[DUAL GPU SYSTEMS] Performance Issues and Troubleshooting

[humble frigate]

i wanna be like ravenger 😦

[elder smelt]

same man, same

[humble frigate]

its really off to me that the secondary GPU is using that much just be idle. like how would it be able to perform while gaming then

[elder smelt]

the usage is "fake"

[humble frigate]

oh?

[elder smelt]

usually that load doesn't actually make the gpu use more power or make its temps go up or anything

atleast for my case

its an indicator of something else

#1328337747399938138 message

try doing all this

I can tell you that chipset driver can help tremendously

[humble frigate]

i just tried something. dont know its help explaining a cause.
normal i would have it 3080 to rx6600 to monitor.
now i tried 3080 to 6600, back to 3080 and monitor.
no delay but my frames dropped ALOT even before LSFG

hmm never mind, cant recreate it

[humble frigate]

"In the NVCP for games:" like i have to do this for my whole steam lib?

[humble frigate]

tried everything. nothing changed other than cyberpunk is now capped at 58 så there are gains from 58 to 90 fps. but thats kinda fake when its capped. uncapped it could do above 80

[elder smelt]

wdym?

does it mean global nvcp settings?

[elder smelt]

rip

I wonder if this is a similar issue to what dranas experienced

[humble frigate]

if i turn down the resolution scale my frames jump a ton it seems

[elder smelt]

also the same thing for me

I think we share the exact same problem

[humble frigate]

what exactly does the resolution scale do? cant tell the difference

[meager yoke]

Hi IV, nope 1000 watts Titanium PSU and just the intel iGPU of the 11800h and a RX 480, all good temps

Getting complete system lockdowns

Have an Intel B580 on the way anyway, will try dual dedicated GPUs this week, will report back

[elder smelt]

its the input resolution that lsfg takes

its very minor increase in artifacts for large gains of performance

70% res scale is usually the best for quality and performance

over 3000 messages now

[humble frigate]

so i just tried the MH wild beta

this feels pretty good. i normally cant get al lot of frames

without LSFG 52 FPS with LSFG 52 FPS boosted to 102

this feel amazing! wtf?!

[elder smelt]

game dependent?

[humble frigate]

might be

[elder smelt]

makes no sense 😄

[humble frigate]

as flex said earlier 😛

[elder smelt]

yep

so does lsfg take no hit on mh wilds?

unlike cyberpunk

[humble frigate]

nope not at all. im just doing FPS x 2

i even asked my wife to confirm this isnt just number going up placebo

[elder smelt]

so odd

atleast its working somewhat well for you now 😄

[humble frigate]

now im wondering what happns if i use the RX6400 instead xD

might have to test that

[elder smelt]

if you can it would be great

you probably could do well with it ngl

maybe res scale adjust it a little

[humble frigate]

i did 100% with the RX6600 in monster hunter and just ate it. so yeah maybe take it down a notch with the RX6400

i have no words tbh. i bought into LSFG dual gpu with MH wild in mind primarely

just for the heck of it i tried booting POE2 and even without LSFG on i barely get any frames

which is not normal for me

[elder smelt]

definitely sounds like my issue too

looks like a cpu bottleneck but it isn't one

[humble frigate]

when i monitor the GPUs the 3080 TI isnt used at all in POE2

6600 at a 100%
3080 ti at 0%

i see. in options it says its using 6600 but i cant change it

[elder smelt]

oh

you sure there isn't a way to change it?

[humble frigate]

found a way to change it

ok POE is just like any other game

[elder smelt]

so it works fine?

[humble frigate]

nono its like the other games ive tested. says 6600 is at 100% even with using it. as soon as i use it, it drops overall and bost it a bit higher

although this one have a new issue it says 56/81 FPS

wouldnt it be 112 fps

[elder smelt]

yea it would

so weird

[vivid zealot]

@humble frigate in you windows graphics setting do you have the render gpu on "Let windows decide" either as the default or overrides per game.?

[humble frigate]

you mean this?

[vivid zealot]

What about at per game level?

Is there anything that might be overriding the default setting?

[humble frigate]

see thats what i thought off as well- havent ever touched it now i went into a bunch of games an overwritten it to 3080 ti

Red dead 2 works great it seems

[vivid zealot]

Also make sure your power efficiency in windows is set to ultimate gaming or high performance.

[humble frigate]

@elder smelt i think theres something to the thought about a bottle neck. 2 games that really a demanding for my pc are red dead 2 and monster hunter. both works great

[vivid zealot]

(Sorry if you already did that.. too much message history fir me to read)

[onyx warren]

Yeah, it's the same for me.
Graphically demanding games keep the GPU pegged at 90+ percent so there's no bottleneck

[elder smelt]

both very gpu demanding

[humble frigate]

i do it whenever i do a fresh install of windows. but still a good advice ^^

[elder smelt]

I ran 3dmark (super gpu intensive) and it was perfectly fine

even the cpu test it does

but then in games my fps dies

[vivid zealot]

I had 3080ti and rx6600 but on intel and I dont recall this issue in win 11 😕

[elder smelt]

is that what you use right now?

[vivid zealot]

No unfortunately not.

[elder smelt]

its mostly amd guys having this issue ngl

especially x3d

[humble frigate]

yeah, tested 6 games and 2 of them is a performance enhance. 4 is borked

[elder smelt]

good testing

very stupid issue

[vivid zealot]

Am I likely to see it on a 5700x3d with 4070 ti super and rx6600?

[elder smelt]

its my cpu so maybe

[humble frigate]

what we know right now. dont 😛

[elder smelt]

this makes me want to move to an am5 system 😔

and never getting x3d again

[vivid zealot]

My son has that setup. Id be happy to give it a try if he let's me. Lol

[elder smelt]

I heard about those stutters too

[elder smelt]

if you can it would be great data

[humble frigate]

never had any stutters

[onyx warren]

3800X as well, but that's older anyways

[elder smelt]

good because I heard many people have the 7800x3d stutter on forums like reddit

[vivid zealot]

Probably will be tomorrow night now, but happy to do some tests.

[elder smelt]

rip

[humble frigate]

@elder smelt i went in and forced cyberpunk to use 3080 instead of let windows decide. that seems to make me gain some FPS. have you tried and see if that made any difference for you?

i am new to AMD GPU. does adrenaline just download the driver without any input from the user?

[versed knoll]

If you have adrenaline software then the drivers are installed

[elder smelt]

that didn't do anything for me, I was already forcing my 7900xt as the render

[humble frigate]

I see. Just popped in the rx6400. About to test rdr2 and mh wild beta

RDR2 and mh wild was a FPS loss compard to the RX6600
interesting.

but RDR2 was hit harder than MH wilds

[elder smelt]

🤔

both cards are running pcie 4 x4 too

[humble frigate]

i know you explained the false W. but this looks so odd to me. if the W is only 34 its hardly doing anything at all?

34W with LSFG on and 17 off

are we 100% sure the power isnt being limited somehow?

[elder smelt]

hmm well it shouldn't be limited in terms of power at all

lsfg isn't an intensive thing for gpus in terms of power used

[humble frigate]

https://tenor.com/view/frustrated-pulling-hair-no-frustrating-gif-3532627

so it all boils down to game dependent and we dont know why

[elder smelt]

who knows what else could be going on

[onyx warren]

Have you tested RDR2 Vulkan vs DX12?

[humble frigate]

I haven't. But I can

[onyx warren]

Maybe it's the engines being weird somehow?

[clear sundial]

Very good chance, if you can, i would swap cards, leaving the main card on the bottom slot and the lsfg on the main slot, see if it helps

[humble frigate]

I'll add it to my list

[clear sundial]

This is because PCI-E bottlenecks hard maximum fps. So if you need just 60 base fps (for example) changing slots could be helpful

Since the LSFG card would stretch its legs

[elder smelt]

if thats what pcie bottleneck does then its not the case here

in a game like borderlands 3 I can push way above my refresh rate

but in another I can lose 20 fps even though I'm running at 100fps

[humble frigate]

cyber punk could be PCIe bottle neck

im having higher frames than ever before right now

[humble frigate]

do you know it says 75/110 fps?

its now perfect. but i dont have my frame dips when using LSFG

never mind i think its because i didnt lock my fps

[versed knoll]

Resolution?
Framerate?
HDR?

