💣┇weapons-gadgets

[real veldt]

like 4 seconds

[tender python]

Yea wtf, I'm sorry this seems like such a busted gadget

[slender bear]

The obvious next step from healing canisters is a universal healing grenade. Medium already steals everyone else's thing, and it would encourage people cough cough lights cough cough to play with their team more.

[tender python]

Free 2v3 for almost 4 seconds is crazy

[crystal garnet]

My hot take - Demat is overpowered, no punishment for using it. Glitch nades / barrels dont close the walls for some reason. No counters aside from another demat.

What is needs - audio queue when deployed that you can hear from a floor above or through a wall, and / or give a 1-2 second delay when closing walls. Opening instantly is fine, but there should be a punishment involved when using it as a rapid fire open / close tool.

[tender python]

The issue is that they could be used selfishly and make flanking much more powerful maybe even allowing people to play less as a team with the additional self sustain

[slender bear]

2 stack lights and you get an easy 3v1. You could even 3 stack and immediately take out someone after for 3 3v1s in a row.

[solar aurora]

in yalls opinion whats the best XP sight?

[slender bear]

Yeah they would have to put serious thought into making it work. I honestly just want to see healing available for someone other than medium.

[tender python]

Yea but to get the full 3 3v1s you would need 3 lights

And a lot of coordination, when you could just run 1 light and get the 2 3v2 which should already be a big enough advantage

[tender python]

There is an audio queue, and the punishment for spamming it is running out of charges. I do think that them closing when hit by a glitch grenade is an interesting idea though.

Also is there not already a short cooldown to being able to close a wall or am I crazy?

[tardy dove]

I like compac

[crystal garnet]

There is no audio queue, or at least any audible one for when the gadget is being held or someone is looking at a wall. Sure it makes the noise when it opens up, but it does nothing in terms of being able to react in time if you get dropped for example.

For closing a wall, it is basically instant

[slender bear]

The gadget is in no way overpowered, I just figured that would be an interesting way to use it, and with a 3 stack it wouldn't be that hard to coordinate. It would be really funny forcing someone to watch as their teammates are picked off one by one. It would even work in 5v5 team fights.

Oh never mind it wouldn't work in 5v5

[tender python]

why should swapping to it or highlighting a wall give an audio queue, no other weapon has an audio queue for pulling it out and if highlighting something made a sound it would be so annoying with constant sound spamming when deciding where to demat, and if it didn't then You could just pull out demat early when approaching and not give a sound queue

[crystal garnet]

Because there is currently no counterplay to demats. Honestly demat mediums are getting to be more annoying than dash lights. They can drop you without warning, open insane flanks with headglitches, and there's nothing you can do but eat shit. Only thing that can counter it is another demat user to close the walls.

[tender python]

If you play around it it's easier to deal with, like using goo for wall demats and already dropping the cash out down a floor so they can't demat the ceiling, there are a bunch of small things like this you can do and just because you don't know how to counter something well doesn't mean it needs to be nerfed

Also there is the fact that there are a lot of cash outs where you just are completely unable to use demat because it's outside

[final lotus]

@sand monolith thoughts on the stun gun rework?

[unkempt moss]

Googun counters demat ez

[oblique crypt]

Googun best specialization

[small mist]

So can you target teammates with the nullifier ? If so that can be hella good to help get them out of bad situations

[tender python]

No only enemies

[small mist]

Well that sucks thought it would make my hard carrying of my freinds a bit easier XD

[tender python]

Real and valid

[sweet grotto]

Nerf the CB's fire rate.
Nerf Cerberus damage.
Nerf CL back to where it was.
Nerf defib:

• Either limit it's pick rate per team to prevent 3x Medium defibs or lower the defib health regain for Medium as a deterent.
  Buff Riot Shield or change it's mechanics.
  Buff dual blades, or change their mechanics.
  Bring back KS and other animation cancels for specializations.
  Add a grenade indicator.
  Put glitch mines on Light or Heavy and nerf them. Maybe have their do a burst of glitch, not a consistent one.

Overall, I believe this game is suffering from Medium's current style. It is designed to be able to do basically everything combat-wise, which is ridiculous. You want to snipe? Medium can do it. You want to melee? Medium can do it. You want to use a shotgun at close quarters? Medium can do it.
I understand that Medium is meant to be a Jack of all trades kind of deal, but it should be capable at most, but a master at nothing in specific. Instead, it's a must-have for sweats who want to optimize everything, and they get the best of both worlds because of how Medium currently it.

Medium can perform support duties:

• Healing
• Defib
• Mines
• Turrets

Medium can perform movement duties:

• Zipline
• Jump Pad
• Demat

Medium can perform combat effectively and indepedently with it's variety of weapons.

• You can have 1 person for long range.
• 1 for close.
• 1 for mid.

Medium is the problem in this game because it has essentially nill drawbacks, BESIDES area destruction... which can now just be substituted with expo canisters and grenades. Change how Medium works, stop freaking out about Light and Heavy being too strong, they both have very noticable weaknesses, while Medium really doesn't (other than destruction). It's infuriating seeing the 3x Medium meta, and it's even more unfun to play against. You made 3 classes for a reason, make them all a viable choice, preferably being LMH instead of a 3x of ANY CLASS.

Also, criticism is welcome.

[unkempt moss]

Can you reload and spool the mini while nullified?

[tender python]

They did nerf the Cerberus

[warm yarrow]

The nullifier looks cool , epic, and a amazing change on paper.
Anyone with experience wanna chip in some knowledge with it?

[tender python]

It gives free 2v3s for enough time to kill someone, so it's kinda like who shoots first wins.

[warm yarrow]

Fair if team play , but it sounds like a must pick like defib or dome barrier is what I’m picking up.
As long as it doesn’t solo assassinate or get out of hand , it seems like a cool change.

[serene glade]

I have heard you cannot

[unkempt moss]

That would be awesome. Come out of the hatred dimension on some lights.

[sand monolith]

Really good but will probably need a range nerf

Design wise it’s one of the coolest stuns I’ve seen

Ana sleep dart but awesome

[serene glade]

They need to just swap dual blades and sword. Makes perfect sense too. Lights get better survivability with melee and medium gets a gap close with the lunge

[eager wasp]

there is not thing as a best sight, its just what ever you prefer

[unkempt moss]

I was called an idiot for saying this.

[serene glade]

Yeah probably, only because sword isn't used for sword, it's just to weaponize dash

[unkempt moss]

They said that the damage was too low on the dual blades for light to use and too high for the medium. I wasn’t aware that the damage numbers on these weapons was permanent, but it was also a dumb fuck greener that said it.

[serene glade]

Yeah game devs aren't allowed to adjust damage values or anything

[unkempt moss]

Right. So keep your stupid ass suggestions to yourself, yellow

[serene glade]

Just a stupid yeller

[slender bear]

I love how much the nullifier encourages team play. If a coordinated team of light's wanted to, they could nullify two people at once in a team fight to make it a 3v1, which basically guarantees a kill. Their third light would then nullify someone again the second they get free, allowing the lights to 3v1 the other guy, then they just 3v1 the last one after they are vulnerable. It would be hilarious.

[tranquil rose]

Or encourages throwing as well

[slender bear]

That's always an option...

[tranquil rose]

On paper it really is a great debilitate tool, the problem is, should it exist in a game like the finals?

[unkempt moss]

The most fun I have is when my stack goes in to purposely throw.

[tranquil rose]

Just to piss the enemy off

[unkempt moss]

Yeah. We spent half a season trying the worst possible loadouts trying to get to bronze. Didnt ever make it, we were hard stuck silver.

[tranquil rose]

Happy moments

[slender bear]

I'd say getting forced out of play for 5 whole seconds doesn't sound very fun, but it's not inherently unbalanced and does seem kind of like the debilitating gadget we might have needed.

[tranquil rose]

It could work if wasn't a point n click hitscan gadget, if it was like a mine, a trap, or even a throwable with very high sound it would much more reactive

[unkempt moss]

A trap would have been interesting.

[frozen urchin]

Heya folks, what are your favorite sights ?

[unkempt moss]

Put it on heavy, thx

[frozen urchin]

Asking because I am unsure as to what I should run

[tranquil rose]

the most basic one

[unkempt moss]

Adder is the best in any weapon imo

[frozen urchin]

Username checks out

[unkempt moss]

Idiot yellows will say holo

[frozen urchin]

How come ?

[serene glade]

Holo

[tranquil rose]

You could go iron sight for the adrenaline rush

[unkempt moss]

Get out of here. NOW.

[frozen urchin]

Hmmm

[unkempt moss]

Clearest sight picture while still maintaining a decent reticle, not a bunch of plastic blocking the peripherals.

[serene glade]

Holo makes you hit more bullets

[frozen urchin]

A good aim will do that to you too.

[unkempt moss]

We don’t have that.

[frozen urchin]

That is fair.

[unkempt moss]

Adder feels like a red dot but I like the fov more

Hard to explain i guess

Looking glass feels better on longer range weapons to me.

[hardy dust]

Red dot is my preferred sight

[blazing flume]

Anyone discussed the fact some practice range dummies have set names? The rest all say Target Dummy, last one even has my name, I might be late to finding this idk

[slender bear]

How are people already complaining about light getting an unnecessary "buff" from nullifier? I love the new gadget but I honestly hope they give use back our free kill button just to mess with people who think this is worse.

[tight saffron]

how do u like fixed stan?

[unkempt moss]

This discord is for complaining only. If people are having a good time they wouldn’t waste it here, they’d be playing the game.

[reef sage]

Spoken like a true king

[indigo nexus]

You would notice that after embark does something the community ask for, the feedback channels just about immediately start becoming dominated by people talking about how nobody asked for the change and how it wasn’t needed instead.

[marble glacier]

Add the kel tec PLR16 as an Pike 556 skin 🙏🙏

[oblique crypt]

Yeah I'm loving the new Nullifier, it's really interesting.

[marble glacier]

The PLR16 as an Pike skin would be a great addition because all other pike skins kinda suck

[vital vector]

nullifier should stop healing

[marble glacier]

Exactly and they should add an PLR16 as an pike skin

[spare drift]

Fr

[haughty rune]

Musket with Bayonet, the first gun + melee hybrid in the game.

Basically it would work as high damage , medium-ranged, one bullet rifle and with long reload. To make it viable, the quick melee would be substituted by a bayonet thrust, dealing considerable more damage

I believe it could work best with Medium than other classes.

Dont need to get very historical with the reload time and accuracy: Focus on making it fun

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8_JKOryQ70

[marble glacier]

PLR16 as an Pike 556 Skin

The PLR16 is just a really small and compact version for the SU16 (PIKE556) and that would be a great skin because there are no good pike skins

[blazing flume]

oh oops wrong channel mb

[spare drift]

Pleas i need a Pike buff and some New Pike skins the current ones suck

[marble glacier]

Exactly that’s what I’m saying. PLR16 as an pike skin

[spare drift]

Can we pleas get a mp for Medium

[marble glacier]

Yes after the Pike buff and the PLR16 skin

[spare drift]

Can we pleas get a crossbow for heavy

[marble glacier]

Keep dreaming buddy

[spark oar]

Guys

what do i buy

[hybrid lynx]

money

[spark oar]

? im new

[marble glacier]

BP for cow charm thingy that does the moooow

[hybrid lynx]

premium battle pass

[hybrid lynx]

free moolah, free cosmetics, and enough multibucks for next seasons battlepass

[spark oar]

lol cool ok what best weapon i unlock on Mid? i have good aim

[marble glacier]

Fcar

[hybrid lynx]

On medium?
Rn the most meta weapon is Cerberus, but depending on what you want something like fcar could work well as it has a high dpm

But I’m legally obliged to attempt to convert you to riot shield.

[marble glacier]

Nah you should convert to pike

[unkempt moss]

Nah. You should be playing GooGun as your primary

[marble glacier]

Indeed

[spark oar]

what about light

[marble glacier]

XP or ARN

[serene glade]

No

[lone swan]

ur cool

[serene glade]

"ur"

[valid garnet]

somthing i learned while grinding for the motion sensor for the minigun

minigun felt like for me that it highly complements gadgets that help cover/give info/or give alt paths even stuff heavys hardly use

so uhh i tried smoke gernades i felt diabolical using them

[slender bear]

Im playing light and getting hunted down by a medium. WHY ARE THEY FASTER THAN ME?

[valid garnet]

are they using melee?

if they get close enough the swings have some lunge to them

[slender bear]

Worse, he's on cerb. I'm the one on sword and I can't get close without getting instakilled.

[valid garnet]

OOF yeah cerb feels like an anti light weapon

[slender bear]

Idk how he's literally moving through the map faster than me, are jump pads in the meta?

