Is that light the same light that Paladins have?
#beta-ptr-spoilers
subtle flower
polar mango
Blizzard are very much like Nintendo in that regard. They do story last.
hollow dock
Yes.
polar mango
Which makes sense for a video game but it's SO DAMN BIG they really should do something with it.
hollow dock
The Light is shared among most priests and paladins.
subtle flower
The problem is Nintendo keeps their stories pretty simplistic. Blizzard doesn't.
hollow dock
They do do somethingwithit
polar mango
Zelda would like a word with you.
hollow dock
its in more media than just their games.
Its in their comics, its in their books, its in audio dramas and manga.
subtle flower
I've played a lot of Zelda, and the stories in complexity really isn't anywhere near the complexity in WoW.
It's simple, it gets the job done.
polar mango
Basically retconned with each new game because they do it 'last' and then they were like "Hey.. uh.. it's just different generations!" Solved that problem lol.
hollow dock
When you try to link all the zelda games together it gets complex
polar mango
WoW isn't complex at all, it is just filled with tons of plotholes.
Come on.
I love WoW but this stuff is pretty generic.
hollow dock
Oh yea it is very generic storytelling
meager warren
I think TES and WoW are similar in shit-lore regards.
But tbh, WoW is worse imo
hollow dock
but the characters, how interestingthey can be is why I stay.
subtle flower
The lore in WoW is super interesting ,I've found.
polar mango
WoW is like Buffy the Vampire Slayer (the TV show) - it's just one 'big bad' each week after another.
meager warren
yes but it's super shitty
meager warren
cookies? goblins?
polar mango
Speaking of which, any over/under on the Sword in Sithilus being the login screen?
subtle flower
Maybe Christie Golden will fixi t.
hollow dock
I love some really shitty video games. Just because theyre absolute garbage doesn't mean I can't love it.
subtle flower
One of these days I need to stop mixing up Dwarves and Gnomes.
hollow dock
Its not hard. One has beards and is irish/scottish/welsh
polar mango
No it hasn't.
subtle flower
Which one is Iron Forge the capital of?
meager warren
it is hard.
1 is short. the other is slightly shorter
polar mango
Wrath and uh.... something else was not a gate.
hollow dock
Ironforge is the Capital of the Bronzebeard Dwarves.
polar mango
But yeah, Lordareon is a high probability.
subtle flower
And where are the Gnomes from?
polar mango
I hope it's Tedrassil burning.
uncut vault
dark portal twice, gates to icecrown, gates of stormwind, gates in the vale, dark portal again, legion portal
hollow dock
The gnomes hail from Gnomregon.
subtle flower
And where is that?
polar mango
Wrath wasn't 'gates' though they were far back.
hollow dock
Actually it wasn't the gates to Icecrown. You were just looking at Icecrown
Gnomregon is next to Ironforge.
subtle flower
Huh.
hollow dock
Its mostly underground
polar mango
Wrath doesn't have the gateway as the login screen.
It's just the walls and the dragon.
meager warren
Gomeregan and Ironforge are like, neighbors
hard to imagine how they're not sick of each other yet
polar mango
They've done very little in regards to that lore.
hollow dock
The gnomes, like the Dwarves and humans, originally came from the northrend continent as mechanical beings made by the Titans. The Old god, Yogg-saron, cursed them to become flesh and thus those 3 races were born.
subtle flower
Having both Dwarves and Gnomes feels redundant.
meager warren
and they should do more, Formal. They do in everything else
hollow dock
Why, just because theyre short?
meager warren
yes
subtle flower
To be fair having two kinds of elves also feels redundant.
polar mango
They should. Dwarves are kind of the backbone of the alliance.
hollow dock
Theres far more than 2 kinds of elves
polar mango
But maybe that's why there isn't much, they just don't have the drama.
subtle flower
Exactly.
polar mango
Just doing their job.
subtle flower
They've gone way overboard on the elves.
polar mango
Fucking tell me about it.
meager warren
they should have made goblins disgusting monstrosities like in Tolkien
polar mango
So sick of elves.
hollow dock
Theres the Highborne-Kaldorei, the Night elf-Kaldorei, the High Elves, the blood elves, the Shal'dorei, and now the Void Elves.
subtle flower
I like the new elves, but did we REALLY need more?
meager warren
Bliz goblins ain't my goblins!
subtle flower
No, no we did not.
meager warren
oh, and the trolls, Vris
polar mango
And it doesn't make sense. 😃
hollow dock
ah yes. The trolls are the original elves.
subtle flower
I assume they meant Nightborne.
meager warren
Highborne aren't Horde or Alliance tho
hollow dock
The Highborne have most certainly re-intigrated
polar mango
The non-tree elves. 😛
meager warren
so, blood elves?
polar mango
sighs
uncut vault
atheyve all had trees
polar mango
It was a joke.
hollow dock
Blood elves were once high elves and joined the horde.
meager warren
i refer you to Poe's Law, Formal
polar mango
I don't like police.
hollow dock
I think thatwas another joke
meager warren
you think
polar mango
Half the problem is probably because I have someone in here ignored so it's half a conversation.
shrugs
I apologize for being confusing.
hollow dock
I wonder who
meager warren
lemme guess, me
polar mango
That being said, I am now sitting here listening to wrath login music.
meager warren
yep
polar mango
Troll: nah.
hollow dock
Oh its most certainlymethen
polar mango
That would be the one.
hollow dock
Ha called it.
meager warren
poor Vris 💔
polar mango
I didn't play Wrath at launch but damn it looked fun.
hollow dock
It wasn't.
polar mango
That was the introduction to LFD?
hollow dock
Indeed it was.
polar mango
Must have been crazy to run Icecrown in her prime.
hollow dock
It really wasn't. Ever other week they nerfed it or added a damage buff aura to us
meager warren
"Evolution? Pfft. If you ask me, elves are a giant step backwards.?"