[humble frigate]

4k
60 to 120 since that my monitor
ues HDR

[versed knoll]

HDR makes it like 20% heavier

Try HDR off

[humble frigate]

i hear ya. but i want HDR on. i payed for it 😛

it did work to switch my GPU around i seems. but it gave a new issue

[elder smelt]

?

[versed knoll]

I mean we can't expect the RX 6400 to be a miracle card when we have it do 60/120, at 4k with HDR

[humble frigate]

nono this is my RX6600 now 🙂

[versed knoll]

That could fit in GPU cruelty

[humble frigate]

seems like my main GPU is now limited by the "worse" PCIe. still hits 60 FPS so i can boost it to 120 though

[elder smelt]

so it is pcie after all?

how does that make sense though tf

wait nvm

you went to the 6600

so it can do pcie 4 x8

your 3080ti though is x4

so does that mean your 3080ti is being utilised properly?

like 100% gpu usage instead of 70% or something

[clear sundial]

That's because PCI-E is hard limiting the base framerate, so if you only need "60" base fps, then you should switch slots, since the LSFG GPU needs more PCI-E bandwidth to generate a lot of frames

If you need like 120 base fps, then PCI-E x4 will hard limit your fps

[elder smelt]

hmm so my issue is a pcie bandwidth limit after all?

[clear sundial]

You should try switching the cards first

[elder smelt]

both are x8

bifuricated

[clear sundial]

Ahh i see, so PCI-E 3.0 x8 or PCI-E 4.0?

[elder smelt]

pcie 3 x8 on both

[clear sundial]

Could be it then

[elder smelt]

rip

at that point I'll get an am5 system

[clear sundial]

Do you have any other slots available?

[elder smelt]

pcie 2 x4 💀

[clear sundial]

Could be worth a try

Main gpu there, other on the main x16

[elder smelt]

I've tried it before its terrible

I'd never do it again

[clear sundial]

Rip

[elder smelt]

well since your already here

what cpu do you recommend?

for am5

[onyx warren]

9800X3D

[clear sundial]

Depends on the price

And your budget

[elder smelt]

I think I can get a system for around 1k aud

[clear sundial]

I would invest more into the motherboard than the cpu if dual gpu is your priority

[elder smelt]

yea I am planning to

x670e chipset

[clear sundial]

But i wouldn't go below 8c/16t

[elder smelt]

so a r7 7700/7700x?

I'm not gonna go back to 6 cores

[clear sundial]

9700x if the price difference is not too big

[elder smelt]

lemme c

[clear sundial]

7000 run too hot

[elder smelt]

same price huh

[clear sundial]

Yeah in that case its a no brainer. How much do the 3d chips cost?

[elder smelt]

too much 🥲

[clear sundial]

Also, what kind of base fpa are you looking for? (Max)

*fps

[wary wraith]

Anyone have qlan idea why this rtx a4000 will only pull 50 watts in this setup instead of 140? I tested it in another computer and it runs fine. I tried a w6600 in the same slot on this build and it runs 100 watts.

[elder smelt]

with lsfg? 100 is fine as long as its stable

[clear sundial]

Motherboard?

[clear sundial]

No, base fps without lsfg

[wary wraith]

https://rog.asus.com/us/motherboards/rog-strix/rog-strix-z790-a-gaming-wifi-model/

[clear sundial]

The "real fps"

[elder smelt]

not really sure, even with my current setup im not base fps limited

more like losing fps

[clear sundial]

Pci 3.0 x1, its crippled to oblivion

[wary wraith]

Thats the 2nd from the top

Bottom 2 are pcie4 x4, I tested in gpuz

[versed knoll]

Me, that just ordered a 5700x

https://tenor.com/view/awkward-black-kid-gif-4937950

[clear sundial]

You're correct, i've misread the specs

[elder smelt]

at least your setup works fine 🗿

[clear sundial]

But those 2 slots are chipset, so if you're running a lot of usb devices, and sata drivers = massive bottleneck

[elder smelt]

@versed knoll what mobo btw?

[wary wraith]

I did the same thing i initially

[versed knoll]

Asus B550 Plus ac hes

[clear sundial]

I'm asking because of how strong the cpu you're going to need. If you only need 60-80 base fps, then 9700x will be more than enough

[versed knoll]

I'm running it with RAM that isn't in the compatible RAM list

[wary wraith]

I thought the same but the w6600 runs perfect, its just the a4000 only runs at 50 watts max.

[versed knoll]

That's why you saw such wonky results from me

[clear sundial]

Even if you want to interpolate to 240hz

[versed knoll]

In the test

[elder smelt]

so many pcie slots jesus

[clear sundial]

Have you tried prefer max performance in nvidia control panel?

[elder smelt]

hmm well I guess so

[versed knoll]

If you ever ask Ravenger what I am, he'll say I'm greedy, and that's because I am 😛

[clear sundial]

You're also running PCI-E power only, when the w6600 uses a power connector

So it might not be giving enough juice

[clear sundial]

I wouldn't be surprised if those chipset slots aren't giving a lot of power

[wary wraith]

Rtx a4000 uses a 6 pin

It pulls max 140 watts

[humble frigate]

@clear sundial what would i need from a MB then to have bandwith enough for both gpu?

[elder smelt]

pcie 4 x8 on both cards maybe?

[clear sundial]

PCI-E 4.0 x8 both coming from the CPU. If you want to have futureproof, PCI-E 5.0 x8 coming from the cpu

[wary wraith]

I have another m.2 sitting around. I might try a new OS and see if that works.

[versed knoll]

Going from saying pcie 3.0 x4 was good enough to asking for 4.0 x8 was quite the development

[clear sundial]

My idea is to get a 5060 in the future for PCI 5.0 x8

Full bandwidth available

[clear sundial]

Have you tried "prefer maximum performance" in nvidia control panel?

Globally, pf course

[elder smelt]

not even sure if that is the clear bottleneck here

[wary wraith]

Trued that. Turned off all pci power saving in bios. Tried a new pcie cable and different slot to plug into psu

Installed workstation drivers but 4090 doesnt show up. Tested anyway and still 50 watts max

[humble frigate]

seems like my 3080ti is being used 100% but now my RX6600 isnt 100% anymore

[elder smelt]

hows the 3080ti performance then

worse?

[humble frigate]

requires further testing 😛

which im doing right now

[elder smelt]

sounds good

[humble frigate]

same honestly. 84 FPS in cyberpunk atm

before LSFG ofc

when i activate LSFG it gets a bit whacky since my fps isnt limited

[elder smelt]

same as in issues same or perfect same?

you used to get higher fps in cyberpunk right?

[humble frigate]

so, how would i read that in specs? 🙂 all isee is just CPIe slots and so on

[humble frigate]

no no 84 is perfect. thats what i got with the TI on the upper slot as well

[elder smelt]

oh nice

[humble frigate]

dude im so stoked. this is working as it should now!

[elder smelt]

damn wtf

nice

does it work on every game?

so rn the 6600 should be running at pcie 4 x8 while the 3080 ti is x4

[humble frigate]

tested POE2, FFXIV, cyber punk, red dead 2 and monster hunter wild beta. all same fps as before and my RX isnt capped anymore so i can go higher resolution and even more FPS if i wanna(i do in monster hunter :P)

[elder smelt]

damnnnnn

hmmmmmmm

would it also work on cpu lanes?