[serene glade]

jump pads are legit always meta

[valid garnet]

usualy i never see a medium without the jump pad

its really good and has multiple uses (more than jumping but also put on a wall as a trap)

[slender bear]

Feels like I'm picking the wrong "movement class"

[serene glade]

feel like it depends on the spec. grapple hook is just way better at escaping/closing distance than dash obviously

[robust crow]

I don't think the Minigun should get any nerfs I don't think it's necessary :/. Although I don't fully understand what they mean with "juggling the spin-up state". I think that's probably bunny hopping which by the way doesn't even matter because if you are in the air the spread of the bullets are so inaccurate... even if you are holding still if the enemy is far away enough you ain hitting shyt. Please consider instead giving the minigun more affective range if crouched, like a tighter choke/spread radius.

[valid garnet]

the minigun takes some time to spin down so you have a window where you can instantly fire after a quick movement action

im still an amature with the gun tho. all i know is what TF2 tought me

but this isnt TF2 this is the FINALS

[robust crow]

yeah that's true, but it isn't nerf worthy imo. If you get pushed by literally anything else the wind up will literally get you killed... so the movement is more of a survival tool than a broken mechanic

[valid garnet]

true. i can get a kill sometimes 2 but i gotta use my gadgets more to survive just long enough to make it

thats why im going for the motion sensor

but somehow the baracade minigun and smoke combo is working well

as cursed as that sounds but sense minigun can easialy chip off a part of the baracade and my enemies cant see i have one up it sometimes tricks them into seeing an easy target

plus you only need 1 bullet to tag soemone to lock on to a someone you cant see due to smoke

it just.... works?

goo gun was funny with it but i feel like i get more bang for my buck using mesh shield. if im caught with my pants down i at least can stall for the team

it is a defender weapon after all

but because its a defender its got that really bad feeling weakness called losing

you gotta march over there with an unspun weapon and thats gonna suck

alright im done talking about it

[robust crow]

I feel everything you just said

XD

[low plover]

the time to type at the end of the game has been cut down a bunch to the point where I cant even type gg as soon as the game ends sometimes..couldnt say sorry to my team in that amount of time..made me feel bad.

[runic whale]

Just got back into game, what happened to the model😭

[royal pier]

People who play at a high level who rally against weapons like the minigun and sledge generally hate the idea that someone with worse aim than them can succeed at the same level as them using the other tools the game provides.

The Spear feels a lot better to use now, too, so we're going to start seeing complaints about that as well I bet.

[low plover]

quick cash spawns are kinda the worst ive ever seen. i dont wanna play for an hour in ranked and wt.

[crystal garnet]

Thanks Embark for buffing Light again and giving them 40m valid range on a SMG. Please nerf heavy more

[low plover]

its an AR btw..but the XP 54 is still annoying. Cant get over that they nerfed some guns ranges but not the XP.. Feels like some sort of joke by the devs..or maybe its their crutch too

[slender bear]

I've been loving the "new" nullifier gadget. It doesn't feel terrible to play against (for me at least) and it seems like exactly what light needed to escape from weapons like cerb.

[unkempt moss]

The real bug that needs fixing is you bugging this guy just because he’s posting in wepsNgadg when there’s a dedicated bug fix channel

[unkempt moss]

It started when they nerfed the sword. They were complaining the spear was demolishing hundreds of sword players at a time like some sort of Dynasty Warriors reenactment in the finals.

[slender bear]

It is kind of an unwinnable matchup. Now that I play with my team more I see the merit in just making it someone else's problem. Before I hated spear's design because it could drop on plat on its own and just spin to delete any and all melee players, but now that nullifier exist as a get away option I feel like spear is OK.

[unkempt moss]

The spear sucks, brother. It may be better now with whatever they fixed, but it was embarrassingly bad before. Im assuming you were running dash with sword, so what was stopping you from escaping before?

If we enter a point where the narrative shifts to spear being anything but C tier we’ve lost the plot.

[royal pier]

You can lunge in-between spin hits. The attacks hit at set points in the animation.

[slender bear]

There's no way to realistically memorize an attack pattern like that and maneuver around it. The lunge doesn't even travel the full distance of the sweeping diameter, so the way the sword stops for a quarter second would still cause you to get hit.

The time between swings is also not long enough to lunge through anyways, so I don't know where you got that from.

[slender bear]

I know spear is really bad in the overall balance of the game. I'm just highlighting that it does have a strength in it's matchups against smaller melee users.

Still leagues worse than sledge or maybe even the medium ones though. I'm glad that light players have an out other than evasive dash, but spear is probably going to need a whole alt rework at this point.

They finally got the alt working hitbox wise, but now it doesn't play the animation sometimes, which is really funny when you think they're just walking backwards and you jump directly into the invisible blender.

[royal pier]

The people who have lunged through my spins disagree.

Not saying its been many, but it has happened.

[slender bear]

That's just lag. People have backstabbed me from the front with daggers, but that doesn't mean the weapon is supposed to do that.

And spear could be WALKED through until recently without taking damage. The hitboxes were bugged.

[slender bear]

Just tested out model 87 and it might have gotten the best buff in this whole patch ( aside from moolah of course). The firewater feels like it's nearly doubled. It might even be as good as cerb right now, it just is a bit more consistent with a little less damage.

It kills light a little slower, but with qm it kills mediums and heavies faster than the cerb. It also has twice as much ammo, so it looks like it might even be the new best weapon in the game.

It doesn't say anything about a fire rate buff like that though? Was it always this fast?

[slow linden]

What'd they do to it

[hardy dust]

Spear is generally really bad but does really well against light/medium melee

[hardy dust]

It did get a buff to fire rate

But from 75 to 77rpm

Very very small

I doubt it's anywhere near cerb, but its an underrated pick imo

And you can still qm between shots with gadget swaps

[sweet grotto]

Nerf the CB's fire rate.
Nerf Cerberus damage.
Nerf CL back to where it was.
Nerf defib:

• Either limit it's pick rate per team to prevent 3x Medium defibs or lower the defib health regain for Medium as a deterent.
  Buff Riot Shield or change it's mechanics.
  Buff dual blades, or change their mechanics.
  Bring back KS and other animation cancels for specializations.
  Add a grenade indicator.
  Put glitch mines on Light or Heavy and nerf them. Maybe have their do a burst of glitch, not a consistent one.

Overall, I believe this game is suffering from Medium's current style. It is designed to be able to do basically everything combat-wise, which is ridiculous. You want to snipe? Medium can do it. You want to melee? Medium can do it. You want to use a shotgun at close quarters? Medium can do it.
I understand that Medium is meant to be a Jack of all trades kind of deal, but it should be capable at most, but a master at nothing in specific. Instead, it's a must-have for sweats who want to optimize everything, and they get the best of both worlds because of how Medium currently it.

Medium can perform support duties:

• Healing
• Defib
• Mines
• Turrets

Medium can perform movement duties:

• Zipline
• Jump Pad
• Demat

Medium can perform combat effectively and indepedently with it's variety of weapons.

• You can have 1 person for long range.
• 1 for close.
• 1 for mid.

Medium is the problem in this game because it has essentially nill drawbacks, BESIDES area destruction... which can now just be substituted with expo canisters and grenades. Change how Medium works, stop freaking out about Light and Heavy being too strong, they both have very noticable weaknesses, while Medium really doesn't (other than destruction). It's infuriating seeing the 3x Medium meta, and it's even more unfun to play against. You made 3 classes for a reason, make them all a viable choice, preferably being LMH instead of a 3x of ANY CLASS.

Also, criticism is welcome.

[unkempt moss]

And we’re wanting to change that?

[hardy dust]

To make it better against stuff other than melee

Buff spear 🙏

[unkempt moss]

I know finals players are against realism, but really spear should be crushing other melee weapons. That’s kind of its thing in the real world, no?

[bronze parrot]

my 1887 is finally back guys?

[serene glade]

spear is honestly fine, it just super meta dependent. more heavies just = more stinky

[unkempt moss]

I told you to leave

[serene glade]

i should whine like sword users to get spewar buffs tbh

[unkempt moss]

No, embark is being based and telling sword users to eat shit.

They might even buff googun at this rate

[hardy dust]

If embark was being based they wouldn't have nerfed sword over people whining about it

[unkempt moss]

No that is based. You have it backwards.

[hardy dust]

Im not so sure about that

[unkempt moss]

Im sure

[hardy dust]

https://tenor.com/view/exousia-limbus-don-quixote-don-limbus-company-gif-1814752005598413659

[unkempt moss]

Not false.gif

Sarge do you play light?

[hardy dust]

Yeah

I play all classes

[unkempt moss]

So do most people but what’s your main class

[hardy dust]

Rn probably medium

[unkempt moss]

Ew

[hardy dust]

I played a LOT of heavy and light in s1-s4 so recently I've been playing a lot more med

[unkempt moss]

Never mind. I was going to pick your brain

[slender bear]

If embark nerfing weapons over whiney players is based, would it doubley based to buff it back because we whine?

[unkempt moss]

No it would be embarrassing

[hardy dust]

By that logic i guess.

[slender bear]

Because it's not what you want this time?

[hardy dust]

It would just be based to not nerf stuff over whining

[unkempt moss]

I never get what I want from embark, bud.

[slender bear]

None of us do ):

[hardy dust]

Its whay embark does best

[unkempt moss]

I actually don’t know what the balance team is thinking with almost every patch

But they hit sometimes.

[slender bear]

I've been playing more sword in the new game mode and it's not so bad. Damage on the lunge might be abysmal, but hit and run tactics annoy opponents more anyways, and now they're the only way to make things work.

[unkempt moss]

I’ll be real, my squad has been messing with the sword. It may just because we come from playing heavy so being able to run people down is new, but it’s feels fine.

[slender bear]

I thought they were out of their minds giving sword whatever that nerf was just before adding back the single best sword counter in the game, but nullifier has turned out to be a net gain for sword because you can shut enemies down until you're in range.

[unkempt moss]

Googun will crush the nullifier as it does with all things.

[serene glade]

it really does

[placid slate]

Btw the fix didn't actually fix anything, the spin still doesn't work near goo or debris

Had my ass tweaking when I went to test it and it still wasn't fixed

[raw cave]

you got one part of that wrong - med cant melee (cl40 explosion)

[unkempt moss]

How long does it take revive?

[raw cave]

7 to steal

[tranquil rose]

nvm

And it's five seconds to revive a player

[unkempt moss]

Thanks for the help guys

[serene glade]

no problem bud

[unkempt moss]

Can we get a nerf to M60, Lewis, Flame Thrower, KS, SA, SHAK, .50s, Mini, Spear, Sledge, and MGL please. It’s not that hard to balance this game, you just need to fix this handful and it’ll be in a good spot.

[silver pollen]

how we feelin about nullifier

[serene glade]

Boring

[faint silo]

I always thought it was 7 seconds
learnt the hard way

[placid pond]

its outdated. Its 7 sec since update 3.6 when they introduced more cash for kills

[spice vigil]

hilarious

[hoary scaffold]

The nulllifier is just so bad

The stun gun wasn't even that overpowered

[eager wasp]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1337155473710911539/1367369081849905152/watermark.gif

[faint silo]

really

[shrewd nova]

Hello folks, I am new here. What do you guys are talking about?

[marble glacier]

We talk about adding the PLR16 as an pike 556 skin

[modest panther]

i think the nullifier gets increasingly stronger the higher up you are in ranked at least. singling out the best player on someones team, or anyone for that matter, then having a 3v2 is so powerful in a coordinated team

the crazier part about the nullifier imo is shooting an entire mag, and if someone jumps you you can nullify and reload your entire clip before theyre back

[lean pumice]

Dawg I think this is a bot

[marble glacier]

New pistol skin?

[tame aspen]

PLZ FIX BACKSTAB HITBOX SO FUCKING INCONSISTENT I DONT CARE IF YOU MAKE IT SMALLER JUST MAKE IT CONSISTENT

[marble glacier]

Okay Stalin

[ornate scaffold]

Also had a light DB opponent who nullified me today to get close and smoke me (since I was playing a slower class). So are many uses for that gadget

[tight saffron]

Healing
Defib
Mines
Turrets

[oblique pine]

Glad to see the tazer back...😭😔

[civic forum]

Nullifier is buffing the enemy. The fact they can shield godmode on objective is ridiculous. Should be able to shoot right past them or through them to make it even viable.

