#ip_rights_violations | ARMA | Page 38

soft egret Jun 25, 2018, 3:51 PM

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you can DMCA if you own the content

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no matter if you uploaded it anywhere

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You might need to additionally provide proof that it's yours later.

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:51 PM

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You only have to show proof, that the content is originaly yours.

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What map are you talking about i.e. what workshop-file?

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:52 PM

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Okay where can i report them on the Flag right under the Picture?

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Its a Modification of Lakeside.. selfmade on the base of Applegate

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:53 PM

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Yep, the flag will lead you to further things.

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:53 PM

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Okay thanks alot

soft egret Jun 25, 2018, 3:53 PM

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The flag alone just reports it. It doesn't do a DMCA

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when you click on the flag there is a link in the text to create a DMCA

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:54 PM

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Just one thought: As Lakeside was released as ShareAlike, isnt it the case that any subsequent mods based upon it have to use the same license according to BI-guidelines?

faint nacelle Jun 25, 2018, 3:55 PM

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yes

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:56 PM

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So basically anyone can take that "totally overholed" stuff and develop it further to his likings. Might then be hard to tell/show steam that its totally your own creation (as it is not)

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:56 PM

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And thats my Problem

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its gonna be hard to proof its mine

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:57 PM

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As you cant, as it isnt

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And as even when you can show them your own parts, it still has to be released as ShareAlike so anybody can take it and change it further to his needs.

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Thats the reason to develop own maps and not change others

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You might try, but i think it will be hard to achieve anything here.

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 3:59 PM

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The PBO of the Map was not Binarized. They just changed to Config. Overwrited my name with there Server and the project lead of the Server

faint nacelle Jun 25, 2018, 4:00 PM

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Off the top of my head the ShareAlike license allows that

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also dont share your stuff unbinarized

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stuff like maps should be packed properly

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:00 PM

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I didnt shared it they took it from the ArmA3Sync Repository

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Its packed there is no Source shared they cant do anything on the map but the PBO was open

faint nacelle Jun 25, 2018, 4:01 PM

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what they might not have permission to do is to upload it on SW

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as its not all their work

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but the license on the files you used transfer on your work too

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:02 PM

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They uploaded so much u can check it yourself if u want

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https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1393458313

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:02 PM

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are we talking about a terrain or mission...?

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:03 PM

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Terrain

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:03 PM

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Lakeside...

faint nacelle Jun 25, 2018, 4:03 PM

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theres quite likely some other peoples stuff there who might be interested to DMCA them

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:03 PM

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ok... i'm out 😄

faint nacelle Jun 25, 2018, 4:03 PM

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but thats up to them

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:03 PM

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Funny to see LifeCommunity turn on each others 😉

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:03 PM

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I know some of you dont like Life Server buts its the same bullshit for content creators

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Always dealing with people who doesnt give a shit and take ur shit 😄

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:04 PM

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as said... support valve with propper proof, case closed

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if you can't...

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¯_(ツ)_/¯

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:04 PM

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Im gonna try my best

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Well they are people who upload CityLife3 and other shit they dont care about it

coral torrent Jun 25, 2018, 4:05 PM

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@safe arrow Lifers hate other lifers more than non lifers do

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:05 PM

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No its different. As the content was originally and totally created by them, with their own licenses. Lakeside and Kellys are Shared to the public, anyone can take any version and further develop it.
In theory no one of them will be allowed to upload any of those versions as its not totally theirs, without the explicit permission of the original creators. But i am not sure if they are even around.

mint edge Jun 25, 2018, 4:06 PM

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just make a completely original life map

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:06 PM

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☝

faint nacelle Jun 25, 2018, 4:06 PM

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if theyre not around == permission cant be asked == defaults to no permission

mint edge Jun 25, 2018, 4:06 PM

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much easier to prove its urs ;P

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if it's someone else's map who let others take and modify it

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:07 PM

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@desert sparrow
to be fair, i know not even one lifer community that doesn't violate in one way or another. i have never seen a 100% clean framework, just copy/pase from other servers

mint edge Jun 25, 2018, 4:07 PM

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90% chance

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they let people take the modified version.

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an release that

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best to contact the original author

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and hear their words

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depending on what they say

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:07 PM

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@dull moon NoPixel did something amazing to the Life Community but knew LifeCommunity is shit and went to GTA

mint edge Jun 25, 2018, 4:07 PM

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that reupload may be in the clear

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:08 PM

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you can see on every modserver NP mods

faint nacelle Jun 25, 2018, 4:08 PM

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lets not talk about gta modding. Its all wildlands there

mint edge Jun 25, 2018, 4:08 PM

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gta && garrysmod

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xd

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who even made Jackson county

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:11 PM

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Applegate did

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:11 PM

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let's not dig that s**t up again...

the only way to create a propper lifer server is:

get a fresh framework with no mods included
build a new "mission" on it and add only mods that are confirmed original content (impussibru)

mint edge Jun 25, 2018, 4:11 PM

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you should ask applegate

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it is his original work

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so he has the final say in a lot of things

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:13 PM

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That was falcos and Sirel76 who created that project as far as i remember.

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Yep: http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=26898

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:13 PM

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@desert sparrow
got a file list of your pack to take a look at?

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:14 PM

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i have no list atm

mint edge Jun 25, 2018, 4:14 PM

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well whoever-the-fuck did the original heightmap sat map mask an object placement / whoever was "project lead" or whoever originally has the rights

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God knows how many people put their greasy hands on it

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just find the original dude and ask him xd

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:15 PM

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@desert sparrow
mind taking some screens of your folder?

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:15 PM

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Although they mention @valid sand for the orginal work in their credits

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:15 PM

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yea i can do it

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:15 PM

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@mint edge
wait... did you...? did you just mention JACKSON COUNTY MAP?

mint edge Jun 25, 2018, 4:16 PM

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that's the map

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he edited

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someone else took

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:16 PM

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Jackson County is the remake for A3 of Applegate, yes

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:17 PM

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0 days since the mentioning of jackson county

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:17 PM

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Here too? Thought this was only a thing in #arma3_terrain 😉

dull moon Jun 25, 2018, 4:18 PM

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i made it global

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deal with it 😄

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 4:18 PM

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👍

astral marlin Jun 25, 2018, 4:35 PM

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As a note falcos did not make anything he just asked for permission to post it on the bis forums

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my 5 cents lol good night

fossil basalt Jun 25, 2018, 6:18 PM

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@desert sparrow lakeside/applegate was made by Opteryx.

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 6:19 PM

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but i completly changed it

fossil basalt Jun 25, 2018, 6:19 PM

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(Which means you have no claim/cannot DMCA)

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 6:19 PM

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i made my own lakeside

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yea that was the point i didnt reported it

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im gonna try to get in touch with the server owners

safe arrow Jun 25, 2018, 6:22 PM

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You didnt make your own lakeside, you changed it based upon the sourcefiles from the original version.

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That still makes Opteryx Applegate the original one and your "just" a modification no matter how much you changed.

desert sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 6:23 PM

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Yea thats what i tryed to tell 😄

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yea thats why i didnt reported it

olive sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 8:07 PM

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well someone at Valve is blind as a bat.

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From: DMCA [mailto:dmca@valvesoftware.com] 
Sent: 25 June 2018 19:37
Subject: copyright complaint 10060

Hello Rob,
We’ve received your copyright complaint against this content:  https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1361987046
However, upon initial review we don’t see the Unsung content listed in their mod.  Will you please take a second look to verify that your content is still in this mod?  If you still see your content then please provide a quick description and we’ll remove the mod.
Thanks for your time,
DMCA

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From: Eggbeast 
Sent: 25 June 2018 21:05
Subject: RE: copyright complaint 10060

Hi there
I have attached a list of 176 files that are contained in the 819 mod pack, which belong to us at the Unsung mod team.
I have also attached a screenshot of the folder I downloaded when subscribing to this mod pack on the workshop.
You can clearly see our files inside their pack.
I hope this proves a satisfactory response. If you need anything else, please let me know.
Kind regards
Rob 
Licensing manager, and Lead developer
The Unsung Vietnam War Mod

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all hail the mighty @river spear for assitance wit hthe file lists - what a great tool

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I filed this DMCA on 19th May.

soft egret Jun 25, 2018, 8:21 PM

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That DMCA guy seems to be a nice dude though. ALthough his name is a little weird

river spear Jun 25, 2018, 8:38 PM

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I always fear that someday someone files a DMCA for an item and then the steam reviewer says nothing is in there and the whole time my system was giving out false information

chilly pebble Jun 25, 2018, 8:40 PM

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I like to think that this confirms my theory that all videos taken down on Youtube is indeed by one man - DMCA.

fossil basalt Jun 25, 2018, 9:02 PM

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They’re a famous rap group ... RUN - DMCA

echo orchid Jun 25, 2018, 9:02 PM

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https://www.reddit.com/r/arma/comments/8tt1b3/comment/e1a3sfi?st=JIUQZA6Q&sh=3a5cba86

fossil basalt Jun 25, 2018, 9:09 PM

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Lots of speculation there.

echo orchid Jun 25, 2018, 9:12 PM

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check the why does people consider ripping bad comment

faint nacelle Jun 25, 2018, 9:28 PM

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Ethically disabled people are all over.

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its an epidemic

olive sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 9:45 PM

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the fact Valve took a month to get back to me makes me wonder if the 819th guys actually said, "no, we have permission" or something ...

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or maybe they just have a lot of work on at Valve. maybe i should apply for a job there lol

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extensive experience with IP issues

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DMCA legal knowledge

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really slow at finding things out

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advanced skills in asking really obvious questions

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as above, without spending any time whatsoever checking customer details (like a mod linked in a DMCA to infringing content)

grand oyster Jun 25, 2018, 9:48 PM

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You'd nail the position

olive sparrow Jun 25, 2018, 9:49 PM

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their mod has 176 files in it of which about 150 being uns_xxxx

fervent needle Jun 25, 2018, 10:59 PM

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They must be your biggest fans then

astral marlin Jun 26, 2018, 5:47 AM

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@olive sparrow when you report it to steam always include a side by side screen shot of the infringing content i normally get a response within a week. This could also be the fact I'm assigned to a person now called Dawn and she is very good

dull moon Jun 26, 2018, 5:51 AM

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I get the feeling that Dawn is an alias. she's also my contact at valve 😂

fervent needle Jun 26, 2018, 6:33 AM

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she was the one that got stuck with all arma 3 complaints 😂

fossil basalt Jun 26, 2018, 7:03 AM

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Her name is DAWN DMCA. Strange surname that!

astral marlin Jun 26, 2018, 7:41 AM

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lol

olive sparrow Jun 26, 2018, 8:51 AM

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Carved into a tree on the banks of the Vltava in Prague "Dwarden + Dawn 4 eva"

dull moon Jun 26, 2018, 9:59 AM

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😂

soft egret Jun 26, 2018, 10:47 AM

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How long, after reporting a monetized server and them not doing anything about it, do I need to wait till I report again?

grand oyster Jun 26, 2018, 11:14 AM

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I would assume 14/31 days

carmine folio Jun 26, 2018, 6:43 PM

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are we still collecting IP violations? https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=912838198

dull moon Jun 26, 2018, 6:51 PM

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@lunar sentinel

river spear Jun 26, 2018, 6:51 PM

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YOU MAY ASK TO REMOVE A MOD IF YOU DON'T WANT IT IN THE PACK!

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Lucky he gave the content creators the permission to ask to remove something from it :^

lunar sentinel Jun 26, 2018, 6:53 PM

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Such a charmer. I usually don't care anymore but left a little comment since he gave me his permission

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Thanks @dull moon

soft egret Jun 26, 2018, 6:55 PM

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hm 🤔 searches for "reupload" in the crawler

river spear Jun 26, 2018, 6:56 PM

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@soft egret just search for I did not

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premium results

soft egret Jun 26, 2018, 7:03 PM

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I like my message on that item up there the most btw.

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I don't think people will risk their whole steam account

drifting scaffold Jun 26, 2018, 7:04 PM

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I don't think that other people other than the authors of the original mods should talk to the guy about removing stuff

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I mean

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I know he did bad

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But lets not bandwagon and all jump on him

dull moon Jun 26, 2018, 7:05 PM

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it's fun tho

drifting scaffold Jun 26, 2018, 7:06 PM

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Still it's a step too far for me anyway

soft egret Jun 26, 2018, 7:07 PM

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Better you tell them nicely about that their are violating the steam rules. Before they get their Steam account banned or DMCA'ed because of something they didn't know about

carmine folio Jun 26, 2018, 8:02 PM

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for Dedmen? https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=789445589&searchtext=TFAR

dull moon Jun 26, 2018, 8:03 PM

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lol, a server maintaining is like a job...
cough... steamCMD cough...

chilly pebble Jun 26, 2018, 8:10 PM

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I like to pretend that my server adminship is like a job, as it gives me a feeling of false importance.

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Sort of like middle management.

soft egret Jun 26, 2018, 8:20 PM

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https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198000002705/myworkshopfiles/ ooo boi

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load the GAU8!

safe arrow Jun 26, 2018, 8:24 PM

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But updating mods on a server is a bigger job, then reuploading all that stuff on steam...sure.

soft egret Jun 26, 2018, 8:25 PM

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And through his reuploads

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he now has to update the workshop item AND the server

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🤔

fervent needle Jun 26, 2018, 8:38 PM

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Is the issue they complain about because the off chance a mod might update so they pack it in a reupload?