"De ladies call me... Zanda-licious, baby!"
"I am en-raptored by your eyes. "
jovial coral
Do we know dark irons mounts yet?
jovial coral
Oh that's right
graceful sleet
are upright orcs allready in bfa alpha?
uncut vault
Not playable
calm garden
well i doubt anyone has gone to the barbershop yet in the bfa alpha to check i that feature is in for the orcs
at least yet anyway6
graceful sleet
then upright orcs will be available in 8.0 patch?
gusty wolf
Don't think so.
jade basalt
@calm garden People did check, it's not in the alpha. Yet.
upper laurel
I'm not the only one who thinks the intro quest into Zandalar for the Horde side is scary af. You get Genn and Jaina closing in on you in a steady pace all Terminator style.
hollow dock
sadly they dont kill you.
languid yoke
Genn and Jaina kill Zul and Saurfang rip expansion
hollow dock
When does Saurfang die? He's just in the stocks
languid yoke
just saying if they were to kill you in that scenario then rip expansion
hollow dock
Oh OK.
zinc sandal
People die when they are killed.
jovial coral
What if outlaw got a gun auto attack
hollow dock
then why would they use the swords? and wouldn't that turn it into a ranged auto attack? Since theres no ranged slot, would that mean they equip a gun over two swords?
zinc sandal
Gun + 1H Sword when artifacts go away
jovial coral
There use to be an extra ranged slot way back in vanilla or something or am I wrong
hollow dock
The ranged slot was removed in Cata.
polar mango
Yeah, you could have like knives and stuff. I think rogues had it too.
Been a long time.
hollow dock
Rogues, warriors, mages, warlocks, etc.
they all used 'ranged' weapons
but never actually used them
Hence why they were just flat out removed.
polar mango
Might also be blurring games though. Hard to keep 15+ years of online gaming straight sometimes.
hollow dock
They were described as 'stat sticks'. As you'd never really use them and just used them for the extra stats.
jovial coral
Outlaw and/or future classes could make use of it
hollow dock
they already do with certain abilities that pull out a pocket pistol.
tulip sun
I don't know how they will do future classes...
hollow dock
But it'll never be used as a main weapon.
tulip sun
Due to legion and all
tulip sun
class order halls are important part
zinc sandal
What do you mean, Khamnin?
polar mango
Nah.
polar mango
If we don't get any new classes in the future because of some old quests no one will be doing anymore I would be very surprised.
zinc sandal
Most Order Halls will disband come BfA due to faction war.
polar mango
"Story" hasn't ever stopped Blizzard.
hollow dock
They wont disappear from legion is what Khamnin is getting at Mess
polar mango
Personally I would rather we don't get a new class but extensions to our own.
zinc sandal
No, of course not.
hollow dock
and thus they believe it'll be hard to actually level new classes through legion
As they wont retroactively add in new order halls
polar mango
In future expansion I mean.
zinc sandal
You mean like, subclass, Formal?
polar mango
Maybe this new artifact system will be what I am looking for.
hollow dock
We do already have extensions to our classes.
That's what the specs are.
This new artifact system will be like our current legendary one.
polar mango
No, just another skill-tree, some kind of extension to existing classes we have to work for. Like Mage Tower but uh... ya know for skills.
But they won't ever do that because 'fairness' and what-not.
Maybe flavoring specs. "Chrono Frost Mage" or something, I dunno.
zinc sandal
I think there is still potential for new classes if they start pulling concepts out of RPG.
polar mango
The problem with 'new classes' is that we already have a shitload.
I'm all for 'new' but I like my old too.
hollow dock
Then play the old and ignore the new. 0-
polar mango
Refining the existing is ideal to me, rather than adding more.
zinc sandal
It's not like you can't play your 'old' anymore.
polar mango
I already don't have enough time for them all. XD
Yes but as a long-time player I want my OLD classes to feel good too.
Kinda the ones we've put 10+ years in.
hollow dock
I'm a long time player and honestly, the classes have felt great with the Legion update.
polar mango
The last few expansions have been just taking away our skills and giving them back to us in another method.
zinc sandal
Classes will continue to change constantly regardless of how many we have.
polar mango
WoD was taking away out top 5 skills and giving them back to us randomly.
hollow dock
Its not like they'll ignore changes to warrior because a new class gets implimented or something.
hollow dock
wait wha.
zinc sandal
Adding new classes and redesigning old ones are not mutually exclusive. We can have both.
hollow dock
What top 5 skills got removed in WoD? o.O they did ability pruning for useless shit like Eyes of the beast.
hollow dock
You'd rather have one over the other despite both happening no matter what?
zinc sandal
I don't know about you guys, but I've always liked Priest and will continue to play it no matter how many more classes are added.
hollow dock
Same with DKs and Hunters for me.
zinc sandal
Or how many changes it goes through, for that matter.
hollow dock
Sure if they add in a new class i'll check it out, but I think those are my mains. :v
jovial coral
Priest And Monk
zinc sandal
Of course. It's not like I'd completely ignore new stuff.
jovial coral
I still don't like that every race can be a hunter
jovial coral
But not with an animal by their side
hollow dock
Not every hunter has an animal at their side.