[raw cave]

how to use the turret? I cant make it usefull

[brittle yoke]

use a weapon that makes ppl 1hp like revo

[unkempt moss]

Take opposite angles from it, force them to choose a target. Have it cover glitched trophies for the alarm. Cover behind you. Stuff like that

[amber ermine]

day 3 of asking for amethyst skins for players who played all seasons and stayed loyal to the game through dark times as well، players who don't have time for emerald and can't reach diamond deserve something as well, pls embark I want a skin that is textured like the emerald ones, I put more than 120 dollars into the game and I've been playing everyday😫 , but don't have time and friends to reach emerald

[modest panther]

i agree that amethyst skins should be a thing, i just don’t think your idea is too good, not trying to be rude, but amethyst is the highest level of badge (outside of ranked/wt) you can get, with the kills revives, money, wins. amethyst should not be given to people who don’t have a lot of time to play the game, making the “hardest to achieve” badge color a participation award detracts from its value.

[amber ermine]

it doesn't have to be amethyst, I just want a skin that is textured like the emerald ones that I don't have time to get

it can be whatever color

thank u for understanding btw

[modest panther]

sure, i think it’s a cool idea. i personally dislike the emerald color so i refuse to equip my emerald skins, the diamond and ruby color ways are super nice though, i agree it would be nice to have other colorways though

[amber ermine]

if embark let u gift emerald skins , are u down to selling one of urs? ide pay a high price for one

[modest panther]

that won’t ever happen since it’s not part of the store, but honestly my account wouldn’t feel so different without them lol

[amber ermine]

I'm in thirst watching another man drown 😩

the thing is that I had all the time in se 1 and 2 so if emerald started from se 1 or 2 ide def have had one

[unkempt moss]

Just keep winning and you’ll get to diamond/ruby. It’s only like 6 wins per rank to get to the next.

[amber ermine]

easy to say when ur not a solo player and dont que with people who dont even bother to open mic not to mention that im in EU and its usaully filled with bad players more than NA

even tho ur enemies are also not that goood but no matter how good u are if ur teammates dont cooperate then ur doomed

[unkempt moss]

Damn. Sounds like the world is out to get you tbh

[amber ermine]

and my irl friends dont even wanna play the finals, even tho they love quick movement fps games

they better count their days

[smoky jackal]

@civic mauve the only skill players like shotta recognize is tracking. their brains cant handle any more skill than that

[civic mauve]

enslaved to the "full-auto" playstyle

[smoky jackal]

cod brain is truly a curse

[lilac fiber]

That’s almost every heavy weapon do you perchance play light?

[serene glade]

It's crazy how that could be looked at as a serious post considering how much light mains complain huh

[sweet grotto]

Nerf the CB's fire rate.
Nerf Cerberus damage.
Nerf CL back to where it was.
Nerf defib:

• Either limit it's pick rate per team to prevent 3x Medium defibs or lower the defib health regain for Medium as a deterent.
  Buff Riot Shield or change it's mechanics.
  Buff dual blades, or change their mechanics.
  Bring back KS and other animation cancels for specializations.
  Add a grenade indicator.
  Put glitch mines on Light or Heavy and nerf them. Maybe have their do a burst of glitch, not a consistent one.

Overall, I believe this game is suffering from Medium's current style. It is designed to be able to do basically everything combat-wise, which is ridiculous. You want to snipe? Medium can do it. You want to melee? Medium can do it. You want to use a shotgun at close quarters? Medium can do it.
I understand that Medium is meant to be a Jack of all trades kind of deal, but it should be capable at most, but a master at nothing in specific. Instead, it's a must-have for sweats who want to optimize everything, and they get the best of both worlds because of how Medium currently it.

Medium can perform support duties:

• Healing
• Defib
• Mines
• Turrets

Medium can perform movement duties:

• Zipline
• Jump Pad
• Demat

Medium can perform combat effectively and indepedently with it's variety of weapons.

• You can have 1 person for long range.
• 1 for close.
• 1 for mid.

Medium is the problem in this game because it has essentially nill drawbacks, BESIDES area destruction... which can now just be substituted with expo canisters and grenades. Change how Medium works, stop freaking out about Light and Heavy being too strong, they both have very noticable weaknesses, while Medium really doesn't (other than destruction). It's infuriating seeing the 3x Medium meta, and it's even more unfun to play against. You made 3 classes for a reason, make them all a viable choice, preferably being LMH instead of a 3x of ANY CLASS.

Also, criticism is welcome.

[icy sparrow]

@dapper marten why u so quiet,go conjure something

[errant jungle]

Place it where people don't expect it and where they'll be in crossfire between the turret and your team

In power shift I place it on a rooftop at an angle aimed at the platform's rourte ( a bit ahead) and wait in an ambush position so they can get fired at from 2 directions from me and my turret

Turret is like a support weapon
Don't leave it alone
Use it as extra dps
As if you had 2 primary weapons

Gas grenades help it alot to cause panic

[gaunt lion]

Guys i think bro got griefed by a medium team 🥀🥀🥀

[tender python]

Cerberus's damage was nerfed

[gaunt lion]

Combo glitch trap with turret

[unkempt moss]

I just want lights and mediums to have even less of an excuse as heavy rolls them all season long. We get out utility balanced around mediums ability to support, our weapons tuned around lights feefees and 150hp.

[tender python]

Only weapon that needs to be nerfed to fix heavy is spear tbh

[gaunt lion]

Heavy is the weak class

Sledge and spear are the only weapons that deal actual damage

[tender python]

Real, spear is broken

[unkempt moss]

Spear is broken? How?

[sharp reef]

Literally the only time I died to spear is because my dumb ass cluttered up with all of my teammates on a cashout and got right clicked by the spear. Like spear is so underwhelming as a heavy melee, simply because it does not have the same utility as the sledge does.

[unkempt moss]

I never thought we’d get to the point where we’re calling for spear nerfs.

[serene glade]

spear cant even 2 shot a light

[unkempt moss]

But I see it more and more.

[sharp reef]

Really? I thought it was 90 Damage

[serene glade]

the first 2 hits of the spears left click does 145 damage

[sharp reef]

Oh bruh

[serene glade]

its a prime example of the game being balanced around 150 HP

[unkempt moss]

“Our weapons tuned around lights feefees and 150hp”

[serene glade]

the spear is then forced to suffer fighting heavies because they dont want it doing more damage to lights?

[sharp reef]

by the time a spear user is halving a heavy's health, the enemy heavy already right click + left click + qm'd the spear heavy

[unkempt moss]

KS gets drowned by light tears. SA. RPG. Sledge. Soon Mini.

[serene glade]

then any time a heavy weapon is somewhat decent it gets toned down because its too hard to deal with when a medium is umbilical cord maxing and defibbing them to keep them up 100% of the time

[raw cave]

riot shield needs a secondary attack rework for it to secure kills on lights or medium, because often they just run away like nothing ever happend. The secondary attack as it is, is just useless, it just moves this "carriable wall" in front of you. Add something obvious like shield bash from overwatch to prevent an attack, maybe slow down affected player and deal 5 damage like winch claw or lockbolt. This weapon is heavily dependant on your loadout, not only on your spec, like other melee weapons, but gadgets, i cant imagine catching a light without a goonade if he runs away, and if they are using throwing knives and dash you cant do shit, they constantly firing at you and dashing on cooldown, so you cant switch to your gadgets

[errant jungle]

The spin kills quite fast tho

[unkempt moss]

True. I hate when the spinning spear runs me down at half their heavy fat walk speed. Witerawy inescapable

[opal pulsar]

Sledge is the best weapon

[errant jungle]

When it's going towards you it really does feel faster than it is

I prefer guns for my heavy

Goo grenade or barrier?
Do you guys use goo grenade?
What is it good for?

[gaunt lion]

*for heavy

[winter jay]

Goo grenade does everything besides damage

[gaunt lion]

Goo is great

[raw cave]

for a lot of things, blocking steal/revive, vertical movement, making barricades, closing doorways, closing walls so enemies cant push with demat block grenade damage, block enemies if they are running away, saving the stealing teammate, blocking turrets

and you can make structures that are out of maps boundaries on skyway stadium fo example

[errant jungle]

Have you ever used the goo gun too?
Or is it not useful enough?

[unkempt moss]

Googun is the strongest spec in the game if you take the time to learn it.

It’s just has a high skill floor.

[gaunt lion]

It can be very useful, a little bit too specialized for my play style tho

[wide onyx]

Goo is generally better, but I'm a barricade purist.

The immediate deployment is great. I'll get surrounded on two sides, place barricades, and then either bait the enemy into CQC or just winch them.

Playing around barricades is much easier than goo as a sledgehammer as well. Smaller area of rotation means you can hit either side an enemy go around with a good slide.

And you can go through them, so you can slap enemies when they don't expect it.

[sharp reef]

Try to get a good spin attack on people outside of drops/ppl stealing cashouts

[blissful iris]

Model 1887 is still garbage

[sharp reef]

If people die from class maxhp to 0 due to spin, its their fault.

[gaunt lion]

He really wasn't ever the same after the accident 😞

[blissful iris]

Can't understan the mentaility, its not good at close due to tight spread, not good at medium range and its outclassed by practically any other gun

[wide onyx]

But we gave it 2 more rpm!!!!!!!

[gaunt lion]

Yayyy.

[wide onyx]

Fractions of a percent baby!

[gaunt lion]

🥀

[wide onyx]

Dunno why they just keep doing stuff like that

[gaunt lion]

Cus the Cerberus... Medium shotgun... "Overpowered"

[wide onyx]

And they say they wanna nerf the minigun lol

I'll be excited for the day Dome shield only gets a 2 second deploy time

[gaunt lion]

Honestly, nerf everything, 0 damage for everything

-Everyone here

[wide onyx]

All weapon breakpoints must be ruined

[tranquil rose]

Bro stop the spamming, put it on the game-feedback if it's a suggestion but not here

[faint silo]

replace everything in the game with squeaky toys

[gaunt lion]

WAAAAA
MEDIUM KILLED ME ITS OVERPOWERED
WAAAAAAA

[faint silo]

squeaky dog toy noise

[sweet grotto]

Nerf emotes

[paper plaza]

Hey what if we have Medium a Shotgun Revolver

[shell hornet]

that would be lit but give it to light instead

[cedar shadow]

Best sight for the shak?

[serene glade]

Whatever you hit more bullets with

[woeful drum]

dumb question but what's the animation with the fcar that makes the magazine spin in there left hand

[normal ice]

@potent fog #👂┇game-feedback message

Yes, it should. Because it takes precision and literally point-blank range. Are you not going to complain about SR-84, SH1900, multiple Sledgehammer combos, mines, or Dagger all one-shotting Light (most of which with more range)?

[potent fog]

No because they're not comparable

[hybrid lynx]

Dagger is skilled. You aren’t.
Also sledgehammer combos. Combos, as in requiring other things.
Yes, certain combos are powerful. They’re meant to be that way. The main thing is making sure individual weapons , specializations, and gadgets aren’t op.

[potent fog]

Mines should one shot lights, daggers should as well, sniper should kill on headshot and has a limited mag bad at close range, shotgun should kill in melee range on all pellets it's got 2 shots and a decent reload time, sledge hammer has a long wind up animation for the right click it's easy to walk away from, if you get winched then you got outplayed and with 2/3 specs you can avoid it anyway

[unkempt moss]

Adder

[potent fog]

I don't personally care what people crying about the sword think I've played with the weapon for 150+ hours

[unkempt moss]

Midnight, join the side of good. Join Heavy.

[potent fog]

A 0 second ttk with 2 dashes left to escape is silly

[potent fog]

I have the 150 games played achivement on light and med I don't really vibe too much with heavy I like the goo gun and I like the deagles but the rest of the kit isn't for me

I mostly play bow/ throwing knives/ CL40 and repeater

[unkempt moss]

It comes with time.

You just have to get a proper taste of culture.

[potent fog]

The skills don't immediately transfer so it's frustrating being so slow with no mobility options

If heavy ever got a movement option that wasn't total ass I'd play it but also that sounds like a nightmare to balance

[serene glade]

They should just make the sword one shot heavy so I can stop hearing the constant bitching and then I can quit the game

Sorry one shot and QM for the extra skill

[potent fog]

They should make sword shoot a powershift car wide beam slash on every left click that does 400 damage

[normal ice]

First of all, I don't main Sword. Sit down with your sass. Second, "skill" is not the arbiter of all balancing.

Sledgehammer right-click is not a combo. It by itself can one-shot Light.

Sword was not OP and being unable to lunge+QM any enemy Light by itself makes it irrelevant. Why the fuck would you use current Sword when you can use SH1900?

[serene glade]

If you get caught in sledge hammer range and get left click meleed as a light you deserve to die

[potent fog]

Honestly true

[normal ice]

Yes. If you get caught in melee range, you do deserve to die. Same goes for Sword...

[potent fog]

And you will just not in .04 seconds

[serene glade]

My fat ass run speed is the same as your walk speed. Definitely not the same considering light has the fastest mobility in the game an movement options

[normal ice]

As Light, you don't have to sit there and eat Sword's lunge. Even if you do get hit by it, you can still make them miss their QM by dashing as they dash.