I'm thinking

my chipset pcie is terrible so I can't do it on that

glad you fixed it though this helps me tremendously as well

[humble frigate]

also latency feels better

[elder smelt]

nice man

seems like you got it all fixed now

this is kinda huge ngl

huge issue has been resolved

I'm thinking about it

could the top slot be more prioritised by my system?

if I swap the cards around it could also fix it if that's how it works

maybe thats why it looks like a cpu bottleneck

because the cpu is giving less care to the 6600xt due to a lower slot

it gets me thinking to how igpu systems work too

closer to cpu = more priority and less latency

[humble frigate]

aaah

[elder smelt]

uh oh

whats wrong

[humble frigate]

nono its an "i see" aaah 😛

[elder smelt]

oh lol

scared me so bad

[humble frigate]

im just reading and learning ^^

[elder smelt]

I mean I'm not expert but I'm thinking about it that's all so take it with a grain of salt 😄

but it should be in theory

[humble frigate]

because im very much interested in what a MB that would have equal PCIe slots for my GPU would run me, so im just takking it all in

[elder smelt]

if there is no performance loss with the 3080ti then you don't need anything more

pcie 4 x4 is quite decent

at most maybe 3% fps loss

even less

[humble frigate]

ah ok. maybe i should just celebrate 😛 im just one of the freaks whos chasing numbers 😄

[elder smelt]

you should because I am celebrating here 😆

if I swap gpus and it works for me to then we have solved the most annoying issue with dual gpus imo

but Its less likely for me because cpu lanes and all

[elder smelt]

I swapped cards

and the results are very nice

it actually helped quite alot

its not perfect mind you but this is close to it

I think I'm definitely pcie bottlenecked now

definitely getting am5 man

this is crazy

feels awesome even though its half baked

[elder smelt]

I'm wondering if theres anything else left to do to improve it

I'll try HAGS etc

[versed knoll]

Nothing a Windows reinstall can't solve ⚰️

[elder smelt]

[humble frigate]

Awesome! So glad to hear 😀

[elder smelt]

so your running pcie 4 x8 and x4, so just double my bandwidth

x670e chipset will do nicely

[clear sundial]

Gotcha fam https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1NQHkDEcgDPm34Mns3C93K6SJoBnua-x9O-y_6hv8sPs/edit?gid=2064683589#gid=2064683589

Choose the chipset then go to "expansion slots"

[elder smelt]

whats the difference between x670s and x870s 🤔

all I see is ram speeds

[clear sundial]

if it shows "5x16,5x8" or "4x16, 4x8" and "bifurcates to x8" then it's almost guaranteed to be CPU lanes only

[clear sundial]

one guaranteed USB 4 port. That's it

[elder smelt]

USB 4 🗿

[clear sundial]

not even kidding, it's completely pointless unless the motherboard has a feature you like

all differences

[onyx warren]

This spreadsheet on mobile is something different

[elder smelt]

ram speed supported is slightly higher on x870s

but thats so minor

[clear sundial]

weird, it opens fine for me on my phone 🤔

also, I think my 4070 ti super is "dying"... 2nd nvidia gpu with issues in the last month

The good news is: I can return it for a full refund.

The bad news is: I can't find anything for the same price, so I have to pay 400€ more to get something similar... F me

[onyx warren]

It does, but now try getting around without being hella confused

[clear sundial]

yeah it's a massive spreadsheet, I don't recommend it on mobile

[elder smelt]

latest driver?

[clear sundial]

it has literally all the info for all motherboards on am5

[clear sundial]

It doesn't post sometimes with GPU led. I have to remove it and reseat it again

[elder smelt]

wth

[clear sundial]

I've tried other GPUs on the same slot and they work fine

[elder smelt]

and its your 2nd nvidia gpu with issues this month

[clear sundial]

Refurbished GPU RNG 😦

[elder smelt]

oh damn

refurbs

better luck with 2nd hand gpus ngl

atleast those are tested to be working

[clear sundial]

Yeah I had a 4080 super (PNY Verto) with the fan controller being completely screwed, going from 20% to 100% fan speed and back to 20% every 2s

[onyx warren]

Why are the X670 Taichis so much more expensive than the X870s? lmao

[elder smelt]

so random

[clear sundial]

got a full refund for it and bought this one

[humble frigate]

i dont see that :S

[elder smelt]

join the dark side (red) 😈

[clear sundial]

choose chipset at the bottom of the page and then scroll to the right until you reach this

[clear sundial]

I was on the red side, but then I've tried the latest DLSS and... I can't go back 😅 I think that's why they're sold out everywhere

[elder smelt]

good thing I haven't seen it then

[humble frigate]

oh like that. thought you meant the sheet called chipset 😛

[clear sundial]

annnd it just froze, I've used the shortcut to restart driver and it full crashed my system. Great

I know it's the GPU because when it freezes and I press the button (not hold) to power down the PC, it does shutdown correctly

[elder smelt]

🪦

I've heard of so many issues with the latest nvidia drivers its crazy lol

but your issues are hardware

[clear sundial]

I'm running the previous driver of that one. Once I saw the issues, I didn't upgrade

[elder smelt]

this is worse than amd drivers 🥲

[humble frigate]

waow its quiet the price to upgrade for one of those MB. back to celebrate i guess.

anyone got a nice way of cooling two GPUs 😛 they get toasty

[versed knoll]

We are slowly approaching 2021 levels of GPU extinction

[clear sundial]

welp, I had to pay another 400€ premium for a 4080 (MSI Suprim X) vs my 4070 ti super. There's literally nothing else on the market here... 😓

I hope this one survives until then... otherwise, well vega integrated graphics it is

I think I had more hardware issues the last 6 months than my entire life. I think I'm over 10 devices dying on me, maybe close to 15 or 16

[elder smelt]

thats quite the achievement

[clear sundial]

I think I might need a priest 😅

[rain hull]

The 6400 normally draws very little power, especially when running LSFG

[rain hull]

What happens when you try 50% LSFG res scale?

[humble frigate]

https://tenor.com/view/todd-howard-it-just-works-bethesda-this-all-just-works-gif-20598651

@rain hull I've found that its a PCIe issue 🙂 swapped the cards around and now everything just works

[rain hull]

What motherboard?

[humble frigate]

TUF B650 plus

[rain hull]

interesting

Probably the game running on the card in the top slot

Actually nevermind

Not sure

[elder smelt]

His setup is pcie 4 x8 on lsfg card and pcie 4 x4 for render

[clear sundial]

So basically, you're also affected by the same performance instability with the framegen card on the PCI-E 4.0 x4 slot than me. So I wasn't hallucinating, good to know! 😅

[elder smelt]

It also helped me 😅

But I think im pcie bottlenecked now

Need to upgrade

[onyx warren]

Man the only mobos where the 2nd slot isn't 4.0x4 are either too expensive or the slot is so close to the bottom my card wouldn't fit

[elder smelt]

3440x1440 165hz with hdr might not be capable on gen 3 x8

[clear sundial]

PCI-E chipset lanes are too sketchy for this kind of workload, especially when you're running a lot of stuff like USB devices and sata drives

[elder smelt]

Riser?

[onyx warren]

Yeah, but they cost money as well

[elder smelt]

I know but it was well worth it for me imo

[clear sundial]

I feel ya completely. I had to change a lot of stuff on my system, it's basically a new computer 😅

[onyx warren]

That would be 400€ for a mobo with a PCIe 5.0 x8 slot and then another 100€ for a riser that works with that 💀

[elder smelt]

100 for a riser??

[onyx warren]

A PCIe 5.0 one for sure

[elder smelt]

Why pcie 5 though?

Pcie 4 risers work fine

[onyx warren]

Yeah, but idk

I'd need a new case anyways since there's no vertical space

[elder smelt]

Pcie 4 x16 cost me like 45 aud

[onyx warren]

Meaning I'd need to completely rebuild my pc anyways

[elder smelt]

Rip

[onyx warren]

No matter what. Unless there's a mobo with a slot that isn't so close to the bottom

[versed knoll]

Reading this made me feel smart

Because every time I replaced a pc part I chose one with extra headroom

"Time to replace this 400W PSU" -me

"Why?" -a friend

"I'm sure at some point it won't be enough and there's good prices right now" -I replied and bought my 750W PSU on november 2023

A year later, it proved to be a wise purchase

At around the same time I bought a huge PC case and I remember thinking "ain't no way room will ever be a problem again"

Voila, 8 months later all I needed was to buy my motherboard and get it working and everything else was already on spot

Even if back then I didn't know of Lossless Scaling

[cedar mango]

I just finished testing everything.

I simply cannot believe how WELL Windows 10 still performs.

I've tested LSFG with W11 24H2, 23H2, Windows 10 22H2 and Windows 10 LTSC 21H2.

Performance with 21H1 Windows 10 is absolutely MIND BOGGLING. Everything works like butter... freaking AMAZING. How could MS screw an OS soo much is beyond my belief.

WIth 1 card you may not see how bad it is but as soon as you add a second card, all those kernel updates and processes running in the background really screw the framepacing.

[versed knoll]

So that's why I'm not having a painful time with my dual-GPU's

(I use Windows 10)

[cedar mango]

I've took a long 15 minutes trace of framepacing with W10 LTSC 21H2 and it stayed at 60 FPS on Dying Light 2 for 15 minutes straight, not a single frame variation and LS seemed to render perfectly fine without a SINGLE STUTTER.

You don't dare touch WIndows 11. It SUCKS for LSFG.