Survivalists would because well. They're the pathfinders. They walk the land and live off it.
jovial coral
Meh they have the option in game
hollow dock
Well yea because that's just a base mechanic you can't remove unless they bake the no pet thing into Marks, which would make people really hate it because soloing without gear becomes an issue.
true matrix
lightforged have the option in-game to be shadow priests, you need to consider the separation between lore and gameplay
also good morning
hollow dock
Yea. not all gameplay directly reflects lore. :v
Mei its only been 4 hours how did you sleep that fast?
true matrix
...vris I hate to tell you this but it's been about 10 hours
jovial coral
I'm just saying I don't like it
hollow dock
Oh right. Forgot the timezone
I dont like that most races cant be outcasted classes.
plucky garden
A lightforged Shadowpreist should glow all yellow instead of shadowy.
hollow dock
shadows aren't yellow though.
plucky garden
Well, more refering to their yellow tattoos and such. Just saying they should glow a different color instead of the black stuff.
jovial coral
I may be reading too much into this but at 49:35 last Q&A josh Allen says "At the moment"
polar mango
I wouldn't be surprised to find Blizzard starts selling us cosmetic auras and stuff soon.
hollow dock
I would. That causes hell on the games engine
polar mango
They still have the glyph system sitting there and being underused.
Start moving on the idea they started with that glyphs become cosmetic only changes.
hollow dock
But that's just to shift away from manditory glyphs. .-.
polar mango
Then again, mage tower feedback was insane so it's hard to gauge where they are with cosmetics.
hollow dock
IMO they wouldn't nullify an entire profession.
jovial coral
They could just have a cosmetic glyph tab or something instead
hollow dock
So what glyphs are now?
polar mango
The only thing I want to be able to do is use my zen flight as a ground mount.
So whatever needs to happen to make that work. 😃
Glyph, mage tower challenge, fucking store bought, I don't care.
hollow dock
but its meant to be the Nimbus cloud.
jovial coral
It reminds me of Everquest
Come to think of it the sethrak kinda do too but not really
hollow dock
I mean theyre sneeple
When I first saw them I was reminded of Sen's house of fun in Dark Souls
true matrix
vris have you seen the sneeple... sleeple
polar mango
Sethrak look so good. I can't wait until they move around the group at high-speed dropping tons of CC and bleeds on us lol.
jovial coral
Crippling poisons
strong python
hahahaha
polar mango
Yeah it's gonna be a blast. 😉
jovial coral
If the sethrak become playable in the future some how I'll probably race change
polar mango
We're getting CC back though so yay!
jovial coral
Is the new shirt a clue that anduin will become corrupted
polar mango
Story-wise it's very lazy.
He just vanishes in the expansion and we have no clue what he is doing or where he is at, but his attachment to Anduin was huge and then suddenly dropped.
But yet... he still felt as though it was needed to break fuckhead out of prison. I don't... I don't understand why they just ignored him.
jovial coral
All I know is he saw the worlds destruction so he must be have a reason for everything he does
polar mango
Like releasing a madman that gets a ton of folks killed?
Altering timelines and shit.
Then he just 'poofs.'
The reality is it's just lazy on Blizzards part.
Wish they would write him up in the story though, or show what happened. Even if Legion invaded and he felt he failed or had to run or whatever, they should have included it.
World Shaman is gone now thanks to him and we're like "No big deal move on with the story.' lol.
jovial coral
To be honest I never liked wrathion
polar mango
I didn't either but I loved his role in the story. I thought MoP was one of the better ones.
Until end of SoO/WoD anyway. Not sure what happened there but okay lol.
I think the writers went on break and left it up to the interns.
jovial coral
Maybe wrathion is getting together the first races that got killed off before the worlds destruction to help stop n'zoth or whoever it is
true matrix
new cryptid: wrathion
jovial coral
Ima stick with my fan fiction for now
polar mango
Oh apparently Chromie's storyline has Wrathion in it.
I should probably do the Chromie stuff.
true matrix
https://twitter.com/k0suna/status/961545068514545664 @hollow dock
the sneeple... they sleeple
jovial coral
I said awhile back wrathion seems like a nice version of a dreadlord
zinc sandal
Make em playable yes
jovial coral
And I've also said these sneeple have similar clothing style as wrathion
So many theories
jovial coral
You know who also wanders Azeroth besides wrathion
That giant turtle
I wonder what those tortollan folks would think of that
dense plover
uh
i mean
shenzinsu is probably one of torga's children
so they probably dont care
especially because they have a baby torga to raise
jovial coral
They can move to the turtles back. BAM, new playable race old starting zone
Easy peasy lemon sqeezy
They'll be like man this neighborhood has gone down hill since this azerite rush we're moving to shenzinsu
zinc sandal
A snake who wants a snake.
steel venture
sethrak are no longer as cute imo
they apparently decapitate vulpera and offer a discount to "vulpera steaks" if you bring in a fresh head with your purchase
and have an enormous slave trade of them
zinc sandal
That sounds awesome.
hollow dock
YES THATS AMAZING
zinc sandal
Kill all the Vulpera.
rich apex
Sounds like a great addition for the Horde
polar mango
Foxes usually prey on snakes so it's just nature. 😉
The snakes evolved to defend themselves AND make a profit.
zinc sandal
Well
These snakes have arms, legs, and are quite taller
So idk who's prey and predator here
dense plover
the snakes are the predators
they enslave the vulpera
literally enslave them
we are ending that
making allies of the vulpera
allies as in help us protect zandalar from the crazies, not allies like allied races
i just realized
this is the first expansion to have independent quest zones for horde and alliance
i have no clue how they are going to do patch zones
jade basalt
There are nice Sethrak too, only the ones aligned with the mean Emperor are bad guys. Horde can get the foxies as long as Alliance gets the snakes.
languid yoke
at level 120 horde and alliance go into each other's zone anyway
we don't know how that's gonna be yet
jade basalt
this is the first expansion to have independent quest zones for horde and alliance
No ?