[potent fog]

So the counterplay to sword is to relegate all lights into playing dash or dying

[normal ice]

The original complaint was about the TTK, not mobility

[serene glade]

Getting caught in melee range to a sledge and a sword is completely different

[normal ice]

Grapple creates plenty of distance. You can always gateway or use jump pads or ziplines, too. You don't HAVE to run Dash to counter Sword

Camp highground and hit your shots before they get into melee range

Oh yeah, forgot to mention Matter can do the exact same combo as old Sword except it fires faster and at range...

[potent fog]

Ok great then you can use that and stop shitting up the feedback channel

[normal ice]

You just abandoned the argument.

[potent fog]

There never was an argument i stated above I didn't care what other sword users think, you're entitled to an opinion

[hybrid lynx]

Also, sorry
I agree with your point
but it went to a different message the first time for some reason
Anyway, buff sword

[normal ice]

Your argument was that lunge+QM shouldn't one-shot Light lol. I explained that it needs to in order to be viable compared to other Light weapons and that it wouldn't be an outlier in the game's design when many other options can kill Lights just as quickly.

[serene glade]

They need to just give lights dual blades and medium sword. Then it's not just a weaponized dash since nobody ever uses the left click

[normal ice]

Left-click had some use, actually. Lunge+slash+QM for M or lunge+lunge+slash for H were all faster TTKs than just spamming lunges

Most players just spammed lunges because it took less skill and hit more area, but it wasn't always optimal

[serene glade]

Oh I know the left click is good, but the only complaints ever is to buff the lunge so they can abuse dash and the burst damage. But giving lights dual blades allows them to get sustain with melee and then mediums get a lunge to help close distance

There's never any talk of maybe working the left click to do more dps or anything, it's always complaints to buff the lunge damage

Yes I know the complaint is to specifically give it back to one shot lights in return with a combo, but it's still just so one dimensional

[normal ice]

Personally, I don't see how that's any more one-dimensional than the firearms where you just left click where the enemy is. But I don't mind the prospect of reworking it, as long as it has some utility that makes it sometimes worth using over other options

[serene glade]

My perspective is people don't like the sword, they just like being able to abuse and weaponize the dash

[weak kernel]

if they reworked the sword 's movement to be a little more based around the weapon itself so you could use it with the other two specs that might be neat but I also think it was pretty much fine conceputally where it was at and the only reasons to nerf it were that casuals are bad at aiming and high level players don't like fighting weapons with a low aim requirement, both of which I think are lame reasons to nerf a weapon

[serene glade]

Id personally be fine with where it was at before if it the servers weren't horrible. There's times where it feels like dash has iframes

[runic whale]

Wtf did they do to stun gun 😭

[weak kernel]

shadow realm teleportation device

[runic whale]

This is so odd

[young yew]

https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/s/CQ8UFo6xrS

[unkempt moss]

This is the best outcome to me. It fixes problem of both weapons/class for the most part. Dash, grapple, and invis are much more viable on a blocking dual blade rather than only dash. Mediums having a gap closer through the right click, as well as more health to stay in with the reduced damage.

The speed of the walk of lights makes dual blades way more viable as well.

#buffgoogun #giveheavyglitchtrap

Then the lights can finally live their dream of standing in front of guns with zero strategy and being rewarded for it. Nothing lights like more than suckling on the barrel of a firearm like a two dollar street walker

[normal ice]

Ngl giving Light defensive utility doesn't sound the best to me. It would require much more to be reworked about the class

[proper lynx]

moolah onesie please, and moolah slippers

[unkempt moss]

Sorry, I know it’s not very esports. I just figured I would throw the lights a bone.

Thought they would have fun with it. But we just shill skins and $500 prize pool round here.

[normal ice]

Don't get me wrong, I hate esports lol

[deep mason]

@lapis cargo with what?

[lapis cargo]

Cerberus

[unkempt moss]

Based. My thought is that the 20% damage getting through hurts more to a light with 100 less health. And values can be tweaked

[deep mason]

Use goo to do it

[deep mason]

Goo yourself in public

[deep mason]

Change the tiger username cause ur not that if u do goo yourself in public

[crystal seal]

hi

[wicked anchor]

i think thats a terrible idea, you cant sit still as a light in melee range, you would just die. even with the block/reflect dual blades gets it wouldnt be enough to save yourself. thats not even mentioning trying to deal damage with them would be cancer because you would have to stop blocking to hit with them and if you cant dash around like you can with the sword you die

[crystal seal]

hi

[tough prairie]

Could go for a revert on that Data Reshaper nerf. Mostly so I can have more access to healing barrels

[unkempt moss]

Okay.

[oblique crypt]

Healing barrels are honestly not that good

[tough prairie]

It is good for the guy who needs healing on demand. Been healing a lot, but got no heals myself. I will take what I can take.

[keen turtle]

The Nullifier should work on teammates. Light seems to be the least supportive class based on gadgets/specializations.

[south plinth]

That sounds cool but people would definitely grief their teammates with it

Also give invis bomb a longer cooldown

[serene glade]

Pretty sure that's the point, but I can never tell. Heavy is supposed to be the "destruction" and "cc" class but medium has demat and light has thermal bore and breach charge so who knows

[gaunt terrace]

https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/s/wJWiInh8sI

give it a peep please and updoot if can!

[autumn dirge]

did they nerf the repeater

[south compass]

yo

[unkempt moss]

Data Reshaper was completely busted. It replaced defib as a mandatory slot for like 5 seasons. It’s about time they nerfed it.

[graceful nova]

Goo gun and sledgehammer is just so much fun

[normal acorn]

i believe this is the definitive best item combo for minigun

[obsidian island]

can you elaborate?

[crystal garnet]

Light should not have goo grenade. Fight me

[ripe timber]

So what loadout carried you guys through ranked this season?

[round sonnet]

what are our thoughts on the cerb now? do we think its balanced?

[normal acorn]

still feels pretty abrasive not bc of the gun itself but bc medium has access to it

[slow linden]

Based,but I run smokes with the minigun and track peoples shadows cause I play with max brightness

[round sonnet]

which class do you think should have it?

[normal acorn]

smokes need to be removed from the game they are inconsistent

[normal acorn]

none. bad weapon

[slow linden]

Nah I think sonar is more problematic,smokes are reliable and good

[normal acorn]

medium has a shotgun that fits mediums playstyle way more and makes sense. just remove cerb and buff the model. cerberus in a mediums hands is just overloaded and it gives medium too much power bc it can literally do everything

why use light ever

[normal acorn]

smokes are not reliable depending on the map they will sometimes just be see through and i hate them

i hate sonars too but smokes more

[slow linden]

I see through on all maps because I play with max brightness,they could also be playing light and using thermal sight

[slow linden]

I think of any kind of gadget,all sonar except for maybe the tracking dart should be removed,they make stealth impossible for any class

[zinc obsidian]

the stun gun is ass

[unkempt moss]

I know the bottom 500 and myself make up a very small percentage of the population on the finals. Less than a single percent. But it’s mandatory because of all the turrets used down here. You see we aren’t able to really get better at the game, so we use reshaper to make up for our inadequacies. We didn’t need to learn positioning and aim, counter picking and loadout building because we have a gadget that makes all that unnecessary.

Those things are irrelevant when we have a singular gadget that can fix any mistake we make with a single click.

Mines, turrets, barricades? No problem. We just don’t play the same game as you guys.

But the nerf was necessary even though we are such a small group. Because a lot of players used it instead of getting better. So it’s been interesting to say the least

I think it was unhealthy for the game to have such a powerful gadget able to be used by everyone on the team. So limiting it by some measure was huge.

[zinc obsidian]

so how was it changed?

[unkempt moss]

They removed one charge.

But every person on the team has it. So you’re removing three charges from the team. Meaning other gadgets become more effective, other things become more viable.

It’s just a big deal to us because we need it.

[zinc obsidian]

well turret is ass cause well...its easy to kill and juist deal with with, healing beam got nerfered also didn't?

[unkempt moss]

I don’t know. We just run turret for the most part because it helps in team fights.

[zinc obsidian]

wait im in practice and still got three charges on it or is this future nerf people want?

[unkempt moss]

APS, glitch, and reshaper. That’s what we use.

[zinc obsidian]

what I am saying is I am in practice mode in the finals and the reshaper still has three charges

[ornate scaffold]

Turrets:

[unkempt moss]

Theyre more consistent than my aim

None of us can aim down here. So it’s a lot of mines and grenades as well.

That’s why APS and Reshaper are popular. Oppressive even.

You have a gadget that does it all. Completely changes the outcomes of fights with a single click.

[zinc obsidian]

FACE PALM

I thought people were asking for a dematerlizer nerf i was worried but being dumb not reading it right

[unkempt moss]

Oh, no, it’s reshaper. Demat isnt very good down in the bottom 500 because it just lets the turrets see you.

I think it’s trash, and no one uses it.

[zinc obsidian]

really? I mean i find it useful for chasing down enemies or dropping mines in places I left. I gotten some interesting kills with it

[serene glade]

Typing out face palm in the face of irony is so based and oblivious pilled

[zinc obsidian]

Reshaper though...like I found useless or not something kean to using since I never really needed something immediately to use it

like the reshaper was random so like how is it useful?

[unkempt moss]

Oh no, bud. You don’t use it for barrels

[zinc obsidian]

???

[unkempt moss]

On enemy kit.

Think of how powerful an entire person loadout is in total. Now imagine not having access to an entire teammates load out in a fight.

[zinc obsidian]

so you like run up to them and it randomizes it....?

[unkempt moss]

It’s basically a 2v3 if they don’t have the right kit.

No. It just shuts it down. Turns it to flower pots and stuff. Imagine youre in a fight, and you don’t have enough entire player on your team because of one gadget.

That would be pretty strong right

[zinc obsidian]

I mean for me turning like random stuff into lets say red tanks to through up at platform to bring it down I thought be useful

[unkempt moss]

It’s all good.

Just know for us terrible players, it was a huge change. It would be like if they removed defib

[zinc obsidian]

so the reshaper was good at dealing with turrets mostly?

[unkempt moss]

And mines, grenades, barricades, APS, dome shield.

[zinc obsidian]

huh okay might use it but since its been nerfed is it still worth using

[unkempt moss]

Maybe. Not sure about anything outside of bronze.

[zinc obsidian]

I still think bringing back season 4 cl-40 be better. Like why make a weapon not so used despite changes a direct impact skill weapon.

[unkempt moss]

I’d imagine it’s because people don’t want to get better at the game. Learn new things. A lot of people probably just get on to escape their pathetic life, play with friends for a bit, and derive self worth from their RS since theyre unhappy with their accomplishments in life outside of the game.

[zinc obsidian]

eesh

[unkempt moss]

Which is a fine thing to do. We all need escapes.

[zinc obsidian]

If anything if they want to make the CL-40 a direct impact weapon give it buff by making the projectile to player hitbox bigger cause HOLY HELL the grenade hitbox is tiny as balls or make it faster like IRL grenade launcher projectiles

[unkempt moss]

I don’t know about any of that. I have a lot of ideas of how to change the game though.

[serene glade]

Id rather a hard stuck bronze balanced this game than the team hard focused on getting nail polish out

[zinc obsidian]

I do too but cl-40...just sucks and the Lh1 I am sorry but 7 shots to kill a medium at 15meters

[unkempt moss]

Is that to the body?

[zinc obsidian]

yes

[unkempt moss]

I’d imagine the thought is to have the marksman rifle hit heads. I can’t do that.

[unkempt moss]

Are you bronze as well? You strike me as a diamond player.

[zinc obsidian]

next season or this it needs a buff also the recoil pattern is odd. your not gonna keep tapping it during games and its random when moving arund like crazy

[serene glade]

Unfortunately. Bronze sounds so fun

[unkempt moss]

It’s very competitive.

We all are very serious about the game. Hundreds of hours in the game.

[serene glade]

So based

[unkempt moss]

All I know is streamers and content creators ask to buy our accounts all the time. I was in a call, not mentioning names, and it sounded like they were neglecting their children. I decided not to sell to them though.

[serene glade]

I mean it's pretty common knowledge that finals streamers neglect children

[unkempt moss]

Oh. I didn’t know that.

Thats kinda scary.