Windows 10 LTSC 2021 seems to be the best OS in existence for LSFG on Dual GPUs.

[elder smelt]

even better than 24h2 ltsc?

[cedar mango]

Absolutely.

[elder smelt]

damn

[cedar mango]

Miles better. Games load faster, LSFG activates near instantly, I don't loose a single frame.. it's freaking crazy.

I've been using 24H2 since it released. But since my 4060 was misbehaving with FG I wanted to give it a full round and test all the OSes... It was a slap in the face....

[elder smelt]

it sucks that features I need are locked behind 24h2 and w11

w10 was amazing

[cedar mango]

And yes I've used 24h2 LTSC. It was I was using before the 4060 arrived.

10 Its still amazing and yes... it is sad and I also feel a lot of rage inside because of what MS did to 11.

There is absolutely no way around it. I've tried 23H2 and 24H2 as they are, with Atlas, with Revi and then later I've tried 24H2 LTSC as it is... then with tweaks... and when I've tested my system with LTSC 2021 I wanted to cry....

Because I have an OLED TV and I completely loose RTX HDR and AutoHDR... it's criminal that they left this out of W10. It really looks like done on purpose...

[elder smelt]

same with oled monitor

and wgc being fixed in 24h2 is huge for me

[cedar mango]

Not quite. W10 21H2 walks around WGC any day... latency wise it's the best OS for FG.

[tired quest]

what about W11 DirectStorage? Its supposed to help in gaming right?

[cedar mango]

Not just latency man... everything opens near instant...

[elder smelt]

wgc is incredible for hdr stuff so I can't lose out on it

[tired quest]

or does it even matter? lol

[cedar mango]

Yeah right... well get this... my SN850X runs at about 3.9-4.4 on most tests on W11 24h2

On LTSC 2021 it goes up to 6.1 Gb/s and stays there for the whole test... it's like the storage subsystem is unobstructed by anything... it's crazy.

I kind of got used to the "less than good" performance of 11 until I went back.

[cedar mango]

What do you mean?. I can run HDR without WCG just fine

[elder smelt]

WGC doesn't need hdr support which also means it also doesn't have performance penalties from it and I also run reshade hdr which requires wgc to function

also wgc has lower latency than dxgi so

[cedar mango]

I did tested WCG and DXGI and found DXGI to have the lowest latency on my dual GPU

Everytime I've tested WCG ended going back to DXGI.

[elder smelt]

maybe for your system its that way

still the hdr capabilities of wgc are insane

[cedar mango]

What GPUs do you have?

[elder smelt]

can't go without it

[elder smelt]

7900xt + 6600xt

[cedar mango]

Yes, HDR capabilities are non-existant on W10

[elder smelt]

thank you microsoft

[cedar mango]

Yep... it's either you get the best performance and no HDR or you get all the bells with slightly worse performance on 11.

[elder smelt]

responsiveness on w11 sucks so much

w10 was so good

[cedar mango]

It does.

[elder smelt]

instant response

[cedar mango]

From now and then try and install it back and see how much you've missed.

The UI responsiveness on 11 is a slap in the face

And the storage subsystem also seems to be impacted on 11.

[elder smelt]

I can just go on one of my laptops and see it firsthand

4 core laptop > my pc in terms of responsiveness

[cedar mango]

They really need to throw in the garbage everything they did for 11 and start from scratch for 12.

They need to redesign the UI... that layer on top of layer of UI is an atrocity... an abomination for responsiveness.

Can you use WCG on W11 23H2?. I know that 23H2 is still faster than 24H2.

It's not w10 but it's not as bad as 24h2 is right now.

[cedar mango]

Just tested it. Seems to work fine on 23H2, no issues. Do you enable Double Buffering when using WCG?

[elder smelt]

its not the same

[tired quest]

anyone tried this?

[elder smelt]

in 24h2 wgc got an update that "fixed it"

[elder smelt]

egpu?

[tired quest]

No its a docking station for pice 4.0

[elder smelt]

so its a egpu

[tired quest]

err yeah its egpu.. never mind

sorry

[elder smelt]

nah dw 😄

[cedar mango]

"fixed it?" - I just tried it. Almost identical than DXGI, 0 issues.

[elder smelt]

shouldn't be the case

[cedar mango]

23H2 22631.4890

[elder smelt]

pre 24h2 it can't do variable fps

[cedar mango]

Oh maybe it's one of the updates that received

[elder smelt]

it works sure but it isn't as good

[cedar mango]

I can see my G-Sync working just fine

[elder smelt]

I don't know if anyone here has tried it yet

I think I saw people are reddit using it

[cedar mango]

Maybe they did issued the update on 23H2 as well because I'm on build 4890 and last package was issued Feb 10.

[elder smelt]

gsync should work fine its just that variable fps isn't handled well on it

[elder smelt]

maybe tbh

they backport a lot of updates sometimes

[cedar mango]

Well I just test it. It works even better than in 24H2 due to 23H2 being a little better, latency wise.

I have about 55-200us in 24H2... can't lower it with anything...

On 23H2 I have on average 30us

Windows 10 - 9us (I want to cry)

[elder smelt]

rip

old is gold

[cedar mango]

The best I could get by unparking all cores, fixing the max clock to 5.3Ghz on my 13900K and removing advanced power saving.

But on Windows 10 I can lower down to 9us !!!. I keep hearing people saying this tool is useless but listen if you can achieve 9us you will literally feel the snapiness.

On 24H2 for some reason this never goes below 55us, no matter what!!

And they screwed the Task Manager so much I want to kill myself with a candle... can someone please tell me WHY did they made the Task Manager on 24H2 even slower than on 23H2 ????. Is there some magical feature hidden in there that makes it slower?

[elder smelt]

its the "future"

[cedar mango]

LOL

The future is slower.. with higher latency and burning GPUs... ! 🤣

[elder smelt]

this forum post has become like a general chat but for dual gpu people

I like it

[cedar mango]

Me too !

Now that we are into it. I think I've found why some games that do not support HDR uses up to 60% of the second GPU even before enabling LSFG.

It seems AutoHDR really screws something up on some games and forces the 2nd GPU to re-render the screen twice, ending up using up to 60% of GPU usage. When forcing AutoHDR to be off and then forcing NVIDIA RTX HDR the problem goes away.

It also appears to completely break NVIDIA Reflex and the framelimiter when it's enabled.

[elder smelt]

I don't use autohdr so I never saw it happen

[clear sundial]

Update: Yup it's 100% GPU dying

[versed knoll]

What even were the odds?

https://tenor.com/view/skull-skull-emoji-sus-smile-gif-25113334

[cedar mango]

I have my RTX3090 Ti on a custom waterblock.. never a single issue. Having the card properly cooled way below operating temperature is godsend.

[versed knoll]

What was the difference between Windows 10 22H2 and Windows 10 LTSC 21H2? @cedar mango

[clear sundial]

LTSC is a debloated Windows install from factory that's used in machines that prioritise stability over features. It's the most stable version of windows and has full update support until 2031

[versed knoll]

Damn, you just needed the first 5 words to convince me

[mental peak]

Its really weird I don't seem to be pcie bottlenecked with my motherboard and it still happens to me

[mental peak]

It also happens only when I turn on loseless, if I don't turn it on, the natives frames don't drop

[warm niche]

I have two pcie 3.0 x16 . when i using two gpu with pcie 3.0 the main gpu will be change to x8 and the power and raw FPS both drop . CPU AMD 5600x 1gpu 3070ti 2gpu rtx 1080 duel pci e 3.0 x8 many thanks

[mental peak]

If I can't find a fix I'll just send the 2nd GPU back and stay on the sigular GPU setup

[versed knoll]

What's your CPU?