dense plover
warlords had 1 zone
not the entire main levelling experience
the only other part of the game to do this is vanilla
languid yoke
end game is both continents tho
languid yoke
eh vanilla mixed horde and alliance too
jade basalt
You also go to the other continent while leveling I believe. And then at 120 you unlock world quests on both continents.
dense plover
i believe the main stories for both are just on your continent
then there is end game stuff on the other one
quests
dungeons
raids
and world quests
there may be the occassional side quest
jade basalt
I think I heard that the War Campaign starts earlier than max level. It's supposed to be the equivalent of the Class Order Campaigns in Legion, which start at lvl 100-102.
jade basalt
It's just that at max level you unlock the rest. But you do go to the other continent before max level.
jade basalt
I'm not sure about that
dense plover
3 zones where the story is mainly about your faction and the zone's story
jade basalt
Could be 2 levels per zones, leaving 4 levels for the other continent/first zones.
dense plover
it isnt
in the alpha, nazmir gets you to 113
not to mention theres apparently a lot of quests that take you back and forth between zones
that right now arent available
or dont work
because you cant go to those zones
terse patrol
why do people think saurfang is going to betray the horde
dense plover
to be specific, nazmir actually would get you to above 113, probably 1/3 or 1/4 of the way, but since the level is locked at 113, theres no way to be sure
who does?
terse patrol
I’ve heard it from a few. they seem to strangely think he’ll recruit draenor orcs to the alliance, and are super mad about it
Like wat
dense plover
yeah those people are firstly insane
secondly vocal minority
saurfang is beyond honorable
polar mango
Bah.
dense plover
he has the most honor of any leader in the horde
terse patrol
I’d be game for a weird orc subrace in the alliance, but not brown orcs. Horde wanted them for ages
polar mango
Every time I get on alt that is the leggo I get lol.
dense plover
honkerton
the entire speculation is from an unvoiced - take me to your boy king
i guarantee that once they add audio, its going to be aggressive and demanding
he is going to go to anduin and tell him of the strength of the horde
he is going to tell anduin that he stands no chance
terse patrol
I’m sure he just wants to talk peace
polar mango
And then Anduin will start crying.
dense plover
he could want peace
but he wants to die in battle
im placing heavy bets that he sacrifices himself because he believes in sylvanas
not because he is switching sides
terse patrol
Im sure he’s going to tell Anduin that the Horde didnt do Teldrassil
dense plover
saurfang would be more likely to challeneg sylvanas than to switch sides
terse patrol
^
dense plover
he would never betray the horde
polar mango
Yeah no way.
terse patrol
Thats what they’re setting up ino
dense plover
it would be beyond dishonorable
terse patrol
imo
polar mango
That makes sense to move the war chief on without killing her.
dense plover
they arent going to kill saurfang
polar mango
But no way he will ever switch sides.
dense plover
they just gave him a new model
polar mango
Sylvannas would 'switch sides' before Saurfang does.
polar mango
Yeah but her hatred can be shifted.
dense plover
they refused to help with the lich king
polar mango
Saurfang is blood to the horde, for life.
dense plover
the first time
polar mango
Just saying, it's easier for her to move to alliance than him.
Which neither of would happen anyway.
sings "Half of my heart is in Sylvanas"
dense plover
i think its far more likely someone could challenge her leadership and she would just step down. who knows - its clearly going to be important in the voljin story stuff - why did he choose sylvanas
jade basalt
Though while he may not betray the Horde, he may plot against Sylvanas. He's not really happy to have her as Warchief, and in the prelude to BFA novel he says that if she ever mis-steps, he will be there to cut her neck, or something along those lines. And during the Battle for Lordaeron she ordered the Forsaken to use the Blight despite his disagreement, because it was not honorable or whatever. That's just lore though, a story-design counterpoint would be that, personally, I doubt they'll pull another 5.3 with a Horde leader asking the Alliance to help him take down the current Warchief. So yeah I don't think they'd do that.
Siege of Orgrimmar, the Return
dense plover
no way in hell
he said if she went crazy, he would stand up for the horde
but he wouldnt plot behind her back unless she was going crazy
and theres no evidence of that so far
jade basalt
Replace the end boss with Sylvanas and the Heart of Zakazj instead of Heart of Y'Shaarj, the Dark Shaman by Forsaken Alchemists, Nazgrim with Nathanos, and there you go. 🤔
dense plover
they also def arent pulling another garrosh
its brought up in the book preview
she mentions how she knows she has to be better than garrosh
she has to be a real leader
and stay out of the shadows
part of her story is going to be that struggle
jade basalt
Yea I led my point with "I don't think they'd do that", the rest is mostly joking. Though to be fair using the Blight is hardly being better than Garrosh, who was against it.
dense plover
the datamined lines are literally along the lines of, we are out of time, the alliance is here, we need to evacuate
terse patrol
Blight is dishonorable.
dense plover
sure it is
jade basalt
Yeah. And Saurfang disagrees with that.
terse patrol
Orcs would rather die honorably, than live a dishonorable coward.
dense plover
but disagreement doesnt mean he thinks she is insane
he isnt an idiot
he isnt going to see the blight as sylvanas losing her shit
he will certainly see it as dishonorable
jade basalt
Except we're talking from Saurfang's point of view, talking about Saurfang's motivations. So yes Sylvanas using the Blight would be a hard negative for him, specially if her goal was to "be better than Garrosh". That's my only point I'm not sure there's much debate to have.
terse patrol
Horde needs an Orc back on the throne.