[vivid ocean]

@proud stone This guy Zenworldo said to buff Mp5 damage when its the best gun in the game 🤣

[serene glade]

@proud stone get in here 🤣

[unkempt moss]

@proud stone I agree bro! I cannot hit shots, dont let these haters get to you

[vivid ocean]

He said it in game feedback. 😂 Bro get in here

[unkempt moss]

Bro! No way

[restive plover]

It's very affirming hearing this bottom 500 representation, i literally came in to ask what the lowest skill floor weapons are because losing against level 1s makes me feel so bad for people stuck with me in their team :p

(and my first purchase was the CB-01, which turns out to be... not the lowest skill floor weapon. :p)

[novel coyote]

smoke grenade is mad underrated

[unkempt moss]

Defib is broken tbhqf no cap

[modest panther]

Reshaper turns deployables into random throwable items such as chairs and flowerpots. Any decor such as chairs and flowerpots turn into random barrels upon reshape. However there is a pattern turning specific barrels into other barrels:
Red (explosive) —> Smoke
Smoke —> Goo
Goo —> Orange(fire)
Orange —> Green(gas)
Green —> Glitch (in my opinion the most useful if you don’t have a light running glitch nade)
Glitch —> Healing
Healing —> Red
The reshaper also has a range of 18 meters, and can reshape multiple things at the same time without consuming more charges. Definitely a strong contender for a reserve item in case you’re going against enemies using a lot of deployables like gas mines which can stall a cashout.

Getting the hang of what turns into what for barrels can help you in different situations, but its main use is definitely clearing deployables.

[obsidian nexus]

NERF XP54

[ornate scaffold]

Facts

[gaunt terrace]

https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/s/nYG0SLM8pB

[warped raven]

Why can't data reshape transform fire into ice or gaz cloud to smoke XD tough one to be applied but yeah that will make that gadget more usable

[placid slate]

Did some research into the sword since it was a hot topic a bit ago. The time it takes to complete 1 lunge is about 1 second, add the charge time and its about 1.5 seconds per lunge, which means that it's ttk is kinds hot ass compared to every other light weapon

Especially compared to its close range competitors like the sh1900, m11, even the matter out kills it

[placid slate]

For example, to kill a light, you'd need to land a lunge then a quick melee. The whole lunge process takes about 1.5 seconds, adding up to about to a rough estimate of a 1.8 seconds ttk. For context, the m11 can kill in 0.9 seconds between 0 to 15 metres

[polar edge]

data reshaper got nerfed in S6 arrival iirc, it should be reverted and imo it's quite underrated in S6 due to the nerf. is a good counter for sentries and mines if there's any on a cashbox or totem

or better, swap heavies barricades with it

[polar edge]

it can swap dome shield? do you have to be inside the enemy dome shield?

because i tried earlier on WT and it didn't work

[pastel cove]

u have to be inside man, yesterday i got banged cuz i thought it can be swaped as turret or mine 😄

[polar edge]

man that sucks, it should be able to swap it from outside the shield

[pastel cove]

alternative is glitch trap or grenade

works from outside

[polar edge]

does glitch trap disables deployed dome shield?

[pastel cove]

nah man only grenade

[polar edge]

earlier on WT it was a BS going against 2H with minigun, mesh and Dome

honestly it was somehow a close fight

[wide onyx]

People don't understand how the sword really want op at all. It's best aspect the lunge, is only usable because of dash. If you see people saying to remove the capability for lunge dashing on light as a nerf, they've never played sword. It's already bad enough thst you have to use your dashes aggressively, meaning any lights you go after will have more dashes to get away from you, than you do to get to them.

[pastel cove]

we won WT yesterday 2 mediums and 1 Heavy with baricades, dome and goo gun is mega broken, when we steal cashout then the game was ruled by us

[polar edge]

glitch nades sould be on med too honestly

[pastel cove]

fr man

[wide onyx]

Please no lol

2 mediums and a light could effectively have 5 glitch utility like that

Would be too busted

[polar edge]

true, but they could put medium glitch nades to only have one nades instead

[pastel cove]

APS turret also exist

[wide onyx]

Nobody uses aps

[pastel cove]

we do

[polar edge]

bunny bash gives people ideas

mfing aps with glitch on the platform is cancerous

they should also reduce glitch trap range

[pastel cove]

agree

[polar edge]

hard to reshape it with data, it's like both of them have the same range

[pastel cove]

my duo is owner of data reshaper man, every gadget fears him XD

[polar edge]

im a data reshaper main too, and honestly surprised not a lot of people using it on quick play cash out

at least on Asia lobby. idk about other server

[pastel cove]

i met player who using it maybe two times

[flint stone]

I just wish it felt a bit better to use, I was shocked when they nerfed it

[polar edge]

since heal barrel got *re-*introduced, hoping to see a heal based gadget to get some on the next season

[pastel cove]

ong, but two slots on reshaper is good enough to make them cry XD

[polar edge]

data reshaper should have 3 charges but only be able to swap 2 items

i keep accidentally click it twice in a heat of a battle

[pastel cove]

ah i see, now i understand

[polar edge]

also APS is somewhat busted if played right since when you retract it, it has no cooldown, allowing you to re-deploy it with full health

it should have at least 2-3s cooldown

[pastel cove]

but it works on every gadget

[wide onyx]

It's not thst busted

That tech is only particularly useful on powershift. Never seen a medium do it once in a cashout mode

[pastel cove]

what about new stungun?

[wide onyx]

APS already doesn't have too much going for it anyway

[polar edge]

stun gun (now nullifier) should be able to hit ally or self

[wide onyx]

I think it's pretty boring. Better than old stun but I dislike suddenly not playing for 5 seconds.

[polar edge]

since there's a tech where you can basically tank dmg for 5s

[tired knot]

hi

[pastel cove]

i think its most useless gadget in game now

[polar edge]

though it could be a griefing item as well

[wide onyx]

Likely why they wouldn't do that

[polar edge]

it can stop a cashout, it is definitely not useless, and can make a 2v1 into 1v1

[pastel cove]

from this angle it is usefull

[polar edge]

it also can be use for escape, they cannot interact with anything that requires a button

famas need adjustment tho

its somehow easier to hit with 93R than with famas

[wide onyx]

Light weapons are supposed to be stronger

[polar edge]

its not the DPS that's problematic, it's the recoil

the accuracy on famas are really bad on med-long range compared to 93R

also with the gadget and weapon they're adding, put a specialization where you can disguise as the enemy team. i know Embark at this point looks at TF2 and think "yeah, that'll be good on the finals"

[pliant steppe]

Can we make placing zip lines as easy to see in The Finals as it is in Arc Raiders?

[oblique crypt]

While I would like this change I can also see it being really annoying for a light to suddenly become Invulnerable and run away.

[polar edge]

i mean you can't literally interact with anything and use gadget, so there's that. but it basically can be a psuedo tank since you can body block with no dmg

[radiant orbit]

I love the flamethrower so much

[unkempt moss]

If they’re going to make the damage so much higher on light weapons then what’s the point of having different health levels?

Just equalize the damage between everything and make everyone 250 if they want the lights to kill fast.

If you’re going to have a light do 350 damage in 2 seconds, and a heavy do 150 damage in 2 seconds then wtf is the point of having different health

[novel coyote]

different play styles.

[unkempt moss]

The play style would be unaffected. The loadout would change the play style.

Just make everyone 250 health, do 250 damage in whatever time you want. One is fast little guy, one is slow guy with shields and walls.

[lusty raven]

grenades, mines, gas?

while heavy cant really tank weapon damage, it is much better at tanking environmental pootis

[unkempt moss]

Everything is already balanced around the most nimble hardest class to hit. Very few things are allowed to do 150hp in one shot. And we always see them changing weapons to do 150 in x shots.

[novel coyote]

i think ultimately the answer is that the game was developed with 3 distinct classes in mind and reworking everything to your specifications would be a roundabout way to end up at around the same place.

[unkempt moss]

So just equalize the health and let the loadouts do the heavy lifting. Right now they just make the heavy feel weak and rhe light feel strong depending on what class you play. And im not saying to switch it, im saying what’s the point.

[lusty raven]

that is true... I agree with the fact that raising Heavy's HP to 350 while them having measly weapons that are struggling to deal reasonable damage to other classes is a massive detriment to Heavy, mainly because they have 0 wiggle space to approach any problem in other way than head-on... but strictly giving everyone the same health and normalizing the weapon power wont be a good change imho

[unkempt moss]

Light isnt allowed to be weak, which is why the KS sucks to use. It’s why everything gets made to feel like a wet noodle when they nerf it.

[novel coyote]

i think you have to look at how the game used to be and what the community used to whine about to understand why heavy feels underpowered right now…

[unkempt moss]

The KS is 23mm shotgun slug and it’s not allowed to do more than 104 damage because lights get sad about one shot combos. So the KS feels shitty.

[lusty raven]

Light is mainly strong, because they have the biggest wiggle room out of all classes... when the odds are against them, they simply disengage from combat and reposition... I believe they HAVE TO carry the strongest weapons to stay competitive, otherwise other classes would simply pummel them before they can prove to be useful...

[unkempt moss]

Right. It’s a sickness put on the game by the devs listening to shitty players.

[novel coyote]

i miss being able to winch, shoot, quick melee for a kill so fkn bad bro.

[unkempt moss]

They have to because the devs won’t tell lights to get better at the game..

[novel coyote]

i don’t disagree, but that’s also every live service game i’ve ever played.

[lusty raven]

though I believe Heavy's should also carry a significant firepower, as they are unable to escape firefight, both because of their bulk and slowness, almost 0 ability to get any movement related gadgets AND massive disadvantage, which is inability to go through vents

Heavy should be a force to be reckoned with, that you need to outplay somehow, which shouldnt be that hard as it has so much weaknesses...

rn the Heavy feels like weaker Medium, that is actively hindering the party UNLESS they carry something very special to the party (like for example Sledge and its ability to level whole blocks at ease)

[unkempt moss]

I agree. Lights never have to get better, and the rare cases they do, they bitch incessantly.

[sand monolith]

This isn’t how it works though

Light rarely has a gun that wins a ttk trade, or even ties

[lusty raven]

ESPECIALLY because the Medium now has access to the Demat, which is by far the strongest breaching tool ingame... used by a class that has stronger weapons and much less limitations than heavy

[sand monolith]

The point of light is to lose direct engagements but use movement to its advantage

Basically, play in any way possible to avoid direct fights because you will lose, you’re rewarded for doing so by having fast ttk and punished for not doing so by dying very quickly

[lusty raven]

hard disagree... the MP5 can easily beat most of other weapons while not having an obvious drawback (maybe the reload time, which is kinda high)

[slender bear]

There's a reason light is still underperforming. It is completely possible to make it viable if you are godlike at the game, but even if you can get that good, you would provide more value easier if you switched medium or heavy, which your teammates will insist on.

[sand monolith]

It doesn’t though. Mathematically it loses almost every ttk race

[unkempt moss]

This is why I said TTK is a bad metric but everyone always says it’s good. I think it’s the dumbest metric to use.

[novel coyote]

i feel like part of this opinion is also just not playing against good heavies because they still are very much a force to be reckoned with (even if i think some of their weapons have gotten nerfed toooo hard).

[sand monolith]

It needs a nerf tho for sure. But it doesn’t break what I said

[lusty raven]

mathematically it does... but that works ONLY if you are both standing still and both hit 100% shots you fire... which is simply not how the extremely mobile game of The Finals work

[novel coyote]

BRING BACK 36 BULLETS ON THE AK.

[sand monolith]

TTK is the most important stat in the game, which is lame but hard to fix. Especially when utility isn’t tied to DPS like it is in other games like overwatch

[lusty raven]

Both Medium and Heavy have much worse recoil patterns and have harder time to force the enemy to miss, than Light

[sand monolith]

Yes which is exactly what I said here #💣┇weapons-gadgets message

[unkempt moss]

Are you a light player?

[lusty raven]

you can simply wiggle a bit left and right and half of the AKM mag goes wild

[sand monolith]

No I main heavy

[slender bear]

If two weapons function nearly identically, but one player had a higher ttk, that player loses unless there is a skill gap. It might be an inconsistent metric because nobody has perfect accuracy, but that's just how it works. A weapon that kills faster performs better.

[sand monolith]

TTK is the most important stat. I agree it’s lame that’s the case but the way the game is set up makes that the case

[lusty raven]

well yes... but fights like these dont exist

[unkempt moss]

I’ve been trying to find a light player because I want to pick their brain. Somehow it’s the most played class but when I ask that everyone is a heavy player.

[sand monolith]

They do with more organized teams. High elo generally forces this playstyle from lights because there’s no other way to play the class

[lusty raven]

tbf I have to play Heavy, bcs all of my friends refuse to touch it lately... and I struggle a lot... is much easier to play 2 mediums instead

[sand monolith]

Pretty sure they lied when they said light is most played. It’s easily medium

[lusty raven]

definitely... medium is by far the most busted class

[sand monolith]

AKM is the most used weapon in the game by a gap thats not even close, confirmed by embark. It couldn’t be light

[novel coyote]

in ranked & wt fasho, in quickplay its aaaalll lights ._.

