beta-ptr-spoilers

[restive sage]

jeez

[dense plover]

Actually it feels more exciting

[undone sphinx]

tbh real probelm with titainforging was that ppl dint understand it 😃

[dense plover]

IMO

[restive sage]

do you want it to be everywhere or nowhere

[uncut vault]

because it's inefficient to farm for the titanforge, but you still need to farm for it if the piece is needed for your class

[undone sphinx]

its more a of a catchup mechanicsm

[restive sage]

tru

which is good

[dense plover]

Well azerite doesn’t war or titan forge

[hollow dock]

I never saw TF as a requirement to perform as a DPS

[dense plover]

And titan forge has a max limit I think

I don’t think an item from a dungeon can titan forge above a certain point

[uncut vault]

I mean, the best example is draught of souls

[dense plover]

Based on difficulty

[restive sage]

is azerite the best armor or something

[uncut vault]

warriors were farming that for months and months

even when it was old content

[undone sphinx]

tbh that was more bliz f king u

[restive sage]

do u upgrade it 😄

[uncut vault]

because it can titanforge to current stuff

[undone sphinx]

up

[hollow dock]

Yea but that's because of its proc effect being so good I thought

and then it got nerfed

[undone sphinx]

it would help if bliz dint make something that was amazing for one spec

[hollow dock]

It was amazing for a lot of specs

[undone sphinx]

then working out they couldnt code it so it wasnt op

[hollow dock]

just it stood out for warriors

[undone sphinx]

yeah they 100% crit thing 😃

[uncut vault]

yeah but the problem was, unlike most other xpacs where the item would be less valuable due to being set at a specific ilvl cap

[restive sage]

i miss the old spec system

where you can be 3 specs at one time c:

[dense plover]

I’m pretty sure titan forging has a soft cap of like +15 ilvl and a hard cap of +25 in BFA I think, so doing better content is still important

[uncut vault]

draught was required all the way up till it was nerfed, because it can be as good as current drops

[hollow dock]

that was never a thing Lord

[undone sphinx]

is old spec gone in bfa?

[restive sage]

yuhu

back in wrath

[hollow dock]

You couldn'e be all the specs at once

[restive sage]

you could points in all the spec trees

[dense plover]

That wasn’t a thibg

[restive sage]

😄

[hollow dock]

You'd hugely gimp yourself doing that

[dense plover]

You could put points in other stuff

[restive sage]

still tho

[undone sphinx]

sigh old specs werea an arse

[dense plover]

But yeah

[restive sage]

its still an option

[dense plover]

You fucked over your power level

It was a waste tho

[restive sage]

i wasnt a very good player in wotlk 😦

[dense plover]

No reason to use it

[restive sage]

mainly because i didnt play in wotlk

[dense plover]

Exactly

[hollow dock]

People need to start realizing that having an option isn't always great when its basically useless.

[dense plover]

The only thing it did was create an opportunity for people to do worse than others

Not to make you better

[restive sage]

it is sometimes

if you ask me it just

[uncut vault]

Id still just be fine with titanforging if it actually had a cap based on its lowest ilvl

[undone sphinx]

they fixed gdruid on bfa yet?

[restive sage]

made alot of builds possible

[uncut vault]

like a 300 item could only titanforge to 330 or something

[restive sage]

instead of everyone using the exact same thing

that kinda kills it

[uncut vault]

so that some unlucky specs dont need to farm an item up till its nerfed because its so good and can be as good stat wise as current gear

[dense plover]

@uncut vault I’m pretty sure there is a cap

[uncut vault]

if they put one in BfA, thats great

but on live there isnt

[dense plover]

From what I’ve seen in beta, soft titanforge cap of 15

Hard of 25

[undone sphinx]

well tf has always had a hard cap

[dense plover]

So if it titanforges it’s usually to +15

But it can give up to +25

[uncut vault]

but the hard cap for lower gear is the same as the hard cap for high gear on live

[undone sphinx]

its just not +30 ilvl from the drop so you can get hc gear in lfr if ur lucky

[uncut vault]

so if they changed it to just a 25 hard cap no matter what, thats a great change

[undone sphinx]

not really

[dense plover]

That’s what I’ve seen from limited testing

[undone sphinx]

cause i woudlnt bother doing lfr as tank 😃

[dense plover]

Once prepatch comes out more testing will occur

[undone sphinx]

so u get 0 tanks in lfr

[uncut vault]

I mean, you'd still do LFR

just only the current LFR

[restive sage]

they should make black ops 4 an rpg c:

like wow 😄

[dense plover]

What does that have to do with BfA?

[undone sphinx]

lol less said about black ops 4 the better

[restive sage]

see

what that has to do with bfa is

if they have competition with themselves

[dense plover]

Move to off topic if you want to be off topic

[restive sage]

they will work harder on bfa

[uncut vault]

the market for black ops has nothing to do with the market for wow

[restive sage]

im sowwy 😦

[uncut vault]

completely separate genres

[restive sage]

sowwy i just saw it on bnet

[dense plover]

Off topic

Anything not battle for Azeroth or wow goes in offtopic

[restive sage]

mrpeach

[dense plover]

Battle.net stuff too

[restive sage]

what does off topic have to do with bfa

😮

[dense plover]

🙄

[restive sage]

😃

[hollow dock]

what do these emoji's have to do with BFA?

[dense plover]

vris

No

[undone sphinx]

bliz need to fiz bfa authentiation so it dosnt go down everytime they launch a new game 😃

[dense plover]

Don’t encourage the bad behavior

[hollow dock]

What does Vris have to do with BFA?

[restive sage]

vris STOP

[undone sphinx]

so we can play bfa 😃

[restive sage]

you all have access to the beta correct?