dense plover
i think he would also see that she isnt doing it for no reason though
yeah saurfang wants to die in battle - but i dont think he would be okay with the slaughtering of the population of the undercity
he isnt a single opinion
he has facets
terse patrol
The Horde’s always been about honor. Under Sylvanas, it’s just about winning.
jade basalt
Again, he still disagrees with the use of the Blight.
dense plover
i mean
blight isnt about winning
blight is about not getting slaughtered
without the blight, saurfang would be dead, and so would a ton of innocents
jade basalt
And orcs are about honor.
dense plover
but they know everyone else isnt
the horde isnt about honor. the horde is about being strong together
the horde is about outcasts being accepted
jade basalt
And honor.
jade basalt
And tauren, and trolls.
dense plover
this is why not having an orc in charge is a good thing
seeing the viewpoints of all of the other races
tauren and trolls are honorable, but that isnt the focal point of their culture
dense plover
that is only the case for orcs
we will be seeing whats important to trolls in BfA - apparently all of the factions are at some kind of meeting
jade basalt
I don't know why you keep arguing. It doesn't matter what you or me think of the use of the Blight, my point is that Saurfang disagrees with it, hates it, no matter if it's used just for fun or because there's a legitimate reason for it. Nobody is talking about the legitimacy of the use of the Blight, we are talking about what reasons Saurfang would have to dislike, or even plot against, Sylvanas. That's one reason.
dense plover
what evidence do we have that he hates it
we know he is against its use
and believes it is dishonorable
terse patrol
lets be real tho, the Forsaken are no longer the “outcasts”. Mistreated and the like. They revel in their twisted existence, and choose to spread their undeath.
dense plover
theres nothing about him hating it
terse patrol
Rather than die heroicly.
dense plover
theres nothing about him feeling so upset that he would switch sides
not even hints of that
ofc it is alpha
but i really doubt it
dense plover
again, saurfang is the guy who if he believed sylvanas is on the wrong path, he would tell her and if she wouldnt listen, he would challenge her to a trial by combat
jade basalt
Not enough to switch sides, but enough to dislike Sylvanas and challenge her. That's literally just as simple as that.
dense plover
from the book
She was not fond of any of them, but Varok Saurfang was the one she gave grudging respect. He was intelligent, strong, fierce ... and, like Baine, loyal. But there was something in the orc's eyes that always put her on alert when she gazed into them. The knowledge that if she misstepped too badly he might well challenge her, perhaps even oppose her.
jade basalt
I'm not backing up people that say Saurfang has betrayed the Horde, at all. There may have been a misunderstanding.
Yeah that's what I said.
dense plover
there are people making an improper extrapolation
jade basalt
Yup. I'm not one of them tho.
dense plover
i know
but the beginning of this discussion was why they were wrong
and then you posted some devil's advocate-esque stuff
so i was posting my side of this
rich apex
People making rush judgements of a plot when they've only seen the first act?
Who would ever do that?
jade basalt
I just said "Though to be fair using the Blight is hardly being better than Garrosh, who was against it." and that sparked a whole argument
Again I'm not defending those guys.
dense plover
i guess i misunderstood a bit
i know it wasnt your opinion that saurfang would switch sides though
thats just plain silly
jade basalt
Unless he escapes with a bronze dragon to an alternate Draenor where he recruits more orcs to- wait
rich apex
:|a
I still don't get why we're going to Draenor
Every time WoD comes up in a discord chat
Someone immeadiately brings up what they hated about it
jade basalt
Or rather, Draenor is coming to us. 🤔
rich apex
Plus, the Grom/Durotan Question
Unless we're recruiting the Laughing Skulls and ignoring them entirely
Or Grom dies, I guess
But hey, let's tell the Iron orcs they were -totally right- to try and dominate their world for the Horde
jade basalt
Though technically the map could also be intended for MU Draenor, in a sort of vision of the past or something. Without view on all the Iron Horde assets obviously, like how AU Tanaan Jungle was used for the Lightforged scenario but after removing all the Iron Horde and Fel-corruption stuff (well at least as best as they could).
rich apex
Truuuue
I'm still assuming the Lightforged scenario was a vision
And they just reused the assets
It's not a straight up copy like the Gorgrond map
At least I don't think it is?
rich apex
Oh for sure. And brown orcs were an obvious choice.
dense plover
assuming that the gorgrond map is correct, and the forest HAS been cut down
jade basalt
It is a straight up copy of the AU Tanaan Jungle, but they did remove the fel corruption and Iron Horde assets. Well, as best as they could. If you go out of bound you can still end up in AU Draenor subzones or find an Iron Horde ship on the beach etc.
rich apex
Oh, huh
jade basalt
I'm talking about the Lightforged scenario
terse patrol
I think the Horde are getting Iron Horde remnants, and the Draenei join the Alliance. I don’t mean as yet another Draenei Allied Race, but to let characters like Yrel return.
dense plover
assuming theyve removed the forest for a reason, there ccould just straight up be an orc overpopulation issue - with no fighting between the clans, the orcs need somewhere to go - why not MU azeroth
jade basalt
As for the GorgrondOrcs map it's literally just the WoD Alpha Gorgrond but they're using the live version of the harbor, and they re-textured the region a bit.
dense plover
yeah
which makes me think they did that for a reason
it wouldve been easier to copy the current map
jade basalt
Maybe to differentiate it from AU Draenor, by pretending this is MU Draenor.
rich apex
I'm still highly skeptical they'd bring over Yrel, much less timey wimey characters like Grom and Durotan
rich apex
You can't bring back Grom Hellscream and then leave him as a B team hero with Mayla
dense plover
thats what outland is silly
jade basalt
In the past, I mean.
