#Guidance Request: Permissibility of Material Distributed on Arma Reforger Workshop Inspired by Halo

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

gentle summit
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@jolly wagon I believe that you would be the point of contact on this, but I've created this as a thread so that it is not lost in the ongoing discussion in the IP channel.

odd basin
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. so i can keep an eye on this

burnt rock
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Thirded

wary solstice
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Did you read the part where the issue lies in that Arma Reforger is an app sold on an app store and is therefore explicitly against the Microsoft rules?

worthy abyss
unique kestrel
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My reading of it is that you cannot use the content in an app that YOU sell, i.e., you can't develop the game then sell that content either with it or alongside it.

The workshop also does not incur any additional fees to use or browse.

I'm not a lawyer though

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"Other people have gotten away with it!" isn't exactly a bulletproof defence, I know, but given that there's been quite a few prolific Halo mods for various games, which are sold then accessed via a mod workshop, and there's never been to my knowledge any issue with it, I think all things point to it being ok.

true urchin
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Basically until BI gives an announcement/clarifications we have to wait and see

lost obsidian
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@gentle summit

image.png
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Looks like a big overreaction with people getting confused in the middle

low cargo
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A giant mixing bowl of Misunderstandings/Miscommunication

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@odd basin

lost obsidian
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Correct, I believe the original point made around the section:
You also can't use Game Content in an app that you sell in an app store.

Its more of a, this could be a problem, not that it is a problem

low cargo
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Yeah, im sure the language barriers did not help the situation at all either.

gentle summit
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@jolly wagon even with the above, I would appreciate clarification in this thread for future reference, and to additionally ensure that the exact wording in the following linked message and the context that it's replying to aren't being misconstrued or misinterpreted - I'm sure you are more than just aware, that mods as a type of content exist in a particular gray space, which becomes even less defined when making use of other existing intellectual property, such that the exact wording of guidelines and rules regarding said content matters almost dramatically. Depending on what is said, and how it is said, it can entirely change what is permissible content, what is acceptable derivative works, etc.

The following message and it's context is, from what I understand (as I was tuned into this entire issue by others that were already reacting to it as though) it meant all Halo content, regardless of their following of existing guidelines by Microsoft/Xbox/Halo Studies (actual IP holders for Halo), was impermissible content moving forward on the Workshop within Arma Reforger:

#ip_rights_violations message

jolly wagon
# gentle summit <@272245679013888011> even with the above, I would appreciate clarification in t...

What began as a simple reply to a loosely directed question eventually turned into a discussion about Halo. Setting that aside (Forget anything from any other modders and the discussions there, as not everything was always connected to this case during the mess), let’s focus on what’s important:

Responsibility for mod creation lies with you. If you violate the terms of the license provided, legal liability will fall on you. From our side, we are obligated to take appropriate action if necessary.

Based on the license we previously discussed, it appears you’re permitted to create fan-made content. However, we’re currently reviewing one particular clause that might present an issue specifically, because the Workshop is managed by us and integrated with the game.

To be clear: there is no call to action to remove or ban content regarding this, nor has there ever been. It’s true that some Halo mods have been removed, but only in cases where content was directly ripped.

lost obsidian
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Thank you 🙂

jolly wagon
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This last part, is why we can't tell you it is allowed on our platform until sorted.

lost obsidian
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Is the plan to provide an update once the relevant clause has been investigated?

jolly wagon
lost obsidian
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Perfect 🙂

jolly wagon
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Thing is

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People ask for transparency on possible issues

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Get the answer and freak out.

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Then this freak out causes everyone to get confused

lost obsidian
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Yeah unfortunately this is not new, I remember when the monetization rules first came in for a3. People did the same thing

jolly wagon
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Whatever you might think, we want what is safe for you to do.

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So do not get mad when we actually tell you something is not allowed.

gentle summit
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Thank you for the clarification Mario, I appreciate it immensely! What clause in particular is under review that may be an issue? Is this referring to usage rules from Bohemia Interactive on the Workshop, or to licensing guidelines within the Xbox Game Content Usage Rules from Microsoft?

jolly wagon
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If it was late in the game, then I apologize for that.

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At least you got the answer at some point.

lost obsidian
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Its this bit I believe:

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cobalt lance
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(which to be clear and to avoid any confusion, in the case of Uppercut, they themselves took it down. Their statement implies they believed it was announced that Halo mods were banned. Someone I believe to be affiliated with the mod stated the mod contains a great deal of assets they made but they're looking into everything to make sure it fits the guidelines, I'm sure they'll update at some point. Seems to be a combination of misunderstanding and an abundance of caution but beyond that anything else is speculation)

gentle summit
lost obsidian
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Yeah fair I'd rather have mario confirm

true urchin
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Thanks Mario for the clarification hopefully everything will be ironed out

cyan canyon
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Thank you, Mario, for taking the time to explain everything for us. We appreciate the work you do here.

odd basin
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That's from last night

burnt rock
cobalt lance