[hollow dock]

Nah

[restive sage]

i have a question about a certain feature in the beta

specifically dx 12

does it help your purformence

[dense plover]

On medium and low end systems it should

It’s a bit of a mess on low end systems right now

It’s very unfinished

[restive sage]

i have potato pooter

another question on the topic of performance

[dense plover]

Right now no

By launch supposedly

[restive sage]

when a new expansion comes out, performance is usually lower

is it the same with bfa? or do you think dx 12 at launch should even it out

[dense plover]

It will run worse on lower end systems

[restive sage]

oh no

[dense plover]

32-bit is being dropped for example

[restive sage]

i have 16 bit pc

[dense plover]

Minimum requirements are being increased

Not by much

But it will hurt a but

[restive sage]

im is gettin 60 fps right now but am scared it will go to 30 😦

[dense plover]

Especially with all of the npcs in the cities

It won’t be hit that hard

It might go from 60 to like mid 50s

[restive sage]

._.

thats like 5 frayymes

[undone sphinx]

bliz at moment dont give a f about graphics optimization

[restive sage]

they need to

alot of people play wow cuz they have tato pooter

[undone sphinx]

well they basicaly dont anymore. dalaran loading times kinda proved that

[restive sage]

dalaran load times are fast for me

i dont even have an ssd and its like 20 seconds

[undone sphinx]

tbh if bliz really wanted to make wow awsome they should switch to vulkan

[restive sage]

yessss

vulkan would allow them to do some much more with the game

[undone sphinx]

then they would only need 1 release for osx linux windows and ps4 xbox

[dense plover]

No load times are that bad in bfa

They won’t ever switch engines

[undone sphinx]

tbh dx12 is pretty cool 😃

[dense plover]

It’s 20 years old

[restive sage]

they switched to dx 12 tho

[dense plover]

That’s an upgrade not a replacement

[undone sphinx]

prech that is total crap buddy

[restive sage]

we were talking about vulkan

[undone sphinx]

they have wow on openpl arealdy 😃

[restive sage]

which is an api

[undone sphinx]

*opengpl which is what vulkan is its a graphics api

[dense plover]

they arent the same though

[restive sage]

theyre both apis

[undone sphinx]

its like 20min of compiling. but a lot of bug fixing to check

[dense plover]

thats like saying wow runs on windows so it can run on mac

[restive sage]

and blizz said they were thinking about vulkan

[dense plover]

theyre both operating systems

no they didnt

[undone sphinx]

dude that what vulkan dose

[dense plover]

they never said that

[undone sphinx]

like exactly what vulkan dose

[restive sage]

they diiid

[dense plover]

no

[restive sage]

it was a while ago

vulkan basically

[dense plover]

my point is you are saying x is y because of z

[undone sphinx]

yeah it was a while ago

[restive sage]

just makes fps so much higher. all you need to no

[dense plover]

link it

[restive sage]

ok

[undone sphinx]

sigh dude look up what a graphics api is 😃

[dense plover]

link or it didnt happen

[restive sage]

i got go find it again

[dense plover]

i know what an api is

but you cant just take what you have and replace it with another without a lot of work

[restive sage]

um

[undone sphinx]

well they already use it on mac

[dense plover]

work that could be spent making new content

[restive sage]

they added in dx 12 tho

those are both apis

[undone sphinx]

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20418713498

[dense plover]

dx12 is just an upgrade, and right now it doesnt help fps

[restive sage]

its not like adding an entirely new engine

[undone sphinx]

lol nope

[restive sage]

jesus christ

30???

[undone sphinx]

its one hell of a recoding going from 11 to 12

[dense plover]

there is nothing there about vulkan btw

0%

[undone sphinx]

and dx12 is pretty cool

[restive sage]

just you w9

il show you all

[dense plover]

oh sorry

[undone sphinx]

go down to first bliz post dude

[dense plover]

2%

we might add support for windows

[restive sage]

if they dont then il talk to them about it

[dense plover]

but we cant on mac

thats the fucking sentence

thats nothing

im not going to argue this

[restive sage]

c

w8 wut

mrpeach

[dense plover]

i would rrather they develop gameplay instead of graphics api

also, this has now strayed off topic

[restive sage]

it honestly sounds like your arguing with yourself

[undone sphinx]

"We tried a 4.1 core and performance and bugs were worse than 3.2. There also aren't really any features we needed for wow that 4.1 gave us over 3.2. The features we'd really like for OpenGL on mac are in 4.2+.

As for Windows OGL 4.2, the guy that did it did it over a weekend for fun. It took very little to zero dev time. Making an initial backend for a properly abstracted game for someone that knows the code base extremely well doesn't take much time. The cost comes from finding and fixing all of the crashes, correctness issues and performance issues."

[restive sage]

this isnt off topic its about something that can be added in bf

a

[dense plover]

no

directx was added in bfa

thats it

[restive sage]

12

[dense plover]

nothing else has changed with the api

[restive sage]

thats what we were talking about

😮

[dense plover]

no

[undone sphinx]

and btw if bliz moved to 1 single gapi they could spend more time doing content 😃

[restive sage]

wuuut

[dense plover]

you are talking about vulkan

[restive sage]

it started with dx 12

then someone mentioned vulkan

[dense plover]

yeah

and then it went offtopic

[restive sage]

sowwy

[undone sphinx]

"Vulkan, formerly named the "Next Generation OpenGL Initiative" (glNext)"

cough cough

[cunning sun]

you know Vulkan isn't ABI compatible with OpenGL right?

and the API isn't at all the same

it'd take a total rework of that layer

[undone sphinx]

nope but i dont think there is gonna be a 4.7 opengl

anyhow later 😃

[dense plover]

oh look

someone with knowledge to disprove the bullshit

and then they leave

what a surprise

🙄

[cunning sun]

[undone sphinx]

"Vulkan, formerly named the "Next Generation OpenGL Initiative" (glNext),[50][51] is a grounds-up redesign effort to unify OpenGL and OpenGL ES into one common API that will not be backwards compatible with existing OpenGL versions.[52][53][54]

The initial version of Vulkan API was released on 16 February 2016."

if ur intrested.