Sounds like a potential CPU bottleneck

[mental peak]

5950X

[elder smelt]

What resolution you trying to run? I have the same pcie 3 x8 setup and I think I'm being bottlencked by it

[clear sundial]

Holy moly, I thought it didn't fit... 😅

[elder smelt]

💀

it can't even breath

[rain hull]

Bro is waterboarding GPUs

[clear sundial]

I can't hear the fans wtf, I'm running timespy blind with hwinfo64 in the background 😬

[elder smelt]

please check those temps 😭

poor gpus

[elder smelt]

can't believe it can do that

meanwhile my 7900xt dies on a vertical mount

[clear sundial]

I'm as much astonished as you are bro... what in the heck

the GPU below will be fine, I think it might even be better because of the top GPU "sucking" the heat. I'm gonna rerun it with 80% PWR limit or 70%

[elder smelt]

so your doing the top slot lsfg card thing too now

someone needs to update the guide fr

[rain hull]

Been a bit busy, I'll try to do it when I get home in a few hours

For now, let's make a list

[elder smelt]

much appreciated, it helps the community as a whole

[elder smelt]

all the issues we fixed here so far?

flexi fixed with w11 reinstall
dranas fixed with a cpu upgrade from 7800x3d to 9950x
mulle fixed with top slot being lsfg card instead of render

[clear sundial]

I was already doing it before, both slots are equal. I can't use the bottom card on the top, otherwise the top one doesn't fit

the bottom card is the "dying GPU"

I'm waiting for my 4080 to arrive

[elder smelt]

oh so it was helping you from the start

4080 lets go

hopefully it won't die this time

[clear sundial]

it's gonna be another suprim... looking at these temps considering it's being choked to death, it's incredible

I didn't even hear the fans

[elder smelt]

1000%

my reference card dies with anything lol

[rain hull]

Problems:

• FPS reduced on LSFG activation, might be caused by secondary GPU not being powerful enough, or solved by resetting Nvidia Control Panel settings

• FPS reduced by outputting video from second GPU, solved by swapping GPUs around, DDU, and reinstalling Windows

-Games crashing on startup, solved by DDU

[elder smelt]

I still have the first one

I assume pcie bottleneck at this point

its not as bad as before though

[rain hull]

LSFG doesn't copy through PCIe, so thats not the issue

Low Latency mode in NVCP caused it for me

It's probably software

[elder smelt]

hmm I don't have antilag on

is there another dual amd gpu user here?

[rain hull]

Try changing a ton of driver settings

[elder smelt]

I can try but there isn't a whole lot that could be related

[rain hull]

Even GPU/Display scaling

[elder smelt]

alright

[rain hull]

What are some more problems?

[elder smelt]

my stutters were worse from what I could tell when I had my lsfg card in 2nd slot so you could add it to the 2nd fix

it just didn't feel good in latency and smoothness

that fixed it from what I could tell

[rain hull]

Is perf identical without LSFG?

As in, to outputting video from render GPU

[elder smelt]

looks like it or close enough

its a whole lot better

[rain hull]

In my case it's identical (4.0 x4 render GPU, 3.0 x8 second GPU)

[elder smelt]

not really sure it could be motherboards being different quality wise

trace layouts etc

[rain hull]

"Better" isn't enough, it needs to be completely solved

[clear sundial]

80% power limit

[elder smelt]

hmm

[vivid zealot]

They are great - 4080 is beast of a card if you get at a good price. I Just sold mine tonight for near what I paid, as I got a 5080 at msrp.

[rain hull]

+5% boys

[clear sundial]

Unfortunately I didn't get it for a good price, since they're extremely hard to get here. My 4070 ti super is at its death door, so i have to return it

[elder smelt]

damn nice deal

[rain hull]

Maybe you bought it from toxicelf

[clear sundial]

70% PWR limit another 4% loss. Gonna keep it at 80%

[clear sundial]

There's literally a single a4 paper thickness between both cards, I still can't wrap my head around these temps and how good they are. Jesus

[elder smelt]

are the case fans 12000rpm or something

[clear sundial]

following CPU curve

Fractal design tempest ftw. I can even remove my CPU cooler (noctua nh-d15s) without taking out the motherboard, a godsend

[elder smelt]

I pretty much messed with all of the settings that I was shown in the amd control panel and they did nothing

[elder smelt]

can't even find a pic of it online

or maybe wrong name I'm seeing

my case is legendary too

[rain hull]

Damn

[elder smelt]

could be some hidden thing or may not even exist at all 🤷‍♂️

[rain hull]

Now I wanna know if there's anyone else running dual AMD too

[elder smelt]

I haven't heard of any here

mainly mixed setups

[rain hull]

So far there's been more issues with same-brand setups than mixed setups

Contrary to popular belief lol

[elder smelt]

😭

[clear sundial]

Sorry, my bad "Fractal design torrent" not tempest, I'm dumb 😅

[elder smelt]

I hate anything rgb so I got a black box

[onyx warren]

Plasticboarding

[onyx warren]

"fixed"
Single GPU still better in a lot of cases

[versed knoll]

Go to Windows 10

Become free

ooooooooooo

[elder smelt]

ok I tested it with display as 6600xt and 7900xt

theres a 10fps difference in the same scene

in a cpu bottleneck

[mental peak]

I'm assuming it's a cpu bottleneck for me too right?

The 5950x can't handle two GPUs I guess

[elder smelt]

maybe

you having the same issue as me?

mulle managed to get it working perfectly for him and the only thing he did was change slots

doubled the bandwidth for the 6600

while lowering the render

and that makes sense

render doesn't need much pcie but the display card does

not sure if thats also the case for us

[mental peak]

Both cards run on x8

[elder smelt]

same but pcie 3

[mental peak]

I was also running the graphics card in the x8 slot before I got my ls GPU, but when I turn on ls, the native frames go wonky

[elder smelt]

so it doesn't happen before lsfg?

have you tried putting your main card in the pcie 4 x4 slot and lsfg gpu on the top slot?

its what people usually run and it works for them

I wonder if that would do anything

[mental peak]

Neither card can fit in the very bottom slot

[elder smelt]

rip

well pcie 4 x8 is really good bandwidth

should be more than enough

you disabled the low latency setting in the nvidia control panel?

ravenger was talking about it

[rain hull]

Resetting NVCP fixed that for me

[mental peak]

I did that already, it was happening before and after that

[mental peak]

Yes, on or off it still stutters

Someone else mentioned a cpu bottleneck since it only happens when I turn ls on, and Helldivers 2 is pretty CPU intensive

[rain hull]

Definitely a possibility

I see a small perf hit and worsened frametimes when running dual GPUs in a CPU bottlnecked emulator

[elder smelt]

not a normal cpu bottleneck though

5950x is quite loaded

[mental peak]

Yeah that's the problem, aside from cpu I'm not sure what's causing it

[mental peak]

I tried the trick where you set affinity for HD2 to not use the same cores as ls but it doesn't work either

[elder smelt]

😔

fck it ill just do single card for the time being until I upgrade or something

[mental peak]

I thought about sending mine back too

[tired quest]

I'll try to run Dual AMD with 7900xtx and 6600xt but I'm still waiting for the delivery. I noticed some of guys in here have issues running with it. If mine doesn't work well. I can replace my 6600xt with 2070S
PC spec is MSI x670e Tomahawk with 9800x3d, I will start trying Windows 10 LTSC

[elder smelt]

Thanks man

Would be great

In the meantime I'll save up my money and wait for your testing

We nearly have the same specs so it should be close

In terms of gpus

[versed knoll]

Replacing the 6600 xt with a 2070 super wouldn't be considered an upgrade in my book

[tired quest]

That is true lol.

[versed knoll]

I hope going to Windows 10 LTSC fixes it for you

[tired quest]

I also have 3080 but I don't know if it will fit in with big ole XTX

[elder smelt]

If you could, try comparing win10 vs w11 24h2

[tired quest]

will do

[elder smelt]

Perfect thanks

If it works for you on your setup, then something is clearly up with only me and a few others

That would motivate me to upgrade to am5 😆

[versed knoll]

Well, I don't have these issues and I'm running cheap AM4

[elder smelt]

The world is a mysterious place

Both cards on cpu pcie slots?

[versed knoll]

Second one is chipset

[tired quest]

with a pcie 4.0 adaptor?

[elder smelt]

Pcie 4?

[versed knoll]

asus b550 plus ac hes, second slot is pcie 3.0 x4

[elder smelt]

I feel like every person that has dual gpus working fine are using the chipset slot

Where are the cpu slot guys at 😭

[versed knoll]

Are there people that use chipset slot on windows 11 that's working fine?

[elder smelt]

Ravenger?

You never tried w11 with your setup?