[lusty raven]

well yes... bcs the Light is mechanically the most fun class to play.... makes sense that people use it in casual gamemodes

It wont bring you a win tho (most of the time)

[unkempt moss]

I agree with this. It has always been the class I see the most. I agree that heavy may be the lowest played though. So who knows. They also probably take in to account Power Shift and casual play.

[slender bear]

I don't doubt that light is the most played with how satisfying movement is in this game, but it's honestly debatable whether it's even the second best class. It has a very high skill ceiling while others get a lower skill floor.

[novel coyote]

exactly, but if they say it’s the most played class, that’s probs why.

[novel coyote]

i play every class & weapon ._. (1200 hrs)

[lusty raven]

hard agree... its super fun but rarely decisive

[oblique crypt]

I have been playing a lot of dagger light recently, it's just really fun to play

[lusty raven]

usually the more Mediums in team you have, the bigger chance you have to win

[unkempt moss]

I can’t bring myself to play light. It just isn’t fun to me outside of grapple hook. But im looking for a die hard light main to ask stuff too, not someone who plays everything. They won’t think the same.

[lusty raven]

bcs Medium gameplay is the most straightforward and easy for veterans from other FPS to understand and get good at... Heavy and Light are specialised classes, that need more brains to be used effectively

[slender bear]

I play light solely for the movement speed. I really considered switching after the sword nerf, but light has always had to work harder for value so I just have to lock in.

[heavy yarrow]

I was against a whole team of mediums in power shift once and when I tell you they strategically ALL had auto turrets on the platform it was difficult to even get near them…

[novel coyote]

grapple hook during the plug meta was sooooooo much fun.

[lusty raven]

I love the Light, because it has many different ways you can approach it... you need a great situational awareness to be useful and usually a good team to help you do the heavy lifting when you run around doing light stuff

[unkempt moss]

I don’t know how someone can come on to a game for fun, look at light and be like yeah I want the little gun that goes patpatpatpat and has zero recoil! But I also feel that way about mediums that get on to play Mercy

[oblique crypt]

support light

[lusty raven]

I rarely play it tho, because it is the most deserved class to play and you cant really play more than one per team if you want to stay competitive

[heavy yarrow]

Dare I say I was a mercy medium main for a while before I switched to light

[lusty raven]

thats the thing... you can do lots of interesting stuff with Light... your main goal is usually to hunt stragglers and revive your team when they lose the actual fight

[unkempt moss]

Heavy has the most fun kit and weapons by a huge margin. Put Cerberus on heavy and I’d probably never touch another class.

[unkempt moss]

My main goal is knock shit down and fire big gun. And make people sad about the GooGun being overpowered.

[lusty raven]

but you can snipe, chip (ARN, LH1), bruise (throwing knives, MP5, Mass), burst (M11, DB, Dagger)....

[unkempt moss]

Would you say you don’t need great situational awareness to play heavy?

[lusty raven]

I dont know... cerberus imho wont be as strong on Heavy as it is on Medium... you spend 90% of time reloading while playing Cerberus and you need to be able to force the enemy to miss at this time... Heavy is too slow for that

[lusty raven]

thats the thing you need EXTREME situational awareness on Heavy, bcs you CANT make a single mistake... it is SUPER hard and unrewarding

[slender bear]

Every time I look at heavy I get a little salty over it's kit. I don't know how heavy got the anti gravity cube while light got gravity vortex, they seem like they would have worked better on other classes. I also feel like embark is just scared to give light other movement options though. Dash and grapple are good enough for now though.

[unkempt moss]

I just like the gun concept. But if you put it on heavy, the fire rate would be abysmal, the spread would be massive, and it would 65 damage when all pellets hit.

[lusty raven]

IF you had a deadly ass gun, that will deter people from just splattering you to the ground as soon as they spot you, it would be as punishing to play Heavy

[unkempt moss]

I made a huge list of changes and swaps of items I would like to see like this actually. Heavy keeps anti grav though.

[oblique crypt]

yeah heavy should keep antigrav

[lusty raven]

agreed Cerberus is super fun to play

[lusty raven]

gib

[unkempt moss]

It’s a huge list, i don’t send it because it feels like spam almost. But you have to go in to it with an open mind.

[lusty raven]

you should make a document

[slender bear]

Yeah heavy needs all the movement it can get. I just hope light gets options other than grapple (which is still very fun) or evasive dash, which I've heard is very annoying to play against. Gateway could honestly be on any class, We're just lucky light got SOMETHING in terms of movement gadgets.

[unkempt moss]

I’ll just send it once. It’s going to get eaten alive anyway.

[lusty raven]

for example Google Doc (or even better Google Sheet) and link it here... best way to keep and share data

[unkempt moss]

GooKing’s Official Fun Balance and Equipment Changes!
Gadget Changes!
The attempt being made here is bring the classes in line with their identity by making things exclusive to each class rather than having a lot of cross over. The design philosophy is meant to follow these guidelines. Light, the mobile highly offensive class, medium as support, and heavy as defensive lockdown specialist.

Offensive Grenade Exclusive to L!

• Frag, Pyro, Gas, and Flash
  Support Throwables Exclusive to M!
• Sonar, Smoke and GlitchGren
  Defensive and Area Denial Exclusive to H!
• Explosive Mine, Pyro Mine, Gas Mine, Glitch Trap, and GooGrenade

Movement Gadgets!

• L: Jump Pad
• M: Gateway
• H: Zipline
  Giving each class a movement option allows for a greater variety in team loadout building. Gateway accentuates Defib very well, and allows for mid combat shifting for the team. Zipline follows the suit of emplacement style gadgets for heavy.

Vision Gadgets!

• L: Dart
• M: Sonar
• H: Proxy
  Exclusive vision for each class that reinforces their advantages. Sonar so M can get vision for their team from a safe distance. Proxy, once again an emplacement style gadgets for heavy and defensive plays.

Gadget Shifts between classes:

• Bore & Vanish to Medium
  Vanish to support team in movement and closing in on other teams. Bore to open walls from a safe distance while supporting their team.
• Data Reshaper to L
  Helping lights in dealing with obstacles such as mines, barricades, and turrets.
• APS and Vortex to Heavy
  Continuing the trend of deployable defenses and CC, this rounds our heavies lockdown capabilities.

Weapon Changes!

• Dual Blade swapped with Sword, M&L
  The block would be super useful for lights in closing distance, along with their abilities to move faster naturally. Sword having a gap closer allows the slower medium class to get on top of their target.
• XP swapped with Model, M&L.
  A nerfed XP would give M a nice well rounded SMG, and the Model sits nicely as a strong shotgun for the midrange on L to balance out two close range shotguns.
• Chimera, new weapon combining the V9S and SR-84.
  Reducing the damage by ~25% and making the V9S a side arm for the SR. The SR becomes a fully projectile weapon, and the hipfire made even worse. Tapping the equip key hot swaps between the two weapons depending on the need of the player. This allows the light to dynamically switch depending on the situation.
• AR rebalancing:
  ARN: increase damage, slow fire rate. Making it feel more AR like than SMG.
  AKM: Increase recoil, increase mag, increase fire rate, buff hip fire. Make it the wild sibling to…
  FCAR: Increase damage, slow fire rate, increase accuracy.

MGL Rework!

• Now fires sticky grenades, alt fire detonates the grenades that have been fired, 8 round cap.
• 3 shots break terrain, 75 damage each.
• Increase projectile speed.
  KS Buffs!
• Increase Damage to 116, 1.3x headshot multiplier.
• Reduce deviation.
• Increase terrain damage to two shots for breaks.
  Flamethrower Alt Fire!
• Using right click on flamethrower gives upwards thrust similar to antigrav.
  Akimbo Buffs!
• Increase hipfire accuracy, reduce ranged accuracy. Full accuracy while sliding.
  M60 Changes!
• Allow weapon to be mounted to geometry for high accuracy, lower ADS and hipfire accuracy moderately. Shield added to front.
  Sledge Buff
• Bring back multi hit to right click.

#buffgoogun

[oblique crypt]

Bonkers

[unkempt moss]

This is a working list that my friend and I talk about as we play. It really only pertains to weapons we like.

[slender bear]

Honestly akimbo should have the accuracy on slide just because it's iconic.

[unkempt moss]

Yes! Wouldn’t that be fun as hell to come sliding in with full accuracy? I don’t need them to be DMRs. I want to knock down a wall and start blasting.

[lusty raven]

while I like the gadgets changes, im not a fan of weapon changes.... but still overall good points

[oblique crypt]

Not sure about the grenades being exclusive though

[unkempt moss]

I have other changes i would like to see as well. Like a tracking dart rework.

[slender bear]

The only thing I disagree with is taking sonar from light. I would rather have tracking dart get brought over just because light needs the awareness that comes with sonar. None of it seems like it would actually overturn the game, it would just spice things up.

[lusty raven]

I personally think that the akimbo deagles is a HORRIBLE "long range" option for Heavy... it has crosshair even in "ADS" and you cant really hit anything farther than 40m, because the crosshair covers everything... on the contrary I believe the Shak would be a GREAT "long range" option for Heavy instead of its current icky two-shot firemode

[unkempt moss]

You can do it either way really. Regardless the dart needs help.

[wicked anchor]

I actually agree with a lot of this list, aside from swapping the sword and dual blade as I’ve responded before (I also feel that contradicts your statement about having weapons inline with class identity as sword’s identity is fast movement but I digress). Only other thing I worry about is removing most of the utility from light might end up putting light back into a place where it has no team based utility besides killing again and that was a spot a lot of people didn’t like as it reinforced the bad light gameplay style of not assisting the team at all

[slender bear]

They could honestly make sonar a universal gadget and I wouldn't complain. The extra game sense wouldn't really hurt any of the classes. I get that light is supposed to counter light, but the others deserve some degree of help when it comes to sneak attacks.

[unkempt moss]

I think that regardless of how much team util you give light, bad lights gonna bad.

[lusty raven]

if you put the Pike scope on a Shak and reworked it to deal more damage at range, while having aggresive recoil, forcing you to fire in controlled bursts or semi (while still dealing reasonable damage), or having the ability to simply let it rip, hold the trigger and unleash extra deadly inferno of bullets, which would be ultra hard to control / keep on target

and then having deagles as ultimate short to medium range hipfire weapon

bascially reverse the roles of these two weapons

[unkempt moss]

Also, just between us… I only want dual blades on light to larp attack on titan with the grappling hook.

[wicked anchor]

That’s fair, but I at least do like having some team utility as a light as currently I don’t even run any of the gadgets you have given to light XD I run glitch grenades, vortex, and gateway (since the update have been swapping vortex for the nullifier to play around with it)

[slender bear]

WAIT THAT'S PERFECT

[lusty raven]

i defo agree with switching the sword and dual blades

[wicked anchor]

Just give both to light, fuck it XD

[unkempt moss]

Actually, yeah. Im fully okay with this too.

[wicked anchor]

I’m a sword main so I just wanna keep my sword

[slender bear]

I'll never complain about more melee options...

[unkempt moss]

I also secretly want riot shield on heavy.

[wicked anchor]

Would be cool if heavy got a bigger riot shield that was just up all the time but the attack was a shield bash

[unkempt moss]

But they kinda have the big boy version with mesh and sledge.

[slender bear]

That sounds like something that could have been on heavy from the start. Medium has the coolest melee designs, I just wish they were viable.

[lusty raven]

fuuuck still no embedd

[unkempt moss]

Feel free to spam those changes in game feed back if you like them

[lusty raven]

tbf IF they split the medium's melee weapons between Light and Heavy... I would not be even mad

[slender bear]

Maybe heavy can get a greatshield that you just swing. It could have a whole door skin on release.

[lusty raven]

Medium is not really a role that is viable with melee

[wicked anchor]

I have a dislike of mediums rn due to all the roof medium 3 stacks so I wouldn’t cry if they lost all their melee

But also tbf mediums melee weapons are not great rn

[slender bear]

I think that's why they ended up giving them defensive gimmicks. They don't have heavy's health or light's movement, so they just gave them a bit of survivability.

[lusty raven]

yes but mostly because they are in a bad place to even have melee

they have too little hp to be able to utilize shield and too slow for dual blades

counterplay to dual blades is to simply leave... as long as you dont shoot at them you are 100% safe, because they cant close the distance... Lights would be much more viable, because they are fast and you could either block shots or slash (which makes you viable to headshot burst)

imho dual blades on Lights would be much more fun for the dual blade user and it would be counterable by simply magdumping the light in the face when they started attacking (as they have little hp)

[serene glade]

Most lights think firing their m11 in my face while blocking is the counterplay, then they hop in game feedback and ask for dual blade nerfs

[wicked anchor]

Speaking of this, I hit plat yesterday and got put into a ruby lobby against a team that was way too good, one medium with a pike was able to just constantly two tap me no matter the situation. It got so bad I’m not even sure if he was cheating or just that good cause at a certain point it’s hard to tell the difference XD

Only reason I know (or highly suspect) it was a ruby lobby is cause it was an RS gain for 6th place which was the first time I’ve seen that

[lusty raven]

pike is super strong

[wicked anchor]

Guy was head shotting from like 40 meters while I zipping around as a light like how do you even do that so consistently

[slender bear]

I really hope they do a medieval season next. Heavy will get that greatsword skin, light can either get a new spec or something other than a gun, and we'll finally get that medieval map. I think they are bound to run out of creative gun ideas eventually, and the melee weapons always add so much more spice to the game. I wouldn't even complain if we got something ranged like a sling or even a bowling ball. The latter would be funny at least, although out of place.