[dense plover]

yeah

not backwards compatible

[cunning sun]

the key part here is the that will not be backwards compatible part

[dense plover]

it would eliminate anyone who cant run vulkun

[undone sphinx]

its bsaicly yeah not backward compatable but it is gonna be open gl 4.7

[dense plover]

which is a huge part of the playerbase

they need as many players as possible

[undone sphinx]

everone can run vulkan dude

[cunning sun]

Vulkan is closer to DX12 than it is to OpenGL in terms of how the API works

[dense plover]

no

everyone cant

thats why directx11 is staying in with directx12

[undone sphinx]

more ppl can run vulkan than dx12

[dense plover]

directx 9 is being dropped finally

but 11 is old

and lots of people who play wow cant run 12

[undone sphinx]

cause dx version is tied to windows edition

where is vulkan/opengl isnt

[dense plover]

but less people can run vulkan than dx11

and if they did vulkan, directx11 wouldnt work

thereby isolating the playerbase

[cunning sun]

the only cards that can run Vulkan games are essentially the same cards that can run DX12 games

[gilded pelican]

My set up sucks

[dense plover]

and losing them money

[gilded pelican]

I’m lucky if I’m over 15fps in antorous

[cunning sun]

excluding NVIDIA Fermi because that seems to have DX12 basic support but not Vulkan

[undone sphinx]

https://developer.nvidia.com/vulkan-driver

[dense plover]

you can keep arguing this

[cunning sun]

yea it supports down to Kepler

Kepler being GeForce 600

[undone sphinx]

obviously i cannt cause u dont really know crap about the topic 😃

[dense plover]

but wow is going to have whatever is supported and can have the most players

[cunning sun]

meanwhile DX12 can run on a GTX 480

really really badly, but it can

and only with DX11 feature level

[dense plover]

^

[undone sphinx]

well dx 12 runs on anything

[dense plover]

switching to vulcan would cut off too many players

[undone sphinx]

as its more a multi gpu assest ting for 12

[dense plover]

also, it would require a totally different engine for macs

another large chunk of the playerbase

[undone sphinx]

dx 12 is more a cluster compute package than a gpi

[cunning sun]

multi GPU is a thing for using multiple GPUs to split rendering or compute loads, it doesn't mean it magically supports more hardware

the GPU still needs explicit support

[dense plover]

^

[undone sphinx]

tbh i am not so sure about that

more it needs to be on a pcie3 bus

[dense plover]

it needs to have support for it though

its not auto built in

[cunning sun]

you can't split a load that's using the DX12 API if the card does not support the DX12 API

[dense plover]

^

[cunning sun]

and it being on a PCIe 3 lane doesn't really help the point because all PCIe 3 certified cards also happen to be DX12 cards

for example take a look at NVIDIAs dev intro to DX12 explicit multi adapter

https://developer.nvidia.com/explicit-multi-gpu-programming-directx-12

at the API level the object is called ID3D12Device, so it's not some super low level thing running without directx

[undone sphinx]

nvida left of how u can pair with amd cards too

[cunning sun]

no they didn't

[dense plover]

hotness

why do you spew bullshit?

when someone is here to prove you wrong?

i cant

im not good at computers

but why do you try to do this?

[cunning sun]

this doesn't mention what vendor the cards on the linked heap are, only when they're comparing it to the SLI approach used by older DX or by DX12 in LDA mode

[dense plover]

do you get some thrill out of saying you know more or acting like it?

and theyre gone

not a surprise

at least i know who to call when he comes back to spew bullshit

is that okay Lappy?

[cunning sun]

I might be sleeping but if not that's fine

[dense plover]

cool

[cunning sun]

useless GPU knowledge is something I can provide

[undone sphinx]

yes this is a explaiation of sli vs new muti gpu rendering 😃

[tulip sun]

Wpwhead giveaway in like 5 hours

[dense plover]

yes

[cunning sun]

towards the bottom it does actually mention a problem that comes with partnering different cards

[dense plover]

but it might not have final results until 10 days from now

[cunning sun]

it just calls it by its technical name of heterogeneous linked node adapters

[undone sphinx]

single proccessing lagg bettween diff speed hardware isnt new 😃

[cunning sun]

when you're doing split rendering between different cards it becomes more of an issue though

since you'll get horribly inconsistent and jittery frametimes

[undone sphinx]

yup tollornce is always gonna be a problem

but there is a well known soltion

u just dont have one on ur gpu bus

[cunning sun]

moving one of them to its own bus doesn't fix the fact it'll be rendering the frame faster or slower than the other GPUs

[undone sphinx]

i am talking about caches

like u have on ur cpu

[cunning sun]

but caches aren't really a solution to this

[undone sphinx]

the really old cpus were slower than ram

[cunning sun]

if you have a Vega 64 and a 1080 Ti and do alternate frame rendering between them in DX12 MDA, every other frame is going to be a different frametime

[undone sphinx]

so when the cpus got faster than ram they had to puch caches on the cpu core to deal with the diffrent speed of the hardware

[cunning sun]

and it'll look poor to the user

[undone sphinx]

yup but

you do get one really cool thing

[cunning sun]

the ability to say you wasted money?

[undone sphinx]

nope more performance with video rendering

which tbh is gonna be the real use 😃

[cunning sun]

but that's irrelevant to DX12

we've had multi GPU rendering for years across diverse hardware

[undone sphinx]

yes but it got better 😃

[cunning sun]

but it didn't get better because of DX12 because rendering doesn't use DirectX

[undone sphinx]

and we dont have pcie passthough. so i guess this is ms way of fixing that 😃

[cunning sun]

PCIe passthrough for what?

you don't need passthrough unless you're running a VM, the host OS has direct hardware access

and we have PCIe passthrough in the form of VT-d for Intel and whatever AMD call their virtualisation passthrough

[undone sphinx]

yup for vm. which hyper-v dosnt support 😦

[cunning sun]

https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/heyscriptingguy/2016/07/14/passing-through-devices-to-hyper-v-vms-by-using-discrete-device-assignment/

does it not?

[undone sphinx]

oh i guess they added it 😃

nice

time to upgrade some hypervisors then

[undone sky]

hi cuties

[tropic trail]

If naga become a playable race, will they be demon hunters?

Since they allied with illidan

or did he only train night elves and blood elves?