[versed knoll]

I haven't

I would rather take a stab to the gut than install Windows 11

[tired quest]

lol

[elder smelt]

I can understand that 🫂

[versed knoll]

I was tempted when I saw that Windows 11 boosted ryzen performance but remembered how garbage Microsoft made it and stopped being tempted

[tired quest]

I noticed some guys in here using w10 have no issues running dual with it

[elder smelt]

You won't try it even once 🥺

[versed knoll]

if I get a sacrificial SSD someday I might

[elder smelt]

I have too many small ssds doing absolutely nothing

[versed knoll]

give me one

I'll buy it from you for 5 doller

💸

[elder smelt]

$50 shipping 😭

[tired quest]

Dang, your mobo have so many slots lol

5 pcie slots

[elder smelt]

Thats what i said lol

[tired quest]

I think it was designed for SLI

awesome mobo

[versed knoll]

I bought it used and it costed me 100 bucks, could have been better but it's been working quite well so far, I wanted to try to resurrect a dead graphics card I have lying around

So I ensured I always had spare slots

[elder smelt]

Quite the beast for being 2nd hand

[versed knoll]

My only grievance with it was that the dumbass owner didn't update its bios so I had to ask a friend to update it with his ryzen 5 3600 because none of my ryzens (the 5 2600 and 5 5500) worked on it

[elder smelt]

Damn you got lucky that you had a friend with that

Otherwise it would be a brick

Paid off though seeing how you can do all this stuff with it

[versed knoll]

Yeah either I would have needed to buy a 3000 series processor or return it and leave an angry review on the seller's page on aliexpress

[versed knoll]

(that hd 6450 is still dead, I'll try harder)

[eager dawn]

I did try this with a 2080ti as the render and a 1080ti as the display/lossless. Worked really great except I had to put the cards in a way so that there was almost no space between them and so the temperature rose extremely quick :/

[elder smelt]

Riser could help with that

Or the 2080ti being the lower card

So it gets cooler

[versed knoll]

Undervolt them

[eager dawn]

They're already undervolted and unfortunately I could not get the 2080ti to perform when it was in the lower slot. For now I'm back to one card but I'll see if I can find a solution in the future.

[tired quest]

I know it sounds dumb, have you thought about repasting the thermal paste for your GPU?

[snow sparrow]

I'm experiencing a weird issue with my dual GPU setup in Monster Hunter Wilds. My system has an Intel 10850K (which stays barely under load) paired with an ASUS ROG Strix Z490-E Gaming motherboard, with both GPUs running in PCIe 3.0 at 8x mode. I'm playing at 1440p. My main renderer is an RX 6950 XT, and when it's the only GPU installed, I get around 90–160 FPS with good utilization. However, once I add my GTX 1080 Ti (which isn’t used for rendering), the FPS drops to about 40–46, and the 6950 XT’s utilization falls to only 35–60%.

My PSU is 1000W, BIOS settings are correct, and I've verified both GPUs are running at 8x. Since the CPU isn’t heavily loaded unless I run at single card and things work as should be. It seems like the mere presence of the 1080 Ti is somehow interfering with performance in Monster Hunter Wilds.

For comparison, I tested Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth and Fire Strike benchmarks, with both GPUs installed, performance remains unchanged in those titles, even benefiting from lossless scaling frame generation.

Has anyone else encountered this issue with MH:Wilds? Could it be driver-related or something specific to how the game handles dual GPU setups? Any troubleshooting tips or workarounds would be much appreciated!

[elder smelt]

that issue is something that a few of us have been experiencing

you're case sounds a bit different

I think it may be a nvidia driver issue here

can you try resetting the nvidia control panel settings to default?

and make sure to have low latency mode disabled in the control panel

[snow sparrow]

I did a complete DDU, and also messed with some settings to see if it would make any difference, nothing have seemed to make a difference in that game in particular with the nvidia control panel settings

[elder smelt]

strange

does it occur in any other games?

usually with this issue, it happens to other games too but not all

[snow sparrow]

Not that I noticed, I noticed some degradation when not having it set to "Prefer maximum performance" because that would mean my card would run on maximized clocks but thats only after trying to run the LSFG to generate frames, without it, it made no difference in fire strike benchmark and FF7 Rebirth.

Those ran just fine having both my GPUs plugged in, in MH:Wilds my main issue is that even when I'm not trying to scale, just having that 2nd card severely reduces my 6950XT Utilization to 35-60% and the game only runs up to 46fps (Most I've seen)

[elder smelt]

same here

exact same issue actually

when I did 3dmark everything was fine

yet in games my fps nukes itself

something interesting here too is that we both run pcie 3 x8

[snow sparrow]

I think 3d mark knows how to "Turn off" the 2nd gpu from being used very well as a driver level thing, but most games don't do that because they never had to?

[elder smelt]

not sure

this bug has me on a stranglehold where I'm back on single gpu for the time being

recently there was another person who fixed this issue

what they did was put the lsfg card in the top pcie slot and render gpu at the lower one

it fixed it for them but they were using the chipset pcie slot at pcie 4 x4

[snow sparrow]

Same... I removed my 1080Ti just because of this, its a shame that there is no way to turn it off without having to plug it away in a non invasive and quick way when there's a driver conflict.

[elder smelt]

I'm trying to find clues as to way this issue even happens

mulle is the most useful subject

[snow sparrow]

The one thing I did notice, maybe u can help me check if its a case by case or related

[elder smelt]

he fixed it by doing that

[snow sparrow]

I noticed that my 11th thread of my CPU is being mega utilized in MH:Wilds but only with having that 2nd gpu in.

without 2nd gpu, its fairly balanced on my cpu/threads

[elder smelt]

now that is interesting 🤔

[snow sparrow]

When I used process lasso to disable monster hunter from using 11th thread

it just jumped to the next one, completely utilizing it

[elder smelt]

thats really useful data

I never noticed a thing like that for me

maybe it was happening for me too

[snow sparrow]

It may be that having 2nd gpu within that game creates a conflict that utilizes specific cores/threads and that is why there's degradation and the GPU is not being utilized correctly

[elder smelt]

what motherboard do you have btw?

[snow sparrow]

because as much as my cpu only shows 20% utilization, it is capped on what MH:Wilds is trying to get cpu power from

[snow sparrow]

ASUS ROG Strix Z490-E Gaming

[elder smelt]

in that case it could just be mh wilds related ngl

can you try other games?

[snow sparrow]

Most likely is, I didn't see this issue with Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth

[elder smelt]

more cpu bottlenecked ones

I noticed fps drops in 7 days to die and that game is cpu and ram heavy

[snow sparrow]

I also force checked it in some old game, ran at 1000 fps just to check

because I wanted to see if there's any degradation on cpu or something weird going on

[elder smelt]

it seems like your motherboard has a chipset pcie 3 x4 slot

could you try that?

Im thinking that cpu pcie slots overload the cpu maybe

[snow sparrow]

I have 16x (8x if 2 gpu), 8x , and 4x

[elder smelt]

most successful cases of dual gpus have all been chipset + cpu pcie

[elder smelt]

yea try the x4 slot

[snow sparrow]

I did as well

[elder smelt]

damn nothing?

[snow sparrow]

Actually one sec, let me share the other post

[elder smelt]

which gpu did you put there?

[snow sparrow]

#1339773957070651522

We tried to go through some of the issues

[snow sparrow]

my 1080Ti was sitting there, so there wouldn't be any bottlenecks ofcourse.

or if there would be, it would be minor

[elder smelt]

the mulle guy did the opposite and it fixed it for him

[snow sparrow]

Best performance was 8x, and another 8x

[elder smelt]

but he didn't have 2 cpu pcie slots to begin with

[snow sparrow]

I had frame time issues, that was solved by putting 2nd gpu on preferred maximum performance (even when LSFG is not turned on)

[elder smelt]

I can attest to this working

but for amd

[snow sparrow]

Either way, the best results I got was using 8x and 8x, my 6950XT was actually on 2nd slot because of headroom for fans...it is bigger than the 1080ti, but it doesn't matter, they run on same speeds 8x on PCIe 3.0, which shouldn't be a bottleneck for both really

[elder smelt]

same here but I also got that issue

[snow sparrow]

Got same FPS using that dual gpu setup as a single gpu in both firestrike and my framerate in FF7 Rebirth

[elder smelt]

any other games you can try?

I think poe2? was running badly for someone too

[snow sparrow]

I was losing my mind over this, because I really wanted it for MH:Wilds cuz the game's running like shit haha and the frame gen built in is pretty bad

I actually tried PoE2 and it worked as usual for me

Didn't enter a map or anything intensive, but just running it to see if it does anything bad

[elder smelt]

#1328337747399938138 message similar case but fixed it

[snow sparrow]

Most of my tests were FF7 Rebirth and MH:Wilds

[elder smelt]

I'm really not sure why this specific issue happens

only a small number of people get it too

any cpu intensive games you could try?