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Updates only ever happen once in a blue moon lol

soft egret Jun 26, 2018, 8:40 PM

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especially for TFAR lul

mint edge Jun 26, 2018, 8:48 PM

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all steam needs is 2 buttons when uploading, if data is already on the workshop the original author can click yes, or they can click no 😃

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rip 80% of the reuploads?

grand oyster Jun 26, 2018, 10:32 PM

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Steam probably doesn't care, only begins to care once they receive a DMCA iirc

mint edge Jun 26, 2018, 10:45 PM

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well

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valve loves people ripping content for their games

south nimbus Jun 26, 2018, 10:45 PM

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I was asked by my friend to take a look at this discord I am sorry not very active in the community anymore I have since left the arma community as hole to work other project’s. I will try to set the record straight as some people are misinformed about the AppleGate Community Project and Jackson County Community Project. The original map is called AppleGate and is a Map for A2 opteryx made the terrain data and nothing more, Sirel76 Aka El76 started to work on the roads and few towns and made most of the object pack. I worked very close with Sirel76 and was taught a lot by him I worked on Textures and some of the Building and getting the terrain data to a playable level and ready for A3 and fixing small issues. While at City life RPG I tried to get a new map for the community the owner did not want it or to change maps in A2 after a bit of time I was banned by @astral marlin for 4 months due to Rules I broke and carried on working on the map and number of building that was for Arma 2 life were a number of small dev had access thanks to Sirel76 teaching us. While I was banned I worked with Arma 3 Life map dev schultzit showing him how things worked and ported it to A3 for there community and for others to learn from. schultzit Ported the Map into A3 known as Jackson County Community Project.

AppleGate is an open source project for people to learn how to make maps and all are welcome to use it as they please. If you would like to know more about the map I will try to answer but have since moved on to unity and VR projects.

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So for my bad English am dyslexic and can not spell good.

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In a nut shell AppleGate Community Project only works for Arma 2 and Jackson County Community Project was made for Arma 3. opteryx Sirel76 and myself are the A2 map makers and schultzit is the A3 map maker.

faint nacelle Jun 26, 2018, 10:53 PM

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Thanks for clearing that up. Problem in Steam uploads and community material like this lies in the Workshop rules where you must have permission from all the makers to upload it

south nimbus Jun 26, 2018, 10:57 PM

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I see very sorry with that am not very good with that stuff or up to date on how that works The main goal for the Project was for people to learn and make there own version reupload this was in A2 were taking content and licence issue were not even thought about when I made the post and upload the files for people. I don't have an answer for that other then "go nuts" lol

faint nacelle Jun 26, 2018, 10:59 PM

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Its not really your resposibility. Those using it must make sure they follow the rules. Thats all.

south nimbus Jun 26, 2018, 11:03 PM

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Oh sorry I thought you was saying it was my resposibility lol

faint nacelle Jun 26, 2018, 11:06 PM

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yeah no, its problem for those who develop the community material further 😄

steep quiver Jun 27, 2018, 6:07 AM

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Thought I might just check just in case as people here tend to know about arma related licenses more than I do.

There shouldn't be anything wrong (from IP point of view) with making basic instruction videos for an Arma community (but publicly available) that feature modded equipment or even outright focus on it, right?
Examples: what to do during mission briefing (mainly focuses on ACE Arsenal and gear rules of the server) or more focused how to use SR radios from TFAR.

No monetization would be involved. Not for the videos and the community isn't monetized either.

soft egret Jun 27, 2018, 6:55 AM

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No problem at all.
If you show ads on the video some people might count that as monetization. But Bohemia, ACE and TFAR team don't care about that. Some others might though.

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If you don't monetize then that stuff atleast falls under fair-use

steep quiver Jun 27, 2018, 7:23 AM

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Yeah, I don't plan on monetizing the videos (or does youtube put ads automatically?), they're supposed to be a service to new members after all.

soft egret Jun 27, 2018, 7:29 AM

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no they don't auto add ad's.. Unless... Your audience get's so big that youtube forces you to put ads on the video....

steep quiver Jun 27, 2018, 7:33 AM

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I'm not worried about that lol, thanks for the info

soft egret Jun 27, 2018, 7:35 AM

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If you're making a TFAR instruction video with the new TFAR beta. Send me that and I'll pin it somewhere

steep quiver Jun 27, 2018, 7:40 AM

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For the purposes of our basic training it's just how to use SR and how to use the interface but sure I'll send it once it's up, we do use the 1.0 beta.

soft egret Jun 27, 2018, 8:18 AM

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http://blog.counter-strike.net/index.php/expresstrade/ here is an example of what happens if you violate the Steam subscriber agreement. 2884 steam accounts with items worth $2 million gone because they violated the subscriber agreement.
Everyone uploading mods they don't own is violating the same agreement. So might get similar punishment

stoic beacon Jun 27, 2018, 8:53 AM

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Was anyone banned for reuploading an modification for Arma?

soft egret Jun 27, 2018, 8:56 AM

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not yet afaik

burnt oak Jun 27, 2018, 9:00 AM

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However it is quite possible that they got the rights removed to upload to the workshop.

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at least i know in my case someone lost that right

stoic beacon Jun 27, 2018, 9:00 AM

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So he doesn't have the option to upload anymore? Or just no permission?

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Like is the button gone or is he formally not allowed to upload anymore

burnt oak Jun 27, 2018, 9:25 AM

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Uploading from that account is not possible anymore

languid fog Jun 27, 2018, 11:10 AM

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Boi hes fucked haha

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In reference to that 'maintaining a server is a job'

burnt oak Jun 27, 2018, 11:13 AM

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honestly did not stop that server from reuploading with another account. Right now they are on the fourth

carmine folio Jun 27, 2018, 12:30 PM

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found another one https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=803659916

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https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1373052439

snow bloom Jun 27, 2018, 2:13 PM

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Oh boy.. More ripped content

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https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/949579682279480397/71E9975D546011CFFBD84F878B9B7F76188F9E3D/

dull moon Jun 27, 2018, 2:26 PM

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Guys, je careful posting the same msg over and over again. You might trigger steams spam filter and risk a one week ban. Happend to me once

tulip nexus Jun 27, 2018, 3:21 PM

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what's ripped there @snow bloom ? looks like a retex of Adacas' Crye uniforms, and the MBAV and USMC/SAF boonie hat from RHS

snow bloom Jun 27, 2018, 3:21 PM

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The uniform looks like the black tactical shirt from DayZ SA

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I recognise it from the ripped mod I recently reported

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only difference is he's swapped the US Flag for the union jack

soft egret Jun 27, 2018, 4:07 PM

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lul. Just took 1 DMCA http://a3liferp.com/

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Or was it two? don't remember

dull moon Jun 27, 2018, 4:17 PM

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?

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steam DMCA?

bronze oasis Jun 27, 2018, 4:19 PM

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Oh wow. That was enough to shut em down completely..

astral marlin Jun 27, 2018, 4:23 PM

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Just another rename of stolen life servers

soft egret Jun 27, 2018, 4:37 PM

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I DMCA'd their modpack twice

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then told them on their third reupload that atleast didn't contain TFAR that it's still breaking rules

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and now they are gone

dull moon Jun 27, 2018, 4:38 PM

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lol... i got guys where i filed 3 times and more and they still keep going......

tawny sentinel Jun 27, 2018, 5:50 PM

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@snow bloom Correct. However, due to the shitty lightning I can't tell for certain, but that is awfully similar to the SA tactical shirt 🤔

snow bloom Jun 27, 2018, 5:53 PM

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I'm 99% sure it is. It's in a few of the ripped mods floating about

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I can understand why, it's absolutely stunning, but it doesnt make it right

stoic beacon Jun 27, 2018, 6:30 PM

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I know the guy, he has ported DayZ content multiple times already

snow bloom Jun 27, 2018, 7:57 PM

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What’s his name?

stoic beacon Jun 27, 2018, 8:22 PM

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Lerry

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And his friends "Funny" etc

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There also was an Brazilian guy if I remember correctly

snow bloom Jun 27, 2018, 9:36 PM

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Ah right yeah

dull moon Jun 27, 2018, 10:52 PM

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AND HIS NAME IIIIISSSSSS.........

ebon sand Jun 28, 2018, 12:06 AM

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JOOOHHHNNN CEEENNNAAA!!!!

river spear Jun 28, 2018, 12:37 AM

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insert shittyfluted theme here

opal zinc Jun 28, 2018, 6:02 AM

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*plays cena theme with kazoo

delicate ember Jun 28, 2018, 8:55 AM

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Lerry, Funny and Vasquez - this one is really annoying and ported almost everything from dayz

snow bloom Jun 28, 2018, 9:21 AM

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I recognise 2 of the names, they do screenshots I believe. Leery and Vasquez

coral torrent Jun 28, 2018, 10:06 AM

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@soft egret https://giphy.com/gifs/christmas-bonus-XqpnXaeZPnupy

faint nacelle Jun 28, 2018, 1:36 PM

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@astral marlin am I to assume this is a joke?

astral marlin Jun 28, 2018, 1:36 PM

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lol

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just give love

faint nacelle Jun 28, 2018, 1:36 PM

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🚪

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you migth as well delete it

soft egret Jun 28, 2018, 1:40 PM

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@astral marlin Refer to #rules please. Thanks

dull moon Jun 28, 2018, 1:43 PM

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oh c'mon, don't be like that. this is actually a pretty good one 😂

astral marlin Jun 28, 2018, 1:43 PM

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some one got me good with it

faint nacelle Jun 28, 2018, 1:44 PM

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serious bussinesseses channel

dull moon Jun 28, 2018, 1:44 PM

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😂

astral marlin Jun 28, 2018, 1:44 PM

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yer i get ya its gone

carmine folio Jun 28, 2018, 2:01 PM

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https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1416389859 this is a lot of violations...

snow bloom Jun 28, 2018, 3:53 PM

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Sent to USAF team

mint edge Jun 28, 2018, 6:29 PM

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https://youtu.be/hdT5Kgw5IdQ?t=317

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identical sound effect to the arma 2 m2 machine gun sound coming from the players with the LMGs

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i believe the awm in this game aswell has the same sound effect as an unused le enfield sound effect from OA

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https://youtu.be/M9CVf8_Nvw0?t=147

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Enfield_1 & Enfield_2 from sounds_e

#

arma 2 did use alot of purchased/outside/outsourced/w.e data but it seems odd that theres multiple account of identical data

#

i cant help but say that other weapon sounds are also strikingly similar to sounds in the arma 2 licensed data packs however these two i can 100% say its the same sound files

tawny sentinel Jun 28, 2018, 7:12 PM

#

https://imgur.com/a/flGgLgR

Talked to the developer, he seemed like a genuine guy. I doubt anything is up judging from our quick chat.

mint edge Jun 28, 2018, 7:13 PM

#

ye prob

#

most of the door textures from arma 2 are on textures.com so

prisma scaffold Jun 28, 2018, 7:15 PM

#

Anything Arma IP related should just be sent to BI. They would be able to tell if something is theirs or just a 3rd party asset.

sonic blade Jun 29, 2018, 10:31 AM

#

Hi I'm working on a proper license page for swedish forces pack and have run into an issue with how to list the things we have that fall under APL-SA. Instead of being smart like rhs and doing rhs_a2port_* we regrettably have them bundled into for example sfp_static_weapons.

#

Would it be better in this case to list them per item (podnos mortar, mk19 gmg etc.) or is there another way that is more suitable?
I don't expect our implementations to be the best source for someone who want to remix these things, but as the license clearly states that they are to be open for modifications even if part of another package I'm quite stumped how to proceed.

olive sparrow Jun 29, 2018, 11:07 AM

#

static weapons do not require APL-SA afaik

#

only some sounds, animations, terrains and things were made SA

#

this may be useful for you

#

http://svn.armanam.eu/ftp/eggbeast/unsung/docs/License/License Agreement2.doc

#

http://svn.armanam.eu/ftp/eggbeast/unsung/docs/License/License Agreement.pdf

#

feel free to modify and adapt it as you see fit, if desired.

#

it works as a one-size-fits-all license

#

note: if you have just imported some arma 2 animations directly, and they are the same as the samples, i wouldn't worry about SA. as the user can access the originals easily.

#

so no need to jump through hoops to make "your" animations available ifthe yare already present in the sample data

sonic blade Jun 29, 2018, 11:26 AM

#

Thanks, the original plan was to use the creative commons by-nc-nd 4.0 license much how RHS has done.
We've also looked long and hard at the CUP license but it turns out that license texts are hard to wrap your head around without some practice

#

@a2 content: that's good to know, I've spent some time trying to figure out exactly what has been loaned from earlier armas, which turned out to be quite a challenge. Not least because we have original stuff that has been with us since SFP4 for OFP and SFP5 for Arma 1

echo orchid Jun 29, 2018, 1:10 PM

#

wouldn't it be easier to pull out the .p3ds out from that pbo bundle/

#

keep the configs separate, then you can have APL-SA on the content ported

#

and whatever other license for the parts you made yourself

sonic blade Jun 29, 2018, 1:24 PM

#

Probably, I've brought it up internally but haven't got a clear answer as to why we have it that way. Either way I will be refactoring a bunch of stuff on our svn during the summer too, so hopefully that issue will be solved as part of it

olive sparrow Jun 29, 2018, 1:28 PM

#

you don't need APL_SA on almost any models (except for TOH)

#

only APL

#

u ca nsee on this page which materials are covered by the more strict SA license.