[dense plover]

he only trained night elves and blood elves

the naga were allies

but they werent demon hunters

[tropic trail]

Oh bummer, that'll be cool to have a neutral demon hunter race.

[dense plover]

naga wouldnt be neutral first of all

if anywhere they would be horde

secondly, naga are super unlikely

they dont have legs

[cunning sun]

haven't blizzard given pretty strong indications that they won't be making another neutral?

[tropic trail]

Yeah but didn't the trolls fight them and stuff?

[uncut vault]

they could pretty easily retcon a few races in

[dense plover]

yes

[uncut vault]

like chaos orcs and renegade eredar who served illidan

[dense plover]

they dont want to make more neutral races

[tropic trail]

Also aren't naga in the demon hunter class hall?

[dense plover]

allies

as i said

[tropic trail]

Ah okay

[dense plover]

one faction of naga

[tropic trail]

To be fair though, the legs can be worked around.

[cunning sun]

when do I get to play a tuskarr

[tropic trail]

They have giant four legged naga in broken isles

[uncut vault]

in the bolvar xpac

[tropic trail]

so Im sure they can do something

[cunning sun]

very good I will eagerly await bolvar expac

[uncut vault]

also I dont think players would really want two legged naga

[dense plover]

they wouldnt

[uncut vault]

not really the iconic naga at that point

[cunning sun]

as a DK another lich king expac sounds fantastic

[uncut vault]

wrath 2.0 is inevitable at this point

[dense plover]

if people wanted legged naga, they wouldnt ask for naga, they would ask for sethrakk

very likely

we need to defeat yogg forever

and talia to bolvar

plus the stuff from legion?

[uncut vault]

at the very least he'll be a side threat in an xpac involving yogg

[tropic trail]

Oh damn

Well I still hope they add Vrykul

Closest thing I'll get to a giant in WoW

[uncut vault]

but with how connected the two are Id say they'll be co-players in an xpac or two

[dense plover]

they might eventually

but not soon

kul tiran are already human alternative

[tropic trail]

If Vrykul are too similar to humans they could be easily turned into frost vrykul or something

[dense plover]

two human-likes are unlikely

[uncut vault]

vrykul are in the same boat as things like helfs and broken

[tropic trail]

like frost giants

[uncut vault]

good ideas that are heavily wanted

but they got a similar alternative in BfA

[dense plover]

^

[cunning sun]

has the high elf thing died down yet

[uncut vault]

the backlash from it, mostly

[tropic trail]

Do Allied Races have to be tied to their racial alternatives?

[uncut vault]

but nothing really changed from the people who want high elves

nah its not a strict requirement

[cunning sun]

probably never will

[uncut vault]

its a plus though

[dense plover]

its not a requirement, but its a tendency for the 8 we are getting

[tropic trail]

True but I dont think Vrykul would be unique enough to be their own race

[dense plover]

they might eventually

but not in the same expacs as kul tirans

[uncut vault]

thats probably where either valarjar or kvaldir options would tie in

[dense plover]

junker gnomes and vulpera seem the most likely as the next unannounced sets

[tropic trail]

Kvaldir is a brilliant idea

[dense plover]

ehhhh

[tropic trail]

But I'm still wanting my frost vrykul

[sharp bluff]

Aussie gnomes woooooooo

[tropic trail]

if they have a name

[dense plover]

kvaldir are pure evil though

like literally

sanlayn seem the most likely for undead

[uncut vault]

theyre also under odyns control now

granted, still kinda evil but

evil on our side

[sharp bluff]

Forcefully under his control

[tropic trail]

We probably dont need another Sea themed allied race anyways

[uncut vault]

nah they just follow whoever has helyas voice

not all that worked up about it

[tropic trail]

So if Vrykul do somehow become a race

would they be dks?

and shamans?

[uncut vault]

if they decide to allow allied races be DKs, probably

[tropic trail]

They have

I think so atleast

[dense plover]

no they havent

[uncut vault]

so far its a "maybe in future xpacs"

[tropic trail]

I read about the dark iron dwarves being dks

[dense plover]

no allied races are dks

[tropic trail]

Oh nevermind

They updated the wowhead page

used to say dks

[uncut vault]

yeah the datamined stuff was PH

[dense plover]

i think it was a potential before we datamined it

[uncut vault]

zanda and kul tirans both had a PH set

[tropic trail]

How about shamans though?

[dense plover]

for which?

[tropic trail]

Vrykul

[dense plover]

nah

theyre not the people to commune with elements

theyre more likely to enslave them

warlocks tho

[tropic trail]

To be fair though

Kul Tiran Humans have their own type of druidism

[dense plover]

yeah

but thats because you dont have to believe in the same wild gods

[uncut vault]

its their own type of druidism, but its still tapping into nature

[dense plover]

the elements of azeroth are the same everywhere

[uncut vault]

same way different kinds of shamanism are still tapping into elements

[dense plover]

vrykul dont tap into elements

[tropic trail]

Dwarves do though

[dense plover]

they would be the kind to destroy them

[tropic trail]

How about Paladins and Priest?

[dense plover]

yeah

easily

have you seen odyns palace?

[tropic trail]

Yes

[dense plover]

filled with gold and light

[tropic trail]

I don't think Vrykul would do to well with the Horde

[dense plover]

lol, they would totally fit in either way easily

they believe in honorable combat

orcs

they look like humans

[tropic trail]

True

[dense plover]

alliance

its why they might not happen

[tropic trail]

They dislike Humans

[dense plover]

they could easily go either way

[tropic trail]

Like Dwarves?

I think they really dont like Highmountain Tauren

[dense plover]

what?

[tropic trail]

Just a whole bunch of vrykul raids by highmountain's borders

[dense plover]

theres not really any evidence of interactions between the two outside of the combat trial

[tropic trail]

I guess

Thinking about it though

What are the pandaren going to do when the zandalari ally?