dense plover
we arent going back in time
they specifically said it was draenor orcs
its very clearly going to be the brown orcs from WoD
possibly laughing skull
rich apex
I do like the past vision theory, but it seems unlikely, alas
rich apex
Durotan: join your war? lol fuck that
dense plover
but they chose the other map for a reason
clearly the forest being gone is important
jade basalt
Didn't say we were going back in time. It could be a vision, or the scenario is set 30 years in the past. Or, again, it is AU Draenor but they wanted to show that it changed a bit since WoD, probably with the Botani gone the forest is gone too.
rich apex
Assuming there's that many orcs left after we wrecked the Iron Horde and Iron-Fel Horde
Outside of the Frostwovles and Laughing Skulls
dense plover
thats what im saying
without the forest
the orcs have nothing to fight
not enough resources
join MU azeroth
rich apex
Ehhh
rich apex
Considering Draenor's a major threat free, uncorrupted, un blown up paradise
dense plover
yeah
rich apex
And the remaining orcs are free of fel bloodlust
dense plover
but then what do they fight
rich apex
I don't get why they'd want to go anywhere
rich apex
Not the pre Horde orcs
rich apex
Like it was improtant because they lived on a death world
But their thing was still honor the elements, reverse the ancestors, hunt the clefthoof
dense plover
the idea of dying in combat was before their world was dying
thats a core part of orc culture
rich apex
It's a part but they didn't war for the sake for war
dense plover
no
rich apex
Of course, they didn't need to with ogres and shit
dense plover
what do you do when your children reach adulthood rapidly, and you need more resources since they arent dying
you cut down trees
you mine
and not knowing how much is too much
you overdo it
especially when your children reach adulthood faster than any other race
rich apex
I will be highly impressed if the orcs managed to overpopulate Draenor in a year or two
dense plover
so now you dont have enough resources
rich apex
After the losses from the Iron Horde's defeat
dense plover
overpopulation can happen very quickly
terse patrol
i think I'm the only one who wants yrel to return, written by christie golden
dense plover
especially when going from tribal to not tribal
rich apex
I can dig that
rich apex
But there is that, yes
dense plover
she didnt even have anything interesting
tulip sun
I like yrel
terse patrol
We need a Maraad replacement
dense plover
no we dont
rich apex
More than one racial representative? Ha
dense plover
we have the fareeya
tulip sun
Yrel is inevitable I think, if horde gets au orcs
dense plover
why?
rich apex
Assuming the Alliance goes back to Draenor too
dense plover
we see thalyssra
tulip sun
Fareeya is lightforged, not regular draenei
terse patrol
Alliance players will be pissed if the Horde gets AU Orcs, and the AU Draenei don't join the Alliance.
tulip sun
Ya
rich apex
Because the major race heroes hardly get equal screentime
dense plover
AU draenei are just draenei
terse patrol
I know
tulip sun
Still adds characters
dense plover
and again
terse patrol
But I'm talking about AU Draenei characters,
rich apex
Adding a quest to recruit AU draenie is pointless
tulip sun
That they spent a whole expansion in
jade basalt
In before "Draenor Orcs" means pale orcs.
tulip sun
You could say that to a lot of people
dense plover
yes
rich apex
Alliance needs to recruit some kind of Allied Race if Horde does
dense plover
sure
tulip sun
That is why you need to bring them back and develop them
rich apex
But there's no obvious choice from Draemor
dense plover
it doesnt have to be on draenor though
rich apex
True
dense plover
they could recruit kul tirans
rich apex
Also true
tulip sun
If one faction goes to draenor, I suspect the others will.
dense plover
why?
rich apex
I would expect that tho, yes
terse patrol
You're forgetting that they can easily make Yrel not "burnt toast boring."
rich apex
Because we know what's happening on Broken Isles
dense plover
theres no argus parallel for the horde allied races
rich apex
Arugs is still part of Legion content
terse patrol
You guys are acting like Baine Bloodhoof was even remotely relevant until Cataclysm.
tulip sun
They are all from legion
dense plover
silvermoon isnt
tulip sun
This is draenor
jade basalt
Alliance gets Podlings while Horde gets DraenorOrcs.
dense plover
void elves are in ghostlands
rich apex
They're tied to Alleria
tulip sun
Voidbelves were set up in legion
dense plover
and?
tulip sun
Your like talking to a wall
dense plover
alliance isnt going to go to draenor
if i was a gambler i would place bets
they arent going to recruit draenei
rich apex
Probably
dense plover
they are the same draenei
terse patrol
also
rich apex
I had just assumed it was an easy parallel with Outland to do Mag'har and Broken
But apparenetly not
tulip sun
I am not saying they'd become a race
dense plover
then why would they go?
terse patrol
Don't you guys want Exarch Akama?
dense plover
the whole purpose of allied race recruitment is getting new races
not going back to old places just cuz story
tulip sun
It would be like other npc factions, similar to how the revantusk will help the horde in bfa
rich apex
They won't make new content just for continuity's sake
dense plover
thats not even sort of equivalent
terse patrol
Alliance are likely getting Kul Tiran humans, while Horde get Draenor Orcs.
tulip sun
It would be using old assets they spent time and money on top
dense plover
revantusk are on zandalar
tulip sun
Too
dense plover
they are already there
terse patrol
Still doesn't mean that the Alliance can't ask the AU Draenei for help.
tulip sun
If your revisiting draenor, mine as well take it
dense plover
no
its a fucking faction conflict
horde isnt going to bring alliance
and if horde is going in
guaranteed that they protect the entrance
terse patrol
Exarch. Akama. Tho.
tulip sun
You really think the au draenei will sit and watch as the au orcs join the horde to fight the alliance who helped them greatly?