#

https://www.bohemia.net/community/licenses/licensed-data-packages

#

applying SA to all your Arma 2 imports is an unnecessary burden

#

so unless your pack contains derivatives of the APL_SA content (typically terrains, animations, cutscenes, or anything from TOH, etc) then you can just mirror the APL license terms.

soft egret Jun 30, 2018, 1:06 PM

#

Got a E-Mail from BI legal department about PsiSyn. We have contacted server owner and requested removal of your Intellectual property from his server. They did comply with our request
Looking at their current modpack. Nothing changed. They did not comply. PsiSyn directly lying to BI legal department?
And they are still leaving them their monetization license and are still not doing ANYTHING against them.
They are also still running HLC and Kickass and others.

safe arrow Jun 30, 2018, 1:07 PM

#

Thats quite a slap in the face of the modding community... especially since they did obviously violate their monetization terms (ask before use etc)

#

What did you reply after finding out, that the stuff is still in there?

soft egret Jun 30, 2018, 1:12 PM

#

I sent back proof that they did not comply

#

Seems like BI really wants to continue letting them do whatever they want. Even after numerous violations they still seem to just say "Just remove the mod and everything will be fine"

soft egret Jun 30, 2018, 1:56 PM

#

Lol. While trying to help someone with a modelling question I found this: https://forums.bohemia.net/forums/topic/192135-how-to-import-a-model-into-arma-3/?tab=comments#comment-3081461
That's the guy taking care of PsiSyn's modpack

olive sparrow Jun 30, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

Let's hope BI realise their mistake and address your complaint properly 😉

soft egret Jun 30, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

And all the other complaints that they seem to be ignoring so far

tight bloom Jun 30, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

@pliant oar Not sure who to report this to, but looks like this guy is trying to sell the Arma 2 US Army Model as his own work on turbosquid https://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/3d-soldier-heavy-weapon/636168#

carmine folio Jun 30, 2018, 6:49 PM

#

Google Drive of another Life server - ALRP
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1UJp7fx63xFsuuba7nXyWpLDcq3dX20ML/view

CUP
FHQ
HLC
Ivory
KA
TRYK
CBA
Task Force Radio
The list goes on

mint edge Jun 30, 2018, 7:05 PM

#

@tight bloom do u have any comparison pics the a2 uniforms are less then 10k and he's claiming those are in the high 20s, hard to think a theif would put that much extra work especially for a soft model into a stolen model to sell

tight bloom Jun 30, 2018, 7:25 PM

#

@mint edge I can make some and post. I don't think there is any doubt that it is indeed the A2 US Model. But I'll post some pics

mint edge Jun 30, 2018, 7:26 PM

#

when I send stuff to infringement at bi I always post comparisons

#

and where to find the data in question in BIS data that's been stolen

olive sparrow Jun 30, 2018, 10:50 PM

#

also, juast checked his beretta m9, not the same as BI texture, so he didn't rip that one

mint edge Jun 30, 2018, 10:54 PM

#

could have reuv'd it

#

you really need to check the model for identical points ect to get a much better idea

echo orchid Jul 1, 2018, 12:38 AM

#

lol IP infringement for KA 😄

prisma scaffold Jul 1, 2018, 2:45 AM

#

Again, just let BI handle it’s own IPs they can do the proper comparison.

ebon ruin Jul 1, 2018, 7:35 AM

#

KA gets abused, I bet he won't stand for this 😄

next zenith Jul 1, 2018, 8:14 AM

#

Isnt KA notorious for stealing content from other games?

faint nacelle Jul 1, 2018, 8:15 AM

#

yes

#

and he is a serial reuploader xD

olive sparrow Jul 1, 2018, 8:41 AM

#

"freedom of speech" crusader is he? It would be funny if someone went to his house and packed up his PC int oa van, and said "I'm going to distribute this to the community"

lusty tangle Jul 1, 2018, 12:18 PM

#

Where should you report violations to the monetization rules?

soft egret Jul 1, 2018, 12:19 PM

#

depends on which community

lusty tangle Jul 1, 2018, 12:20 PM

#

There's different systems for different communities? 🤔

soft egret Jul 1, 2018, 12:20 PM

#

There is a report button: https://www.bohemia.net/monetization/approved/arma3

lusty tangle Jul 1, 2018, 12:20 PM

#

What if said server doesn't have approved status..

soft egret Jul 1, 2018, 12:20 PM

#

There is one different system for one big community that violates daily

lusty tangle Jul 1, 2018, 12:20 PM

#

Let me guess

#

ALRP 😂

soft egret Jul 1, 2018, 12:20 PM

#

not even ^^

#

One sec. There is a email adress.

lusty tangle Jul 1, 2018, 12:21 PM

#

yikes

soft egret Jul 1, 2018, 12:21 PM

#

Oh wow. That was easy monetization@bistudio.com 😄

lusty tangle Jul 1, 2018, 12:22 PM

#

Ah I think the contact forum sends to that anyway, so that works

#

cheers mate 😃

soft egret Jul 1, 2018, 12:22 PM

#

provide server name, link to where they monetize. Maybe some screenshots as proof

carmine folio Jul 1, 2018, 7:34 PM

#

Just like to report an IP violation of disney/starwars name - https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1392359293&searchtext=Legion.

#

just here to help

stoic beacon Jul 1, 2018, 8:26 PM

#

You would be better off reporting it to Disney, if they even care

snow bloom Jul 1, 2018, 8:38 PM

#

They usually do

carmine folio Jul 2, 2018, 5:02 AM

#

@stoic beacon would you be able to help me with this?

stoic beacon Jul 2, 2018, 5:05 AM

#

I've never reported anything to Disney or any other company. All I did so far is filing DMCA's with the Steam Workshop template. If you do some research you might find some sort of IP rights Email from Disney.

#

@carmine folio

#

https://support.disney.com/hc/en-gb/articles/115005422546-How-can-I-report-piracy-or-copyright-infringement-

stoic beacon Jul 2, 2018, 6:03 AM

#

Over 100.000 reuploads? There might be something wrong with crawler?
https://imgur.com/D9biQeH

river spear Jul 2, 2018, 9:09 AM

#

Uhhh

soft egret Jul 2, 2018, 9:10 AM

#

Is that a deep search? If so maybe you have a readme.txt or something in there and the crawler found that in many other repos

echo orchid Jul 2, 2018, 10:07 AM

#

yeah someone needs to give me run through deep scan, would be nice if i could search just parts of it, because as it is, with the amount of results i get it is pretty useless

soft egret Jul 2, 2018, 10:08 AM

#

Optix added filename based include/exclude filter recently.. I think. Maybe not recently

echo orchid Jul 2, 2018, 10:09 AM

#

i can only add a filter but cannot customize that filter's search behaviour.

dull moon Jul 2, 2018, 10:16 AM

#

go to filters, add a new filter, click on the filter type and use the one you want from the dropdown. after that, add the filter value. if you choose an exclude filter for example, add the extention as value, like TXT, HPP, whatever.
it's some time ago i added filters, you need to experiment a little

tawny sentinel Jul 2, 2018, 10:17 AM

#

So... Teach a old dog new tricks? (/s)

echo orchid Jul 2, 2018, 10:29 AM

#

@dull moon i have no option to add any values to any filters

dull moon Jul 2, 2018, 10:29 AM

#

got an account on the crawler?

echo orchid Jul 2, 2018, 10:29 AM

#

yeah of course

#

i can only add a new filter, change it's name and that is about it

soft egret Jul 2, 2018, 10:32 AM

#

https://s.sqf.ovh/firefox_2018-07-02_12-32-32.png

echo orchid Jul 2, 2018, 10:34 AM

#

https://i.gyazo.com/5a32ba8e61b7137dc57ad5a129a2eb34.png

dull moon Jul 2, 2018, 10:35 AM

#

since i can not post videos, PM...

soft egret Jul 2, 2018, 10:35 AM

#

"Add New" button on bottom right

#

should add a new element

echo orchid Jul 2, 2018, 10:37 AM

#

add new creates a new filter for me

soft egret Jul 2, 2018, 10:39 AM

#

not for me :D
I was very confused when I tried that thing the first time.
But right now it seems to be working for me

echo orchid Jul 2, 2018, 10:39 AM

#

ahh yeah, went back and then again to it, now i can add filter values

#

pretty weird\

#

i had a fuckton list of filters with no filter settings

#

@dull moon cheers man, yeah seen you PM just now

#

also cheers @soft egret , new toy to play with now

dull moon Jul 2, 2018, 10:48 AM

#

👍

astral marlin Jul 2, 2018, 12:28 PM

#

Brace your self guys i feel out my seat when i see this
https://pastebin.com/XaAMqTht

Pastebin

/* Author: Cobra @ArmaLifeRoleplay */ if (!isMultiplayer) exit...

soft egret Jul 2, 2018, 12:28 PM

#

Cobra.. I've heard that name already

#

He sold that modpack to that Life server that I DMCA'ed twice which shortly after shutdown completly although it only existed for a couple months

river spear Jul 2, 2018, 2:22 PM

#

I'll make the interface a lot more user friendly when I redo it 👌

mint edge Jul 2, 2018, 3:13 PM

#

dayz crawler inc?

#

game will certainly have steam workshop

coral torrent Jul 2, 2018, 3:13 PM

#

Shhhhhh > >

dull moon Jul 2, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

@astral marlin
because... why not? almost as funny as adding an admin console backdoor to a mod, that if used without permission allows the autor to open the admin pannel, gives him millions of credits, ect

astral marlin Jul 3, 2018, 7:29 AM

#

no whats funny is there whole mod is stolen content and they have the cheek to add that

#

E.G.
_layer1 = "normal" cutText ["Files stolen from ALRP - www.armaliferp.co.uk. Files are not permitted to be used by anyone other than ALRP.","PLAIN"];

soft egret Jul 3, 2018, 8:50 AM

#

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1261297982 🤦

olive sparrow Jul 3, 2018, 9:23 AM

#

who wrote ASDG? are they aware?

soft egret Jul 3, 2018, 9:24 AM

#

Robalo.

#

He probably doesn't care much

#

but using ASDG is just dumb. And reuploading it even more

olive sparrow Jul 3, 2018, 9:24 AM

#

someone lookingforglory no doubt

grand oyster Jul 3, 2018, 9:25 AM

#

GLORY FOR ARSTOZKA

#

🤣

olive sparrow Jul 3, 2018, 9:25 AM

#

glory's down in her hole, with the beer, where she belongs.

soft egret Jul 3, 2018, 7:29 PM

#

They are really doing it. They really plan to go back to a TFAR version from early 2015.

#

And BI is really gonna let them slide with that.

#

They use mods without permission repeatedly and get reported repeatedly. Then they directly lie to BI legal department saying that they removed the mod they were supposed to remove.
And BI is just like "yeah.. Okey don't care. But now do it pls or we'll have to do stuff cuz we'd look bad otherwise"

keen trout Jul 3, 2018, 7:49 PM

#

MLGDab

tawny sentinel Jul 3, 2018, 7:53 PM

#

@soft egret Forums next perhaps?

#

Make enough of a ruckus about it and they'll have to do something, this was proven when the whole Caden thing went down a few years ago.

undone pier Jul 4, 2018, 3:02 AM

#

sad to hear Dedmen .. sadly not surprising to hear ..

olive sparrow Jul 4, 2018, 11:53 AM

#

@soft egret does that version have permission for monetization? can they prove it?

#

are RH weapons now removed also?

#

has BNAE commented about it? does he want his weapons removed?

#

do any other mod makers have a complaint?

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 11:55 AM

#

HLC was in there when I checked on Friday. RH don't remember didn't check for it.
Their A3Sync is down now as they are moving to a different server. And I won't download their full google drive archive now..
Don't know about any other mod makers.

Won't give further details about TFAR in public till this is over.

mint edge Jul 4, 2018, 12:09 PM

#

last time I was interested I think bnae doesn't allow monetize

#

last year

#

he's easily contactable tho to get his word

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 12:11 PM

#

His mods are licensed as CC NC ND sooo...

mint edge Jul 4, 2018, 12:16 PM

#

ah

#

pretty sure every life mod and their mom has his stuff packed away in a release somewhere

olive sparrow Jul 4, 2018, 12:23 PM

#

he allowed us to use his bolting function, but not his animations. I imagine he wouldn't want monetizing going on with those, but might be worth letting him know about this server also..

safe arrow Jul 4, 2018, 3:24 PM

#

Shouldnt it be the server that has to provide and prove, that they got all the needed permissions for their included mods? I.E. whenever BI asks, they have to provide them with emails or whatever showing the permission for each file (as stated in the monetization licenses). ATM it sounds rather strange, that they could get away that easy with all the other mods and just changing TFAR to an older version (where i am sure they cant show a permission too)

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 3:33 PM

#

it should be yeah

#

but apparently they are saying "we don't have proof" so BI goes and asks the author if they agree.