[dense plover]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[tropic trail]

I think Vrykul would do good in the Horde

but we don't really need another human like race in the horde

also they have a strong connection to dwarves and humans

and gnomes

anyways thanks for the chat

Im going to level my mage now

[dense plover]

oh no i absolutely think they should be alliance

human-likes for alliance only

[tulip sun]

How they look shouldn't dictate which faction they join.

[tropic trail]

You're right

[uncut vault]

blizz could pull anything but

odyn and eyir would not like the horde

and the most likely faction of vrykul to join the factions is sigryn's group

[tropic trail]

Horde just kind of feels like it belongs to tribal races

or races with some type of dark history

or both

[tulip sun]

I mean

Horde is not primarily tribal anymore

[tropic trail]

Yeah but the Horde kind of feels like that misfits type of group

with the histories of the Orcs, Blood Elves, Undead

I can't really say but they just don't feel right being in the Horde

[devout wagon]

Vrykul will never be playable so there is little point debating it.

[tulip sun]

What, Vrykul?

[tropic trail]

Yeah

Why will they not be playable?

[tulip sun]

Depends on the tribe/clan whatever.

[tropic trail]

Yeah, I guess

[uncut vault]

theyre making an explicit effort to give both sides mixed elements

horde isnt gonna be mostly tribal, alliance isnt gonna be mostly pretty races

[tropic trail]

Yeah, but Vrykul are kind of both.

Hard to say which faction they belong in and I guess they're not adding anymore Neutral races due to earlier's statement.

[devout wagon]

Their models are too large, regardless of tribe. They're even larger than Tauren, and Tauren have trouble getting through most doors. That being said, mount size is also dependent on the size of your race, which means if you are playing a notable large race, your mount could end end up being considered griefing of other players. Vrykul as far as lore goes, has zero business with the Horde and has never explicitly said they'd be interested in joining either.

[tropic trail]

I mean they can make something up

[devout wagon]

They won't. That was my point.

[tropic trail]

The models aren't really that big of an issue

they can just size em down

[tulip sun]

^^

Tauren in lore are suppose to be much larger

[devout wagon]

There are already far too many other, much more appealing alternatives. They won't go out of their way to make a new playable model unless they've exhausted the models they already have. (I'm looking at you, Darkspear tribes).

[tulip sun]

I am not saying it will happen

But it is not impossible

[devout wagon]

I never said it was impossible either. 🤷

[tropic trail]

you said they will never be playable though

also what about skinny kul tiran humans

[uncut vault]

what about em?

[devout wagon]

I said it wont ever happen.

[tropic trail]

Kul Tiran Humans have the thin option right

I read it on wowhead but Im not sure

[uncut vault]

nah

its just an NPC thing, devs clarifying that the thin models are just a canon variant of kul tirans, not some other race

[tropic trail]

Oh alright

I can see Vrykul definitely making sense as a race

there are giant races in other fantasy games

but I see the point with the model

I dont think making an entirely new playable model isnt too much of a stress though

there are better options sure

but there are some races that make sense as playable ones and some that dont

its like all the generic fantasy races that are playable, y'know?

And giants are one of those generic fantasy races

excluding pandaren and draenei

[tulip sun]

Vrykul could easily be implemented.

Just needs the story

[devout wagon]

Well that solves it. It'll never happen. 😛

[tropic trail]

killing dreams one by one, aye?

[devout wagon]

The last time Bliz "wrote a story" for a new race, we got Void Elves.

[tropic trail]

I think they're making some type of effort to give us the races we want

[devout wagon]

Honestly, I really want Vulpera.

[tropic trail]

We have Dark Iron Dwarves and Mag'har Orcs

[tulip sun]

Maxi, all they need to do is implement the story within the intro quest.

Plus the vrykul have plenty of lore outside that

[tropic trail]

Im thinking Vulpera will be recruited by the Pandaren but who knows?

If they do become an allied race that is

I dont really know though

[tulip sun]

No need to shove one race into recruiting it

[tropic trail]

I mean the pandaren leaders

so they can be a neutral race

vulpera wont be neutral

[tulip sun]

They are 100% not being a neutral race if added

[tropic trail]

Oh dang

make sense for both factions

in an expansion about faction conflict, they're not going to add a neutral race

[tulip sun]

Plus they are only interactable with the Horde

Flagged horde pvp

[tropic trail]

thats what pandaren did though greenegg

[tulip sun]

Their reputation is at war with alliance

[tropic trail]

alliance doesn't have a ton of interaction with vulpera, not sure they make sense for both

[uncut vault]

vulpera dont make sense for alliance much at all

got no connections, no contact, and they're currently neutral allies of the Zandalari

[tulip sun]

and the horde literally saves them

While the horde does nothing

[tropic trail]

true

[devout wagon]

Well, I think it's safe to say that they'll make decisions that dont make any sense.

[tropic trail]

maybe they werent meant to be an allied race

We already have our fluffy joyful animal race

[tulip sun]

Ryswell, it is pretty obvious they have allied races in mind when creating Vulpera

[tropic trail]

Yeah, I know

If my dreams come true

and vrykul become an allied race

I hope they're like nightborne when it comes to quality

not as good as kul tiran humans or zandalari trolls

but one of the better allied races

not bias or anything btw

im totally for highmountain tauren

it just feels like highmountain tauren and lightforged draenei lack some things

y'know?

[devout wagon]

Yeah, cause Highmountain Tauren joining a faction led by someone who uses necromancy makes sense. 👍

just sayin

[tulip sun]

Maxi, do you ever not complain? Seriously?

[devout wagon]

Only about their decisions regarding allied races -- because none of it makes sense.

[tropic trail]

You make no sense.

[tulip sun]

Please elaborate.

[devout wagon]

Necromancy at it's core is against the very aspects of nature that the Highmountain follow. Why would they join the Horde?

[tropic trail]

i just realized blood elves are like high elves and night elves are like wood elves

in a way

highmountain joined the horde because their low born cow brethren are there

[tulip sun]

The Horde quite literally saves their asses.

and they are to rekindle relations with Baine/Mulgore Tauren

[tropic trail]

why are the alliance allied races as of now only argus?

and horde only broken isles?

