Ideally
The void wins
Universe is consumed.
darkness falls upon everything.
But then
little dancing lights appear in the distance. Little flickering lights that burst in an explosion against the darkness
and the universe is reborn
WoW 2 starts
tropic trail
What...they'd remake the world just like that?
hollow dock
That's literally what happens to create the universe in the first place.
that's how you'd end WoW
pulsar iris
I would actually like that. Would be a good excuse to have a new game
hollow dock
all of warcraft.
Everythings consumed just to make a new universe
as the cycle dictates it
tropic trail
But they'd create a new wow right after the original ended?
zealous basalt
Nah
hollow dock
Right after no, but we'd be given that
hollow dock
and then some time passes
probably a few eyars
and bam
next game releases
WoW's shut down
zealous basalt
They take all the time they want to make a new story
Probably something different than wow?
tropic trail
What possible plot would they use for a WoW 2?
zealous basalt
Anything they want
hollow dock
It's literally a new universe
zealous basalt
It's a new universe
pulsar iris
They could reuse a lot of the existing plot from WoW to make WoW 2
zealous basalt
We all could we friends
hollow dock
Like they did for Draenor
pulsar iris
There are so many retcons in the story
hollow dock
and just alter it slightly
tropic trail
Maybe they throw us into AU azeroth, where the draenei invaded instead of the orcs
pulsar iris
I mean...
zealous basalt
No more Horde or Alliance in da new wow
hollow dock
of why we'd go to AU Azeroth
pulsar iris
Wouldn't be draenei tho, would be just eredar
zealous basalt
What if AU is actually the future
tropic trail
Nope Draenei
hollow dock
Wouldn't be Draenei
tropic trail
And the draenei group is not called the horde
pulsar iris
Why would the peaceful and light worshiper draenei invade another world? Fits the eredar best
hollow dock
Johann
pulsar iris
Please do, Des
tropic trail
AU draenei is not peacefull
pulsar iris
Welp. There is that
tropic trail
Let Des elaborate on his theory
hollow dock
So they find the Dark Portal. They rebuild it.
Others willingly throw themselves to fuel it
they invade AU Azeroth
the light is taking over.
Alliance AND horde go
there are allies both sides can gather
the remaining human kingdoms and the high elves for the alliance
while the horde recruits the forest trolls, Zul'jin.
And bam. We head home.
Everyones happy.
tropic trail
But they invade the current world?
hollow dock
the current state of AU Azeroth.
pulsar iris
And then WoW 2 would be AU Azeroth facing the evil light?
pulsar iris
Oh
hollow dock
Cuz AU azeroth exists
pulsar iris
In theory, it does yeah
hollow dock
not in theory
Blizzard has outright stated "yes it does exist, we just likely won't see it"
pulsar iris
That could change tho
tropic trail
Would be interesting to be the setting for wow 2
tropic trail
But the orcs and draenei would be on the same side
hollow dock
For WoW 2
zealous basalt
Like, if it's a completely new game
zealous basalt
Change it entirely
tropic trail
There's no legion and no horde on AU azeroth
tropic trail
But we destroyed it
hollow dock
Remember how time works, Arcane?
zealous basalt
That was 2 late
pulsar iris
What I would love to see was Blizzard destroying this "you can be a human, but you need to be for the alliance". You COULD join the alliance. But, why not join the kirin tor? Or be just an random adventurer with no allegiance
tropic trail
Lothar is still alive