#

BI is doing everything they can so that the monetized server stays happy and alive

fair rune Jul 4, 2018, 4:10 PM

#

is proof that they straight up lied to BI a good enough?

wild pollen Jul 4, 2018, 4:24 PM

#

Fly to BI's office and report them in person

pliant oar Jul 4, 2018, 4:40 PM

#

future content validation, the owner must visit BI studio and leave DNA, eye scan and sign the "i'm the author" with own blood and agree to get injected with chip for Sol position tracking incase he isn't lmaoroflxdddd

safe arrow Jul 4, 2018, 4:41 PM

#

Dwarden can you explain this behaviour? As it basically is a slap in the face to all mod creators

pliant oar Jul 4, 2018, 4:41 PM

#

the paper has in nano print that violators are neutralized , for good

safe arrow Jul 4, 2018, 4:41 PM

#

(and contradicts the terms for monetization)

pliant oar Jul 4, 2018, 4:44 PM

#

overally the whole monetization system is quite hard to enforce due to no access to server master and workshop backend etc.

#

so if it was up to me, i would toss the whole scheme over the cliff as it's too much work for too low gain for either side

safe arrow Jul 4, 2018, 4:45 PM

#

Didnt you have possibilities to lock them down via BattleEye? Thought i heard something like that before

pliant oar Jul 4, 2018, 4:45 PM

#

so they will disable battleye or keep switching IPs endlessly

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 4:45 PM

#

yeah. If the loose the license and continue monetizing

#

which of course doesn't happen if they don't actually loose the license

safe arrow Jul 4, 2018, 4:46 PM

#

So in fact the whole system and reporting-tools are useless and there is nothing a modder can do to protect his content other then calling a lawyer or something

pliant oar Jul 4, 2018, 4:47 PM

#

unfortunately that's real world problem

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 4:47 PM

#

no.. If you stay penetrant (not correct word) then BI will take care of it

#

but you really have to keep at it for a couple weeks

faint nacelle Jul 4, 2018, 4:49 PM

#

Id say a butt print should be taken too when they register.

fair rune Jul 4, 2018, 4:50 PM

#

definitely

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 4:52 PM

#

Considering they said themselves that the responsible admins didn't even read the monetization rules... Something should be done when they register....

safe arrow Jul 4, 2018, 4:53 PM

#

Well you dont need the whole list and registration including the rules, when BI doesnt do anything to make them follow the rules

#

At the moment, this list is just advertisment for those servers earning money with stolen mods

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 4:55 PM

#

I'd say most servers are probably legit.. Because most servers are vanilla ^^

fair rune Jul 4, 2018, 5:05 PM

#

Vanilla? What about KOTH? That's technically a mod

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 5:06 PM

#

They have licenses tho

#

Even RHS which no one else has a monetization permit for

grand oyster Jul 4, 2018, 5:06 PM

#

Wasn't that revoked recently?

fair rune Jul 4, 2018, 5:07 PM

#

I think KOTH was an exeception

tawny sentinel Jul 4, 2018, 5:07 PM

#

That exception has since been removed.

grand oyster Jul 4, 2018, 5:07 PM

#

There was a twitter or facebook post to drive home the point that it was a "legacy verbal agreement" and then I believe it said had been revoked

soft egret Jul 4, 2018, 5:07 PM

#

RHS permit is revoked on sunday.

#

next sunday

grand oyster Jul 4, 2018, 5:08 PM

#

That's pretty kind of them to give em time 🤣

#

👍 to RHS 😄

snow bloom Jul 4, 2018, 6:52 PM

#

@RHS Guys - Guy on the right holding the flag looks like he's wearing retextured ACUs? Your mod is the only one I know with them? https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/949580410981134685/65F798887152D5875D8D82A7D7CE9CE0F793F011/

winged vapor Jul 4, 2018, 7:08 PM

#

@echo orchid

echo orchid Jul 4, 2018, 7:10 PM

#

@snow bloom looks like it, where did you get that image from?

snow bloom Jul 4, 2018, 7:11 PM

#

From none other than ya boi Lerry

#

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1430749761

stoic beacon Jul 4, 2018, 7:30 PM

#

He didn't upload it on workshop afaik, so is it actually "illegal"? Isn't it allowed for personal use?

snow bloom Jul 4, 2018, 7:32 PM

#

Well imo, if the license says you cant retex something I don't think it matters whether it gets released or not

stoic beacon Jul 4, 2018, 7:34 PM

#

I totally agree, but if I remember correctly, then you can do alot of stuff as long as you don't share it with anyone. I'm not trying to say Lerry didn't do anything wrong.

wild stone Jul 4, 2018, 10:48 PM

#

But sharing the image is doing something wrong.

mint edge Jul 4, 2018, 10:50 PM

#

he did share it

#

if he is using it with other players privately

ebon ruin Jul 5, 2018, 8:56 AM

#

afaik about other things, in some countries (eu) you can download and edit stuff as long as it's for yourself. This was like movies and video games

#

pictures and videos too

#

Also, changing the configs with my own pbo and leaving the rhs.pbo to be original. I can just retex like that, can't I?

sonic blade Jul 5, 2018, 9:01 AM

#

@eu and personal use: people like to cite "fair use", it's commonly seen on youtube video descriptions, but that doesnt stretch to sharing afaik

ebon ruin Jul 5, 2018, 9:02 AM

#

Yeh, I just know they told us we can download (pirated) games and movies and it's not illegal here, as long as you don't redistribute. + all data is treated equal

topaz monolith Jul 5, 2018, 9:03 AM

#

publicly sharing a limited depiction of remixed material isn't sharing the remixed material

#

and if it's a completely custom texture it's technically not even a remix to begin with

#

but if it's using original texture parts then it's a nono

#

blobcat

echo orchid Jul 5, 2018, 12:05 PM

#

@ebon ruin we have expressed our desire not to have ACU retextured whatsoever http://www.rhsmods.org/page/EULA#re-textures

#

you cannot really re-texture stuff without using the base texture in any way or form, because you have no clue where the UVs are, so all retextures are definatelly remixes if you want to call them that

#

technically, if this shit carries on, we can simply disable ACU hidden selections altogether and that would definatelly solve it. we choose not to, simply because it makes out own job harder, but still some people are too thick to follow a simple fucking license

#

why some of you feel there has to be some middle ground and some justification beats me, when things are black and white in this case

#

if you don't agree to EULA you are free not to use the product that comes with that EULA

ebon ruin Jul 5, 2018, 12:29 PM

#

I think they don't understand why, there for they don't comply.
The why is, this is not compliant with the EULA.

#

I get it 'tho. Given a free product, the least one can do it is respect the EULA and rules set by the creators of said product

river spear Jul 5, 2018, 1:02 PM

#

I was about to suggest make a small list of donts with the license

#

Then I looked at the license and was like "wait this isnt a long license"

#

And back to

#

https://media.giphy.com/media/CKHo4ZlaudKdG/giphy.gif

delicate ember Jul 5, 2018, 2:56 PM

#

That ACU looks like from one of mods on SW there was like 10 configurarions of rhs acu, mod got updated and removed all of them but i dont remeber when, anyway i gotta ask if someone retextured it, someone download that but author removed it after short period of time, but downloader has local copy of it and is taking pictueres who is guilty here pictureman or uploader?

tawny sentinel Jul 5, 2018, 3:03 PM

#

@delicate ember Both? That's a non sequitur if I've ever seen one.

snow bloom Jul 5, 2018, 4:40 PM

#

I think as a community, it might make sense to have a small site for all the major mods to upload “summaries” of their licenses for everyone to see. If it was done correctly it’ll give people a clearly understandable set of rules for these mods

#

I’ll use RHS for example; you are allowed to retexture assets, with credits given, HOWEVER the ACUs may NOT be retextures

echo orchid Jul 5, 2018, 6:56 PM

#

if you think RHS license is a long read...then dunno what a short license is

delicate ember Jul 5, 2018, 7:53 PM

#

@echo orchid i gotta ask, RHS have wiki but its totaly incomplete i miss US ammo categories like russin ones

#

Are you going to update it soon?

tulip nexus Jul 5, 2018, 8:34 PM

#

no, too busy modding

#

we have a config browser of sorts anyway

#

http://class.rhsmods.org/

snow bloom Jul 5, 2018, 8:36 PM

#

Just a note on the class thing you guys have, would there be any way to display the magazines that the weapon can use? Just a thought

tulip nexus Jul 5, 2018, 8:38 PM

#

well there will be some changes in what magazines many of the weapons can use, since there's a bit advancement going on in Arma 3 with regards to that

echo orchid Jul 5, 2018, 11:19 PM

#

@delicate ember nope
@snow bloom the class thing is one of Soul Assassins pet projects. It can pull in theory whatever entries are defined already in the config.

#

also this is unrelated to IP infrigements or rights, so please stay on topic

delicate ember Jul 6, 2018, 4:05 AM

#

@tulip nexus what? Are they adding cusom mags support? Like Veteran mod has or HLC?

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 6:46 AM

#

@delicate ember magazineGroups now renamed magazineWells. Google it. As PuFu said. unrelated to this channel.

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 11:57 AM

#

PsiSyn now got asked a second time to remove TFAR. After they lied about removing it to BI last friday.
Today I look into their repo. It's still there.

keen trout Jul 6, 2018, 12:29 PM

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paddlin

river spear Jul 6, 2018, 12:36 PM

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pakkogun

low tapir Jul 6, 2018, 12:52 PM

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😢

proud flicker Jul 6, 2018, 1:37 PM

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jeebus discord is flooded with rippers today. 😮

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 1:44 PM

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@soft egret can i get a link to that repro once more plox/

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 1:45 PM

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ftp://93.115.26.134

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who asked about bnae a.. ah @olive sparrow

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lots of bnae stuff yeah

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do you want to report that to BI? Else I'll mention that in my next mail to them

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 1:52 PM

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who are you talking with from BI legal?

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i wanna report the MELB thing, would be lovely to land to the same person

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 1:53 PM

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Karel Novàk

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 1:53 PM

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for bnae, should first try and contact him via BIF i think, i have no other direct contact

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 1:54 PM

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You don't really need to contact him though. Just tell BI they are using his mods. The community then has to provide proof that they are allowed to do so.
No reason that only the author of the mod could report that

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 1:55 PM

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true, then mention MELB as well please, would save me an e-mail 😃

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 1:55 PM

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PM me a link to the mod that I can reference. And which pbo file that is

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 1:55 PM

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melb.pbo

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 1:55 PM

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I guess I'm playing mailbox then 😄

keen trout Jul 6, 2018, 1:56 PM

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I see some SFP stuff there too

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sfp_bas90.pbo and sfp_objects.pbo

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 1:56 PM

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be my secretary plox ty 💙

keen trout Jul 6, 2018, 1:57 PM

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https://sfp.anrop.se/license/

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Use any of the material for commercial purposes. This includes running any Swedish Forces Pack content on servers that employ any monetization schemes, including but not limited to donate-reward systems.

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@sonic blade

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 1:57 PM

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Yeah yeah.. Come on guys. Throw stuff at me :D
Do you want to see the mail before it goes out?

burnt oak Jul 6, 2018, 1:58 PM

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porobaly not a good idea to show the mail before it goes out

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 1:58 PM

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no, but you can trow a CC (legal at rhsmods dot net)

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 1:59 PM

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Why? ^^ Will just say "also other mod makers told me..."
Yeah will do that

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 1:59 PM

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cheers

soft egret Jul 6, 2018, 5:03 PM

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lol. A guy PM'ed me about a Monetized Life server.
TFAR, RHS MELB, RH weapons, CUP weapons. Maaan..

sonic blade Jul 6, 2018, 5:14 PM

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How not to be allowed to monetize 101

echo orchid Jul 6, 2018, 6:11 PM

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which ones?

wise cairn Jul 6, 2018, 6:55 PM

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are monetized servers allowed? Im guessing no since ive never heard of them before

fair rune Jul 6, 2018, 7:03 PM

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Yes, monetized servers are allowed but you do need a license / application for it and you cannot monetize any mods you do not have permission for.

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https://www.bohemia.net/monetization

wise cairn Jul 6, 2018, 9:13 PM

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I see

olive sparrow Jul 6, 2018, 9:50 PM

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Im feeling left out

fair rune Jul 6, 2018, 9:51 PM

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😢

wide bobcat Jul 7, 2018, 12:01 AM

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can I just clarify....so, even if you get monetisation approved by Bohemia, based on a set of options that Bohemia have scrutinised to not be game changing, you then can only run vanilla arma because all the mod makers will claim you are in breach of their EULA even though your donation options are ok with Bohemia, not game changing nor, selling any of the mod makers' assets?

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or have I got this wrong...

fallow panther Jul 7, 2018, 12:06 AM

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You can't violate a mod maker's EULA just because BI approved monetization..

wide bobcat Jul 7, 2018, 12:08 AM

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but, players follow the mods so, server owners have to run the mods to gain population. Most and I mean nearly all, server owners are struggling to meet overheads, they're not for profit, just trying to ease losses so, doesn't that seem a bit harsh?