[snow sparrow]

I'm unaware of how many people get it, Are they also using AMD Main and NVIDIA 2nd gpu?

[elder smelt]

im amd+amd and I have it

mulle was nvidia + amd

[snow sparrow]

I wonder if people with nvidia+ nvidia have it

Need to really tick down possibilities

[elder smelt]

I'd expect so

[snow sparrow]

Maybe its AMD driver level issue with having 2 gpus in

[elder smelt]

if it was, it wouldn't have been fixed by mulle

he is the only lead we have tbh

[mental peak]

I have two nvidia GPUs, maybe it can be a driver issue too?

[elder smelt]

oh yea pyro you have the issue too yea?

[mental peak]

Also I'll definitely check core usage again when running helldivers 2, my CPU is around 35-50% in that game. Other games are difficult to measure.

[snow sparrow]

Try to check for each thread if possible, avg cpu usage is not good enough! ^^

[elder smelt]

so different gpu setups and we all have it

we can rule that out probably

[mental peak]

For my case its only even ls is turned on that I experience issues.
Also for double nvidia GPUs, the control panel allows to set some supportsd games to utilize cuda cores of both gpus at the same time for more processing power. I ruled that one out by disabling the ls GPU from being used

[snow sparrow]

So this is a different issue, it seems more of a LSFG issue rather than just having a 2nd gpu issue

[mental peak]

Or a CPU bottleneck which is weird for me with the 5950x

[elder smelt]

no the same happens to me, I experience both

lower fps without lsfg and even lower with lsfg

[snow sparrow]

That sounds like bandwidth limitation of PCIe though

[elder smelt]

115fps in 7 days to die turns into 90fps and turns to 80fps with lsfg

[elder smelt]

pcie 3 x8 🤷‍♂️

[mental peak]

I ran same exact config I did with so the single GPU setup and I got issues. I then lowered both graphics, resolution and ls settings like res scale and it was still happening. Helldivers is extremely noticeable in that context

[snow sparrow]

Can you both try to check your CPU core/threads to see if there's any at 100%?

while trying to run those games or limitations u have?

[mental peak]

There's a couple cores that have high usage but I did the config where I remove helldivers 2 from using certain cores and put ls on those cores only to separate core usage and it still happens

I've also never ran into any CPU usage issues, it also never goes above 60°C

[snow sparrow]

You said u have this issue without using LSFG no?

[mental peak]

No that's the funny part, running the game without ls is fine. I get my 46 fps, no stutters or drops. As soon as I turn on lsfg it starts droping native frames despite neither the CPU, GPU 1 or 2 being at max usage. Graphics GPU is usually at 70-80%, ls GPU is at 40-50%, CPU is around 30-50% but helldivers is very CPU intensive

And from the cache and bandwidth readings, I theoretically should have no problems

I'm on Windows 11 tho, don't know if that's been discussed too much

[snow sparrow]

What renderer are u using in LSFG

[mental peak]

LS1

[snow sparrow]

And what capture API?

I'm on win11 too

[mental peak]

Dxgi always, never had an issue with it. Unfortunately wgc has the same issue

[snow sparrow]

Okay, what happens if u put scale factor at 2x, frame latency at 10 and resolution scale at 25%

do u still have that issue?

[mental peak]

Tried frame latency at 5, res scale at 25 and scale factor at 2.3, incrementally lowering each one and it was still happening

[elder smelt]

when you lower res scale, does it improve the issue in anyway?

[mental peak]

Nope

100 or 25 its the same

[snow sparrow]

what are ur stats then? can u check?

[mental peak]

Maybe if I could go to 1 resolution scale...

[snow sparrow]

CPU/Threads usage, gpu usages

Watt gpus are using

[mental peak]

4070 for graphics, 4060 for ls

[snow sparrow]

I mean watt as for psu usage

hahaha

[mental peak]

1300W

That's the psu

4070 is around 130W
4070 around 80W

[snow sparrow]

Are either drawing the right amount? are they power limited? thats an important factor to check too

[mental peak]

CPU at 110

[mental peak]

No matter if they are undervolted or not it still happens

[snow sparrow]

Can u check the cpu/thread usages and GPU usages under the settings I told u to put in LSFG?

[mental peak]

Tested with and without

[mental peak]

I'll try tomorrow

[snow sparrow]

And also try in "Preferred gpu" to test on both, see if there's any difference

[mental peak]

Although even separating the cores between programs didn't help

[snow sparrow]

Just to check if u're still not utilizing 99%

[mental peak]

Yeah I usually never have any component at 100%

[snow sparrow]

@mental peak @elder smelt I'd appreciate if you can ping me once u get more info or even done some more testing, its haunting me haha

[mental peak]

Hauting me too

Cache stats just in case for reference

Motherboard is asus x570 pro creator wifi

[elder smelt]

no problem but I doubt I'd be doing any dual gpu tests for the time being

I've opened my pc so many times recently that I got pretty tired of doing it

unless theres a huge breakthrough I'll keep it single gpu for the time being

[snow sparrow]

Ahh, a shame, I really wanted to know if its the threads having utilization issue and capping themselves, which is hiding cpu bottlenecks as being an issue because ur cpu may seem as if its only 30%, but the thread being used by the game/program is at 100%, which could result in this degradation of performance

[elder smelt]

I find it really odd that its happening like that

its so random

1 thread being maxed out for no reason

I never saw that happen for my case

[snow sparrow]

Threads and cpu are fine in single gpu, I triple checked

Only when second one is in, its doing this weird thing.

and when I limited which cores MH:Wilds can use, it transferred to another thread and maxed it out for no reason.

[elder smelt]

yea I remember checking with process lasso when using dual gpus

all threads seemed equal

[snow sparrow]

Meaning it could be a driver level issue, either by AMD, NVIDIA, or MH:Wilds
could be also a conflict, which is why I wanted to see if having 2 different drives or gpus could be the issue, but u have 2 amd cards, kinda hard to pinpoint, but something funny is going on there.

[elder smelt]

definitely could be

krimson is planning to use 2 amd cards soon and test them

both on w10 and w11

he has an am5 system and a 9800x3d

the ultimate test

[snow sparrow]

What cpu do u have?

[elder smelt]

5700x3d

[snow sparrow]

So its not just having high core count issue mhmm

[snow sparrow]

I hope we can get more details about this, do let me know and ping me if there's any debate about this subject, its interesting ^^

[elder smelt]

will do

or try to remember to do 😅

I can be forgetful at times

[mental peak]

One day I will have a 9950x3d and I will test test and test

[onyx warren]

Same with the 9800X3D for me

[broken solar]

Hello guys, I wanted to chime in for a bit. I was also facing the same problem as many of you, where my LS GPU would be overutilized while being idle and activating LS would cause significant Base FPS drops. Using 4070 Ti Super and 4060.
I had everything set up correctly: Cable plugged into LS GPU, Render GPU set in Windows and Nvidia Control Panel, LS GPU set in LS. Tried Windows 10 with altered Registry, Windows 11.
Basically nothing did the trick - UNTIL I switched my GPUs PCIE Ports. With the 4060 now running in PCIE 5 @ x16 and the 4070 Ti Super running in PCIE 3 @ x4 it works as intended.. mostly. The Render GPU is now consistently being utilized, BUT at much lower performance. Going from 120 FPS capped in Fortnite at ~70% GPU Utilization, to really unstable ~90 FPS at 100% Utilization. Compared to that the 4070 alone could do 120 FPS x 2 and sit around 96% Utilization. The 4060 is now only at around 15% Utilization and only gets utilized more when I enable LS.
I am not sure if the 4070 is completely seated in the slot, since the design of my 4000D case prevents it from going in until the latch clicks. But it gets recognized and works without crashing, so I doubt this is it.
Is my extreme hit to performance only due to the reduced PCIE bandwidth? The 4070 draws only 15% TDP while in PCIE 3x4, as reported by HWINFO, at 100% Utilization.
Why does the setup not work with the cards in their "proper" slots in the first place?
Also some games just completely refuse to run on a card other than the one that the monitor is plugged into. The new Kingdom Come Deliverance 2 is one of them. Just crashes on startup. Elden Ring completely spazzes out on me in terms of FPS and Input delay.
So for now it seems that I'll have to stay single.. story of my life lol.
Any thoughts?