rich apex
They're not going to make timey wimey character plot relevant
dense plover
^
i dont think you understand how the allied race stuff works khamnin
its not going to be a major storyline
dense plover
its going to be a 20 minute thing
tulip sun
My first thought that, something happens to an draenor to turn it into outland, and the au come to azeroth.
dense plover
they arent going to make one for alliance just to tell story
rich apex
The Horde going to only recruit the Laughing Skulls, who allied with the Horde, makes enough sense, I guess
dense plover
then you know that what you are describing is silly
rich apex
And also dodges the Durotan/Grom question
dense plover
^
rich apex
And the draenei question
tulip sun
It is not silly to bring back yrel if they are going there. Who knows, but if they do she is likely to come back
dense plover
she isnt even an interesting character
jade basalt
This is the alpaca model from Torchlight, and it honestly feels like it would also fit perfectly in WoW (since we know there's an alpaca model coming with BFA). https://d1u5p3l4wpay3k.cloudfront.net/torchlight_gamepedia/thumb/1/11/Pet_alpaca.png/300px-Pet_alpaca.png?version=4bd8c6d50a92272e446ff8778fcaebc4
dense plover
why do you want her back?
rich apex
Going to AU Darenor at all is silly, man
But far be it from me to guess what BLizz is thinking
terse patrol
Blizzard's the ones who made Warlords of Draenor, keep that in mind.
rich apex
Blizz also surely knows how most people feel about WoD
tulip sun
That doesn't matter for what you think? She was a major character in draenor, so if they return there is No reason not to have her make at least a cameo, after her being a major part of wod.
terse patrol
I think Blizzard wants to try and salvage Warlords of Draenor.
dense plover
what?
rich apex
She probably does deserve one, but probably won't get it 😛
rich apex
It would be nice to check up on both sides
But that's more work than they're going to do
polar mango
I want an alpaca.
dense plover
who gives a fuck about either side?
dense plover
no they didnt
polar mango
I also want a giant elephant.
dense plover
she had a questline
and it sucked
and a cutscene
with like one line
maraad was infinitely more interesting
because he has backstory
and character
but hes dead
polar mango
Void Elf story kinda pissed me off because the other half of it is on the horde side.
They should have somehow shown us both all that.
terse patrol
Mrpeach, why are you thiss flustered over people wanting a character they like back?
dense plover
no they shouldnt have
polar mango
I hate going on Youtube to find out the rest of the fucking plot.
tulip sun
That is your opinion, that you keep repeating. You bc ould learn backstory and develop character if she comes back though. It is no guarantee, but if they take stuff from draenor, I can't see them not doing it.
dense plover
unlock nightborne
rich apex
Use the freebie boost to roll a Hordie
dense plover
how can you see them not doing it?
i can
heres how
only horde goes back to draenor
ta da
polar mango
Nah.
tulip sun
That iis a simple way to look at it...a bit too simple.
terse patrol
Anduin frown when he see Grom Hellscream battling his forces in Kul Tiras
"wonder whats goin on...."
dense plover
half the fucking game is super simple
terse patrol
He shrug
dense plover
i dont think it will be those orcs
i think it will be laughing skull
hence gorgrond
tulip sun
The au orcs would be fighting against people the draenei died and fought with. All I am saying us at least a cameo
polar mango
Would prefer they just give us more fleshed out storylines instead of hiding half behind another 100 hours of leveling. 😉
No biggie.
tulip sun
Hmm. I keep reading that there is a forest troll officer in the warfronts
terse patrol
Laughing Skull Orc armor looks nothing like the Allied Race gear the Draenor Orcs are getting.
dense plover
you keep saying there has to be a cameo. if the horde are there, why would she even show up? she has no reason to care about what they are doing. they arent fighting the draenei anymore, so why does she care
terse patrol
He think hard
terse patrol
I wonder what other clan is in Gorgrond...
dense plover
its more traditional orc armor
terse patrol
He think
dense plover
i mean actual iron horde
terse patrol
I wonder what clan saurfang is.......
He think harder
i wonder what clan eitrigg is....
tulip sun
I am not saying it is a must. I am saying it'd be likely. We have no clue what has been happening on draenor.
dense plover
oh yeah
terse patrol
he skull begin to crack from hard think
dense plover
blackrock is there too
armor still doesnt match tho
@tulip sun
the expac ended with them making peace
why in fuck would there be a cameo>
she has people to take care of in a different zone
why would she even be there?
give me a reason
not just - because she is important
why would she even care?
terse patrol
but yes. Since we know we're getting DRAENOR Orcs, and we know there's some new map of Gorgrond, and we specifically see Eitrigg at the Horde feasting table.
I'm pretty sure the Blackrock Clan is joining us.
terse patrol
They will need a new leader since Blackhand is dead, so I assume Saurfang or Eitrigg will mak'gora for leadership maybe.
terse patrol
Seeing as how Blizzard's been on a glowy eye kick lately, Blackrocks are fitting.