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btw, I'm not looking for a ruck, I'm just literally clarifying

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do mod makers grant permission ever or, is it a blanket 'No' when asked?

wide bobcat Jul 7, 2018, 12:31 AM

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I feel like this is an epic game with a great number of truly superb mods but, I worry that it's success may be being thwarted by overly restrictive 3rd party terms and conditions. Surely, if Bohemia give the OK that they're happy that the proposed donation options are within their very strict guidelines and not interfering with game play, then why should the mod makers be concerned beyond that?
As it stands, I now understand why many communities will fly under the radar and not seek monetisation approval...they simply can't because, even if they get approved, they then have to strip their server of all mods and then they'll lose population. So, all I see is a lose or, lose situation for server communities which create the population around the game.

mint edge Jul 7, 2018, 12:42 AM

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bi doesnt own the data that a modder produces

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thus modders have their own licenses

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which are compliant with bi licenses

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however they modder still has the final say

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and its "success" isnt determined by server owners raking in cash from idiot players while modders cannot recieve compensation without breaking the tools EULA

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there should be a total overhaul to the eula for tools aswell as monetization policy

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its simply unfair in the server owners favor, modders are stepped on essentially hence why most modders just blanket "no"

dull moon Jul 7, 2018, 12:45 AM

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@wide bobcat
this community was way healthier before "legal" monetization was introduced

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monetization killed it

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or is about to......

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¯_(ツ)_/¯

mint edge Jul 7, 2018, 12:46 AM

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why not just get someone to MAKE mods for your server...? my server runs 3 mods ive made myself supplimented by some other quality mods, i dont monetize but if you want to monetize, that is the way to start, it takes me barely an hour to do a quality and acceptable port of a gun from arma 2 for the masses, in less then a week of 1-3 hours a day i could create an entire arsenal to use standalone + vanilla guns, i dont see the issue here for server owners as i am one, not to mention a healthy community has no issues funding a server and then some out of the goodness of their hearts, my server will run well into 2020 with charity donations alone

dull moon Jul 7, 2018, 12:46 AM

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☝

tawny sentinel Jul 7, 2018, 12:48 AM

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@wide bobcat It's not so much as "third party modifications aren't allowed, period, on monetizated servers. It's about them respecting the license which the mod is distributed as, which is usually what the problem is around here. With explicit permission from the author(s) (provided they own the work of course) you're free to use them on your monetized server.

dull moon Jul 7, 2018, 12:48 AM

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the monetizing servers are the smalles number of servers compared to non-monetized, but the highest number of fubar

mint edge Jul 7, 2018, 12:49 AM

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its a typical vocal minority

dull moon Jul 7, 2018, 12:49 AM

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so to say, yes

tawny sentinel Jul 7, 2018, 12:51 AM

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The problem is, we've had plenty of creators the last few years who has gotten fed up with their work being ripped and unattributed, or in some cases, someone else has claimed they created someone else's work. It's a fine balance to keep, but I know most creators here will either give you a straight answer or they'll be open to discuss it.

echo orchid Jul 7, 2018, 1:15 AM

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@wide bobcat you don't need to be approved for monetization if you only take donations (as in 100% voluntary, without anything in return)

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the moment you get approved for monetization, you need to get permission from all the individual addon makers to use their content

olive sparrow Jul 7, 2018, 1:19 AM

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👆

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mod makers are not killing arma. time is.

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like with all games.

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however, with arma, like only with a few other great game titles (elder scrolls for example) the work of mod makers making total conversions and tons of quality bonus content, and new game modes etc, is what is extending the life of a game which would have been dead already otherwise.

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people who monetize servers are free to do so if they have permission for the mods they use (as pufu explained). If they don't have permission and they make $30k or $100k (and they really do make this kind of money in 3 to 6 months), from abusing the non commercial use licenses of those mod makers who created their work, then they and not the mod makers are behaving harshly. often mod makers have non-commercial sourced third-party content, so they MUST enforce their licenses, e.g. RobertHammer or Unsung, and so it just puts extra strain on the mod makers to have t oactively enforce their license on these miscreants who are taking money out of the community but not putting anything back

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so who is killing arma? the mod makers who extend its life? or the one or two monetizers who instead of just accepting donations and running a cool server, decide to cash in and make $50,000 and then cause a shitstorm over stealing other peoples content to do it.

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them's the facts folks...

narrow slate Jul 7, 2018, 5:49 AM

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who made $50k ?

soft egret Jul 7, 2018, 8:50 AM

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@wide bobcat simple. If you are a monetized server. You need permission for EVERY mod you are running. That's it. You are breaking the BI monetization license. Not the Mod maker's license (Though in some cases you are breaking both)
but, players follow the mods so, server owners have to run the mods to gain population. Ask the mod maker if you can use it. If yes you use it. If no you are screwed. So be nice.
I allow anyone to use the mods I have rights on. Unless they ask after they already got reported and if they also run tons of other stuff they don't have permission for.

The only problem is server that simply don't care. Like that one "Oh. It's not our fault because we didn't know that we are not allowed to. We didn't even read the monetization rules or the licenses of the mods that say they are clearly not allowed to be used comercially"

pliant oar Jul 7, 2018, 11:33 AM

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not permission for just every mod, every script every mission and any and all assets used on the server (that includes even stuff like music)

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that's only proper route to do monetizing, even if there were no BI rules, the same does apply in the real world ...

olive sparrow Jul 7, 2018, 12:14 PM

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@narrow slate A3Life had £102,000 in their paypal account when we saw a screenshot of it. I heard a rumour that psy had made over £30,000 when he launched his new server, KOTH servers have made over £100,000. These numbers are fairly normal for the popular monetized server teams.

opaque sage Jul 7, 2018, 12:15 PM

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pretty sure A3PL made more than all of that combined

olive sparrow Jul 7, 2018, 12:15 PM

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in taxation law terms, they supply a service to users who pay for it, and they make large sums for supplying this service. They probably shouldapply VAT (sales tax) according to their national rules, and the yshould certainly declare the income to the tax authorities and pay their taxes on it.

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this supply of a service is CLEARLY commercial use, which breaks the licenses of MOST mod creators.

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which is why BI added the monetization rules

echo orchid Jul 7, 2018, 12:25 PM

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....with a complet lack of infrastructure to control, verify and enforce these monetization rules

tawny sentinel Jul 7, 2018, 12:30 PM

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Hence why I think we should make a big stint of it on the forums to see it improved.

echo orchid Jul 7, 2018, 12:31 PM

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dude, most of the old farts like myself that have been around modding since OFP have voiced our opinions

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the monetization rules were bound to get reviewed by first by the end of 2016 and based on the feedback and impact changed

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there was no change done, same stuff remained the same, was simply pushed the way it was

sonic blade Jul 7, 2018, 1:43 PM

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Hence why it's more aggressively enforced by the modders in what few ways there are?
We've had some issues with life servers breaking out our sfp_wheelchair and sfp_bas90 from their parent mods, but this is apparently way way bigger than people being dumb about what you can do with things that aint yours to decide over 😮

echo orchid Jul 7, 2018, 1:53 PM

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the main issue is the lack of fucking education

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just because something is free doesn't mean it is open source

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or that can be used whatever way one feel like

mint edge Jul 7, 2018, 1:53 PM

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it's just dumb that this is even a topic because of you just made the mods yourself that you plan to monetize nobody would even say a word about it let alone attempt to go after you lol

mint edge Jul 7, 2018, 2:14 PM

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if I plan on doing any kind of long term project I wouldn't burn my bridges with those around me whom I could benifits by atleast being cordial with

narrow slate Jul 7, 2018, 2:19 PM

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@olive sparrow maybe. they haven't shared any with samatra though it seems. he told them to fuggoff

signal hemlock Jul 7, 2018, 2:48 PM

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So can you use RHS on a public server aslong as you dont edit the pbo's and dont monetize?

tawny sentinel Jul 7, 2018, 2:51 PM

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@signal hemlock http://www.rhsmods.org/page/EULA

olive sparrow Jul 7, 2018, 2:53 PM

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Same with unsung. Dont monetize and dont repack or modify

echo orchid Jul 7, 2018, 3:03 PM

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@signal hemlock yeah of course you can. you cannot repack, edit and redistribute it. The content is available via SW, of course you can use it on either public or private servers

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we are releaseing mods just so you cannot use them, but we do not allow monetization - again, donations are fine

soft egret Jul 7, 2018, 3:04 PM

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It wouldn't make sense to publish a mod and not allow anyone to use it

tawny sentinel Jul 7, 2018, 3:04 PM

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See but not touch

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The sadist's guide to mods

icy latch Jul 7, 2018, 3:05 PM

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@soft egret Explain to me whats happening with this PsiSyn Situation out of curiosity?

soft egret Jul 7, 2018, 3:05 PM

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They are breaking BI's monetization license repeatedly and are lying to BI legal department.

icy latch Jul 7, 2018, 3:06 PM

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How can you prove they are lying?

soft egret Jul 7, 2018, 3:06 PM

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I can check if they did what they said they did

icy latch Jul 7, 2018, 3:07 PM

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You can check? How

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Yikes dont get too lippy

soft egret Jul 7, 2018, 3:08 PM

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Let's take this example: A guy tells you he got a haircut. Next day you see him and his hair didn't change.
Did he lie to you?

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So how can I check? I can use my eyes.

icy latch Jul 7, 2018, 3:08 PM

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but you cant check private emails?

soft egret Jul 7, 2018, 3:10 PM

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I can't and I don't need to

icy latch Jul 7, 2018, 3:10 PM

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between Lewis and BI and obviously BI Dont get a fuck because they havent "taken" Action according to you

soft egret Jul 7, 2018, 3:11 PM

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won't give more information till this is done

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If you want I can publicise everything afterwards

icy latch Jul 7, 2018, 3:15 PM

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PsiSyn wont shut down anytime soon, and Will it finish? 🤔 BI dont seem to care?, and yes please

novel goblet Jul 7, 2018, 3:18 PM

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"To be continued"...

tawny sentinel Jul 7, 2018, 3:53 PM

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@icy latch That's some fantastic spelling which really articulates your point further.

dusk dew Jul 7, 2018, 5:23 PM

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What point was he exactly trying to get across? There is no need to bash someone's spelling

snow bloom Jul 7, 2018, 5:56 PM

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Agreed ^ English isn't everyone's first language

proud flicker Jul 7, 2018, 6:27 PM

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It really wretches my gut that the content creators cannot monetize, but the server owners can.

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Pair that with figures of mutiple-thousand USD of revenue... easiest way to get someone to stop making mods.

fervent needle Jul 7, 2018, 6:28 PM

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The only way is make a mod for your own server then monetize that, which is quite stupid

proud flicker Jul 7, 2018, 6:29 PM

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And as Pufu said, the whole monetization scheme/policy is just fake.

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Its not effectively enforceable.

fervent needle Jul 7, 2018, 6:33 PM

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Its not at all

proud flicker Jul 7, 2018, 6:38 PM

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This was my analysis of the stituation from over a year ago:
https://forums.bohemia.net/forums/topic/207137-is-approved-server-monetizers-an-effective-measure/

Bohemia Interactive Forums

Is Approved Server Monetizers an effective measure?

The further my current A3 content project progresses towards the finish line, the more I start into looking how to license my content upon release.

...

mint edge Jul 7, 2018, 8:29 PM

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if a person doesn't care about being part of the greater community they can get away with practically anything without any real repercussions...

soft egret Jul 7, 2018, 11:39 PM

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@dusk dew the point he was trying to get across was "psisyn is god. They cannot be hurt by anyone. It's worthless trying to force them to violate rules because they can get through with anything they do"

undone pier Jul 8, 2018, 4:17 AM

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my argument is still if you guys want to see BI act, you have to organize a community mod team "strike" pulling all your mods from workshop, for an extended amount of time, until it gets media attention and forces BI, or maybe even Valve, to act

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however at least you need to expand public awareness - this discord (channel) doesnt really make a difference (in regards to outside modder circles)

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with the current situation obviously nothing will improve (significantly)

wild pollen Jul 8, 2018, 4:54 AM

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or instead of that bohemia actually enforces its own policies?

undone pier Jul 8, 2018, 6:03 AM

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imo the whole server monetization system should be ditched as it gives abusers a legitimation and instead a clear "no-money involved" policy should be established again (except donations without any strings attached and team/group membership to pay server fees) - unless the active system and policy actually helps community people in a significant enough way to enforce their right (requirement to sign a proper contract and proof your identity to allow/help with legal prosecution in case of breach of contract) in combination with an automated monitoring system if the said server only uses the permitted mods, plus support of the system to allow authors to set their policy for their work and to flag abuse very easily ("these are my mods" - link to workshop, proof of being that author)

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it will still get abused or people just ignoring the system altogether, but thats as best as its gets unless Valve gives BI more control in workshop

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(for the record: encryption wont help in practice and has significant downsides - so no option and pointless to argue for)

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 7:19 AM

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I haven't checked Psisyn pack lately, but if he still has content that violates copyright. Google Drive has it's own rules in which you could probably contact about.

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As for the last convo after that. I would like to point out that BI has taken a unique approach to allocating some legal/support to mod owners. There is dozens of games that have very little protections, or worse, have clauses that basically say any mod made on the game is property of the devs.

undone pier Jul 8, 2018, 7:33 AM

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the last point is obviously void and to be ignored

pliant oar Jul 8, 2018, 8:10 AM

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ye but each support has it's limits (manpower allocation) plus when BI does something it must give all sides chance and timeframe for responses etc.

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it would be too easy if i could just use banhammer

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combined with the lack of total control over master servers / workshop etc. it leaves BI only limited area of operation vs IP issues related to monetizing

proud flicker Jul 8, 2018, 8:43 AM

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Perhaps an exe modification that is a startup parameter: You need to enable this to be able to join monetized servers. This modifciation then shuts down external mod loading and only allows to load mods that come from the workshop.