[tulip sun]

The Alliance in BfA is arguably just as worse if we are counting bad magic

[tropic trail]

void elves actually have nothing to do with argus really

they just needed a rep to attach to them

Yeah I know but the best part about making an allied race for me was questing through the zone and learning the race

[tulip sun]

I don't see the points of your argument Maxi

[tropic trail]

and the only time i really learned about void elves was in argus

which wasnt much btw

[tulip sun]

You literally witness the birth of the void elves.

[tropic trail]

Not really

[tulip sun]

and will get more lore later on

and quite literally you do Ryswell.

You are there when they are created

[devout wagon]

I guess you don't understand the importance of lore then? 🤷

[tropic trail]

what do you mean "not really" before you go to recruit them they're still blood elves

No I wasnt talking about that

I said not really to what you said

[tulip sun]

Maxi....because someone has necromancy in their lives does not make them evil or anything.

To the Highmountain, Sylvanas leads the nation that aids and saves them. Baine vouches for them/her.

[devout wagon]

And that concludes this discussion.

[tropic trail]

because alleria being a void elf herself has a lot to do with argus

[tulip sun]

Whatever, just go complain on the forums instead of here then.

[tropic trail]

and the whole void power thing we went through

[devout wagon]

Lmao.

[tulip sun]

I wouldn't really personally count Alleria as a void elf

[tropic trail]

alleria is still a high elf, she's not actually a void elf

[tulip sun]

She is a high elf which harnesses the void.

While void elves were physically changed

almost into void monsters.

[tropic trail]

so she's a void elf without being purple and what not

a high elf

yeah but void elves are high elves

[tulip sun]

No, she is a high elf with void powers.

[tropic trail]

thats void eles

elves

void elves are blood elves

[tulip sun]

Void Elves WERE blood elves

[tropic trail]

were*

[tulip sun]

They were physically changed, almost into void creatures

[tropic trail]

so void elves are first elves mutated slightly by fel, and then later mutated by void

they tell us high elves are blood elves

and yet they're different

physically and lore wise

right now, they are the same, but until BfA kul tirans were also the same as humans

[tulip sun]

I am not going to get into the difference/similarities between them.

But Void Elves -are- different.

[tropic trail]

they were never the same

[uncut vault]

void elves are basically half-ethereal

[tropic trail]

blood elves use fel magic or whatever

high elves dont

in game the only discernable difference is eye color

but we also know many have tattoos

but that's not shown in game

except on alleria

fine

we can say she's both

she transforms, right?

she can use shadow/void form

[tulip sun]

She is not both.

[tropic trail]

like priests can

[tulip sun]

Blood Elves = High Elves

But Void Elves are drastically changed

[tropic trail]

Alleria isn't even the race leader, umbric is

Let’s talk about how nice the armor looks for Bfa I’m glad I don’t need to worry about set bonuses anymore.

I like the dark iron dwarf armor

[uncut vault]

honestly I like all the gear except the tier replacements lol

[tropic trail]

other allied race armor is a disappointment

I wish they gave out weapons with the armor

[uncut vault]

Warfront, allied race, and leveling/dungeon stuff ins incredible

[tropic trail]

I'm excited for the TES dwemer plate

Like with the nightborne and stuff

[uncut vault]

Uldir is disappointing so far, aside from the plate set

[tropic trail]

dark iron dwarves get a shield

[uncut vault]

really looking forward to azshara's raid though

even just the staff is amazing

[tropic trail]

Yeah it’s a bit eh but we got a few more raids coming. And yeah that’s lame that they get something but no one else really does I mean

zandalari do cause of their zone but...

what about dark iron dwarves?

That’s what I’m saying they get something compared to anyone else

For like

Race weapons

Zandalari technically do same with Kultirans

But that’s cause of their zones

mag har orcs can just use draenor weapons

to be fair

That’s true I guess

Still upsetting for like Nightborne

THey have plenty of weapons you could use man, really wanted those double sided swords

maybe they'll add something for the rest

stuff comes out at the weirdest moments

I hope so, would love those weapons.

I wish lightforged draenei were more than reskinned draenei

I really like the recruitment scenario

and the lighforged stuff in argus

but they really arent that unique

I mean they're cool though

How is it not unique

😄

I mean customization options

also they kind of keep the same thematic as normal draenei

[uncut vault]

I mean in terms of uniqueness, lightforged only barely pull out ahead of highmountain

[tropic trail]

The same goes for Mag'Har orcs tbh

[uncut vault]

theyve only got the gold theme going for them

[tropic trail]

True

[uncut vault]

AU draenei are what the lightforged should have been, ideology wise

[slate ingot]

Maghar atleast has the option for other orc clans

for skin tone

[tropic trail]

that and they have been a highly requested race

[uncut vault]

Maghar at least have the iron themes that the green orcs dont fully have, highmountain and draenei are basically their counterpart race, with LF having a slightly different color scheme

[slate ingot]

the only differentiation in LF draenai from normal is the light tattoos

and some glowing bits

[tropic trail]

To be fair though Highmountain are different

[uncut vault]

only real difference is the antlers

armor is literally just a normal tauren set

[tropic trail]

highmountain quest really grows on you though

compared to argus

[uncut vault]

and non-white tats are something the normal tauren have canonically anways

oh I love the highmountain to death

great story

but its story the normal tauren should also have had

[tropic trail]

Maybe they can make the tauren more african based

if they are ever updated

lore wise

[uncut vault]

Baine's updated model would have been their chance to do that

the headdress and outfit cemented them as native american, just like the highmountain

[tropic trail]

Damn

Well

Highmountain Tauren still have uh

Nevermind

Highmountain arent bad but they're what normal tauren should've been

as you said

[uncut vault]

yeah, I love highmountain, and I like the lightforged aesthetic too

[tropic trail]

however LF draenei are bad and they are hardly different

[uncut vault]

but in terms of personality and culture, they both severely needed something different from their counterpart

[slate ingot]

I mean if they would of added the LF draenei as customization to normal Draenei instead