[tired quest]

Just wanted to let you know that you're not alone.

[mental peak]

What's your cpu

[ivory moon]

does the gpu that generates frames have to be the one that is connected to monitor ?

nwm, found the guide.

[snow sparrow]

Can you try to run them in 8x mode? or u only have 16x and 4x?

[snow sparrow]

Few things I want to know, is how's the headroom for the fans on the 4070Ti.

Second of all, what are u nvidia control panel settings looking like

[broken solar]

13700K

[broken solar]

I went into my BIOS and set it to x8/x8, but it made no difference. Although the only options available were "auto" and "x8/x8" to begin with

[broken solar]

Not sure what you are asking about the fans. Temps are looking good if thats your concern.
The control panel is basically default, except OpenGL rendering GPU is set to the 4070 Ti Super.
I'm not at my PC right now, but I made sure that something along the lines of "reduce latency" and another setting I saw mentioned somewhere are off

[snow sparrow]

screenshot would be great ^^

[broken solar]

Nvidia Control Panel + my Specs

I will be happy to give all of you any info you need if it helps narrowing the problem down

[ivory moon]

how saturated is the PCIE xx bandwidth when using LSFG at 4k120HDR(planning 165hz in future.. LG G5) in dual gpu mode, but outputting trough rendering GPU ? 😄

I have spare 1050ti in office and wanted to know if it can handle 4k resolution with low res scaling value applied 35-40%.

I wanted to see for myself how finicky the dual gpu setup is and then buy something like 6650xt as dedicated frame gen GPU

[onyx warren]

4K120 works fine with 4.0 x4 but I can't tell you the saturation since AMD GPUs can't show it on Afterburner

[elder smelt]

that sounds kinda similar to mulle and his fix but something else is also the issue here

[ivory moon]

Ty. When I get my riser cable, i will post some info regarding:

1. 4090 rtx, render gpu, output, pcie 4x16
2. 1050ti gtx, frame gen gpu, pcie 3x16
   (I cannot output trough 1050, as it does not have hdmi 2.1)

[elder smelt]

If you can't output with the 1050ti its pointless

Won't function otherwise

[ivory moon]

Well.. 6650xt has one hdmi 2.1 port.... guess I HAVE to buy that then.

[snow sparrow]

power management should be on maximum performance, the rest is up to u, could make the difference.

[rain hull]

Worse performance from just plugging the 1080ti in? Or from outputting video from it?

[rain hull]

I had the same issues myself and resetting NVCP fixed it

[snow sparrow]

Just having it in

[broken solar]

Your Render GPU was fully utilized and outputting much lower FPS than normal (while in the lower bandwidth PCIE slot) and resetting NVCP fixed it?

[snow sparrow]

Just by having it in and playing MH:Wilds

[broken solar]

if so, I will try it again tomorrow

[mental peak]

@snow sparrow sry for poor photo quality, first half of graph is in game (helldivers 2) with the settings you recommended with ls: 25 res scale, ls1 performance, factor x2, and 10 frame latency. Tried with and without seperating core/thread affinity for both programs and I still have stutters/frame drops. Sometimes native fps, sometimes ls fps drop on their own.

Graphics GPU (4070) hovers around 60-70%
Ls GPU (4060) is about 20%

[mental peak]

Intersting enough, when checking under GPU in the task manager, it says the 4070 is using the "video encode", and the 4060is using "3D".
Shouldn't it be the other way around, doss it matter at all? I can confirm the 4060 never gets used unless I turn on ls and the 4070 is the graphics GPU in both windows by default and the games themselves.

[elder smelt]

🤨

maybe the 4070 has to send the frames to the 4060

counts as video encode?

[mental peak]

https://tenor.com/view/jerma-jerma-evil-jerma-sus-jerma-silly-jerma985-gif-10405359493425114915

[elder smelt]

4060 using 3d makes sense because lsfg

[mental peak]

Interesting I didn't know it's be categorized as 3d and not video encoding

[elder smelt]

im just making a guess tbh

your top card is render?

sidenote, am5 motherboards are complete ass ngl

each and everyone one of them are skimping out on something

[clear sundial]

modern economy in a nutshell 😅

I'm still annoyed by that asus board though. RMA came through and sent me another unit which I'm trying to resell at a big loss fml

[elder smelt]

asus board?

[clear sundial]

I had an asus x670e f before using dual GPUs, then I had a lot of issues with LSFG (horrible performance) which was because it was cooking my CPU because of a bad temperature sensor

[elder smelt]

oh that one

jesus

[clear sundial]

I RMAed it and bought an MSI x670e carbon which has been amazing so far. That RMA process took almost an month

[elder smelt]

a month fkning sucks

[clear sundial]

And the price difference...? 50€. This board is sooo much better overall

Now I'm having difficulty selling it for 100€ less than I paid for

[elder smelt]

holy crap that board is really good

[clear sundial]

And it's brand new

[elder smelt]

$600 here 💀

doesnt even exist nvm

[clear sundial]

I paid 450€ for it (which is a lot I know... But most boards are garbage, like you said)

[elder smelt]

rip

yea these boards are complete ass

[clear sundial]

and that asus board cost me 400€. It feels like a 200€ board (at most)

[elder smelt]

MSI Pro X870 P is the only decent board I've found

there was MSI X670E GAMING PLUS too

but it was 6 pcb layers and not enough info

otherwise its a really good value board

[clear sundial]

you're locked at PCI-E 5.0 x16 + 4.0 x4 (chipset)

same as the asus board

[elder smelt]

yep...

what setup you're running now?

pcie 4 x8 on both cards?

[clear sundial]

yes

[elder smelt]

hmm

I can try finding one like that

but probably for $300 more lol

[clear sundial]

ProArt B650-CREATOR how about this one?

[elder smelt]

hmm

doesn't seem to be in stock anywhere

damn

thats loaded

[clear sundial]

gigabyte B850 AI TOP?

I'm basically looking into that spreadsheet and giving you options for dual x8 slots

[elder smelt]

can't seem to find it

[mental peak]

Top card is 4060 for ls. If I put the 4070 in the top slot the cards will have 5mm of clearance. Right now they have 2~3 cm

[elder smelt]

sounds fine

[clear sundial]

Asus ProArt X670E-CREATOR WIFI

[mental peak]

That's basically mine

[elder smelt]

pretty goood

you can't use the pcie 4 x4 slot can you?

[mental peak]

No way, 4000D has no room. The 4070 is already super close the psu

[elder smelt]

good temps btw

no idea how

[clear sundial]

Just slap a ciment block sized cooler and it's fine 😉

[elder smelt]

the solution to all problems

[clear sundial]

as long as the GPU doesn't have an height above 61mm, like mine https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/msi-rtx-3070-suprim.b8570 it will fit in most motherboards

anything above, you need to use the bottom slot for the bigger gpu

[elder smelt]

its funny that the 6600xt is bigger than my 7900xt...

doesn't mean that the 7900xt doesn't weigh like 10x more 😄

super compact and heavy

[clear sundial]

yup, my 7900 xtx hellhound weighted more than that brick I'm using at the bottom, while using a lot less space 😄

and it ran cooler too!

[elder smelt]

I can't say that my card runs cooler but it doesn't make much noise

[clear sundial]

Anything below 80C I'm good as long as it doesn't make a lot of noise

[rain hull]

My second GPU (B570) is also way bigger than my render GPU (4060ti)

[elder smelt]

80c hotspot?

[clear sundial]

nah, die only. Hotspot I would accept anything below 90ºC. I know it's fine up to 105ºC hotspot, but I don't like taking chances

I might even accept 95ºC. 100 or above nope

[elder smelt]

same but even 90c I can't do

my die runs 60s while hotspot is around 80

[clear sundial]

PTM7950 is your friend

or Thermalright Helios (same stuff)

[elder smelt]

I did that within the first 6months I got the card 😄

so thats with ptm

[clear sundial]

dayum, so basically the same that happened to this brick (that was throttling to hell when I got it). Maybe bad cooler pressure?

[elder smelt]

hmm not sure

it was always like that

ptm just made temps far better though

[clear sundial]

my hellhound had a 13-15ºC delta, which I'm almost 100% positive had PTM7950 pre applied from factory

[elder smelt]

ptm from factory?

insane if true