Since they have glowy eyes.
terse patrol
terse patrol
dense plover
it has been a few years
armor still doesnt make sense though
matches up more with the brown orcs on outland than on draenor
which is weird
tulip sun
Mrpeach, no offense but I am done with the conversation. Anything I say you just repeat yourself.
terse patrol
Could be the Iron Horde are chilling out with the "cover everything in Iron" thought process.
kinda wish AU Blackhand wasnt dead though. As silly and anime looking as he was, he looked badass. Good voice actor, too.
dense plover
you gave the same reason after 4 different questions khamnin. the fact that you cant come up with a reason beyond "she was important" and "if they are there, she might as well have a cameo" means that the reasoning is purely implicit bias from the fact that you like yrel as a character and want to see her more. while there is nothing wrong with liking her, basing speculation off of things you like, because you like them, is ridiculous
i mean
Honk
isnt the armor red
with bones
like the horde armor from WC3?
and the ogrimmar exalted armor?
tulip sun
It is not because I like her...i just think it would m
make sense if she
appeared
dense plover
why?
like just explain why
you keep saying it would make sense
why?
you are giving an opinion, not speculating, because you arent providing any reasoning
strong python
excuse me guys
just dropping in the discussion
I kinda see the @tulip sun 's point
it's pretty much like "hey, Horde is gathering some cool allies from Draenor, let's do the same so we can't be equal in strength"
dense plover
but there are no allies to gather
strong python
btw, sorry in advance for bad english
dense plover
they arent going to recruit the draenei
its the same race
i dont expect the alliance will even be let in to the portal
dense plover
i dont see them doing that
strong python
I mean yes, they could give a shit about lore and stuff and ignore them
dense plover
and if that is the case
strong python
but wouldn't make much sense in my opinion
dense plover
then when the alliance goes to recruit a new race
strong python
just like on BfA
dense plover
what doe the horde get?
a scenario of what?
they arent going to give the alliance more story than the horde
strong python
they are at war, they need new forces
horde needs new naval strength and goes to Zandalari
alliance goes and try the same stuff with the Kul Tiras
strong python
and horde goes back to Draenor to get more people
what is so strange about Alliance doing the same to get equal?
dense plover
thats the opposite of your example
strong python
maybe the even go to MU Draenor (aka Outland) and get some Broken army, who knows
dense plover
that could make sense
but you are saying
factions go to two different continents
evidence for same continent (draenor)
those are opposites
tulip sun
Draenor is an entire world....
dense plover
if horde goes to draenor to get a new allied race. What is the new allied race for the alliance? why does it have to be draenor? Answer = it doesnt!
strong python
but they just do that because they have no other "options"
I mean, what would Alliance do at Zandalar?
dense plover
theres no evidence of allied races for the alliance on draenor
strong python
who would they recruit?
tulip sun
The alliance won't get an allied race in draenor, they'd gain more draenei and named characters
dense plover
the current allied race ideas for alliance based on datamining are dark iron and kul tirans
strong python
I'm not saying it DOES HAVE to be on Draenor tho
dense plover
what does horde get then khamnin?
tulip sun
Obviously draenor orcs
strong python
chances are that they'll finally convince the Kul Tiras to join them with some crazy shit Druid Humans
dense plover
if the alliance gets a second scenario, not tied to allied race recruitment, what does the hrode get when alliance gets their allied race recruitment scenario?
thats my fucking point khamnin
strong python
BUT it doesn't mean that Yrel and her gang joining the Alliance doesn't make sense
they could do that
tulip sun
Your getting a bit phased over this peach....take a deep breath
dense plover
do i need to break this down for numebrs?
tulip sun
Pissed*
dense plover
horde gets a scenario on draenor
thats 1 scenario for horde
they recruit allied race
you want alliance to go there and not get an allied race
thats 1 scenario for alliance
strong python
it doesn't necessarily need a scenario for alliance
dense plover
then alliance recruit a new race
tulip sun
Mrpeach, we are not saying for certain or anything, just stop.
tulip sun
All I mean, is it would be likely for them to appear
strong python
I mean, the AU draenei may even join during the HORDE scenario
dense plover
because what im saying is
strong python
like "hey man, wtf are you doing joining their war?"
dense plover
holy shit
why would they
they are at peace
the draenei have no reason to give any fucks about the iron horde
dense plover
you dont just throw in side characters for the fuck of it
gilded drum
Why would they though
dense plover
^
gilded drum
Why do we need any allied races rn is the real question
dense plover
more people to fight our battles
strong python
lol @gilded drum good question
dense plover
more fodder for the army
gilded drum
Yeah but we are getting what
dense plover
my point is
gilded drum
3 more per faction
strong python
just cool new skins to players I guess
gilded drum
Why do we need more
dense plover
there is no fucking reason for the alliance to go to draenor
gilded drum
I agree.
dense plover
and theres no reason for yrel or the draenei to show up
she has no reason to care about the horde and the blackrock orcs
it doesnt effect her
gilded drum
The only thing I want from Draenor is Yrel to have an actual storyline
dense plover
that wont happen
gilded drum
But it’s too late for that
dense plover
shes a nobody
strong python
I don't believe it will happen BUT it wouldn't be out of nothing
dense plover
it kind of would though
gilded drum
Why would war go to Draenor. We already fixed that problem.
dense plover
'gorgrond is nowhere near the draenei
yrel is in shadowmoon
and she has 0 reason to give any fucks
hey orcs, come live with the other orcs
strong python
@gilded drum again, just like peach said, more fodder to the arrmy
dense plover
draenei - what? why do you want to leave draeneor?
oh wait
we dont care
we have shadowmoon
strong python
it's not just "Live with other orcs"
dense plover
yes it is
strong python
it's battle for them
gilded drum
Yeah but Eraser. Why would we go to Draenor to get more fodder.
dense plover
idk
gilded drum
I understand the whole
dense plover
but we do
strong python
@gilded drum again, just the whole "cool new skins for players"
dense plover
my guess is the orcs take heavy losses at lordaeron
or
saurfang being captured is demoralizing
so they need orcs who arent demoralized
gilded drum
He chooses to stay in prison
you go to rescue him
He’s like
I didn’t ask for this
Leave me here
And stays
strong python
I know but was it a part of the plan?
or they were there just to rescue the princess?
gilded drum
It was a part of the plan.