This way monetized servers would force players onto the workshop, where the situation is certainly still a mess, but so much more controllable than currently. Flag a workshop entry as "non-monetizeable" and it will prevent from being loaded in monetized-mode.

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(Just a random thought)

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It would also only show monetized servers that are loaded from a database that is monitored and curated.

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Lose your monetization status -> gone from the list -> gone from the browser.

fair rune Jul 8, 2018, 8:47 AM

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^ This is an interesting ide

pliant oar Jul 8, 2018, 9:42 AM

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inpractical also ever heard about private workshop items ?

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negated solution in first 30s of writing comment :( {i'm so good on breaking things}

undone pier Jul 8, 2018, 9:46 AM

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get a flag from Valve if mod is public or not 😉

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 10:23 AM

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I haven't checked Psisyn pack lately, but if he still has content that violates copyright About 5 different mods currently. Even though they told BI that they removed one last week. It's still there. And BI still let's it slide.
plus when BI does something it must give all sides chance and timeframe for responses etc That is the problem @pliant oar Why? People accepted the monetization rules when they got the permission.
Why can they break the rules every couple weeks and get through with it and have BI just tell them "Fix it within a week and it's fine". They violated the rules. They should loose the permission immediately.
Like if you in real life punch a guy. Then give him a kiss onto where it hurts and then everything is just fine again. 5 minutes later you punch him again.

Getting monetization apprival requires reading the rules.
They can't say they didn't know the rules. Or that they didn't know the Mod didn't allow it, because the rules say they need Permission for every Mod and they got permission for almost none. Clearly a rule violation. But BI just doesn't act.
That's the biggest problem from my point of view. Monetization is already kinda bad. But there are actually really a few good guys that monetize and do everything according to the rules.
But we just can't do anything about the bad guys because BI simply doesn't act even after we tell them about it. This throws everything into the bin and makes people boycott the entire Monetization scheme even if not everyone is a bad guy.

pliant oar Jul 8, 2018, 10:24 AM

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@soft egret what slide, 2 days of state holidays last week, also there are timeframes before action are taken

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stop expecting things happen instantly

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 10:27 AM

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I mean that people already reported psiSyn months ago for rule violations. I reported them like.. 2 weeks ago now. At first BI said "yeah we asked them to remove the mod" (Why? They clearly violated monetization rules which should follow in a monetization ban)
One week later BI told me "They removed it" they didn't though. So I told BI that they lied to them. And BI said "Yeah. We asked them again to remove it". They are still openly violating rules. They even stated here that they didn't even read them. And instead of enforcing the rules BI just says "Just remove it and it's fine".

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I'm talking about a slide of months. Not days.

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And BI was clearly corresponding with them but let them slide every time with what were clear rule violations that should show that they shouldn't be monetizing

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Some guys told me they reported them months ago. I reported them a little over 2 weeks ago.
Here we are right now: Bnae, CBA, HLC, Jbad, Kickass, (Kiory? Actually don't know), RHS, MBG killhouses, Robert Hammer, SFP (Anrop), TFAR, TRYK, RHS

Here is a list of mods that I recognize and that they for sure don't have explicit permission to monetize. I know some of these mods don't care about people monetizing them. But the monetization rules cleary state that you need EXPLICIT permission for every mod.

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My problem is from my first report on. BI just handled them like it was just a little accident. Which it is clearly not.
This is blanked ignornace of the rules. What are the modders supposed to think if BI let's them through with this?

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 10:35 AM

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That and it is a very bad example for others, as they always state: "Why should i not do this? PsiSyn and other make money for years and no one cares." Same like those damn reuploads on the workshop.

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Arma 3 is still alive mainly because of all the modding community unlike other games. You should do things to protect that

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 10:36 AM

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This was BI's answer to me reporting they are using TFAR and HLC:
We have contacted server owner and requested removal of your Intellectual property from his server. They did comply with our request but told us that, they will be switching to another version for over which you allegedly do not have rights
I can't believe that BI gave them a OK to do that. "Hey yeah. we knowingly ignore the rules. But okey if that guy want's it we'll use a different version of the same mod where that guy has no rights on. Although we still won't have permission to use that mod at all"
Like.. what?

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You don't tell a repeating offender "It's fine. But don't do it again please"

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And yeah. BI legal department is too small to take care of everything. They are overfilled with work. But maybe they would not be if they didn't have to investigate the same communities every couple weeks.

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 11:19 AM

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Here we are right now: Bnae, CBA, HLC, Jbad, Kickass, (Kiory? Actually don't know), RHS, MBG killhouses, Robert Hammer, SFP (Anrop), TFAR, TRYK, RHS
@soft egret - RHS? where?

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if they are using RHS i missed that one, but i will fucking C&D their website host and server provider

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 11:23 AM

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MELB.

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We talked about that on friday ^^

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 11:25 AM

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ahh yeah, we share IP with MELB as it is also a separate addon, but also part of RHS so development is shared 😃

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i thought there were using direct RHS data

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¯_(ツ)_/¯

olive sparrow Jul 8, 2018, 11:55 AM

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i'm sure Luiz won't want people monetizing his MELB

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 2:21 PM

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yeah that is sorted, of course he doesn't

tight copper Jul 8, 2018, 3:19 PM

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Just thinking out loud, can monetized servers get a special flag in the server list?

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or do they have that already?

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 3:19 PM

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They don't, but how would that help?

tight copper Jul 8, 2018, 3:20 PM

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In that case a mod sniffer can be used to quickly check what mods are used, if that sniffer has a blacklist, life of reporting gets very easy

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would be easy I think, as all the mods are listed anyway when you select a server aint it?

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 3:22 PM

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Yep, at least Kind of. They are listed by either the file name or name in the mod.cpp. But most Life server pack everything into a few @ folders to make it easier. So only this pack will be listed instead of each mod individually

tight copper Jul 8, 2018, 3:25 PM

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Yeh, forced steam workshop mods would be a better option

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Also a setting for content creators to not allow it on monetized servers would be great then

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 3:28 PM

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Exactly, you would need to limit access to mods to the Steam Workshop. But alot of mods which aren't on the workshop and aren't updated anymore won't be able to be used... This might lead to reuploads. Also it wouldn't stop anyone from uploading their pack on the Steam Workshop, but you could at least take it down easier. This would enable the option to disallow the use on monetized server by a button Press. But this also means work for Steam and BI, so we most likely won't see this feature.

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Iirc Dwarden said that "work" between Steam and BI is very limited.

pliant oar Jul 8, 2018, 3:37 PM

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it's not limited it's just not as unlimited as we would like it to be wasntme

tight copper Jul 8, 2018, 3:40 PM

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Is there a full list of all the approved monetized servers?

grand oyster Jul 8, 2018, 3:46 PM

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There's a list, no idea if it's the "full" list

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 3:51 PM

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Should be yea: https://www.bohemia.net/monetization/approved

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 3:52 PM

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Oh yeet, didn't know HLC did not allow monetization

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Well ripperinos to all these approved exile servers that use it xD

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 3:54 PM

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@errant drum might be worth telling him about that

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 3:55 PM

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@stoic beacon tell who?

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 3:55 PM

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Toadie2k

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 3:55 PM

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Oh yeh

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 3:56 PM

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Isn't he in the discord as well?

tawny sentinel Jul 8, 2018, 3:56 PM

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I brought up the PsiSyn thing literally months ago, originally with the inclusion of HLC and (wrongly) CUP terrains. I know -FM- forwarded it. It's not a matter of expecting things to happen instantly Dwarden. And the "We'll just switch to another version which is literally just switching the burden to another party whilst still violating the agreement.

mint edge Jul 8, 2018, 3:57 PM

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just because everybody monetizes with something doesn't mean they ever got permission lol

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 3:57 PM

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@stoic beacon just messaged the dude

#

On Biforums

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 3:57 PM

#

👌

mint edge Jul 8, 2018, 3:57 PM

#

the ONLY way to garuntee a modded server is in the clear is to do every mod yourself and fully made by yourself

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 3:58 PM

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@mint edge u already said that, shatap now ty

mint edge Jul 8, 2018, 3:58 PM

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aswell as any other content, scripts and the like, sounds, images

tawny sentinel Jul 8, 2018, 3:59 PM

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https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/411672018090459136/430763688618754069/aec84ef6267b2973b068af2d8c161a1b.png?width=530&height=437

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 3:59 PM

#

Yeet

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That's a lot of addons xD

tawny sentinel Jul 8, 2018, 3:59 PM

#

Already brought it up with Toadie once, this was in fourth of april I believe

tight copper Jul 8, 2018, 4:01 PM

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So off most of them we have a list of IP's

stoic beacon Jul 8, 2018, 4:02 PM

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So?

tight copper Jul 8, 2018, 4:03 PM

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Meaning sniffing out the mods is not undoable

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its just a bit of work

undone pier Jul 8, 2018, 4:09 PM

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A3 launcher has the protocol/algorithm for that, but i think its known how to do anyway

#

@river spear next level challenge for you? :)
query all servers from the steam server list - or at least monetized (from the BI page), subscribe and download all (public) mods, hash the pbo and contents, match vs blacklist/whitelist of mods

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 4:18 PM

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@errant drum Oh yeet, didn't know HLC did not allow monetization no one said that they don't

undone pier Jul 8, 2018, 4:18 PM

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PS: IMO this is what BI should have done in the first place and is their responsibility - monitor, verify and act upon it

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 4:19 PM

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You need EXPLICIT permission for EVERY mod you are using. That is the problem

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TFAR also generally allows monetization. But if you don't get that explicit permission you are still violating the rules

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 4:19 PM

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@soft egret thought that

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https://gyazo.com/e76b2d14c7d9d98dd25c177b4b68a970

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Means it does not allow

undone pier Jul 8, 2018, 4:21 PM

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so give modders an interface to confirm the permission - would be way more clean anyway (login into Steam acc, or even BIF acc, go to server page, and set your mod(s) as approved)

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 4:22 PM

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@errant drum explicit permission by the author is higher than the license

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and considering you need EXPLICIT permission for EVERY mod on the monetized server.. The license doesn't really mean much in that case

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Unless you monetize and run that mod without explicit permission. Then you are violating the monetization rules AND the mod's license

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Which is what psisyn is doing with like half a dozen mods

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 5:02 PM

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@soft egret quick question on the matter, if lets say a modder grants you permission, and then he decides to revoke it, ur basically screwed right?

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 5:03 PM

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correct

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 5:03 PM

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Ok cool

#

I feel like Arma should have 2 licenses, that are similar but different. Idk I work with other material and other licenses, which are there so that you know what's happening with the material you are handling. All this permission grant, license interpretation etc are a bit too confusing lol

mint edge Jul 8, 2018, 5:34 PM

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I can agree that it gets a bit ridiculous sometimes but the wishes of the author should always take precedence, it's their work and they have the final say over all

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:18 PM

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@errant drum we did just that with arma koth. it is out prerogative, gave them 1 month to comply though

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:19 PM

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@mint edge the wishes of the author should be expressed through the license

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:19 PM

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as in starting today, no more monetization for anyone, legacy agreements or otherwise

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:19 PM

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So that any of this shenanigans are avoided imo

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:19 PM

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that's false ^

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:20 PM

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There should be Arma License 1 - Do what you want with my stuff - Arma License 2 - You are limited to do stuff - all problems in the world solved

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And third world countries hunger with it as well

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:20 PM

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nope

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i can make exceptions from my own license

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:21 PM

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You can do that but it's better if you are clear from the beginning

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:21 PM

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No, that doesnt make anything better. Each modder can and should be able to choose what to allow and what not. And changing licenses doesnt help anything when people like PsiSyn etc just dont read or ignore them.

#

It was and is clear from the beginning. People just have to read what they accept....

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:21 PM

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You could just file a actual lawsuit.

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:22 PM

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Indeed, cause there are some people that have APL-SA for example and say "do whatever you want"

#

See that's wrong, there should be a do whatever u want license to begin with to avoid unnecessary interactions and misunderstandings

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:23 PM

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Sure, and the monetization rules still state that you have to have permission for every mod you are using. All that applied for that list, accepted that

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:23 PM

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Then you have the - ask me permission to do whatever - license, so you know you have to do that

#

Clearly, distinct, 2 different licenses and ofc there's always gonna be the turd who's not reading them but god forbid

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:23 PM

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The normal licenses have nothing to do with the monetization rules

#

The same applies for the steam licenses for uploads on the workshop

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:24 PM

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I am a video editor, photographer, and when I am choosing/buying content I know what I can do with it right off the bat

#

I don't have to go ask for permission to someone to use it

#

Cause the license says it all.

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:24 PM

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As I mentioned before you can contact google, and see what you can do about him hosting his mod on google drive which contains copyrighted content.

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:24 PM

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but you are not buying anything for arma, are you now?

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:24 PM

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As does the monetization rules you have to read before being able to apply for the list....

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:25 PM

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and you still need to ask permission to the authot (no matter where the file as hosted)

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:25 PM

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Why do you have to do that

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:25 PM

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for using said content for booze and tabaco adverts for instance

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:25 PM

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When you can have a license that says it already

#

Why not break that useless gap?