[uncut vault]

should have used the story theyre using for the lightbound on the allied race

[slate ingot]

and actually gave an allied race instead of the LF draenei

[uncut vault]

shoulda been the broken

[tropic trail]

Kul Tiran humans remind me of the riverfolk from the Hobbit

[uncut vault]

give draenei a gold eye option like blood elves

[slate ingot]

remove LF draenei as an allied race make them just normal Draenei customizations tbh

and give alliance an allied race that isn't a poor skin job of a regular race

[tropic trail]

To be fair though port the same thing could be said about zandalari trolls and normal trolls

not that they are very similar

but zandalari trolls just have better lore

[slate ingot]

Zandalari is a different skeleton i thought

[tropic trail]

that normal trolls should've got

we're talking lore wise

[slate ingot]

oh in that sense

yeah

[uncut vault]

I think zandalari succeed where highmountain/lightforged failed in the way that yes, they have better, more fleshed lore than the darkspear

but its also extremely different better lore

highmountain are just the normal tauren in an actual native american atmosphere, lightforged literally use an exodar draenei built ship

zandalari have a completely different mesoamerican theme

no savagery

[tropic trail]

good point

darkspears are like

the old horde troll allies

cant remember their name

zuljin?

[slate ingot]

zul;jin was amani ?

zul'jin*

[tropic trail]

Yeah the amani trolls

Well atleast I have a reason for unlocking highmountain tauren and playing them

since they're just better tauren

I dont really have a reason for playing lightforged draenei

[uncut vault]

Id play the hell out of lightforged if they just had more than one skin tone and two hair colors

[tropic trail]

other than that they look prettier as paladins and priest

[uncut vault]

give me an actual grey skin tone, and some dark grey/black hair colors and Id jump on it

[tropic trail]

I'm not pissed though

If anything I'm happy

Kind of

Still waiting for my Vrykul

But for the most part the only allied race I care about

Is getting all the love and attention it needs

a new model would be nice but im happy enough

The day they announced they could be my main class

That really excited me

[pastel ore]

BTW that is a bfa spoiler

It is the new jaina model

[rich apex]

Accurate

[rich ocean]

When Sylvanas says fuck that to horde and alliance getting along cause calia is stupid

[devout wagon]

Slyvanas killing her own people was pretty crazy.

[rich ocean]

Those fleeing i can understand, i dont agree with at all, but i can understand that

killing those who were returning to her though... Holy snap

[tropic trail]

She freaked out because she realized her mind control was weakening on them

I believe that the vast majority of the forsaken population is compelled to some degree to serve sylvanas, one of her WC3 abilities was mind control after all

so seeing that some of them were slipping from her control probably scared her, and she didn't want to take any chances

[deft escarp]

I don't think Sylvanas is going to be Warchief after BFA...

I don't think she will die (because of fan-favoritism) but perhaps she will go rogue or something

[tropic trail]

I'm not sure tho, the horde has been losing leader after leader, there'd be a ton of complaining if they went through yet another warchief, her getting killed or not

[deft escarp]

But there are so many that doesn't want her as Warchief

[tropic trail]

I think even more want the musical chairs of warchiefs to end

[deft escarp]

Perhaps a council then?

[tropic trail]

we'll have to see, I don't think sylvanas will stay warchief either, but it might be a bad move to change leaders yet again

[deft escarp]

Personally, I think it was a bad move to kill off Vol'jin so soon

Barely did anything

[rich garnet]

Aye. Making voljin warchief was utterly pointless. He came by to congratulate us on our garrison, to inspect our shipyard, and then bite the bullet at the broken shore..

[tropic trail]

how about no warchiefs

both anduin and sylvanas can die

maybe they can be the final boss of BFA since it's a faction war expac anyways

plus I've never seen an old god as a final boss of an expansion

if you don't count the garrosh thing

same raid different bosses

I just think it's weird that the orcs kept the title "warchief" when they're trying to prove to the world that they're not blood thirsty

when thrall founded the new horde anyway

traditions?

orcs are a proud people

[rich garnet]

Thrall wanted to reclaim the old honourable past of the orcs, after centuries of their lives stuck in the Hillsbrad internment camps.

[uncut vault]

I mean it’s a tradition of about 20 years

Founded by guldan

[rich garnet]

Oh, it's much older than that.

[uncut vault]

It really wasn’t

By the time Thrall took the mantle of leader it was 20 or so years since the first warchief, Blackhand

[rich garnet]

Oh, right. I thought you meant from now and back to its creation being 20 years. My bad. :)

[rapid berry]

um anyone knows where i could find zandalari empire quatermaster?

[rich garnet]

I personally do not. Sorry.

[tropic trail]

I’ve payed and played world of Warcraft for 12 years, and I didn’t get a beta key....Sueing blizzard.

[strange mist]

lmao I've been playing on and off for 2 years and I got one

it's random

[tropic trail]

Smh I’m pressing charges

[rich ocean]

first time i got a key.

i got in mop from purchase and won a legion key

bfa first time i got in legit

[rich garnet]

Congratulations! 😄

[tropic trail]

You know, Im still upset that every single person on my bnet has it

And like none of them even play WoW anymore XD

[mild current]

We all know how beta keys work

They're given to streamers and to people who won't use them, nobody else

[hollow dock]

But we have like ten people in here who are using them

[oak wraith]

<< not a streamer, using mine

And playing WoW 😋

[mint arch]

👌

[hollow dock]

I love it Honk

[tulip sun]

The forums are so toxic.....they are kinda overreacting over the preview pages

[wild pewter]

I think you can just end your sentence at "The forums are so toxic" 😄

[tulip sun]

They need to wait and see the meat of the story...we saw the start and finish

They are tslking about unsubbing, not buying the book....boycotting it. Like wtf?

[forest lynx]

Forumgoers are a minority, don't take any of that shit seriously. If they wanted to unsub, they would have already.

[hollow dock]

^

[terse patrol]

Forum users will always be the saltiest people.