[lusty raven]

tbf Light has shitton of non-guns... I would like Medium to get a non-ar (preferably not a firearm at all)

I wouldnt mind if they moved the Bow to Medium and gave Light something new instead

[misty solstice]

a medium good melee weapon would be cool

[slender bear]

They could give us a high damage, low fire rate and range shot put to compliment the throwing knives. They could give us a dodgeball skin and a bowling ball with a unique animation.

[wicked anchor]

Medieval season would be dope, crossbow, sling, flail, mace, etc lotta weapon possibilities or just skin ideas like a longsword for the sword, greatsword for the sledge

[lusty raven]

we just had a discussion about medium not having any melee weapons at all

[slender bear]

(No viable ones at least)

I think it would be cool to see more unique options for everyone.

[lusty raven]

i agree that medium should get unique options, but melee weapon simply doesnt fit

[slender bear]

We need a greatbow for heavy tbh

[opal crow]

I don’t think medium needs a viable melee weapon I think it needs a viable movement options to make its melee weapons viable, like maybe a speed boost pad

[misty solstice]

maybe something with more range and speed

[wicked anchor]

That would be kinda wild but would have to have a similar downside to minigun like barely any movement speed while drawing

[lusty raven]

or that... that is actually an interesting idea

[keen turtle]

Give Heavy a drill with a mini CnS on the right-click. I want to see more destruction that's on the level of the sledge hammer

[lusty raven]

how about this

[opal crow]

Yeah, it’d fall in line with other medium movement options as ones teammates and enemies can use as well, but actually help medium melees close gaps

[wicked anchor]

That is a good idea, like a Mario kart speed boost pad lol

[slender bear]

Medium already gets the most movement out of all classes from it's gadgets though.

[lusty raven]

yes... but the way they do it is non-selfishly which imho fits

[slender bear]

I think medium could use some more convenient movement though.

[opal crow]

Light gets the most movement options out of all classes using mediums gadgets achtually 👆 🤓

Mediums movement options are counteracted by the fact that everybody else also has access to them which imo balances them out. I especially like having them available as a light and just being able to extend jumps even further with dashes or lunges or both

A carelessly placed jump pad might just help that enemy light more than you in a lot of cases, so it kinda works out 🤷‍♂️

[slender bear]

That's true. I just feel like if they wanted a team based speed pad it would need to take you pretty far. That paired with jump pad and zipline would make it hard to defend light as the "movement" class.

Light gets the same drawbacks from gateway. It would be cool to see a more selfish light movement gadget.

Gateway feels like it was meant to be on medium but they didn't want to give medium a third movement option without light getting one.

[opal crow]

It might’ve started out as a medium idea idrk, similar to how riot was intended for heavy, but I do feel that it fits light way more. I started using gateway pretty recently tbh, like with the taser removal pretty much, and I’m kinda embarrassed I wasn’t using it before since it’s so useful for so many different things

Also feels nice and wholesome to let your death machine mini gun heavy drop on the enemies and engage with you without having to run the whole way

[slender bear]

Yeah overall the movement balance is pretty good. Light gets slightly more movement but it's selfish, medium gets almost as much but it's also supportive. Heavy gets nothing because they're heavy.

[opal crow]

I mean charge and slam is kind of movement, and winch has an obscure tech iirc but mostly charge and slam, I like charge and slam a lot

[slender bear]

I just think it would be cool if light actually stood out as the movement class by a wider margin.

[opal crow]

I don’t disagree but I think having movement specs that we use way more than the other classes use their specs puts us on that level already

[slender bear]

They are definitely more convenient at the very least.

It's like giving Batman prep time. Light gets convenient, fast movement, and if they set up medium gets the same speed.

[lunar hare]

Just get that.nullifier out of here :3

[slender bear]

If you want we can take the free kill button back (:

[opal crow]

I love the nullifier ngl whenever I swap it out I feel like something inside of me dies and I have to equip it immediately again

I keep trying out a smoke thermal sword build and it’s cool but I just love having the nullifier available more

[opal crow]

Idk medium kinda has some convenient movement capabilities too if you know the demat sauce and use jump pads selfishly but I do generally agree that light has way better movement expression for on the fly decisions

[unkempt moss]

You still have the XP for that

[slender bear]

M11 kills faster, I guess we have two.

[unkempt moss]

Honestly V9S is still ridiculous.

I used it for a contract recently, good lord.

[slender bear]

M11's damage is the only thing that actually holds up in 1v1s against other classes though. db is similarly broken tbh

[unkempt moss]

Lights seem to love underplaying how good their weapons are

I was able to 1v4 an enemy team with the V9S and im terrible. Just moving around in a building gave me enough of an advantage.

[slender bear]

It sounds like your opponents were the terrible ones. If I try anything like that I get spun on after the first shot and just die.

[unkempt moss]

I don’t know. I just tried the hidden light technique of not standing in the open like a dumbass

[slender bear]

Although I mostly just play sword and pick off stragglers.

[unkempt moss]

You and I are enemies Braq

May god have mercy on you if we ever meet on the battlefield, because I will not.

What’s your name in game.

Im hunting you down. As the leading voice for lights in wepsNgadg, it is my duty to smite you.

[pastel cove]

i just hit a crazy clip guys XD

[opal crow]

Heavy’s got some monster guns too tbh, like I started using the shak 50 and man that thing just tears up lobbies

Like basically no recoil or if there is any I didn’t notice it, tears through lights and mediums with ease and as long as you’re hitting heads it ain’t all that bad into heavy’s either

[keen turtle]

Goo gun/Sledge menace

[opal crow]

I fw the fit

[wide onyx]

Looks like you're chewing on that puze can

[gritty swallow]

anybody know the melee combo's for dual blades?

[jovial knot]

I love lockbolt

[unkempt moss]

Leftclick multiple times.

[serene glade]

Best combo is to quick melee after the second round of swings because the final swing sucks that much ass

[clever hollow]

Can nullifier be used on teammates to turn them invincible before they die? Any uses outside of making someone helpless for a bit? Can you reload while nullified?

[oblique crypt]

No, IDK, Yes

[plain pilot]

As a Heavy main, i just now learnt about sledge+quick melee combo

[indigo nexus]

There aren’t really any relevant combos unless you miss some of your hits, in which case the space of solutions grows quite large

[clever hollow]

Thx

[indigo nexus]

Here’s some uses;

stops steals (important)

can stop someone else from stopping a steal (important)

turns an xVy fight into an xV(y-1) fight (also important), which is a flat edge in a fight with two or more enemies.

can get you out of a sticky situation, such as a heavy sledgehammer in a small room

gives you a breather to deploy gadgets and such

It’s mainly a defensive option outside of team fights

[clever hollow]

I was asking for uses as versatility. Like if it could glitch out turrets or something. Steal stopping and cash box dropping is useful, I’ll keep it in mind. Can you charge slam or use grappling hook while nullified?

[weak kernel]

it shuts out more or less everything you can do aside from use basic movement

imo it was obviously stronger than old stun gun at a glance and it surprised me that some people weren't immediately acknowledging that

stunning someone for a "free kill" (they can react and shoot back before you swap weapons and kill them) < completely removing someone from the equation for a few seconds with the downside of "you can't kill them during this time"

[shell sonnet]

could only react and fight back when they actually had a gun, during which they are also a very easy target

i think the rework makes it a lot more bearable in casual, while being stronger in ranked, which is pretty much exactly what we needed imo
time will tell if it actually ends up that way

[unkempt moss]

Can we get a Shak nerf please?

[tranquil rose]

There isn't what to nerf, the weapon has a clear weakness and strenght T:

[opal crow]

Shak just rips apart lobbies I think anyone could pick that thing up and top frag ngl

[unkempt moss]

Let’s nerf it

[serene glade]

I hope future patch notes have more threats to heavy in them included

[unkempt moss]

My enemies need a Shak nerf. Im begging you, Embark. These guys are so tired of getting thrashed, bruv.

[unkempt moss]

We allowed to post tier list for peer review here?

[royal pier]

Some of you mfs won't be happy until Heavy is a free kill.

Cerberus out here deleting everyone and Embjork is concerned about minigun, the only weapon to significantly shake up the meta in several seasons.

[serene glade]

Now we are getting somewhere

[rapid hull]

Fr

[unkempt moss]

Sarcasm detection unit: Offline

[unkempt moss]

Cerb isnt even good, bruv.

[royal pier]

You're delusional to say this if serious.

[unkempt moss]

How is it good?

[shadow onyx]

KS-23 basically

[royal pier]

It can 3-tap heavy I mean come on. It can win against a sledgehammer head-to-head.

[shadow onyx]

Cerb is meta this season. In all pro scrims people are running it it's definitely the best medium weapon or at least top 3

[unkempt moss]

Nah

Never seen it

[slender bear]

Cerb is a contender for the best weapon overall. They basically made double barrel with an extra shot and slightly less damage.

[royal pier]

Normally I don't even care what high level players think is good, but sometimes it's fuckin obvious.

[royal pier]

I don't believe you.

Half my matches devolve into every Medium using Cerb.

[modest panther]

would be cool but worrying how much dmg it would do depending on how many arrows are stored in the crossbow.

[unkempt moss]

Just because everyone uses something doesn’t mean it’s good. Best in slot doesn’t mean it’s too powerful.

[modest panther]

it literally beats any other weapon close range, on par with db

[unkempt moss]

Nah

[royal pier]

Name another Medium weapon can can just run up and kill Heavy.

[modest panther]

gooking youve said in the past that youre bottom 500. its everywhere in high ranks, im in diamond/ruby lobbies.

[naive rivet]

Only good on fortune with demat let’s be real

[modest panther]

literally this. the nerf only changed ttk on light

[unkempt moss]

I could see this

[slender bear]

You were complaining about xp earlier, but you think cerb is balanced despite being better. Both of them are unbalanced, and that's why they're the most played in their classes.

[modest panther]

i have to disagree, its strongest probably on fortune but it still is used to great effect on vegas and monaco.

[unkempt moss]

If I said I could fly would you believe that too. Nice try

[unkempt moss]

XP is too strong

[modest panther]

bro you yourself said youre bottom 500. the only difference the cerb nerf did is stopped its ability from 1 tapping lights.

[polar edge]

Cerb is great overall, though it definitely requires Luck and Aim

[slender bear]

Cerb is better

[modest panther]

i implore you to watch prohub tournaments on twitch @unkempt moss

[unkempt moss]

I’d legitimately rather bleach my eyes than watch finals pro play. Im sorry, me screwing with you guys aside, thats too far.

[slender bear]

It sounds like you don't want to accept that it's a crutch. You can't defend a weapon while complaining about something weaker than it.

[serene glade]

Esports, more like your kid is hungry, go get a job

[modest panther]

then you wont understand the meta at all. how can you have such strong opinions on the meta when you yourself dont expose yourself to it

[unkempt moss]

I don’t. I started messing with Ben because he’s oblivious to sarcasm and then the gaggle of nimrods showed up. So I just went with it.

[modest panther]

as i said. diamond/ruby lobbies are overrun with the cerberus, even still after the nerf

[unkempt moss]

Do you know what the meta is all the way to ruby? Playing whatever you want.

The game isnt difficult to climb if.

[modest panther]

ok whats your peak rank then

[slender bear]

I mean they want to play cerb because it's broken...

[unkempt moss]

Like number? We climb to diamond every season for the skins now and then switch to wt to hit emerald.

[serene glade]

@unkempt moss please watch finals Esports, it's very serious. They play for $500 prize pools and think they are superior to you

[unkempt moss]

Okay. Then I can post in the discord again?

[serene glade]

Yes, please educate yourself sweaty

[royal pier]

Which is the vast majority of nerfs as of late. Helps light, nobody else.