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:25 PM

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There is no useless gap

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:25 PM

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What if I wanna use a mod and the author has not connected to steam in 10 months

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:26 PM

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the only useless thing to be honest is allowing anyone to monetize arma content

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:26 PM

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I don't see the big deal with expressing clearly what you want to be done with ur material

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:26 PM

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i can change the fucking EULA 4 times a week if i want to

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just like BI can change their monetization rules anytime they want to

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:26 PM

#

Then tell arma to remove monetization xD

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:27 PM

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As a normal server owner or private you can use all that mods as stated in their licenses. No problems wether the log in or not. Only if you want to monetize you have to apply at BI for that list and therefor read these special rules..... thats not hard to do and not complicated at all

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:27 PM

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It's exactly the same concept with media, if I use stock footage that is under a strict license, that I did not paid for I get striked

dull moon Jul 8, 2018, 6:27 PM

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apparently it is hard to read the rules...

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:27 PM

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Some media is free to use and u can do whatever u want

#

APL-SA is too ambiguous imo

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But that's just an opinion

#

I am not part at all of this license-monetization war

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:28 PM

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Adam.... do you even read? Monetization rules have nothing to do with the regular licenses and are pretty simple and easy to read

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:28 PM

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Just giving an outside prospective to make yall lives simpler

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@safe arrow did you even read? No one cares about those rules, they are being broken constantly

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:28 PM

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Idk, to me at this point. It seems like people care, but don't want to do anything unless it involves a easy button. All of you are more then capable of going to court with these things..

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:29 PM

#

my own license is pretty straight forward, mainly because is it based on Creative Commons ones

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:29 PM

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A small line of text won't stop some one from abusing and violating said agreement. Just like in the real world companies must activity fight infringement.

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:29 PM

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i did have to write down, because no one reads these CC licenses but myself

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:29 PM

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@echo orchid and you even state on your website that it is absolutely not allowed, which is perfect

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:29 PM

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that monetization is prohibited

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:29 PM

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If that involves gofunding a lawyer, so be it...

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:29 PM

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That's why everyone knows how RHS and CUP work in regards

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:30 PM

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even though the license itself is non-commercial anyways

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:30 PM

#

On the other hand, the other 9,999,999 modders don't say anything in regards

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:30 PM

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but that is easy

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:30 PM

#

Is it?

#

😛

#

Does not seem so

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:30 PM

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it is

#

if the license doesn't expresely say you are allowed to use said content for commercial purposes, including or just for monetization

#

then it's a bit NO

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:31 PM

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I know but it's hard for people to understand apparently lel

echo orchid Jul 8, 2018, 6:31 PM

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and that is up to BI to solve it

#

because it is their own rule set

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:34 PM

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Is that so hard to read or understand?


You may, but ONLY if you have proper permission from all of the authors of such mods. Monetizing without it contravenes our licenses.```
https://www.bohemia.net/monetization/faq#!#c7

wild pollen Jul 8, 2018, 6:35 PM

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Clearly noone takes that seriously, if psisyn is still up and its clear hes violating that why should anyone else follow that?

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:35 PM

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And this is the point we are discussing about:
If we feel anyone on the list at https://www.bohemia.net/monetization/approved/arma3 is exploiting any loopholes or is not acting in the best interests of the Arma 3 community, we will remove them. That will mean they will have to cease this kind of monetization immediately or face legal action.
Cause no one has ever seen legal actions from BI-side only those "please take the mods off and everything is fine" again and again....

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:36 PM

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They can turn off a server

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:36 PM

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They are not removed or anything else, BI just lets them keep on also there are clear and obvious violations.

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:37 PM

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I am sure that legal action is last resort, you know, lawyers ain't free

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:37 PM

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^

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 6:37 PM

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They can, i know. But they dont do it for whatever reasons after all the things Deadmen told us so far. And that is the problem with setting up rules, but not enforcing them

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:38 PM

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https://support.google.com/docs/answer/2463296?hl=en

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:38 PM

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There's no need to call a laywer

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When you can erase them from the internet yourself

#

😉

wild pollen Jul 8, 2018, 6:39 PM

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shouldnt have to go to google, bohemia should just enforce there own rules

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:39 PM

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Shouldn't, but have to.

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:39 PM

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If you are the content owner, you can take down their server, website, social media, everything

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Ask @echo orchid he knows

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😛

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:40 PM

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I'm not trolling when I'm saying lawyer up. I just get annoyed by all the complaining because you knocked on one door, didn't get the response you wished. But refuse to try another one tell justice is served.

#

I learned this working tradeshows for 5 years.

wild pollen Jul 8, 2018, 6:41 PM

#

thonk

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:41 PM

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It's like this...person calls police on issue, police say no don't care.

#

Said person goes, ok, then goes to the media.

#

If you have to go through google, because BI isn't enforcing it's own policies. So be it.

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:42 PM

#

^

#

If you are the content owner again, you have all the power on this world, through your content and license to destroy someone

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And u don't even need a lawyer some times 😛

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:43 PM

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Exactly.

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:45 PM

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Point being is, being mad at BI for not doing anything is just stupid, if you want ur shit not to be used or taken down do it yourself

#

We need a be like @echo orchid meme

#

He knows how to

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😛

#

"Your mod is being used against your will, be like PuFu, destroy them."

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:48 PM

#

@errant drum On the other hand, the other 9,999,999 modders don't say anything in regards Yeah they don't need to. By default monetization is not allowed. On ANY mod. And the mod maker saying "you can monetize all you want" is per the monetization rules also not relevant.It's still not allowed.
Actually doesn't matter at all what something is licensed under. You cannot monetize if you don't have explicit permission. period.

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:49 PM

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Yeah but mine and Sabre's point is, if you are not satisfied with BI's attention to the problem, or how they enforce their shit, you can do it yourself

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:50 PM

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Yeah.. I can pay for a lawyer.. sure..

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:50 PM

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You can literally obscure their website, social media, even discord bro

#

Nope

#

Don't need a lawyer

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:50 PM

#

It's not like we think BI shouldn't improve their enforcment

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:50 PM

#

What then?

#

Tell them to stop? Doesn't work. Tell BI to stop them? doesn't work.

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:50 PM

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You can copy strike through youtube, google, discord, facebook, twitter

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:50 PM

#

^^^^^

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:50 PM

#

What?

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:50 PM

#

OVH

#

You can tell OVH to shut off their dedis

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:51 PM

#

I can copy right strike their Discord and Facebook because they are using a Mod on their Arma server... Really?

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:51 PM

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Yup

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:51 PM

#

What does their Discord and Facebook have to do with that?

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:51 PM

#

Yes, becuase BI gave you the rights and framework to do so.

#

It was just a example given

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:51 PM

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Did they?

#

BI rules only apply to Arma

#

"Hey you stole my pen in school. I'll now copy right strike your thousand dollar server in another country! HAH!"

#

That doesn't make any sense

#

And it for sure won't work

#

Sure. If they share my IP on their facebook I can..

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:53 PM

#

lol Deadmen

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:53 PM

#

But they don't

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:53 PM

#

I think that is overthinking it, that is like me saying corsair owns rights to a model since I used my keyboard to make it.

#

It's clear within the license agreements provided by BI to apply to mods that we own them, and extend only certain uses to it. Add that on top of BI's current policies(which companies won't bother investigating how well they are being enforced). It is more then enough to put some DMCA claims in.

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:55 PM

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Yeah. I can send them a DMCA. Which they will just ignore till I get a lawyer.

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 6:55 PM

#

You won't know tell you try.

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:55 PM

#

^

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:56 PM

#

Well BI told them twice on my behalf to take my stuff out. They didn't do it. soo..

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:56 PM

#

I mean again @soft egret if you don't believe to what we say, ask PuFu, he's done it I think a couple of times

#

Successfully

#

Because he was not satisfied with BI's "performance"

soft egret Jul 8, 2018, 6:57 PM

#

RHS legal team is playing in a different league than me.

#

And you should know that too

errant drum Jul 8, 2018, 6:58 PM

#

@prisma scaffold doesn't have a legal team, I am sure he has dealt with it already without using a lawyer

#

I have done it on other platforms for other related stuff, and it worked

#

So again, you can't say it doesn't work until you try it

#

Instead of spending all your energy with BI, take some action yourself, see if that works, if it doesn't, at least you can prove us wrong at that point and you have nothing to lose?

#

I mean we're just tryna help, you can do whatever u want at the end of the day 😄

fossil basalt Jul 8, 2018, 7:09 PM

#

discuss there violations before sending email to infringements@bistudio.com , Arma 3 EULA : https://www.bistudio.com/community/licenses/arma3-end-user-license
The hint is in the email.

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 7:15 PM

#

Psy has already been fined a lot of money for his illegal gambling.

#

If you can't lawyer him, you can do what internet does best. Make his life miserable by blocking every way he tries to circumvent the rules. 😛

#

Just assemble the evidence.
Include.

correspondence between you and him. Rather he responds or not, you just need to establish documentation you attempted to settle this out of basic talk.
Your license agreement, and BI's rules
Explanation on Mod Keys, so they understand they establish ownership.
Explanation how he is using a 3rd party tool (like google drive) to circumvent rules, and how he already been knocked off steam because of violations on copyright.

#

Those are just a few things I can think of I would include in a e-mail for a DMCA

heavy moon Jul 8, 2018, 7:25 PM

#

also if you have correctly registered copyrights in your works, then you can use that as evidence in any dmca claim.

prisma scaffold Jul 8, 2018, 7:25 PM

#

^

#

Also finding his server provider would be useful. They might have their own infringement policies you can report to.

fossil basalt Jul 8, 2018, 7:36 PM

#

This particular topic has been "discussed" enough. It is in the hands of the BI legal team. Let them deal with it.

heavy moon Jul 8, 2018, 7:37 PM

#

yeah, but its also fair to have a place to discuss the measures one can take to protect their content, not specifically directed at anyone 😃

fossil basalt Jul 8, 2018, 7:38 PM

#

Yup, that place is the Forum.

undone pier Jul 8, 2018, 7:45 PM

#

never seen anything on the forum in those regards

#

also forum is no longer used much by most ppl

#

so bad advice

#

also BI doesnt seem motivated to deal with him/it

#

anyhow let the shit show continue

heavy moon Jul 8, 2018, 7:50 PM

#

i'd say that isnt entirely true,. I have had response from BI in the past about abuses of their monetisation system,. as with any dmca claim though, once submitted leave it to them to deal with and investigate fully,. doing stuff in the interim period may hinder any investigatory stuff they may be doing.

fossil basalt Jul 8, 2018, 8:03 PM

#

never seen anything on the forum in those regards

Thats my point kju! Create a post to document these sorts of abuses and propose logical solutions. I came back from holiday to find a ton of messages rehashing the same thing over and over. After 1 page forward or 1 page back, no one reads it, so it becomes an "Alzheimers" page of the same thing.

The entire point of this channel is to discuss if something is a violation and if it is, then to send it on to infringements@bistudio.com ... That it.

safe arrow Jul 8, 2018, 8:04 PM

#

Then there is no need to discuss at all if BI doesnt take any actions beside asking nicely over and over again to follow the rules? BI missing to enforce its rules, thats the whole point of this discussion including alternate possibilities etc.

fossil basalt Jul 8, 2018, 8:06 PM

#

Is "x" infringing? Yes or No? Unsure? Then Discuss. Outcome, send email if infringement or not if it isn't.

olive sparrow Jul 8, 2018, 9:10 PM

#

@soft egret I can put you in touch with his server provider tomorrow if you like - drop me a pm. I'm on good terms with the company.

tawny sentinel Jul 8, 2018, 9:28 PM

#

Legend.

scenic swallow Jul 9, 2018, 3:28 AM

#

Shit I've reported a server 4 times over the past 6 months for violating monetization rules, each time they get a slap on the wrist and nothing gets done. This most recent time they started selling in-game money for donations and have made over $800 in the last week alone. Again, nothing was done.

undone pier Jul 9, 2018, 4:46 AM

#

atm probably the most meaningful and eventful is to DMCA all related services (Steam, server host, web host, download host, media host, etc)

undone pier Jul 9, 2018, 5:02 AM

#

https://forums.bohemia.net/forums/topic/217755-armaservices-stealing-other-peoples-functions/

Bohemia Interactive Forums

ArmaServices stealing other peoples functions

just came to my attention that ArmaServices is using some peoples functions in their scripts that they are selling, just direct copy/paste, not even a rew...

#

probably a good business model to offer paid scripts for Lifers

#

the stealing part is kinda killing it though

prisma scaffold Jul 9, 2018, 5:54 AM

#

Ow man, you want to talk about the worst of the worst. It has to be the life devs

#

By life devs, I mean the people who charge to set up servers. I mean imagine being payed to basically install a bunch of stuff. Zero cares if it's stolen, copyrighted, ect. Then off to the next victim.

scenic swallow Jul 9, 2018, 7:33 AM

#

devs

#

That's a very liberal use of the term there

snow bloom Jul 9, 2018, 7:39 AM

#

I once encountered a dev who quoted someone £110 to SETUP an arma 3 server

#

£110??!1!1!1!1?1!1

soft egret Jul 9, 2018, 7:43 AM

#

Yeah. Also once got a similar offering. He asked in public if anyone wants help. I answered. He said "okey i'll message your privately then" and then nothing happened.
For tons of Life servers everything is about money. Both on the input and output.
Which is also why it's more economical to just buy a modpack that A3LP tells you is approved for monetization and everything will be fine. Rather than paying devs and making stuff on your own.
Problem is when someone actually tells them that, that modpack is not okey. The last server with a bought A3LP pack that I reported completely shut down after a week. They atleast understood that it doesn't work like they thought it works. But some other communities are stubborn.

snow bloom Jul 9, 2018, 7:52 AM

#

It’s so stupid like seriously, imagine the possibilities of mods if they paid people to make original content for each server.. much and all as I don’t appreciate the life community, they can produce some nice assets when they want to

sonic blade Jul 9, 2018, 8:16 AM

#

Modders union when?