[ruby prawn]

@tropic trail Anduin won't be a raid boss. We already know he will live a very long life. It was a cinematic on the broken shore or on Argus where we saw him and Velen (Anduin was very old) going to fight against the void

[viscid chasm]

It could end up being like SoO technically once you killed hellscreem it said unconscious instead of dead.

[hollow dock]

Not to mention: Anduin isn't an antagonist at all in BFA

so it makes no sense to go and attack him.

[terse patrol]

Filthy Horde. @hollow dock

Looking for reasons to hate our beautiful boy.

[hollow dock]

Ikr?

Wonder why they'd hate him so much.

[sharp bluff]

😯

honk you genius you

[terse patrol]

We getting a beta build today?

I heard someone say we might get the prepatch in the PTR

[mint arch]

M A N D U I N

also

anduin-kun

[lavish pawn]

Now where is the kids dog?

[hollow dock]

We might. If we're staying optimistic

[sharp bluff]

if anduin looked like that first pic, I might follow him

[mint arch]

don't worry, anduin-kun will flash that golden smile once we kill sylvanas

[sharp bluff]

I belived that last week with the book, this week i doubt that

[mint arch]

what changed this week?

[sharp bluff]

just a thought, we shall see

[tropic trail]

Or smile with his final smile when sylvanas stands over him and steps on his throat. Nod

[mint arch]

then u wake up

and realize, blizzard already confirmed anduin-kun is gonna survive until he old and leadin the light~

[meager warren]

Dadduin

[hollow dock]

anduins not a dad

[tropic trail]

How do we know.

Maybe he felt up on some cute girl without us knowing.

We don't know what he does when he is alone..

[sullen dagger]

hes' a riest

[tropic trail]

So what?

Saying he likes litt-..nvm

[sharp bluff]

Anduin only likes goats duh

[tropic trail]

A Tom Brady fan.

Good

[sudden oak]

anduin thought how majestic the hands of a dreanei shaman looked when she was using wind

[deft escarp]

When you see that booty

[tropic trail]

his eyebrows make him look sinister

[uncut vault]

he inherited them from Varian

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/heroesofthestorm/images/3/37/Varian.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/356?cb=20140624091109

[sharp bluff]

The eyebrows? Or the goat hands thing?

[tropic trail]

why not both?

[sharp bluff]

True

[hollow dock]

@dense plover TOLD YOU

[dense plover]

what?

told me what?

oh pathfinder

yeah i know

i said it was unlikely

but they do require full exploration of both continents as i predicted

and completion of the final scenario

though kul tiras doesnt have that yet

its still missing the implementation of a bunch of stuff tbh

itll be done soon though

what does surprise me is that you dont need to complete the war campaign

i bet that is added later

maybe part 2 will require the full war campaign to be finished

[hollow dock]

Yea. Which the war campaign is supposed to take you to the other continent doesn't it? so exploration isn't that bad. But the idea of forcing people to play through all of both stories to get flying was a bit much :p

[sharp bluff]

Oh come on Vris, your gonna do it anyway right? 😛

[restive sage]

who is the person in that screenshot

is he the king

[still lily]

Anduin

[restive sage]

he looks like the guy in the bfa trailer

[still lily]

Put them together Bungus

What do you get

[hollow dock]

hell no

Bungus do you really not pay attention to the game? o= several quests have you going to Anduin, the high king and he even has the title in game

[sharp bluff]

you won't do Rexxar story Vris?

[hollow dock]

Nah. With Kul Tiran druids I have no reasont o go play horde

[sharp bluff]

Troll paladins

and the return of the troll ❤

you know da one

[hollow dock]

dont care for trolladins

I havemy goats

maybe my elves

Im content with that

[dense plover]

i mean both sides are important if you want story

but forcing that would be unusual

so im glad they arent

[hollow dock]

Indeed.

[limber mural]

whoever said old anduin is in an argus cutscene

it's a comic

[hollow dock]

yup and its not a vision

[uncut vault]

dunno if its been shown here yet

https://i.redd.it/rug3addn7gz01.png

[sharp bluff]

my god....

it is beautiful ❤

[still lily]

Looks kinda basic o3o

[limber mural]

I feel the individual pieces have transmog potential

but it does look pretty basic

[still lily]

it looks like a slightly more garish stormwind guard model

[sharp bluff]

the cape ❤

[uncut vault]

comic is out

https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/21791564/new-comic-world-of-warcraft-battle-for-azeroth-1-jaina-reunion

[hollow dock]

the comic

is

amazing <3

[sharp bluff]

hmm any other alliance members getting a comic?

maybe a book?

it was good though

[hollow dock]

it's a series

so we won't know

until they come out

[dapper cosmos]

I have a feeling we're going to get one for the horde and the other might deal with Magni looking in to how to save Azeroth.

[hollow dock]

Inb4 tyrande one saying how peaceful things are in teldrassil and how they started to have kids there for the first time in a long time

[dense plover]

not much suprising in that comic

but ashvane has a model now

[hollow dock]

it's more affirmations of what's already happening in beta

[dense plover]

so we know that her model ingame isnt final

pretty much

[terse patrol]

@hollow dock Is this Anduins theme?

https://youtu.be/7zkX6kfnWbk

[hollow dock]

yes

[terse patrol]

Someone needs to redo the Arthur intro, but with Anduin and WoW characters.

[uncut vault]

that is her in game model though?

[hollow dock]

did they update ashvane from the normal human model?

[terse patrol]

Yes

[hollow dock]

like in gameand all

[uncut vault]

https://d1u5p3l4wpay3k.cloudfront.net/wowpedia/6/6a/Lady_Ashvane.jpg

[sharp bluff]

she looks like a taller, non green, trade prince

who would sell her people for....

[hollow dock]

Oh good

they did update it

Let me guess

a fat person joke

[tropic trail]

wAIT

WAIT

WAIT

[sharp bluff]

wait she isn't Gallywixx right? no the selling her people off for power/money part

[unborn pagoda]

Busty night club Mama :D

[tropic trail]

THAT CLOAK IS A REAL THING?!

[hollow dock]

Yes

why did you think otherwise?

[tropic trail]

Cause when I saw the armor before it didnt look like that.