[modest panther]

sure but do you think a weapon with such fire rate should one shot light, 2 shot medium and 3 shot heavy? i think at least adding a quick melee to total dmg for each class is better suited.

especially a weapon on medium

[royal pier]

No, but it should require a quick melee for Heavy

[modest panther]

i think if it needed either a qm or an extra shot for each class it would make more sense. either way your teammates can shoot them and youll still be within reach of old ttk

[royal pier]

Or have a lower RoF

[modest panther]

that would work too

[royal pier]

Maybe some heavy kick that requires adjustment after each shot

[modest panther]

my main problem with it is it just feels too easy. i would much rather go back to model being meta (with less than old range) because movement was a big part of it. ppl using cerberus legit just walk in a straight line

[modest panther]

just something that adds some skill ceiling to it

[slender bear]

I think the balance on all the shotguns is a little wierd. Double barrel one shots from further away than sword, the matter kills faster than sword can even swing, cerb kills faster than sword, I thought shotguns were easier to aim and did more damage to counteract their short range. How are they better than weapons with the same drawback but worse, and sword still got a nerf on top of that.

[unkempt moss]

Do you want me to go hit ruby? Or is diamond enough.

[modest panther]

i hate swords, but i dont think that they shouldnt be able to right click quick melee, i think at least 110 dmg is fine, especially with how many one shot weapons vs light there are on light

[slender bear]

M11 can currently kill a light player in the time it takes to swing the sword once. The handling of light's balance is honestly kind of disgusting.

[modest panther]

i just think that the statistics they use to balance, and the feedback they use to balance should at least be measured in a higher elo setting, and accompanied by personal experience from the people responsible for balancing

[slender bear]

Yeah

I would hope that's what they're already doing.

[modest panther]

someone on the subreddit said "you should be able to hold the right click on the sledge"

like how would that make a positive difference to the game

[polar edge]

question, do you think the changes to dagger in S4 (i think?) is a nerf or a buff? where it forces you to charge

[royal pier]

Sword nerf is probably more due to how unenjoyable it is to fight regardless of its strength. Having to consistently turn 180-degrees just feels bad.

[royal pier]

I kinda like the idea of the Cerberus not automatically centering itself after each shot, forcing you to manually bring it back on target.

[slender bear]

That's fair. The sword player has to make the same turns though, so I don't see why they would give it a damage nerf. That did literally nothing to fix all the spinning, now you just have to do an extra turn before they kill you.

[modest panther]

i agree, i feel like it makes more sense for the model to self center tho

[royal pier]

Yeah, Medium is sorely lacking in interesting gimmicks

[slender bear]

I kind of hated it. Daggers new slow walk speed while holding a charge makes it overly reliant on evasive dash trickstabs, and now it plays the slowest out of any weapon other than the sniper.

[royal pier]

I think it's possible we see a rework.

[modest panther]

i think there should be at minimum 2 different (literally different) weapons of each type on a class that are viable. cerberus AND model should be viable.

[slender bear]

The insta kill is inherently impossible to balance though, so I would rather have seen dagger just get a whole new alt.

[modest panther]

i think melee weapons should just have a skill based combo system honestly, a series of inputs is way more interesting than one singular input

[polar edge]

yeah, they should've made it optional to hold it like throwing knives

then again, Backstab is OP

[slender bear]

I wouldn't be opposed to that idea. Sword's entire identity is the lunge movement though, so it would have to still have something by the way of movement. The problem would ultimately still be there.

[modest panther]

thats where i found sword was the most interesting, theres more combos on sword than the other melee weapons (sure sledge has winch left click melee on lights but not the same)

[slender bear]

I just hope we get a new melee weapon at some point. Those are usually the most interesting to play.

[royal pier]

Maybe the lunge stops upon contact with an enemy and speeds up the main swing or something.

[polar edge]

Boxing Gloves for Heavy

[slender bear]

With a knuckle duster skin (:

[modest panther]

more than anything id enjoy new specializations, but i cant even think of what they could add

[polar edge]

with how much type of weapon at this point, i think we're gonna See TF2 in TF sooner

[royal pier]

Heavy spec that lets you grab enemies and preform one of two moves.

[polar edge]

i put a suggestion on feedback, honestly it's quite literally blatant copy but still interesting take

[royal pier]

Yes, I know what a technical disaster that would be, but I wanna german suplex someone off the map.

Or choke slam them.

[polar edge]

getting choke slam with the new female heavy body type would be equivalent getting Emma frost in Marvel Rivals

[royal pier]

I was going to post a gif of Rhea Ripply pinning someone but it might get me in trouble.

If you type in "rhea" in the gif search it's literally the first one for me.

[modest panther]

would you be seen as "blue team" on their screen?

[polar edge]

honestly we need more Specialization for Med and Lights

[polar edge]

i said it there yea

[modest panther]

sorry skimmed through it

[polar edge]

i think it's generally balanced and can create a unique play

[slender bear]

I've been in the feedback forum suggesting a light spec that let's you walk on walls (and the ceiling). You would look at a wall within 5m and activate it to flip onto it. The duration would be infinite, but you fall off if you jump, and it would have three charges with 20 second cooldowns. This would make ambushes more interesting, and you could walk across the skyscrapers in fortune stadium for more interesting approaches and angles. Could you imagine being able to stand on the side of a sky scraper with the sniper and line up shots while your whole perspective was sideways? You would even have to account for projectiles falling down by keeping in mind which way "down" is!

[polar edge]

Wall Running

[modest panther]

if they nerfed sword because of tracking the sword movement i doubt theyll add titanfallesque movement. walk on walls without vertical movement maybe but if you can climb walls idk

[slender bear]

And ceiling running!

[modest panther]

sure if youre camera is inverted lmao

[polar edge]

it should be lmao

i still can't believe it that Lmao is filtered when fml is not in the game

[modest panther]

i still cant believe i cant switch off the profanity filter like i used to be

[slender bear]

It wouldn't really add any quick movements, it would be more of a positioning tool. If you flipped onto a wall in a fight, all that would change for an enemy would be that you look sideways and you can run upwards, which could be kind of trippy ig.

[polar edge]

it also puts you at a worst position since it's easier to headshot, so i think it balances it out

tho, throwables would be difficult to throw

[slender bear]

I'm honestly just obsessed with the idea of waiting in ambush on the ceiling. You could stand just over a doorway and drop on somebody, or just try to laser them from there like a wall mounted turret!

[modest panther]

but do you think it would suit the fighting of the game? can you imagine in big rooms like in vegas where the ceilings are like 2-3 stories tall and theres a light shooting you from above running around while the rest of the team is on the ground? sure fighting from above is a totally normal thing that occurs but being able to do it on a whim without prepositioning sounds kinda not good to me

[polar edge]

and also do note, destruction affects the ceilings

plus the game is also movement shooters, and making it a spec would actually hurts lights

[shut bane]

I love how useless thermal vision makes invis rats feel

[sacred void]

Wall running would be sick as fuck

[slender bear]

That's part of why it would be kind of useless in a fight. They could flip up before hand though, which would give you an edge. If you picked a fight with someone, then flipped onto a wall in one of those rooms, you would still have to run your way up to the ceiling (while being shot at) then flip onto said ceiling.

[polar edge]

real, then again it'd still be quite the fight if it's invis DB light

[modest panther]

i love how useless i feel with thermal vision when the skybox/world border is behind a light thats invis

[sacred void]

That and there's no cover on walls. If you run into something while wall running you drop

[sacred void]

I just want the. To up the range of the thermal

[modest panther]

so whats the benefit of it, if you dont gain speed then jumping on a wall when youre next to a wall anyways wont really change your center of mass

[sacred void]

I feel it should make you gain speed

[slender bear]

It's not supposed to be a momentum based thing, you could just stand still on the wall. It would effectively just make the wall your new floor.

[modest panther]

nah 50m is good also if your fov is wide get the enemy on the left or right edge of your screen and you can see where they are ;)

[polar edge]

i think in general, it wouldn't fit light at all. since they are glass cannon and all movement

[sacred void]

No just having a wall grab is dumb.

[sacred void]

I say why not both

[polar edge]

but for medium, maybe, you can already place turret in walls and ceiling

[unkempt moss]

They could probably just work a wall stall in the grapple hook to help it a little.

[sacred void]

Good idea a wall stall rather than a infinite wall grab

[sacred void]

That would work better just have a wall stall with the wall run. Call it moon gloves or grav gloves

I just thought making a moon shoes joke would be funny don't actually call it that

Just call it grav pack

So it doesn't obstruct cosmetics

[polar edge]

honestly gadgets/spec/and weapon would probably correspond based off season theme too

[slender bear]

That was kind of why I wanted it on light. Giving medium or heavy that ambush potential would be horrible. Besides, light already has cloak, which is solely for ambushes and stealth, so it wouldn't actually be that out of place, it just doubles as some positioning like how grapple does.

[polar edge]

then again, wth is season 6 is about

[sacred void]

Having a wall grab alone would be a bad specialization at least on its own. Give us a speed pack that lets you run. Sort of like adrenaline from Titanfall. I want mobility options that aren't vertical speed.

[sacred void]

Ok great idea give light a ospuze themed energy drink that increases speed and movement

[slender bear]

When I said you COULD stay still I meant it. You can still run around, it would literally just flip you so you are running (or standing) on a different surface. I agree just attaching yourself to a spot on the wall sound boring.

[sacred void]

Oh I didn't see the could stay still. Mb. if that's the case that works but I feel like it shouldn't be able to wall stall forever.

[slender bear]

That's fair. I just kind of figured heavy has goo gun which does the whole stalling game just as well.

[sacred void]

Season 7 should add the moon and a moon colony some moon map with buildings and low grav space walks outside of the buildings

Just not for the cash out. The low grav shouldn't affect cashouts

[slender bear]

It would add more forethought if they gave it a 30 sec duration so you had to know somebody would enter a room before getting in position, I just thought infinite duration wouldn't be unbalanced.

[polar edge]

real, moonmap

[sacred void]

Make a space themed season give light the wall run/grab and give medium a hover pack. And give heavy a jump pack that gives them a jump boost but you cant really move well while boost jumping.

Maybe give light a vvvvv style grav switch that lets you flip gravity for you or at least to a certain height.

[slender bear]

With love, from CNS ❤️

[sacred void]

So you don't just float into space

Give a prop launcher that launches props harder so they do more damage on impact

This game is a simulation. The only limit is the limits of the game engine

Ok so give heavy a jet pack/ jump pack. Give light a wall run/ wall stall. And give medium a gravity switch.

[unkempt moss]

I wanted them to change charge and slam to a hulk jump that does the slam

[sacred void]

Yeah make it a sort of lunge jump but with no damage. Maybe a area that pushes back players but no damage. Or if it does do damage make it so if you land on someone it does it

[slender bear]

Doesn't heavy already have a gravity switch in the form of the anti gravity cube? You could just put that on medium as well.

[sacred void]

No I mean flip upside down gravity not low gravity.

[sacred void]

Look up vvvvvv for what I mean

[slender bear]

Anti grav cube does flip gravity upside down. It would be kind of cool if if flipped the player upside down as well though.

[sacred void]

Like walk on ceiling but you can flip between the two kinda gravitu switch. Maybe let us do it with other players too or Cashouts and cash boxes. Obviously to a point.

[sacred void]

It doesn't let you walk on ceilings. Anti grav cube is just a portable gravity lift

[slender bear]

Like a personalized gravity toggle? It could be on a resource like cloaking device, bit with a bit of a longer duration (1-1.5 seconds)

[sacred void]

Exactly

[sacred void]

That's the gravy switch I'm talking about

[slender bear]

I feel like that might still clash with anti grav cube a bit, but since it doesn't affect objects it wouldn't really steal the fortification side of the cube.

[sacred void]

The anti grab cube isn't there for mobility in fact it's to stall movement. Like I said it's like a grav lift. Vs this which is mainly for movement

Plus it's super slow to go up in using the anti gravity cube

It sort of plays into your idea of the wall stall. But I feel since light already has a ambush tool it works better for medium especially because it's not just for you

[slender bear]

Yeah I get that. This wouldn't have the fortification stuff so it's different. Although I do kind of disagree that anti grav cube doesn't also serve as movement, It's actually one of heavy's stronger movement tools, just a bit worse than charge and slam.

[sacred void]

Nah it's only good for vertical movement and even then it slows you down significantly and stalls your movent.

[slender bear]

I do like the idea of medium having some gravity shenanigans though. It sounds perfect for medium.

[sacred void]

Yeah especially because they get data shaper and dematerializer

[unkempt moss]

I use it as an anti defib tool.

[slender bear]

According to the wiki light hasn't gotten a new spec since release. I'm not actually sure if cloaking device was added in an update or not, but we're long overdue for something new regardless.

[solemn light]

SKIN IDEA:

DESKTOP MONITOR CLAMP, BUT ITS CLAMPED TO A CAN OF OZPUSE

CLAMP DOWN ON THE COMPETITION WITH OZPUSE

(the depicted clamp is missing the other end to actually clamp it because I had to create this idea the moment it entered my mind)

Could be a matching pair with the SH from the BP