#

I mean, if <organisation> doesnt listen to individual voices, unionize.
You can feel any way about workers unions, but they exist for damn good reasons.

#

Does it require effort to achieve, probably, but right now it seems to be that whats needed is a somewhat larger impact than what a few people doing DMCA's yield

astral marlin Jul 9, 2018, 8:21 AM

#

@snow bloom most life server just pay for content from turbosquid there is no talent as they are all copy paste. Then the few that do have skills get sucked into the paywalls

snow bloom Jul 9, 2018, 8:22 AM

#

Exactly. I can’t model myself and I can’t understand the hard work, but I do understand that surely the quality is gonna be better and you’re gonna be a lot more satisfied with the result

soft egret Jul 9, 2018, 8:23 AM

#

Getting people to work together is very hard to do @sonic blade :D
But that would definitely be nice. If they don't listen to complaints from "small" people. If the guys with the important mods suddenly arrive on the scene and threaten with revoking permission to use the mod. That could do alot.

astral marlin Jul 9, 2018, 8:23 AM

#

i stopped publishing to the A3 community years back as other servers would make big bank from our content while i was making a paying for our own servers

sonic blade Jul 9, 2018, 8:25 AM

#

@soft egret tell me bout it, i chaired a student org for a year, and did other stuff in it before/after, shits hard 😬

tawny sentinel Jul 9, 2018, 8:26 AM

#

Rob is working on a project to organize modders atm

sonic blade Jul 9, 2018, 8:27 AM

#

But indeed, it's usually way more effective to say "WE stand with this" rather than to have a bunch of people pipe up now and again

#

Thats great!

tawny sentinel Jul 9, 2018, 8:27 AM

#

Indeed it is

soft egret Jul 9, 2018, 8:30 AM

#

Just imagine that huge Life server using a small modder's first mod against his will. That Life server doesn't listen to the modder's request. The modder is overwhelmed and doesn't know what to do.
Suddenly RHS, CUP, TFAR come around the corner. I bet the life server guy will suddenly become very small and only say "I'm so sorry I'll remove it right away and it will never happen again. Please don't hurt me" 😄

astral marlin Jul 9, 2018, 8:46 AM

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Yer but then again people who still live with mummy and still have the i'm immortal view on life will just say i only pay for the server i have no control over the content even though i stream putting in the stolen content lol and bis ignore IP violations still not had a response from bis in over a month now. I guess numbers talk even if they are calling people who play ArmA pedo's in public just to get more numbers on there own server

sonic blade Jul 9, 2018, 8:50 AM

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Frankly i think it's more along the lines of

Individual modders dont have a large impact when raising issues
People are stupid about licenses and dont care or simply evade when said modder comes along to talk
2 can hopefully be solved by solving 1, but the other way around is unlikely to be an effective way.
Lemme know where to sign up SFP if push comes to shove regarding organising something.

soft egret Jul 9, 2018, 9:09 AM

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still not had a response from bis in over a month now wut? I got responses within 2 business days

dusk dew Jul 9, 2018, 6:58 PM

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So the Demillion that talks in scripting is the one from the link Kju sent?

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Phone can’t see on @ list

carmine folio Jul 9, 2018, 7:01 PM

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Is it just me or have I seen these models elsewhere?
https://armaservices.net/product/farming-system/

mint edge Jul 9, 2018, 7:09 PM

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maybe the arma 2 pumpkin, if so then commercially selling BIS data

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the rest I've never seen before or remember seeing

soft egret Jul 9, 2018, 7:38 PM

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Same. Only thing I remember is the pumpkin

wild pollen Jul 9, 2018, 8:17 PM

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Doesn't look like the Arma 2 pumpkin

shy beacon Jul 9, 2018, 8:28 PM

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Both planters they used in there video are from Arma 3 .

fair rune Jul 9, 2018, 8:29 PM

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how do you know?

shy beacon Jul 9, 2018, 8:29 PM

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just checked by the looks

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in arma 3 editor

fair rune Jul 9, 2018, 8:29 PM

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where do we see pumpkins in arma 3?

shy beacon Jul 9, 2018, 8:30 PM

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the planters he used to plant the plants in, not the plants themselves.

fair rune Jul 9, 2018, 8:31 PM

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sorry, brain malfunction on my end. Never seen those watering bottles though

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:09 PM

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Mods Required. Tonic Framework Required.
€29.99
Categories: Modded, Tonic Framework ```

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that makes me sick to see

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so they are commercially exploiting Tonics work

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surely this https://armaservices.net/vendors/alexanders-store/ is completely illegal commercial use of Arma - breaking the EULA?

grand oyster Jul 9, 2018, 11:11 PM

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"they" is a little vague, as I believe Armaservices is a platform for people to sell their own creations

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It makes me sick to see some simplistic scripts for €29.99 🤣

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I believe there has been debates over selling scripts, I think the outcome was code can be sold and other stuff as long as Arma tools weren't used

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:13 PM

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https://armaservices.net/terms/ - the guy is in Cyprus

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https://armaservices.net/product/portable-speedcamera/

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that is a model

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This website is not affiliated or authorized by Bohemia Interactive

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so it is a basic store someone set up to sell in-game content. how can it not be shut down by BI?

grand oyster Jul 9, 2018, 11:15 PM

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They openly advertise it on Steam and the SW

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Hell, even some of their "content" has reached the front page of the Arma workshop

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I'm not intending to defend them if I appear so

Wouldn't their site / content have been brought under the spotlight sometime ago if it wasn't allowed?

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And @bright tartan 👀

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:18 PM

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if they can sell a speed camera model, we can all sell an m16 or a tank. that cannot be correct.

bright tartan Jul 9, 2018, 11:19 PM

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mate cmon, if you come now

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nobody is allowed to sell

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what about a big seller like red?

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hm

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i dont want to think about such guys, which makes 1000000€

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:21 PM

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i'm asking if it is possible under the EULA to sell content for arma?

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afaik it is not in any way possible, except to maybe make a private deal with someone to help them etc

grand oyster Jul 9, 2018, 11:22 PM

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As far as I'm aware it's allowed provided, it does not touch Arma tools

bright tartan Jul 9, 2018, 11:22 PM

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then tell me, why all the sellers are there and not blocked or something

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:23 PM

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to actually set up an e-commerce site for it is stepping right into the "commercial use" definition which the EULA prohibits

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i'm asking tha texact same question!

bright tartan Jul 9, 2018, 11:23 PM

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i mean

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:23 PM

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my understanding of the EULA must be out of date

bright tartan Jul 9, 2018, 11:24 PM

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the sellers havent started yesterday

grand oyster Jul 9, 2018, 11:24 PM

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Take a browse on the forums and perhaps in this channel @olive sparrow I believe commercial sales have been brought into question

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:25 PM

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when they started in't material really. i am asking HOW they can do it - as once i understand that i'm off to make my first million lol

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i always assumed that you could not generate content for arma in any commercial capacity

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https://www.bohemia.net/community/licenses/arma3-end-user-license

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 End User's Obligations

    As a Subject to the Grant of License herein above, you may not, in whole or in part, copy, duplicate, reproduce, translate, reverse-engineer, modify, disassemble, decompile, derive source code, create derivative works based on the Program, remove any proprietary notices or labels from the Program or otherwise modify the Program without the prior written consent of the Licensor.
    You are entitled to use the Program for your own use, but you are not entitled to:
        Sell or transfer reproductions of the Program to other parties in any way, nor to rent, lease or license the Program to others
        Publish and/or distribute the computer Program or any of its parts
        Exploit the Program or any of its parts for any commercial purpose including, but not limited to, use at a cybercafe, computer gaming centre, computer aided training center or any other location-based site where multiple users may access the Program

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**Exploit the Program or any of its parts for any commercial purpose **

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if making an e-commerce site to sell in-game items doesn't breach that EULA i'm a monkeys uncle

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:29 PM

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@olive sparrow Scripts are allowed as they can be created without any tools of Bohemia, however anything that requires you to use the BI Tools is not possible

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:30 PM

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ok so they chose a more relaxed interpretation of the A3 EULA (nevermind the tools EULA)

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interesting

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:32 PM

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well if you took it super serious you could argue that for example microsoft could stop all commercial activity on windows at its for most parts only able to run in combination of windows

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but on top of my head i dont know of any case where writing a software that only works in combination with another one was restricted down by the license of the product it interacts with

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its still a original creation

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:33 PM

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i ca nsee the logic there, but the environment of an operating system is quite different to that of a game

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:34 PM

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the base issue is practically the same though, software only having commercial value in combination with something else

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:34 PM

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do people sell mods for elder scrolls or call of duty etc?

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afaik mods aren't paid content, unless the owner like valve allows it

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the ycreate a workshop and allow people to make things for their game

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and the ycontrol who makes stuff, and take a cut

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:35 PM

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the issue there is that these games usually require you to use some kind of file format specific to that game

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and when such formats are used or special tools by the same company they can put a license restrictions on the work that utilize them

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:36 PM

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i thought sqf was bohemia specific

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:36 PM

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its a very generic programming language, there has been a bunch of attempts to copyright a programming language, but there hasnt been any successful case yet

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given how similar the programming languages are, they all use the same basic constructs

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one incident with this for example is the legal fight between oracle and google

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:37 PM

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some content on that site is physcial objects - like camera models. can p3d be made without arma tools?

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:38 PM

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with p3d im not sure, i dont know if there are any tools outside of the bi toolset that allow you to create these files, also i dont know if p3d is something bohemia made or not :/

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:39 PM

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itis made by object builder afaik

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:39 PM

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that google oracle thing was actually a huge discussion https://www.theverge.com/2012/4/13/2944440/google-oracle-lawsuit-programming-language-copyright

dull moon Jul 9, 2018, 11:39 PM

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P3D can be exported by blender if you use the arma tool box by alwarren

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:39 PM

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and OB was BI's proprietary tool the ycreated for themselves to make OFP/arma originally

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ok so if i buy a royalty free m16 i can load it into blender, rig it, export to p3d, make some rvmats and a config, and pack it using mikero tools and sell it on an e-commerce site for arma players to use?

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if this is the case, I have like 100 models i could do that with right now.

dull moon Jul 9, 2018, 11:42 PM

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not so sure... i think mikero's tools use binarize by BI

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:43 PM

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these guys with their e-commerce site - they dont sell a pbo? only a script that the user makes into pbo?

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so i could sell the model rifle and config etc in an unbinned folder

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(i'm not planning to btw, i'm asking theoretical questions about how the EULA is interpreted)

dull moon Jul 9, 2018, 11:44 PM

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that's legal tho... sell it as *.TXT and a tutorial how to generate a pbo

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:44 PM

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any classnames used in a config have to derive from a BI class

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:45 PM

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the whole topic about this is very complex though

bright tartan Jul 9, 2018, 11:45 PM

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any classnames used in a config have to derive from a BI class

Now....

dull moon Jul 9, 2018, 11:45 PM

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it is, and controversial @river spear

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:46 PM

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ok well i didn't want to start a fire lol/ I just was unaware that e-commerce sites were permitted

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as that's CLEARLY a commercial activity - arma-related product offered for sale

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hang on, I pay a sub for mikeros tools. so how can they use BI tools?

dull moon Jul 9, 2018, 11:49 PM

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like i said, i'm not sure. that's for mikero to answer

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:49 PM

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This is from a huge discussion about paid mods in Skyrim

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Authorship and Legal rights

You are the author of the mod, what does it really mean ?
It means that you own all the rights of the mod, with a few limitations :

Your mod is most likely using the skyrim lore, universe, engine or whatever. It means your content fall under the "Fair use" case. Fair use does not mean Bethesda own your stuff, it only mean that they can prevent you from distributing it and can even ask for damage and interest fees if they think you are hurting their image, making money out of their work, etc... But this would have to be brought to a court. The most likely "bad" thing that can happen is that they don't like your stuff and send you a DMCA preventing you from sharing your work. That's it, and that thing is true for any game mod or fan fiction. They do NOT have any right to sell, use your work, or whatever. ```

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It's very much thing where there is no clear yes and no

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Then again thats also just the opinion from someone so dont take it for granted 😄

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:51 PM

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understood, it is about license interpretation and enforcement policy

dull moon Jul 9, 2018, 11:51 PM

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you know what's even worse? walking up to the fridge to find your ben&jerry's eaten by your "friend with benefits", and she put the empty cup back...

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:52 PM

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that's what i was unaware of, that someone can carry out open commercial transactions with arma-related content

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:52 PM

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tell her to find the door

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:52 PM

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well enjoy the benefits more thoroughly to get your pound of ice-cream back

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:53 PM

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bohemia likes to clearly tell you "this isnt allowed", but its not like they could bring it to court and win over it in an instant

olive sparrow Jul 9, 2018, 11:53 PM

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sounds like a cheap price

river spear Jul 9, 2018, 11:54 PM

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i feel like this also shows with their legal team, they give very vague information and often say something only to contradict themselves later on